# Maybe 2 months left?



## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Bought my goat around the first of November. Previous owner said she was 1-2 months pg then changed it to he didn't really know how far. I took pics and I'll put them on here. She's def preggers but no idea when to expect the big day.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Here's a shot of her backside...


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

And here's a shot of her side.


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

She is definately preggers  And... she's not a Pygmy, too much color for her to be purebred  
With her udder growth, she may have anywhere from 2 weeks to a month to go.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Oh, and she's a pygmy. And a FF.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

She's supposed to be a pygmy.


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

Pygmylover said:


> Oh, and she's a pygmy. And a FF.


FF udder looks on target for being due in as late as a month and she has too much color to be a purebred Pygmy, she's very likely a Nigerian/Pygmy cross. I have a solid white doe who I know is a cross because I had her sire, a PB Pygmy and her dam was a gold nigerian dwarf 
Her udder looks comparable to my FF ND in size


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Oh. Well, I didn't buy her as a pedigreed pygmy. I bought her and her sister. They were supposed to both be pg but I don't feel anybody moving around inside the other goat. And the other goat has a very small, if any, bag. Of course she just may be showing differently or not as far along. And she is also a FF. Thanks for the info! I figured between 1-2 months left just from lurking on GoatSpot.


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

How long has her udder been this size? That itself will determine exactly how long she has to go 
My little FF started with an udder the size of a baseball about 3 weeks ago, it is grown but not yet filled and my other FF who is due on February 11 just started hers, size of a baseball, so I'm figuring that my first doe is about a week to 2 weeks away as most FF will start an udder anywhere from 6-8 weeks prior to delivery with 6 weeks being the norm


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

We didn't think they were really preggers so we didn't even notice it until this weekend. I do think its gotten a little bit bigger since Saturday. And you really can't look at the questionable one and see anything different.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I just went and checked to see the exact purchase date on my goat. I got her on 10/21. The guy said 1-2 months pregnant. If he was at all correct, she could possibly deliver by the end of January. Since I am a first time goat birthing mom, what are the chances of survival of the baby goat? At this point she'll be birthing in my laundry room. She has severe pinkeye and can't see. So we had to bring her inside. Which also brings me to the question of if she can give birth inside a giant dog kennel? She has room to stand up and turn around. The kennel is the biggest size I know of that you can buy. She goes outside on a lead for a little while during the day so she isn't in there all day. Any birthing suggestions are most welcome!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

If she delivers within the week she is suppose to kid, the kid(s) with be OK. Close to 2 weeks is a gamble and can be touch and go and sometimes they don't make it, their lungs are not fully developed. 

It is hard to say, when her Due date is, because the breeder left such a wide margin from 1 month to 2.

A Large Dog Kennel might be a bit tight, not sure on the extra room needed. I would worry about her accidentally laying or stepping on the kid, if she is trying to have the next kid. And the odds of her wanting to deliver in one, she may or may not want to.

Have blankets laying around the floor to catch the mess in the laundry room.
towels or plenty of paper towels to dry off kids faces, I don't dry all the kid off at this time, so momma can bond.
Dip the cords of the newborns with iodine, 
When you see the kid bubble at the door, make sure, you see 2 hooves and a head in the middle of them. Like a diver but with one leg back slightly, if you do not see that, you will have to wash up and help her. 
If she does not dilate, you will need to help her, with 2 fingers go in the vulva area just slightly, lightly and gently, pull your fingers outward towards you, around the inner edge, make sure you fingernails are short. Work all the way around the inside wall with your finger tip area, repeat until she dilates more, if she is having difficuly getting her kid out and it appears there isn't enough room. If you have to help her, make sure when she pushes, you pull. Work together.

Always remember, if she is pushing with no progress, she needs help, make sure it is no longer than 30 minutes. I worry if it has been 15 minutes with no babies on the ground, but 30 minutes is the number not to exceed. The next kid should follow quickly after, watch the time frame.

Get a nose sucker, it gets the mucus out of their nose and throat.

When she has her kids, put them in front of her, so she can bond with them. If you have to hold them up to her nose, then, do so especially if she is unable to see.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Tonight's backside pic... I have discovered that her sister does have about the same size bag. The pics on this thread are of Sasha. She's easy to get a pic of since he's in my laundry room. I felt her sisters bag yesterday and it didn't feel big at all. But tonight I got an up close and personal peek when I was replacing a lightbulb. I was on my hands and knees and her tush was at eye level. She is every bit as big as Sasha. But I didn't feel any baby movement like I have with Sasha. Should I be worried about that?


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Thanks Toth! Ill stay close to home until she kids. I always go check on her when she maaas. And it only takes about 20 minutes to drop the kids off at school.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Your welcome 

She has a nice little udder going on there. It needs to fill a bit more though, it may be 1 month to a month and a 1/2 left.
But still watch her because with some, they surprise us for sure, especially not sure of the due date. Glad you are keeping an eye on her. 

