# Grinding Teeth :(



## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

So L.G. is grinding teeth. I noticed this am he was off feed and acting off.
Here is what I have done....

This morning:

Temp 101.3 

Gave him AC drench (then witnessed him pee two minutes later after watching for it for over an hour  )

1 1/2 cc banamine 

Probiotics in water but haven't seen him drink

Tylan [email protected] 1cc per 25 lbs SQ because I am paranoid of silent pneumonia

He gets hay 24/7 but has not been eating it today. He is drylotted...no new feed has been given.

Tonight:
Temp 99.8
6 cc bcomplex
60cc oatmeal stout (flat)

Poor guy is still teeth grinding, not constant but enough....seems very melancholy..not a happy camper 

His eyelids are a nice pink. He was recently (last week) dewormed with Valbazen @ 1cc per 10 lbs.

It's possible he got hurt by my other buck, as they are both in rut and rowdy. Not sure what all it could be except maybe pneumonia or injury? No response from him anywhere on his body by touch...so no obvious injury.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

I should mention he always runs a lower temp...never 103...


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## catharina (Mar 17, 2016)

Will he let you feel & press all over him to look for an injury? What a relief it's not UC though! Is he doing anything else different like lying down a lot, limping, or hunching his back?


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Could you get a fecal done to include coccidia?

ETA: If he isn't drinking the probiotics, I would give it to him orally at a much higher concentration.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

He lets me feel everywhere and has no issues with it. Lying down quite a bit. Yes, I can get a fecal but I'd rather just treat for it honestly....the vets is over an hour drive and I won't have a car tomorrow  DD is using it to go to work.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

He is pooping berries. I am laughing at myself for not thinking of coccidia :lol: That is one of the first things I suspect all the time!! But for some reason, not today :doh:


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Suzanne_Tyler said:


> Could you get a fecal done to include coccidia?
> 
> ETA: If he isn't drinking the probiotics, I would give it to him orally at a much higher concentration.


I struggle to know how much powder to give. I use Goats Prefer Powdered Probiotics. It comes with a scoop in it...


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Just give him maybe five or six scoops. You can't OD it.


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

Can you hear any rumen noises or have you seen him bring up cud?

The Banamine may have contributed to the temperature drop but still concerning 

I would add B-Complex injections to the sequence you began above and continue with all the above and see if you notice changes.

If there is no evidence of rumen activity, I would go ahead with trying to do a successful cud transfer. Risky for fingers and horrifically smelly but very effective. 

Poor Pal, hope he turns around quickly. Can you offer him any leafy branches?


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

No rumen noises that I have heard...he won't eat anything I offer. Now he has very watery drops of drool, but his mouth is closed? I gave him more bcomplex this morning along with the Tylan and a beer drench.I also dosed him for cocci...

He coughed this morning and brought out some snot...he has coughed this morning a few times but not sure if that's caused by the AC drench from yesterday morning. He really didn't like that one.
So frustrated!

Thanks Suzanne...I'll try that today...right now he's about sick of me


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

I haven't given banamine again...may tonight if he is still grinding.He's laying down a lot.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

So weird...he was acting totally fine the day before :shrug:


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Hmmm... there are some acorns in their pen...


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

Have you re-taken his temperature today? I know you feel so bad harassing them constantly when they already aren't feeling well. It's really hard. Chin up - you've got this!

The drooling is concerning for the possibility that it is a neurological symptom related to polio/listeriosis. I'm not sure if you should switch to Penicillin or not at this point. Perhaps someone else could chime in on that. You would want to continue the Tylan if it is pneumonia. Is the B-Complex you are using the fortified type? Just in case this is polio/listeriosis. 

I would repeat the Banamine if he is still grinding teeth but I would take his temperature first before you do it. 

Have they ever had access to acorns before? Mine eat them regularly with no issues but supposedly they can build up a tolerance for the tannins. 

The low temperature and lack of rumen activity certainly point to more of a rumen issue than a pneumonia type issue but sometimes these things happen in sequence.

Can you tell if he has drank anything at all? Maybe put multiple sources of water in the pen and some closer to him? Flavor one with kool-aid or Tang if it will convince him? 

If he has not drank anything at all by tonight you are going to need to check for dehydration and possibly drench him if he will swallow.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

The tree has always been there next to the pen. I have never noticed him eating any acorns but it doesn't mean he never has, just not sure.
Right now all he is doing is laying down in his shed. Not eating,drinking,chewing cud...nothing

I do have Thiamine and PenG on hand...I am hoping he improves today


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

He won't drink at all but will swallow when drenched if he has to


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

This is him


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Temp 98.3 
BUT...I got him to move around a little and he nibbled on some pine branches so's there's something


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Have you tried some activated charcoal?


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

No....I have some....how would I mix it? And how many tsps? I have some powdered AC that I use for soaping...


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I'm not sure how much. Just in some water.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Tonight's temp 99.9

Gave beer drench with probiotics
Tylan 200
6 cc bcomplex

He nibbled at some hay tonight and had less teeth grinding so I hope he is on the mend. If he doesn't satisfy me eating by tomorrow morning I will make a slurry and add AC to it.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

keep working his rumen...a cud transfer is a good idea but be careful...I tried one today and got bit!! Those teeth are sharp!! and I swear! they know you are coming!!! offer leaves from his fav trees,,pine or cedar are both healing...

best wishes


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

ugh...temp 97.8

No appetite this morning so I have a slurry of alfalfa pellets in the works. I haven't seen him poop so drenched with beer and MOM. 

6cc bcomplex and his Tylan 200 along with second dose cocci meds.

He's standing some now though.....


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

I am not bold enough for a cud transfer! lol....still trying with probiotics at night. How about goats milk drench?

The drooling seems to have stopped...I'm thinking it was from the AC drench burning....


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

Standing is good! Dropping temp is not...

If you carefully tuck a few leaves or a few soft short pieces of hay back in his mouth will he chew them? 

Cud transfer really isn't that bad aside from the smell factor! I wore a thin pair of gardening gloves when I had to do it before. The smell is horrific, but having the farm-specific bacterias is critical for his compromised rumen. 

