# Have you experienced UC in the past and had a animal survive?



## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

I am curious who on this list has ever experienced UC in one of their animals and had it survive? Also would like to know what you fed....and feed now or if UC made you change their diet? I am in the middle of it now. Just had surgery. Would love to hear others experiences with UC.

Please either PM me directly or chat here....I need to chat with others who have experience with UC.

Thank you!

Tami


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Bump


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Yep, I have...I'll go dig out his records, it was years ago...


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

I'd be greatful for any info. Trying to make sense of what I thought was great diet for my boys. . Whatever you have to share would be appreciated Jill.


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Case file Willy...Boer/Togg cross. 

Willy was raised by an elderly woman by bottle and then fed nothing but grass hay his whole growing life. He was 2 when we ended up with him. 
At age 4 he threw a stone into the urethra. He was taken to Caine, where a minor surgery was preformed removing his pizzle to allow him to drain out the stones. Consensus was that he had quit drinking during the cold snap we were having causing the bladder to tip. We were advised to use baited water and to add salt to feed at a rate of 6% to keep him drinking. We also added some alfalfa to better balance his diet.
This was during a 6 month job we were doing in Idaho. Moved back home to this place with my DH and his 4 broken ribs after a steer tried to kill him. 
At age 8 he again threw a stone, this time consulted with McMinnville Equine Center. The stone was palpable in the penis so I was able to turn it enough to drain his bladder slowly a few times a day. We were given 2 pills. Each pill was to crushed and divided into 6 piles. One pile a day was rubbed directly into his gums. 2 days later he started peeing mud and by a week later he was completely cleaned out. The pills were Uro-Ease 400. Consensus that time...It was Purina's fault. They bought out the Honor show feed company and changed to a least cost formula without telling anyone. Before that Honor had been a complete feed that was perfectly balanced for goats. That change killed many animals that year. 
Willy was one of the goats killed from a bad load of local grass hay when I lost almost my entire herd a couple years later. I never fed local hay again after that one.


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## Chopsgoats (Aug 20, 2013)

I had a wether live to the age of 15!!!! At the age of one year old I went out to put the goats down at night(2 wethers) and he was squatting and screaming. It looked like he was trying to pee. Reflexes I put my hand under him and blood was dribbling out of his penis. I threw him in the truck at 8:00 at night and found a vetto see him. He grabbed him and turned him over and cut off the tip of his penis. Imediately he stated peeing. I think we got lucky that it passed (almost) but we were new to goats and were feeding him some grain, not a lot but we were feeding it to him. After this we fed only quality hay and a good mineral mix. We had the two boys until they were 14 and 15 years old. Simple diet worked for us.


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## LadySecret (Apr 20, 2013)

I've only had one goat get UC. Panda was one of my first goats. He was a first generation mini Nubian. When he was 5 months old, he and four does escaped their pen and managed to travel five miles and ended up at a neighbors house. The neighbor raised chickens and thought goats could eat anything. So she feed all of them chicken feed. I got them back 3 days later. They were all skiddish and had watery stools from the chicken feed. But Panda was peeing bloody urine. I didn't know what it was but I knew it wasn't good. I called the local large animal vet. He didn't want to operate on a goat and told me he could come put him down or we could wait to see if he can pass the stones on his own. We waited it out. After a few days back at home and with his normal diet, he stopped peeing blood and fully recovered. His normal diet was all the pasture and browse he wanted (I'd say it made up 90% of his total diet), 2 flacks of alfalfa hay per day shared by the five goats, and 1/2 cup each of 12% sweet feed. Also, manna pro loose minerals.

I think the only reason he recovered was because the UC was caused by a sudden change in diet and not his normal diet. The stones didn't form over a long period of time. They were small stones that he could pass. I'd say this isn't the typical UC situation most people face but since you where looking for survivors, I thought I'd share. 
Here's a picture of him. He's the one in the middle. Not a great picture but this was a long time ago. His sister is the black goat and the little brown Pygmy was the sweetest goat ever. Really miss those three. They were great first goats.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

One buck got UC at 9 months. Cut the tip off (the pizzle) and he survived. He did end up having it again later in life at his new owners. I know she did something for him (I think a flushing) and he's still alive to this day


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Wow this is so fantastic! Thank you so much for responding!! How you are going to help people like us!!! Thank you Jill, Chopsgoats, Ladysecret and Stacey!!! 

So....Another question for each of you. Were your boys who had UC all bottle babies from birth? I am curious about this connection....so thought I would ask.

Jill: What a amazing story about your Willy! That is interesting about the medication you rubbed on his gums. And it dissolved the stones! So they must have been struvite stones. Did you ever find out what they were? Interesting!! So you didn't say I don't think in his case history....Purina was to blame. But you said he only had grass hay and alfalfa in his diet. Did he also have grain? Maybe I missed that in the post. I am so sorry for your loss! How sad about the bad local hay....
What hay do you use with your boys now, you probably told me and I have forgotten. We use Orchard Grass that is eastern oregon....from a local hay guy who really has fantastic hay. His family business.

