# Goats stressing me



## Mrsdowns (Aug 1, 2018)

I'm ready to throw in the towel.

Am I feeding them too much?
All of my goats need their hooves trimmed constantly. How often should this be needed?

Am I not feeding them enough?
I have two doelings born February 2018 and March 2018. They are too small, one actually looks like a pygmy.

Out of 5 does only one was bred. I have one kid and am out a lot of money over the last two years.

Any advice is welcomed. Including selling everything and forgetting it all.


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Oh, wow. I can really feel your frustration right now, And I don't blame you. We are going to ask you many questions about your goat management and feeding practices. This is only to help you figure this out. Not to criticize at all, OK?

This first question is ultra important. Goats need a quality loose mineral mix available to them 24/7 in almost all cases. Molasses blocks won't do, and mineral salt blocks won't do. It needs to be loose, granular, with a high level of quality nutrients. Minerals affect everything, including hooves, growth, and reproduction. Minerals are as important as clean water and non moldy hay.

No judgement here, are you providing this? What brand/formula of minerals are you providing if you are giving anything?

Where are you? A general region will be adequate if you don't want to be specific.

What breed(s) do you have and how long have you had them? How long have your problems been going on?

What do you feed, and how much of it, and how often? Like what type of hay, what type of concentrate or grain (specific grains if you feed grain and not a pelletized concentrate)

What type of surface are they living on? Woodchips, gravel, mud, sand, rocky outcrops, cement... etc.

What is the size of the pen/pasture they live in? Do they get to move from place to place or are they sedentary and need you to bring everything to them?

That's enough to get started. These answers, especially to the minerals! will help get you happy with your herd.


----------



## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good questions above.

I would think the cause of being small would be possible cocci and/or worms. A fecal may tell you.

How are their inner lower eyelid coloring, pale pink white ect?


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Good point, @toth boer goats I should have mentioned that.


----------



## Nigerian dwarf goat (Sep 25, 2017)

following. I'm sorry but you shouldn't give up, Goats are a fun experience, and you will learn to love them


----------



## fivemoremiles (Jan 19, 2010)

I take it you have a meat breed.
Minerals would be my first thought.
what are you feeding your does and how much. Your does will not settle if they are too fat or if they have poor nutrition.
so the next thing we need to know is the does body condition.
body condition 1 is a skeleton. you feel every rib and valley.
body condition 5 is a butter ball. not a rib felt.
you want your does to have a body condition 3 you can feel the ribs but not the valleys.
Goat nutrition is the hardest part of owning goats. 
For an example
lets say you have a free source of celery goats love it. but your goats can only eat so much and when they feel full they will stop eating. 
most goats will not eat over 8 to 10 lbs but if you are feeding just celery the goat will need to eat 35 lbs of celery to get all the nutrients they need.
I have mentored a family that was doing something very similar to what i described here. 
Welcome to TGS
we will do our best to help you


----------



## fivemoremiles (Jan 19, 2010)

Maybe you are not a bot after all


toth boer goats said:


> Good questions above.
> 
> I would think the cause of being small would be possible cocci and/or worms. A fecal may tell you.
> 
> How are their inner lower eyelid coloring, pale pink white ect?


----------



## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Welcome! Breeding can be tricky, for example it has been reported that cows don't get calves if they go daily under a high voltage line (I hope the translation machine served me here).

I remember one year when my goats had perfect hoofs, without trimming. That was the winter when I had a daily errand 500 meters away, and I brought my goats. The gravel road (I hope the translation machine served me here) was frozen, like concrete.

As you see, there can be many reasons for your problem. Sometimes a photo or two can help us figure out something. But don't throw any towels, goats are wonderful pets!


----------



## SonRise Acres (Apr 24, 2018)

I would start with the questions above. That will give us a lot of information.

Just a tip on the hooves: what is their pasture made of? Any rocky areas? I learned when I put some very large rocks for my goats to play and walk on in my pasture the hoof care got considerably easier. I still have to do hoof care but they naturally were better from use.


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Trollmor said:


> But don't throw any towels,


So close! The phrases are "Throw in the towel." and "Don't throw in the towel."

It comes from very early boxing rules (boxing is a sport, not a holiday here)
One of the boxer's towels being thrown into the boxing ring was a concession to the other boxer. The other boxer would win.

