# Yearling doe looks toothless and hoof trimming advice



## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

So I have this doe, Missy. She is a year and 2 months old. about 8 months ago, i noticed she had lost her 2 front teeth. then a few months afterwards, i noticed two more teeth were gone. 

there are pieces of teeth in the gum, but i can't be sure if they're new teeth or old teeth that are leftover. nothing seems to have grown for a while, but when i looked today, it seems like the 4 baby teeth that are left shifted further back...maybe to make room for the new teeth?? anything i can do to help her with her teeth? she isn't in pain or anything, and she eats just fine...just wondering if this is normal. 

i tried taking a picture, but it's hard to hold down a goat!! attached is the best that i could have done.

also, i'm not sure how to trim her hooves. the tips of the toes curl in. is there a way for me to trim them to help correct it? she also likes to stand on the heel of her hind legs...anything i can do to fix it?

thanks for your help!


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

Not really much you can do about curled toes, curled toes are genetic. Breed up and monitor feet closely, they can get out of hand and get worse (I'm sure you won't let that occur). 

As for teeth? Can't really help much in that area but I do know they lose teeth as with other mammals.


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

I thought there would be a way to trim the toes so they start growing straight....

anyone know anything about my teeth situation? she's almost all gums!


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

Is she getting enough calcium with her feed and minerals? At her age, her adult teeth should be there already... does she have loose minerals? I ask because her lack of teeth would make it impossible for her to get what she needs from a block


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

My doe lost some baby teeth at a year old -- and the curled toes can straighten out. Clip them like you would a normal hoof, it should be okay.


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

Thanks ThreeHavens!


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

When I was new to goats, I let one of my doe's hooves got a wee bit too long and it started to curl. I began correctively trimming, and have seen great improvement. Her kids have no issues.


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

how did you correctively trim? I've been trying to take down some of the inner heel, and take more down by the toe. what else can I do?


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

Hers looks like it's just going to be a clip as you go. I have two does with thin curled inside claws. Both same daddy. Can't really do much else for them other than keep a good eye on em and trim as needed. I'll see if I can grab a pic or two for ya this afternoon.


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## ptgoats45 (Nov 28, 2011)

For the teeth, are you using a mineral block, or any kind of block? I have heard of goats (and sheep) having premature tooth loss due to eating on blocks because they are constantly scraping their teeth on them. Those teeth don't look normal at all to me for a 1 year old.


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

we have loose minerals, but she likes to eat bark. maybe that's what's making her teeth fall out?

no...they don't look normal, but they don't seem to be slowing down her eating. what can i do about them?


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## GTAllen (Jul 22, 2012)

That is a bad broken mouth. You need to trim more off the hoof walls and level the frog with the inside part between the toes. Keep your angle correct with the top of the hoof. Make sure the hooves are level. While you are trimming place the foot down on a flat surface. Be careful and don't take too much off the heal.


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

Thanks. Yea...her teeth are horrible. she looks like a hockey player.....


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

oh, and fyi - this is the best mineral supplement that I can find down here.....


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## cybercat (Oct 18, 2007)

What are you doing for copper?


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## OwnedByTheGoats (Mar 7, 2013)

Yeah, what about copper? I see that sheep can eat that, too. That means it contains no copper. That could be why you have the problems. This is what my almost yearling goat's teeth look like. You can see them just at the bottom.  She posed for this pic.


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

i knoooowwww!!!!!!! I've been doing copper sulphate 2x per week, tiny pinch into her food.

trust me. i'm fighting copper issues. there is NNOOOO copper here. no goat mineral, no bolus, NOTHING! i haven't had time to go to the ministry of ag to see if i can have someone mail it to me without having it confiscated at customs.

someone suggested i give my girl Red Cell which has some copper in it, so i started that yesterday.

there is a copper deficiency issue with all goats all over the island, but zero people seem to know that it's an issue in goats. entire country...seemingly no one but me know about this copper thing for goats. what gives???