Chopsgoats: Wow that is amazing! Thank you for sharing your case history on your boy! Wow he lived a long time. Don't you just love wethers!? I am so sorry for your loss. Wethers we have found are just special!! Thank you for sharing about your diet! That is interesting how you changed the diet and he didn't get stones again. I am thinking we are going to do that. I don't want to take out minerals though as the vet hosp is saying to do. 
So was your wether a bottle baby from birth?

LadySecret: Wow Panda was so precious! Thank you for sharing his photo and those of your other two! They are adorable! So sorry for your loss! Thanks for sharing what you fed him as well! That is helpful! Very interesting information! Yes that is amazing he recovered so quickly! Wish that had been our situation! The pizzle was cut off on our wether but he didn't pee like he should have. Although he did still have a stream....and we were able to wait a bit for surgery which was good because he was getting over pnuemonia.

Stacey: Thank you for your case history of your buck too! This is really helpful! I am hopeful that our wether won't get stones again with a change in our diet for him but if he does it is good to know they can flush them..... I will share our case history too in this thread although I think I have already shared it elsewhere but probably not all the details. So I will do that here but not tonight.

Thanks so much everyone that has chimed in so far! I really appreciate all of you taking the time to write down your case histories with your UC animals! Thank you!!!

Anyone else have case histories to share??

Tami


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## LadySecret (Apr 20, 2013)

Panda was dam raised but he was such a pocket pet you would have thought he was bottle raised.


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Thanks for that additional information!! What a sweet boy he must have been!!!


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Willy was a bottle baby from birth, raised on milk replacer, he belonged to my mother-in-law. 
The food he was on is called a total daily ration type food, it's impossible to find anymore unfortunately. It came in a 80 pound bag and contained everything needed coarse chopped grass, alfalfa, corn stalks, beet pulp, small amounts of oats, barley grass, etc. all perfectly balanced. It was a great food everyone did really well on it. Jeter was a youngster at that time and is still here now at age 14. 
He had Silica stones. Before moving to Idaho for that short job we did a stint in Fort Rock not far from the DE mine. That stuff is horrid, gets into everything everywhere. Anyway, my male dog also ended up with Silica stones from that trip. That's why I keep trying to tell everyone NOT to feed their goats DE. 

I would be interested to know if the goats are African or Swiss. I see so far it's a Boer mix and Nigies.


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Oh, I forgot, right now my boys are eating 2nd cut Montana alfalfa and 4 foot tall grass :lol:


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Wow Jil!! This is great information. Why on earth doesn't someone make that mix anymore?? Too costly?
Sounds like a great mix!!
Interesting that Willy was a bottle baby. So is our wether. I wonder if more people were to respond and share their case histories if perhaps there is more often than not a connection to UC and being bottle fed? It's at least interesting. 

Yes please everyone make sure you mention what breed you are sharing your case history about. That's a great point Jill!

I use DE in my garden mostly now. Used to use it in the barn. And tried it for mites externally but not sure it worked. It does work in the garden on pests tho. Do u use it at all on your farm? Thank you for sharing that info about silica stones and DE's connection! That's great info to have!

I will be finding out what stones our wether had. I forgot to ask today. I think he may have said calcium. But will ask. 


Oh you should share a photo of your Jeter!! Wow isn't 14 old for a goat?

Thanks for sharing what you feed. We don't have alfalfa hay. Meg doesn't want them to waste it. So we feed the girls organic alfalfa pellets. What's yr thought on those?

Thanks for all this information Jill!

Tami


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Here he is hiding from his wormer with his mouth clamped down :lol:


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Lol. What a handsome fella!! Sly for the wormer but handsome!!. Thanks for sharing his photo!
What are you using for worming? I'm not sure what to use next time we need some. The herbal wormer is working pretty well so far. What a difference a year can make. Will see what our next worm count is tho. Guess things can always change. I will test prob after kitty has her kids in June. Ivermectin I don't know if I should try that again or something else. It didn't work well last year.


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Great cyber space ate my reply, back in a few.


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## Chopsgoats (Aug 20, 2013)

This was Jasper, he was 2 weeks short of his 15th birthday. We loved the two wethers we had more than any animals we ever kept. Bottle fed them since they were two weeks old. We knew nothing about goats back them and learned along the way. We have a great vet that taught us a lot. We have four does now that we love very much but nothing like our boys!!!!


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Chopsgoats: Oh he is precious! What breed is he? Interesting both your boys were bottle fed! So your other boy didn't get UC? Was your other boy younger than Jasper? Wonder what was different with him? Was he a different breed?

