# What do you think of these does?



## farmchick897

I'm looking to add a Saanen doe to my farm. Can you tell me what you think of these girls? I know they sent me crappy pics and they said they don't have any udder pics. Should that be a red flag? They also don't test for CAE but many goat owners in this area don't. They are both suppose to be bred to kid in Feb. Thanks!


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## MoKa-Farms

They'd be absolutely gorgeous if it weren't for their coats. The second picture looks alright, but in the first one their coats look iffy to me. Are there any siblings, mother, grandmothers in lactation they could send you udder pictures of? Not many people test for anything around here either. If you do want your doe(s) of choice to be tested, you could ask them if they would draw some blood and send it in, and that you would pay for it (A brief warning: even if you offer to pay for it, many people don't like this and may get rather upset with you, like it is a sign of distrust or they know that their goats have something and they want you to still buy (a) goat(s) from them,). Hope that helps. What are they asking for her/them?


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## ciwheeles

I'm no expert so I'll help bump this for you. It's hard for me to tell though without seeing pictures from the side and the doe does look a little steep in the rump. Although that could just come from how the picture was taken. I personally wouldn't buy a goat from a non tested herd, but everyone does things differently.


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## farmchick897

They are asking $325 each, which frankly is kind of high in this area. They are registered though. The fact they are due in Feb is why I'm considering them. But if they are not blood tested pregnant that will be another red flag. They said they don't have udder pics and the one doe has been hand and machine milked. This is the buck they are bred to..


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## farmchick897

There is another person selling unregistered Saanens, can I post CL ad so you all can see pics??
They look nicer to me but then again I don't know much about conformation. Also, I don't care about registration, I only want a good milk producer that is disease free. Thanks


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## ciwheeles

I'm pretty sure you could just post the link so someone can check it out. If you want to be sure they are disease free then I would definitely do what Moka said and ask for the one or ones you want to be tested. Better safe than sorry IMO. ;-)


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## farmchick897

http://louisville.craigslist.org/grd/4190883526.html


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## Emzi00

I like the doe in the third picture of the ad best, her rump isn't as steep as the others, she has a nice strong topline, and her legs look good. If you want tested animals, ask if they'll draw blood and send it in and you pay for it, or you could buy um and quarantine them and test um yourself.


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## ksalvagno

If the first girls are pregnant, that is why they are more. The Craigslist goats aren't bred and aren't full blood. But the second group does look nicer. From what I can tell, it would be worth it to look at all of them. I would want proof of pregnancy and registration. You may have to pay for any testing but hopefully they are tested.


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## farmchick897

They say they are pregnant but no test was done and they don't look very big. Both of these people are quite a distance from me so going to look is not really an option. I would have to test them once I buy them and take a chance. I know second ad they are open but it looks like he has many to pick from and they look healthier. Do you think it would be better to wait until kidding season and buy one already in milk? That way I know what udder looks like, how milk taste and if they are ok with getting milked? I'm just worried I won't find anything and if I get an open doe now I could breed her for May kids.


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## farmchick897

Also, when you say steep rump, what does that mean? Does that have any impact on kidding or milking? I looked at pics again and can't see a difference. :/


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## Emzi00

The angle of the rump. It's harder for them to kid with a steep rump, anatomically, a steep rump is not correct. It's easier for a doe to kid when she has a long level rump.


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## ptgoats45

You would be better off to buy a doe already in milk, a lot less chance of anything going wrong, her having a bad udder, or kidding without any milk, etc. In the craigslist ad, in the first pic the adult doe looks like she may have a lump by her jaw. I would be kind of worried about that, unless it is a badly placed wattle. They do all look pretty nice, but if registered is what you want then I would wait and get a registered one. There are usually quite a few goats for sale in the spring, and especially around nationals you might be able to find someone with a doe you really like that is coming near you on their way to Nationals.


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## farmchick897

Thanks, I think I will wait until spring. I'd rather buy from a good breeder than a CL ad but just haven't been able to find anything. Are you looking at the hip bones to the end of tail when you say steep? So, what angle are you looking for, flat?


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## Emzi00

Yup, the flatter the better. Looking at this, the 25 is what you want


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## farmchick897

Great chart! Thanks!
I see Nationals in 2014 are in Louisville, KY. I will be going to look for a doe there.