No worries with trying to feel for babies, a lot of times, we never feel them throughout their pregnancy. We are either not feeling in the right spot at the right time or they are position where you can't feel them. Never worry about not being able to feel them, they are OK in there. :-D


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I'll continue to keep a close eye on them both. The other mom to be is in a pen with a couple other goats and our Pyrenees. Do I have to separate her when she goes into labor? I only have the one pen right now. Thanks for letting me know. It's okay not to feel baby(ies). That's a relief!


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Tonight's pooch and bag pics!


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Pics


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

The doe who is out with other goats and your LGD will need to have a safe area to deliver and care for her kids, most new mama's do not like having the distraction or threat of another animal close by when the time comes.
Going by the date you bought them and having a 2 month time frame of the breeding, she could go as early as the end of this month or onto mid February.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Yeah, I was thinking about purchasing a 10 x 6 chainlink dog kennel and putting her in there.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

What is this?! Is it impending birth or just losing some goop? It actually the color of infected pus - dark yellow. This is not my blind girl, but her sister.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

An why is the tail shifting to the right? I didn't touch her at all when I took the pic.


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

Normal discharge


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Thanks. I was worried she might have an infection or something.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Yep normal.
The tail to the side, she just may of moved it that way as you took the pic, or is she continuing to do so?


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

It's still to the side.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Wry tail, is most likely what it can be.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

What is that? Does she need to go to the vet for it?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

No vet, it was inherited and undesirable in boers.

Wry tail: the tail joint is not correctly attached to the dock at the base of the spine, causing an off center tail. 
If you feel at base of spine leading to the tail bones, you should feel a kink in the bone.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Oh, we'll its a good thing she's not a boer! And I'm relieved she has something I don't have to treat!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

It is bad to have for any breed.

But yet, it may be pregnancy too. 
Was she born that way?

Another thing too read this link.
http://www.thegoatspot.net/forum/f197/wry-tail-worse-during-pregnancy-160399/


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Her tail was normal until the other day.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

OK then, it is not wry tail, but one of the other things as mentioned.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Thanks for the info!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

You bet.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

It's been a week since I started this thread. Here's a pic of her backside tonight.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

It's hard to see her udder? Anything there?


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Yup. Her fur is covering it.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Literally. She has a hairy udder. I don't own grooming clippers.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Ah, I got ya, they leave us waiting and wondering with kidding don't they. :doh::wallbang::wink:


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

My husband just said "These goats have been having babies for thousands of years. And now y'all wanna clip their backsides and worry about the size of their udders." He's baffled by the whole goat forum! LOL!


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Lol...he'll survive.

Sent from my SCH-I535 using Goat Forum mobile app


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

:lol: too funny


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Someone told me that as the goat's utter fills, the nipples get shorter. Is this right?


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I just noticed the autocorrect has been doing funny things! It's udder,not utter!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Nipples usual get longer actually. With First timers they are small, then by the next freshening, they elongate a bit more, as time goes by, but no, they do not get shorter.

Yes, you are spelling it wrong with utter, it is "udder".


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Thanks for the info! I thought they got longer because I'm always lurking on the Kidding Korral to compare other goat udders with my goat's udders and they're usually long. I do know they're udders and not utters but my autocorrect apparently doesn't like the dd and wants the tt instead. And I don't ever proofread! Lol!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Your welcome. 

HeHe, yeah, the spell check thinks it is smarter than us, LOL, but it isn't sometimes.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Today my goat was constantly hollering at me. She wanted more food (ADM pellets, sweet feed, and alfalfa). I've been letting her have tons of it and am slacking off since I know she shouldn't be eating so much of it. She is gonna have to just eat hay tonight. She has been eating so much of the pelleted food that I'm afraid she'll have a 40 lb baby! I'm REALLY hoping for multiples because I have truly over indulged her. She just loves the stuff so much.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Yes, be careful with giving too much grain, glad you are going to limit it. 
They do get very spoiled when giving grain and can get very demanding. :roll:


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I knew that and yet she was so skinny and so hungry. I guess I was trying to fatten her up the last two or three weeks. Luckily I haven't been doing that the entire pregnancy! On another note, her ligs feel springy. There still there but they dont seem as rigid, they have some give. Does that make sense?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

If you feel they are changing to softer and springy, she is getting a bit closer then. The best thing to do is feel a goat that is not preggo and you will feel the difference and know.

If she is not gaining weight and you were feeding her really well, like you were, she may have worms or cocci going on. Cocci doesn't always show scouring signs.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Her ligs have gone back to normal. I think she has a couple more weeks at least because her udder doesnt look like its going to explode. All the udders I've seen on here look like they're full to bursting. She just doesn't have quite that huge an udder. I wormed her a little over a week ago. So that's probably why she was and is skinny. Also her belly dropped. She's always been on the smaller side. Her preggo sister was almost as skinny. But now has gotten big. The sister is carrying up high so she has a ways to go yet.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

My goat either has twins who like to tussle or she's got one rowdy baby in there trying to kick its way out her side! LOL! Her tail area looks weird to me too. It seems like her tail is in a different position or something. Her ligs feel further apart this morning but she doesn't have discharge. I'll post a pic of her here. For some reason my phone won't let me post two pics at once so I'll put another pic on the next post


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Here's her backside for your viewing pleasure. LOL! Cool I just figured out you can edit! No idea why these pics come up sideways on here. I'm not exactly a techno giant. ;-)


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Don't know where the pic went. Stupid iPhone. Let me try that again...


