# Doe with painfully swollen legs



## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

We have a boer doe who is huge and looks like she should kid any minute but I don't know exactly when she was bred. Her back legs are swollen and walking is clearly painful for her. She gets up to eat and drink periodically but goes right back down. She moans constantly too. This morning I baited her outside the kidding pen to an overgrown area and she wouldn't even browse, her favorite thing. She ate what I handed her then just hobbled back into the pen and ate some fed before lying down. I think it just hurts her too much to walk. Is this pregnancy toxemia?
BTW, she acted just like this before her first kidding 3 yrs ago. She was fine after kidding. Her second pregnancy was easy. This is her third. 
Any advice would be greatly appreciated. 



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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Get a temp on her.

Treat her for Pregnancy Toxemia, in case, occurs late in pregnancy. Loss of appetite, weakness, limping or swollen feet, laying around not wanting to stand, moaning.

Pinch nerve is another thought.


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## canyontrailgoats (Jan 4, 2014)

Definitely treat for ketosis as Toth said! In case of pinched nerves, you can slowly and deeply massage her legs upwards. She will need her leg muscles relaxed, so applying hot towels and heat pads to her sore spots will help.


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## lottsagoats1 (Apr 12, 2014)

I'd be willing to bet this is ketosis/preg toxemia. I went thru it with my Obie doe this year, she got pneumonia, stopped eating and went down with preg toxemia. The biggest sign was the painful swollen legs. I almost lost her. She had triplets. All lived.


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## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

Thanks for the replies. I've been obsessing over this all day. I've read so much about pt that I've already had to recharge my iphone. There is so much conflicting information! 
I started her on CMPK drench along with Magic and B complex. I bought a ketosis test kit which indicated moderate to high levels. I'm still uncertain about dosing on the CMPK drench and some folks say it is dangerous if she doesn't have milk fever. I can test for ketosis but I'm not sure how you can test for calcium deficiency. 
Of our 9 does we lost one to an unknown illness during an extreme cold snap in December and have lost 3 to coyotes since. I can't stand to lose another. I've got to figure this out before it gets bad. 


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

You are doing the right thing, I don't see it as dangerous if she does not have PT. 
It is better to be safe than sorry in my opinion.


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## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

toth boer goats said:


> You are doing the right thing, I don't see it as dangerous if she does not have PT.
> It is better to be safe than sorry in my opinion.


How much and how often would you give the CMPK?

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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

2 x a day

Here is a link that may help as well

http://www.thegoatspot.net/forum/f186/cmpk-no-144363/


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

How are things?


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## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

toth boer goats said:


> How are things?


Thanks for asking. She is acting exactly the same. Lying there groaning like the most pathetic creature I've seen. She will get up, pee and poop, eat a few bites and get a drink, then it's back to moaning. No signs of labor but she looks like she might split wide open any second. 
I got some ketosis test strips and she was moderate to high yesterday and it has improved to the low side of moderate so the trend is good. 
I was wondering about giving her some banamine to make her more comfortable. Do you have thoughts on that?

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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

You can give her a shot.


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## OGYC_Laura (Jan 9, 2014)

My goat had ketosis and I gave her mollassis water free choice, drenched magik twice a day, and gave vit. B shots. Mollassis really pulled her out of it!
Hope your girl improves!!
Prayers your way!!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

How is she?


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## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

She moaned less today and the ketone test showed improvement. Still eating and drinking but mostly lying down. I'm cutting the CMPK with magic to reduce the calcium dose while keeping the carb level up. I'm drenching her 4x a day alternating between CMPK/magic and Nutridrench, 60cc each, and 6cc B complex 2x a day. 
She needs to have those babies! Looks like there may be a dozen in there. We need some girls too, we're 4 for 4 on bucklings so far. 


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Glad she is better.

If her kidding date is really close, you can have her induced. You may want to talk to your vet and see what they think.


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## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

toth boer goats said:


> Glad she is better.
> 
> If her kidding date is really close, you can have her induced. You may want to talk to your vet and see what they think.


Unfortunately I'm not sure exactly when she was bred. It would sure be nice to have that option. It's pretty here today so I let her into the pasture and she actually walked about 50 yards out before lying down. Progress...

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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Keeping her up and walking here and there throughout the day, it is really good for her. 

Glad she is getting around. Keep up the good work.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

How are things?


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## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

Thanks for checking in. No change in behavior. She has stayed in the pasture the last 3 days and gets up now and then but not for long. I just got a urine test for the first time in a couple of days and was surprised to see her levels are higher than before I started treatment. I had lowered her dose a little so I'll go back to what I started with. No sign of labor. 



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## Tenacross (May 26, 2011)

You are doing the right things. Is her udder getting big? Are you feeding her any grain/feed? She needs all the extra you can get her to eat. Propylene glycol is sometimes used in these cases, including by me. Nutri drench is mostly propylene glycol and will work. It can stimulate appetite and give energy. They will sometimes get almost normal hungry an hour or so after administration and use the opportunity to get them to eat some grain/feed. You just have to keep them going until they kid. I maybe would try banamine one time and see if she will eat better as a result. I would keep giving the CMPK.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I totally agree, good advice.

Also, try to get her up more. Even if you have to take her for a grazing walk to nibble on things.
If she lays down to long, she may not want to get up again.


