# More udder and conformation pics - compare the three does



## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

I havent yet got more photos of that saanen doe, but here are a couple of others I have enquired about. I'd really appreciate your thoughts on them

British Alpine, 3 yrs old, giving 5L (11 lbs or 1.3 gallons) per day



















Saanen doe, 2 yrs old, giving 2L (4.4 lbs or half a gallon) per day but only milking one side - have enquired why, not heard back yet










I am just waiting to hear back from the guy with the other saanen doe about his price, this lady is looking for 500 for the two of them to go together, which is ridiculously cheap given that she is one of the top names in show goats in Australia. I am thinking the other guy will probably want more than 250 for his doe, anyway will see. I am waiting for rear udder photos on these two does.

So what do you guys think - would you buy these two does??

As a side note yet again, I am seeing a steep rump on the british alpine - something the australian breed needs to work on? The saanen seems better in this regard - but then again, there is probably three or four times the number of saanens in Australia compared to BAs.

EDIT:

So this is the first doe, they are asking $400 for her














































Would you go for the two animals for 500, or is the first doe superior enough to justify spending the higher amount on her? Which way would you go?


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## PiccoloGoat (Sep 10, 2008)

*Re: More udder and conformation pics - different does*

I think they both look nice.
The second Doe is more level and such.
But i havent a clue 

Good Luck with em :wink:


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## goathappy (Oct 5, 2007)

*Re: More udder and conformation pics - different does*

Doe #1: She's a very nice long doe, very dairy, she has nice shoulders and appears to have nice feet. She's showing a bit of weakness in the chine.

Doe #2: Not as dairy as the first doe, more heavily built, she appears to have a better rump angle that doe #1, she has good body capacity but you don't see the dairyness and length of neck that you do in doe #1.


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## sweetgoats (Oct 18, 2007)

*Re: More udder and conformation pics - different does*

I really like Doe #1. She is beautiful.


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## PiccoloGoat (Sep 10, 2008)

*Re: More udder and conformation pics - different does*

haha guess I was wroong.


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

*Re: More udder and conformation pics - different does*

i like both.. and i don't think its a steep rump.. it looks like she is relaxed and not too concerned..

and over a gallon is fantastic..

the white doe is nice.. and leveler.. but i really like the first


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

what do you guys think of the two versus the other saanen with the good udder?


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## PiccoloGoat (Sep 10, 2008)

I think the 2 does together would be more worth it.


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

I would go for the more expensive single doe. She is of much nicer quality and you'll be able to ask more for her kids. JMHO.


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

honestly.. body wise the two saanen does are n't much different... too bad you dont have a rear udder shot on the one..

i think the two is a better choice


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

This is what happened with the saanen:

'The saanen kidded while we were away at a family do and the lady who looked after them didnt realize she was missing so when we got home 3 days later no kids and a very sick doe with mastitis just on one side. I could not get anything out at all and it just ended up dry. I hate to think of those babies as we have plenty of foxes and i always kid in sheds. She was way down the padock and I would say thats where she last saw it or them.'

The breeder is going to send me some udder pics of them when her daughter gets home. 

The saanen's mother was a champion show doe in 2005, and she has the twin buck to this doe who is apparently throwing very nice kids. She also has kept a sister of the alpine plus a doe kid out of her. 

Will update again when I get the udder shots.


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

It'll be interesting to see their rear udders as the attachment looks poor from the side. They also do not have good fore attachments as it is hanging down (more so the Alpine). But as SDK said, their body types are kind of similar. It certainly is a better price for the two.


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

and i think the two does may be milked out or not full


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## hornless (Oct 5, 2007)

I really like that first doe. Her udder is very nice, well attached, nice teats, maybe a tad more MSL needed, but still very nice. And in the pic of her grazing, her rump looks nice, just in the last pic does it look really steep, which I think is her stance. Nice long neck, very dairy- I'd go with the single doe.


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

hornless, what is MSL?

I can see where you guys think the BA hasnt got a strongly attached udder, but I thought the saanen (that goes with her) looks to have a nice tight high udder? Though not as smooth a foreudder as the other saanen. 

I quite liked the depth on the pair saanen compared to the BA and the single saanen - or is that not 'dairy'? Do you want a leggier animal in the dairy breeds?


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

MSL = Medial suspensory (sp?) ligament - the medial.

I can't be sure how high and tight her udder is without the rear view. Her forudder is much nicer than the BA but not as smooth as the other Saanen (the single one). 

I like a doe with both dairy character but also the body capacity and depth, a good balance of both.


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

Okay this is starting to get confusing so I might start calling them by their names:

The single saanen is Anna and the pair are Kibale (saanen) and Grace (british alpine). 

I'm going to try and explain my logic here and hopefully you can give your opinions. I'm not that great at judging dairy animals so bear that in mind. 

Comparing the two saanens bodywise, I think they both have well structured legs, length of body, good angle to the rump. Kibale has more depth and body capacity, which I like, but Anna has more overall balance, which is more pleasing to the eye. Leaving aside the fact that one side is dead, Kibale appears to have a reasonable udder, Anna has a very good udder with strong attachments, they both seem to be producing respectable amounts of milk, and I am just waiting on udder shots of Kibale to accurately compare them in this regard. 

At this stage, I am thinking that unless Kibale has a terrible udder, there is not a great deal of difference between the two, and my logic says that Kibale is cheaper than Anna, taking into account that Grace is part of the deal. Acknowledging that Grace is not as high quality as Anna or Kibale in terms of udder, although she has a reasonable body type and is producing a good amount of milk. 

Do you follow my logic, and what do you think of it? Am I missing the point completely and is Anna a MUCH better doe than Kibale?

Cant wait for those udder pics ...


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Just a thought. . . . since Kibale got mastitis this year - couldn't it be possible that the one half of her udder will never be able to produce milk? I've never dealt with mastitis and only know what I've read on it, but isn't this true?

I like the extension of the brisket on Kibale. She doesn't look to be in as good of condition as Anna though. Anna looks very well. Only thing I see is that her foreudder could be more extended, it is smooth though and that is great. 

Did you get the udder pics yet or do you have a timeframe on when you will get them? 

I still like Anna better for these reasons: I like her overall conformation and balance, dairy character, and udder. She looks very healthy and well-cared for too. The only downside is her price. . . . but I think she is worth it. But in the end, you know what you like best and go by your "gut." That's what my mom always says, go by what you feel is best.


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

Yeah I dont think Kibale will ever milk from the affected side. But while I will use the milk I am more interested in these two (Grace and Kibale) for their breeding potential. 

Aargh, havent got the udder shots yet. Will email her to find out when. 

I'm considering being naughty (hee hee hee) and buying all three. If my angora sale follows through I might just. Sell 16 angoras and replace them with 3 dairy does, my mum cant get too angry bout that can she? :angel2:


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Now that's a great idea!!  Just what I would have done! :shades: 

How old is Anna anyways?? The other girls are pretty young. . . . but I don't recall seeing her age.


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

Anna is 4 yrs. 

Should have those udder shots by tomorrow. The breeder of Kibale and Grace just told me Grace has better attachments than that photo shows ... her mother has never ever been beaten in the show ring. Twice best of breed at sydney royal. The only reason she is selling grace is that her teats are too large to be a top show doe, but she said she is happy for me to show her, just as long as I realise she wont be winning the big titles. But she might be good for me to get my feet wet.


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