# Bottle Babies make bad mothers?



## lilaalil (Sep 5, 2014)

Hi! I've been stalking this forum for awhile, and will finally be moving out to my land next month, and ready for goats by the beginning of March. Yay! So now I can start making plans. 

There is not a huge selection of quality dairy goats in my area (or so it seems from stalking Craigslist). Also, it seems most people around here leave their goats horned, which I don't feel comfortable with, as we have small children. I don't think banding the horns is an option here, as it is very, very wet here (Hawaii) and I'm afraid of rotting/ fungus issues. 

But there is a goat dairy about an hour away that sells bottle babies every spring for $25 each. Since they are a business, they have been selectively bred for milk production, even using AI, and they dis-bud all babies. So, while I may find some nice, hornless milk goats on Craigslist at some point, these dairy farm bottle babies are a sure thing. 

So, finally, to the point, a few questions about bottle babies!

1. I really want to dam-raise any future offspring. Is it true that bottle babies are more likely to reject their own kids? I don't want to get into an endless cycle of bottle babies producing more bottle babies. 
2. What do you think of the temperament of bottle babies vs dam-raised?
3. If I happened to find a nice adult doe, at some point after getting my 2 bottle babies, would she be likely to be nice to the babies, and would they benefit from each other's company? Ideally, I would find an adult either in milk or pregnant, so we could start getting milk sooner than waiting for the bottle babies to grow up. I guess the answer to this one is probably "it depends", but just wondering what others' personal experiences were. 

I think that's it, but anything else you think I should know, or experiences, please comment. I've been reading online about raising bottle babies, and think I could do it, time-wise, etc., but it's certainly not what I would choose, if there were more options around here. 

Thanks!


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

In your case I would go for the dairy that's an hour away. They will have been disbudded in their first week & have gotten colostrum.
The owner will probably be happy to show you how to give injections too.
As for bottle vs dam raised, all my dam raised are in my face friendly though I have had a few bottle raised who made equally fantastic mothers.


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## Goat_in_Himmel (Jun 24, 2013)

As for how an adult doe treats youngsters who aren't hers, it has a great deal to do with the temperament of the doe. My current herd queen's a treasure, as she's nice to all the youngsters, while still letting them know the rules. I ended up selling someone else, who was mean to kids who weren't hers.


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

I agree with Nancy on the dairy being a good choice for you. They would most likely be willing to help you out with any questions you might have also. 

I don't see a big difference in temperament in a small herd of bottle babies vs dam raised. In larger herds where the goats don't get as much "pet" time....then the bottle babies tend to be pretty "in your face" vs the others. But that also makes them friendlier and easier to do things with too. My bottle babies (the few that I have ever had) were all good mothers too so that shouldn't be a concern.


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## janecb (Sep 23, 2014)

I have a small herd, and some of my goats are friendly, some are not. Those that aren't have clearly decided they've been deeply wronged by humankind and no amount of chips, grain, or petting will ever change their opinion :lol: But I have many dam-raised goats who are as friendly as my bottle baby goats, if not more so.

As for mothering, my bottle babies seem to do fine. I've had dam-raised goats who were awful mothers one time, fantastic the next; the same goes for the bottle-raised goats. It really depends on the goat herself... most of the horrible mothers were just *stupid* goats (it doesn't sound nice, but they must've had next to no brain cells).

And for whether an adult doe will be ok with babies... as long as they aren't trying to nurse off of her, she should be fine with them... although it does depend on her temperament.


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## J.O.Y. Farm (Jan 10, 2012)

I've had bottle kids go on to dam raise and are great mothers! Some does (dam or bottle raised) will reject kids.. I've had some do that as FFs and are fine the next year.. 
I agree that the dairy sounds like a good choice!  good luck!!