Our Boer wether who just had surgery to remove his stones got UC. I have another wether who hasn't gotten it. He was dam raised. To me, the bottle baby aspect is very interesting!!! 

So if I'm counting right, we haven't heard from Stacey but three out of five (including mine) were bottle babies. Not sure how that plays into the equation but it may! I would guess Stacey's buck wasn't bottle fed. But will see what she says. 

I'm hoping more people give case histories! This is very good info for anyone who has male goats!!

Please if your reading this and had UC with one of your boys please share your case history of your animal! Thank you all for giving us info about your animals!


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Humm wonder what happened to Jill???


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## Chopsgoats (Aug 20, 2013)

They were both bottle fed born one day apart and they both had the same sire and only the one had UC but we stopped the grain at the same time. They were nigerians


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

I private messaged you - in the case I told you about, both were dam raised.


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Wow ok. Very interesting. So in their case it was probably diet. That is really interesting. Thanks for giving all this info about your boys!!


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Oh ok three havens. Thank you! I have messages I need to read. I'm sorry I haven't responded yet but I will. Thanks for letting me know!! I appreciate your taking the time to share your experience!


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

No problem! I know pretty much for sure their case was diet. Their sire had no history of the issue, and as far as I searched, none of his sons had either. Plus the quick onset.

Both of those boys were also neutered between 5 to 7 weeks. I will note, the one banded at 5 weeks was the first to develop stones in that particular situation, but they both eventually did.


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Interesting! Thanks for sharing this info too!! My boy prob was banded fairly early. Can't remember how early. The breeder told me. But breeder told me no hx with the sire. 49'er was his sire.


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Sorry Tammy, there's a Wolverine or big Fisher trying to tear into my barn this year. I fell into bed when I was done chasing it off. 

Okay pellets and wormer right?


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

I use alfalfa pellets in the winter for everyone. The boys get a mix of 2 parts alfalfa pellets and 1 part beet pulp at the rate of about 2 lbs a day. The girls get alfalfa pellets or Chaffe Hay pretty much free choice. Both get Orchard, alfalfa, or Teff hay. 

I am very careful not to pellets that have binders in them and won't feed pelleted feed for that reason. The muco-proteins used to glue the pellets are a known cause of UC.


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Oh Jil no worries!! I figured something must have happened. Wow that doesn't sound good!! I haven't had anything try to get in my barn yet. Hoping that doesn't happen. Not sure we have wolverines. What are big fishers? Not sure I've ever heard of that. 


Wow Jill thank you for this info! So where do you find beer pulp? You feed interesting grass. You guys must have better options for people selling grass hat over there! What is chaffe hay? Where do you find teff hay? That's cool. Teff grain is neat stuff!

So aren't the alfalfa pellets muco proteined together too? So all pellets would be bad for boys? They haven't been getting alfalfa pellets right now. But just wondered about that. We have organic ones. Shouldn't they not have that glue? I need to look at the brand and I will tell you more info after I get back from the barn.


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

So what wormer are you using now? I am not sure if I should try ivormectin again or not.


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Jil??


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Sorry. busy week and going to worse next week.

I still get use out of Safeguard for the young kids. 
Valbazen doesn't work here.
I use Ivomec and Ivomec Plus as needed.
I use Moxidectin as needed.

I will not buy a goat who has ever been injected with Ivomec. 

Soon I will be back to never needing to worm for years at a time as the lease on the back pasture is up and my little core place is pretty easy to keep worm free. 
I pay the neighbors 7 year old 5 cents a piece for every slug and snail he can catch for me during the warmer days, that helps a bunch.


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## lottsagoats1 (Apr 12, 2014)

I had a customer who bought one of my weanling Nubian bucklings who was then wethered. At about 18 months he developed UC. He was treated by the vet (pizzle-ectomy and flushed). He was fed a diet lacking in calcium because the owner had been told that male goats should never have alfalfa or any other supplement with calcium or grain/concentrates. The Vet wasn't really up on the dietary part of goat husbandry, so didn't suggest a diet change.

Once she changed to my suggested diet (alfalfa pellets added to a small amount of meat goat grower and free choice minerals) she never had a problem with UC again.

This kid was dam raised and wethered at about 3-4 months or so, maybe later.


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Jill thanks for letting me know what works for you regarding wormer! That is so great about the neighbor kids and the slugs and snails. I haven't seen any snails here but have seen slugs a bit.


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Lottsa goats thank you for commenting! I appreciate your case history! So the wether was dam raised? Interesting. And interesting about the diet. That is somewhat how our wether was being fed and he got UC. Maybe it has to do with amounts though too. Not sure. And maybe water minerals play a role. Not sure. Thank you for weighing in. Very interesting case histories presented in this thread


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