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## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

She has free access to feed and alfalfa from dusk to dawn while in the barn. CMPK, if I'm not mistaken, is based with propylene glycol as well so I was worried about giving Nutridrench and CMPK each twice a day as I've read that propylene glycol can burn their throat. I was giving 60 cc of each twice daily, or 4 60cc doses total daily. It just seems like a lot but I guess that's what I need to go back to. Her udders are full but not tight. 


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

This is a good link that may help. Yes you will have to increase the x per day.

http://www.thegoatspot.net/forum/f186/so-frustrated-143738/


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## Tenacross (May 26, 2011)

Jbphipps said:


> She has free access to feed and alfalfa from dusk to dawn while in the barn. CMPK, if I'm not mistaken, is based with propylene glycol as well so I was worried about giving Nutridrench and CMPK each twice a day as I've read that propylene glycol can burn their throat. I was giving 60 cc of each twice daily, or 4 60cc doses total daily. It just seems like a lot but I guess that's what I need to go back to. Her udders are full but not tight.


If it has propylene glycol in it, it would say on the label. If it's injectable CMPK, then I doubt it has PG. If it's a drench solution, then it probably does have some PG as my MFO does and that is a CMPK drench solution. It is not the main ingredient listed, however. Anyway, I would definitely go back to giving 60 ccs of each twice a day like you were before. That is a good dose. The nutridrench is all sweetened up. I doubt it is burning them much, but regardless, You should be aggressive. They can die from this.


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## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

She walked farther from the barn this morning, and in a new direction away from the other goats. Maybe....? 


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Kidding time maybe?


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## Tenacross (May 26, 2011)

Jbphipps said:


> She walked farther from the barn this morning, and in a new direction away from the other goats. Maybe....?


Fingers crossed.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Any news?


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## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

toth boer goats said:


> Any news?


I wish. It's about to make me crazy. She seems to feel better though. 24 hours after going back to 60 cc of CMPK drench 2x/day and 60 cc of Nutridrench 2x/day her ketone levels are back down in the "low" range. I added thiamine in addition to B complex and some banamine as well.

I really appreciate your concern. I hope I can post pics of healthy kids soon.

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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Praying for her. Glad she is doing OK

Hang in there.


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## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

Triplets!! The doe is doing well but kids are weak. Temps right at 100. They are wrapped and in the sun, hot rice bags too. What should I do??


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## canyontrailgoats (Jan 4, 2014)

Congrats! Did they get colostrum yet?


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## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

canyontrailgoats said:


> Congrats! Did they get colostrum yet?


My family is working on that. I had to run back to work. They had Nutridrench though.

The first was apparently easy, (no witnesses), the second was breech and I had to pull, the third was presenting normally but she wouldn't push so I got nervous and went in. I think she's done, I couldn't feel any more. I gave her penicillin, Nutridrench and B complex and she seems strong.

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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Congrats.  

Seeings how the temps are 100 degree's, make sure they get colostrum.

Give the kids Bo-se shots 

I would try to get them started on mom's teat and go out every couple of hours, to ensure they are getting colostrum.
This will help them stay warmer as well.

Putting up a heat lamp for them, while they are weak is good. Especially during the night or if they are a bit sub temp.


How is momma?

Dip their cords.


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## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

Momma has stood the whole time. She is attentive and seems strong. Udders aren't as full as I'd like to see but she's been a good milker in the past so I bet they'll fill up. 

Thanks for the iodine reminder. I had forgotten to do it. 


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

No problem.

If you have some Oxytocin, give her just a little bit for milk letdown. While she is still open.

Has she dropped her afterbirth yet?

The kids will help stimulate her, feed her grain and good Alfalfa if possible. If she isn't use to it, do it gradually.
Plenty of fresh water too.

She should kick in with the milk soon.


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## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

She passed the placenta but a lot of it is still hanging on. I don't have oxytocin. Is it ok to do that tomorrow if she hasn't shed all the afterbirth? 

She'll have a full buffet tonight. Whatever she wants. Grain feed, alfalfa, sweet feed, heck I'll go get her a salad from Chili's if she asks. I just hope this is the beginning of the end of her PT. 


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Oxytocin should be given when the Doe is still open to be safe.

If she passed the placenta, you wouldn't see it hanging, so, she has not dropped it yet.

Give her a B0-se shot and gel caps, vit E, snip off the end of 2 pills and squeeze the vit E in her mouth. 
know bo-se has vit E in it but, I find it helps get it in the system better. 
Holding afterbirth to long can be selenium deficiency.

If her afterbirth is dragging or hanging too long, tie it gently into a knot to get it off the ground, it helps with weight, to help get it out of there.

Glad she is doing well, good work.


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## Jbphipps (Apr 17, 2014)

Update: She dropped the afterbirth on her own a couple of hours later and she ate everything in sight for hours and walked almost normally right after kidding. 24 hours later I did another urine test for ketone levels and it showed completely negative. Her udders still aren't as full as I'd like but maybe she'll make more milk as the kids demand it. 

Our last girl kidded yesterday and I slept 9 hours last night! Thank you all so much for the support. The girls and I appreciate you. 


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Congrats on the newest additions. 
Yay :stars: she dropped her afterbirth that is good.

Awesome she is back to normal, good work. 

Good Alfalfa, grain and water will help along with the kids stimulation to build more milk.

How are the kids belly's, are they full or empty? If they are not getting enough, supplement feed them until momma gets more milk in.


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