You were using it correctly, just the wording was a bit off.


----------



## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Haha, of course, an 'in' must be there! The saying has been translated to our wild remote language, and the explanation did follow. (I might not agree about boxing or chicken fights being sports, though.) I think, on the other hand, that Mrsdowns so far did not get the advice to "sell everything and forget it all".

Not from us. We probably love those m-m-m-ies too much.:inlove:


----------



## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

fivemoremiles said:


> Maybe you are not a bot after all


 May I ask, what you mean by that?


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

toth boer goats said:


> May I ask, what you mean by that?


I think he was saying that he really thought that particular post was helpful, and bots don't really say anything helpful or pertinent?


----------



## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Was answered here Maria, LOL 

https://www.thegoatspot.net/threads/kidding-3-times-in-2-years.202397/#post-2194295


----------



## fivemoremiles (Jan 19, 2010)

toth boer goats you post so many times that i was wondering if you were a robot algorithm that scans through the posts so i tested you.
you are not a bot you are amazing for scanning so many posts.

Thanks for your time for making TGF such a great plsce to come and learn.


----------



## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

:clever: 
Aww, shucks. (shy)
:ty::up:


----------



## Mrsdowns (Aug 1, 2018)

We give loose selenium salt, same as the sheep. Also, copper bolus. 

Located in southeast Ohio. We have boer and boer mix. We have a total of four does, two doelings, a wether and a buck. Started with the goats almost two years ago. Last year's doe kids and wether just don't seem to be growing. Of five does we have one kid this year. Dapple with overgrown hooves. 

They get very little grain once a day. Corn, oats and a general purpose/sweet feed. They have access to clean water and hay always. Most of the time they have a round bale which they share with last year's 8 lambs. Also they are not fed on the ground. 

I'm not sure how much ground there is but there is more than enough for what's in that area. They have access to the barn at all times. There is a little of everything there. Grass, mud, gravel. Rocks to climb on. A brush pile they climb on and lie in. 

I have only been "farming" for 7 years but my husband has raised animals all his 46 years. Cows and sheep. He has me wanting to sell all the goats, he pretty much hates them.


----------



## Mrsdowns (Aug 1, 2018)

There is also concrete around the barn.

None of them have diarrhea and they look healthy.


----------



## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Goats really do have different needs than cows and sheep. The slow growth is probably coccidia. If the have it long enough, it can stunt their growth. They need a diet that is at least 2:1 calcium to phosphorus. So the corn, oats and stock feed is higher in phosphorus which means they need more calcium which you can find in alfalfa. They also really do need a good loose mineral.


----------



## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

Did you purchase them all from the same breeder? Are they all related?

Hoof growth can be a strongly genetic trait. If they all came from a herd where they don't cull for fast or unhealthy feet then genetics may be part of it.

It's hard to cover everything really in one post. But if you and your husband do not like the goats and resent caring for them then yes, selling may be the best option.


----------



## Mrsdowns (Aug 1, 2018)

None of them are related other than the dapple doeling and the all black buck kid and their dam. Those ones have good hooves. The good problem is the big dapple doe. The rest I can deal with. 

I did not go into this on a whim. I read numerous books and article about goats and raising them. I understand goats needs are different from cows and cows needs different from sheep and so on. My husband has had a few goats years ago when they weren't worth $20. He said he has never seen anything white like what we have. 
Trust me, the only reason we have them is because I wanted them because our cows are not friendly and I don't like the sheep. I don't resent them but I do feel like they are just waiting for a reason to die. Worse than sheep.


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Thank you for that very thorough answer. So helpful!

Definitely minerals, Oh my yes.
A fecal check for coccidia will tell you if they have that problem, too. I'm not denying that should be done. But the minerals are inescapable. And the lack of protein too.

They live with your sheep, yes? That means you need a quality sheep mineral that will have a LOW level of copper. That leaves out most cattle and goat minerals. Do any of your stores offer a sheep mineral or an all species mineral? If you find one, come back and show us the tag, and we can help you evaluate the quality. I'll also do some research online and come back to you. What stores do you have in your area? Rural King? Southern States? TSC? etc.