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## mirandahite (Dec 19, 2013)

Ive read that their tale will move or lean to the side when their close to birthing ..

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I317 using Goat Forum mobile app


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Changes are good. 
Some Does though, may fill overnight, or even at kidding, so watch her. 
Most Does get super tight and shiny, just before kidding.

If you see an amber long tube like stringy goo coming out of her, it is really close. 

But they can have a white discharge, 1 month or so prior.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Miranda, her sister's tail moved over a week or so ago but she's still not ready. And she had some discharge a week or two back. And her sister also looked preggers first (in the pooch area) and she looks like her milk ba may be bigger now. This one showed a bigger milk bag at first, but now her sister has passed her! Goats are odd! But I love them!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I agree, they are so hard to read.

The wait is torture as well, I know, I am approaching the last month to kidding for my girls on Friday.
Their udders are coming in better and can be seen when I stand behind them.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Oh my goodness. The tip of her vulva seems to be a bit swollen. And she is acting real skittish. But no change in ligs and no goop coming out. She's just getting closer I guess. She has been more vocal today too. A lot more pacing than she usually does. She's also trying to eat wood and stuff she normally wouldn't. Weird!


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

It won't let me post 2 pics so here's another. Also, she just dropped what looked like a big pinecone but was a poop cone! She's been wormed but is due today for another worming. I'll take her poop to the vet and get it checked out. Is that normal for a pregnant goat? Also unrelated to the poop, she is now pawing at the ground and me! And she's rubbing her right side against a wall and pushing her head against the wall too. But she has no goo coming out. No tube of amber or white stuff or anything! She is quiet. Not crying or moaning. Is this normal?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Being preggo makes their poo off a bit or she is getting a bit too much grain ect.

She almost sounds like she is pre-laboring which could be many hours or a few or her kids are pushing on area's that are putting pressure on things making her uncomfortable.

Don't always see the goo, sometimes I don't catch it and it drops off before I see it.

All I can say is, keep that eye on her. 

Pawing is nesting behavior so, there is definitively some thing going on there.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

She is calm as can be tonight. I just knew she was ramping up for it. Maybe that was her practice run. LOL! She's in a giant dog kennel in the house so I'll know when she starts yowling. Unless she decides on a Tom Cruise-Katie Holmes silent birth! LOL!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Make sure, there is enough room for her in case she does kid, so she doesn't lay on a kid, having the next kid.
She may have more time to go, but it is so hard to say when she will. Glad you are watching her closely.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Still no baby goat(s) but she is still acting weird. And she just keeps shaking her head and pawing at her ear. I am wondering if the vet was incorrect about her not having ear mites. Can I use Mitex in her ears? It's for dogs but I assume that can work on goats too. Or is the head shaking and ear pawing part of weird goat pre labor stuff?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Sounds like ear mites possibly? Ask your vet to make sure, if the shaking and scratching is worse, it might be mites. 

I have never known this action to be kidding associated.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Talked to the vet and he said she probably has mites. And he's gonna leave some ear mite meds at the front desk for me to pick up in the morning. Okay, let's see... Pregnant goat still pregnant, pink eye almost cleared up, goat lice finally gone, and now we've got the ear mites. All this within a matter of 2-3 weeks! I'm sure she already had the lice and I just didn't know it. But man what a lot of stuff all at once!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I hear ya, at least she is well cared for, give yourself a lot of credit, you have done a great job. Now the wait for kids.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Thanks, I'm trying! Ah, the wait. Now THAT is gonna really do me in! LOL!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Oh I know. :shock:


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Today's pooch and udder shot brought to you by a crazy lady in waiting! :-D


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

And here's a more up close and personal one from a slightly different angle...


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

She was scratching her ear and I got a good udder shot too. I really wish I knew her breed date. :-/


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Her body is definitely getting closer to kidding, wish you knew the kidding date too.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

It would help if I'd been through it before to kind of know a little bit more about how much closer she's getting. The wait is maddening. I have this need for her to go into labor NOW and the need for her not to go into labor until March because of the cold weather. I need therapy! LOL!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I hear ya, it is maddening. I feel for you, not knowing an exact due date. 
Hang in there. :hug:


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I've been feeling and seeing a lot of baby goat movement the last couple weeks. But today I barely felt anything and what I did feel was to the left of the front of her udder. I had to put both hands around her belly in front of her udder and feel for it or I wouldn't have felt that. It's hard to explain exactly where I felt the movement to the left side but it felt like baby, not rumen. It was her underbelly not her side. Do I need to worry? She still has ligs and no tubular yuck coming out. I don't see discharge of any kind nor do I feel any wetness on her tail.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

She's also acting odd outside her kennel, more maaaaing and actually pawing at the door to get out of the laundry room. Maybe she wants to see the snow? She jumped on top of her kennel several times today. I had to put her back in the kennel because I was afraid she'd hurt herself jumping onto the slick floor. She quieted down after I put her up. The kennel was open the entire time she was out and she could've gone back in if she wanted. Here's a pic of her on the kennel. She kept looking around so the pics are somewhat blurry.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Sounds like she is bored. Kids move around in the womb


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Thanks! I was getting worried. It's snowing here (it hardly ever does that here) and I really didn't want the goat to go into labor because I'd have to keep her in the house for all the messy delivery.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Today's up close and personal pic...


