# Treasure’s waiting thread



## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Today, Treasure is 9 days from day 145. 14 days from day 150. My dad finished a nice goat shelter for Treasure, Shamrock, Kicks, and Dandy to share. It will be a day pen they share until Treasure gets closer. We are putting up a five cattle panel round temporary pen for the girls to use during the day by the house. It will be lined with chicken wire to kid proof and keep the 4 ducks in. The girls will be cohabitating with my Saxony duck group. Shamrock’s kids grew up with these ducks climbing into their mom’s kidding stall when they were all new to the world. I think they’ll get along well. When Treasure’s kids are old enough, they will go back down to the kid proof pen after we expand its size.

Treasure is uddering up! It’s still small and wooly. I think it needs to at least triple in size. Next Tuesday is day 145. Her twin sister had her kids on day 150. I’m expecting between day 145-152. She doesn’t look quite close enough to suddenly kid. I really hope this batch is delivered on time and healthy for her! I know she wants her own kids.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)




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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Hope everything goes well!! What a NICE shelter!! Love it!


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

That shelter is awesome! Can't wait for the kids!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Here’s her cute, hairy udder.


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Awww, I just love little "baby" udders!


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

She's smiling with a pleased, contented look on her face. 💜


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Aww she does look content


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Just before the picture, she stole a little chicken feed off the ground I spilled scooping it into containers to bring out to the birds. I rubbed her head a little to let her know she wasn’t in trouble. She’s a cute goat for sure.


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## Goatastic43 (Jun 11, 2021)

Awe! Love that face (and udder too)! She looks like my Snowflake when she knows she’s cute and has ALL your attention!


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

Oh you think that smile is for cuteness? Noooo. Its a "I know something you dont. I know the doe code and you didnt read it!" Such a beautiful face.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

How cute.

Hopefully she didn’t get too much chicken feed, that would make her sick if she ate too much.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

toth boer goats said:


> How cute.
> 
> Hopefully she didn’t get too much chicken feed, that would make her sick if she ate too much.


No worries. It was just a tiny bit that fell from the scooper as I put it in the bucket. She thinks she got away with it, but it was just a trace dusting.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good to hear.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Hanging out with the goats today in their day pen and saw two bald eagles gliding low with the wind over my head. Goats are getting along great with the ducks. Bourbon red turkey hen, Annie, made her way over and into my lap for attention…Treasure is progressing normally which was my greatest hope for her. She is starting to hold her tail up and to the side, getting poochy, and I am starting to see changes to her ligaments. I felt a kid moving in her belly🥰 I don’t expect kids for the next three days, though. I bet she will kid next week overnight and try to sneakily have them. I will see it happen and be there! 👁👁


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Bald eagles are such amazing and powerful creatures!! Glad to hear everyone is getting alone nicely. It sounds and looks like Treasure is getting closer and what a nice udder she has started! Isn't it such an amazing experience to be able to feel the kids kicking inside of mama?!?! Can't wait to see the adorable little hostages she's hiding and I hope she will let you witness the birth of them. Good luck and happy kidding!! Praying everything continues to go well! 🥰😘


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

It kind of seems that her sides have dropped. She laid down, so I’m going to wait until she’s up and walk around to check her ligs. Udder and vulva say she’s got a bit of time left, but I know some goats change fast. I believe I will be constantly checking her tonight just in case.


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Her sides do look a little sunken in the picture.....have you checked her ligs yet?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Whenever she does kid, she is gonna get a good butt wiping when I clean her up. Her udder is filling a bit faster…but she’s not looking ready yet. Her ligs are barely there. She feels like my other moms did when they lost their mucus plugs. Her sides are sunken but look more or less sunken as I stare at her. She’s been doing a lot of big pregnancy stretches. She looks different than yesterday for sure! I just don’t know how long this will last until labor starts. She’s acting odd and hanging out by herself. I believe she is trying to hide it from me. It could be that the kids are working around in there making her uncomfortable and what I am seeing is just them moving. I can put my hand on the sunken spot on her side and push down. I would call her having kids in 24 hours if she had more udder development. I know some goats supposedly fill up quickly before they kid. Flora looked hollowed out for a few days before she suddenly went in labor after I checked her 30 minutes before and saw no signs. I’m going to be checking her a few times tonight just in case. Tomorrow will be 4 days from 145 days.


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

I believe I've read/heard that if you can still feel kids, then the doe won't deliver for at least 24 more hours. I also know some does don't fill their udder until after kidding, so who really who knows when they'll kid! The doe code I tell you. 🙄 She is looking really close though!! Tell Treasure we are all waiting to see her babies....oh wait...then she might keep them in longer. 😜


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## Goatastic43 (Jun 11, 2021)

Come on! Release your little “treasures” already!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

She’s about the same today. Drinking other goat’s urine and making buck faces, though.😝


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Emrcornerranch said:


> Drinking other goat’s urine and making buck faces, though.😝


Ewwww, Treasure you are NOT a buck!! Come on girl!! 😜 🤣


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

When she does have her wee ones! Please put pictures and add to our numbers on the 2021 Kidding Tally. We love to look at all the wee ones.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

The boys’ breeder retired from goats, so I took screen shots of my bucks’ sires’ pedigree info and pictures of them. I didn’t realize Cowboy’s dad is moonspotted. Cowboy’s grandpa is a reserve champion, and Leprechaun’s grandpa is moonspotted and an elite status buck with superior genetics with the ADGA. So fannnncy! Lep’s grandpa also has moon spots. I don’t know if that will ever carry over onto Lep’s kids. Can a buck still carry the moonspotted gene if they themselves don’t have moon spots? Just wondering how that works. The udders and teats of my bucks’ ancestors look great too! Hope my herd benefits.


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Sounds like Treasure should have some really nice kids!! Is Treasure registered? I'm not sure how moonspots are passed on...


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Dandy Hill Farm said:


> Sounds like Treasure should have some really nice kids!! Is Treasure registered? I'm not sure how moonspots are passed on...


All my Nigerians are registered. Working on getting the Nubians registered still. We might just do unregistered mini Nubians with the Nubian does. If it’s this hard to get the adult Nubians registered with their old owner, I imagine getting the kids registered will be even worse. I read that because the does were hers when she bred them, I will still need her to be a part of the process to register the kids. Was hoping I could get the moms registered and just breed them to a registered buck and accept that this group of kids would just not be registered. VERY happy my Nigerian Dwarfs breeders were so much better about this! The ADGA sent me my first kids’ papers without any mistakes. I’m so proud to see Dandy and Kicks’ papers! They’ve grown up to be so friendly. I can pretend to milk them, and they seem to enjoy it. LOL. As much as we’ve loved on the Nubian kids, they are not this friendly. Barley is almost this friendly and calm.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

My mom’s friend visited with her mother. Her mother grew up on a farm with over 400 sheep before their family immigrated to America. She can read the future with tea leaves supposedly. As she was leaving, she turned to me and said, “Your goat is going to have her babies tonight.” I don’t know how accurate she is but who knows??


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

What fun! That will be neat to find out. Did she say how many, or sexes? This could get fun..l ol l🙃


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Moers kiko boars said:


> What fun! That will be neat to find out. Did she say how many, or sexes? This could get fun..l ol l🙃


She didn’t say. Just got in the car, and left it at that. I don’t know if she said “baby” or “babies,” but I THINK she said plural. I said that I hope she waits until normal vet hours tomorrow just in case! 🤣 One way to find out if she was right. Now I’m REALLY neurotically watching my goat.


