# Respiratory illness in young goats



## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

Hi from Connecticut! Has anyone experienced chronic coughing in young goats? 

I’m new to goats, have 2 - 7 month old Nigerian dwarf kids since the summer. They were doing great till I added a third that came with a cough in October. The seller/breeder told me goats can get a cough when weather gets cool, no big deal. (Should have listened to my inside voice and walked away but she was nice and I trusted her, lesson learned).
Had our vet check her on arrival, he treated for lung worm “in case”, said it wasn’t pneumonia and wasn’t concerned, negative fecal. Vet gave us go ahead to pick up a fourth kid we had deposit on.
Within a couple weeks, the original two got the same spasmodic cough that ended with a sneeze. 
Vet came out again, he checked them all, repeated fecals, still not concerned. They didn’t act sick, ate fine, playful. 
One goat improved, two continued to cough, the youngest was still trying to fit in, not sick, slow to gain. Vet thought she was weaned too soon, put her on her high calorie grain, fed separately.
A month into it, the youngest got acutely ill and died before vet could come. Necropsy determined she died from opportunistic acute bacterial pneumonia most likely secondary to viral infection. The coughing goat was returned. The other two were treated for lungworm although tested negative and were given 2 antibiotics 5 days apart.
The cough never resolved, today they both had a fever 103.1, and 104. Took them to Vet, both had a chest x-ray ( normal for one, patchy for the other), a tracheal wash to try to identify what virus/ bacteria is causing it, as well as blood work. Given Draxxin and Meloxicam while we await results. Vet suggested vaccinating for RSV as it appears to be viral and she said it could help resolve the illness.
Has anyone experience this ? Was the cause identified and did it finally resolve? 
Thank you!


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

WOW

Well I'm certainly sorry for your experience in goat owning thus far. 

I have nothing to add to the what the veterinarians have diagnosed & treated so far. I honestly didn't even know there was an RSV injection for goats.


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Welcome to the forum, I am not any help to you. I am sorry you are having health problems with your little goats.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

SalteyLove said:


> WOW
> 
> Well I'm certainly sorry for your experience in goat owning thus far.
> 
> I have nothing to add to the what the veterinarians have diagnosed & treated so far. I honestly didn't even know there was an RSV injection for goats.


Thank you for your reply! It's been a little discouraging, I'm sure the damp fall and cold winter have not helped. Vet raises sheep and has been battling similar issues.
From what I could find on it it's for BRSV, the only thing I question is if a vaccine will help once an infection is active......and in reading other posts, I need to start Probiotics


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

Dwarf Dad said:


> Welcome to the forum, I am not any help to you. I am sorry you are having health problems with your little goats.


Thanks, it's ok!


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

You can give B-Complex injections for 5 days straight and that will support their rumen health and appetites during the course of antibiotics.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

SalteyLove said:


> You can give B-Complex injections for 5 days straight and that will support their rumen health and appetites during the course of antibiotics.


Ok, thank you
The doeling is a bit off today, increased cough not as interested in her grain. Temp 102.5.
The more I read, the more this looks like BRSV, no treatment for it and it can recurr, puts them at risk for bacterial pneumonia. I'm thinking of vaccinating with Once PMH


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

I do highly recommend the Once PMH if you can choke down the cost!

102.5 is a good temperature. Normal for goats is 101.5 to 103.5

I'm not sure how your vet would feel about it... But some folks use children's Robitussin DM for their goats!


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

SalteyLove said:


> I do highly recommend the Once PMH if you can choke down the cost!
> 
> 102.5 is a good temperature. Normal for goats is 101.5 to 103.5
> 
> I'm not sure how your vet would feel about it... But some folks use children's Robitussin DM for their goats!





SalteyLove said:


> I do highly recommend the Once PMH if you can choke down the cost!
> 
> 102.5 is a good temperature. Normal for goats is 101.5 to 103.5
> 
> I'm not sure how your vet would feel about it... But some folks use children's Robitussin DM for their goats!


