# Buck sired 20 kids , 4 with teat faults….



## daisymay (Feb 13, 2017)

So, I found a very nice young buck but…he sired four kids with teat faults Out of 20. Who would buy him and who would not? His kids are preety nice. The four kids were out of three does. Two of the does were related but the others are way far back related to the buck… I also found this guys brother who has not sired any teat faults but he has had 18 kids On the ground but they don’t seem like they have as nice general appearance .So far I contacted a few maternal sibling owners and none have had any faults yet.
this seems to be everywhere… it’s very frustrating


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## alwaystj9 (Apr 10, 2019)

I would just wait. There's an awful lot of bucks out there.
Is he substantially cheaper because of this?
What are you raising your goats for? Showing, milking, eating, pets?
When do you need a buck?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Teat flaws can show up at random with the cleanest teat pairing.

4 out of 20 isn’t too bad actually. 
Just don’t pair those with him again.


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## daisymay (Feb 13, 2017)

Nigerian dwarf, no he is the same price as he was as a kid. I don’t need a buck, i have been browsing and really like his dam Who scored a 91. And trying to find a buck I can use for the doelings I keep from my other two bucks. The doe has excellent ruh and are. Helpful that they both have a bit of flash- moonspots. But shiping is another epensive of course and planing on keeping this guy for a few years.


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## Calistar (Jan 16, 2017)

There will ALWAYS be another buck, but issues can be very hard to work out of your herd. There's no reason to knowingly invite them in.


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## daisymay (Feb 13, 2017)

Yes there are many…I am, figuring out some lines with teat dq’s but it seems random so far.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

If you are going to be spending money on transport, then I would wait. It is so unacceptable in the dairy world to have teat faults.


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

I’d pass. 4 kids out of 20 is actually really high, and there are too many good bucks out there to bother with one that may throw teat faults.


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## Sfgwife (Feb 18, 2018)

Nope i would not buy him. i also would not sell him intact to anyone either. He could be a wether or in a freezer for dog food….. buck meat is not good at all. Lol. We processed one this spring way after he was stinky from rut. He made great dog food for a raw feeder that buys from us.


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## daisymay (Feb 13, 2017)

well he was 1750 as a kid so i doubt anyone is going to process him. but thank you all. i am still looking...


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

Sfgwife said:


> Nope i would not buy him. i also would not sell him intact to anyone either. He could be a wether or in a freezer for dog food….. buck meat is not good at all. Lol. We processed one this spring way after he was stinky from rut. He made great dog food for a raw feeder that buys from us.


That’s kind of funny. There are people around here who prefer to eat bucks… I’ve never tried it myself 😅
Seems like you could wether him ahead of time and give him a few months to mellow before butchering. I really like goat meat tho so it just seems like a waste with how prices are going up at the store for everything… but I guess your customer really loves their dog too 😉


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

daisymay said:


> well he was 1750 as a kid so i doubt anyone is going to process him. but thank you all. i am still looking...


Omg. I can’t even imagine spending that much on a goat 😅. Especially a ND - those are generally sold as pets? Assuming 1/2 his kids are boys… take awhile to recoup that expense.


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## lottsagoats1 (Apr 12, 2014)

Boer Mama- good Nigerians go for high prices, so depending on genetics, parents production and conformation that could be an average price. There are 2 types of Nigerians- pet quality and show/production quality. The show/production quality is where the higher prices are.


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

lottsagoats1 said:


> Boer Mama- good Nigerians go for high prices, so depending on genetics, parents production and conformation that could be an average price. There are 2 types of Nigerians- pet quality and show/production quality. The show/production quality is where the higher prices are.


Oh I do know they go for high prices… it’s just crazy to me 😂
So much could happen from predators to them being dumb and breaking a neck. I lost a buck to pneumonia last year. (Which is upsetting, and I should have saved it but didn’t realize in time, but would have been that much worse if we’d had a large investment into him).
I can’t wrap my head around a $5k boer buck either, so it’s not just me picking on one breed. Lol
But I guess that’s why I’m just raising a little commercial herd and not playing ball with the big guys 😉


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## Sfgwife (Feb 18, 2018)

Boer Mama said:


> That’s kind of funny. There are people around here who prefer to eat bucks… I’ve never tried it myself 😅
> Seems like you could wether him ahead of time and give him a few months to mellow before butchering. I really like goat meat tho so it just seems like a waste with how prices are going up at the store for everything… but I guess your customer really loves their dog too 😉


the first chew was ok. Kind of a bit gamey taste. Second chew got stronger. By the fifth chew could not get that out our mouths fast enough and the taste LINGERED! Lol. It was BAD. a friend had told us not to do it. But like you hate to waste. So we just had to try it. And NEVER AGAIN hahahaa.


