# Doe delivered still born.....



## browervillegoats (Oct 29, 2014)

Ok so I just missed the birth of a still born. Baby still warm when I got here and it's 10 out now! This is our first baby. How long before the doe if she's going to have a second? And how long until I should expect her to pass the after birth??? Sucky day for sure. Thanks!!


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## Fillyfrenzy (Jun 10, 2013)

browervillegoats said:


> Ok so I just missed the birth of a still born. Baby still warm when I got here and it's 10 out now! This is our first baby. How long before the doe if she's going to have a second? And how long until I should expect her to pass the after birth??? Sucky day for sure. Thanks!!


Sorry for the loss, yes it stinks...

Has she finished kidding yet? If you are not sure, look at this link on how to "bounce" the doe and feel for more kids: http://fiascofarm.com/goats/bouncing.html

As far as the afterbirth, I think it should be completely expelled by 24 hours post-kidding.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I'm so sorry you had a stillborn. Usually they have them fairly quickly. Were there anymore or has she started passing the placenta yet?


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## browervillegoats (Oct 29, 2014)

No more. She hasn't passed her placenta yet either. I "bumped" her and didn't feel anymore kids. She's eating and drinking. Happy overall. Could it be that she expelled it already and ate it before I got there? The baby was still quite warm when I got to her. It was clean and she was licking it. For my first kid this really sucks. Thanks.


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## 4seasonsfarm (Jan 22, 2014)

I'm so sorry was it for sure a stillborn? It can take up to a day to pass the afterbirth. One lady on here told me to give the doe molasses water, and it helps a lot!


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## browervillegoats (Oct 29, 2014)

I can't be certain it was still born but it was all crumpled up and not any signs that it tried to move. Crap crap! I'll check out the molasses water and get that to her just for good measure. Thank you.


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

Don't beat yourself up. It is sad your first baby is gone, but not your fault. 
Stuff happens and we just can't control everything. 

Watch the doe, she certainly could have eaten it. If you can, milk out the colostrum, that
will signal her body to start shrinking the uterus. If she hasn't passed the placenta, milking
can help start the process.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I am so sorry. 

Things happen like that unfortunately. 

I agree watch her, if 2 weeks go by and she is not sick, she must of passed the afterbirth.
Did you check all the stall under hay ect.
If she did not pass the afterbirth, she will soon become very ill and stop eating.

You will have to dry her off and milk her when needed to keep her from getting mastitis.


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## browervillegoats (Oct 29, 2014)

Talked with the vet this morning and her opinion is that she had the kid earlier and cleaned out before I got there. She was almost laying in the kid which is why it was still so warm. IDK. The doe is acting perfect except she's looking for the kid and smells it on me. I let her out with the rest of the group this morning after watching her brought the night. Slept eating pooping and peeing like normal. I should milk her though you think. Never done that before but certainly will do what needs to be done.

On the flip side and the kid died because of he cold, how do others keep their does when they don't have an area that's heated? Are they smart enough to go near a heated area to deliver? Say the stall they were in had a heated corner. Would that work 9 times out of 10? She wasn't due until the end of next month but I have 2 others due that time now and am a bit anxious about not going through this again if it was due to the cold. Thanks!!!


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## packhillboers (Feb 2, 2011)

Its so hard when this happens. We had our first loss last year after 4 years of kidding.


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## dreamacresfarm2 (May 10, 2014)

If she was for sure not due until next month then the kid was too premie to survive and you could not have prevented the death.


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## browervillegoats (Oct 29, 2014)

Talked with the vet this morning and her opinion is that she had the kid earlier and cleaned out before I got there. She was almost laying in the kid which is why it was still so warm. IDK. The doe is acting perfect except she's looking for the kid and smells it on me. I let her out with the rest of the group this morning after watching her brought the night. Slept eating pooping and peeing like normal. I should milk her though you think. Never done that before but certainly will do what needs to be done.

On the flip side and the kid died because of he cold, how do others keep their does when they don't have an area that's heated? Are they smart enough to go near a heated area to deliver? Say the stall they were in had a heated corner. Would that work 9 times out of 10? She wasn't due until the end of next month but I have 2 others due that time now and am a bit anxious about not going through this again if it was due to the cold. Thanks!!!


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## Cactus_Acres (Sep 24, 2013)

I will be honest - a cheap baby monitor can be the best way to save kids in cold weather. I have both a baby monitor and a video camera over my kidding stalls.

Just this morning, my husband woke me up and told me that it sounded like Silvie was pushing (she was our only doe who hadn't kidded yet). I grabbed my iPad off my nightstand, and looked at the video feed. She had the head of one kid out. Turns out she had two kids trying to be born at the same time. The tinier doeling was headed out first, presenting with just her head, and legs tucked back. Cold and dangling her head out. The larger doeling had gotten her head past the pelvic bone too. Neither had a leg forward. I havent delivered this presentation before, so we headed to the vet. I know she had started productive labor after 4, as I checked on her then (same clump of mucus crud stuck to her then as the previous evening, no stringy stuff). I went out to assist with delivery at 545. Had we not had that monitor on, it may have been another hour or more before I would have checked on her. Once they are dry, they generAlly do pretty well. Hence the monitor, to hear the sounds of does going into labor so that you can be present to dry off the kids.