 I've been going through Tufts Ambulatory in Woodstock, there were 3 vets checking them out yesterday, they didn't mention the syrup. I read people use it. It may help them feel better. As for the cost of the vaccine, the IN version is pretty reasonable, especially when compared to what's been spent so far.... thanks!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Where are you keeping them at night?
Is it draft free, have plenty of fresh bedding?
Not a wet area?
Does it smell really strong of urine in their sleeping area?
Put your nose down low where they would lay and sniff.
If really strong smelling, it can cause pneumonia if inhaled for too long.


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## fivemoremiles (Jan 19, 2010)

we have that same problem from time to time. 1 cc oral Benadril works for us.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

I don't have anything useful to add. I just wanted to say I'm sorry this happened to you. What rotten luck.

Also that I really like the ONCE PMH IN vaccine.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> Where are you keeping them at night?
> Is it draft free, have plenty of fresh bedding?
> Not a wet area?
> Does it smell really strong of urine in their sleeping area?
> ...


They have an 8x12 enclosed shed, goat door that is left open during the day, horse mats over crushed stone. Bedding consist of shavings around the hay feeder which is changed weekly, use Sweet PDZ on mat where there was wet spots, usually no ammonia smell. 
Have a heated water bucket , water changed daily. They have a foot or so straw over the shaving in the corner where they sleep and I keep travel crate with straw that they sleep in sometimes. We have horses and chickens kept separately, familiar with ammonia and the problems it can cause. Good thinking and thank you for bringing it up! I appreciate any help and insights.


toth boer goats said:


> Where are you keeping them at night?
> Is it draft free, have plenty of fresh bedding?
> Not a wet area?
> Does it smell really strong of urine in their sleeping area?
> ...


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

mariarose said:


> I don't have anything useful to add. I just wanted to say I'm sorry this happened to you. What rotten luck.
> 
> Also that I really like the ONCE PMH IN vaccine.


Thank you, vets are puzzled, have seen lots of coughs in sheep and goats this fall. I should have walked away from the coughing goat, there were other doelings with her coughing and that indicated it was contagious.The breeder made it sounds like it was a common thing. I've been reading several of the health and wellness posts here and it seems goats are pretty fragile, vets try their best but not as much is known about them, it's a little scary. Time will tell if they get over it.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

fivemoremiles said:


> we have that same problem from time to time. 1 cc oral Benadril works for us.


Ok, thank you.Benadryl the antihistamine ? Do you mean to quiet the cough ? When your goats had the illness, how long did it last ? My concern is that I've lost one as a result, it sets them up for opportunistic bacterial pmeumonia much like the flu does.


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

I've used children's robitussin DM with my goats and they prefer the version that has honey. Tennessee meat goats has an article that recommended it. It helped quite a bit and my doe would run up to the counter to take it thinking it was a treat instead of medicine.


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## fivemoremiles (Jan 19, 2010)

we give benadryl as needed. I forgot to say use children's benadryl.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

It sounds like you take really good care of them.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

GoofyGoat said:


> I've used children's robitussin DM with my goats and they prefer the version that has honey. Tennessee meat goats has an article that recommended it. It helped quite a bit and my doe would run up to the counter to take it thinking it was a treat instead of medicine.


Good to know


fivemoremiles said:


> we give benadryl as needed. I forgot to say use children's benadryl.[/QUOTE
> Thank you, got some today, pretty funny giving it, even tough it was sweet needed a helper to hold them.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> It sounds like you take really good care of them.


It's pretty easy when there are only two, and I like spending time with them. They're like puppies, just happy to have a human around. Hopefully they'll get over this and I can get them a few buddies, so many adorable kids borned this time of year!


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

Whatever is causing this ongoing illness, I’d like to find ways to boost their immune system. Has anyone had good results using herbal remedies? Anything else that should be considered? I’ve found info at Molly’s Herbal for single herb and mixtures, and if they are effective the best way to get goats to take them. The two I have only seem to like their grain and Mana Pro goat treats. Thanks for sharing!


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

I just put a clove of garlic in each goats' food bowl with their alfalfa pellets, tablespoon of kelp and two tablespoons of BOSS. Free choice bermuda hay and good cattle minerals with ammonium chloride mixed in.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

I'd find ways to up their zinc. And vitamin C. @NigerianDwarfOwner707 has knowledge of herbal "stuff".