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Oooo, how exciting!! I hope she's right!!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

I will say she correctly guessed (knew) right away which of the four goats in the pen was pregnant. But I said she was due any day now, so it wasn’t hard to say she’s going to have kids tonight. 😄 Now I’m all excited. Her udder could sure fill some more, but vulva looks ready and sides have dropped.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

The prophecy was false.🤣😂


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Darn...that Darn Doe Code won Again! 😜😂🤣🤪😁🙃


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Moers kiko boars said:


> Darn...that Darn Doe Code won Again! 😜😂🤣🤪😁🙃


She was hiding under a wood shelf earlier she is meant to lay on and being weird, so I’m pretty sure she’s getting close. She was standing under it stretching acting like she was hiding. But she frequently acts like she has a screw loose. She’s back with the other goats acting more normal now. I was sure she was having contractions under there for a second! I bet nothing she has them tomorrow.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

As long as the wee ones are healthy and hungry, the wait is worth it. Ive had does go 160 days to deliver. Believe me, I understand the wait game. lol its frustrating! I had to keep telling myself, they aren't ready yet. Gods time...not mine.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)




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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Oh bummer. But I couldn't agree more with what @Moers kiko boars said!! It's all in His perfect timing. 🥰


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

I just want to be there when his perfect timing happens!😄 It’s harder when the goat has a prior history of pregnancy issues, isn’t it? This will be my 5th pregnant goat in labor, but I’m still really nervous about this one.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Treasure’s mumbling nonsense today. I can’t imagine her getting any weirder. I believe it’s today. “Bleh blehhehe blehhhhh.” Udder filled a bit last night, so it looks right. I don’t see a mucus plug yet. She’s doing something with her tail and feet stamping like she might be having light contractions. She’s also looking for kids to clean off, but stops in confusion, “Oh, I haven’t had them yet.” She’s going to be a great mom.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

🤣 That entire post cracked me up. I really hope today’s the day we get to see her babies!


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Ooo, I hope today is really THE day! I can't wait to see her kids!!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

The color of the discharge she just had is making me nervous. It doesn’t have a smell. I felt kid movement yesterday morning. I hope everything’s ok.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

It's scary yes but as long as she's not bleeding out.... may be soon here with that discharge, do you think it's the mucus plug?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

K.B. said:


> It's scary yes but as long as she's not bleeding out.... may be soon here with that discharge, do you think it's the mucus plug?


I think it might be? She had this kind of discharge last time.😬 There’s more coming out of her here and there as she lies down. It doesn’t look normal. Maybe it’s HER normal, but I don’t like it. My dad’s obnoxious Pink Floyd music is NOT helping my anxiety.
Edit: He turned the music off.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Oh, was it the same color as before? Keep an eye on her you may have kids soon!


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

I'm so anxious about my Molly too... just relax  and keep watching her! I'm sure she's fine


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

K.B. said:


> Oh, was it the same color as before? Keep an eye on her you may have kids soon!


It was the same color before but kids were mummified and had died about 2 months into pregnancy. I know at least one kid was fine and moving yesterday so fingers crossed.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Oh no! That's good you felt some movement yesterday then!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

K.B. said:


> Oh no! That's good you felt some movement yesterday then!


I would be freaking out right now if I hadn’t felt movement. I’m hoping they are all ok, but especially hoping one is alive.


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

How are things now? Hoping everything is (and will be) okay!!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Dandy Hill Farm said:


> How are things now? Hoping everything is (and will be) okay!!


I’m not sure. She sat like a dog a few times. She’s been arching her back funny. She finally gave two lip up pushes, and I thought she was getting close. Then, the turkeys appeared and she stopped progressing when a turkey flew in her pen. All’s quiet now, so I’m waiting for some more big pushes.


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

IMO, it sounds like she is in the early stages of labor. What do her ligaments feel like?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

The gross goo has stopped. I did try to put my hand in. She didn’t feel ready. I wanted to make sure there wasn’t a stuck kid right there, or help pull out a mummified fetus if that’s what’s happening again.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Watch her closely.

Has she been actually pushing?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

toth boer goats said:


> Watch her closely.
> 
> Has she been actually pushing?


I thought she was pushing hard but not pushing with all she’s got like they do when the kid is about to come out. Just lip up for a few seconds, legs out, looks at her back end, then it stops. She isn’t making noise when she’s pushing yet. I think she’s starting to push harder.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Is this goo string normal?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

She is in labor and has indeed been pushing, looks to be her water sack which has broke and what you see.

Wash up and go in and check to see if she if fully dilated and has a kid at the door. It may be positioned wrong. 

May be too, she hasn’t fully dilated and needs to be manually stimulated to do so. 

She looks like she needs help, her body even shows labor position.


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Praying everything goes well. 🙏


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)




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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

LIVE buckling!!


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Yay!! So glad he's alive! Do you think she's done?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

I had to push him back in and find his hoof. It was so difficult! She was tight! I was so happy when I felt teeth and he bit down on my finger.


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Good job!! So glad he's okay and you were able to get him out!! Again, great job helping!! 🤗👏


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

HES GOT WADDLES


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## Goatastic43 (Jun 11, 2021)

Yay! So glad he’s alive! Congratulations!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

She has two sacs. I’m waiting for her to push another. I don’t believe she could just have one. Maybe there is just this little guy.


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Has she had another yet?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

I thought she was having more contractions. Not much has changed. She’s very obsessed with her kid. When I think she might be pushing she goes and checks on her kid.


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Good to hear she is very attentive to her buckling!! Have you tried bumping her?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

I see three sacs. Could only one have developed into a kid or does anyone think there could be another kid?


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

You need to go in and feel around.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

So after they pass their placenta, can there still be another kid?


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Emrcornerranch said:


> So after they pass their placenta, can there still be another kid?


I believe so...but don't quote me on this. I agree with @ksalvagno you should go in to make sure there are no other kids.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

I went in and she started pushing out more placenta. I wasn’t able to reach in too far, but I didn’t feel anything else kid goat like. There are two new pinker sacs I stimulated her to begin to pass. They feel like they have bones in them. The bigger one you can tell was going to be a kid but stopped developing very early on. So she had two mummies and one live.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Aww that's too bad... how's the live one?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Nursing and squeaking. I’ve named him Pumpkin Spice. It seems he was REAL lucky!


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Cute we want pictures!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)




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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Omg what a mini me lol... cutie


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)




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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

His ears don’t know what they are yet.🥺So precious!


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

You got some cute pics  he's a doll, that's funny  his ears


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

K.B. said:


> You got some cute pics  he's a doll, that's funny  his ears


Treasure and I are so proud he’s here.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Congratulations to you and Treasure on the arrival of that miraculous and adorable little Pumpkin Spice. Good job for the 3 (three) of you with the birthing. Welcome to the world little one.


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## GoosegirlAsh (Mar 24, 2021)

Oh he is so cute and I love the name! Congratulations!!


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

Well done treasure. Well done goat mom. Welcome pumpkin spice. What a cutie.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Congratulations! He is so adorable. I love his ears. She seems like such a good mama. ️


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

She only passed half her placenta last night. She was making great progress but stepped on it. I saw she tore the placenta, but she still had one of the undeveloped kid sacs hanging, so I thought that would help pull the rest out. I just went in her about as far as I could go to see if I could stimulate her to pass the rest. It doesn’t fell like it can come out. It’s like it’s stuck on something and under tension. She’s trying to get it out after I went in. I had planned to get a shot of exceed tomorrow if lactating moms can have that. If I had something to start her contractions and help her push it out, I’d give it to her. She’s pushing, so I’m going to let her try. Maybe 30 minutes without any progress on her placenta, and I think I’m going to call an emergency vet to come out.