I hope you see a normal poop and pee now that he's standing a bit. Has he drank anything? Dehydration would be a critical concern at this point.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

I haven't seen him drinking but I did see him pee a good stream yesterday. I have not seen him poop but I have been working so not able to watch him for prolonged periods of time. I keep running out every hour or so to check on him. 

I'll have to try the cud transfer...but my girls aren't to tolerant for that kind of thing. I'd need to get it at the right moment before they swallow it!

I'll try tucking food in and see...


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## brigadoonfarmgal (Jul 14, 2016)

How is he doing?


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Well...I drenched him some alfalfa water (about 300cc ) but he is getting dehydrated. He doesn't fight me for that drench though so that's a plus.He ate one bite of pine...but I separated him for now because I am going to drench him every hour with alfalfa water. I put some pine branches in with him and some probiotic water. He's shivering so i put a heat lamp above him too.
Getting dismayed...not sure he'll turn around


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Still no poop...should I give more MOM?


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

Do you have Clostridium CD anti-toxin (not toxoid/vaccine) on hand? What about Activated Charcoal?
It's grasping at straws at this point but I would give doses of both since you are not seeing improvement otherwise. You can get activated charcoal at the human pharmacy in capsules. I have only used it once and I opened 4 capsules and drenched it with 12 cc of water but that powder is insanely messy - it maybe be more effective if you can get the capsules themselves down him.

I would personally vote no on the MOM unless you really suspect poison or constipation. He hasn't eaten for several days at this point and rumen isn't functioning so nothing left in the bowels to be flushed out. That's just my personal feeling though since MOM would continue flush out any good stuff you've managed to get in the rumen (probiotics, alfalfa, etc). 

Rooting for you and him! Not sure what else to offer at this point. I've heard Cumin can be used to bring up the body temperature? But I have never used it.

Have you re-checked his FAMACHA score today? Just in case you're original idea of internal injury from another buck was correct? You might see some anemia if he was bleeding internally.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Heading out now to give him his slurry....and will recheck eyelids.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

I will give AC that I have on hand and some antitoxin...which I do have...just gotta look up the dose


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Gave activated charcoal, cd antitoxin (12 cc sq in two spots and 1 6 cc shot IM for a total of 18cc)
Gave more slurry and he swallows...but he was reluctant to stand this time. Also gave 120 cc of probiotic water.
Temp with heat lamp went up to 101.2. 
I'm at a loss...he looks like crap 
Eyelids still a good pink


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

6:50 update

Temp 101.0

Drenched with 16 ounces of slurry ( a large DD cup full) and 60 cc's water and probiotics.

Husband is getting some Guiness and will have that later tonight. He also picked up a couple of enemas to have on hand.

Guess I'll try to give time for the cd antitoxin and AC to work though. Just hard waiting and watching...and I wreak of a buck. It'll be worth it to stink if it makes him better!

Does anyone have any ideas on how much slurry/water would be too much? I am going to give it every hour until bed then see where he's at.


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## Nab58 (May 8, 2016)

I don't have any advice for you but want to say how I admire the effort you're putting in. Hope you find the treatment that works for him.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Ok drastic change  He is now down and head circling. This is a couple hours after antitoxin....Just administered 6cc Thiamine and 8 cc PenG. Switching gears because I'm desperate....should I discontinue bcomplex and Tylan? I also gave 1.5 cc banamine ...should I still give him slurry?

Here's a video


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Nab58 said:


> I don't have any advice for you but want to say how I admire the effort you're putting in. Hope you find the treatment that works for him.


Thank you! I could cry right now...I hate seeing him like this


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Oh no  Praying for him!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Pm Goathiker. She could probably give you advice. I hope you can pull him through.


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## sassykat6181 (Nov 28, 2012)

You've been trying so hard. I have found that once the head circling starts, it's too late.
But this is what I've done:
start high doses of Thiamine or Fortified B complex every 6 hours, Pen G every 12, and Banamine.

100 mg Thiamine/B complex: 1 cc per 20 lbs. 200 mg Thiamine 1 cc per 40 lbs.
Pen G 1 cc per 20 lbs.
Banamine 1 cc per 200 lbs every 12 hours or 1 cc per 100 lbs every 24 hours.

Do you have white tailed deer? Are his back legs limp? Could be meningeal worm


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Oh gosh...that is the ONLY thing I haven't treated for! But his head circling has stopped since the Banamine,Thiamine and PenG shots...so maybe???

He is leaning up against a bale in the stall to hold him up...


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Well that's a relief. I was so scared  
Still praying for you both.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks Suzanne...he is currently leaning on a hay bale to stay upright. I have no idea what has been going on or what started all this....very frustrating. Sunday he was fine...Monday off feed , teeth grinding and a slight cough...Tuesday off feed, grinding teeth and laying down more...and today he was very depressed and head pressing this afternoon...but no teeth grinding..then between 7 and 8 tonight he must have started the head swinging and eye dancing. Since those last shots of Banamine, PenG and Thiamin, he is no longer head pressing or swinging. He can't keep himself up straight though. 

I have no idea where he would pick up polio from? The hay is fine to the eye/nose. The feed looks ok too....wondering if it's that then maybe from being off feed for a couple days? Weird though because I have been giving him bcomplex since day 1?


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

This is him just now...literally 2 hours after the video I took. His eyes are not dancing like they were and he seems a little more "alert"....next dose is at 2 am but going to drench him with slurry and beer at 11.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Well, this does not look good  He is breathing fast and constantly swinging around. Gave more Thiamine. I'll be surprised if he makes it.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

It's so weird how he goes from better to worse to better  He keeps flapping his mouth and for a little while he was yelling out. I'm heartbroken. I feel like I have failed him. Poor goat.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Just a thought....I would suspect polio symptoms maybe secondary...If I understand correctly....when a goat goes off feed/hay/graze they cant produce the B 1 they need

so glad he is feeling better


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

well, he was.....now he's bad again


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Not sure if I should just put him down at this point.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Here's a video from just now....he's actually not flapping his mouth like before. I went ahead and gave more banamine. It's been 4.5 hours since the last dose. I can't stand to see him in pain....at least he's not yelling out now.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

:tears: Poor baby...sounds like treatment is helping..just not consistent in the results?? May need more time...


