# Wildflowers kidding countdown



## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Here is my goat, Wildflower. She is due January 20th. As you can tell not much of an udder yet. Her mother's udder is impressive and this is her second kidding (first with me) So......

http://i869.photobucket.com/albums/ab26 ... CN2764.jpg


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Wrong picture- That is her sweet face. Here is the rear view.(new to photobucket)

http://i869.photobucket.com/albums/ab26 ... CN2766.jpg


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

looking fat and preggy 

what day is she on?


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

She's looking very round!!


The second time around I found that udders are more pronounced, she'll likely live up to being her mothers daughter :thumbup:


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Stacey- she is on day 108 as of today. She is from the Caesar's Villa line (hence her look). I believe she had twins last year.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

certainly twins if not triplets in there :thumb:


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Although I would love trips, I worry because she is my smallest goat in height and stature. I don't need my first goat birth to be a huge assisted birth!!!!


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

trips dont necessarily mean assisting needed


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

I know, I am just a worry wart (with my goats and children) :wink:


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

She's looking good. I saw twins.  I'm sure you wont have any problems but if you need any help you can always call me.


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Thanks Ashley! I am sure I will do fine but I will keep your number just in case!!!!! I did get the bo-se from an area vet. How much should I give and when?


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

She's Cute! 

I say twins  

Whats her breeding? Caesars Villa perked my ears :wink:


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

I give the Bo-Se about a week before they are due. 1cc per 40 lbs is what I give.


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Addie, here is the pedigree...

sire-Caesar's Villa FDSheriff *S
dam-Doubletrees FS Truffles

sire-Caesar's Villa PN Fiddler *S
dam- ARMCH Caesar's Villa STS Suthrn Bell 2*D

sire 4Fun Frankie Sinnot *S
dam-Doubletree C Litl Bito Jessica

as copied from her AGS record

Jen


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

she looks great....I also say... twins maybe trips... :wink: :greengrin:


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## Idahodreamer (Sep 19, 2009)

Nice looking doe. Love that shade of red!
I am going to say 'twins'. :girl: :girl:


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

I like her color too! I have one roan, one white, one frosted, one black with moonspots and one red! It's a rainbow of goats at our house!!!!! :stars:


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## Sweet Gum Minis (Oct 6, 2007)

I have two due late January, Cha-Cha on 1-23 and Hallelujah on 1-24 and your girl looks about the same as mine. Looking good!


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Oh good to know. I have another (Jasmine) due on the same day. She looks bigger to me but she is a larger-looking goat than Wildflower. I will try to start her kiddingthread this weekend.


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

And just for fun you could start Jazz's kidding thread really early. :wink: :thumb:


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## sweetgoats (Oct 18, 2007)

Looks Great. I have several due around the same time.

Very pretty girl.


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Okay Ashley- I will try to start Jazz's kidding thread this weekend. I know you can't wait to see her!!!!! :wink:


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

:dance: :slapfloor:


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Tad bit of an update. Today while petting Wildflower and checking her over, I noticed a bit of discharge. Not a long mucus string but a clearish bit (similar to heat discharge). Is this normal? She seems fine, eating, drinking, affectionate as always. Her due date is estimated (not an exact one) As always, I worry with it so cold. I will pick up a baby monitor this weekend. You would have thought I would have kept one after having four children!


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

Its not uncommon for some does to start losing their plug over a month ahead of kidding time. I wouldnt worry- shes progressing right along :thumbup: 

Now where are those Jasmine pics :clap:


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

Discharge is normal....from clear to a creamy white, any with blood or greenish looking is not normal.

Baby moniters are AWESOME!! I got the one I have had for 6 years at the Thrift Store...works very well and I paid like $5 for it.


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Jamines pics are coming!!!!! You and Ashley!  Jasmine is much bigger!


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

The discharge is normal as long as it doesn't smell bad.


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

No smell, no discoloration just a bit of clear (and by bit -I mean small drip drip)


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

Yeah, thats nothing to worry about. :thumb:


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## shanzone2001 (Nov 8, 2009)

I am glad you posted that picture. I have tried to put good pooch pics up here, but my goats always run away and won't let me. I bought them 3 months ago as "possibly bred". My goat looks the same size and not much udder yet either, so I was worried she may not be bred. Your due date gives me some sort of timeline! Thanks!!! I would LOVE for one of the two I bought to kid!!! Good luck with your doe!
Shannon :wave:


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

here is an update on Wildflower... small bag developing

.photobucket.com/albums/ab260/4-goatkids/DSCN2791.jpg

and

photobucket.com/albums/ab260/4-goatkids/DSCN2792.jpg


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## BetterBuckskins (Feb 1, 2009)

Look at that baby bump! :shocked: :dance:


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

I know- she is really getting big! I can feel an udder forming slowly...


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Wildflower is ready to pop! She waddles. Her udder is pretty big (though still hairy- trimmers come quick!) I talked with the breeder I brought her fromtoday and she said the earliest she could be due is tomorrow (145). Wildflower looks very uncomfortable but no thick discharge and still eating and drinking. It is cold here and as always-I worry. How early do people start doing night time checks? (My husband already thinks I am goat crazy)


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## Idahodreamer (Sep 19, 2009)

I usually do night checks starting day 142.