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Congrats!! Pumpkin Spice really is such a little pumpkin! Love his name, ears, and waddles. Do you know if he has blue eyes like daddy yet? So sorry to hear the others didn't make it to term, I wonder why Treasure has a hard time carrying kids full-term? I'm very thrilled to hear that you at least got one healthy and absolutely adorable kid from Treasure! 🥰 

Oh no, I hope everything will be okay and she will pass the other half of her placenta.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Dandy Hill Farm said:


> Congrats!! Pumpkin Spice really is such a little pumpkin! Love his name, ears, and waddles. Do you know if he has blue eyes like daddy yet? So sorry to hear the others didn't make it to term, I wonder why Treasure has a hard time carrying kids full-term? I'm very thrilled to hear that you at least got one healthy and absolutely adorable kid from Treasure! 🥰
> 
> Oh no, I hope everything will be okay and she will pass the other half of her placenta.


He does have his dad’s eyes.❤
She was bred the heat after she had her last nondeveloped kids because she slipped past my mom, and my mom couldn’t keep her from letting Cowboy out of his pen by pushing the fence. I wonder if she would have had normal kids if she had come into heat a few times, allowing her to fully recover. If she has partially developed kids whenever I decide to breed her again, I’ll know if this is just a trait of hers. She’d be a pet goat for us, and I’d try my best to keep any oopsies from happening. It’s really like half her placenta does not look healthy. I wonder if that’s a medical condition? I opened a sac with an underdeveloped kid, and it has ears, legs, and was going to be a doeling. It didn’t have any hair yet. Seems like it stopped around 2 months maybe?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

She had a shot of anti-inflammatory, exceed, and oxytocin. Vet did not feel any more kids, but he couldn’t go in far. He said because the two kids were mummified, it can take longer for the placenta to come out. He also agreed with me to give her over a full year and breed her one more time. If something like this happens again, she shouldn’t be bred again. Because she got bred the heat after she had her first mummified fetuses, that issue may have carried over. He asked if we had any other kiddings with mummies, but thankfully this seems to be an isolated issue with her. I’m so glad we have a live kid!


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Good you got a hold of a vet better to be safe... how are the 2 doing today besides that?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

I have not seen her eat or drink. No fever. She’s acting very off but tending well to her kid. He’s a great little spunky dude! Very active. He already has horn buds I can clearly feel.🙃 Here I was all worried he may be underdeveloped or something, but clearly he’s fine. Jumping around then napping. He is the cutest goat kid born so far.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

I also got to meet a different vet at this practice, and he seems very knowledgeable.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Oh no hopefully she eats... that's great news he seems to be healthy ... did the vet check him over as well? If he's acting spunky I'd say that's a great sign!


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Emrcornerranch said:


> I have not seen her eat or drink. No fever. She’s acting very off but tending well to her kid.





Emrcornerranch said:


> She had a shot of anti-inflammatory, exceed, and oxytocin.


Did she have some molasses water after birthing? Probiotics, B Complex and some electrolyte water in another bucket to keep her hydrated, aid her rumen, give an energy boost, and stimulate her appetite.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Check her ketone levels.
Also she may need some calcium.

Selenium deficiency can also cause them to hold afterbirth.

What is her temp?

I agree on probiotics and forties vit b complex.

How is her inner lower eyelid area?
Is she anemic?
I am hoping her uterus isn’t torn.
Did you try to pull the afterbirth out?


Do you have any areas with grass or tree/shrubleaves safe for her and her baby to go to?
She may start nibbling something out there. Take her and baby out if weather permits. May make her feel better. We need to get her to eat. Unless she doesn’t want to go anywhere, then don’t force her. 


Otherwise getting alfalfa pellets about a 1/4 cup and water in a blender making a slurry so you can feed her slowly with a big syringe, new turkey baster or something to get some nutrients down her. She also needs water or electrolytes.

You did a good job.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

She drank warm water with nutridrench and electrolytes last night and nibbled a bit at some food. I’m going to make her another batch of the same mixture. I’m also going to giver her some probiotic. I bet the anti-inflammatory will really help her feel better. I’m also going to lower her food and put in near where she keeps laying to entice her to eat her normal morning ration.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

I’m also going to grab some honeysuckle and hickory leaves. Those are some of her favorites. Her temp was 103. She did not want to leave her pen when she went to the vet. She’s sleepy but she isn’t weak. She doesn’t look pale. I think she’s stressed and exhausted. I’ll let you guys know if she eats.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

She just ate three animal crackers.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

👍


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Good she ate something atleast


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

She is not eating for me. She hates me right now after the vet visit. I gave her probiotic and vitamin gels. The oxytocin is kicking in, so I think she’s feeling more uncomfortable. Famacha is the same as before she kidded. I hope she doesn’t prolapse from pushing.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

I hope so too ....


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Do you have white pine trees and/or willow trees? The needles and leaves from those trees are my goats' favorite, maybe Treasure would like them too. Red raspberry leaves are another favorite here and are good for goats towards the end of pregnancy and/or after delivering. My goats also go crazy for Chinese Elm tree leaves. Hope Treasure passes her placenta and perks up soon!! 💙💜💙


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

She’s eating maple leaves, hickory leaves, and honeysuckle. She still won’t eat her morning ration. She doesn’t seem to want to eat any leaves that I have directly touched. 😅


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Emrcornerranch said:


> She’s eating maple leaves, hickory leaves, and honeysuckle. She still won’t eat her morning ration. She doesn’t seem to want to eat any leaves that I have directly touched. 😅


That's good to hear!! Why are goats such picky eaters? 😅


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

I’m treating her for ketosis just in case. I’m syringe feeding her water and a bit of apple juice every two hours and giving her a mixture of corn syrup and molasses. I also give her probiotics. She’s gotten b gel a few times today. I noticed after my dad and I walked her and her kid that she seemed to be doing better. I think walking outside to see her sister really helped lift her spirits. She’s very alert when she’s out. There is a sweet floral smell coming from her vulva. I smelled her urine, but I believe her pee smelled like normal. Since the walk, she’s done a lot less teeth grinding. She’s still not eating right. She seems to have more of an appetite after I drench her. She’s been eating a few black raspberry leaves, honeysuckle leaves, locust leaves, and maple leaves when I coax her into eating.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

I’m starting to put honeysuckle leaves in her mouth, and she chews them up and swallows. I haven’t seen her chewing her cud at all today. I also did give her some calcium drench around noon.

She just drank a little water on her own for the first time today. No one else can smell this sweet smell. It’s so weird. It kind of reminds me of antifreeze.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Have you given her flat dark beer?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

ksalvagno said:


> Have you given her flat dark beer?


I don’t know why I don’t have that on hand. I think I’ll get some tomorrow. I wiped her down and the smell was on her legs, udder, between her udder and thighs, and tail. Im doubting it’s urine now. I wish they’d given her a uterine flush with antibiotics at the vet. But I didn’t know she was going to have stayed the same by now. She might be going back to the vet tomorrow. Her temp is 102 so that’s great!


