# Help!



## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Goat had baby while I had to run an errand. Do I tie off umbilical with dental floss. Unsure if mom only had one inside she has blood string hanging. Could there be more?


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I can't get the baby still long enough to get the floss tied on and I'm the only human here so no helpers!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Unless the kid is bleeding there is no need for the floss. Just dip in iodine.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

As far as I know the baby hasn't eaten yet. How soon after birth should they eat?


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Keep an eye on her and help her find the teat. I like to see them nurse within 15 minutes but no later than 30 minutes.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

It was at least an hour I think before she ate. But she was am wagging her tail. The only thing that seemed to bother her was that she was cold. I towweled her off and exchanges the incandescent for a heat bulb until she quits shivering. It's in the low 40s here. Should I leave heat bulb in all night or exchange for incandescent? Also the mom looks huge still. How long between babies? It's probably been an hour to an hour and a half. She's done, right? She passed some goo but still acts a little weird (soft crying and occasional belly tensing).


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Oh. And these are pygmy goats. The low is going to 27 tonight.


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Low 40's you should be ok. Did she pass a placenta? It's usually only minutes between babies so IF she passed the placenta, I'd say she's done. "A little goo" doesn't sound like placenta and the way she is acting doesn't sound like she's done. Do you feel comfortable trying to go in and check? If so, do it. If not, I would get her to the vet. Maybe a wasted trip to the vet, but better that than a dead or sick mama....


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Can't I just bounce her? And the goo was about the size of a fist.


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Yes, you can just bounce her. I just never feel anything that way so not my first option...but that's just me. Fist sized...maybe placenta then.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Here they are


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Baby still walking wobbly. Normal?


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Baby keeps shaking her head. Is that normal?


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Yep, normal. You might check if baby has any fluid in his nose and suction if she does. Cute baby!


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Thanks! I am going to lose my mind worrying about her. She's shivering and I'm having to make her mom let her nurse.


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Baby is shivering? Get her dried off as best you can. Some people even use a hair dryer to get them dry. The sooner she dries off, the warmer she'll be. Do you have the heat lamp on? I would go ahead and keep it on for a while. And I saw where your temps will be below 30 tonight...up to you on the heat lamp tonight then. We do keep ours on for a couple days but our temps are usually down there for longer.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

She is dry and has been for close to an hour. Heat lamp is on and is staying on all night. I'm kind of worried she'll follow her mom outside the house. She's done this once already. I'm literally sitting inside the house blocking the door. But I'm gonna have to pick up the kids and tonight I have to sleep!


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Find a way to block the door so mom has to stay in too then. I can't help you with that one. Sorry.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Ill try! The pyrenees may not allow that, but I will try! Here's another shot of baby Savannah...


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Is it okay to leave the pyrenees in the same pen with the momma and baby? I can't catch the four month old to put her out but she's afraid of everything so I doubt she'll be trouble.


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

I wouldnt but if you think she'll leave them alone that is up to you

Carmen, Co-Owner Oleo Acres LLC, Nw Ks


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Will she kill it? She's been good all day. I kind of want to keep her in the pen to keep predators at bay. But not if she's gonna hurt the baby goat.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I guess I don't understand your setup. I would have mom and baby in their own pen with a heat lamp. You also need to be sure there are no more kids. Take a pic of mom's back end.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I have a pen that normally holds everyone and has a heated house. The other pen is just a 10 x 6 dog fence And I put the queen goat in there so she wouldn't interfere. But I have a four month old I couldn't catch in the big pen with mom and baby. The four month old can't get in the goat house. The pyrenees is in the pen to keep predators at bay.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Backside pic..


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Baby is still shaking it's head like it has ear mites or something. And she doesn't want to eat. She hasn't eaten in an hour. Is that normal? She's also still wobbly on her feet. She wags her tail though. And mom still won't let her eat without me holding her! And baby poo was sticky and dark.


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## hallsthirdacrefarm (Mar 30, 2011)

Back end looks normal...I'd look in kids ear with a light. Get some selenium e gel in that kid and put the dog with the other goat...make sure everyone even the 4 month old has shelter from the cold. Take the babies temp...it needs to be over 100 or the kid is freezing. Do not feed the kid if colder than 100 degrees. Keep holding mom to let kid nurse as long as it takes...dog may be distracting mom. Check kids belly...should be full not flabby but not round and bulging either

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Goat Forum mobile app


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Mom and baby are locked inside goat house so the dog is not a distraction. The baby refuses to nurse. I gave her some nutridrench and milked the goat and gave baby a couple ml or so from a needleless syringe. I don't know where to get selenium e gel. Is it one of those things thats for horses and can I get at tractor supply? I don't have a thermometer. Should I bring her in and bottle feed? She feels quite warm to the touch.