When I went to the vet, the first kid presenting appeared dead, being cold, not moving, swollen head, swollen tongue. She was dangling out for an unknown amount of time prior to me getting out there, then like ten or so minutes it took to realize I couldn't do this myself, and another15-20 minutes that it took to drive to the vet. He pushed back the other and delivered her. Guess who is sleeping in a plastic tub right next to me right now? He said there might be a spark, a small movement he saw out of her, so I grabbed a towel and went to work. Didn't give much hope for her at that time, but said I ought to try. I learned today that unless it is decomposed, to rub the kid and see what happens. She is a weaker kid, but I am bottle feeding her. Momma has enough milk for all of them, no problems there. Not guaranteed that this one will make it, but she has been given a fighting chance. No judgement on how you handled this, I just wanted to share a very recent experience almost confusing unresponsive with dead. 

Turns out our doe had triplets in there, and the two larger kids were behind the small one in the birth queue.


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## Goat_in_Himmel (Jun 24, 2013)

Yeah, that's got to suck, to lose your first kid before it even arrived. Like dreamacres says, if the kid was a month early, there is nothing you could have done to save it. Was it fully formed, or looked like it had some "finishing" to do? 

Do milk out the mama (a) that will stimulate the uterus to expel the afterbirth and (b) colostrum comes handy sometimes. You can put it in a ziploc and freeze it. If she has any milk, that is, if this is a premature birth?


I'm sure your other does will be fine, assuming they carry to term. Make a draft-free area where they can go, or else take them to a draft-free pen when it looks like they're ready to kid. Make sure they have hay there, and water. You can make sure that mama dries the kids off, and can help her finish the job. There are pictures on here of kid barrels heated by ordinary light bulbs, or just dog carriers insulated with straw bales stacked around them. You can improvise.


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## browervillegoats (Oct 29, 2014)

Thanks everyone for the advise with this. At the time the little guy was clearly gone and I did think about trying but became more focused on the doe. The buck was fully formed. Was traditional boer colored with a good amount of brown fur but very little white fur covering him. Eyes seemed to be stuck shut. I've recounted and double counted he dates again and she was 3 weeks early. This is the same doe hat I have in another post where she has a sore spot on her udder that we've been treating.

I milked her out tonight. He sore side of her udder I wasn't able to milk out completely but she was certainly relieved. I can now cross that off my bucket list.

We crafted a hut inside the stall and I now have the other 2 does that are due in 3 weeks in there. 2 heat lamps in there so the cold factor is reduced I feel. It maybe early to start locking them up but after yesterday I'm not taking chances.

Sorry to hear about others troubles with kidding but in the other hand it's comforting to know it happens to others too! Learned so much this past year with these goats and this forums. Love them to pieces. I've tried a baby monitor but loose signal due to it being a metal shed. Going to get creative this weekend though.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good job milking her. 
Keep an eye on the udder she may fill again, relieve her as needed. You say you couldn't milk all out on one side? How did the milk look, normal, bloody, clumpy, stringy and is her udder hot, hard or lumpy?

Feed less quality hay, no alfalfa or just a small amount, little to no grain. 

As to the stillborn, if it was that early, it definitely wouldn't of made it. Also if the kid was warm, that kid was just born, they cool off really fast being lifeless or cannot move well(weak). 

The doe will take 2 weeks or so to clean out, so I disagree with the vet.

Doe's won't go to a warm spot to kid. A video camera is a good solution and to keep them in an area where it has good thick bedding and out of drafts.
Then place the kids at a heat source, such as a heat lamp ect. in a bonding pen.

It is crucial for a newborn to get on their feet as soon as possible, so they can get first colostrum, this warms them up. Full bellies are good, empty one's kill quickly in cold weather. If they cannot get up quick enough and it is cold out, they will go to sub temp real quick. If they cannot get up or even if they do and I am there or find they have been born, I feel the inside of their mouths, if they are warm, I feed the babies with a syringe (no needle) 2 to 4 filled of 12cc syringe for my boer, if it is in the middle of the night and cold it is up to 4, I will feed it very slowly so I ensure they get it, then will try to introduce the teat to them as well or in some situations come back in 2 hours. If they have cold mouths, I get a temp, those are usually sub temp, I go warm them up in the house, when I get them to 100 degree's minimum, I will then feed colostrum from syringe momma's colostrum in that situation. Then wrap the kid in a towel and take the kid back out to momma and try to get it to latch onto the teat. You can put a sweater on them if you have no heating source or have heat lamp ect for them to get under..


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