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

How is she doing today?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Temp is 102.3 which is reassuring. I really don’t like how *dull she is. She’s shaking a bit now too.she only gets up to nurse the kid.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Sounds like she needs to go back to the vet. Something isn't right. I'd have her ultrasounded.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

She has a vet appointment at 2 this afternoon. If she changes, I’ll call them back and get in as an emergency patient.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Poor thing. I’m glad you’re getting her to the vet today. Let us know how it goes.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Poor girl, but she is getting up for pumpkin spice to feed?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Her poop. Good thing she IS pooping, but she grunts she poops like it’s difficult because she’s so sore.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

And you are giving her probios? And electrolytes? She looks a little constipated


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

K.B. said:


> Poor girl, but she is getting up for pumpkin spice to feed?


I couldn’t get milk to come out of the right side, which he prefers. It feels less full. The left still has milk. He just nursed. My back up plan is to hold Shamrock as he nurses if Treasure can’t make milk. I don’t think Treasure is making as much milk as she should. She just drank a decent amount of water. More water than normal comes out of her mouth than a normal goat when she drinks. I’m going to try to keep her up and active, bring her more leaves, try to get her to eat more hay, give her more of the nutridrench/corn syrup/molasses mixture, and probiotics. Should I give her more calcium drench?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

K.B. said:


> And you are giving her probios? And electrolytes? She looks a little constipated


I’ve been giving her probiotics. I was giving her electrolyte water. I’ll drench her with some. She started coughing after I gave her some water last night, and I worried I was doing more harm than good. I backed off overnight. She is not better, so I’m going to try harder with what I’m doing.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

I’m working on getting her dark beer.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Is there any kind of dark beer that’s better? Sweeter? Just any kind?


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Emrcornerranch said:


> Good thing she IS pooping, but she grunts she poops like it’s difficult because she’s so sore.


Pooping is a good thing, you're right about that. Speaking as a mother, it is uncomfortable having a BM for the first several days after giving birth. Simple anatomy, the birth canal and rectum are top to bottom from each other. Pressure and swelling from birthing will make a BM more sluggish to pass. More fiber and liquids helps to soften the fecal matter for easier passage. 🥴


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Emrcornerranch said:


> Is there any kind of dark beer that’s better? Sweeter? Just any kind?


Guinness or Becks, if the store carries them.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

She may be drying up, as in milk because she isn’t getting proper calcium feed and grain to support what is being nursed.

Do you have alfalfa hay?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

toth boer goats said:


> She may be drying up, as in milk because she isn’t getting proper calcium feed and grain to support what is being nursed.
> 
> Do you have alfalfa hay?


I still have not been able to find a good alfalfa hay here. I have alfalfa Timothy mix, but it’s more on the grass side and less alfalfa than I wanted. I’ve given her three drenches of calcium drench since yesterday morning. She just had one about 30 minutes ago. I’m going to make her an alfalfa pellet slurry. Do I use a blender or let the pellets soak in water and mash?


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

That's would I would do!


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Poor Treasure, and poor you! I'm very sorry to hear things aren't going as smooth as they could/should. Hope she hangs in there for you and little Pumpkin Spice. I also hope the vet is able to find out exactly what's wrong. Keep up all the great, hard work!! I know Treasure couldn't be in better hands. 💜💙💜


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

She ate a tiny bite of a weed then laid down in the grass at the vet. They are very concerned. She is no longer calling to her kid but let’s him nurse. Shamrock is going to be his milk source or one of our other moms. I can also bottle feed him. I want to see if Shamrock might just let him nurse. I’m preparing myself for if we lose Treasure. 

Vet gave her banamine, corid, a “shot of dewormer,” iv fluids with electrolytes. I am going to give her banamine once tonight and 2 times tomorrow. I’m also going to give her iv fluids once a day. She’ll get the rest of the Corid over the next few days as well. Farm prices are nice here! It only cost $79 today and that’s with the needles, iv fluid bags, and stuff.

He said her prognosis does not look good if she hasn’t improved tomorrow. She is able to walk, had no fever, is peeing (a little), scouring, but still has some fight to her. He believes themummified fetuses and bad placenta have given her an infection. She might also be in a lot of pain.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

He was also happy I mentioned dark beer and was consulting with people on here. It’s up to Treasure now to respond to the things I’m doing. I know when you have animals, you lose animals. That is a part of life. It will be very sad whenever it does happen. I hope we don’t lose Treasure, but I am preparing myself.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Oh Sweetie, I am so sorry you, Treasure and Pumpkin Spice are going through this. Virtual hugs and snuggles for you all.


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## GoosegirlAsh (Mar 24, 2021)

I'm sorry to hear that Treasure's not doing well. It sounds like you are taking very good care of her. Hoping she pulls through!


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Omg I'm sorry...  I hope she pulls threw this.... be prepared, I'd almost start supplementing pumpkin now with the bottle, atleast get him used to the idea. .. I'm sure she'll be fine praying


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

How's she doing tonight!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

She got up and walked to find her kid when we had him out, but now that she’s lying back down…She’s looking worse. She’s adamantly spitting out honeysuckle. She’s moaning. I’ve been giving her about three drenches of the alfalfa water mush every other hour. She’s getting 30cc corn syrup and molasses every two hours. The beer made her burp. I’m going to give her a little less of it next dose. I thought we had a major break through when she ate some alfalfa mush off a spoon with interest. She hasn’t done it since. She is peeing what looks like blood. It is nauseatingly sweet smelling to my nose.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Omg I'm crying  reading this blood!  the burp was probably a good thing though...


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Kid did nurse off a bottle though. I know he’s getting nutrition. So there is that.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Omg that's good!


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

@Emrcornerranch 


Emrcornerranch said:


> She’s getting 30cc corn syrup and molasses every two hours.





Emrcornerranch said:


> She is peeing what looks like blood. It is nauseatingly sweet smelling to my nose.


2 (two) things to consider. Sweet smelling urine can be a sigh of hyperglycemia (high blood sugar) in humans. The only information I have been able to find concerns ketone levels and hypoglycemia (low blood sugar). Do you have any ketone test strips, or can you get some from the drug store, or pharmacy section at WalMart, etc.? Just takes a dribble of urine, and match the color to the color strip that comes with the kit. And the bloody colored urine might be coming from her vulva, not her bladder. There is a bit of a bloody tinted discharge after delivery and when you pee, the urine gets a reddish look to it.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

I started her on the corn syrup mixture after I noticed the sweet smell of her backend. At first, I worried I was giving her diabetes but remembered she already had that weird smell before I started. My heads getting fuzzy. As with everything, I worry I am doing something that might make her worse. It’s very weird no one else in my family can smell it. It’s getting stronger. I actually feel nauseous when I am in the pen with her. Her breath seems to have a bit of the same smell as well.

I don’t have ketone strips but after reading about ketosis, I think I will have them on hand in the future. If she is with us tomorrow, I will get them and test her. I saw her pee what looked like dark red blood. It would be nice if it’s just her uterus healing.


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## Goatastic43 (Jun 11, 2021)

Oh I’m so sorry @Emrcornerranch! Praying she makes a break through!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I'm so sorry. I hope she pulls through.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Please pull through treasure


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

Poor treasure. Whatever the outcome you are a great goat mom. I know its hard and I know its going to drain you. We are all praying for treasure to make it through so that cinnamon spice has his momma.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

She is still with us this morning. Her breathing is very fast and labored. She peed more normal. But she is grunting like she is in a lot of pain. She has yellow foam coming out of her mouth now. I gave her a baking soda and probiotic drench with a little corn syrup. She also had a shot of banamine. Getting up is becoming much harder for her. Her muscles on her sides, her ears, her face are twitching. Occasionally she sticks her legs out. She let her kid nurse, but I gave him a bottle that he drank.