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

Thanks to both of you, that’s very helpful. 
We have access to orchard hay up, I’ve seen alfalfa pellets at feed store, didn’t get yet as there was mixed reviews due to concern of urinary stones.
Been using Blue seal dairy goat grain with ammonium, free choice Sweetlix. I had free choice Thornton kelp, they didn’t go for it . I’ll add it in their grain with the BOSS. 
They weigh 30llbs, is there an approximate dose for the ammonium? Zinc and C ? The vet thought I should stop the grain soon, the each get a small handful twice a day.


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

I think the ammonium chloride was about 1/8 teaspoon. Maybe less. I mix one and a half pounds to twenty-five pounds of their minerals. I have read ,but forgotten how much zinc and vit C.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

Dwarf Dad said:


> I think the ammonium chloride was about 1/8 teaspoon. Maybe less. I mix one and a half pounds to twenty-five pounds of their minerals. I have read ,but forgotten how much zinc and vit C.


Ok, thanks. 
I also have Redmond Salt which I read can be provided free choice...any thoughts about doing that? They do like it, they don't seem to eat much Sweetlix.... maybe I need to switch brand


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Marie Desjarlais said:


> Whatever is causing this ongoing illness, I'd like to find ways to boost their immune system. Has anyone had good results using herbal remedies? Anything else that should be considered? I've found info at Molly's Herbal for single herb and mixtures, and if they are effective the best way to get goats to take them. The two I have only seem to like their grain and Mana Pro goat treats. Thanks for sharing!


Thanks for mentioning me @mariarose.

One of my wethers developed a chronic cough at a few months old. Took ages to get rid of it! I tried everything natural I could think of, and finally I started him on a rigorous garlic regimen, cleared up almost immediately. For info on dosing garlic at a treatment level you can check this out - https://thegivinggoat.home.blog/2019/01/01/using-garlic-to-improve-herd-health/


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Marie Desjarlais said:


> they don't seem to eat much Sweetlix.... maybe I need to switch brand


You won't see them eat much if they don't need much. They don't regard it as a food group, more like a seasoning or condiment. Don't set out a large amount at a time, they like it fresh.


NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Thanks for mentioning me


You were a natural person to call for.


NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> One of my wethers developed a chronic cough at a few months old. Took ages to get rid of it! I tried everything natural I could think of


Could you tell us some of the natural routes you tried, that did not end so happily for you? It helps just as much to know what does not work for what. Otherwise, we might try something recommended because it is natural, but if it is ineffective, all of "natural" could get a black eye.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

mariarose said:


> You won't see them eat much if they don't need much. They don't regard it as a food group, more like a seasoning or condiment. Don't set out a large amount at a time, they like it fresh.
> 
> You were a natural person to call for.
> 
> ...


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

@Marie Desjarlais you said, *"At 8 months and 30llbs, would it still be good to introduce Alfalfa pellets ? Is that a life long nutrition recommendation?"
*
My week old triplets are learning from their mother what solid foods are good to eat, and that is including alfalfa pellets, whole grains, hay, leaves, and (unfortunately) the dog food when I don't get it out of the area fast enough. Yes, at 8 months, it won't hurt for them to get alfalfa pellets.

Alfalfa, in proper proportions with the rest of the diet, is generally regarded favourably. So, yes, to your second question.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

mariarose said:


> @Marie Desjarlais you said, *"At 8 months and 30llbs, would it still be good to introduce Alfalfa pellets ? Is that a life long nutrition recommendation?"
> *
> My week old triplets are learning from their mother what solid foods are good to eat, and that is including alfalfa pellets, whole grains, hay, leaves, and (unfortunately) the dog food when I don't get it out of the area fast enough. Yes, at 8 months, it won't hurt for them to get alfalfa pellets.
> 
> Alfalfa, in proper proportions with the rest of the diet, is generally regarded favourably. So, yes, to your second question.


 Thanks again, the reason For my question has to do with what you refer to a proper proportions. It's mentionned frequently in r/t goat nutrition and it's sounding like chemistry. So maybe I'll start to substitute alfalfa pellets for some of the grain as a first step. 
One of the two took the garlic mixed with honey and rolled into grain, the other smelled a rat.
I then tried a small whole clove mixed in a small amt of grain, she ate the grain but not the garlic...