DON'T get medicated minerals.
Do your goats get any salt other than the selenium salt? If not, A cobalt salt for them to choose from may well help your reproductive woes. Here is an example of a cobalt lick, it is safe for sheep.
https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/p...-cobalt-iodized-salt-block-50-lb?cm_vc=-10005
The last salt lick I'll mention is a sea salt lick. Goats (and sheep too!) require a lot of salt and it is good to give some choice. Here is one that is very good
https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/redmond-rock-all-natural-mineral-salt-7-lb?cm_vc=-10005
and what I normally get, because I can get it at a store close to me
https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/trophy-rock-all-natural-mineral-lick-12-lb?cm_vc=-10005

There is a product called Replamin Gel Plus. I highly recommend that for your goats. Here is a link.
https://www.jefferspet.com/products/replamin-gel-plus
I get the 300 cc size because it is so economical. I also got the gun
https://www.jefferspet.com/products/applicator-gun
and I highly recommend it. Makes it so easy.
The minerals in it are so very available that you should soon see the deficiencies being corrected. Don't give it to your sheep, that level of copper could kill them. It is safe for cattle.

OK. Do any of your stores provide a general purpose or multi species protein tub? Here's an example from TSC.
https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/dumor-general-purpose-protein-tub-125-lb?rfk=1
and
https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/dumor-16-protein-tub-200-lb?rfk=1
Protein is important because there's not a lot in the diet, and to produce muscle (meat) and kids, you need protein.

If you can, I'd lose the corn in your feed. It really has very little to offer in nutrition or health, either to your goats or your sheep. Whole oats, whole barley, are better nutritionally for them. Can you show us the sweet feed you use? We'll have a better idea then, because there are so many and they vary in value.

The last nutritional thing I'm going to mention is a product called ZinPro 40. It is an excellent bioavailable source of zinc that does not have copper in it, so it is safe for your sheep. You only have to add a little bit to your animals' rations to benefit them, so it is very economical.

Final thoughts, because I have to get to work myself. I am so sorry your husband hates the goats. They are tricky to learn about when you think they'll be the same as you've known your whole life. They just aren't. You aren't going to be willing to pour money down their throats to get this sorted. Although what I've mentioned seems like a lot, this is the most economical way toward a healthy productive herd I've been able to think of. The several salt licks will last a long time, the Replamin will start to sort things out almost immediately, The protein tubs are a set it and forget it issue, the zinc is vital for animal hooves, hair, wool, skin, and you can have it mixed right in with the rations you are already giving. The corn is just a waste of money anyway.

I do understand. If you decide to throw in the towel, you will at least be passing along a healthy herd, and NOTHING (except the Replamin) I've recommended will harm your sheep. Will even help them.

I have to go. I'll be back. Good luck.


----------



## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Sometimes it seems they look for a way to die, too!LOL
Mariarose is our go to on minerals. Most here have regular fecals done to check internal parasites. www.wormx.info has best practices.


----------



## Mrsdowns (Aug 1, 2018)




----------



## Mrsdowns (Aug 1, 2018)

We use Gerber and Sons for general purpose and whole oats. We grow corn on the farm. 

I am going to look into getting their fecal checked.


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Yes, I'm familiar with that salt. It is excellent. The other licks mentioned above will still be useful, but that is very good.
I'll talk about the feed in a moment.

Hubbard has a sheep mineral whose Typical Analysis numbers look good. I can't find ingredients online. The product number is
Sheep Mineral #7Z65
The dealer locator is
https://www.hubbardfeeds.com/dealerlocator

The mineral mix below is one I can get in my area, I do not know if you can or not, perhaps call them? But if you look at the Analysis and ingredients, you can have a standard by which to judge the tags you look at.
http://www.tennesseefarmerscoop.coop/ourcoop08/feeds/products/sheep/productDetail.aspx?fm=79 If I had sheep, I would be getting this.

These people look good, but remember, you don't want fly control or deccox in your mineral. You want the sheep and goats to eat what they need.
http://www.hunternutrition.com/sheepmineral.html

OK, the feed. Boy, I sure understand you wanting to use what you already grow. I really do. If this is nonnegotiable, then please consider moving away from a feed in which the first ingredient is Corn???
Since you don't give much, it really needs to pack as much nutrition in a small space as you can. Consider mixing your own? My local co-op will custom mix for me as long as I get a minimum of 300 lbs. That's 300 total, not per ingredient. There are several excellent DIY recipes here on TGS, and some do include corn. I can help look up some of these recipes if you need me to, or perhaps people will chime in with their own.

