# what is Goat Conformation??



## keeponfarming

Hi everyone am still new to the site and very new to the world of showing dairy goats, i noticed this page is pretty much plastered with photos of everyone's goats and then many of you say whats right or wrong...Why? is this to see who meets breed standards? or showing? this is one of my girls now i really only bought her because i find her to be so pretty but she is registered "grade" what should i be looking for in dairy goat? what about her? please be elaborate as i want to learn this stuff and i really have yet to understand it! thanks! so here is topanga, and i know there is some stand you should put them in? However i just tried hooking her to a post...so i don't even know if you can tell anything from these photos?


















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## Catahoula

Don't know much about goat confirmation. Topanga is beautiful to me.  I love spots.


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## keeponfarming

she is a sweetheart, i got her when she was only 20 hours old, the breeder wanted to sell her a.s.a.p since the mother rejected her...Now since i bottle fed her and raised her myself, anytime i come near the barn she needs to be right next to me, she was very upset i tired her to the post for the photos...she wanted to cuddle lol. she is only about 6 months old now.


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## clearwtrbeach

So as for conformation, everything has conformation. Goats dogs etc. what that is, is the registry (ADGA, AKC what ever the animal is) says ok this is what the perfect animal of xxxx this breed should look like. Then animals are 'judged' 'compared' to that perfect 'standard'. 
You mention she's registered grade, so I'm assuming registered through ADGA or AGS? you can go to their website and look up how they judge the animal. For example a level top line (that back area from the withers toward the tail), or the udder etc. There are diagrams there ( I printed them out ) then when I look at an animal I stare at the diagram then the animal .
For milk goats it's important to try and get 'good' mammary system that will hold up to years of breeding/milking. There is another thread on here that says udders- you can take a look at some of the photos to help. For me the extra photos help compare to the diagram and when looking at my goat. 
As for the stand, you don't need a stand to take pics.  Actually tied up, or having some one hold them. Youd did a pretty good job right there!. When taking photos some one to help (believe me I can never get any help). Have them stand so the camera is about animal height and shoot sqarely at the animal. 
As for your girl, she is very cute. She looks nice and long bodied, and to have good angles on her rear legs. It looks like even though she may be fighting being tied up a little. Her front legs look nicely coming out under the shoulder (visualize a straight line down through the shoulder straight down the front legs).
One last thing goats are ADDICTING


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## keeponfarming

thanks for the info! maybe i should have changed the title of this post, lol am hoping more people chime in here!


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## emilieanne

I think she is not good and needs to come over to my house!!(; 
Only kidding.. Haha 
She's adorable. 
I think she looks to have nice strength in her legs. 
She also sets up pretty good for being fighting the leash, in her back legs. 
She looks to have a pretty good top line 
She has a not so bad steep rump and a good long neck! 
She's beautiful!! 
She also looks to have a good barrel.


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Topline gos up from the withers
Rump is steep
Brisket needs a bit more blending

Nice rear leg angle
Nice amount of brisket
Nice length in neck and body
Fair amount of body depth
She looks to have a fair amount of power in the front end
Strong shoulders
And of course that color!

I cannot fully judge her in the grass, but she is a fairly nice doe as far as I can see.