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Should I give the thiamine every 4 hours?


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Yes, I would...and if you have Dex I would switch from Banamine to dex...dosing per Tennessee meat goats article..


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Dexamethasone ( cortico-steroid) injections can be used to reduce brain stem swelling. Dexamethasone will induce labor in pregnant does, but the doe is likely to abort anyhow as a result of this infection, so producers might be wise to abort the pregnancy if they wish to save the sick doe. Dexamethasone dosage is 5 to 6 cc per 100 pounds bodyweight given IM in decreasing amounts daily. Example: Goat is 100 pounds liveweight. Dosage is 6 cc into the muscle on Day One, 5 cc on Day Two, 4 cc on Day Three, 3 cc on Day Four, 2 cc on Day Five, one cc on Day Six, nothing on Day Seven. If the goat is over 100 pounds, drop dosages daily in increments of two or three cc's. Example: Dose a 200 pound goat at 12 cc on Day One, 10 cc on Day Two, 8 cc on Day Three, 6 cc on Day Four, 4 cc on Day Five, 2 cc on Day Six, nothing on Day Seven. Dexamethasone should be tapered off rather than quit abruptly.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks, not sure I can get any dex...how often on the PenG? I have read every 6 and every 12


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I might go every 6 hours right now...

Dex is pretty cheap but need a vet to get it...


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Ok...will do every 6.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

3 am check....he's not looking good. Lots of fast breathing and head swinging...gave more PenG and Thiamine...seems to calm it a little. Eyes dancing. 

At a loss...


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## Dayna (Aug 16, 2012)

I'm so sorry. I wish I knew the answer.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I sure hope he makes it for you.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks guys....he doesn't seem to be improving  Not sure how long to keep up treatments. I'll see how he is at 7 am and go from there. I did give Ivomec SQ in case of mworm....getting some safeguard in the am...all I have is Ivomec and Valbazen.


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## brigadoonfarmgal (Jul 14, 2016)

Did you continue the CD Antitoxin (double the preventative dose) at 12 hour intervals? What the body doesn't need will be excreted in the urine. ((hug)) you are doing your best and he couldn't ask for a more caring person looking out after him! You have my best thoughts with you!

Edit: 
I found this article posted by a person who seems to have many of the same symptoms as your goat is displaying and the vet diagnosis...
http://www.goatworld.com/articles/listeriosis/listeriosis_gwmf.shtml


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

7 am

Gave Thiamine...he's standing right now. Also gave 300 cc's of slurry and 60 cc's dark beer. He's still kind of banging his head but not as wildly as at 3 am.

This is by far the worst thing I have ever watched an animal go through.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

brigadoonfarmgal said:


> Did you continue the CD Antitoxin (double the preventative dose) at 12 hour intervals? What the body doesn't need will be excreted in the urine. ((hug)) you are doing your best and he couldn't ask for a more caring person looking out after him! You have my best thoughts with you!


Thank you! No I didn't...but should I? I guess it couldn't hurt...


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## brigadoonfarmgal (Jul 14, 2016)

yes you are supposed to continue the Antitoxin every 12 hours. I know how hard it is to continue to stick him (I struggled with this myself) you are doing your best!


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Poor poor thing  
How is he now?


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Oops, disregard the last question. Didn't see there was another page on this thread :/


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Here is a video of him a few minutes ago...


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

I would guess that the Polio has set in due to the rumen stress of whatever the initial issue was (is). 

If he were mine, I would switch to strict Polio/Listeriosis treatment and forego all other items since I would consider that the most critical issue now. So Thiamine, Pen G, and Dex only per Tennessee Meat Goats dosing and timing recommendations. I would stop beer, banamine, anti-toxin, deworming, and everything else. But keep trying to keep him hydrated and get some nutrition in him (alfalfa slurry and/or electrolytes as needed). 

We are all rooting for you, you are working so hard for him both physically & emotionally.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Here is one that shows his dehydration and weight loss...


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks Katey...I am only going to treat for polio/listeriosis right now as you suggested. I will need to use banamine however instead of dex and will mix probiotics and a little beer in each slurry.

I have no idea what started this. And he was getting bcomplex from day one of being off feed!!

I am hoping for more improvement when I drench and treat him again at 11...


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## brigadoonfarmgal (Jul 14, 2016)

oh....that breaks my heart I am so wishing you the best!!!


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks brigadoon! I am going to try and catch a nap....got 3 hours of sleep last night


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

He's still the same as the last video. Headed to TSC to get more needles and syringes. Got another DD cup of alfalfa pellet/water mix down him. Going to try drenching every hour if I can stay awake! Making Mom drive to the store....


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## brigadoonfarmgal (Jul 14, 2016)

fingers are crossed here for you both!


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks! I have been giving Thiamine 6 cc's every 4 hours and PenG every 6 hours at 1cc per 20 lbs. 
I have gotten 32 ounces of alfalfa pellt/water/probiotic/beer mix into him just a few minutes ago. He swallows and does not fight the drenching. He is just starting to twitch when I give shots...before he would act like he didn't even notice.

He is very lethargic, melancholy, standing a lot and then laying down at times. No dancing eyes and no head swinging too often but he hangs his head low and presses it or bangs it at times.

Will not try to eat/drink. I have not seen him pee today but he did last night.

Next shots at 8 pm but I'll go out and see how he's doing once every hour.

I think this should be made common knowledge that this can happen anytime your goat is off feed....for any reason. Maybe it is and I was just ignorant. I do believe this is secondary to the initial problem, but I am not sure what it was.He was definitely sick before this started.

I truly hate to see him go through this...it is terrible  But as long as he is willing to swallow and stand....I am willing to fight with him!