I believe in my heart it is time to let her go. There’s some arguments this morning about if she may recover at the vet. I think it would be best if she didn’t pass away suffering alone. I think she is done. I’m going to give her a few more hours to see if the baking soda helps any. I’m going to ask the vet for a necropsy to figure out exactly what was wrong. It might give insight into the reason she’s having mummified fetuses. I would like her tested for Chlamydia if they can because that could really help us prevent this from happening again if she’s positive. I asked the vet in April if a sample of the placenta would help them figure out what happened. They said no. I do believe that was a mistake. I read placenta is a great way to test for Chlamydia, which causes abortions and mummified fetuses. You can treat the goat with antibiotics. I remember the girls’ former owner did have a goat with pinkeye. Our girls have eye discharge here and there that goes away. I think it’s very important to know if that’s what we are dealing with, especially with breeding season.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

The rest of my family wants to have her hospitalized at the vet. I guess that’s what will happen. Im going to call the vet soon.


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

I really hope a good decision is made. For or against will never be judged.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Tanya said:


> I really hope a good decision is made. For or against will never be judged.


Thank you. At this point forcing her to drink anything just seems like it’s making her stressed. I could keep giving her sugar but it hasn’t helped at all. She smells so sweet to me it makes me feel sick to my stomach. I feel so much better when I’m out with the other animals. My turkey Half n’ Half did chores with me this morning. She sat in the back of the atv for the drive. She keeps coming up to me and being extra sweet. It was a nice break from the sadness. My goat Blizzard was also being loving today.


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

They can feel your sadness and know there is a sad situation happening. Making piece with the choices helps to make the choices that are hard. We are thinking of you and her.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)




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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Emrcornerranch said:


> The rest of my family wants to have her hospitalized at the vet. I guess that’s what will happen. Im going to call the vet soon.


If possible, allow the vet to council you (your Family?) concerning hospitalization. Take into consideration, the added stress from being transported for the 3rd time; what it would do mentally and physically for Treasure, left alone in unfamiliar surroundings away from home and the herd members; being handled and tended by absolute strangers; and ask/question what could be done for her being hospitalized that you can't do or haven't done at home. You know Treasure better than anyone else, weigh the options for yourself, not the opinions of others. Sometimes, keeping the peace is a far cry from being at peace with the choices we must make.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

NigerianNewbie said:


> If possible, allow the vet to council you (your Family?) concerning hospitalization. Take into consideration, the added stress from being transported for the 3rd time, what it would do mentally and physically for Treasure, left alone in unfamiliar surroundings away from home and the herd members, being handled and tended by absolute strangers, and ask/question what could be done for her being hospitalized that you can't do or haven't done at home. You know Treasure better than anyone else, weigh the options for yourself, not the opinions of others. Sometimes, keeping the peace is a far cry from being at peace with the choices we must make.


Unfortunately, my mom has it set in her head that they will perform a miracle with the fluids. She was going to take her to the vet with or without my permission. I keep telling her that they won’t be doing the ketosis treatment, alfalfa mash, and beer that I have been. I doubt they will be putting honey suckle in her mouth to try to get her to eat. I doubt they’ll hold her head while she sleeps. 😭Getting worked up again over here…

Anyway, I don’t know what they could do there that I can’t. Aside from tube feeding her which I don’t know if they will do. I just worked her with valbazen and ivermectin horse paste. I was about to try a cud transfer and was standing over my healthy goats with a bowl and a spoon when my mom started yelling at me to get the goat in the car and go. My sister and I are going to make a solution with beer, cooked sweet potato, yogurt, water, and molasses. A version also includes raw eggs… I don’t know about adding raw eggs for a goat. We are going to have to give it to her at the vet I guess.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

They recommend taking her to a university. So now we are going to do that. Vet said she is most likely a goat that is going to die. At least at the university an hour away, the people will dote on her.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Omg  this is sooo sad... I hope she pulls through though    .... Universities are some of the best places to take animals and your right she probably is better off there!


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

How's pumpkin spice?  is he eating well still? Cuddle up to him and give him loves  it's going to be hard for the both of you while she's healing. I'm so sorry


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Emrcornerranch said:


> They recommend taking her to a university. So now we are going to do that. Vet said she is most likely a goat that is going to die. At least at the university an hour away, the people will dote on her.


Wishing you all and Treasure a safe travel. (Hugs)


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

K.B. said:


> How's pumpkin spice?  is he eating well still? Cuddle up to him and give him loves  it's going to be hard for the both of you while she's healing. I'm so sorry


He’s getting really good about drinking from a bottle. She still nurses him, but I know it’s not enough. Plus, I’m worried her toxins might be in the milk? He’s doing really well. He’s got great vision and agility! Knows how to sneak out of the pen, jumping 6 inches over the bottom of the doorway, and hops all around until he comes over to people.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Cute! I'm glad he's doing well!


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

Safe trip


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Glad the baby is doing well.

So sorry mama isn’t doing well.

You say she is twitching?
I would make sure she gets thiamine IM or fortified vit b complex SQ. 

Prayers for her.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

toth boer goats said:


> Glad the baby is doing well.
> 
> So sorry mama isn’t doing well.
> 
> ...


It’s like she’s having small involuntary muscle spasms. I can see her ears shaking a bit. Sometimes her head shakes a bit. I can feel her sides twitching. Vet thought that might be because of the toxins from her uterus in her bloodstream. I’m going to ask them to give her red cell and a thiamine shot. Any other shots with those? Uterine flush with antibiotics?


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Didn't the vet do an ultrasound?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

ksalvagno said:


> Didn't the vet do an ultrasound?


No. I’ll ask the university vets about it. I think he was getting out of familiar territory. Or if he saw something, there’s just not much than can be done to help her anyway. Her pee is no longer bloody. That’s the one improvement I’ve noticed.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Her temp was also 101, so she’s a bit colder than normal but within range.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Well at least it isn’t high, which indicates infection if any is low. 

It could be her rumen being off and not moving around. Plus not eating well.
So giving her probiotics, straight thiamine and fortified vit b complex SQ will help her.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Did you get her to the U?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

The vets at the university are more optimistic. The big bads: her pulse is very accelerated, and she has zero rumen sounds. She also had some brown diarrhea for them. Her temp was 102.8. They heard wheezing when she breathes out without any crackling in the lungs. That could be from inhaling some of the drench I was giving her. Her vulva discharge did not have a bad odor. She did not appear very dehydrated. She also had a good eyelid color for them. I saw, and it looked darker pink than this morning. Everything is getting hard to remember, but I threw whatever I could think of at her this morning that I have and could try. Ivermectin horse paste and Valbazen just in case. Ade gel with probiotics and b gel.

They are going to give her an ultrasound, do bloodwork, give her fluids, steal rumen contents from a cow and give it to her. Future treatment depends on the blood results. I asked about a uterine flush, and they said they can try it. I’ll remind them when they call back with her blood results. Depending on her blood count, I’ll suggest red cell and a thiamine injection. They should be calling soon.