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## hallsthirdacrefarm (Mar 30, 2011)

Okay, yes you can get selenium e gel in the next day or so at farm supply. you can also give 1/2 of a selenium capsule and a vitamin e capsule from human pharmacy to help a weak kid...you may be okay on that front.

If the kid feels warm and is active, you are probably okay. They struggle with nursing at first. Just keep watching and holding mom and have someone help you get kid latched on. If kid gets a few sips of colostrum each time, you will be good. I like to be safe so like you I syringe a little into their mouths off and on at first. If momma is really tight, you may need to milk her down a little so nursing doesn't hnurt. Also, right now, nursing triggers the release of oxytocin so her uterous contracts and cleans her out...so nursing = pain. If momma is otherwise interested in the kid (licking/bonding/snuggling) it will be okay...just see that kid gets some colostrum over next few hours. Syringe feeding is fine.


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## hallsthirdacrefarm (Mar 30, 2011)

I also like to give momma a bucket of very warm water with some molasses and a little salt...she will drink it ALL...thus making more milk

you can eve ndab a little molasses, honey or karo syrup on babies tongue for an energy boost to get them going. I sometimes then dab a little on the teat if they perk up and like the taste....then they go for the teats. They are new to life and figuring it all out...both momma and kiddo are tired.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I've been practically living in the goat house, which is a converted kid's plastic playhouse. She feels quite warm but my hands are quite cold! Is the selenium e made for goats, or is it a horse or cow type thing? I did put the kid on her teat several times and she latched on. But she hasn't wanted anything to do with it since about 4 hours ago. Mom has been pulling baby's ears off and on for the past hour or so. It's like she just doesn't want her to be down there near her bottom. She doesn't seem relieved at all when I milk her. She even pulled my hair once! She's a pygmy so I'm on the ground next to her when I milk. My husband and I were talking about bottle feeding the baby and just keeping her in the house where it's warm. What would you do?


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## hallsthirdacrefarm (Mar 30, 2011)

I would want a temp. Just a thought...if you have a cooking thermometer...warm some water in a pan until it's 100 degrees (it will happen FAST so watch it)...have baby with you. immerse your hand in 100 degree water...then dry it and feel inside the goatslip or under it's thigh...compare the temp. 

Baby may have poopy problems too,,,I mught syringe a few ccs of oil and water up the other end and wip to make sure all is clear. How is the kid doing on its feet...if it's wobbly and weak...I'd send hubby to the pharmacy for thermometer, selenium capsules and vitamin e capsules now. Once I knew kid was warm I'd put some karo syrup or honey on it's tongue...even a few tbsp. of strong coffee (some use whiskey) to give it a jolt, then syringe feed a few cc colostrum at a time, letting kid stay warm under your shirt. 

I am hesitant to pull and bottle feed immediately as dam raised kids are easier...last year in your shoes, I put momma and baby in a large (48") dog cage indoors and kept all pets away from them. Momma got stressed but babies thrived. I am not there though...go with your gut. If you feed with a bottle but keep bringing kid out to visit mom off and on, you may be able to put her back on mom when she/he is stronger in a day or so.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I have a large dog cage housing my goat that had pinkeye. She has been inside even though she can see now. I was afraid she would catch cold since she's been inside. I would love to bring mom and baby in but I only have one big cage. It's probably too cold to put the inside one out (27 tonight). Baby pooped black sticky balls earlier tonight. Will nutridrench work in place of selenium e?


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Brought mom and baby inside my laundry room and look! When I went back out, mom was partly laying on baby to keep her warm and the stupid dog had wormed his way inside and was laying across from them sleeping! But I brought mom and baby in anyway. Who needs a laundry room anyhow? :-D


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

No nutridrench is not a replacement for Bo-Se or Selenium/vit e paste. 

I feel as if you're too stressed over this. Sounds like baby is doing very well, and mom is too. Babies will nurse when hungry ( every 1-4 hours), and mom may have a say in how often as well. This is natural. If she's caring for baby, just keep checking belly and let nature run. Momma knows best normally. Baby is obviously going to be chilled at first but by this time should not be shivering anymore. If she is, make a little coat out of an old sweater and put it on. 

Sounds like everything is ok so far, relax momma! 


Animals make such personable friends, they pass no criticisms, offer their ears through happiness and sorrows, and yet possess such undying devotion, even whilst they know all our secrets.