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

*ADGA JUDGING​A. GENERAL APPEARANCE . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .​*An attractive framework with femininity (masculinity in bucks), strength, upstandingness, length and
smoothness of blending throughout that create an impressive style and graceful walk​*Stature​*​​- slightly taller at withers than hips with long bone pattern throughout. . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .​
*Head & Breed Characteristics​*​​- clean cut and balanced in length, width and depth; broad . . . . . .
muzzle with full nostrils; well-sculpted, alert eyes; strong jaw with angular lean junction to throat;
appropriate size, color, ears and nose to meet breed standard.​
*Front End Assembly​*​​- prominent withers arched to point of shoulder with shoulder blade, . . . . . . .
point of shoulder and point of elbow set tightly and smoothly against the chest wall both while at
rest and in motion; deep and wide into chest floor with moderate strength of brisket.​
*Back​*​​- Strong and straight with well defined vertebrae throughout slightly uphill to . . . . . . . . . . . . . .
withers; level chine with full crops into a straight , wide loin; wide hips smoothly set and level with
back; strong rump which is uniformly wide and nearly level from hips to pinbones and thurl to thurl;
thurls set two-thirds of the distance from hips to pinbones; well defined and wide pinbones set
slightly lower than the hips; tailhead slightly above and smoothly set between the pinbones; tail
symmetrical to body and free from coarseness; vulva normal size and shape in females; normal
sheath in males.​
*Legs, Pasterns & Feet​*​​- bone flat and strong throughout leading to smooth, free motion; . . . . . . . .
front legs with clean knees, straight, wide apart and squarely placed; rear legs wide apart and
straight from the rear and well angulated in side profile through the stifle to cleanly molded hocks,
nearly perpendicular from hock to strong, yet flexible pastern of medium length; strong feet with
tight toes, pointed directly forward; deep heels with sole nearly uniform in depth from toe to heel​
*B. DAIRY CHARACTER . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .​*Angularity and general openness with strong yet refined and clean bone structure, showing
freedom from coarseness and with evidence of milking ability giving due regard to stage of lactation
(of breeding season in bucks).​*Neck​*​​- long, lean and blending smoothly into the shoulders; clean cut throat and brisket.​
*Withers​*​​- prominent and wedge shaped with the dorsal process rising slightly above the shoulder
blades.​
*Ribs​*​​- flat, flinty, wide apart and long; lower rear ribs should angle to flank.​
*Flank​*​​- deep, yet arched and free of excess tissue​
*Thighs​*​​- in side profile, moderately incurving from pinbone to stifle; from the rear, clean and wide
apart, highly arched and out-curving into the escutcheon to provide ample room for the udder and
its attachment.​
*Skin​*​​- thin, loose and pliable with soft, lustrous hair​
*C. BODY CAPACITY . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . .​*Relatively large in proportion to size, age and period of lactation in does (of breeding season for
bucks), providing ample capacity, strength and vigor​*Chest​*​​- deep and wide, yet clean-cut, with well sprung foreribs, full in crops and at point . . . . . . . .
of elbow.​
*Barrel​*​​- strongly supported, long, deep and wide; depth and spring of rib tending to . . . . . . . . . . . .
increase into a deep yet refined flank.​
*D. MAMMARY SYSTEM . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . . (Sr. doe only)​*Strongly attached, elastic, well balanced with adequate capacity, quality, ease of milking and
indicating heavy milk production over a long period of usefulness.​*Udder Support​*​​- strong medial suspensory ligament that clearly defines the udder halves, . . . . . .
contributes to desirable shape and capacity, and holds the entire udder snugly to the body and well
above the hocks. Fore, rear and lateral attachments must be strong and smooth.​
*Fore Udder​*​​- wide and full to the side and extending moderately forward without excess . . . . . . . .
non-lactating tissue and indicating capacity, desirable shape and productivity.​
*Rear Udder​*​​- capacious, high, wide and arched into the escutcheon. uniformly wide and . . . . . . . .
deep to the floor; moderately curved in side profile without protruding beyond the vulva.​
*Balance, Symmetry & Quality​*​​- in side profile, one/third of the capacity visible in front of . . . . . . . .
the leg, one/third under the leg and one/third behind the leg; well rounded with soft, pliable elastic
texture that is well collapsed after milking, free of scar tissue, with the halves evenly balanced.​
*Teats​*​​- uniform in size and diameter in proportion to capacity of udder, cylindrical in . . . . . . . . . . . .
shape, pointed nearly straight down or slightly forward, and situated two/thirds of the distance from
the medial suspensory ligament on the floor of each udder half to the side, indicating ease of
milking.​
*​​​​​*​*
*


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

*Evaluation of Defects - General Defects​Slight to Serious (depending on degree)​*1. Large scurs or stubs
2. Undershot or overshot jaw
3. Enlarged knees; non-disabling lameness
4. Bowed over front knees; buck knees
5. Small boned for body size
6. Loose, winged or heavy shoulders
7. Narrow chest or pinched heart girth
8. Short, shallow or narrow body
9. Low-backed or steep rumped
10. Broken or wry tail
11. Close in hocks
12. Swollen hocks
13. Swollen stifle joint
14. Postiness
15. Hind legs close together
16. Sprung pasterns
17. Turned out or crooked feet
18. Udder of beefy texture or with a pocket
19. Front, rear or side udder attachment
lacking
20. Separation between udder halves;
presence of scar tissue
21. Teats that are:
a. Set close together
b. Bulbous
c. Extremely large or small
d. Pointed sideways
e. Uneven in size
f. Having small streams or hard to milk
g. Not clearly separated from the udder​*Very Serious Defects​*1. Udder that is:
a. Pendulous
b. Too distended to determine texture
c. Hard or swollen (except in does just
fresh)
d. So uneven that one half is less than half
the size of the other half
e. Udder lacking in size in relation to the
doe
f. Double orifice in teat of doe
g. Extra teat(s) or teat(s) that has been cut
off in does
h. Leaking orifice
i. Misplaced orifice
2. Crooked face on does
3. Very crooked or malformed feet​*Disqualifications​*1. Total Blindness
2. Serious Emaciation
3. Permanent lameness or difficulty walking
4. Blind or non-functioning half of udder
5. Blind teat
6. Double teat(s)
7. Extra teat(s) that interfere with milking
8. Active mastitis or other cause of abnormal
milk
9. Evidence of hermaphroditism or other
inability to reproduce
10. Permanent physical defects, such as a
navel hernia
11. Crooked face on bucks
12. Extra teat(s) or teat(s) that have been cut
off in bucks
13. Double orifice in teat of bucks
14. Buck with one testicle or abnormal​testicles


