# First Aid Trivia Game



## MellonFriend

I've got an idea! Why don't we try an educational game. It's a trivia game. Someone -who either knows the answer or does not- asks a simple or complex goat first aid question. If you are a knowledgeable person, let the a not so knowledgeable member answer it and see if they can get it right. Multiple people can share their opinions on what they would do. There may be multiple right answers to a question. I'll give an example to start. Distended left side of abdomen, signs of discomfort, moaning, grinding teeth. 

I have no idea if this game is going to take off or even work at all, but I hope to give us newbies a chance to test our knowledge of first aid, and maybe a way to learn in a more proactive manner.


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## Amber89

My guess is bloat?need baking soada and stop food and around 1/2 cup of oil not mineral oil but peanut oil or something like that can try massaging her sides? Am I close.lol this is kinda intimidating


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## Morning Star Farm

Oh this is fun! I've got a first aid question that I see way too often. Staggering, swaying, looking all around dizzy, unable to control back legs, holding head crooked and swinging head as well as falling down a whole lot!


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## groovyoldlady

I'm thinking "Treat aggressively for polio/listerosis". 

How about, "My goat has weird little bumps on her udder and belly. What can it be?"


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## Amber89

Morning Star Farm said:


> Oh this is fun! I've got a first aid question that I see way too often. Staggering, swaying, looking all around dizzy, unable to control back legs, holding head crooked and swinging head as well as falling down a whole lot!


That white tail deer worm?


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## Amber89

I have one ..Buck off feed,kinda stand offish,tries to eat and starts choking and shaking head up and down..?


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## Amber89

Morning Star Farm said:


> Nope! I'm afraid not! There is usually no anemia involved.


Hmm im thinking lol gotta be something to do with the brain or nuerlogical


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## Amber89

Hmm and its not the menegial worm,,spell check lol hmm white muscle disease? Maybe exposure to something toxic?! Help y'all! Lol


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## Morning Star Farm

Amber89 said:


> Hmm and its not the menegial worm,,spell check lol hmm white muscle disease? Maybe exposure to something toxic?! Help y'all! Lol


Ok, the neurological guess was close so I'll tell you. It's actually.any type of spinal cord injury, usually to the neck, atlas or tailhead. It can happen at any age, but young kids in with adults are especially susceptible. They lose all their balance which is why they stagger and try to compensate with their heads and necks. Treatment is usually chiropractic and laser and acupuncture can help in extreme cases like one of mine had. It is not at all uncommon.


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## MellonFriend

Amber89 said:


> My guess is bloat?need baking soada and stop food and around 1/2 cup of oil not mineral oil but peanut oil or something like that can try massaging her sides? Am I close.lol this is kinda intimidating


Yep bloat is what I was thinking of. That treatment sounds right to me!


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## MellonFriend

groovyoldlady said:


> "My goat has weird little bumps on her udder and belly. What can it be?"


 Staph or yeast infection? Wash with udder wash or maybe some other type of antibiotic ointment?


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

MellonFriend said:


> Staph or yeast infection? Wash with udder wash or maybe some other type of antibiotic ointment?


Probably staph. Treat with chlorhexidine and wear gloves.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

Okay how about this one:

Pale eyelids, bottle jaw, weight loss, diarrhea, clean fecal tests.


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## MellonFriend

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Okay how about this one:
> 
> Pale eyelids, bottle jaw, weight loss, diarrhea, clean fecal test


Give garlic? :shrug:


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

MellonFriend said:


> Give garlic? :shrug:


Haha! Always.


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## healthyishappy

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Okay how about this one:
> 
> Pale eyelids, bottle jaw, weight loss, diarrhea, clean fecal tests.


I was going to say worms till I saw clean fecal tests.
Does coccidia always show up on fecal tests though?


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## MellonFriend

healthyishappy said:


> I was going to say worms till I saw clean fecal tests.
> Does coccidia always show up on fecal tests though?


Yes it does.


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## healthyishappy

MellonFriend said:


> Yes it does.


So then it couldn't be worms.
Hmm..... I'm stumped!


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## Dwarf Dad

Copper deficient?


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## healthyishappy

Dwarf Dad said:


> Copper deficient?


That's a dang good guess, now that I think about it that would make sense!


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

healthyishappy said:


> I was going to say worms till I saw clean fecal tests.
> Does coccidia always show up on fecal tests though?


Negative for coccidia


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## healthyishappy

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Negative for coccidia


And not copper deficiency?


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

healthyishappy said:


> And not copper deficiency?


No but that could also be going on.


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## healthyishappy

Anybody else then?


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## NigerianNewbie

Johne's Disease


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

Maybe I went too broad. How about some hints:

Acute anemia and bottle jaw appeared, say, over the winter. You had a very wet season. Goats graze near ponds, eyelid membranes go from pale to yellow, body temperature lowers.