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## Sfgwife (Feb 18, 2018)

daisymay said:


> well he was 1750 as a kid so i doubt anyone is going to process him. but thank you all. i am still looking...


so wait…. The breeder knows he has a teat flaw like this and is trying to sell him for that?!?!?!!!! As a breeding bucl?!?!?!! Run. Run fast and far from that breeder! They are in it for the money and absolutely nothing else!


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

Sfgwife said:


> so wait…. The breeder knows he has a teat flaw like this and is trying to sell him for that?!?!?!!!! As a breeding bucl?!?!?!! Run. Run fast and far from that breeder! They are in it for the money and absolutely nothing else!


Sounds like someone bought him from the breeder for that much as a kid. We don’t know how much they are currently asking for him.


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## daisymay (Feb 13, 2017)

yes sorry they bought his as a kid for that much. He has excellent lines and his kids are preety nice but that dang teat gene... you just never know when its going to pop up...i believe he has at leat 6 siblings(different ages) and i found 4 so far that hasnt had the issue.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I think the others are being too hard on you. It is what it is and I still feel 4 isn’t that bad out of 20 goats. I know it is frowned upon in that breed world. However, we learn lessons from things thrown at us.

I would sell the flawed goats as commercial or as meat.

Flaws happen to the best of us and when we least expect it.


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

toth boer goats said:


> I think the others are being too hard on you. It is what it is and I still feel 4 isn’t that bad out of 20 goats. I know it is frowned upon in that breed world. However, we learn lessons from things thrown at us.
> 
> I would sell the flawed goats as commercial or as meat.
> 
> Flaws happen to the best of us and when we least expect it.


I will say it is way more of an issue with diary goats than meat goats. The dairy industry was worked so hard to get extra teats out that I just think it’s smart idea to avoid the issue when there are plenty of better options out there. You’re right flaws happen to the best of us and we certainly shouldn’t thrash ourselves if something happens to show up in something we bred. But to knowingly buy what is a big problem in diary goats doesn’t seem wise for the long term goals of a breeding program.


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## daisymay (Feb 13, 2017)

its just frustrating because so many breeders have had teat dq's so you try to avoid those lines then another line that you thought was good for that issue it pops up too...
one breeder iknow just decided to get rid of the whole line. her buck ended up producing grandkids with teat dq's. still dont know where he got it from. 
So she bought a totally different line of buck and guess what.... she has had a few kids born with teat dq's from him! ithink she probably has 20ish does. 

i do know some breeders wont tell you of any defects as it might ruin there image.


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## Sfgwife (Feb 18, 2018)

daisymay said:


> yes sorry they bought his as a kid for that much. He has excellent lines and his kids are preety nice but that dang teat gene... you just never know when its going to pop up...i believe he has at leat 6 siblings(different ages) and i found 4 so far that hasnt had the issue.


the breeder should have bought him back from who bought him!


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## daisymay (Feb 13, 2017)

Why? He doesn’t have any faults?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I agree. ☝

The breeder sold a buck who had clean teats. Any of you could of been in the same situation. Paid a lot for him too.

So where did the flaws come from?
Either in the bucks lines or the does lines somewhere.
No one knows from where.
What if it isn’t the buck and is one of the OP’s does? Hmm

As was said, occasionally dairy breeds throw bad teats, even with good teats.
We just don’t allow the buck and the doe to pair up again. So we try to stop the flaw to occur again.

We can only do, what we can do, with goats. Some may have other options for a new buck while with others, we cannot. Please put yourself in OP’s position.

I know, flawed teats are not allowed in the registry. Just don’t register those.
Some people don’t want registered, they just want a milk goat.
Even with flaws, they can be milked.

If they can feed their kids, the flawed does who are not registered, that is all that matters right?

I know, meat goats are different when it comes to teat structures.
However, the buck in question is clean teated.
I am sorry we don’t all agree.


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## CountyLineAcres (Jan 22, 2014)

I agree with Pam.

There are likely several genes responsible for teat structure and flaws appear to be inherited in a recessive manner. That means, trying to find a buck that’ll never throw a DQ is like finding a needle in a haystack.

Unnecessary culling and bottlenecking breeds will always cause more damage in the long run.

20 kids isn’t a big sample size. Especially since all three does were either related to each other or related to the buck. That would be a poor sample to base a cull decision on. It takes two to tango, and teat faults DO come from the doe side as well. The does that threw these DQ’s are just as responsible.

If he is a high quality buck that’ll improve your herd, then simply cull the kids with visible teat faults and breed/sell only the kids with clean 1+1. That’s the most responsible practice you can do in dairy rather than shooting for an impractical goal you can’t see.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I agree ☝


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## daisymay (Feb 13, 2017)

thank you all! i do appreciate all the feedback!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

No problem.


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