# Doe is acting just like a a male for extended period



## cwatkin (Jul 9, 2012)

I was recently given a seemingly healthy female goat that has one issue. It acts just like a male. This is a long-term issue and not just an indication she is in heat. Basically, the goat was given to a friend of mine who was going to shoot it as she thought it was obnoxious to her other goats and she didn't like listening to it. She had recently been given the goat by someone who could no longer care for it or had no interest in it. It came to her as a pair of mother and daughter. She kept the daughter and gave me the obnoxious mother. It has only been bred this one time and had triplets like 2 years ago when it was a little over a year old.

I brought it over, made sure it was wormed and gave it a few vaccines, then introduced it to my herd. It began humping and going wild. It made all the blubbering, snorting, tounge waving, etc. gestures that bucks in rut make. She is jumping up and humping on other does, moaning like a male, and you would think she was a male based on how she is acting. She acts more like a male than some of my males.

Anyway, I am wondering if she needs to be bred or if there is something wrong with her like a hormonal problem. Do goats ever have disorders that can cause this type of issue? I know she was wormed regularly and is plenty healthy and strong. She is also very stubborn and it took her a few times of tearing through my electric fence before she would respect that boundary.

I introduced her to my bucks and they seemed interested like she was in heat but she wasn't very receptive to breeding.

She is a Nigerian dwarf with maybe some Alpine or Toggenburg mixed in but I don't know. The previous owners do not know about her background but she has blue eyes and other characteristics of the Nigerians. Her previous owner has almost exclusively Nigerians so I doubt it is a characteristic of this breed.

What do you think?

Conor


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I'd be curious why she hasn't gotten pregnant again. You could always work with her and do some hormone shots and work on getting her pregnant.


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

She could have cystic ovaries. That will cause all sorts of hormonal problems; bucky behavior, hard or impossible to breed, etc. 
Giving her lute may help straighten her out. (how do you spell the proper name for "Lute"?)


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## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

Yes, my friend has a doe who was cystic and acted exactly like that. My coat smelled like my buck and she kept blubbering and sneezing at me, and ramming the fence. My friend gave lute (Lutalyse) as well as some herbs, and she has since come into heat and been covered (not confirmed pregnant yet.)


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces (Apr 7, 2013)

I would think cystic ovaries are the culprit. Try and get a hold of a CIDR progesterone implant, some Lutalyse, and Cystorelin and see if you get anywhere with that.
The CIDR will stop her body from producing so much testosterone, and it will make her body think it's pregnant, when you remove it, it will send her body signals to come into heat, the lutalyse ensures she comes into heat, and the cystorelin ensures she will ovulate. When you breed her on the induced heat and ovulation cycle, she should settle.


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## hallsthirdacrefarm (Mar 30, 2011)

lutalyse...


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## cwatkin (Jul 9, 2012)

She was bred only one time because the people didn't have a buck, not because of this problem.

How does one go about implanting the CIDR? Is it best to have a vet do this and what is the cost?

Also, will she ever be somewhat normal or will this procedure need to be repeated each time you want her bred? Will one time break this cycle?

I put her in with one of the bucks and he have been breeding her nonstop today. She did stand there and let him get her quite a few times so I don't know if she is in heat or just messed up. Whatever smell she is giving off is driving the bucks crazy but I don't smell the distinct buck smell coming from her.

Is it possible that being around the bucks for a time will settle her down? If so, how long? Also, if a pregnancy takes, how long will it be before the signals are sent to her body that she is pregnant.

Thanks,

Conor


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## cwatkin (Jul 9, 2012)

She just stood still with rapid tail wagging. The buck got her really well this last time. This looks like she is in heat but maybe the hormones have her confused.

Conor


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Time will tell. If she keeps cycling, then she is probably cystic.


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces (Apr 7, 2013)

If she keeps cycling after this, go ahead and try the CIDR with lute and cystorelin.

A CIDR is a vaginal insert for goats, sheep and cows. You can buy the sheep size In packs of 20 or individually from Biogenics. You need the $10 applicator to insert them however. 
You can do it by yourself, or have a vet do it. Doesn't matter. It's like putting a tampon in a goat. It stays in for 14-21 days depending on what protocol you want to use.

She may cycle and settle normally after this, or she may need the protocol every time you want to breed her. Even the shots and implant isn't a guarantee she will settle, but she has a much much greater chance if you use them.


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## cwatkin (Jul 9, 2012)

I have an update on this. I have here with the males so she has every opportunity to get pregnant. She acts like she is continually in heat and the boys are constantly mating her. I figured maybe she had enough so I put her back in with the girls and she started trying to breed them once again. She went back to the boys at this point.