My family sometimes thinks I'm nuts....but that's ok. I love that goat, and it is my responsibility to do everything I can for him, so that's it.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Any idea how long to give the straight alfalfa slurry? I'm hoping it isn't harmful to give him just alfalfa and nothing with it.He's probably getting two cups a day of alfalfa pellets once they are hydrated and mixed with the beer and probiotic water.

ETA: Tonight makes 3 days on banamine....should I stop after that?


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## grindylo (May 15, 2014)

This is so awful and sad to read! Hugs to both of you! It's really cool that you're doing so much for him. Hope he knows he's loved with all that pestering. <3

Not sure if it matters since you aren't giving a lot, but I remember hearing that alcohol depletes some B vitamins a bit in humans. Is beer for his rumen?


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Yes, it is. and thank you for your kind thoughts and words!


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## rochelle (Jul 10, 2016)

I got tears reading this, reminded me of when I was trying to help my white baby goat...I'm praying for your baby to pull through, it's so hard seeing them in so much pain & our hands are tied, even bring them to ma vet seems they can just do so much which really stinks! ️


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

If anyone has ever experienced this before...would you mind telling me your thoughts on this? He seems to do better, then worse again. Very heartbreaking and if he's going to die, I'd rather end it for him...

Got another 16 ounces slurry in him and then took some videos and pics...they will follow in sequence of how I took them...here's the first when I went for his five o'clock drench


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Then this....


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

so hard to watch!






So I went in and helped him up...which is hard to do against his muscle power...and he was doing this when i left


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Poor guy.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks Karen....I am unsure what else to do. I just gave his 8 o clock Thiamine along with 100 cc's of water with probiotics in it.
I'll be out there again at ten. He is either resting comfortably..or shutting down. Not really sure. 
I'll be giving him his last dose of Banamine tonight at ten...


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

AWE..: ( Im sorry. I wish I new what to tell you...you know him best..you are there...and you will know in your heart when enough is enough...((hugs))


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

While at the the feed store see if they have "Calf Pac". It is a mixture of probotics, yeast, and targeted prebiotics that kill Salmonella, Coronavirus, and others. 

Also see if they have "Save-a-Calf". It is an electrolyte and glucose mixture that will help his energy as well as his dehydration.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks Cathy....I'll wait and see....he doesn't seem to be in pain right now, so that's one good thing.And he is not thrashing around or breathing heavy...he is laying down but you can tell his muscles are stiff.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

goathiker said:


> While at the the feed store see if they have "Calf Pac". It is a mixture of probotics, yeast, and targeted prebiotics that kill Salmonella, Coronavirus, and others.
> 
> Also see if they have "Save-a-Calf". It is an electrolyte and glucose mixture that will help his energy as well as his dehydration.


I have electrolytes with vitamins and power punch...would those work?


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Ohhh, I see...the prebiotics....I'll call the feed store in the morning


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

http://pacificagrisales.com/Dairy/Calf Pac Soluble 001.pdf


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Interesting...do you think this will help him with Polio? Lord knows I have a ton of eggs with 60 hens...can I give him one raw and get that effect?

I thought this was for scours...or am I wrong?


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

The hens that the eggs they use come from have been hyper-injected with different diseases to produce eggs with antibodies to those diseases. 
The antibodies will protect him from getting a secondary disease take over while the yeast restarts his rumen and the probiotics repopulate his gut. 
This is what it means to use it prophylactically, to use it _before_ something else attacks him.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Great explanation. I'll try to find some tomorrow.


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## sassykat6181 (Nov 28, 2012)

I had a young doe go down earlier this spring. She was just turned a year old. She was fine at dinner time, ate her grain and hay, had been out on pasture all day with the herd. Next morning feeding she was laying down and would not eat, not her normal self. I immediately started treating her with b complex, pen g, banamine and antitoxin and drenched electrolytes. Continued this on schedule. By afternoon she was eye dancing and spinning circles. Continued meds through the night. By morning she had made no improvement. I actually thought she had passed because she was laying in the corner with her head totally flipped backwards. When I walked in and touched her she didn't move. But when I started to pick her up, she flinched. I decided that she'd had enough. She wasn't willing to fight.

YOUR guy is making slow improvements and hanging on. I would keep up the fight for as long as he will. Polio/listeriosis are not a quick fix. It can take weeks.
I do wish you and him the best. Hugs to you!


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thank you Kat! I so appreciate your input! I'm sorry your doe didn't make it. I hope LG does...he does seem to be fighting it.
Well, time for PenG and slurry again...


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Just keeping my records straight. Gave 32 ounces slurry and 9 cc PenG. 1 1/2 cc Banamine for last dose.
L.G. was really ramming his face down this time  Hoping the dose of meds will help. Midnight is next Thiamine dosage.


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## rochelle (Jul 10, 2016)

sassykat6181 do you know what your young doe had or got into? This is what scares the crap out of me...I get so attached to my babies, I had a vet tell me I shouldn't have fur babies cuz I become a total wreck/mess when something happens...so I worry all the time especially since I already lost one already to stones! So sorry you lost her so young! Poor baby! ️


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Man ~I just ordered more Thiamine and some Dex...I only have enough thiamine left for 2 days and shipping is 2-3 days but I'm not sure they use Saturdays. I hope I get it before I run out 
Going to give it every six hours instead of four now to try and stretch it. :hair:

Any ideas on Banamine use after three days?


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

happybleats said:


> Dexamethasone ( cortico-steroid) injections can be used to reduce brain stem swelling. Dexamethasone will induce labor in pregnant does, but the doe is likely to abort anyhow as a result of this infection, so producers might be wise to abort the pregnancy if they wish to save the sick doe. Dexamethasone dosage is 5 to 6 cc per 100 pounds bodyweight given IM in decreasing amounts daily. Example: Goat is 100 pounds liveweight. Dosage is 6 cc into the muscle on Day One, 5 cc on Day Two, 4 cc on Day Three, 3 cc on Day Four, 2 cc on Day Five, one cc on Day Six, nothing on Day Seven. If the goat is over 100 pounds, drop dosages daily in increments of two or three cc's. Example: Dose a 200 pound goat at 12 cc on Day One, 10 cc on Day Two, 8 cc on Day Three, 6 cc on Day Four, 4 cc on Day Five, 2 cc on Day Six, nothing on Day Seven. Dexamethasone should be tapered off rather than quit abruptly.


