# Questions about Milk Replacers, Goat Colostrum, and more...



## HollowbeadRanch (Oct 5, 2007)

Since we had the scare the other day with the little Buckling that we lost, I had thought I would stock up on a few things to have on hand. I have been looking at a couple of different products and wanted to see if anyone had used any of them before. These are the ones:

1) Sav-A-Kid Milk Replacer
2) Kaeco Oral Gel Goat Colostrum
3) Omega 3 Energy Drench for Goats
4) Pritchard Teat

Has anyone used any of these products? Also, I have been reading on the Goat Colostrum and it says to give 10ml per day for 3 days... then the Milk Replacer says to give Colostrum for the first day and then start the Milk Replacer on the second day, so do I need to give a Colostrum Supplement for the first day along with the 10mls of Oral Gel Colostrum and then start giving the Milk Replacer on the second day along with the Gel as well?? If so, then I have been looking at Manna Pro Kid Colostrum Supplement to use as the supplement for the first day, has anyone used it before?? Please let me know if I am interpreting all of this the wrong way. It can be a little confusing with the minimual amount of information available online for the use of these products, and this is MUCH different from bottle raising a puppy, kitten, or baby bird. Any help would be greatly appreciated! Thanks!

Brandi


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## trob1 (Oct 5, 2007)

IMO the colustrum replacements are of no use read the ingredents and you will see animal fat with preservatives, you really need to express colustrum from the dam or use some frozen from another doe. They really only need it for the first 24 hours then I use whole cows milk from the store. I do not like milk replacers, read the ingredents list and you will see why. It has dried cows milk and lot of other unneeded stuff added along with preservatives. Pritchard Teat nipples are the best and all I use.


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## Muddy Creek Farm (Oct 5, 2007)

I agree. And I buy organic milk, so I now I'm not pumping antibiotics into their little bodies. Of course the best thing is raw goats milk, if you have to bottle feed.


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## FarmGirl18 (Oct 5, 2007)

I've used the Omega Energy Drench, the goats seem to like it alot better than Nutri Drench. And I love the Prichard teats for starting kids out on the bottle. I have some of the gel on hand, but I had a hard time getting it down the little kids, I had a few problem ones this year.


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## fritzie (Oct 6, 2007)

i agree with the above. if you can not get goats milk then i would give whole cows milk. i have found that the replacer milk gives them scours. also if it is from one of your does milk out the colostrum & use that.you can also freeze it if you have extra for next year. i use the pichartt nipple the first two days then i switch them over to the lamb bar nipple because i use the lamb bar bucket for mine. of course i have full size dairy goats. the lamb bar nipple would be to big for a mini i think.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

I have used replacers in the past. It was made by land o lakes and I believe is one of the better ones out there. It was like 50.00 for the 50lb bag though! but I was able to bottle feed 2 kids for almost 3 months I think it was.

I never had a scouring problem - but I had not choice once I realized mom wasn't feeding them (mastitis) I had to do something, they were 2 days old. 

That was my only experience with replacers. 

If I had to do it again....... I don't know that I would do it any different, given the choices I had. 

at 4.00 a gallon for whole milk..........I dont know if I could affored to bottle feed with cows milk.

oh and because mom wasn't able to feed them I have no idea if they got colostrum or not. Maybe before she got mastitis :shrug: she was such a good mom before that I never worried about it. to me it is a miracle those kids servived!


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## lesserweevil (Oct 5, 2007)

I use milk replacer to feed bottle babies - if I don't have any goat's milk. Obviously I would use the goat's milk if I had it... I raised 4 goatbabies on mostly milk replacer this year and they did fine with it. Harmony was the only one who hadn't had enough colostrum, and she is still smaller than Demi - who had plenty. Also, I lost 2 kids, Rhythm and Melody, to a disease which might not have been fatal if they had received enough REAL colostrum when they were born. They did have sheep's colostrum and cow's colostrum - but the antibodies weren't the same. 

I would recommend that if you have a goat kid that has surplus colostrum - freeze it in case you have one another year which doesn't have enough. The frozen colostrum lasts a year, I think, in the freezer. I now have a bottle in the freezer just in case of emergencies like this time!


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

you know that might explain why the bucks owner said of Daisy "that goat is really small" I didn't think she was small but given that I raised her I got use to her.

Something to pass onto her new owners as a possibility.


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## trob1 (Oct 5, 2007)

Believe it or not the adverage milk replacer adverages out to $3.00 to $3.50 a gallon and I payed $3.50 a gallon for whole cows milk at the store. If you can find milk on sale or buy it at a Sam's club you can get it cheaper and freeze it. So to me price wise it is the same but ingredents are way different. I have used milk replacers in the past and didnt like the results but it is really a to each his own kinda thing.