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

OwnedByTheGoats said:


> Yeah, what about copper? I see that sheep can eat that, too. That means it contains no copper. That could be why you have the problems. This is what my almost yearling goat's teeth look like. You can see them just at the bottom.  She posed for this pic.


i wish my little yearling has pretty teeth like yours!!!!


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## lovinglife (Jun 6, 2013)

Cow minerals have copper, can you get some of that? OR order in some good mineral?


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

I've tried looking for cow mineral, but the places I've been to also doesn't seem to have any. there is a cow mineral block that i tried with my girls, but they don't like it (too much salt). i would order, but i think the cost would be way too high. this weekend at the farmers market i'm going to ask the organic dairy farm what they do for their cows, and see if they bolus them if i can get a bolus off of them. but i'm not going to be too hopeful about any of that....

there is pig mineral that has copper in it, but i'm not sure if i can feed that to the goats. next time i'm at the feed store i can take pictures of all the mineral options and get your opinions on them. but from what I've seen, this is the only option.

next time i'm on the mainland, i'm going to bring some boluses back with me, but that won't be for months, and i dont' think they sell them in Canada (tried looking online and nothing). no plans on travelling to the US, and no American friends are planning a trip down anytime soon.

i'm going to try to go to the ministry of ag tmr and ask about someone mailing me the bolus. hopefully it'll be no problem.

sigh...so hard to get stuff you need living here...for goats and for people!


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## loggyacreslivestock (Mar 5, 2013)

So sorry you can't get what you need. I am thankful I have a good goat vet and access to many stores/feed mills/ farmers for help. This site is so wonderful! I hope they help you tomorrow. Maybe your vet can order it for you and you can just pay them?? Like medically necessary or something??


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

we'll see. I've dealt with the main large animal vets, and none have been helpful so far. all have scoffed at the idea that a goat could be copper deficient. it's ridiculous.

yes, be thankful you have a good goat vet and access!!

hopefully my girl's teeth grows in soon...i can't bear to look at them anymore! poor thing.


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces (Apr 7, 2013)

It looks more like bad tooth decay to me. It definatley shouldn't be like that ever. I have a doe that is almost 11 and her teeth are great, still white. She has 4 of her 8 bottom teeth left, but it doesn't slow her eating.

As for the copper, can you get boluses from an online supply?


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

Little-Bits-N-Pieces-ADG said:


> It looks more like bad tooth decay to me. It definatley shouldn't be like that ever. I have a doe that is almost 11 and her teeth are great, still white. She has 4 of her 8 bottom teeth left, but it doesn't slow her eating.
> 
> As for the copper, can you get boluses from an online supply?


tooth decay??? what can i do with that??

most places won't ship copper outside of the US. and i don't know the import limitations of it here if it comes by mail. easiest for me is if i have a friend coming from the US, to ship from them. just spoke with a friend and she said she maybe going to the US for a short visit. hopefully that's the case and i can FINALLY get some copper into my girls!


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces (Apr 7, 2013)

I don't think that you can fix it....

But do you have any friends or family in the US, Hawaii, Alaska, Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico, Guam, Canada, or Military bases?

Jeffers ships to all those places. If you have friends in any of those places you could have Jeffers ship copper to them, and they could ship it to you.

http://www.jefferspet.com/copasure-for-sheep-and-goats/camid/LIV/cp/0040894/


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

they won't ship to Canada, but i'll wait and see if my friend is headed back to the mainland. she's only really gone for a short period.

i just fear that the stuff will get here, and get confiscated by customs.


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces (Apr 7, 2013)

I'm pretty sure they ship products to canada, just not vaccines anymore.


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

i emailed both Jeffers and Valley Vet Supplies recently about shipping to Barbados, and they both said they don't ship any supplements outside of the US, Canada included.  i was hoping to get some shipped to Ontario as i'm heading there later in the year, but that kind of ruled it out.

i'll figure out what the regulations are here. someone on this forum already offered to ship some to me, so i just have to drive my butt down to the place to ask. i'd do it over the phone, but i doubt they'll know what i'm asking and i'll have to go down there anyway. sigh!