I just ordered some online. He is roughly 150 lbs so it would be 9 cc then 7 then 5 etc?


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

L.G. had his first bowel movement in days! Not to be too informative but it was pellets with white mucous-y stuff...but I'm going to take that as a good sign. He is standing and seems to be trying to "chew" the syringe when I drench him. He got his Thiamine and PenG along with 32 ounces of slurry at 5.

Really worried about the Thiamine running out before I get more.It was a brand new bottle when I started giving it to him but at 6cc every 4-6 hours, it's going fast  I may have to use a combo of bcomplex and pills or something. Any ideas just in case?


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## brigadoonfarmgal (Jul 14, 2016)

I am so happy he was able to go potty! I was wondering what wormer you used on him and how much? While your guys poo probably had mucus in it ..could there have been some tapeworms in it? If you haven't wormed for tapes prior maybe it would help. I had a little doe a long time ago that was all hunched up and nothing I did seemed to help (not nearly as severe as your big guy though) but on a whim I treated with Safegard and low and behold out came the tape and she improved.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

No, no tapes...he has been dewormed in the past month with Valbazen and he had Ivomec SQ.

He for sure has Polio/Listeriosis as a secondary problem. I think the first problem may have been pneumonia....his weight was great before this and so was his coat, and eye color too.

Glad it worked for your doe though


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## brigadoonfarmgal (Jul 14, 2016)

I am glad you are seeing some improvement! I hope it keeps up! I ran to my PC this morning and held my breath until I got to your post hoping you had encouraging news~! My get better wishes are with you !


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Go ahead and use the banamine.


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

If you run out of Thiamine you can switch to Fortified B-Complex but the dosage will be different to get the same amount of thiamine I believe. Do you have fortified B on hand? can you post a photo of the label just to be sure on dosage?


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## sassykat6181 (Nov 28, 2012)

rochelle said:


> sassykat6181 do you know what your young doe had or got into? This is what scares the crap out of me...I get so attached to my babies, I had a vet tell me I shouldn't have fur babies cuz I become a total wreck/mess when something happens...so I worry all the time especially since I already lost one already to stones! So sorry you lost her so young! Poor baby! ️


I have no idea what she got into. The pasture is about 8+ acres. No other goats or the horses got sick. She was up to date on cdt too. She went downhill so fast, I didn't even have time to try and figure it out. I searched the field, there's nothing out there.

Our vet said the horses can get into a toxic fungus that grows on clover when the weather conditions are right. We had one show symptoms of drooling but she was okay.
Right now we have bitterweed, that supposedly is also toxic to horses. They like it and are drooling like a hose and high as a kite. I need to figure out what I can treat that section of pasture with that won't affect the horses or goats. The goats are leaving the bitterweed alone.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks Karen...I'll use the banamine.

Katey~ My bcomplex has 100 mg/ml so I would assume it would be 4.5 cc per 100 lbs?

Thanks brigadoon  I hope he recovers ray:


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Here he is at 11 30 this morning. This is new behavior. He is kinda twitching his head and right front leg keeps lifting and being put down. He also reacted more to his shots. He got 1.5 cc banamine, 6cc thiamine and 9 cc PenG. 32 ounces of slurry. ETA: He is not stuck...he keeps doing it on purpose. Thinking it makes him feel more comfortable somehow?






He also has a new development of a swollen eye. It's leaking if you can see in the picture. My thinking is that it's the water/swelling on his brain trying to come out? I am hopeful this is a good sign. He has also pooped some black tar-ish looking berries several times.


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

Eye injuries are really common in polio/listeriosis cases from the uncontrolled movements/dizziness/thrashing etc. 

He is such a beautiful animal. I am feeling so hopeful that he is going to turn the corner soon!

(and then later we can all yell at him for being such an *** and putting you through this!!! when he is stinky and breeding)

How many hours have you been doing the consistent 4-6 hour Thiamine/Pen G injections? Has it been 48 straight hours yet?


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks Katey, I love his one dark ear, one light ear, his "milk" spot on his chin,  , moonspotting and his attitude, he's a nice backyard buck. Yes, I wanna yell at him! I am exhausted and worried to death! Tonight at 7 30 will make 48 hours of every 4 hours except for overnight I did every 6 due to worrying about running out of thiamine. So it was every four and then two hours later again with the PenG. Now it's every 6 but I am doing drenching in between as well as when he gets shots to keep him as hydrated as possible.
I will continue to do every six hours...until he says not to. He seems to be fighting it. If it is an eye injury, should I wash it out with veterycin? I keep that on hand..

I hope we are right in being hopeful....I so want him to pull through!


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

My meds ( Dex and thiamine ) were shipped out today from horseprerace...hoping they come Saturday but thinking it'll be Monday. Supposed to be 2-3 days shipping but not sure Saturday and Sunday would count


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Unforunately,Monday is Labor Day...


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Oh man  I forgot!! So how long can I continue banamine then? Today is day four...should I do every 12 or every 24 hours?
Going to TSC today to get more bcomplex and PenG


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## brigadoonfarmgal (Jul 14, 2016)

NyGoatMom said:


> My meds ( Dex and thiamine ) were shipped out today from horseprerace...hoping they come Saturday but thinking it'll be Monday. Supposed to be 2-3 days shipping but not sure Saturday and Sunday would count


What was the name of the product that was the injectable Thiamine from horseprerace?

The closest I could find was their "Newcells Plus" injectable and I purchased this ....did I miss something? I specifically looked for Thiamine ... I could kick myself if I missed it because I just got my shipment today....lolol
edit: Just found it drats... I must have looked on the other horserace website for the Thiamine and just assumed this one didn't have it...here goes another order....blah...How long does Thiamine usually store for?