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Try minced or crushed garlic mixed with some feed. They may refuse it for a day or 2 but fear not, they WILL decide to eat.

I had a crazy-funny girl once. She kept me in stitches. I rearranged the milk room once, moved her milk stand 90 degrees. Same spot, but rotated to the side. She refused to eat her grain for 3 days as I milked because she wasn't looking at "her" wall. On day 4, she decided to eat her grain.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

mariarose said:


> Try minced or crushed garlic mixed with some feed. They may refuse it for a day or 2 but fear not, they WILL decide to eat.
> 
> I had a crazy-funny girl once. She kept me in stitches. I rearranged the milk room once, moved her milk stand 90 degrees. Same spot, but rotated to the side. She refused to eat her grain for 3 days as I milked because she wasn't looking at "her" wall. On day 4, she decided to eat her grain.


LOL, they can be pretty determined. All right, will keep trying. I was also thinking hiding it in a piece of banana, it might camouflage it better...


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## Treva Brodt (Jan 11, 2019)

I have noticed three of my boys coughing. Two seemed unaffected but the third started having a runny nose with clear to white discharge. I tried vitamins, LA-200 for three days and no change. I had to transport him to the vet where he had a temp of 102.5. Vet said on the high side of normal so he gave him another shot of antibiotics (I don't know what) and sent him home with Sulfatrim by mouth. His behavior is fine, no more runny nose but he still has a slight cough. My husband isn't worried. He says animals cough from time to time. I'm still concerned even though everyone's behavior and appetite are completely normal. I also thought about worming them for lungworm. He doesn't think so as long as they haven't lost condition or act off. I'm interested in your thoughts.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

With the snot, and the time of year, I'd suspect pneumonia before lungworm, but I could be wrong. I think that LA-200 needed to be given for longer that 3 days to be fully effective. Without knowing what your vet gave you, all we can counsel you to do is to keep watch.

Good job jumping on that so fast.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I agree.


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## Treva Brodt (Jan 11, 2019)

mariarose said:


> With the snot, and the time of year, I'd suspect pneumonia before lungworm, but I could be wrong. I think that LA-200 needed to be given for longer that 3 days to be fully effective. Without knowing what your vet gave you, all we can counsel you to do is to keep watch.
> 
> Good job jumping on that so fast.


The vet said bronchitis because he was congested in his upper respiratory system instead of wheezes or crackles at the bases. Pneumonia usually settles to the bases of the lungs. I just had concerns because he wasn't the only goat with a cough but he was the only one that presented with any other symptoms. I started the LA-200 over the weekend when the temperatures were predicted to be -6 degrees hoping to prevent a vet emergency. It was on a Monday that I took him in because he wasn't any better on what I was giving. I haven't been raising goats for long. I'm like a first time mom with all of them.


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## dreamacresfarm2 (May 10, 2014)

I use childrens benadryl and monitor temp daily. If they get a elevated temp or labored breathing i start on antibiotic.
Rarely have to use antibiotics


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

This is what I’ve learned in the past four months dealing with my coughin goats.

There are different organisms that cause respiratory infections, some are silent and deadly, typically acute bacterial pneumonia, affected animals don’t always have a cough. Other types of pneumonia are less acute, similar to walking pneumonia in people.
Viruses can also cause respiratory illness, and the animals may not be acting sick except for the coughing, sneezing, nasal secretions much like a cold or the flu. It still affects their immunity and makes them susceptible to a more serious bacterial infection. That happened to us and we lost our most vulnerable doeling to acute silent pneumonia in a matter of hours.
Lungworm is also on the list, our vet treated just in case. Lung abscesses can be chronic so not likely in new onset illness.
Because their cough has been ongoing and did not respond to previous treatment, we decided to test them. Meanwhile, with the elevated temp (acting fine) and coarse Breath sounds, the vets treated both with Draxxin to be repeated in 5 days. Their rationale for choosing this antibiotic is that it concentrates in the lung tissues and also covers for mycoplasma. 
I agree with treating especially when there are abnormal lung sounds and temperature. 
Hopefully they will be over it soon!