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## hallsthirdacrefarm (Mar 30, 2011)

I agree...she's eating pooping and up moving around... she'll be fine. Let them stay warm for the night then get them back out over the next day. If baby is strong g tomorrow don't worry about the selenium...If wobbly I give it and some fortified bcomplex...but tonight they sound fine

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Goat Forum mobile app


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Ya think I'm stressed? What was your first clue? Maybe the forty million questions? LOL! She did seem like a different baby when I brought her in. But she's still shivering. Our central heat and air return is in our laundry room so it blows a Gust of wind in there when it's on. Hopefully, she'll adjust to the wind tunnel. It's still warmer than outside. I will NEVER breed or buy a goat unless the due date is May or June! Too much to worry about without having cold to contend with. Our girls are pretty cold hardy but the babies don't like it. Or maybe it's me that doesn't like it! I froze my tush off out there! I wish that was literally true. LOL! Thank you so much for helping me!


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Thanks EVERYONE on Goat Spot for all your help. You all rock! You've helped me through pinkeye and pregnancy and delivery and baby problems. And you haven't mentioned once that I'm a basket case! LOL! I tell anyone I come across who is new to goats to come on here and read up! And believe it or not, I have read up. I just tend to forget everything in a crisis. I do remember what to do in a human crisis but for some reason, not so much with an animal crisis. Thanks again! I'm sure I'll be back on here with another crisis in an hour! But I wanted to take this one second of calm to say thanks!


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

She'll shiver as she adjusts to the heat.  


Animals make such personable friends, they pass no criticisms, offer their ears through happiness and sorrows, and yet possess such undying devotion, even whilst they know all our secrets.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Did mom ever pass her placenta?


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I think the fist sized goop was it. I looked up pictures and it looked like what she plopped out. She's only a pygmy so I think a fist size would be about right, don't you? And she seems fine now. She talks to her new baby a lot but she doesn't talk to her stomach. And I don't think she has stopped eating for more than a few minutes at a time. She was probably eating while she was giving birth! LOL!


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Took mom and baby to vet this a.m. because baby only fed for a few seconds and moms udders felt real warm. No mastitis on mom but baby wouldn't drink from her or a bottle. Mom had slight fever so vet gave antibiotic shot. Gave baby vitamin b. Baby still only feeds for maybe 5-10 seconds then goes and lays down. I forced some milk down her but didn't get a whole lot in her. She pranced around for 3-4 minutes after she woke up and ate off mom for 5 seconds then she lay back down to go to sleep.vet said if she won't eat, we'll have to tube her. Oh and vet gave mom oxytocin or something and she must feel better because she lets baby eat. But baby doesn't like to eat. This sucks.


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Babies usually don't nurse for very long at a time. Just a few seconds several times a day.


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## hallsthirdacrefarm (Mar 30, 2011)

Sucking for only 5-10 seconds a feeding is normal though....so long as she does that often trhoughout the day...


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Oh, we'll then she's doing great as long as I put her on the teat every so often. The vet milked some of of mom and checked her for any leftover babies (just to make sure since she had a fever). And after the oxytocin or whatever it was called, she has relaxed and hasn't had an issue with baby drinking her milk. She also got all oozy out her backside - gross. But it really doesn't bother me as long as she feels better and baby is eating. How do you know they're able to get any milk since they only eat for a few seconds? I am a worrier, after all. So of course I'm gonna worry she doesn't get enough milk. Also momma prefers her right side be used. Won't we left get encouraged?


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## hallsthirdacrefarm (Mar 30, 2011)

Check her belly..it should not feel flabby...but will be full without being rounded. Flabby and sunken means supplement. If it makes you feel better....supplement with a bottle or 2 a day...one a few oz from mom. This give u bonding time too and will put u at ease

Sent from my SPH-L720 using Goat Forum mobile app


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

She won't drink a bottle. I have even tried putting Karo on it and she will not drink! I have to squeeze the bottle at the back of her throat for her just to swallow it. She'll spit it out if she can. I just hope I was able to get enough colostrum in her yesterday. Half or more she spit out. To be so little, she's feisty! She probably got a couple mL of colostrum that I could tell she swallowed. Not sure if she was able to suck much out of mom. :-/


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I would weigh her daily. You need a scale that weighs in pounds and ounces or pounds and tenths of pounds. A hanging fish scale works well.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

That's a great idea! Do you know if they sell them at tractor supply?


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I looked online and TS doesn't sell one. Maybe walmart does.!


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

How long did you have baby inside? Did you just put her back outside without adjusting her body to the cold? Or is mom inside too? 




Animals make such personable friends, they pass no criticisms, offer their ears through happiness and sorrows, and yet possess such undying devotion, even whilst they know all our secrets.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

If you need to bottle feed..here is a honey trick that usally works..with honey on your finger, place you finger on the back of her tongue to stimulate her sucking reflex, get her sucking on your finger..repeat the honey dip finger several times andhave a bottle ready with honey on the nipple.. then once she is suckingon your finger, slip the bottle in...she will taste the honey first and should begin sucking...