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

http://horseprerace.com/Vitamin B1 Thiamine Injection 100mL Horses Greyhounds Camels Alpacas Pigeons


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

That's ok, I was so tired last nitgh when I ordered it...I put one order through and then thought after...well, I better get another so I did a second order for another and then it showed "other products" and I saw the dex...so I made a THIRD order...lol...they e-mailed to verify the orders hahaha...then they shipped them together and refunded some shipping.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Just got back from TSC...got more PenG , goat electrolytes, bcomplex and another drenching syringe in case this one breaks...long weekend? Bring it on!!! :shades:

Not sure how long it stores but I have had this one in my fridge for quite some time. Seems to be helping.


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## brigadoonfarmgal (Jul 14, 2016)

Stephanie you are a healing machine...you go girl!! Hope this weekend brings you nothing but health and some much needed rest! 

Also I totally understand your situation with the horseprerace website for some reason I find it rather hard to read their descriptions and that makes me more than a little wary when I ordered that is for sure!! I bounced back and forth on a few items trying to figure out what would be the best thing to get...Ie: On some of the Injectable meds the info that is provided is for giving the medicine orally ... Felt like I was back in Mexico again at the border pharmacia's lolol


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

How is he doing? I have only ever given Banamine once a day but in his case you might need to do it twice a day. If you need to, I'd do the banamine until you get the dex. But you are looking at him so I guess decide what is best for him.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks guys!

He is about the same as earlier as far as head pressing and doing the little shake of his head, lifting that right front leg up occasionally.....BUT....he did lick some minerals from a cup! I was so surprised...eye still swollen and weepy, still standing ( he has stood all day today) without lying down that I saw. He did turn to my voice a couple of times today. 
He has a new development though...he is dribbling pee every few minutes. Not like he's straining but more like he has no control. 
He is pooping however and it is like clumps now. He actually tried to chew on the syringe a bit when being drenched and I gave him 48 ounces of slurry. I added goat electrolytes to it and a small amount of calf manna.

I decided when DH got home to ask him to clean his stall....so I took him outside up to the fence to see Alex....he seemed to like it and Alex enjoyed blubbering at his buddy through the fence.... however...I didn't notice how close to the electric fence box he got and he zapped himself  I felt so bad!

Karen~ he has been getting it q 12 hours for 3 days....I'm so nervous he'll get another problem!


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Does anyone know how often banamine actually causes problems? Is it a "for sure" thing or a "maybe, might with some goats" thing? And how would I know?


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

It is not a for sure thing. I know alpacas are more susceptible because they get ulcers much easier than goats.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

I found an article that said it can stay in the major organs causing ulcers among other issues but wasn't specific. So frustrating.It also said I could give Tums along with it to help decrease that risk...

I just went out to check him...only been an hour since I left him and he was laying down on his side with his hoof stuck in the fence and his face smooshed into his leg and breathing heavy  I removed his hoof from the fence and watched for a few minutes and he seemed to slow his breathing some...his temp was 102.8 earlier so I will take it again at 11 30 pm when I do his shots. Just trying to decide to do banamine or not


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Found this...seems the problems occurred at 25 times the recommended dose in calves...if I am understanding this correctly?

http://www.banamine.com/research/AcuteToxicity.asp

and 3-5 times the recommended dosage here along with being 3 times as long?

http://www.banamine.com/research/Pharmacokinetics.asp

Being that he's a goat...I would think it wears off pretty fast.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Ok, so I just gave him his slurry and shots...he was laying down....and he seems ..."heavy" ...like if you or I were exhausted and fell asleep....he is either finally sleeping some or giving up. I am leaning towards finally trying to rest.He did not act eager to swallow...he was too "tired" to even react much to it.

His temp however was 103.6....high for him so I will keep an eye on it and administer Tylan if I have to. I wouldn't think infection/pneumonia could set in with all this PenG, but...he is a goat!
I also heard a rumen sound when he was laying down which is a first in days....so I am confused. I went ahead and gave the banamine since he was kind of moaning with each exhale...nothing horrible , just a quiet moaning. I just hope it was due to being so tired. I have not seen him sleep for days. I figure if he is giving up...that will ease him and if he is in pain, it will help.I gave this shot last of everything and he got upset and stood back up from it...darn it...I wanted him to sleep 

I am anxious to see how he is at 5 30 am.Don't know that I can sleep....darn goat.


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## Dayna (Aug 16, 2012)

I just wanted to follow this post. The work you're doing is amazing.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

5 30 am update
L.G. was standing when I went in this morning...looks more alert, actually tried to get away from me with shots and temp!! He chewed the drenching syringe. His eye swelling seems a bit less and he actually ate a couple pieces of feed from my hand :dance:

Temp was 101.6 He is standing slightly hunched and coughs some. I am going to add a squeeze of molasses to his water bucket I felt I could safely put back in. So I guess I was right in assuming he was thoroughly exhausted last night...He also has better head movement. ray:

I'll take video later on today at 11 30am's shots and drenching to show his progress.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Dayna said:


> I just wanted to follow this post. The work you're doing is amazing.


Thank you! It's hard to feel like that for me...I keep thinking "what if I did this in the beginning, or that?" Maybe he wouldn't have gotten so bad. I have come to realize the only thing I wish I did earlier was polio treatment. But I knew to do that as soon as I saw the head swinging, eye dancing. He literally could not have been doing that for more than an hour when I started treatment for polio/listeriosis. I had left him an hour before my DH got home and he hadn't been doing it. But then DH came in and asked me why L.G. was laying down and paddling. I ran out to the stall, then back in for thiamine and peng, which I had on hand thankfully! Hopefully, that is going to help with recovery.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

I also wanted to add what I have been doing for his slurry's. I put 1 cup alfalfa pellets in a bowl with 1/4 c calf manna. To wet it I add 2 quarts of goat electrolyte enhanced water and 2 scoops probiotics. Every third mixture I add a small amount ( 30 cc's?) of dark beer, flattened. I let it set and keep stirring occasionally until all pellets are dissolved.He is getting drenched with a 30 cc drenching syringe and gets two of these bowls a day...so 2 cups alfalfa and 1/2 c calf manna. By doing this he is getting less dehydrated. I have noticed a difference in his skin.
Just to have it all in one post...
Started out for the first 1 3/4 days of his polio symptoms, I was doing Thiamine every 4 hours and PenG every 6 round the clock. Now he is getting 6 cc Thiamine and 9 cc PenG every 6 hours round the clock. Every 12 hours I have given 1.5 cc Banamine for four full days. (plus one extra shot when he was particularly bad off)
Every time I give his shots, he gets 16 ounces of his slurry drench. Takes time at 30cc's at a time....but he has been fabulous about it!
I have taken his temp twice daily to keep an eye on it.