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Marie Desjarlais said:


> Thanks again, the reason For my question has to do with what you refer to a proper proportions. It's mentionned frequently in r/t goat nutrition and it's sounding like chemistry. So maybe I'll start to substitute alfalfa pellets for some of the grain as a first step.
> One of the two took the garlic mixed with honey and rolled into grain, the other smelled a rat.
> I then tried a small whole clove mixed in a small amt of grain, she ate the grain but not the garlic...


Blog post on garlic - might have some creative ideas for feeding it - https://thegivinggoat.home.blog/2019/01/01/using-garlic-to-improve-herd-health/ crushed in applesauce is my preferred method.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

Thanks so sending this link! I was giving too much, and will try the applesauce. Yesterday tried a piece of banana which went over a bit better, except for the doeling who looks at me as if I’m trying to poison her. Still awaiting results, which I’ll post.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Marie Desjarlais said:


> Thanks so sending this link! I was giving too much, and will try the applesauce. Yesterday tried a piece of banana which went over a bit better, except for the doeling who looks at me as if I'm trying to poison her. Still awaiting results, which I'll post.


How much were you giving? And yes, sometimes goats just won't trust you...best to figure out what they love prior to adding garlic. @elvisandoliver feeds her goats garlic in peanut shells!


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> How much were you giving? And yes, sometimes goats just won't trust you...best to figure out what they love prior to adding garlic. @elvisandoliver feeds her goats garlic in peanut shells!


I gave them each one good size clove, article recommends 1/4 to 1/2 tsp per serving, easier to hide. Turns out the wether loves bananas, the doeling so far didn't go for honey/goat treat balls, banana and peanut butter. She smells it and goes the other way. Not sure applesauce will hide the strong smell...we'll see


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Marie Desjarlais said:


> I gave them each one good size clove, article recommends 1/4 to 1/2 tsp per serving, easier to hide. Turns out the wether loves bananas, the doeling so far didn't go for honey/goat treat balls, banana and peanut butter. She smells it and goes the other way. Not sure applesauce will hide the strong smell...we'll see


One good sized clove usually gets crushed to about that amount. I wouldn't worry, sizes of cloves vary... one clove is good (I wrote the article, trust me). It's really the slippery elm in the applesauce that hides the garlic, the actual applesauce is more of just a vehicle for them to lick up quickly, before they notice there is garlic in it.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

It is easier to give the garlic crushed, it seems like a smaller amount.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

My new title should be "The Garlic Goat Mama" because I believe there is nothing better than garlic for goats, I can't say enough great things about it!!!! Good luck feeding garlic to your picky goats!!!!


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> My new title should be "The Garlic Goat Mama" because I believe there is nothing better than garlic for goats, I can't say enough great things about it!!!! Good luck feeding garlic to your picky goats!!!!


Wow! Well thank you for explaining, I'll get the slippery elm and give it time. How long do you give garlic for and do you periodically stop it? In humans it can cause heartburn over time, was wondering if it could affect goat rumen similarly over the long run.


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Marie Desjarlais said:


> Wow! Well thank you for explaining, I'll get the slippery elm and give it time. How long do you give garlic for and do you periodically stop it? In humans it can cause heartburn over time, was wondering if it could affect goat rumen similarly over the long run.


I didn't know about the heartburn. My heartburn is gradually going away since I get a clove of fresh garlic daily when I give the goats their's.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Wow, garlic works for heartburn on humans?
How exciting.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Marie Desjarlais said:


> Wow! Well thank you for explaining, I'll get the slippery elm and give it time. How long do you give garlic for and do you periodically stop it? In humans it can cause heartburn over time, was wondering if it could affect goat rumen similarly over the long run.


As explained in the blog post, I feed garlic daily. Some days I miss it due to random reasons, but I try to give it daily as a preventative. Treatment doses I give for 5 days straight, then another 3 days at a lower amount, and then back to 1 clove daily.

Garlic has only ever shown to improve rumen function. Often the heartburn people complain about from garlic can just be the reaction to the spice and potent flavor of it, which goats do not experience/mind.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

That’s good to know, just being cautious. Did find a few research articles that explained effect of garlic on goat rumen and it does affect bacterial balance but not in a harmful way. So much to learn! Thank you all!


