# Dividing fence and neighbor with cows



## Cali2013 (Jun 2, 2013)

I have a non-goat question that someone here may be able to answer.

The fence at the back of our property is the original that was first put up years ago (slick wire for the horses previous owners had). The neighbor behind us has cows (no more than 2-3 at a time) and over the years they have really done a number on our fence. It is leaning so far over in some parts I wouldn't be surprised to see his cows on our property sometime soon. 

So who's responsibility is it to make sure the fence is kept up enough to keep the cows where they belong? Ours, since it is our fence? Or our neighbor's since it is his cows wearing our fence down?


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## Chadwick (Jan 24, 2014)

I would talk to them and tell them they are damaging the fence and that you would like to redo the fence but you need the cattle off of the new. 

They need to contain their animals not rely on your fence to do it, the other option is to put up a cattle fence then another a foot or two inside your land.


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## NubianFan (Jun 3, 2013)

It is their responsibility to keep in their cows. However you've let them use your fence for so long they probably think it is theirs. you need to talk to them about it the best plan would probably be for the two of you to redo the fence in somwthing cow and goat proof and split costs. Especiallt if they are good neighbors ypu want to keep a good relationship with. Otherwise you could each have a fence with a small gap in between


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## Cali2013 (Jun 2, 2013)

My goats aren't in this particular pasture. We have never had livestock in that pasture. The people that lived here before us had horses, but that neighbor wasn't living there druing that time.

So neighbors are expected to split the cost of a new dividing fence even if one neighbor doesn't have livestock? IMO, he has the cows, his cows have always worn down our fence, he should be responsible for replacing it. 

My hubby is always the one that will go out and push up the fence posts, straighten the fence at the last minute, before it looks like the cows will walk over it. Our neighbor (who we are on good terms with) likely is just relying on my hubby to keep up our fence that his cows are running down.


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## DMSMBoers (Dec 23, 2013)

Its gonna depend on the state laws where you live. Here in Missouri if one person has no livestock on their land the person with livestock has to up keep the fence, but if person with out the livestock ever gets any they have to pay the other person half. Otherwise if both parties have livestock both have to pay half an you can even put a lean on someones place if they dont pay half. Just depends on where you live.


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

Hmmmm... tough one! So since you don't have livestock in the pasture then you don't need a fence there. Perhaps begin a friendly conversation with the neighbor and indicate that the fence along this property line is in very poor condition so you were considering taking it down but realize that he has used it to contain his cattle for many years. I would just begin the conversation and see how he responds. You can always say that you'll talk more about it and get back to him - you don't have to come up the solution right then but just gauge his response. In reality, if it is on your property and you take it down, he is still responsible for containing his livestock. But I supposed some very agricultural areas may have special rules for perimeter & livestock fences.

Maybe duck in to Town Hall and asking the zoning person just to get an idea.


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## Chadwick (Jan 24, 2014)

The only issue with splitting a fence project is to make sure you draw up a maintenance contract. Who fixes what and when, if you don't have an agreement prior to building it you may never agree on fixes and repairs later.


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## NubianFan (Jun 3, 2013)

No they absolutely are responsible for containing their cows and providing fence. I merely suggested that to have a win /win for both and keep good relatiobs with a good neighbor which is a valuable thing. If you dont want to do that you can tell him to build his own fence and stop using ypurs and you can try to get him to repair. But how successful that will actually be depwnds on a lot of factors. Depending on state laws in our state allowing use of property for a number of years makes that propwrty seen as almost partially the users. Sort of a type of squatters rights. Ypur state may see it differently.


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## NubianFan (Jun 3, 2013)

And I am posting from my phone so typos are frequent and next to impossible to fix sprry.


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## canyontrailgoats (Jan 4, 2014)

We went through the same thing, and let me tell ya: good relations with your neighbor should be top on the list! A few dollars out of pocket is worth it, if you and your neighbor are still friends in the end.

Whatever you do be as courteous and patient as necessary, while nicely "guiding" them in the direction you want. The direction of fence fixing that is.

Then if they decide to be jerks about it, you can take your demands up a notch...


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## Cali2013 (Jun 2, 2013)

I didn't know there might be state laws on a dividing fence. Interesting. I'll have to see what Texas states. 

I agree with having a good relationship with neighbors. Years ago he asked if we would like to go in halves to put up a new fence. Well, that kind of money was not in our budget and we didn't want to spend $ on a new fence when we didn't need (no plans to ever have livestock) or want one so hubby kindly told him we were not interested. So, all these years hubby has fixed our fence when his cows have all but pushed it flat to the ground. We have noticed he's painted our corner posts. Not that we care but maybe that means he has plans to fix/replace the fence, too now. We RARELY see this neighbor. Never have the chance to talk to him.


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## Dayna (Aug 16, 2012)

I would approach him this way.