I hope this helps someone else if their goat gets polio/listeriosis!


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## brigadoonfarmgal (Jul 14, 2016)

Maybe try adding an "expectorant" (not sure what kind would be best with the meds he is already on) to see if he is standing because he can't breathe if he lays down could be why he is standing all the time...


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

That is great that he is showing improvement.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Ok so here is his 11 30 am update

Temp is down to 99.8 ...turned the heat lamp on. He is shivering all over but not like a normal "I'm cold" shiver...more like a weak shiver? Not sure the video will show it...Decided not to give banamine. I may give it tonight provided his temp is good. Eye swelling has gone down some.

Got his 16 ounce drench of slurry and his two shots. I added an ounce of Power Punch to his slurry mix so by tonight he will have had the full ounce.

Good news...he ate mineral from my hand and is now pooping regular berries!! He also had two good streams of urine while I was out there. He is getting a gallon of water daily with all the drenching after all!

Here's the pic of his eye today and a video of his trembling...


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## sassykat6181 (Nov 28, 2012)

Have you been treating his eye? Of be putting Neosporin in it


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

I have vetrycin and terramycin...I think I'll try the veterycin first


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Am I seeing bottlejaw?
How are his inner lower eyelid coloring?

His shaking , banamine drops temps. It is good you have the heat lamp out for him. 
He needs to move around to get circulation going and for rumen health. I do find if I take a temp in the morning before the goats are out and about, it is a bit sub temp. Retake it later in the day when he has moved around. How is his rumen sounds and movement. Is his rumen working?

If he hasn't eaten much, make an alfalfa slurry and feed him slowly at the back corner of his mouth. 1/4 to 1/2 cup of pellets in electrolytes or water.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks Pam...he has been getting a gallon of water a day with 2 cups alfalfa, and 1/2 c calf manna, goat electrolytes and occasionally dark beer mixed in....at 4 separate intervals.He has been being drench fed for days now....not taking food on his own since last Sunday. Drenching started Monday morning and has been every few hours since round the clock.

I have heard minimal rumen sounds but he has been standing almost constantly for days. I am encouraged by his behavior today...he actually took some food from my hand...not much but a teaspoonful on his own! He also licked up about 1/8 th of a cup of minerals too! He is laying down normally and resting finally 

His lower eyelids look nice and pink. His chin looks that way due to dehydration...his skin is sagging but it is improved from what it was.

Great idea on getting him out and about. I will do that after I give my son a ride to a friends house for target practicing. He's gearing up for hunting season...

I had thought of the banamine being a cause for the temp drop...but it's been over twelve hours...would it still be affected?

Thanks for your input!


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

In case you haven't seen the whole thread...he is being treated for polio/listeriosis. We are on day 4....


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Pam! Thank you so much for reminding me to get him moving!! I took him out for a slow walk around the yard and to see his buddy and the girls. It did him a world of good!


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

We brought him back in and he did this..... :shock: :shock: :dance:
Check out the cough...does that sound like respiratory to you guys?






Then this...






He is peeing...a lot! Like every few minutes. He drank 1/4 of a bucket of water on his own :stars:

He still is not chewing cud, but he has eaten minerals, hay and drank on his own. Temp is back up to 102.4  (Still has a heat lamp) Sooooo....I will continue the peng and thiamine for a few days at least. I gave him 30cc of beer too.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

You are so welcome, wow look at him that is wonderful. It puts life back into him seeing the others. Goats being alone don't do well. That is why I suggested out and about time, it also helps their rumen. Glad to see him happier.

Bring his feeder down more, I think he is coughing because of the stretch of his neck, he is looking good otherwise of what he has been though already. 

It is OK for him to be out during the day, but keep an eye on him. If it is hot weather or too cold, make sure he doesn't stay out in the sun too long or is subjected to any cold weather.

He may of been shaking because he was having a hard time regulating his body temp and is not moving around.

I have never seen dehydration such as that. I usually see sunken in eye's and hips ect. Never a look like barber poll worms? It s strange.

With him roaming around like that, his rumen will benefit from it, massage his left side, keep watching for better gut sounds. 
Giving probiotics and fortified vit B complex will help along with all you are doing for him. Keep up the good work.

Glad he layed down for a while, he did need the rest. But feared he couldn't get back up, poor guy.

Banamine is suppose to be given every 36 if used, so it is long lasting. but he seems OK, it does help him and you have the heat lamp for him at night if he needs it. Polio can lower there temps, they have a hard regulating it.

Keep us updated


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks so much Pam! 

I'll lower the feeder and go from there. 

Yes, it does look strange but when you touch it , it is clearly dehydrated skin flap...he has quite a few wrinkles on his neck :lol:


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Prayers sent, glad to help.


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

I think the cough is just a residual effect. If you watch closely he coughs and repositions the hay in his mouth before chewing it more. It's like he lost control of it and tried to swallow it too soon.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks Jill...I'll keep an eye on it for sure...He is still not cud chewing at all.


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## sassykat6181 (Nov 28, 2012)

Glad to see him doing so much better. Keep up the great work.

Maybe you can try stealing some cud for him?


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Oh man! I have been avoiding that lol :lol:


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Went out to give 11 30 pm shots....WE HAVE CUD CHEWING!!! :stars: :stars: :dance:

So now my question is....how long to continue q 6 hour thiamine and peng?