C’mon guys!!


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## groovyoldlady

Liver flukes! Wet ground = Flukey ground!


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

groovyoldlady said:


> Liver flukes! Wet ground = Flukey ground!


Ding! Ding! Ding!

Nice job.


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## groovyoldlady

MellonFriend said:


> Staph or yeast infection? Wash with udder wash or maybe some other type of antibiotic ointment?





NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Ding! Ding! Ding!
> 
> Nice job.


Wooooooot! I actually only learned about Liver Flukes recently...

OK, here's one: My does really seem to have weak pasterns. What could they possibly need?


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

groovyoldlady said:


> Wooooooot! I actually only learned about Liver Flukes recently...
> 
> OK, here's one: My does really seem to have weak pasterns. What could they possibly need?


SELENIUM!!


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

Large crusty areas on body, flaky and dry. Loss of appetite and libido. But skin scraping is negative for mites. What could it be?


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## groovyoldlady

MellonFriend said:


> Staph or yeast infection? Wash with udder wash or maybe some other type of antibiotic ointment?


 Yes, staph. Treat with Chlorhexadine wash!



NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Probably staph. Treat with chlorhexidine and wear gloves.


 Ayuh!!!!!


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## groovyoldlady

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Large crusty areas on body, flaky and dry. Loss of appetite and libido. But skin scraping is negative for mites. What could it be?


 Hmmm. Zinc deficiency? And/or copper deficiency.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

groovyoldlady said:


> Hmmm. Zinc deficiency? And/or copper deficiency.


Yep! Zinc!

This one is actually a true story. A friend of mine had a goat with this awful skin issue on her stomach and nothing helped until I recommend zinc!!


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

Alright now instead of diagnosing what about treatment protocols:

DIARRHEA! What do you check for and what do you do?


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## healthyishappy

groovyoldlady said:


> Liver flukes! Wet ground = Flukey ground!


Argh!!!! That had crossed my mind but I didnt think!!!


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## healthyishappy

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Alright now instead of diagnosing what about treatment protocols:
> 
> DIARRHEA! What do you check for and what do you do?


Probios! I know there's more too that too. 
I would check famacha too.


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## Nigerian dwarf goat

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> DIARRHEA! What do you check for and what do you do?


Listen for rumen noises, get a fecal, check famacha, take grain away, give only hay, keep hydrated with electrolytes, probios and of course, some good ol' garlic!!!


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## NigerianNewbie

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Alright now instead of diagnosing what about treatment protocols:
> 
> DIARRHEA! What do you check for and what do you do?


Examine and pay attention to color, smell, formation and frequency of the stools. Consider possible known dietary causes for the loose stools. Take a rectal temperature, and check eye membranes. Cease feeding anything other than hay until the stool returns to normal. Provide electrolytes 24/7 to combat dehydration and give daily probiotics. Consider giving a dose or 2 of pepto to calm the gut down. Get a fecal to check for worms and/or coccidia.


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## Morning Star Farm

Ok, my next one is going to be similar to the liver flukes in symptoms, but totally different. Should be easy!

Interest in food, but lack of appetite for anything, corresponding weight loss and loss of energy, clean fecals and no anemia. Also can result in abortions if they're bred.


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## NigerianNewbie

Your goat was bitten by a poisonous snake, what do you do to treat or support the goat through this ordeal?


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## Nigerian dwarf goat

Morning Star Farm said:


> Interest in food, but lack of appetite for anything, corresponding weight loss and loss of energy, clean fecals and no anemia. Also can result in abortions if they're bred.


hmm.... Could it be a really severe deficiancy? copper or selenum? That one is tuff...


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## Nigerian dwarf goat

NigerianNewbie said:


> Your goat was bitten by a poisonous snake, what do you do to treat or support the goat through this ordeal


um um um... I am getting these brain juices flowing!

dose of Pen G, um... Banamine for pain, fever and swelling... andddd Ask my friends on TGS??? Is that the right answer(shy)(shy)

Edit!!
Electrolytes, iodine on the bite, and FIND THAT SNAKE!!!! lol


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## Nigerian dwarf goat

Hmm.. does anyone else have a guess??? I am stumped


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

Morning Star Farm said:


> Ok, my next one is going to be similar to the liver flukes in symptoms, but totally different. Should be easy!
> 
> Interest in food, but lack of appetite for anything, corresponding weight loss and loss of energy, clean fecals and no anemia. Also can result in abortions if they're bred.


Make it more obvious with some hints like I did perhaps.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

Morning Star Farm said:


> I'll try! There aren't too many symptoms which makes it more deadly. But they can be standoffish, avoiding human contact and other goats, and (sometimes) extra loud or extra quiet. Does that help?


Honestly my only thought is rabies.


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## Amber89

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Honestly my only thought is rabies.