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

*Evaluation of Defects - Breed Specific Faults​Moderate Faults
Alpine​*Mature does less than 30" tall or 135 lbs.
Mature bucks less than 32" tall or 170 lbs.
Does that are all white or with
Toggenburg color and markings​*LaMancha​*Mature does less than 28" tall or 130 lbs.
Mature bucks less than 30" tall or 160 lbs.​*Nigerian Dwarf​*Mature does less than 17" tall
Mature bucks less than 17" tall​*Nubian​*Mature does less than 30" tall or 135 lbs.
Mature bucks less than 32" tall or 170 lbs.
Straight face​*Oberhasli​*Mature does less than 28" tall or 120 lbs.
Mature bucks less than 30" tall or 150 lbs.​*Saanen​*Mature does less than 30" tall or 135 lbs.
Mature bucks less than 32" tall or 170 lbs.​*Sable Saanen​*Mature does less than 30" tall or 135 lbs.
Mature bucks less than 32" tall or 170 lbs.​*Toggenburg​*Mature does less than 26" tall or 120 lbs.
Mature bucks less than 28" tall or 150 lbs.
Few small white spots in hair of does​*Moderate to Serious Faults
Alpine, LaMancha, Nigerian Dwarf,
Oberhasli, Saanen, Toggenburg​*Roman nose​*Serious Faults
Alpine​*Bucks that are all white or with Toggenburg
color and markings​*Oberhasli​*Small white spots in hair of does​*Saanen​*Dark cream color
Several small dark spots in hair​*Toggenburg​*Black color in does
White stomach on does
Large white spot (More than 1 ½ " in
any direction) on does
Few small white spots in hair of
bucks​*Very Serious Faults
Nubian​*Dished face
Barely drooping ears​*Oberhasli​*Small white spots in hair of bucks​*Breed Specific Disqualifications
Alpine​*Pendulous or LaMancha type ears​*LaMancha​*Any other ear type but gopher and elf in
does
Any other ear type but gopher in bucks​*Nigerian Dwarf​*Pendulous or LaMancha type ears
Mature doe over 22.5" tall
mature buck over 23.5" tall​*Oberhasli​*Pendulous or LaMancha type ears
Black bucks
Any colors other than chamoise (or
black in does)
Large white spot (More than 1 ½ " in
any direction)​*Saanen​*Pendulous or LaMancha type ears
Large dark spot (More than 1 ½ " in
any direction)​*Sable Saanen​*Pendulous or LaMancha type ears
Solid white color
Solid light cream color​*Toggenburg​*Pendulous or LaMancha type ears
Tricolor or piebald
Black bucks
White stomach on bucks
Large white spot (More than 1 ½ " in
any direction) in bucks​*Recorded Grades​*​​​​- A doe that is recorded as a
specific breed type should only be faulted if
the breed character defect would be a
disqualification. Then the fault should be
considered as if it were a very serious
defect.​
​​*
*


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

*JUDGING PROCEDURE

While the goats are moving, watch for:​*- Pleasing carriage and smoothness of walk
- Width between hocks, strength of pasterns and width in chest floor
- Strength of topline, angle of rump and blending of shoulder blades into the withers and point of
shoulder​*Stand the goats in a head to tail line and look for:​*- Overall angularity and dairy character
- Length and refinement of neck
- Set to front and rear legs
- Udder shape and apparent capacity
- Extension of fore udder and smoothness of rear udder
- Head profile and breed character (be sure to see both sides of the goat)
- Depth of heart and barrel
- Strength across the topline​*In a Side by Side Line from the front look for:​*- Width and depth of chest
- Set of front legs and cleanliness of knees
- Blending of point of shoulder​*In a Side by Side Line from the rear look for:​*- Sharpness of withers
- Fullness in the crop and spring of rib
- Width and flatness of rump from thurl to thurl
- Set of hind legs
- Height and width of rear udder
- Teat size, shape and placement
- Openness and width of the escutcheon​*In Close Inspection​*- Head and jaw abnormalities
- Rib spacing
- Coat texture and skin pliability
- Total area of udder attachment
- Udder texture​- Abnormalities in the teats


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

That is how you judge a dairy goat. I used to be a judge, hope that helped.