One last idea before I close again. There is a certain stage of growth where the maximum amount of nutrition has been drawn up into the corn plant. If you can cut the corn stalks at that stage, and dry them in stooks, you can then feed them in that form all Winter, stalks, leaves, ears, and all. Now, you don't have to do your entire corn crop that way! I grew up in Indiana, and although our cornfields did not rival Iowa's in size, they were still far larger than I was willing to stook! But wat about part of it?

Here's the thing about the corn grain (what we think of when we say corn). It has very little nutrition, a LOT of sugar, and no fiber to help the rumens cope with all that sugar. But, cutting the stalk at the peak of nutrition and feeding the whole thing? Different as night and day. But our equipment is not designed to do that any longer. So I'm just throwing this idea out there.

If this is something that anyone else would like to try, you can even grow pole beans and pole peas into the mix. Grow them together, harvest them together, feed them together.

I have to go again. Get back with me on the stores you have around you and we can be more pinpointed in our help.


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Oh, I forgot. Horse hoof NIPPERS... Just sayin'...


----------



## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

I am wondering, if perhaps the gene for growing hoofs might be the same as for growing horns? In that case the ones with great need for trimming would also carry long beautiful horns?

And yes, we know you know they are wonderful pets! :inlove:


----------



## Mrsdowns (Aug 1, 2018)

We're going to be changing a lot around here in the coming months. First is the mineral. I can't find anything exactly like the sheep mineral mariarose suggested but I found one locally that is very similar. 

As for feed we're going to be getting rid of the GP and decreasing the corn. As of right now I'm having trouble finding barley.

Is there something else I could try with the oats and BOSS ? 

Also as soon as the weather changes the goats that we're going to keep will have their own space, barn and all! 

Thank you all for the advise.


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Mrsdowns said:


> I can't find anything exactly like the sheep mineral mariarose suggested but I found one locally that is very similar.


Oh, I'm so glad. Local solutions are almost always best. When you get it, we'd LOVE a picture of your tag? Pretty Please?


Mrsdowns said:


> As for feed... Is there something else I could try


Are you asking about one of the DIY solutions? Or are you wanting an already bagged feed?


----------



## Mrsdowns (Aug 1, 2018)

We were going to mix it at home, I just can't get barley. I've checked rural king and my local store.

I will get a pic of the mineral after bit. My baby girl kept me up all night, I may need a nap.


----------



## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Local farmer? Usually cheaper, too.

And congrats to the baby!


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

@goathiker, can you give your feed recipe? It's one of the best I've seen anywhere.


----------



## Mrsdowns (Aug 1, 2018)

It's not really grown around here. If our local feed mill doesn't have it in not going to be able to find it local. I'm not in a big grain farming area. We have a lot of corn and soy beans.


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

@Mrsdowns here is a thread you might like. I'm continuing to look.
https://www.thegoatspot.net/threads/favorite-goat-feed-mix-pre-or-homemade.199733/

Both of these products are very decent
https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/search/Purina Stocker


----------



## Mrsdowns (Aug 1, 2018)

Everything is still barley. I'll figure it out. Thanks.


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Mrsdowns said:


> Everything is still barley. I'll figure it out. Thanks.


??? I've just quickly looked through and plenty of posts in that thread don't mention barley...

But OK. Let us know what you need from us, anytime. We'll try to help.

Hugs.


----------



## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Hm, what is wrong with corn? onder:


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

@Trollmor Corn in the US is a nonnutritive sugar with little to no fiber. For the livestock (and pets, and people) to stay healthy, the use of corn should be managed carefully. Instead, it is in everything here.

Europe has different goals and standards, and your corn may well still have nutrients. I don't know. I'm specifying US corn only.


----------



## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Corn - also called maize - is mainly imported from America. Only recently farmers here have begun growing it any much.

(And in Swedish, the word 'korn' means either _grain_ or _barley_.)


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Trollmor said:


> Corn - also called maize


I should have thought to use the word Maize.


----------



## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Don't worry! But sugar? Here, we use it for pop corn, for baking, for salads, and it is supposed to be as nutrious as any seed.