Me 2


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## Morning Star Farm

Ok, I'll go ahead and tell you because this one might be tough without seeing the goat. It is a broken tooth or tooth abscess. It is a silent killer because most goats won't let you know they have it, especially if they're bred you don't notice the weight loss and it leads to ketosis, abortion or toxemia. I know someone who lost one of their best does that way and only learned the cause through necropsy.

I actually know several people who've had it happen. There was no jaw swelling or anything to suggest teeth.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

Morning Star Farm said:


> Ok, I'll go ahead and tell you because this one might be tough without seeing the goat. It is a broken tooth or tooth abscess. It is a silent killer because most goats won't let you know they have it, especially if they're bred you don't notice the weight loss and it leads to ketosis, abortion or toxemia. I know someone who lost one of their best does that way and only learned the cause through necropsy.
> 
> I actually know several people who've had it happen. There was no jaw swelling or anything to suggest teeth.


Very interesting. Good information for everyone to know.

Thanks for sharing


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## Morning Star Farm

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Very interesting. Good information for everyone to know.
> 
> Thanks for sharing


I'm trying to think of things that are common enough for most goat owners to see, even if they just have pets, but that are not common things people are told to look out for.


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## momto6ls

Ok. I'm so new, I don't know what liver flukes are...or how to treat. You stopped too soon! What's the first aid?!?


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

momto6ls said:


> Ok. I'm so new, I don't know what liver flukes are...or how to treat. You stopped too soon! What's the first aid?!?


Liver flukes are a parasite. They are usually found in areas that have ponds or marsh grass. They are carried by snails. If goats ingest their larvae, they migrate to the liver instead of a normal international worm going to the stomach. They will then cause a variety of issues such as anemia, weight loss, diarrhea, bottle jaw, and more.

The treatment is Ivomec PLUS or Valbazen.

Natural treatments have not shown to be as successful, though @happybleats suggests myrrh essential oil can help.


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## momto6ls

If my goats are like me they won't take Myrrh EO. LOL That stuff is NASTY! And I'm all about natural, so I can take quite a bit. 

Liver flukes. Got it! :ty:


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## happybleats

momto6ls said:


> If my goats are like me they won't take Myrrh EO. LOL That stuff is NASTY! And I'm all about natural, so I can take quite a bit.


Oh yes, nasty nasty stuff..taste like bandaids lol. My goat acted like I gave her poison.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

happybleats said:


> Oh yes, nasty nasty stuff..taste like bandaids lol. My goat acted like I gave her poison.


I honestly just want to try to see because applesauce tends to hide the flavors really well.

Does DoTerra have myrrh I've never seen it?


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## happybleats

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Does DoTerra have myrrh I've never seen it?


Yes they carry it


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

happybleats said:


> Oh yes, nasty nasty stuff..taste like bandaids lol. My goat acted like I gave her poison.


But did it help?


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## happybleats

There was so much more going on at the time I cant say. I did send out fecal for Liver fluke check which came back clean..but again, she was on a lot of herbs and other oils.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

happybleats said:


> There was so much more going on at the time I cant say. I did send out fecal for Liver fluke check which came back clean..but again, she was on a lot of herbs and other oils.


Are her eyelids better?


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## happybleats

Yes, much better.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

happybleats said:


> Yes, much better.


Good! I'm glad!


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

Let’s revive this thread 

A goat with poor parasite resistance, poor body condition, and a poor coat (maybe some balding... maybe some curling...) 

What might this goat’s problem be?

I know, I know, starting out easy.

For this game - symptoms by one person, and the next guesses the problem AND the treatment!!

Let’s have some fun! Keep it going!!


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## 21goaties

The goat needs copper (that their body can use)?


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## Nigerian dwarf goat

Ok... Goat is coughing, sneezing, has a small rasp in lungs, but no fever and acting fine... You cut hay 2 days ago... What is it? 

The hay cutting kinda gave it away LOL


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## CaramelKittey

21goaties said:


> The goat needs copper (that their body can use)?


x2 

Could it be lice/mites as well?


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## CaramelKittey

Here’s one that was used before, but the symptoms are a tad different. 

Flaky skin, balding on the bridge of nose, and around the eyes.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

CaramelKittey said:


> Here's one that was used before, but the symptoms are a tad different.
> 
> Flaky skin, balding on the bridge of nose, and around the eyes.


Zinc! Could be copper and zinc as well!

If wanting to cover zinc but some copper too - TruCare4 is a good option!!


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## Tanya

Bristling hair, shaking, crying, sucking unsuccessfully and always looking for food.


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## CaramelKittey

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Zinc! Could be copper and zinc as well!
> 
> If wanting to cover zinc but some copper too - TruCare4 is a good option!!


:goodjob:
Yes!!


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## CaramelKittey

This is fun! Here’s another one. 