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## BetterBuckskins (Feb 1, 2009)

Especially with the cold weather I'd start doing them now.


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

I assumed I should- this weekend is supposed to have a cold snap. How often do you go 2-3 hours? I usually go to be at 9:30 ish but get up about 4


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## Idahodreamer (Sep 19, 2009)

Starting from day 142, I check on them every 4 hours, checking their ligs and udders mostly. As day 148 grows closer, I start checking them every 2 hours. When they start having discharges or looking really uncomfortable I usually sit with them for about 2-3 hours. You should see my books when I bring them home after the 'goatie midwife visit'. the edges are completely tattered from being nibbled on. :ROFL:


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

Have you checked her ligaments?


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Ashley- I can't find her ligaments but I couldn't find them before either. I can feel them on my other does but Wildflower (who is very patient with me). can you give me specific directions... I follow the spine down toward the tail but before I feel anything I can feel the pinbones(top of legs). I can wrap my hand around her tail head but again I could before also. Help?


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## Mully (Jun 23, 2009)

She looks like those little goaties will just POP out of there ... 1,2,3 would be my guess. Post pictures after the event... best of luck


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

If you can't find her ligaments then you need to go by behavior and how posty she is.


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

Yes I agree with Ashley

But also- it is UNMISTAKEABLE when they really truly lose their ligaments and are within hours of kidding- that entire area back there turns to mush


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Don't think we are there yet then. I will keep you updated. By the way what is the bose dose again? And I am going to worm after kidding with safeguard (it is a paste style ) How do you know how much when it is a turn style container?

Thanks girls!


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

triple the goats weight and then dose by the weight. 

With horse paste wormers you cant over dose them so more is better then less


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Here are yesterday's pictures...


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

and another...









her udder has grown more today (still no clippers) and she has a small amount of discharge and some on her tail (small amount though)


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

awe cute udder :thumb: 

twins I say


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

ND's don't usually have a lot of discharge, I think only one of mine has so far. They are more for the drama of yelling, talking, pawing, funny faces, ect. lol Or they don't let on that anything is happening.


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

judging by pictures I would say you have some time yet
That udder will fill more and her kids will drop- they are still nice and high

I say twins too! :clap:


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Believe it or not I think jasmine may go first. Her udder is starting to come in and she looks very relaxed in the bottom area


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

YAY- I dont know what the heck she was waiting for- but I bet it blows up over the next week and a half

I cant wait to see Don Juan's kiddos! :leap:


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Wildflower kidded this am after a long night. She had trips buck (not doing well), doe (doa) and a doe (the best of the bunch). After much help from Ashley at Phoneix Rising we decided to transport the two remaining kids to my vet for iv fluids. Neither kid will nurse. The buck is very floppy. Wildflower still hasn't delivered the afterbirth (still hanging) so the may be the second vet trip. All in all delivery was smooth just after not so great. This was our first delivery and my children are struggling with the fact that life doesn't always go as we plan.


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

Oh my gosh- so sorry to hear about the rough time. (and your loss)
Glad Ashley could help you through it though!

I am ray: that the two kids thrive for you and that momma is okay


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

the doe has 24 hours to drop the placenta -- I wouldnt rush her to the Vets office just yet. Give her some calcium to help her contract to get the afterbirth out. Have you given her some molasses water? they love that and its good for energy 

as to the kids -- have you tube fed them? IV fluids will only help so far. What is their temp? 

I have tube fed many times so if you need instructions I can lend a hand


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

I didn't know how to tube feed. I tried with a syringe minus the needle but no luck. I decided for my children's sake to bring them to the vet. I need some bottle advice just in case. Tips?


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

are they sucking now? have they gotten any colostrum into them? 

I dont bottle feed anymore because I freek out when doing it so no advise to give you there


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

Milk your doe out to get some colostrum ready for the bottle if you need it- put that in the fridge

If you can- get a pritchard teat/lamb teat at your local feed store and it screws onto a 20 oz soda bottle

if you cant find those- get a regular baby bottle and cut an X in the tip of it for better flow

They should eat every 2-4 hours for now

If they dont have any suck reflex yet they will need to be tube fed until it develops

Also- if they have no suck reflex and you havent given them any bose- bose could help


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

I will try to reintroduce back to the doe if at all possible. I am just getting back up plan b- as of this morning no suck reflex at all. lips clamped shut.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

what did teh vet say?


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

Any ideas whats wrong with the kids?
Its strange that all three are having such a hard time... she wasnt early was she?

Tube feeding is SUPER easy- not nearly as scary as it sounds- but you will definately need to get colostrum into them asap- either via tube or bottle


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

the vet said possible sel. deficency. the doa I believe the cord broke? prior to arrival. I don't know. I think I did everything right. She did a great job delivering. I was right there. I tried and tried with the doa baby to revive but had to give up. Vet said girl is up and looking better. Boy could go either way


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

did the vet give bo-se then?
did you dose the doe with bo-se prior to kidding?