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

toth boer goats said:


> Wow, garlic works for heartburn on humans?
> How exciting.


It may be a coincidence.:shrug: I started taking the GISoother from Fir Meadow at the same time. Off label of course.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

Dwarf Dad said:


> It may be a coincidence.:shrug: I started taking the GISoother from Fir Meadow at the same time. Off label of course.


Heartburn is one of the common side effects; it's great if you don't have a problem with it as it has several health benefits. Maybe the herbs you take provide GI protection.


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Something is working, no reflux for about two months, no Tums for about three months. Not quite ready to give up my OTC Omeprazole that I have been taking for years and years.


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

@Marie Desjarlais - how are your goats now? Any less coughing?

If you are on Facebook, there is a great group called "CT Goat Owners" you should definitely join


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Yes, how are things?


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

SalteyLove said:


> @Marie Desjarlais - how are your goats now? Any less coughing?
> 
> If you are on Facebook, there is a great group called "CT Goat Owners" you should definitely join


Hi All, well they are unchanged, still coughing the same, still playful. The vet called with the last results yesterday, mycoplasma was negative, bovine respiratory syn virus negative, culture and sensitivity negative for bacteria, lentivirus negative (CAE). Chest x-ray did show an infiltrate on one of them initially and her thought is that this is probably lingering parainfluenza 3. She reccomends giving Inforce 3 vaccine a couple weeks after the Once PMH I hope vaccine.
Told her about garlic and probiotic for immune system strengthening, she didn't say much about those or fortified B complex injection. She said the BoSe they got should help and she reccomended ZinPro trace mineral as the blend contains zinc, copper, cobalt and manganese in a form that is easily assimilated. She let me know another herd in our town is battling the same issue.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

Marie Desjarlais said:


> Hi All, well they are unchanged, still coughing the same, still playful. The vet called with the last results yesterday, mycoplasma was negative, bovine respiratory syn virus negative, culture and sensitivity negative for bacteria, lentivirus negative (CAE). Chest x-ray did show an infiltrate on one of them initially and her thought is that this is probably lingering parainfluenza 3. She reccomends giving Inforce 3 vaccine a couple weeks after the Once PMH I hope vaccine.
> Told her about garlic and probiotic for immune system strengthening, she didn't say much about those or fortified B complex injection. She said the BoSe they got should help and she reccomended ZinPro trace mineral as the blend contains zinc, copper, cobalt and manganese in a form that is easily assimilated. She let me know another herd in our town is battling the same issue.





Marie Desjarlais said:


> Hi All, well they are unchanged, still coughing the same, still playful. The vet called with the last results yesterday, mycoplasma was negative, bovine respiratory syn virus negative, culture and sensitivity negative for bacteria, lentivirus negative (CAE). Chest x-ray did show an infiltrate on one of them initially and her thought is that this is probably lingering parainfluenza 3. She reccomends giving Inforce 3 vaccine a couple weeks after the Once PMH I hope vaccine.
> Told her about garlic and probiotic for immune system strengthening, she didn't say much about those or fortified B complex injection. She said the BoSe they got should help and she reccomended ZinPro trace mineral as the blend contains zinc, copper, cobalt and manganese in a form that is easily assimilated. She let me know another herd in our town is battling the same issue.[/QUOTE
> Thanks for the reccomendation about the CT goat owner group!


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

Thanks for the detailed information!


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

Hoping it may help someone that find themselves in a similar situation. 
Vet said the temperature patterns high daytime and very cold at night is hard on them. I do think vaccinations, good nutrition and being biosecurity mindful is the way to go.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Marie Desjarlais said:


> [The vet] reccomends giving Inforce 3 vaccine a couple weeks after the Once PMH I hope vaccine.


1. Which "ONCE" vaccine is meant by the "I hope" vaccine? I do understand this is an autocorrect or typo, I'm not being snarky. I just want to know which one she said.
2. What did she say would be the benefit or purpose of the "Inforce 3" vaccine in addition to the ONCE PMH, and if there is more than one Inforce 3, which one did she reference? Again, genuinely interested, no snark intended.