I am guessing her hormones are all off and causing her to seem like she is in heat all the time even when she isn't. The boys have settled down some since she was first introduced but I can tell they are pretty much breeding her an a daily basis. I will try to keep them together for about a month to make sure another heat cycle has had an opportunity to occur before trying anything else. I was hoping she might get pregnant on her own and the situation would then hopefully resolve itself. We will see...

Conor


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces (Apr 7, 2013)

Constantly appearing to be in heat is a big sign of cystic ovaries. They can't settle when they have cystic ovaries, because there is a big block that isn't allowing them to ovulate and drop their eggs.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Her being constantly bred is bad. That much breeding could cause a uterine infection or even further damage. I would get her out of the boys pen and treat her for cystic ovaries.


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## cwatkin (Jul 9, 2012)

I have her in a separate pen from the boys and the girls now but in close range of the girls so she can at least have interaction with other goats. She cannot be placed in with the girls as she constantly harasses and tries to mate them.

I am going to look into having a vet treat this as I could take her to him easily and figure it might be best to have a pro do this on the first go around.

Conor


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## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

Do you have a wether you can keep with her for company?


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## cwatkin (Jul 9, 2012)

I don't have any wethers at this time as they all went to the sale a few days ago. Darn... Besides, she would probably be humping one all the time. The only ones she doesn't hump are the larger bucks.

I called a vet this morning about having him do the procedure. What do you think the odds are this treatment will solve the issue?

Conor


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Really can't say. Only time will tell. Hopefully the vet can help you.


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## cwatkin (Jul 9, 2012)

I do have an update on this situation. I had called a vet and basically I decided that between the cost of treatment and the possibility of it not working, I was going to sell her. This goat had been through many hands because of the troubles it caused and I decided I was going to take her to the sale for meat. With only two days to go before the sale, she suddenly settled down. I currently have her in with the females so I hope maybe she is pregnant as of now. We will see as she was in with the boys for a while and they went crazy breeding her. If so, I hope this breaks her bad cycle and she can become a normal goat again.

Conor


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I sure hope she is pregnant for you.


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## cwatkin (Jul 9, 2012)

Thanks. I sure hope she is pregnant too. I honestly don't care which one of the bucks bred her as long as this takes care of the problem. She was terrible! There are still hints of her old self but I think she was doing it so long that it might take a while for her to get everything out of her system, especially if her hormones were out of whack for so long.

Conor


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## LuvMyNigies (Sep 14, 2013)

I know this is a relatively old post, but I was wondering what ended up happening with your doe? I'm thinking my doe may have cystic ovaries, so I'm interested in knowing what happened.


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## cwatkin (Jul 9, 2012)

I still have the goat and things are inconclusive. I decided not to spend the money on her to have this treated and will take her to the sale if things don't become obvious soon. She has been with bucks and was bred A LOT so we will see. Basically, she was never a nice goat around me so I am in no way attached to her. She got her vaccinations and is fed with all the others but has been such a pain that I don't feel bad moving her along at the sale. Tearing down the electric fence seemed to be a daily routine for a while. She eventually got tangled in the wire for several minutes which seemed to cure her of this behavior.

The cost of treating this is essentially the cost of buying a new goat and there is no 100% success with it from what I read. Since I have no attachment to her, I am going to see if she is pregnant but she will go to the sale if not. Either way, she is gaining weight and looks like she might be pregnant. This could also be from all the springtime growth they have to eat.

That is the story here. I guess I could keep her through the growing season and then mover her along to give her more time without having to feed much more.

Conor


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## COgoatLover25 (Dec 23, 2013)

Keep us updated 


Home to Reg. Nubians, Nigerians, and meat goats.


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## LuvMyNigies (Sep 14, 2013)

Thanks, and yes, do keep us updated.


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## cwatkin (Jul 9, 2012)

I will let you know what happens. She looks pregnant but still acts odd from time to time. I will keep her another month for sure and then decide what is going on and test her for pregnancy.

Conor


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## cwatkin (Jul 9, 2012)

I wanted to give everyone an update on this situation. I have never gotten any conclusive answer on this doe but she seems to still sometimes come into heat and attract the attention of the males. She sometimes allows herself to be bred but often does not. Either way, I have decided to take her to the sale this coming week. Although I know she could be treated, it may be costly and unsuccessful so I view her as a cull. She was never friendly with other goats and has been very destructive to fencing and the like. She is a nuisance and will push an unlatched gate open faster than I can stop her. She is a cull on many levels so she needs to go. 

I decided to hold out once spring hit when there was plenty of forage and I wasn't using a lot of feed on her and I knew some kids would be going to the sale in a few months. That deadline has come and she hasn't changed.

Conor


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

You have to do what is best for your herd.


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## cwatkin (Jul 9, 2012)

Yes, between this problem and the fact she is just downright destructive and a nuisance, means she has to go. I gave her a good chance but she didn't come through for me.

Conor


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