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

Yes she gave BoSe before kidding and to the kids


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

wow- how could they be deficient then? :scratch:


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

Well she gave BoSe before kidding and once the kids were out she called me and told me they weren't sucking and the boy couldn't really walk. So I told her to get BoSe into the boy, but he seemed to just keep going downhill.


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

how long before kidding was it given do you know?
Maybe it wasnt long enough ahead of time to be absorbed by the kids?

I do 4 weeks and 2 weeks ahead of time and dont have any issues with selenium def in the kids- last year i actually OD'd some of my kids by giving them a bit of bo-se when they were born too- it was not good, so now I just only dose the does ahead of time.


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

I do it a week ahead of time and haven't had an issue. I don't do it any earlier because I was told by someone that if you give it too early it can cause them to kid too early.


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

I quess I am to blame as I didn't dose far enough in advance. I did 10 day ago assuming she was due around the 20-21 which was what we originally expected prior to me calling the past breeder


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

hmm never had one kid early from bo-se and I do that to all of my does.
you dose CD&T at 4 weeks out to ensure the kids get the transfer of that- so thats why bo-se is done at the same time here


and you cant blame yourself for this! :hug:


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

PH i thought it was MuSe you OD the kids on because the vet didnt give you the smaller dosage and dosed as if it was BoSe


anyway Jen I wouldnt think its your fault, I dont give BoSe to my goats at all and I have heard 1 week before kidding ot give the BoSe. 

Are teh kids still at the vets office is that what I am gathering?


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Kids still there. Going to call around three and pick up whomever is thriving (if any) He is concerned the doe may reject them. I did milk her out a bit to make her more comfortable and saved it in the fridge for the kids


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

No it was bo-se- just a stronger concentration than usual I guess :shrug:

This is where I got the bo-se information-
http://fiascofarm.com/goats/prenatalcare.html
they actually suggest giving it 5 weeks prior to kidding- but I just give it the same time we dot cd&t at 4 weeks out


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

Everyone gives BoSe at different times. I prefer to give as few shots as I can during pregnacy to reduce the chance for a reaction. In which case Epi and Dex would need to be given, which would in turn, induce labor. So by giving it later , if there is a reaction, the kids have a better chance of survival. BoSe is also an injection and injectable is absorbed much faster than oral, so a week before kidding is OK. Kids with deficiency perk up just hours after oral dosing, so injectable is fine at a week before. :thumb:


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

To each their own- but like I said CD& T is given 4 weeks out to make sure the kids get the full protection from it and that is an injectable too, so I would think it would take just as long to absorb bo-se injectable as cd&t

Was just providing the information I have and use and sharing it for others to see and make their own assessments


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

Same here, just saying why I do what I do. 

With CD&T they are making antibodies so it is affecting the immune system. It is a totally different process. So yes, I give cdt 4 weeks before kidding IF the doe has gotten it before and has never had a reaction.

With BoSe they are not making antibodies they are absorbing vitamins. Again just any fyi. :thumbup:


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Vet said doe is doing okay. boy is sucking by very shaky on his feet although alert. I am going to pick them up. He said they will need to be handfed until stronger. Addie and Ashley- thank you both for your concerns and for sharing... you are both wonderful resources for us to have!!!!!!! :kidblue: :kidred:


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

Awesome news!  :wahoo: :stars:


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

GREAT! keep us posted- it sounds like you may need to tube feed

have your vet give you a large syringe and tiny catheter and if you need help doing it- just let me know!


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

I think this came in my baby kit from Hoeger. Is it the save a kid syringe? Help addie!


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

if the buck is sucking I wouldnt tube him -- you should work with him on a bottle or with mom.

As to tubing yes the save a kid is what you use. You will want to coat it will veggie oil so it slides down nicely. YOu insert the tube -- it wont go in if its headed to the lungs. THen you attach the syringe with the kids head up you push down slowly on the plunger. 

works better if you have two people


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

Yep, it's the save a kid syringe. Comes with the catheter and the syringe. You measure it from the mouth to the elbow and that will be how far you need to put the tube down. I've only tubed a goat once for bloat. 

I'm sure your vet will show you how to do it if he thinks he will need it, but I would try to get them on the bottle like Stacey said.


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Vet says I should wait on Wildflower's placenta- no oxytocin now. She pushes every now and then ut seems fine. Should I be concerned?


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

If she pushes every once and a while then she is trying to get rid of it on her own, just keep an eye on her temp.


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

So sorry to hear that your babies have had a rough start....their progress sounds good though, give mama some extra TLC and of course once those babies have a bottle of colostrum in their tummies they'll perk up...do try though to get them on mama if you think they are strong enough and if you think mom will take them back.


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## 4kids (Jul 21, 2009)

Babies looking better. baby girl nursed on mama for a bit but I brought her in the house per vet's request. Baby boy to weak to nurse well (syringe feeding) but seems better then the floppy baby this am.


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## ProctorHillFarm (May 15, 2008)

How did the night with the babies, how are they? Hows mom....and how are YOU :hug:


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