We are driving back home with the kid. They offered to take him too and feed him. The head vet stepped up and agreed with me that she isn’t ready to take care of him. She could lay on him or put her head on him while she’s out of it. They were very interested in what I’d done so far. I felt very respected for trying. ❤ I am so proud of myself for understanding everything they were saying to each other. I’ve become so much more comfortable giving shots and have learned a lot of medical information about goats. It was so easy to give Treasure banamine this morning. I’ve come such a long way taking care of goats. I loved listening to them talk and the students discussing what to do. They were as interested in possible treatments and noting her symptoms just as I have been. I know they will try very hard to save her. I still don’t know if this was the correct route for her. Time will tell if we just extended her suffering.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

I think giving her the best shot possible was the right thing to do! If they sound optimistic that's a good thing... still praying  for her to pull through she's been in my thoughts all day!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

K.B. said:


> I think giving her the best shot possible was the right thing to do! If they sound optimistic that's a good thing... still praying  for her to pull through she's been in my thoughts all day!


Thank you! This has been stressful. It’s a learning experience. I hope she makes it and this becomes just a stressful memory to draw knowledge off of and help me improve what I have on hand!


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

I'm sure it's been very stressful but idk that you could have done much more! She needed the vet care and you did your best! She will be in good hands now atleast you'll feel better trying to do something.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

K.B. said:


> I'm sure it's been very stressful but idk that you could have done much more! She needed the vet care and you did your best! She will be in good hands now atleast you'll feel better trying to do something.


It made me feel a lot better that they were petting her. I don’t think they will just have her in a stall dying alone forgotten about. I think they’ll try to keep her spirit up. It helps that she’s so cute. The vet assistant at the local clinic actually helped birth a capybara during his training and thought Treasure really does look like a capybara. 😂


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Lol funny! That does help that they care about her!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Ultrasound looks like there are pieces of placenta. They are going to consult a reproductive specialist about doing another ultrasound and a uterine flush. Her blood work shows signs of inflammation and infection. Banamine was appropriate to help her. Her kidney values are high but not terribly alarming. Her electrolytes are also wonky. Fluids should help.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Sounds like they know what their doing!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Sounds like she is in good hands.


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

Sounds like you did exactly the right things when you were treating her and now they can carry on the good work.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

My dog has been super good with a baby goat in my room overnight. I still wouldn’t just leave them alone for extended periods of time, but she’s treating him like a new puppy. She checks him when he cries. She lets him hit her for milk. She tries to play with him, and I’m teaching her not to play with him like a dog. We are working on boundaries. She is bringing him toys. She has always been very great with the animals. I can bring a duck in my room while I drink coffee.

She isn’t the BAD dog. I’m being really careful to keep my sister’s dog far away from baby. Maple is helping great with that. She is becoming protective of him, and other dogs are not allowed in the room anyway. I keep my door closed all the time. During the day, I’m going to put him back in a stall, then let him interact with his mom’s twin sister. She is very curious about him.

I’m bottle feeding him 5 times a day about 1.2-1.5 oz. he weighed 3.7 lbs two days ago. I’m going to weigh him again today. His sides should look straight/flush after drinking, right? Not poochy but not sunken in? Some family members are trying to give him more milk. I know it seems like a tiny amount, but he’s tiny! Please confirm I’m feeding him properly just in case he needs more. He also looks like he’s ready to be disbudded already…


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

Such beaitiful pictures. How is momma goat doing?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

They haven’t given me an update yet, but no news is good news!


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

I love that your dog is bringing him toys. How sweet is that? She sounds like she’s so good with him. Those are great pictures.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

That's adorable


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

So cute.

Prayers for mama.

You need to be commended for what you have done so far. 👍


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

toth boer goats said:


> So cute.
> 
> Prayers for mama.
> 
> You need to be commended for what you have done so far. 👍


Thank you so much. It’s been a roller coaster the last 5 days.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Emrcornerranch said:


> I’m bottle feeding him 5 times a day about 1.2-1.5 oz. he weighed 3.7 lbs two days ago. I’m going to weigh him again today. His sides should look straight/flush after drinking, right? Not poochy but not sunken in? Some family members are trying to give him more milk. I know it seems like a tiny amount, but he’s tiny! Please confirm I’m feeding him properly just in case he needs more.


Absolutely spot on! Great job. Is Maple a blue tick? She's beautiful, and it's wonderful she is wanting to mother Pumpkin Spice.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

NigerianNewbie said:


> Absolutely spot on! Great job. Is Maple a blue tick? She's beautiful, and it's wonderful she is wanting to mother Pumpkin Spice.


I agree! Some only feed 4 times but I'd go with 5 with what your doing!


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Feeding schedule based on age

< 1 week every 2-4 hours

1-2 weeks every 4 hours *can go to 6 hours during the night * have hay and/or grass available at all times from here on

2-3 weeks every 5 hours *can go to 8 hours during the night *offer grain 2 times per day from here on

4-5 weeks 4 times a day *Breakfast, lunch, dinner and bedtime

5-6 weeks 3 times a day *Breakfast, lunch and dinner

7-9 weeks 2 times a day


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

NigerianNewbie said:


> Absolutely spot on! Great job. Is Maple a blue tick? She's beautiful, and it's wonderful she is wanting to mother Pumpkin Spice.


Yup! I know she knows he’s a goat, but she treats him like he’s a new puppy. She plays with my goat Bambi from time to time, and she’s played with our Nigerian bucks. It’s always very odd and quirky the way they try to figure out how to interact with each other. My dad’s Great Dane has head butted the goats before. 🤣 I’ve seen Maple imitate they way they rear up at each other. Bambi’s really the only goat that likes dogs like herd members and enjoys a little light chasing. Everybody else just is indifferent or slightly friendly to Maple and Nova. Before my sister moved in, Bambi would walk into the house, clip clop down stairs to the basement, and run around the basement with the dogs. They played a game with who was going to run out of which door or around the stairs when. Wish I’d taken a video. Maple also goes on walks with the goats a lot, and they follow her. I do have that on video. And last summer I was told there would NEVER be goats or birds allowed in the house!🤣My mom brought Blizzard into my room to wake me up one morning right after the house was finished. The favorite turkeys know where the dog water bowl is in the kitchen. Lol. Of course, my sister’s dog has to be outside (monitored) when a bird is inside or he goes after them in the house.


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Sounds like Treasure is in great hands at the University. That is always very comforting to know your animal is being treated like one of their own. You have had just a really, rough five days both emotionally and physically, but from what I can tell, you have been handling it so well and couldn't have done any more for Treasure while she was in your care. Treasure is very lucky to have you as her momma. I really do hope she pulls through this for both you and her baby.

Those pictures are adorable! It looks and sounds like you and Mable are being amazing foster moms to little Pumpkin Spice. I'm so happy to hear that he is thriving and well. I hope he continus to stay strong. Keep up the fantastic work. You're doing great!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

She had a fever of 104 this morning, so they gave her more banamine, and it went down. They gave her the cow rumen contents. She still hasn’t eaten on her own, but she is taking small sips of water. They are going to do a fecal. They have added penicillin. She is getting more spunky and fighting them. They have not done an ultrasound with a specialist. The specialist does not believe a uterine flush would help her because it isn’t commonly done in goats and wouldn’t change the treatment. They are continuing her on iv fluids but might take her off ivs tonight depending on how it goes. The big thing is getting her to eat now and getting her pain and inflammation managed so she might feel like eating.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Oh good you heard from them!  she's got this! I'm rooting for Treasure!


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Did you hear anything else from them tonight?


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Been busy but still thinking about her! Some kids born today to raise your spirits!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

K.B. said:


> Been busy but still thinking about her! Some kids born today to raise your spirits!
> View attachment 213383


Love the ears on the white one! And the one with spots, and the fuzzy brown/tan/apricot color of the other one.🥰 I haven’t heard anything else from the vet. I probably won’t until tomorrow unless something bad happens.🤞HOPING SHE EATS.🤞


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Emrcornerranch said:


> Love the ears on the white one! And the one with spots, and the fuzzy brown/tan/apricot color of the other one. I haven’t heard anything else from the vet. I probably won’t until tomorrow unless something bad happens.HOPING SHE EATS.