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

The baby goat movement has been diminishing the past few days and now I feel no movement whatsoever and ligs are still in place. Is the baby goat dead in there? I used a stethoscope and I only hear one heartbeat. It sounds like a fainter heartbeat than the mom so I'm thinking its probably just her heartbeat I'm hearing.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

No. Many times you can't feel them. They are probably getting in to place for birthing


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Thanks!


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## Everfree (Nov 15, 2013)

Pygmylover said:


> The baby goat movement has been diminishing the past few days and now I feel no movement whatsoever...


Towards the end they are getting so big that they don't have much room to move around in there. If mama gets something sweet to eat it might perk up the kids. (Works in people, anyway.) 

Everfree Farm
Kiko and Nubian


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## MylieD (Sep 16, 2013)

My pregnant jumps off things a good 3-4 ft off the ground. Up until just recently she was still climbing on the slanted roof of her house, abour 5 ft off the ground, and leaping off, belly jiggling the whole time. It made me nervous at first, but she is unphased, so I think it's ok for them to keep bouncing around. Both of them jump on a kennel I have out there and no big slips yet. I'm just saying so you don't worry about her jumping. That seems to be their fun times.

I don't always feel the babies either. Sometimes after I give her molasses water they start squirming around. Other times I figure they're in a weird position. It is kinda scary when you can't feel them.

We also got snow which is rare. Nancy, my pregnant goat, doesn't mind it at all. She hates being locked up, so I just check on her way too much. Luckily it'll be warming soon and I can worry less. 

Here's to hoping for kids sooner rather than later, though I have a feeling that'll bring a whole new set of worries. Lol.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Y'all are awesome! Thanks for all the info!


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I just fed her some sweet feed and was able to feel the baby. Is it possible to see the baby move on the left side hollowed out part just under the spine? There was major and BIG movement there that i don't normally see, but I also felt movement on the middle of the underbelly.


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## IvyMayPygmyGoats (Jan 24, 2014)

Is she in the house? If so, i'm glad im not the only one... (they come in to visit, they don't live inside)


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## MylieD (Sep 16, 2013)

I felt what was definitely a baby part in that same spot, so I'll say yes.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Ivy, she had pinkeye and was temporarily blind. We brought her in because she couldn't find her house to get out of the rain and cold. And now she's used to the indoor "weather" so we're gonna have to wait for warmer weather to put her outside.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Mylie, I'd heard that the baby could be seen there but I'd always assumed that was when the momma was still carrying high. My goat's belly has already dropped. But I've never seen movement there before so I guess it was a baby.


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## MylieD (Sep 16, 2013)

I am new to all this. Nancy's my first goat. Her baby/ies sometimes seem to be higher and sometimes lower. I really have no idea if my goat is dropped or not. It seems really empty up top sometimes and other times I feel hardness with movement. It was just that one time I felt movement in that spot on the left. It was a palm sized lump that moved around and then sunk in. Maybe your goat's baby was low and decided to do a back flip so it's feet were pointed up? Lol.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

LOL! Maybe! From what I gather, the sides sink in and they look like there aren't any babies there anymore. We bought our goats already preggers and have no idea when they're due. I'm guessing this one is due in the next 2-3 weeks but I could be totally wrong. Her sister is still carrying up high so I'm guessing she'll be due end of February or beginning of march. This is my first time to have pregnant goats and it would've been soooo much easier if I'd known the due date!


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## IvyMayPygmyGoats (Jan 24, 2014)

That's so cute! I feel aweful sending my ladies out at the end of the evening, my youngest (March 2013) was hand reared indoors (we bought her without her mum at 8 weeks and she was a small baby) so she's house trained! She loves the dogs and cats, and to wee on the sofa -_-


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Ivy may, when I told my best friend that I had a goat in the house, along with two rabbits, she called me Ellie May Clampett from The Beverly Hillbillies! I'm gonna share that title with you! LOL! We are definitely goat crazy!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Most people may not even know who that is. Loved that show.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I know the younger generation probably has no idea who I'm talking about! Feeling old! LOL!


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## IvyMayPygmyGoats (Jan 24, 2014)

As a member of the younger generation I can confirm that I have no idea what you mean. They can me Crazy Goat Girl.. Despite the fact that I have hens, ducks, sheep, dogs, lizards, a rat, cats and...... Oh actually that might be it..!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Do a search on utube for Beverly Hillbillies. Probably could find some of the old shows.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Lol ;-)


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Yep! That's it! LOL!