I use the ONCE PMH IN vaccine, and I do have a couple of sick girls. I'm not faulting the vaccine, this has been horrible for the goats and I'm convinced had I not vaccinated, I would have been dealing with many deaths by now. I recommend it even more highly than ever now. But I am very interested in what a separate vaccination in addition to the ONCE IN would do.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> As explained in the blog post, I feed garlic daily. Some days I miss it due to random reasons, but I try to give it daily as a preventative. Treatment doses I give for 5 days straight, then another 3 days at a lower amount, and then back to 1 clove daily.
> 
> Garlic has only ever shown to improve rumen function. Often the heartburn people complain about from garlic can just be the reaction to the spice and potent flavor of it, which goats do not experience/mind.


Does this alter the flavor of the milk?


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

NyGoatMom said:


> Does this alter the flavor of the milk?


Not in my (admittedly anecdotal) experience.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

NyGoatMom said:


> Does this alter the flavor of the milk?


Garlic can alter the flavor of milk. It depends on how much you give, and how strongly you yourself can taste it. You can experiment and find out, sometimes it does flavor it and sometimes it doesn't. But that is one of the main reasons why some people choose not to feed garlic to their goats. It won't alter it long term, though. You can always just pause to feed it when a goat is in milk, unless you really need it to "treat" an issue.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Yeah, I thought about that. Trying it during the off season and then see what happens.


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## 212008825a (Apr 4, 2017)

Marie Desjarlais said:


> Hi from Connecticut! Has anyone experienced chronic coughing in young goats?
> 
> I'm new to goats, have 2 - 7 month old Nigerian dwarf kids since the summer. They were doing great till I added a third that came with a cough in October. The seller/breeder told me goats can get a cough when weather gets cool, no big deal. (Should have listened to my inside voice and walked away but she was nice and I trusted her, lesson learned).
> Had our vet check her on arrival, he treated for lung worm "in case", said it wasn't pneumonia and wasn't concerned, negative fecal. Vet gave us go ahead to pick up a fourth kid we had deposit on.
> ...


I have had 2 Nigerians that I had to put down because of lung abases. Both were on steroids for pemphegus which is rare and really rare in goats. I originally thought they had pneumonia as the vet did but with extensive biopsy it turned out to be deadly pemphigus. Please have you vet check into this. The steroids lowered their immune system which called lung abbesses. Hope this helps as I love my goats. i have since then bought 2 mini nubians which I love.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

mariarose said:


> 1. Which "ONCE" vaccine is meant by the "I hope" vaccine? I do understand this is an autocorrect or typo, I'm not being snarky. I just want to know which one she said.
> 2. What did she say would be the benefit or purpose of the "Inforce 3" vaccine in addition to the ONCE PMH, and if there is more than one Inforce 3, which one did she reference? Again, genuinely interested, no snark intended.
> 
> I use the ONCE PMH IN vaccine, and I do have a couple of sick girls. I'm not faulting the vaccine, this has been horrible for the goats and I'm convinced had I not vaccinated, I would have been dealing with many deaths by now. I recommend it even more highly than ever now. But I am very interested in what a separate vaccination in addition to the ONCE IN would do.


Sorry about the typo. 
The vaccines cover/protects against different organisms.
Vet reccomended Once PMH IN, effective for Manheimia H and Pasteurella M. Which are bacterias.
Inforce 3 IN is for viruses, IBR, Parainfluenza 3 and BRSV. It's like getting a pneumonia vaccine and then a flu shot.
Because of how it's behaving, the wether was fine then started coughing again, his chest x-ray was abnormal but he was acting and feeding ok, she thinks it's viral in nature. Bacterial pneumonia is usually more severe and can be deadly.
What I'm wondering about and could not find is it vaccinating against a viral illness that is presently active helps.

If anyone has info about Zinpro it would be appreciated. She said to top dress withTru Care for goats as since helps immunity and goats get copper deficient.
The last thing she said was that it was a tough year all around for small ruminants and resp illness. What I've seen here weather wise doesn't look like it's ending anytime soon, climate change ?