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## ptgoats45

You should be able to find a nice one for sale there, or put out an ad that you are looking and find a breeder that may have one that they can throw in the trailer and bring with them.


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## farmchick897

An ad on here or do you recommend another site where breeders look?


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## ptgoats45

You can try one on here, but might get more notice on another site. If you are on any Yahoo groups you could try the SaanenTalk Yahoo group, or on Facebook there is a Saanen Breeders group, a Dairy Goats Saanen and Sable and a Saanen and MiniSaanen group.


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## Cadence

farmchick897 said:


> Great chart! Thanks!
> I see Nationals in 2014 are in Louisville, KY. I will be going to look for a doe there.


If you are willing to wait until Nationals, you basically have the entire country at your fingertips. Most people will be willing to haul an extra goat to Nationals if she is already purchased. You could pick from almost any bloodlines.

This could also be to your advantage because you could then breed to a more local buck or breeder without worrying about inbreeding too drastically.

Don't go to nationals expecting to purchase a goat from the animals there though. Most of us can only afford to take five or six of our very best goats there = not usually the ones we want to sell (although we will sell kids from those animals).

What are your goals of your saanens. Maybe I can offer suggestions or breeder to contact?


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## farmchick897

Looking for young (prefer under 3), negative tested for CAE, CL and Johne's. Would prefer in milk. I would want her to be a good milker (volume, taste and disposition on milking stand). She would be a family milk goat so she doesn't have to be a show winner, personality and milk flavor is more important. I'm not dead set on a Saanen, although I do like the milk flavor on my Saanen more than I do the Lamancha. Open to any breed that will fit the description. Thanks.


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## farmchick897

Ok.. So I know I said I would wait until Nationals to find a doe but I would really hate to wait that long and not find something. Especially since I would have to find a breeder beforehand and make sure she brings that goat along. So... Found this doe on CL (I know.. Not an ideal place). But tell me what you think. She is 3 years old, had triplets this past spring that are sable (is that ok that she produces that color)? She is rebred to a Saanen and due in Feb.


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## farmchick897

Here is another picture minus kid on her back.


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## ksalvagno

There is nothing wrong with goats from CL ads. She looks nice and healthy. Hard to tell conformation from those photos.


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## farmchick897

Anyone have any comment on sable Saanen's ?


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## NyGoatMom

I want a sable too...I love the colorations you can get and still keep the saanen personality  Around here they are impossible to find


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## farmchick897

So it's a good thing? The guy selling her said this, "As I understand this proves their pedigree since sables can only be product of both buck and doe which are pure with recessive gene for sable".


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## NyGoatMom

Hmmmm...don't know about the genetics of it....hope someone who does will pop on..


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## Wild Hearts Ranch

Her udder doesn't look well attached to me. 

AFAIK, the sable coloring only proves that both parents had an ancestor with the color, but if either parent isn't papered it could come from an Alpine rather than a Sable.


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## peggy

I have a sable saanen. Love her to pieces. It does indeed mean that both white saanen parents carry the recession gene for sable. But be wary that unless you are confident that the breeder is on the level and honest they could be alpine cross. That being said. there is nothing wrong with throwing Sable kids. If that is what you want. Not sure on the registry in the US for Sables. I am in Canada and there is no registry for Sables so my girl cannot be registered even though she is from excellent Saanen stock.


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## farmchick897

Here is a picture of one her kids, does it look like an Alpine?









I'm going on Sunday to look at all he has for sale but I like this doe the best from pics. That is.. If the weather doesn't prevent me from going.


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## Wild Hearts Ranch

Do they have a good picture of her udder? For a family milker I would be more concerned about that than possible Alpine cross.


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## Tenacross

The second picture looks like a different doe. Is the second picture of the same doe when she was younger or something?


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## wildegoats0426

farmchick897 said:


> Ok.. So I know I said I would wait until Nationals to find a doe but I would really hate to wait that long and not find something. Especially since I would have to find a breeder beforehand and make sure she brings that goat along. So... Found this doe on CL (I know.. Not an ideal place). But tell me what you think. She is 3 years old, had triplets this past spring that are sable (is that ok that she produces that color)? She is rebred to a Saanen and due in Feb.