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Still has ligs and no goo yet. Today's pic of my goat's backside, it goes from smooth to puckered up to smooth again...


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

The waiting is MADDENING! She probably isn't even due until the end of NEXT month! ARG!


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## MylieD (Sep 16, 2013)

I feel you big time! I thought my goat was due the 23rd of January. Guess not. Feels like she's going to hold them in until the last minute and then have them when I'm out.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Yep, that's how I feel too!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I too agree.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

My goat is making a bit of noise and all I can think is "you better NOT have that baby during the Super Bowl!" GO BRONCOS! And no she isn't in labor. I'd bring her in my living room and deliver it in front of my tv if she was! LOL!


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

No better than the broncos are playing it would be more exciting to go to the barn and deliver babies

Carmen, Co-Owner Oleo Acres LLC, Nw Ks


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

You're right about that. My Broncos have disappointed me but there's always next year!


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Pretty darn sad, wasn't it?


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

The saddest.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Sasha has almost no ligs left. But she doesn't have any goop coming out yet.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

No ligaments but no goop either. How long after ligs go will I see goop? Not sure with her sister because hers kept coming and going for a couple days.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

You will just have to keep an eye on her. No guarantees of anything.


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## MylieD (Sep 16, 2013)

Nancy only had a little discharge, no amber goo or long tubes at all. I like it was about 12-14 hrs after I first noticed no ligs at all, that she kidded. The big give away for me was her udder suddenly filled up fast. All that to say, you never know what your goat's going to do. But I sure hope it's soon for you!


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Stupid flipping goat got her ligs back! She mocks me with her amazingly unpredictable ligaments! LOL! Her vulva hasn't started gaping open yet anyway. Not sure if that is the way it's supposed to happen but her sister had gaping open vulva for a few days before birthing. It was just minor gaping - like when you peek behind the curtain to see who's at the door. My dear goat had me up checking her an hour after I went to bed and I got up early (on the weekend!!) to check her. That's when I found the ligs went up and down like her sister's did. I'm not quite as impatient as I was before because I already have a baby goat to play with and coo over. But I want to be awake and at home when she goes into labor.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Sasha hasn't had ligaments for at least a couple hours. But no goop and no baby either. Not sure if I should go to the grocery store or wait and see if she delivers. :-/


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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

Pygmylover said:


> Sasha hasn't had ligaments for at least a couple hours. But no goop and no baby either. Not sure if I should go to the grocery store or wait and see if she delivers. :-/


If your weather is as nasty right now as ours is about to be, I'd go get my groceries; just a quick trip. My thinking is, & I could be sincerly wrong, but if she hasn't gone into active labor yet you'll have time to run out & get back. Be safe! 

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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Hootenanny, do y'all live in the south? Cause we're fixing to get some bad stuff here too. Here's a pic of Sasha today. Get a load of that udder!


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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

Pygmylover said:


> Hootenanny, do y'all live in the south? Cause we're fixing to get some bad stuff here too. Here's a pic of Sasha today. Get a load of that udder!


Yes, we're in North Louisiana; supposed to get ice tonight. If we get a single flake of snow or ice, everything shuts down... schools, grocery stores... everything. People here don't know how to drive in it. Your pic didn't post... I think.

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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

No idea why the pic didnt load . Lets try again.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Well I'm 2 for 2 on pics! Don't know why it's not loading! Lets see if the 3rd time's a charm! We're in Alabama an have the same thing as far as everything closing down. But I'd rather close up than have idiots who can't drive in the sunshine try to drive on the ice! LOL!


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Maybe goat spot isn't working properly? I've never had a problem posting a pic before. :-(


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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

Pygmylover said:


> Well I'm 2 for 2 on pics! Don't know why it's not loading! Lets see if the 3rd time's a charm! We're in Alabama an have the same thing as far as everything closing down. But I'd rather close up than have idiots who can't drive in the sunshine try to drive on the ice! LOL!


Lol! So true! 

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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Well she just started contracting and couldn't get the bubble thing out so it kind of ruptured on my hand while I assisted. Worried about actual birthing a baby.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

She just had a boy but there's another orange bubble coming out. Is that placenta?


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Probably is if you don't see a kid in it.


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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

How exciting! Congrats! Hope all is well. 

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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

She's still got the ball of goo hanging. I had to pull baby out. She just couldn't get him out. She had a hard time getting the fluid bubble out before having him. His water sac broke on the way out so I had the towel all over his nose and mouth trying to get it clear. He still hasn't nursed. She keeps grunting at him. He keeps trying to nurse her collar. I put him on the teat but he just goes back to her head!


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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

Pygmylover said:


> She's still got the ball of goo hanging. I had to pull baby out. She just couldn't get him out. She had a hard time getting the fluid bubble out before having him. His water sac broke on the way out so I had the towel all over his nose and mouth trying to get it clear. He still hasn't nursed. She keeps grunting at him. He keeps trying to nurse her collar. I put him on the teat but he just goes back to her head!


Maybe the teat still has a plug. I would milk just a LITTLE BIT so he can smell it. I also read, if he still refuses to nurse, put a dab of honey on the teat & a dab on his tongue so he can taste it.