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

wonderful news..keep up treatment until he is 100% better...then ween him off by giving meds further and further apart...


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Ok, thanks Cathy! I'm so happy he is recovering


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

I want to say thank you - thank you for working so hard for this boy, and for this incredibly educational thread. SO glad he is improving. You're amazing!


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## brigadoonfarmgal (Jul 14, 2016)

NyGoatMom said:


> Went out to give 11 30 pm shots....WE HAVE CUD CHEWING!!! :stars: :stars: :dance:
> 
> So now my question is....how long to continue q 6 hour thiamine and peng?


Super!!! I am so happy for the both of you!


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Awww, thank you threehavens! I wanted to document this as much as possible to help other people when it happens too!

I wanted to add that I gave him one last shot of banamine last night just to be sure no swelling comes back. Also, yesterday he had a clear liquid coming out of his nose, not a ton but enough to notice.
He has two more hurdles to overcome, one maintaining his temp and two control of his bladder. He still drips and is all wet because he drips urine almost constantly. But overall he is great!
This is a terrible condition to see them go through.I hope I never see it again! Not to mention, if I were to work outside of my own business, I don't know how I would have helped him round the clock. It definitely takes determination and will power! I am exhausted. :faint:
I will always have banamine, thiamine , bcomplex and dex on hand. If I hadn't had the banamine, peng and thiamine to give right away, it may not have been as good an outcome. I am so grateful I had them ahead of time for a "just in case"!


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

So glad to hear he's doing better!!! :leap:


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

That is great that he is doing better.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

So glad he is improving, keep up the good work. 

Does he get Ammonium chloride in his diet?
You say he is dripping urine, have you seen him pee a good steady stream or dripping? Urinary calc. might be possible if he isn't peeing a steady stream.

The clear nasal drip may be allergies, but keep an eye on that. Do you have a stethoscope? If so, listen to his lungs to verify they are clear. Or just put your ear up to his lung area.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks guys 

Pam, yes, he pees a LOT. But he was getting drenched a gallon a day and he is now drinking a LOT. But yes, steady streams often and in between dripping occasionally.It seems to be slowing...he was outside for an hour today and tried flapping his tongue at the girls so another improvement.
He also is trying to get away from me when I give his shots so I have to hold him against the wall now to do it.
I'll be doing 3 daily sets of shots today and tomorrow I'll try two sets and go from there.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

I do have a stethoscope...I'll check that tonight


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

He sounds a lot better, good work. 

Let us know.


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Stephanie, I really think that you would be making a mistake stepping the B1 down so quickly. This is the turning or sliding point, if he goes back down you may not get him up again. The Pen G can go to twice a day until the course is done, but, keep giving the B1 3 times a day until he has full control of his bladder and throat muscles. By then he should be eating normally. Then go to twice a day for 4 or 5 days before jumping down to once a day. 
Taking the Thiamine away too quickly can cause a relapse that is much much harder to get them up from and lasts for weeks...


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

So, switching gears...just gave LG his shots and will not give the next until morning chores. He is MUCH improved and eating well.
Temp was 103.1 no heat lamp since yesterday.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

goathiker said:


> Stephanie, I really think that you would be making a mistake stepping the B1 down so quickly. This is the turning or sliding point, if he goes back down you may not get him up again. The Pen G can go to twice a day until the course is done, but, keep giving the B1 3 times a day until he has full control of his bladder and throat muscles. By then he should be eating normally. Then go to twice a day for 4 or 5 days before jumping down to once a day.
> Taking the Thiamine away too quickly can cause a relapse that is much much harder to get them up from and lasts for weeks...


Good to know! I will keep doing three times a day then for a few days. Thanks Jill!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good luck.


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## brigadoonfarmgal (Jul 14, 2016)

I am so happy for you both it took an a whole lot of dedication and tireless efforts and I applaud all of you (advice givers too) for a job well done ! 

On a different subject : When you get your shipment from horseprerace could you let me know what the expiration date is on the Dex and the Thiamine please 

Thanks so much!


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## sassykat6181 (Nov 28, 2012)

How's LG doing?


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## rochelle (Jul 10, 2016)

Yes how is your baby doing? I've been thinking about both of you️


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks guys! He is doing well. I put him back out with Alex and he is getting bcomplex twice a day still because I'm scared to stop it Lol...will probably stop by Sunday and go from there. he is no longer getting peng.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

That is great!


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Good to hear!!


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Good news!!!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Awesome.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Just to update this thread...this goat bred my girls this year and is fine


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## odieclark (Jan 21, 2016)

*polio recovery*



NyGoatMom said:


> Just to update this thread...this goat bred my girls this year and is fine


Awesome! Dealing with this right now with a buck at the farm...

banamine, gave Bo-se, some nutri drench, and B complex injection.

started with temp under and around 100, now to normal.

was laying, and kicking legs, then went to sitting. has stood a few times and has finally taken a drink. Not sure where we are at with this, but that is what has been done. going back and reading what you all did! Great work!:ram:


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

pm'd you


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

:update: Just realized I never updated the initial cause of the polio setting in. I think it's important to share. When LG went off feed in the beginning, I started him on Bcomplex from TSC. What I didn't realize at the time was that it was expired! So all the time I gave him that for being off feed, it wasn't helping which is why polio set in! ALWAYS check the dates before you buy!!!

LG is still happy and healthy and seemed to have no ill effects after treatment


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Glad you figured it out and he is fine.


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## odieclark (Jan 21, 2016)

So, as this was updated our buck made a full recovery as well! Wonderful as we had a great crop of 2017 kids from him and he is now working on making more kids at another farm! 

Great that he recovered! We had this happen in a similar way to a lamb, and had success with it as well!

Thanks goat friends!


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks odie!! I am glad for you as well


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## odieclark (Jan 21, 2016)

Thank you! Isn’t it great to have a successful outcome !


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Glad he made full recovery


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Yes! I really thought he was a goner...worst thing I have ever seen


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Suzanne_Tyler said:


> Glad he made full recovery


Thanks Suzanne! Me too!


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