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## ariella42 (May 22, 2014)

I bought my first goats this spring as bottle babies from a small local dairy. We got high-quality kids (as far as milk production) for a fraction of what they're worth just because they had so many they had to get rid of. Ours are 8 months old now. They're a bit needier than the dam-raised kids I've met, but they're super sweet and just love it when my husband or I are around. In the summer, we were told that the dairy was downsizing due to some health issues and their FFs were for sale. We eventually decided to get one, and the only one left was one of our bottle babies' mothers. She was a bottle baby herself, and even though her daughter was pulled at a week old, she recognized her and started mothering her. She also took over our other one (though she's a bit less tolerant with her). I think that it really does depend on the doe how good of a mother she is and how she accepts other kids. We've been super happy with little herd so far. The dairy owner has been a huge help to us too, and it's really nice to have local resources.


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## lilaalil (Sep 5, 2014)

Great, thanks so much, everyone! I loved reading all your responses, and I'm so glad that the "bad mother" thing has not been your experience. I could handle all the possible drawbacks I read about, except for that. And I really think these babies are my best option (at least that's presented itself so far), so I'm glad it seems it'll be ok!


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Arieilla don't you just love it when a doe recognizes her kid after a long seperation! It just melts my heart.


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## Dayna (Aug 16, 2012)

Which dairy? On Big Island? Bonnie and Cloud were born there.


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## lottsagoats1 (Apr 12, 2014)

I have never had a bottle raised doe reject her kids, they were just as great a mom as their dam raised. In fact, any doe who ahs rejected her kids were dam raised.

I would go with the dairy farm bottle kids.


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## lilaalil (Sep 5, 2014)

ariella42 said:


> I bought my first goats this spring as bottle babies from a small local dairy. We got high-quality kids (as far as milk production) for a fraction of what they're worth just because they had so many they had to get rid of. Ours are 8 months old now. They're a bit needier than the dam-raised kids I've met, but they're super sweet and just love it when my husband or I are around. In the summer, we were told that the dairy was downsizing due to some health issues and their FFs were for sale. We eventually decided to get one, and the only one left was one of our bottle babies' mothers. She was a bottle baby herself, and even though her daughter was pulled at a week old, she recognized her and started mothering her. She also took over our other one (though she's a bit less tolerant with her). I think that it really does depend on the doe how good of a mother she is and how she accepts other kids. We've been super happy with little herd so far. The dairy owner has been a huge help to us too, and it's really nice to have local resources.


Aww, that's a sweet story! I'd love it if our goat dairy happened to be downsizing at the right time (they do occasionally sell off an adult). I'd even be happy to take an older one that only had one more season left in her, and then let her live out her old age with us, since by the time she was done milking, the babies would be grown and ready to take over. Guess we'll see how it works out!

Glad your mama and baby got reunited! That's so cute.


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## lilaalil (Sep 5, 2014)

Dayna said:


> Which dairy? On Big Island? Bonnie and Cloud were born there.


Hi Dayna! Yup, I was thinking Hawaii Island Goat Dairy, up in Ahualoa.


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## harleybarley (Sep 15, 2014)

I have a bottle mom who never touched her own kids til she birthed on my farm. She scared the crap out of me, wouldn't even look at them, but when she understood they were HERS she turned into a different goat. She still comes up to me sometimes with deep looks like "how can I ever say this?" She dotes on her kids and grandkids. I can't sell the wether grandkids, because she loves them soo much. She lost so much before she came here.

I also have a bottle baby who is an absolutely indifferent mother. She didn't reject, she just doesn't love. She just has no concept of parenting. And I learned something - half of the deal is the kids. Good kids will stick by a bad mom. If she'll feed them and you'll help them, it can work out. Bad mom will go out in pasture and forget she has kids. After getting "lost" a couple times, the kids learned it's up to them to keep track of mom. Yeah, sometimes I had to go out and save the kids. I literally took her and her kids out to pasture and showed her how to keep track of her kids. But a good herd will step in, too.

The first generation is iffy, but it's not a permanent problem. If the bottle babies are bad moms, you teach the kids what love and trust and safety feels like, and they know how to be better parents.


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## janeen128 (Dec 31, 2012)

I have both bottle raised and dam raised does, and they are all great moms.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

welcome!!! 

I have a few does who never got to raise their own babies until they got here...they are the best moms ever..not issues...our bottle raised kids are all wonderful moms as well..as for introducing an adult to the kids..do so slowly...keep watch..most does will shove the kids off but not agressive...but there is always those who can be quite mean...


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