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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Moms milk doesn't squirt out, it just oozed a drop out when I milked her. I think I'm gonna take her and baby to vet to get checked and maybe get mom an oxytocin shot. Baby has only had a couple drops of milk so far. He'll eat but she won't let him!


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

If I'm unable to get milk out of mom, will her sister who kidded last week nurse him?


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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

Pygmylover said:


> If I'm unable to get milk out of mom, will her sister who kidded last week nurse him?


I'm sure you know this, but he needs colostrum very very soon.

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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

No, a Doe that kidded a week ago will not have colostrum.
You are going to have to get some from either powdered colostrum sold in feed stores or get it from another Doe that just kidded, be sure it is a CAE clean Doe.
It is crucial to get the colostrum in the kid ASAP. there is a short window of when it needs to be given or it does no good.

Glad a vet is going to look at your Doe and kid.

Is the Does udder hot or hard, have stringy milk?

Some Does colostrum at first is so thick, you have to work at it getting it out. It looks really thick, thick and yellow , real sticky as well. This is normal, after a little while of working the flow, it gets easier and thins out bit. Unless she has no udder formed or has other issues.

With those thick ones, I will start milking it into a 12 cc syringe and will feed it to the kid(s), go to each teat side, back and forth. 

Keep working at it. If it is not congested udder or mastitis, then with a little time and effort, it will get better. If it is from being thick.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I FINALLY was able to get baby nursing for a few seconds! Not sure how much he got since its soooo thick!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

That is good, just keep letting the kid do that, it helps momma for milk letdown and as the kid nurses, it helps to make the colostrum less thick as time goes by. 

Does mom's udder look tight and full or somewhat empty?

Feel the kid's tummy, is it full, empty ect?


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Udder looks full. But now the baby is refusing to eat and it won't take a bottle. I hope it lives. It looks sickly and keeps sneezing like it got something up its nose. :-(


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Oh dear. Momma has diarrhea. Her sister didn't have that after she gave birth. Is that normal?


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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

Pygmylover said:


> Oh dear. Momma has diarrhea. Her sister didn't have that after she gave birth. Is that normal?


I believe it's normal after kidding. Be sure you worm your does the day of or the day after kidding because of the stress of kidding. You don't want the worms to compromise their immune system. Sorry you're having a rough time.

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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

Pygmylover said:


> Udder looks full. But now the baby is refusing to eat and it won't take a bottle. I hope it lives. It looks sickly and keeps sneezing like it got something up its nose. :-(


You may have to tube feed the baby. I would try my best to get that does colostrum; the baby desperately needs it.

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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Mom may be congested. You need to do warm compresses and massage and bag balm or peppermint oil. You also need to get colostrum into that kid. At this point you may as well get the powder and get tubing to tube her. Otherwise then yes you will lose him. You also need to take his temp. If it is under 100, you need to warm him up first. Temp should be 101.5 to 103.5.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Thank the sweet Lord, the baby is nursing. I just have to hold momma still because she does NOT like it! Do any ff's let their babies nurse without being held at first?


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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

Pygmylover said:


> Thank the sweet Lord, the baby is nursing. I just have to hold momma still because she does NOT like it! Do any ff's let their babies nurse without being held at first?


Praise the Lord! Eat up kid! Depends on the goat, I think.

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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Oh, and I was able to eek out a tablespoon of colostrum, which I froze. How long will it keep in the freezer?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I would feed the colostrum to the kid, if you are not getting very much out for the kid. Gradually warm it up with warm tap water. Don't put it in the microwave. 
If it is in a container or baggy make sure it doesn't leak into the water part. Heat that way until warm enough but not to hot, test on your wrist. You can feed that by syringe (no needle) very slowly at the back corner of the mouth. If you are not getting much out of her I would feed it to her baby now.
Keep allowing her baby to nurse, that is good it will help momma.  

If momma is super tight in the udder, you need to milk out just enough, if possible to make her more comfortable, some FF and any new momma, needs help with an overly tight udder. Some FF need to be taught to be momma's, but will catch on. Just have them in their own boding pen away from other goats. 
If her udder is tight and sore, she will be reluctant to feed the kid, cause it hurts.

Try warm compresses for her udder as mention by Karen above.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Ill try the syringe feeding method. No idea why I didn't think of that since I used it on his cousin last week. I've been trying to hold mom still but this last time he only nursed for a millisecond. I gave some nutridrench to him a few hours ago. He didn't like it. I tried Karo but he didn't like that either. I milked his mom until her udders squirted instead of dripped. How long does she make colostrum?


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Oh, and both mom and baby are inside in their own kennel. It's really cold here and mom has been inside for a month due to her pinkeye blinding her. Then the weather was so cold we couldn't put her back out since she'd gotten used to the warm house.


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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

toth boer goats said:


> I would feed the colostrum to the kid, if you are not getting very much out for the kid. Gradually warm it up with warm tap water. Don't put it in the microwave.
> If it is in a container or baggy make sure it doesn't leak into the water part. Heat that way until warm enough but not to hot, test on your wrist. You can feed that by syringe (no needle) very slowly at the back corner of the mouth. If you are not getting much out of her I would feed it to her baby now.
> Keep allowing her baby to nurse, that is good it will help momma.
> 
> ...