----------



## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

Trollmor said:


> Don't worry! But sugar? Here, we use it for pop corn, for baking, for salads, and it is supposed to be as nutrious as any seed.


Wrap it in aluminum foil and put it on the grill or fire. Yum  A lot of people here do that, then melt butter over it and some add salt on top of that. I just like it as is.

I wonder on the feed... if the goats are in with sheep, couldn't you find a good sheep feed? Then that would be safe for everyone, but then there is still the issue of the goats not getting enough copper.

Your goats are mix breed, forgive my tired mind if I read wrong, but not sure what they are mixed with correct? If not, the growth could be partly genetic. I'd recommend the fecal, and definitely feed change, and if they still aren't growing to your liking, considering selling and getting replacements that suit what you want.


----------



## Sophie123 (Feb 18, 2019)

We feed ours a lot of grain in winter and their hoofs grow really fast also. I trim them once a month. If you keep up with it, it's easier that way. Not sure why you don't get a lot of kids, maybe not a good buck? Maybe get some sheep instead, they are easier. Goats take up a lot of time, but I love my goats so that's ok. But if you don't , get rid of them I would say.

We are fairly new to goats also ( 2.5 years) but we had 26 goat kids ( all alive and well, except one that was born when it was really cold and died) from 7 goats. One had 6 ( photo on my intro) , one had 4, a lot had 3 and only the one that died was a single. We feed them beef commodity which has the minerals in it goats need also, 3 way mix( gluten , soy, corn) and a small amount of sunflower seeds and alfalfa pellets. Plus in winter when it is really cold they get free choice hay. Goats are a lot of work, having a problem with parasites at the moment

forgot: they get mineral blocks specific for goats also


----------



## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Sophie123 said:


> We feed ours a lot of grain in winter and their hoofs grow really fast also. I trim them once a month. If you keep up with it, it's easier that way. Not sure why you don't get a lot of kids, maybe not a good buck? Maybe get some sheep instead, they are easier. Goats take up a lot of time, but I love my goats so that's ok. But if you don't , get rid of them I would say.
> 
> We are fairly new to goats also ( 2.5 years) but we had 26 goat kids ( all alive and well, except one that was born when it was really cold and died) from 7 goats. One had 6 ( photo on my intro) , one had 4, a lot had 3 and only the one that died was a single. We feed them beef commodity which has the minerals in it goats need also, 3 way mix( gluten , soy, corn) and a small amount of sunflower seeds and alfalfa pellets. Plus in winter when it is really cold they get free choice hay. Goats are a lot of work, having a problem with parasites at the moment
> 
> forgot: they get mineral blocks specific for goats also


What do you use as your parasite management plan?


----------



## Sophie123 (Feb 18, 2019)

I don't know how to quote things on here..sorry

Parasite management plan: we use FAMACHA for worms, and deworm only when needed with both Cydectin and Valbazen ( one right after the other). We deworm on an empty stomach. So far we have not lost a goat to worms yet, and I haven't even seen one with really pale eyelids.
We went to some classes on parasites given through the ag extension office run by the vet school here, that really helped. Worst mistakes ( according to them) is to deworm all of them on a regular basis, not use enough dewormer, use the wrong dewormer than no longer works in your area, or rotate dewormers. All those things are bad and create resistant worms. Worms are a huge problem here , very wet. Another thing we do is rotate pastures. 
If you are estimating weight of a goat, you are better off giving more dewormer than less. It won't hurt them any to get extra. 
Hope this helps. 

We are now having a problem with mites , I have a thread on that on the health forum. 

I really don't know how anyone around this area has organic goats. It must be really hard, or they just let a bunch of them die and the strong survive. I just don't want to do that.


----------



## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Sophie123 said:


> I don't know how to quote things on here..sorry.


Down to the right there is a box "Reply". Click on that, and after a while you will find the entire entry in the box where you type your entries.


Sophie123 said:


> just let a bunch of them die and the strong survive. I just don't want to do that.


Thank you!!!


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Sophie123 said:


> I don't know how to quote things on here..sorry


If you highlight what you want to quote, then two options will appear. If you click on the reply option then what you have highlighted will appear immediately in a comment box. If you hit the quote option, then it will be stored as you collect quotes, then you can deposit all of them in the same comment box. That is what I have done here, collected 2 quotes from your comment and put them both here.