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## goathappy (Oct 5, 2007)

This is just my opinion, but for colostrum if you can't get the real stuff from the goat(which is the best you can get) here is a good replacer:
3 cups milk
1 beaten egg
1 tsp cod liver oil
1 tbsp sugar

For cows milk, I know I'm probably rocking the boat here but personally, after doing much research, I'd rather give my kids expensive replacer than cows milk. After talking to several breeder friends and doing my own research, many cows throughout the US in dairies carry or have Johnes, and Johnes is not killed by pasturization. I would rather feed replacer than risk my goats getting infected with Johnes.
For milk replacer, Purina, I've found, is probably the best milk replacer you can get, we used that one year when we didn't have enough goat milk and our kids did wonderfully on it.


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## fritzie (Oct 6, 2007)

i have used replacer in the past & i did like tht land o lakes the best. again i think it is what works for you & your herd. i know alot of breeders will use the colostrum replacer & milk replacer to make sure that the babies are free of c.a.e.
when i did have to buy milk it was not as expencive as it is now. for a while i even mixed whole milk with the replacer to make it go farther.


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## trob1 (Oct 5, 2007)

Sarah you do know that kid milk replacer isnt made from goat milk but infact is cows milk and or soy. If you know that then how is it safer than the whole milk from the store we drink?


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

fritzie said:


> for a while i even mixed whole milk with the replacer to make it go farther.


that is the idea I had if I ever have to bottle feed.


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## goathappy (Oct 5, 2007)

I don't know for me though I just personally wouldn't use the stuff from the store. Actually, our babies did better on replacer than they did on the stuff from the store, the store milk gave them scours really bad.


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## morganslil1 (Nov 13, 2007)

I fed both of my bottle babys purina replacer. The only problem I had is sometimes it would be lumpy when I mixed it and I had to drive 80 miles just to get it.


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## fritzie (Oct 6, 2007)

stacy that work real well for me two years afo. i bought a 2 week old buck & none of my does had freashend yet so i gave him that for 2 months until i had the goats milk.


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## goatee (Nov 22, 2007)

hi all,
just had a baby goat on last sunday the 25th. nov.
baby and mom doing great. it took me a few min to get the newborn to suck then it was all good. 
mom is a part haberlasi and boer. baby dad is full boer. baby looks like a boer mom looks like a haberlasi. nice looking baby goat female.
Why do so many people seem to prefer bottle feeding? I had goats when I was a young teenager and don't remember ever having to bottle feed.
the goats I had back then were saneen and gave lots of milk though. and it was in upstate NY very cold in april during kidding time. 
Am I missing something here or is it just a preference to bottle feed? thanks goatee


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## fritzie (Oct 6, 2007)

goatee with me it is a preference & i sell breeding stock most dairy breeders will not buy if they have not been raised on C.A.E. prevention or are tested for it. also i am home all day & i enjoy it.
i don't think that it is right or wrong just what you enjoy & what works for you.


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## HollowbeadRanch (Oct 5, 2007)

Thanks for all the responses! Teresa, do you heat the cow's milk before feeding (I am figuring you do, but just wanted to check to be sure)? I think I will try the cow's milk if the occasion ever arrives. The main concern I had with using milk replacers is that no one near hear (not even tractor supply, co-op, or the vet) carriers milk replacer specifically for goats, and if I was going to use a replacer I would want it to be formulated for goats so it would have the copper in it. So I would have to order the replacer, which doesn't bother me but if I get in a bind and run out then I have to wait for it to come in. So I am very happy to hear that the cow's milk works well for some of you. If anyone has a feeding schedule that includes when and how much you should feed the babies then I would love to have a copy of it. I am going to purchase a few tubes of the dried goat colostrum and possibly a bag of colostrum supplement to have on hand. Also, the next time I have a Doe to kid, if she has enough I am going to try to milk her to get some colostrum to freeze. I will also be purchase some pritchard teats to have one hand and a weak kid syringe. I was VERY lucky with Todd, and the next time anything goes wrong I don't want to rely on luck. Because knowing the way things go around here it will happen on a Sunday when most things are closed and no vets are available :roll:


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## trob1 (Oct 5, 2007)

Here is a schedule for the mini goats that I like to use

1-3 days.................6 feedings a day...2-4 oz per feeding with first bottle at 6 am and last at 9 pm (I feed more often and round the clock for weak kids) 
3 days-2weeks.........5 feedings a day...2-5 oz per feeding
2-4 weeks................4 feedings a day...5-9 oz per feeding
4-6 weeks................3 feedings a day...10 ounces per feeding
6-8 weeks................2 feddings a day...10 ounces per feeding
8 weeks-3-4 months 1 feedings a day...10 ounces begin reducing the amount in each bottle, until weaning is complete.