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

the picture makes it hard to see well.but...is the tooth remaing black or is that a shadow? the front teeth that are gone look broken..but not rotten...those should have been her baby teeth she will get her adult teeth but if the baby broke off early you will have to wait for them, my concern would be the pieces left in her mouth could become infected or painful..goat begin to loose their baby teeth by age 1 1/2 and start with the two front teeth and work their way back...by age four all eight front teeth should be adult...I would see if the remaining pieces are loose...make sure they are not actually the adult teeth coming in...keep an eye on them and watch for infection...her body might just pop the peices right out..here is a link to show the teeth and ages of loses and so forth....also I cant imagin how fustrating it must be to not only to get meds and copper and so forth you need but to have vets so udderly clueless of basic goat care...hopefully some one can get you copper bolus..: ) best wishes
http://goat-link.com/content/view/14/#.UbDuePaDR68


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

Thanks Cathy!

i'll try to see if they're wiggly later tonight. she HATES having her mouth open, which is why it was so hard to take the picture! they've been gone a while and she doesn't seem like it hurts her. still stripping bark off everything!


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces (Apr 7, 2013)

nchen7 said:


> i emailed both Jeffers and Valley Vet Supplies recently about shipping to Barbados, and they both said they don't ship any supplements outside of the US, Canada included.  i was hoping to get some shipped to Ontario as i'm heading there later in the year, but that kind of ruled it out.
> 
> i'll figure out what the regulations are here. someone on this forum already offered to ship some to me, so i just have to drive my butt down to the place to ask. i'd do it over the phone, but i doubt they'll know what i'm asking and i'll have to go down there anyway. sigh!


That is so crazy, this is what Jeffers told me,

*Penny: *Good afternoon, how may I help you?
*Me: *Can i get shipping to canada?
*Penny: *Sure
*Penny: *When a Canadian order is placed via the telephone or online, the order is processed at this end to determine the shipping costs. Someone here will then call you and get your final approval before the order goes out.
*Me: *Do you ship the copper boluses to canada?
*Penny: *I'll check
*Penny: *There are no shipping restrictions on Copasure
*ME: *Thank you!

(I changed my name to Me)

So yes you should be able to get them to canada.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

weird....


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces (Apr 7, 2013)

Yes.... Very....

here is where they ship to right from their site

*Important shipping information for customers OUTSIDE of the Continental US:* Shipping and freight charges to addresses in Hawaii, Alaska, Virgin Islands, Puerto Rico, Guam, Canada, APO Box, AA Box, or AE Box cannot be determined until the actual time of shipment. We will send you a second email confirmation, including these additional charges, when your order is shipped. If you would like to know your total charge PRIOR to shipment, you will be given a chance to provide your contact information during checkout. *Canadian Customers:* Please remit all orders in US funds. Duty, GST and Brokerage Fees, PST (if applicable) will be collected at delivery.* Additional charges added by delivery service or Customs cannot be refunded by Jeffers!*

They do ship outside of the US! I don't know why they told you they didn't....

I spoke with 2 people at Jeffers about this, they said they ship outside the US like they state in the Shipping Information page, and there is no restrictions on copper capsules or boluses.​


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

weird...why would they tell me different? 

anyway...good news! friend is going to miami for a few days next week, so i'll be shipping to her! yay!! copper for my girls soon!!!


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

good news....at least now you know Jeffers can ship ..so maybe check with them again for future needs...Weird..you may have gotton a newby who didnt know what he was talking about...


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## nchen7 (Feb 25, 2013)

update!

so I've been looking in Missy's mouth a lot, and she hates it. One of her adult tooth has grown in! great news! so I picked off the baby tooth that was dangling this morning, and again she hated me for that.

but I also did notice that other tooth has been cracked off. maybe when she was at her other home she didn't get enough minerals, or didn't get enough when she came to me (she was 5 months old) b/c I was new and didn't know anything about giving goats minerals? doesn't seem to stop her from eating, so that's a bonus... guess i'll just have to wait for years for all her other teeth to grow in.....


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