# Nubian kid with a foamy mouth "throwing up"



## FreedomStarr (Oct 21, 2014)

I know I just joined, sorry to say I already have an issue with the nubian buckling I just got last month. I came out to feed and noticed he was not interested, and he had foam all over his face. I wiped it off and then he did this heaving thing and brought up green foamy liquid. I have him inside, is there anything I can do until I get him to a vet tomorrow? Why does this stuff always happen on a Sunday!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Is he bloated? What is his temp? Any other symptoms?


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## glndg (Feb 8, 2013)

Hopefully someone with experience will comment soon. In the meantime, could he have eaten something toxic? Someone recently had goats vomiting with azalea poisoning. Acting quickly is important. Get a temperature on him. 

If it is a toxin, people often use activated charcoal, although Milk of Magnesia is used for some things. Don't use them at the same time.

Karen, I didn't see your post when I was typing this one.


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## megg16 (Oct 31, 2014)

It sounds like posing I had the same think about s month ago. Tons of Gatorade and activate charcoal as quickly as you can. You can get activate charcoal at any vitamin supplements store. They come as pills you can stuff it down there throat or break them open and administer that way. I used a bottle mixed with a little water to get it down my goats throat.


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## FreedomStarr (Oct 21, 2014)

His temp is 102.3 He is very clearly miserable, heaving and bleating and shaking. If the vet was open right now I'd be driving him there. I don't have activated charcoal but I have pepto bismuth- the Internet seems to think I can use that:


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## glndg (Feb 8, 2013)

You can get charcoal where they have pet/fish supplies as well. Or maybe your grocery store has a supplement section.

Does your vet have an emergency number? Maybe they could walk you through treatment over the phone.

I don't know, but I don't think pepto would work....it's good for diarrhea, but you need something to absorb toxins IF that is what is going on. 

Does he seem bloated? Is his side large and hard?


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## megg16 (Oct 31, 2014)

Try giving Gatorade my vet recommends that because it helps to flush toxins and keeps him hydrated. Keep my fingers crossed for your baby.


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## FreedomStarr (Oct 21, 2014)

No- he is not bloated as far as I can tell. In pretty far in the sticks, I'd have to drive about a half hour to get to a place that might have that. I guess I better get ready to go. I think I'll call my vets emergency line. I am scared he is going to die.


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## glndg (Feb 8, 2013)

Good plan. Good luck. Sending good thoughts. It sounds like he needs help ASAP.

You should be able to get Gatorade at the store even if you can't get charcoal.


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## FreedomStarr (Oct 21, 2014)




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## megg16 (Oct 31, 2014)

Aww poor baby. Try giving fluids. Keep us updated please.


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## TDG-Farms (Jul 12, 2013)

Might also have a little something caught in the back of his throat. We had a doe kid this year that every time she ate grain, she didnt chew it right and would get some stuck in her throat. But it was obvious she was trying to get it out by shaking her head. You might try to tube him.


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces (Apr 7, 2013)

Feel his throat for any blockage, they will often foam at the mouth if they have choke. If has has a block, run a tube down his throat. If he doesn't have a blockage, get some charcoal down his asap, and get some milk of magnesia to dose him with after the charcoal. 
Also, if you don't have any C&D antitoxin (not the toxiod, the antitoxin), pick some of that up as well, you can get it from tractor supply.


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

I have a doe here that does that every so often. i syringe water into her mouth while her nose is pointed down , so it doesn't go down the wrong way. It helps dislodge what is caught. Its very nerve racking , but you can do it. Another thing is it might be a toxicity. You should have charcoal and CD antitoxin and MOM on hand . Its worth the trip IMO.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I agree..check his throat for anything stuck first, you can do this by pushing a smooth flexable tube or hose..make sure its smooth on the end and be very very gentle......If you feel poisoning is the problem dose with 15 cc per 60# Milk of Magnesia..it wil flush toxins out...keep him hydrated...here is a qualilty electrolyte recipe

Homemade Electrolytes

A half gallon of hot water
2-6 Tablespoons of Unsulphured Blackstrap Molasses or what you have or honey
1-2 Tablespoons of Either Sea Salt, Epsom Salt, Baking Soda or Table Salt.
1 cup of Apple Cider Vinegar


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Hows the baby doing ?


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## FreedomStarr (Oct 21, 2014)

I tubed him some Gatorade and MOM to him. He has stopped throwing up, is chewing cud, but is listless and laying under a blanket. Hoping to hear from vet. At least I think he is improved.


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

I know you are in Oregon where Rodies grow wild everywhere. We have had a few run ins with them. These do work...

These recipes work for plant toxins and are good first aid for other toxins while you wait for the vet. - Irene.
Irene's Recipe for Rhododendron Poisoning.