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## keeponfarming

oh boy do i have alot to learn! i might try and get a photo of my other girls and her again but on flat ground so you can see her hoofs. thanks for the info!!!


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## emilieanne

keeponfarming said:


> oh boy do i have alot to learn! i might try and get a photo of my other girls and her again but on flat ground so you can see her hoofs. thanks for the info!!!


If you wanna come to some shows before you start showing, PM me and ill let you know of the shows that I know of. (Most of which ill be at!! )


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

^^Beat you to it! LOL, here is a list of all the ADGA sanctioned shows, so far...
http://www.adga.org/pages_adga/plain_shows.php


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## emilieanne

Lol guess you did, or so you thought!!(; 

Down here in Florida, ADGA hasn't posted out sanctioned shows yet. Ours don't start til like September October...


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

That's why I said.... so far.....! Lol, yeah they don't have everything up yet, they're working on it, they have to decide what judge is going where. Oh boy is it nice to be a judge though! I miss it, they pay your airfar, hotel, meals, everything you need, just to come out and look at goats all day! Lol


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## keeponfarming

So here is a weird question how long does a show last?....i imagine am going to have to drive pretty far since I live out in the middle of no where....how does it work....drive for hours. Get there sign up,show,and drive all the way back home within a few hours? How do you even travel with the goats?


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Well, it depends on the shows, some are a day, some are a few days, and some like Cal Expo are 17 days!
Normally I take them with a trailer, or in the pickup (I have a cage).


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

But showing in the ring, it's normally no longer than 45 minutes, but sometimes you sign up for several classes, which means showing them several times,


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## emilieanne

keeponfarming said:


> So here is a weird question how long does a show last?....i imagine am going to have to drive pretty far since I live out in the middle of no where....how does it work....drive for hours. Get there sign up,show,and drive all the way back home within a few hours? How do you even travel with the goats?


My goats are trained. Some like to be in a dog crate, others like to chill in the seat next to me 
With county fair that's 20 min away, I just go back home after showing is over. With state fair (3 hrs away) we go, and stay in a tack stall. They give you a stall for your goats and a stall to put your "tack" in. We bring sleeping bags & sleep in there. Lights out at midnight. Usually showing ends at 10 or so.. After feeding and stuff maybe 1045 then dinner and night night haha. 
It's usually 4 days. Thursday-Sunday. You leave Sunday.

Little bits- can you PLEASE come judge in fl?? we get the worst judges at my county fair, we get one judge for meat and dairy. He's a meat not dairy judge. Knows nothing. Lol we neeeeed you.


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Aww, I wish I could, but I'm retired from judging, and my goaties need me, lol! My daughter however... if your showing in the next few years, she is interested in being a judge.

That is down right....not right...(wish that could come out better...) You cannot have MEAT goat judge, juding a DAIRY goat! Maybe I can talk to ADGA for you. Or what is your fair name? Maybe I'll talk to them, because we have a small county fair out here, but we get a meat judge and a dairy judge, along with judges for other species.


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## emilieanne

Little-Bits-N-Pieces-ADG said:


> Aww, I wish I could, but I'm retired from judging, and my goaties need me, lol! My daughter however... if your showing in the next few years, she is interested in being a judge.
> 
> That is down right....not right...(wish that could come out better...) You cannot have MEAT goat judge, juding a DAIRY goat! Maybe I can talk to ADGA for you. Or what is your fair name? Maybe I'll talk to them, because we have a small county fair out here, but we get a meat judge and a dairy judge, along with judges for other species.


I will be showing til the day I die or I stop walking!!! Haha

And my fair is volusiacountyfair.com it's volusia county fair. 
I'm not sure if ADGA sanctions it, don't think they do, but that's just not right. For the pigs and the cows and everything else they get a breeder judge and a market judge. ....