That's better than bad news... thanks  thought you could use a smile


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

His ears are so funny his brother and sister seem normal but his are larger and floppy lol


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I hope they get feed down her, even if they tube or drench her. 
She needs roughage for her rumen to work properly or it will shutdown.
Plus she will starve without nutrients.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Have you heard anything today?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

toth boer goats said:


> I hope they get feed down her, even if they tube or drench her.
> She needs roughage for her rumen to work properly or it will shutdown.
> Plus she will starve without nutrients.


Do you know what they can tube down her? I’ve been hoping they will, but I don’t know what. I suggested an alfalfa pellet mash, but he didn’t seem concerned about it yet. I think if they can force her stomach to start without her eating, it might help her feel better and start eating by her own.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

K.B. said:


> Have you heard anything today?


I haven’t heard anything yet. It’s frustrating just waiting for a call. I’m dying to know if she is eating yet but afraid to be told she isn’t. I feel today and tomorrow are the days she needs to start eating or she isn’t going to ever eat again. If I call, they’ll just tell me the vet will get back to me when they have time.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Emrcornerranch said:


> I haven’t heard anything yet. It’s frustrating just waiting for a call. I’m dying to know if she is eating yet but afraid to be told she isn’t. I feel today and tomorrow are the days she needs to start eating or she isn’t going to ever eat again. If I call, they’ll just tell me the vet will get back to me when they have time.


Ugh waiting is sooo frustrating  but the good news is if there were bad news they would have called you already!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

I’m becoming very happy Treasure’s kid is a buckling. He will never have this issue with mummified fetuses or retained placenta. If this is a genetic issue, I have less chance of encountering it with his offspring than if he were a doeling, since he is 2nd generation issue and his kids will be farther from Treasure’s issue. 

Edit: Forgot to add this in, but Treasure was very easy to milk before her udder started disappearing. It wasn’t like milking Shamrock at all. Her teats felt much more like tiny versions of my Nubian Flora’s teats.

Her former owner sent me an email that I want to run past people with larger herds and a ton more kiddings. She said she’s had does with mummified fetuses before but usually only one born with the rest of the kids full term and live. Are mummified kids within the range of normal? Is there an acceptable amount in a herd that is normal and accepted, or is her herd having a history of multiple mummified kids concerning?? I’m wondering if her herd has a higher genetic chance of carrying mummies, if it’s just a part of normal goating, or if this could be like an std issue? What do you all think?


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

https://tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/abortiondiseases.html





https://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/pregnancycomplic06.html


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

NigerianNewbie said:


> https://tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/abortiondiseases.html
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Did you know newborn goat kid feet work on phone screens? Had to let Pumpkin calm down before reading.😆

I certainly haven’t had weak kids. According to the article, Pumpkin would be very weak, which he certainly is not. Treasure’s placenta sounds think like the article mentioned, though. She may have had the kids stop developing in the correct time line as well. None of the kids (mummified or Pumpkin) had lesions.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

So the little guy likes to tap, tap on your phone screen does he? I copied those links to provide additional information about pregnancy complications and some of the causes for them in regards to goats. I don't as a rule, breed any type of animal. All of my various types of animals are spayed or neutered, unless it is medically impossible or carries a high risk. I don't know whether the complications Treasure experiences are genetic or caused by an STD. I thought some of the information in the links could help narrow down the reason. 

Did Treasure come to you already bred her first freshening? Did you use a different buck for this freshening? Did she have these type of complications if she kidded prior to you owning her? 

It also sounds a little alarming to me that the OP of the herd Treasure came from has experienced mummified kids often.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

He was standing on my shoulder while I was in bed and pawing at my phone…

Treasure had never been bred before according to the original breeder. I do trust them on this. We bred Treasure last October to Cowboy. She had her first mummies in early April. Then she got out and was bred with Cowboy the month after kidding. 😖 Which was something I really didn’t want. Her twin sister was slow to pass her pass her placenta but it came out the next day. It also took her an hour and 20 minutes to deliver the second kid. I believe that was due to her over attentiveness to the first and confusion about kidding for the first time. Now, I know to go in and check for another kid if they aren’t making progress.

Yeah. The fact that her herd has a history of mummified fetuses seems off to me. She does have like 120 Nigerians. At least 40 are bucks. I don’t know if it’s more common than I thought, but one kidding here and there maybe…But if it’s a pattern? It seems like a red flag to me. I don’t know what it could be, but I really want to understand why and what is happening with Treasure.

I’m really happy she was upfront about it! I appreciate her honesty!

No matter what outcome, Pumpkin Spice is Treasure’s last kid. I will not breed her again. I just want her to be ok.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

I sincerely want Treasure to recover as well.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

It is a little odd that the breeder has had the same problems


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

NigerianNewbie said:


> I sincerely want Treasure to recover as well.


Thank you. I really do appreciate it. She has a lot of people rooting for her.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

The vet called me a bit ago. He is very disappointed she hasn’t improved yet. She hasn’t eaten, so they added morphine to see if more pain management would encourage her to eat. They haven’t tube fed her yet. I’m getting frustrated that they haven’t. He said he will consult some people about that tomorrow. If I hear they aren’t going to try it because “it isn’t commonly done in goats,” I’m just going to take her back home. She is going to be tube fed or she is going to die. I don’t understand their hesitation. I told him if she hasn’t eaten on her own by now, she isn’t going to. She should be ravenous. I think tube feeding her to get her rumen going until she eats on her own is the best bet to get her eating. I saw some people use a product used for tube feeding calves. We could try alfalfa pellet mash as well. They are going to do more blood work tomorrow to see if there are any imbalances that need to be corrected.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Ugh  why won't they try it! I know they Do for kids so...


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

K.B. said:


> Ugh  why won't they try it! I know they Do for kids so...


He pretends to consider it, but I can tell from his tone that it’s not on the immediate list of to-dos. I hope they do it. I won’t feel satisfied until they try it.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Apparently it’s midterms. He said they were really busy, but it clicked for me. It’s probably midterm week. We might just bring her home today. If they don’t tube feed her today, she is coming home.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Emrcornerranch said:


> Apparently it’s midterms. He said they were really busy, but it clicked for me. It’s probably midterm week. We might just bring her home today. If they don’t tube feed her today, she is coming home.


Oh I see... well she's still fighting to stay alive, you may want to consider keeping her there one more day... did they get any food into her?


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

K.B. said:


> Oh I see... well she's still fighting to stay alive, you may want to consider keeping her there one more day... did they get any food into her?


It seems like they haven’t actually tried to get her to eat. They were hoping she would just go over to the hay and eat it independently. They thought the morphine would get her to eat. He’s still set on the idea that she isn’t eating due to pain. I disagree. I think she is in a cycle of not eating because we need to get her rumen started. Originally she stopped due to pain, but I think the only way to get her to eat is to put food in her and get that tummy started! They tube fed her rumen contents from a cow. So, why not tube feed her alfalfa mush, ensure, or a calf supplement? 