There is a Crusty circular raised lesion on the surface of your goat’s skin. Your goat has been scratching it lately.

What is it? How do you treat it? How should you protect yourself from it? (That gives it away )


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## CaramelKittey

Nigerian dwarf goat said:


> Ok... Goat is coughing, sneezing, has a small rasp in lungs, but no fever and acting fine... You cut hay 2 days ago... What is it?
> 
> The hay cutting kinda gave it away LOL


Could dust from the hay be in their lungs?


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## MellonFriend

CaramelKittey said:


> This is fun! Here's another one.
> 
> There is a Crusty circular raised lesion on the surface of your goat's skin. Your goat has been scratching it lately.
> 
> What is it? How do you treat it? How should you protect yourself from it? (That gives it away )


Ringworm. (Which I know to be not a worm at all). Never had to deal with that myself, but I have a sister who got it once. :lolgoat:

Hmm. I'd try Nustock on it and wear gloves myself when handling said infected area. I believe sunlight is affective at getting rid of it faster too.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

MellonFriend said:


> Ringworm. (Which I know to be not a worm at all). Never had to deal with that myself, but I have a sister who got it once. :lolgoat:
> 
> Hmm. I'd try Nustock on it and wear gloves myself when handling said infected area. I believe sunlight is affective at getting rid of it faster too.


Don't forget some diluted iodine or betadine - a crushed garlic and olive oil paste applied to it is also good - some say diluted bleach works, but I think it's a bit strong!!


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## CaramelKittey

Yes @NigerianDwarfOwner707 and @MellonFriend!


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## CaramelKittey

Tanya said:


> Bristling hair, shaking, crying, sucking unsuccessfully and always looking for food.


I'm stumped.  What is his/her temperature? How old is it?


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

Here’s a tough one - there’s one clue/piece of info that would give it away - so I’m not going to say it, but if you guys are stumped I will... think outside the box!!

Weakness, poor appetite, separation from herd, foaming at the mouth, neurological symptoms - tremors, stargazing, teeth grinding, sweet smelling breath.


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## Goatzrule

i was just reading on this but cant remember the name. Ketosis?


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## Goatzrule

Listeriosis?


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707

Goatzrule said:


> i was just reading on this but cant remember the name. Ketosis?


Yes! Pregnancy Toxemia, which is the same as ketosis - ketosis is after they have kidded and toxemia is before. In this case I was aiming for a pregnant goat with it, but you are correct!! Good job!!


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## Goatzrule

This is a fun game.
My turn. Trying not to give too much away
Young kid showing symptoms of head tilt, progressive paralysis, loss of coordination.


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## Tanya

CaramelKittey said:


> I'm stumped.  What is his/her temperature? How old is it?


3 days old and temp was 104.2. I got a cleft baby in 2 weeks ago with those symptoms. She never made it. I couldnt feed her enough to keep her going. My vet had to euthanize her in the end.


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## MellonFriend

Awww I was going to guess cleft pallet. Sorry you lost the little baby.


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## Goataddict

Diarrhea, weight loss, loss of appetite, low FAMACHA

What is the treatment.


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## Boers4ever

I would guess coccidia and stomach worms? Take a fecal to the vet and see is she has worms. If she does then deworm her with a good dewormer that will kill coccidia. Am a right or am I forgetting something?


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## Goatzrule

young kid showing symptoms of head tilt, progressive paralysis, loss of coordination.


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## Goataddict

Boers4ever said:


> I would guess coccidia and stomach worms? Take a fecal to the vet and see is she has worms. If she does then deworm her with a good dewormer that will kill coccidia. Am a right or am I forgetting something?


Right on.


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## Goataddict

Goatzrule said:


> young kid showing symptoms of head tilt, progressive paralysis, loss of coordination.


Some type of neurological disease CAE perhaps.
Not sure.


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## CaramelKittey

Tanya said:


> 3 days old and temp was 104.2. I got a cleft baby in 2 weeks ago with those symptoms. She never made it. I couldnt feed her enough to keep her going. My vet had to euthanize her in the end.


I'm so sorry to hear that. 
:hug:


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## Tanya

CaramelKittey said:


> I'm so sorry to hear that.
> :hug:


Its ok. I didnt even get a chance to name her. It was sad. She was a rescue but the family that abandoned her did not even try to feed her. She was just wasted away. I found her in a box at my gate.


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## Goatzrule

Goataddict said:


> Some type of neurological disease CAE perhaps.
> Not sure.


Yes, CAE. Most humane treatment is euth


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## CaramelKittey

Tanya said:


> Its ok. I didnt even get a chance to name her. It was sad. She was a rescue but the family that abandoned her did not even try to feed her. She was just wasted away. I found her in a box at my gate.


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## CaramelKittey

I can't believe it has been so long since the last post! Here is one: 

Coughing, miscarriage (in pregnant does) and goiters


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