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

emilieanne said:


> I will be showing til the day I die or I stop walking!!! Haha Which might be soon with your crackly joints! Lol
> 
> And my fair is volusiacountyfair.com it's volusia county fair.
> I'm not sure if ADGA sanctions it, don't think they do, but that's just not right. For the pigs and the cows and everything else they get a breeder judge and a market judge. ....
> 
> It should not matter what fair you have, they need to give you a dairy and meat judge, I'm sure if you have/had show stoppers, ADGA would like them placed right, and you and everyone else would like them placed right. I'll see what I can do.


 Answered in the quote cuz it was easier, sort of. Lol


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## Texaslass

So, forgive my ignorance here, but do you win something in shows? Are there prizes for first, second third, that kind of thing? I don't really expect to show ever, but I'd like to have some knowledge of it. -the rest of this thread was very informative BTW, I'll definitely be studying it.


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

I have contacted both ADGA and the Volusia County Fair, hopefully I will hear some good news in the morning!


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

NDlover said:


> So, forgive my ignorance here, but do you win something in shows? Are there prizes for first, second third, that kind of thing? I don't really expect to show ever, but I'd like to have some knowledge of it. -the rest of this thread was very informative BTW, I'll definitely be studying it.


You win money, ribbons, rosettes, plaques, bonds, etc.
And a title on your goats pedigree if it places well


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## still

Little bits you are a wealth of information! Thanks!!

Sent from my iPad using GoatSpot


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

^^ Thank you!


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## keeponfarming

Thank you everyone for all the info! 
please note:am really new at this so i hope i make sense.

So as am thinking about "shows" and lets say there are a few shows near me one 2 hours away,3 hours away and one 4 hours away...is there a show i need to go to First. in order to enter the other ones?....

like i need to start in a basic show, win that, and i can move on to the more high end show?....ugh. am i making any sense? i imagine there is a show in the U.S.A That is the mother of all goat shows....win that. and you cant win anything higher....if you end up winning shows where you live, Do you end up traveling with your goats state to state in order to stay in the competition?.... 


i think i might try a local show if its near by, i can already see a problem, see i dont just own goats...i made it my own little homestead i have ducks,geese, 80+ chickens,hogs,rabbits and goats!...and am the little farmer!...if i end up finding someone to watch the place. i wonder how me showing would work out.


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## emilieanne

keeponfarming said:


> Thank you everyone for all the info!
> please note:am really new at this so i hope i make sense.
> 
> So as am thinking about "shows" and lets say there are a few shows near me one 2 hours away,3 hours away and one 4 hours away...is there a show i need to go to First. in order to enter the other ones?....
> 
> like i need to start in a basic show, win that, and i can move on to the more high end show?....ugh. am i making any sense? i imagine there is a show in the U.S.A That is the mother of all goat shows....win that. and you cant win anything higher....if you end up winning shows where you live, Do you end up traveling with your goats state to state in order to stay in the competition?....
> 
> i think i might try a local show if its near by, i can already see a problem, see i dont just own goats...i made it my own little homestead i have ducks,geese, 80+ chickens,hogs,rabbits and goats!...and am the little farmer!...if i end up finding someone to watch the place. i wonder how me showing would work out.


Little bits- you are AMAZING!! thank you, so so much!!

Heather- I thought that too. 
Actually, I know for a fact in Florida, you just go to all the shows you want. If you win, I suggest you keep on going to other shows but you don't have to. It's not really a competition. Like with cheer leading, you do sub districts districts state then nationals. With showing, it's like go to whatever show you want. If you loose, you can still go to whatever else you want. 
Hope that makes sense

Also, there's us the ADGA national goat show. I'm thinking about going next summer. It's in July I eat to say?

I'm sure with the animals, you can find someone, it'll be fine just a few days. 
I think the longest show in Florida is 6 days. And I've heard some bad stuff about that. + it's in Miami I wanna say!!(; haha.


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## keeponfarming

i think i might need to go to a show just to see how its ran and what to do first hand


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## emilieanne

keeponfarming said:


> i think i might need to go to a show just to see how its ran and what to do first hand


Good idea!! 
Haha. 
I'm August ill know when the very first show is but I know up here in Deland there's one in late October then there's one November 15-17 and ill be at both of those. 
They're youth shows but still


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## keeponfarming

i found out there is one from me about 2 hours away in west palm beach and i think another one in Tampa.


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## emilieanne

keeponfarming said:


> i found out there is one from me about 2 hours away in west palm beach and i think another one in Tampa.


Yeah!!


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