I don't know about dairy goats but I love the kid on her back and the random chicken in the next pic lol


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## Wild Hearts Ranch

What makes you say that? I think she's just standing different and it's better lighting.


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## Tenacross

zebradreams07 said:


> What makes you say that? I think she's just standing different and it's better lighting.


Seriously? What about the beard? What about the udder? What about the relative weight the goat in the second pic is carrying?
I think the first pic is after and the second pic is before, kidding.
Or it's not the same goat.


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## Wild Hearts Ranch

The beard might be hidden by the hay, the udder is hard to see from the side, and the second picture may be from a different time of year - or it's just a better angle and lack of kid climbing on her. The first pic is not from before kidding since she has the kids with her.


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## farmchick897

The first picture is with her and her kids this past spring. The second picture was taken a few days ago. She is dry now because she is due in Feb, so I would guess the extra weight is because she is pregnant. Both pics she has a beard, so I'm not seeing where it's a different goat.? They don't have a pic of her full udder which I know is not ideal, I also know it's not ideal that she isn't tested for any diseases but once again you won't see that around here. I have plans to test her immediately for pregnancy as well as CAE, CL, Johne's and Brucellosis. And I can isolate her from my others until I get test results back.


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## NyGoatMom

She's beautiful


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## Tenacross

zebradreams07 said:


> The beard might be hidden by the hay, the udder is hard to see from the side, and the second picture may be from a different time of year - or it's just a better angle and lack of kid climbing on her. The first pic is not from before kidding since she has the kids with her.


Oh boy. What I wanted to say it the *second* pic is before and the *first* pic is after kidding. My bad all the way.


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## Tenacross

farmchick897 said:


> The first picture is with her and her kids this past spring. The second picture was taken a few days ago. She is dry now because she is due in Feb, so I would guess the extra weight is because she is pregnant. Both pics she has a beard, so I'm not seeing where it's a different goat.? .


Have you seen her in person? The second pic looks like a younger goat to me.


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## farmchick897

No, I plan to go on Sunday. She is suppose to be 3 years old. They have a 5 year old for sale too, maybe the pics are mixed up. ? The 5 year old also had triplets this past spring but the pics of her she looks a little thin. I like the easy keepers more. They also have two 9 month olds but they are not bred and have horns so don't want them. All the pics of his goats they look (background and all) like they are kept in a clean, nice facility. I think that says a lot.


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## peggy

There really isn't any way to tell if a kid is alpine cross because the conformation is so similar. However there is a slight difference in the head shape and I would guess that this kid is a sable from the shape of the ears and head. A very nice looking kid. Like the others said, decide what you want in a goat, a family milker, a show goat, etc. If you are just looking for a family milker then I don't see anything wrong with the does you are looking at. The main thing is health.


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## farmchick897

Thanks all, I brought her home today. She is wider than she is tall (VERY pregnant). I hope the trip home won't stress her too much. Her name is "Sugar". They only had a small herd of the two does, 2 babies from this year and the buck. They were selling them all because of health issues. 
Now on to my next purchase.. I'm looking at getting a registered Dutch belted heifer. I hear the milk is very similar to goat. 
Is there a such a thing as too much milk?


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## ksalvagno

Congrats! You will have to post updated pictures.


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## NyGoatMom

Congrats!


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## peggy

Congratulations.


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## farmchick897

Thanks! I'll try and get a picture soon. We are in a the middle of a ice storm so it's miserable outside. The one thing I can say about her is she is very quiet, not one peep out of her on the 3 hour ride home and even when I enter the barn. She didn't touch her hay last night but I gave her some alfalfa pellets and chopped hay in a dish and she picked through that. 
I plan to draw blood this week too and send it off. I was going to test for pregnancy too but I think it's obvious she is. May do it anyway for piece of mind.


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## farmchick897

Okay, a picture of Sugar and our ruined pine trees from ice storm.


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## peggy

She looks lovely. When is she due to kid?? Was she bred to the same Saanen buck that produced the Sables?? It would be neat to get Sables from her.


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## farmchick897

Due in Feb. and yes same buck that produced the sables. So, I'm hoping for sables too.


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## NyGoatMom

She looks adorable  the trees, not so much


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## peggy

Awesome, I'd love to see what she has, keep us posted.


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