This is what you do if you don't want to have the entire quote in your answer, just part(s) of it.


Sophie123 said:


> or they just let a bunch of them die and the strong survive.


I don't claim to be organic, and I'm having as much trouble right now as anyone else at the moment with this weather, just I have a point to make that is a good complement to what you said.

I don't "let" anyone die from worms. I absolutely do treat, but if I have someone who is repeatedly wormy, I do move them along so they are no longer in my breeding pool. Sometimes that does mean killing them myself.

So sometimes they do die, but not because I just let them. I see that as an acceptable use of livestock that should not be in the gene pool for one reason or another. As a result, I am using fewer and fewer doses of chemical dewormers. This takes time (years) but I believe it can work, to cull for parasite tolerance.

Again, I do treat, please don't take me wrong on this.


----------



## singinggoatgirl (Apr 13, 2016)

Hey, everyone has given you great advice! 

About the barley: It is similar in starch, protein, and fiber to oats. If you can't find barley, just replace the word "barley" in any recipe with "oats." No big deal. The biggest difference between oats and barley is in the levels of trace minerals they take up, but that isn't a deal breaker when you have good minerals available separately. That's what I do, and it works well.


----------



## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Sophie123 said:


> I don't know how to quote things on here..sorry
> 
> Parasite management plan: we use FAMACHA for worms, and deworm only when needed with both Cydectin and Valbazen ( one right after the other). We deworm on an empty stomach. So far we have not lost a goat to worms yet, and I haven't even seen one with really pale eyelids.
> We went to some classes on parasites given through the ag extension office run by the vet school here, that really helped. Worst mistakes ( according to them) is to deworm all of them on a regular basis, not use enough dewormer, use the wrong dewormer than no longer works in your area, or rotate dewormers. All those things are bad and create resistant worms. Worms are a huge problem here , very wet. Another thing we do is rotate pastures.
> ...


Have you tried VetRX for mites? What is your area? We have super wet weather and worms are terrible here. I deworm preventively naturally, I would never deworm preventively with chemical wormers. If needed, I'm not against chemicals, but I don't believe in using them unless there is a confirmed fecal or worm analysis. That being said, we haven't had to use chemicals even with our barber pole epidemic here, and herbs and garlic with proper management have done well for us.


----------



## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

ksalvagno said:


> They need a diet that is at least 2:1 calcium to phosphorus.


The quote (?) changes during the year, due to different stages of growth, pregnancy, lactation etc. Therefore it is very nice that goats generally can combine what they need, if constantly offered a nice buffé (word?) of salts and minerals.

In one way, I should say that a good growth of hair and hoofs/nails is a sign of good health. (Just like jumping fences!  )


----------



## Sophie123 (Feb 18, 2019)

"So sometimes they do die, but not because I just let them. I see that as an acceptable use of livestock that should not be in the gene pool for one reason or another. As a result, I am using fewer and fewer doses of chemical dewormers. This takes time (years) but I believe it can work, to cull for parasite tolerance."

Sorry, still can't seem to get the quote working...so I copied and pasted 

Anyway, we have 1 goat that came from a farm where they dewormed monthly , needed or not that needs to be dewormed more than any of our others. But she is our Lamancha milk goat, which we only have 2 and she was not cheap, so she stays. I have to deworm her maybe 3 times a year. The others maybe once a year, and I usually deworm the does after they give birth, but I suspect they have pale eyelids then because of blood loss from giving birth maybe. 
If it's a meat goat that isn't as healthy as the rest, it goes to the auction, or in the freezer.


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

You seem to be making the decisions you need to make for your own herd. No one can do more than that.


----------



## Sophie123 (Feb 18, 2019)

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Have you tried VetRX for mites? What is your area? We have super wet weather and worms are terrible here. I deworm preventively naturally, I would never deworm preventively with chemical wormers. If needed, I'm not against chemicals, but I don't believe in using them unless there is a confirmed fecal or worm analysis. That being said, we haven't had to use chemicals even with our barber pole epidemic here, and herbs and garlic with proper management have done well for us.


Ok, think I finally figure out how to quote 

Barber pole in this area also, we are in SW Virginia, very wet, especially last year, and this year also so far, flood watch at the moment again. But we seem to not have too much problem with worms. We do use chemicals, but maybe once or twice a year and only when needed.


----------