Knowing how much she weighs is important so you dont over feed...Her tummy should feel flat but firm, not suncken in or pooching out...


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Your doing great  And congrats on a beautiful baby 
Your in the best of care here , so don't worry . Just one thing though , I read in one of your posts that your squirting milk in baby's mouth and sometimes she tries to spit it out. Please don't force milk into baby via a bottle . By accident it could go into the lungs and that would be a very serious if not deadly scenario. That could be why baby is trying to spit it out. That's what made me want to bring this up. 

Glad you went to the vet with them too. At least you know momma will be OK and what to expect from baby. Did your vet talk to you about tube feeding if you need to ? Just wondering …


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Okay, it's really really cold today. I think the high was 33. So mom and baby are living in my laundry room. There's no heater in there so it isn't quite as warm as the rest of the house. But it's still warmer than the goat house with the heat lamp on. My goat house isn't air tight so it is still pretty cold even with heat lamp. They'll go back out when it isn't literally freezing. And the laundry room opens onto the outside so they get cooler air coming in as I go in and out during the day. 

Baby tummy feels good. She's got round soft tummy, not hard, not bulging. She just feels full. But I'm not sure how often she eats because I can't sit with them nonstop to watch. Last time I felt her belly, she seemed full but I put her over by her moms teat but she just walked off and started prancing around and playing - sooo cute!

Cathy, if I need to bottle feed ill try your method. Thanks!

As for forcing the bottle milk on her, I made sure she didn't get choked. When my son was a baby, he threw up and stopped breathing. Even after I got breathing again, I called paramedics to make sure he didn't aspirate the vomit. And even when he was a toddler, he would throw his head back to vomit instead of forward so I had to push his head down. No idea why he did that. Anyhow, the point of that story was that I'm super careful not to choke an animal whether force feeding milk or meds. But you had a good point and I do appreciate your input.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Oh. And yes my vet told me that if we tube baby, she could catch pneumonia. So he wanted to try to get her eating on her own.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Megan, I'm glad you asked about acclimating baby. When she goes back out, it will be gradual. She'll get seriously sick otherwise. Thanks for reminding me! I appreciate all of y'all!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

If the kid has a full belly, she is doing OK and sounds like she is happy and content. 

If a kid is crying out all the time or trying to get milk constantly and doesn't seem satisfied, and has a empty tummy, I'd worry.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Will I need to milk the udder that the baby doesn't seem to like? Of course I don't know for sure she isn't nursing it when I'm not in there.


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Pygmylover said:


> Okay, it's really really cold today. I think the high was 33. So mom and baby are living in my laundry room. There's no heater in there so it isn't quite as warm as the rest of the house. But it's still warmer than the goat house with the heat lamp on. My goat house isn't air tight so it is still pretty cold even with heat lamp. They'll go back out when it isn't literally freezing. And the laundry room opens onto the outside so they get cooler air coming in as I go in and out during the day.
> 
> Baby tummy feels good. She's got round soft tummy, not hard, not bulging. She just feels full. But I'm not sure how often she eats because I can't sit with them nonstop to watch. Last time I felt her belly, she seemed full but I put her over by her moms teat but she just walked off and started prancing around and playing - sooo cute!
> 
> ...


Wow , you sure had quite the ultimate scare with your son !! Im sorry about that  Im sorry , i really didn't mean to sound like "you did that" , just that it could happen in our haste to get baby to eat. Your handling it all very well 
Glad you have momma and baby inside . I bet its a lot easier for you then going outside as often as you have to  Enjoy your new little bundle of love 
If baby has enough energy to jump around and play , she must be getting enough to eat


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I don't mind being reminded of all I need to do. and not everyone realizes they could get the milk into the lungs. So it's a good thing to go ahead and let me know what I should and shouldn't do. Plus there are other newbies who are reading all this that might just learn a thing or two. Never be afraid to offend someone with too much information. It could save a goats life! And thanks for all your help!


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

On moms udder, yes keep them as even as you can..: ) after about 3-5 days +/- the colostrum will be gone completly and milk will be yummy to drink..: ) 

Sounds like baby is fat and happy..: ) moms doing a great job feeding her..and you in careing for both...

Best wishes


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I agree


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I noticed today that baby did eat some on both sides. Yay!


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## fishin816 (Mar 4, 2011)

Just make sure you dab the cord in 7% iodine. That keeps all the germy parasites off the cord.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

The cord is dried up already. Today it was 48 degrees so I took mom and baby outside for about 5 minutes. It's their first out since day before yesterday. I'm gonna take them out whenever it's warm enough. My pregnant goat went outside today for an hour or two.


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