Great advice! 

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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

Pygmylover said:


> Moms milk doesn't squirt out, it just oozed a drop out when I milked her. I think I'm gonna take her and baby to vet to get checked and maybe get mom an oxytocin shot. Baby has only had a couple drops of milk so far. He'll eat but she won't let him!


He's so dang cute! Looks like he has a sneaky grin. 

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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

Pygmylover said:


> Ill try the syringe feeding method. No idea why I didn't think of that since I used it on his cousin last week. I've been trying to hold mom still but this last time he only nursed for a millisecond. I gave some nutridrench to him a few hours ago. He didn't like it. I tried Karo but he didn't like that either. I milked his mom until her udders squirted instead of dripped. How long does she make colostrum?


Someone feel free to chime in if I'm wrong, but I believe it's 2-10 days. The good keeper stuff is within the first 2 hrs. I think these little guys need it within 30min to 1hr. But getting in him is a plus so he can get the antibodies he needs.

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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

The kids only absorb the antibodies for like the first 12 to 18 hours or so and mostly under 10 hours. After that the colostrum won't help them with immunity.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Well I syringed almost a tablespoon in him about 5 minutes ago. He was born between 11:30 and 12 and it's 11:58 now. So maybe I got him some in time. He did eat a tiny bit earlier so hopefully he'll be okay. He definitely didn't eat anything the first hour or so though. :-/


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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

Pygmylover said:


> Well I syringed almost a tablespoon in him about 5 minutes ago. He was born between 11:30 and 12 and it's 11:58 now. So maybe I got him some in time. He did eat a tiny bit earlier so hopefully he'll be okay. He definitely didn't eat anything the first hour or so though. :-/


I'm sure he'll be just fine. 

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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I just gave baby about 5 mL more or less (he probably spit one or two mL out!). Anyway, he's still trying to nurse IF he gets
some milk first. It's like that stimulates his brain to go get momma milk. He plays in between me giving him milk and him going to get it from mom. But he really isn't getting much from mom because her nipples are so long! So here's my question... How many mL do I give him and how often? Remember he's a pygmy and he probably weighs about 2 pounds.


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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

Pygmylover said:


> I just gave baby about 5 mL more or less (he probably spit one or two mL out!). Anyway, he's still trying to nurse IF he gets
> some milk first. It's like that stimulates his brain to go get momma milk. He plays in between me giving him milk and him going to get it from mom. But he really isn't getting much from mom because her nipples are so long! So here's my question... How many mL do I give him and how often? Remember he's a pygmy and he probably weighs about 2 pounds.


Look under "Kidding Koral". Stacey has a feeding schedule for minis that might be helpful. 

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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

If momma won' t hold still, tie her head snug to something and one back leg, up off the ground, the one you will be working from, so she cannot kick and her leg is out of the way. Then milk her or put the kid on there. Every drop you get out either by putting it into a clean container or bucket or syringe, feed it to the kid.
If you managed to get 2 ice cubes worth into the kid before it was too late, the kid should be fine there. If not, as long as the kid recieved some that is better than nothing. But hopefully it was enough.

Sounds better, you are getting a stream of milk now instead of just thick, keep at it to get that flow going good.

Stimulate her, massaging and light bumping, like kids do, helps her udder. Putting the kid helps as well.
How does the milk look, is there any blood, strings, clots, discoloration, hot udder, hard, anything looking out of the ordinary? 
Or is it nice yellow or light yellow milk color and looks good?

Have you picked up the baby and felt her belly? Is it empty, feels like something in there or full? 
If it is empty, you will have to supplement feed in between, so the baby gets enough. If the kid has something in the gut that is good.
Watch the kids belly or weigh the kid so you know if it is gaining each week.

Spitting it out, are you feeding at the back corner of the mouth? Instead of the front?
Do it really slowly, so it is not spit out or just runs out of the mouth.
With the syringe(no needle) I take my index finger and put it in the mouth mimicking the teat. I am wanting that suck reflex, I do this at the same time I am feeding the milk very slowly. Then, I will put the kid on momma. Tickle the tailhead and lower back of the kid, when nursing, it stimulates the kid into nursing and that is what momma does. It helps.

Mom's nipple being too long is fine, it is the matter of, are they too large in circumference that the kid cannot get the mouth around it easily?
As I mentioned, tickle the tailhead, it does wonders. Whether feeding from a syringe, bottle or momma. 
If the teat is really low, you may have to put the kid on it's knee's, so it is easily accessed. Takes a bit of trickery and persistance here, they hate doing that, but eventually will get the idea, it is easier to reach or find. This is if the teat is close to the ground?