Ingredients:
15 mls Renco (rennet)
15 mls Mylanta (milk of magnesia)
5 mls brandy
Mix all together
This is the adult dose!
For kids under 4 months give 5 mls each of Renco and Mylanta and 2 mls brandy, for kids over 4 months give 10 mls of both Renco and Mylanta and 5 mls brandy. Treat goatlings as adults.
Renco is the tradename for junket rennet and you can buy it in any supermarket. It is good for a variety of gastric ailments in goats, and it works even when it is well past its UseBy date, so don't chuck it out just because you can't use it for junket or cheese any more. The action of the rennet is to neutralise the toxins from the rhododendron. Mylanta is the trade name for milk of magnesia. Sometimes you'll find it in a supermarket but more often you have to go to a chemist. Again, it is useful for a number of stomach upsets in goats (as well as humans).

Its action is twofold: it puts a lining on the gut, and it regulates the pulsing of the gut (peristalsis), which often gets out of kilter with poisoning or colic.

The brandy works, but I haven't yet found out why. It is a fortified spirit so has a high alcohol percentage and you don't need much. Alternatively you can use sherry, which is a fortified wine. They are both made from grapes, and work better for medicinal purposes than spirits or wines made from grain or other substances. I got 100 mls of bulk brandy from my local Liquorland. The staff were highly amused when I told them what it was for, although I admit I have nicked the odd tablespoonful for making fruit mince.

It is usual for goats with rhododendron poisoning to vomit rather spectacularly, everything within a 5 metre radius is likely to be covered in green slime. For this reason it is difficult to drench them with an antidote because it is easy for things to go down the wrong hole and either drown the goat within minutes or cause inhalation pneumonia which isn't treatable in the farm situation. That is why I like this recipe because the amounts are small, and you can take 15 minutes over the drenching, a ml or two at a time between sickies, if you have to. One dose is usually sufficient. I've never heard of anyone having to give two although if the goat did not show improvement within an hour after dosing, one could consider a repeat.

It is important to keep the goat warm, but not in the sun, and out of the wind. Have a bucket of fresh warm water available for the animal to drink, and each time it gets fouled by vomit (which has stuck to the face hair) empty and refill it, otherwise the goat will just be drinking up more poison. A goat which is vomiting all over the place is getting rid of the toxins much more efficiently than one which is not, so vomiting is good.

Once the goat is feeling better, offer a mixture of yummies, a handful of various weeds like yarrow, cleavers, dock, prairie grass or twitch, some green pine needles, tree lucerne (tagasaste), willow, and some good plain hay or straw. Don't give much at a time as anything which is fouled will have to be thrown away, so why waste it by being over-generous?

Some other evergreens such as camellias will give similar symptoms to rhododendron, though not usually so severe, and the goat may not vomit. The recipe will work pretty well on most forms of poisoning, including toadstool spores. It also does a good job as a first-aid measure in organo-phosphate poisoning until you can bring goat and vet together. I suggest sticking both Lorraine's and my recipes on the wall beside your telephone so you always know where they are, and you have immediate access if someone else phones you in a panic.

Lorraine's Recipe for Rhododendron Poisoning

Quantities do not need to be too exact.
Ingredients:
¼ cup cooking oil
½ cup strong/strong cold tea (6 to 8 tea bags removed) ["English" tea]
1 teaspoon ground ginger
1 teaspoon baking soda
MIX ALL TOGETHER and drench the goat with it all.

How does this work?
Oil puts a lining on the stomach preventing more poison going into the system, tea is the antidote, and ginger relieves pain, baking soda helps bring up the gas.


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## FreedomStarr (Oct 21, 2014)

Well, thank you to everyone he seems to be feeling much better after his nap. He woke up and drank a whole bunch of water. He told me he is still much to sick to go back outside with the other goats, but I think he is just taking advantage of the situation. Thank you all for your quick replies and help. I will still probably take him in tomorrow to see if I can identify what happened. Plus I will get all hose things to have on hand.


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## IvyMayPygmyGoats (Jan 24, 2014)

_Oh bloody hell i've had this happen. Lots of water, try get them to keep throwing up (warm water and olive oil syringed into mouth usually works) and then try get some food in them. My Nubian was my first to do this, she screamed like buggary and we were told to try keep her standing too. Lots of water helped. She was fince within a half day although it did then occur once again a few days later. Not since thought, i suspect it was poison from our chicken corn (with poop in it) Good luck!

ps) stinks doesn't it! _


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## IvyMayPygmyGoats (Jan 24, 2014)

Oh and our vets didn't know what it was either but gave her something to calm her stomach down and anti-biotics too.


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Im glad he is doing better ! Keep us posted


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

im glad he is better...I would give the MOM a few more times as well to bind any toxins still lingering...lots of fluids and offer him leaves , pine, cedar, vines what ever you have growing out your way....pine are pretty awesome for upset tummies

best wishes


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