# Buy or A.I.



## IFFGoats (Apr 8, 2013)

I was wondering if you think i should buy a couple of bucks or just A.I.?


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces (Apr 7, 2013)

If you know how to AI, you can definitely use it to your advantage with the genetic potentials, but I'd have a buck on hand just in case, as some does will not take with AI breedings. Plus, AI-ing every doe you have would be crazy expensive.


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## MsScamp (Feb 1, 2010)

I agree with Little Bits. Even if you choose to go the AI route, you're still going to need a clean up buck for the does who don't settle with AI.


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## ptgoats45 (Nov 28, 2011)

You also generally need a buck to help bring the does in heat and know when they are in. Most people also advise to not AI virgin does, so you would need a buck for them.


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## ciwheeles (Apr 5, 2013)

AI can open up a lot of doors, breeding wise. But, the start up costs are very expensive. Plus the chance of conception is lower with, if your new to doing AI, than with just a normal breeding and knowing when and how to AI takes practice. 

I think it's better to start out with a buck and have a long term goal of getting into AI. That's what I've done and plan in doing.


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## BRBG7 (Oct 17, 2013)

I tried AI for 2 years in a row each time spending $75 a straw for 5 does plus a couple hundred for supplies and for the AI person to actually do it. I never got any AI kids. Last year a dairy breeder near me got 12 of her does bred and none of them took either. Through personal experience its way easier buying a nice buck than trying to synchronize a group of does. If you did want to try to do AI get a good technician with good reviews.


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

We use to AI cows. You really have to be dedicated to paying attention to heat cycles and everything else. We would give shots to bring them into heat and then check 3 or 4 times a day until they came into heat. Then my brother would AI. It's a LOT of work. Unless there is some super high-powered buck you want to breed to and unless you have enough does to make it worth your time and effort to AI and unless you, yourself, know how....I don't know if the cost would justify it. Plus, if it's as difficult to actually get them pg as posted above...you're going to get very frustrated.


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## TheMixedBag (Oct 16, 2010)

Laparoscopic AI has a better preg rate than trans-cervical AI does, but the price difference is a bit steep. Tanks are NOT cheap, and neither is paying for a semen service company to store them for you. AI classes around here run about $400 a pop, kits about $125.


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## HoukFarms (Apr 14, 2013)

Wow I never knew that A.I. Was soo expensive!!


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## BRBG7 (Oct 17, 2013)

Like kccjer we AI breed in cattle and some years we have 100% success rates and others we have one out of 10 cows have an AI calf. Semen tanks are expensive and they cost a lot to maintain ( you have to keep filling with liquid nitrogen). Ai has helped out our cattle operation a lot but unfortunately we couldn't find the same success in our goat herd. Goats have to be at least three times more expensive to AI breed than cattle.


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## TheMixedBag (Oct 16, 2010)

We have tanks that you only need to fill every 20 weeks but it's $1000. Liquid nitrogen is $1.35 a pound, and while semen is usualy $5-$10 per unit, you oftem have to (and really want to) buy in bulk, which can cost over $100 depending on distance.


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces (Apr 7, 2013)

How many tanks do you have, and how big are they to come out to $1000 for fills? 
1 liter of liquid nitrogen it's 1.782lb so if you had to fill, say 35 liters, it'd only cost $85-86 at $1.35 a pound.


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## TheMixedBag (Oct 16, 2010)

I don't have any, but my job sells them. I want to say they hold 1860 units, but I could be wrong. I have to double check.

Now, the cost of the tank (or rental, as we have giant tanks for clients so they don't need to have one) and semen doesn't even begin to cover the cost of bringing the doe into heat or the cost of the procedure, whichever one you choose to do.

ETA: $1000 is how much the tank costs, not the fill price.


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces (Apr 7, 2013)

Oh, ok, gotcha. I've seen brand new tanks with 7 month hold times for $600, so it's not that bad, I'm looking into getting my own tank and learning A.I this year.


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## TheMixedBag (Oct 16, 2010)

It *looks* like it's fairly easy, at least to learn. I've attended 5 LAP AIs and one trans-cervical AI. The tank is likely going to be your biggest expense, but I'd imagine it's a lot nicer to have your tank with you than renting out space at a CSS facility.

You want to get into a real expensive headache? Try flushing and ETing goats. Gah.


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces (Apr 7, 2013)

Oh, hey, how expensive is flushing and ET with goats?


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## TheMixedBag (Oct 16, 2010)

It depends on where you go, but it's comparable to the price for cattle (around $300 per flush, $125 for embryo transfer), but then you have to add in the costs to sync the recip does, get the donor doe AIed and then the cost of the laparascopic flush (goats can't be flushed via catheter like cattle can, at least not where I work). If you're doing fresh transfers, it's cheaper, but if you're freezing the embryos, then you have the costs of processing and freezing added.


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