I think this is the link for mini's on how much to feed.
http://www.thegoatspot.net/forum/f197/bottle-feeding-info-140259/


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Wow, I just checked out the minis feeding schedule and amount, and I haven't been feeding him anywhere close to as much as he needs. I'm hoping that he'll get the hang of eating off momma so I won't have to keep feeding him. His cousin started eating like a pig after the vet gave her mom an oxytocin shot. Unfortunately the vet didn't want me to bring Sasha in for her oxytocin shot until today. It's icy today and I can't take her. :-( As for her milk, it's on the yellowish side and it looks fine. No clumping or blood or bad odor or anything. And she doesn't mind her baby nursing now as long as I'm rubbing her breastbone! LOL! But he just nurses for less than a second and then he doesn't do it again. Not sure if he's getting anything. He definitely needs practice to figure out how to get that milk out. I did give him some vitamin b the vet gave me when I took his cousin last week. So far all I can say is that he's doing okay. He's not doing great but he's not doing badly either. He plays after I give him his food but he's kind of lethargic beforehand. His week old cousin is so vibrant, maybe he just has a different personality? Or maybe it's because he's only 24 hours old? But at least he perks up after he eats!  thanks so much for all your help!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

He needs more milk, supplement him by other means, until momma increases her supply or baby starts nursing better.
That is why he isn't thriving as well.

How is the kids belly? Is it empty?


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

He isn't getting enough to eat. I would milk out mom to get her going.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I don't know how full his belly is. It isn't fat like his week old cousin but it feels like hers did last week. The cousin is definitely eating well but no bulging tummy. But last week she was skinny like he is. He did eat off mom a little bit ago. When I went to check on them, he was standing up and came over to me and started playing. He even nursed his mom a couple seconds while I was watching. He'll also go up to mom's udder and just bump it with his nose a couple times and walk off without eating. It's like he wants it to know it better be ready when he wants more milk. Lol!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

He is acting good. That is a plus. 

If the belly feels like something's in there and he isn't crying for milk, weak, he may be getting enough. 
But I am not there to feel his belly.

Compare bellies to the ones that are full, pick up the kid and feel on the lower belly area, where the flanks are but in front on it. When you pick them up, a kid that is full will show a plump round belly and the kid that has nothing in there, will be flat. You can feel it as well that way.

You don't want him to go back and forth trying to suckle and be impatient, almost panicky, that means, he is not getting what he needs.
If you put the kid on the teat and he bumps then walks off, he is satisfied and may of nursed when you weren't looking. 

Keep at momma. Any milk you get out, feed it to the kid. 

Make sure momma gets plenty of Alfalfa and grain to help her milk supply. Also she needs to drink, if you can, offer her some fresh warm molasses water to encourage her to drink.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

He feels a bit fuller after I syringed about 3/4 of an ounce in him. He seems to dislike her right nipple so I'm milking it and freezing the milk. It isn't easy feeding him. His mouth is so small and he won't swallow if he can help it. Stubborn!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

You are doing the right thing by milking and keeping an eye on that ignored teat.

Kids are stubborn and want only one side to claim when nursing, so we have teach them there are 2 sides on momma if there is a single. They are difficult to get onto the other side but, with persistence it can be done. Just keep at it and eventually, he will catch on especially when he gets bigger. Unless of course, the teat is really too big for the kids mouth now, being so young.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I just went to check on mom and baby. Baby was doing that hoppy bouncy thing. He is so cute! He jumped around for quite a while. I didn't feed him because he seems to be getting enough from mom. I'll go check on them again before I go to bed to make sure he's still lively. If he isn't, I'll feed him.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

That sounds real promising, hope he is still doing good today. 
Always feel the belly and see if he has something in there, which it does sound like he is and momma must be doing better. Still keep an eye on them. 

Great work by the way.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I hadn't fed baby since 11:30 or 12 last night. At 10:30 this morning, he was jumping around and playing so I didn't feed him. His stomach isn't empty but it isn't full either. I'm gonna leave it alone for now. I think he'll feel fuller once he and momma get more in sync. But for now he seems fine. I'm afraid if I interfere he and mom will never figure things out.
On another note, his cousin who is a week old today feels like she's gonna burst open. She has a fat little tummy. And she was just like the baby boy last week. She sure isn't missing a meal. I've even seen her mouthing the hay. I assume that's okay. It's not like I can keep her from it since that's their bedding.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

All sounds good.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I haven't fed baby boy all day and he's got a full tummy and is very playful tonight. Moms getting him what he needs apparently. :-D


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## Hootenannyshollow (Jan 3, 2014)

Pygmylover said:


> I haven't fed baby boy all day and he's got a full tummy and is very playful tonight. Moms getting him what he needs apparently. :-D


You're a good Grandmother! Good job! 

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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

:dance::thumbup:

Wonderful news, great work.

Sounds like all will be OK.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

I have a milk question. The momma's nipples weren't full of milk. I tried each one to make sure baby is getting fed. The milk came out but the nipples weren't full of milk already. Is that normal? It's the same with my other momma goat.


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

It means that he's nursing often enough to keep her empty, she'll let down as he bumps her udder and nurses.


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## Pygmylover (Oct 20, 2013)

Thank goodness! I didn't need another problem! LOL! Thanks for your help.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I agree.


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