If you have a doe who kids a single they are great for stealing some colustrum to freeze. some people freeze it in ice cube trays so you can thaw what you need when you need it. A good place to get a feeding tube sized for the little kids we have is http://www.maggidans.com she sells them and lots of other neat stuff.


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

I use the pritchard...only had them on hand "just in case" I actually used them first on piglets!! I also had very good results with the Uni-Milk brand replacer, TSC carries it. When I ran low on the goats milk for these baby pigs I started "thinning" it with the replacer, and when they were weaned and sold I still had replacer so when I got "stingy" with my girls milk and Angel seemed to want to nurse from Tilly, I gave her a bottle of the replacer, as well as Chief..never had an issue with scouring on it, you really need to follow the exact directions on the mixing....and if you do use the replacer best way to mix it free of lumps is with a "stick blender". And I had also milked Bootsies colostrum off of the side her buckling wasn't nursing from and froze it. It came in handy when a friend had a rejected boer kid, he is doing great too.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

welcome goatee. A lot of people bottle feed because of CAE. And others do it because they like to. Anothe reason is when mom rejects a kid.

I was reading the breeds of your goats - did you mean oberhasli? I love that breed, I first started with them and then moved onto the minis.


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## HollowbeadRanch (Oct 5, 2007)

Thanks Teresa! I am going to print that out and put it with my goat stuff right now. I have got a small tote w/ lid that I keep all of my kidding supplies in, so I am going to put it in with my kit. I have a Doe that should be due to kid before the end of this year, so if she delivers a single then I plan on milking her some. Does anyone know how many days a Doe produces colostrum? Is it two days? I think I read that somewhere but I can't really remember. Thanks again for all the help!!


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## DancinGoatGal (Oct 5, 2007)

The first three goats I had were taken off their dam at about 2 days old, old enough to have gotten colostrum, yet young enough to change to bottle feeding.. I switched them to Land O Lakes Replacer right off the bat and don't remember having problems with scours. I personally would NOT use store bought milk to feed my kids.. It's something I just couldn't do. If I ever had to buy replacer - it would be the Land O Lakes - nothing else.

We can milk each year (well, this year we didn't can as much because of other reasons). The canned milk gets used as our "replacer" during kidding season - and we do go through a lot of it. They don't like this quite as well as the raw milk, but if you mix it 1/2 & 1/2 - they will drink it.

We freeze any extra colostrum we have. I feed colostrum for one whole day (even though my neighbor told me I only need to feed 1 oz per pound - I feed it a full day). Then start them on the raw milk - I tried pasturizing it - but found for me at the moment it was easier to use raw milk. I haven't gotten the money to test for CAE yet - and once I do have the money to do the test yearly I'll probably start pasturizing the milk just to say that I am doing a CAE prevention program!

Bottle feeding for me is a preference - I like to handel the kids - and really enjoy bottle feeding and the bottle fed kids sell a little faster around here because of all the 4-H'ers wanting goats that they can hadle for their projects. 

Some does will produce a yellow colored milk for several days. I've had 2nd day milk almost as yellow as first day and I still freeze it - because I figure even that is better than nothing if you have an abandoned kid or the dam dies. I don't think I would freeze milk to use more than two days - but IDK?


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

by the third day most of the colostrum is gone out of the milk but it is best to wait till 2 weeks after kidding before trying to drink the milk because it tastes aweful if you don't wait! I tried it  so obviously there is traces of the colostrum for that length of time.


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## HollowbeadRanch (Oct 5, 2007)

Thanks! I am hoping that I don't ever have to use all of this information, but you never know. I just wanted to be as prepared as I could be.


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## mystic's_mom (Oct 5, 2007)

Out of all the replacers I have tried in the past, Merricks has had the best one by far; it also has the least amount of 'additives', and the best vitamin\mineral content than others that I have found. This one is a spendier one, though, but in my book, if I am going to spend $ on a replacer it better be a good one, and this one has proven it self good over and over again. 

Plus for me, Replacers have always been easier to store, and especially now, when I really have no extra storage space... :roll: When I am done with it for the spring, I will put left over replacer good baggies, and put the extra replacer in the freezer; it takes up much less space than bottles of milk, and will last longer too. When I need it, I just take it out one baggie at a time. 

I never really had much luck raising kids on store bought milk; probably because it lacks some of the vitamins and minerals kids, and even whole milk still doesn't have as much fat and protein in it as I like to see my kids get. Kids did better when I mixed Replacer and whole milk together. That is just my experience though. 

I do tend to stick with the Merrick Replacer though. It is formulated for kids, and that to me, is important; I know they are going to get what they need from it. Others don't like replacers, and that is fine with me, too. They have worked well for me in the past, and I am sure they will in the future too.


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