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

Marie Desjarlais said:


> Sorry about the typo.
> The vaccines cover/protects against different organisms.
> Vet reccomended Once PMH IN, effective for Manheimia H and Pasteurella M. Which are bacterias.
> Inforce 3 IN is for viruses, IBR, Parainfluenza 3 and BRSV. It's like getting a pneumonia vaccine and then a flu shot.
> ...


 About True Care it should say Zinc , not since.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

212008825a said:


> I have had 2 Nigerians that I had to put down because of lung abases. Both were on steroids for pemphegus which is rare and really rare in goats. I originally thought they had pneumonia as the vet did but with extensive biopsy it turned out to be deadly pemphigus. Please have you vet check into this. The steroids lowered their immune system which called lung abbesses. Hope this helps as I love my goats. i have since then bought 2 mini nubians which I love.


I'm so sorry about your loss, the chest x-rays should have detected abscesses. It was one of the reason for obtaining. they must have been pretty sick, pemphigus is very serious. Mine act ok then will have a coughing jag, cough a dozen time in a row which sometimes sounds a bit wet then they sneeze and a little clear mucous can be seen.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Marie Desjarlais said:


> Vet reccomended Once PMH IN, effective for Manheimia H and Pasteurella M. Which are bacterias.
> Inforce 3 IN is for viruses, IBR, Parainfluenza 3 and BRSV. It's like getting a pneumonia vaccine and then a flu shot.


Thank you very much.


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## Marie Desjarlais (Feb 1, 2019)

mariarose said:


> Thank you very much.


Thank you for all your reccomendations!


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## TCOLVIN (Sep 22, 2014)

Marie Desjarlais said:


> Thank you, vets are puzzled, have seen lots of coughs in sheep and goats this fall. I should have walked away from the coughing goat, there were other doelings with her coughing and that indicated it was contagious.The breeder made it sounds like it was a common thing. I've been reading several of the health and wellness posts here and it seems goats are pretty fragile, vets try their best but not as much is known about them, it's a little scary. Time will tell if they get over it.


Many time’s I seen breeders so eager to sell they come up with all kinds of answers to make the sale. On another note I’ve seen what looked healthy goats, have problems that were not apparent when you buy them. Change of environment, feed, leaving their buddies and your herd bosses can cause a lot of problem. First thing I do when I bring a newbie or more into my pasture, they are quarantined for at least to 3-4 weeks. Temps are are checked and I spend a little time with them at least 30 minutes. Offer a small amount of feed and don’t get to impatient if they don’t eat at first . Make sure plenty fresh water is available and fresh hay. Watch for coughing, famacha score, rub all over for hidden bumps or knots around neck, jaws, breast, and along sides and bag if a nannie. I had one coughing when I got home the other day from a sale and when checked she had a temp of 104.4f. I gave 5 days of Noromycin 300 and a shot of Vit. B Complex each day, along with probiotics and fed green oak leaves. After a little over 3-1/2 weeks I determined they both were safe to join herd. Am I a goat professional, definitely not, but after spending a lot of time with them you begin to see things that can head off problems. Always keep a temp gauge and a small bottle of spray alcohol to clean it with then rinse good, two or three whole garlic cloves per goat, at least 3-4 times a week. At first they want eat the garlic probably, so just start with a little smooth peanut butter. After a couple days of that, dip your garlic cloves into peanut butter and hold it out for them. It may still take a day or two of this then “bam “, it hits them , that’s kinda good, I have about 12-13 nannies and they will eat 3-5 whole cloves each if I let them have. The ones that don’t want it today make eat it next time, so I don’t worry if one turns up their nose. Normally when they see another gobbling them up they will come get one at least. Make sure you got a good dab of peanut butter on for the finicky goats and when they start to like or bite the garlic push it in their mouth, very few will spit it out. Once in and they chew it , they will swallow. Don’t mince the garlic, only serve in in cloves. It looses it healing properties. I have to break mind up before I go to pasture as I have two nannies that will grab a whole blub and run off and Wolf it down. I don’t like that but once they got it you may not can get it back. Like I said , I’m no goat professional but like I always say, “ if you stand close to the heater, you feel the heat”. Same with your goats. Sorry this is too long, but, it’s what I do. Good luck.


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