I would say that the fence is becoming a safety hazard so you are looking at having it removed but you're worried about them being able to keep their cows in their yard.... And let them take it from there.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

No you need to find out what the laws are in your area. Here where I'm actually sitting the law is since I have livestock I have to keep up on the fence. It's a fence in. Where my parents have a place it is fence out which means everyone around us has to keep up on the fence if they don't want our cows in their yard. Since we are not jerks we do work on the fence to keep them in but we don't have to. 
But with him saying he will pay half either he knows he should be keeping up on the fence or he is trying to keep the peace but either way you need to find out what the law is.


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## Chadwick (Jan 24, 2014)

One thing that comes to mind, if he has to corral the cattle he is likely to fix it, let it go down, it is a passive fix but sometimes letting someone get there themselves is the easiest way.


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## DMSMBoers (Dec 23, 2013)

I would be careful on just taking the fence out. In my state you cant do that. That's considered letting someones livestock out an its a big no no. You said you don't plan to ever get livestock or you have goats? In my state if you have livestock on your property then you have to pay half of the fencing. Really need to check your state laws before proceeding.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

He wasn't saying take the fence out just simply stop fixing it.....and the 'b' in me is kinda liking that idea. But no don't take the fence out. It may be your fence but say those cows get out after you took the fence out it's not going to look good on your part. If the owners of the cattle were to lazy to fix things then it's on their heads. But still you need to find out because here with our neighbors without livestock they do not need to pay half but the one who also has cattle would have to pay for half.things are so different from place to place.


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## DMSMBoers (Dec 23, 2013)

http://www.angusjournal.com/ArticlePDF/Fencing%20Pt6%2006.10.pdf Older article but a good read on fencing laws!


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## MsScamp (Feb 1, 2010)

Cali2013 said:


> So who's responsibility is it to make sure the fence is kept up enough to keep the cows where they belong?


It depends on the state laws regarding livestock. I live in Wyoming and Wyoming is a fence out state - meaning that it is our responsibility to erect/maintain fences to keep the neighbors livestock off our property. If you live in a 'fence in' state, it is the neighbors responsibility to erect/maintain his fences to keep his livestock on his property and off yours. A lot of times neighbors will share costs to maintain fences, but you cannot depend on that.


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## MsScamp (Feb 1, 2010)

NubianFan said:


> No they absolutely are responsible for containing their cows and providing fence.


No, they are not. It depends on the laws regarding livestock that are on the books.


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## MsScamp (Feb 1, 2010)

canyontrailgoats said:


> We went through the same thing, and let me tell ya: good relations with your neighbor should be top on the list! A few dollars out of pocket is worth it, if you and your neighbor are still friends in the end.
> 
> Whatever you do be as courteous and patient as necessary, while nicely "guiding" them in the direction you want. The direction of fence fixing that is.
> 
> Then if they decide to be jerks about it, you can take your demands up a notch...


Rebecca, I absolutely agree with your basic premise and your ideology, but both falter in the face of reality a lot of times. Imagine, if you will, your neighbors scruffy, conformationally(sp?) incorrect, disease ridden animals tempting your buck from just across the fence. Now imagine having to run your buck through the chute every day for a week to treat for vibrio, lepto, etc. - how friendly are you going to be towards him/her? I'm thinking not very!


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## NubianFan (Jun 3, 2013)

MsScamp said:


> No, they are not. It depends on the laws regarding livestock that are on the books.


To Jean, you are right about that, I had forgot about fence out states. 
Those are mostly out west but I think she may live in Arizona so it could be a fence out state. But yeah, I did tell her to find out her state laws. But good point and good catch.

To OP still think especially now since you said in the beginning of you living there he offered to pay half the fencing that would be the best idea. I know you said your goats don't use that area, but if you guys split cost on goat proof and cattle proof fencing that would give you another option for another area for your goats. It just seems like a win/win to me, unless you guys truly just can't afford it. And if that is the case, I would sit down with the neighbor and be honest, he seems like a reasonable guy. I would say, we would really love to split the cost of putting in new better fencing with you, but we just can't afford to do that. Since you have been able to use our fence to contain your cows would you consider at least repairing it yourself? He might surprise you and offer to rebuild the fence. Or work some other arrangement out with you. I am telling you though, the BEST thing you can do if you can do it AT ALL is keep good relations with your neighbor. Having a good neighbor that cares about you and your family and will help you out when the going gets tough truly is priceless.


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## NubianFan (Jun 3, 2013)

Op I see now you live in Texas, not Arizona sorry about that, I don't know how I didn't see that before. But anyway don't know Texas laws either.


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## canyontrailgoats (Jan 4, 2014)

MsScamp said:


> Rebecca, I absolutely agree with your basic premise and your ideology, but both falter in the face of reality a lot of times. Imagine, if you will, your neighbors scruffy, conformationally(sp?) incorrect, disease ridden animals tempting your buck from just across the fence. Now imagine having to run your buck through the chute every day for a week to treat for vibrio, lepto, etc. - how friendly are you going to be towards him/her? I'm thinking not very!


I totally agree with you, that would be frustrating and I'd be VERY upset. I guess it all depends on the circumstances, and what exactly you're dealing with.


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