# Polled or Not Polled?



## DaisyMayFarm (Jan 19, 2013)

Had the first babies ever to be born on the farm arrive today! 1 boy, 1 girl. How do I know if they're polled or not? Momma is, daddy wasn't. I've felt both their heads, but it's just smooth and feels like both my polled does'.


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## milkmaid (Sep 15, 2010)

They are beautiful!!!!! The first kids are always very special! Congratulations!
If one is polled and the other isn't, you will easily be able to tell by comparing the hair pattern on the head. It's not so easy if they're both the same.
If over the horn buds the hair is very swirled, then the kid is horned. If it is hardly swirled at all, then the kid is polled.
Here's a link to some pictures of twins born here this year. The light buckskin doeling is polled; the black and white buckling is horned. I could tell the minute they were born. Pictures 2 and 6 show the difference most clearly.
https://picasaweb.google.com/117715...authkey=Gv1sRgCMeSgduB1cDbhgE&feat=directlink


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## DaisyMayFarm (Jan 19, 2013)

The grey and white one is the boy (ND ears), who I'm almost positive is polled. The brown/white/black/tan doeling (Mancha ears) is a bit harder, and I don't have as good a shot of her. Problem is, ALL her fur is swirly and has a ton of cowlicks in it.


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## milkmaid (Sep 15, 2010)

I commented on your other thread before saying that I thought they were both horned, but judging by these pictures, I think you're right about Clover being polled. His hair doesn't swirl over his horn buds, but comes to a halfhearted point.
Now Posy...it might just be the "doeling effect" (aka wishful thinking), but I think she might be polled too. IDK, in some pictures she looks polled, in some she looks horned.
Funny that I could tell right away with my polled kid, yet it's so hard in pictures! You say you're almost positive Clover is polled, so you're probably right.


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## DaisyMayFarm (Jan 19, 2013)

Thanks for the guesses! I'm just happy momma had an easy delivery, had twins (she's a FF) _and_ had a beautifully marked doeling! :clap:

I would love it if Posy was polled. I'm about 80% sure Clover will be sold, but Posy is staying here. And since my other two are polled, it'd be awesome if I could have a totally polled herd since I don't do disbudding.

Would you feel _anything_ if they were pulled? All I feel is smooth skull, no bumps/points/anything. I'm such a newbie!


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## milkmaid (Sep 15, 2010)

I really can't remember. I think that horned kids are usually born with bumps, at least the ND kids are. Especially bucklings.
Please let me know what they turn out to be! They are beautiful! I love polled goats. And after I once met some Lamancha kids, I have found elf ears irresistible! Posy is SO cute!


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## DaisyMayFarm (Jan 19, 2013)

Will do! Thank you for your help.  Once last question : what age will I know for sure if they're horned or not? A few days or weeks?

I love Posy too! Her ears match my adult LaMancha doe's; it's too cute.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

no swirl..no horns : ) hair will look like bangs...might need to wait a day or two for hair to settle...both are beautiful either way..Congrats!!


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## ptgoats45 (Nov 28, 2011)

By the time they are a couple weeks old you should be able to either feel a horn bud starting, or not. Most doe kids will not have noticeable horn buds when they are small, but usually by 2 weeks you can tell if they have horns. 

I know with cattle a polled calf will usually have a more rounded head while a horned calf will appear a bit more square. Newborns calves can be harder to tell, but as they age the difference is obvious. Goats all seem to have rounded heads though, so that wouldn't really apply to them.

Is there any one near you who has some newborn kids that are for sure horned and you can feel their heads to see if there is any difference between them and yours?


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## milkmaid (Sep 15, 2010)

What breed are they?
With my Nigerian kids, the horns grow really fast; I mean by 3 days they definitely have little horns coming in. But other breeds may be different. I have heard some people say the horns can take a month to start growing, but that has never happened to mine.


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## DaisyMayFarm (Jan 19, 2013)

milkmaid said:


> What breed are they?
> With my Nigerian kids, the horns grow really fast; I mean by 3 days they definitely have little horns coming in. But other breeds may be different. I have heard some people say the horns can take a month to start growing, but that has never happened to mine.


Their mom is a ND mix (mostly ND though) and dad was a mini Mancha.

Here are two new pictures. I'm thinking polled?

Clover (buckling) is first, then Posy (girl).


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

I'm not an expert, but I think the first is polled, second horned.


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## milkmaid (Sep 15, 2010)

Aww, look at those darling little heads! Don't they just warm your heart?  You're giving me baby fever!
Clover is polled, 99% sure. Still not sure about Posy; her hair swirls a little, but not as much as it "should" if she were horned. Hoping polled, but leaning toward horned. Can't wait to find out!
With their high percentage of ND, I'm practically certain that you would feel little nubs by now if they were going to be horned. But since Posy is a doeling, hers might wait a little longer...


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## JaLyn (Oct 10, 2012)

Sometimes it's harder to tell on doelings at first..


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## woodranch (Aug 27, 2012)

My polled goats have what I can poll bumps. They have a bump that has a flat, smooth feel to them where as a horns goat will have pointy bumps.

Probably does not make sense, but I hope this helps.


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## DaisyMayFarm (Jan 19, 2013)

They're cute, that's for sure! Posy got the Mancha looks, where Clover got the incredible Mancha temperament, which I'm a bit bummed about. 

Woodranch, their heads feel exactly like my polled adults' just smaller. If that makes sense.


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

My week old polled buckling has TINY flat, smooth bumps that you can wiggle the skin over.


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## sassykat6181 (Nov 28, 2012)

I saw in your previous post that you want a polled herd....I have read that you shouldn't breed a polled doe with a polled buck for health reasons.


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## DaisyMayFarm (Jan 19, 2013)

sassykat6181 said:


> I saw in your previous post that you want a polled herd....I have read that you shouldn't breed a polled doe with a polled buck for health reasons.


Yeah, I've heard that too. Both my girls were bred to horned bucks, and will be in the future. I'd keep any horns girls, I just prefer polled as I won't disbud.


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## milkmaid (Sep 15, 2010)

So have any horns sprouted yet?


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

they looked polled to me


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## DaisyMayFarm (Jan 19, 2013)

milkmaid said:


> So have any horns sprouted yet?


Nope! Nothing at all; as smooth as they day they were born.  Hope it stays that way!


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## vlinealpines (Sep 23, 2012)

I vote both polled!


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## ptgoats45 (Nov 28, 2011)

I think I read somewhere that a polled kids skin will move over the area the horns should be and a horned kids skin will not move. I've never had a polled kid, but they do look polled to me too.

I have heard that the polled gene is associated with hermaphroditism, not sure of the truth in that.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

ptgoats45 I think you must have missed the whole discussion we just had on that


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