I know I’m growing impatient, but it’s sounding more like she is just left on her own in the stall. I don’t care how busy they are. She is there for them to do things I can’t. She is there for them to try. I could be giving her IV fluids. I just want them to make this worth it financially and with her stress. I don’t know what they would see redoing her blood work. She is a goat that hasn’t had a real meal in 6 days. That’s my biggest concern. The priority shouldn’t be pain management. It’s getting food in her. She’s starving, her rumen is shutting down, the rest of her body will shut down soon. Can’t they give the person who gets her to eat extra credit??? Maybe the local vet around here will give them a job! Come on!


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Emrcornerranch said:


> It seems like they haven’t actually tried to get her to eat. They were hoping she would just go over to the hay and eat it independently. They thought the morphine would get her to eat. He’s still set on the idea that she isn’t eating due to pain. I disagree. I think she is in a cycle of not eating because we need to get her rumen started. Originally she stopped due to pain, but I think the only way to get her to eat is to put food in her and get that tummy started! They tube fed her rumen contents from a cow. So, why not tube feed her alfalfa mush, ensure, or a calf supplement?
> 
> I know I’m growing impatient, but it’s sounding more like she is just left on her own in the stall. I don’t care how busy they are. She is there for them to do things I can’t. She is there for them to try. I could be giving her IV fluids. I just want them to make this worth it financially and with her stress. I don’t know what they would see redoing her blood work. She is a goat that hasn’t had a real meal in 6 days. That’s my biggest concern. The priority shouldn’t be pain management. It’s getting food in her. She’s starving, her rumen is shutting down, the rest of her body will shut down soon. Can’t they give the person who gets her to eat extra credit??? Maybe the local vet around here will give them a job! Come on!


Oh I know it's stressful  I think your right at this point getting her to eat and get that rumen going IS really important!


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

The vet just called me. She is in kidney failure. He sees a very slim chance they can save her. They believe the kidney failure was caused by copper toxicity? They were acting weird about me giving her Replamin gel. The former breeder did have several goats die of copper poisoning 2 years ago. Maybe she had too much copper in her liver from then? I believe it’s time to let her go.💔


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Oh nooo    you may be right, maybe it's time to make the hard decision I'm so sorry!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

The rumen needs fiber and nutrients to make it work. No grain.

Unbelievable, allowing the poor goat starve for that long, even when you are warning them with your concern.

Making a thin alfalfa pellet slurry, really watery as possible, but still have green coloring, so it goes through the tube easily will get nutrients to her which she desperately needs.

Pain or not, they are in the wrong for starving a ruminant animal.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

toth boer goats said:


> The rumen needs fiber and nutrients to make it work. No grain.
> 
> Unbelievable, allowing the poor goat starve for that long, even when you are warning them with your concern.
> 
> ...


I believe we are ending her suffering today. They believe it is copper toxicity. Could not eating have also caused kidney failure? I just don’t believe it. If she was eating, she wouldn’t be drawing on her own body. I wish wish wish they would have tube fed her like I wanted. Instead, I am putting her down this afternoon very unsatisfied that everything was done to prevent this after taking her there…💔


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

I am so, so, sorry this is happening. There is nothing I can do or say that will take the pain and loss away, other than to be available to listen to you if there is a need to talk. (Hugs)

Below is some information on copper poisoning, and this unfortunate tragedy can also be a learning experience for others. 

Copper found in hay and soil can be sufficient to provide the right amount of copper needed in a goat’s diet, however, most goat caretakers have experienced copper & mineral deficiency, and copper poisoning is less common. Copper poisoning causes liver necrosis and results in hemolysis which happens when the blood turns copper colored, also known as hemolytic crisis. DMV360 states:


> “Copper is a strong oxidizing agent. It binds to proteins in the liver cells and is stored in lysosomes within hepatocytes. As long as the copper remains stored in lysosomes it does not cause tissue damage. Copper can, however, be spontaneously released or released at times of stress, including shearing, weather extremes or transport. Chronic copper poisoning is, therefore, often described as a stress-related disease.”


If your goat is suffering from copper poisoning, a tell-tale symptom is copper colored urine, with a sweet smell. You may confuse this symptom for bloody urine from urinary calculi; however, a simple test will determine if blood is in the urine. If not, your goat is most likely in hemolytic crisis.

Copper Poisoning (Toxicity) in Goats - Boxwood Ave (boxwoodavenue.com)


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

NigerianNewbie said:


> I am so, so, sorry this is happening. There is nothing I can do or say that will take the pain and loss away, other than to be available to listen to you if there is a need to talk. (Hugs)
> 
> Below is some information on copper poisoning, and this unfortunate tragedy can also be a learning experience for others.
> 
> ...


Good info! That may be the sweet smell that you smelled @Emrcornerranch I'm so sad I'm crushed I really thought she'd pull through!


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

It is always difficult to say good bye to a pet that has given so much joy to you. I am so sorry that they did not listen to you and give her food via the tube. Even if it was toxicity, leaving her to starve was cruel. 
My heart goes out to you. Talking helps. We are all here for you.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

K.B. said:


> Good info! That may be the sweet smell that you smelled @Emrcornerranch I'm so sad I'm crushed I really thought she'd pull through!


You’re right. I bet that’s what I smelled.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I am truly sorry. 
You tried so hard.
Sometimes we can throw everything at them and still they go down. 

I respect your decision.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

Thank you all for helping me through this! 

It’s so very unfortunate, and I’m left questioning my goat management or if this was lingering from her old breeder who lost goats to copper toxicity. I suppose I’ll be more conservative with vitamin/mineral gels. Maybe slightly deficient is better than the risk of overdosing? My goat, Kicks, has some rusty patches on her legs I’m pretty sure is from copper deficiency, but now I’m questioning giving her replamin. I’ll wait a few months and see if it goes away from the last dose of gel she had.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Emrcornerranch said:


> Thank you all for helping me through this!
> 
> It’s so very unfortunate, and I’m left questioning my goat management or if this was lingering from her old breeder who lost goats to copper toxicity. I suppose I’ll be more conservative with vitamin/mineral gels. Maybe slightly deficient is better than the risk of overdosing? My goat, Kicks, has some rusty patches on her legs I’m pretty sure is from copper deficiency, but now I’m questioning giving her replamin. I’ll wait a few months and see if it goes away from the last dose of gel she had.


Which loose mineral do you use? Have you considered giving a copper bolus as needed? Could you post a picture or two of Kicks? If possible, show the rusty patches, the rump, and the tail area. And also a close up of the neck from the ears down to the shoulders. A picture full body standing on a solid surface would help us see her pasterns.


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

NigerianNewbie said:


> Which loose mineral do you use? Have you considered giving a copper bolus as needed? Could you post a picture or two of Kicks? If possible, show the rusty patches, the rump, and the tail area. And also a close up of the neck from the ears down to the shoulders. A picture full body standing on a solid surface would help us see her pasterns.


I’ll take some pictures when I get home. They were on manna pro mineral with occasional trucare4 mineral. Then they had dumor mineral for about a month. Now they have sweetlix meat maker. Instead of bolusing, I’ve been giving replamin gel as needed. I switched brands of replamin gel to a larger tube. I usually put a dab on a cracker. The dosage on the tube is 5cc for 100 something lbs. I thought using less and speeding the dosage out would be more natural and less risky. But here we are…


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## Emrcornerranch (Jun 13, 2020)

She’s gone now. I posted in the Rainbow Bridge thread.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Emrcornerranch said:


> She’s gone now. I posted in the Rainbow Bridge thread.


Omg  you poor thing I'm sure your heartbroken  ... we're all here for you, I think you made the right decision although the hardest decision to make!


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

Now try to focus on Pumkin Spice and make sure he is healthy and happy! He'll give you hugs from me!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)




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