# Kidded 5 days ago and udder is getting engourged



## Overthehill (Apr 14, 2013)

First, please note that we are new to milking goats. Star, our pygmy gave birth to a single doe kid 5 days ago. The unusual thing is the first time she kidded, while she was with the previous owner, she had triplets.
She is producing too much milk. Her udder gets engourged. 
We started milking to relieve her once a day around 4 pm when her udder seems the fullest.
I believe the kid is getting enough because she is quite active and seems healthy. 
My questions are ,and I hope my questions aren't dumb, but do we milk her out or just enough to relieve her? Will we be taking milk from the baby?
Should we be milking her more than once a day? 
Our intention is to eventually use her as a dairy goat. I wanted to wait until 2 weeks and then separate the kid from Mum at night and milk her in the morning. 
She hates the milk stand too. I will give her a bit of feed in the bucket to keep her still but she eats so fast. I man the head while my husband milks the goat.She twists her head and tries to pull through. I try talking softly to her too but even that works for only so long. You see, since the kid is so young she bleats for her mum and that makes mum nervous. It's quite a dilemna.
Thank you for any advice and teaching us the basics


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

If she is that engorged you might want to relieve her twice a day. As kid grows it will be nursing larger amounts.


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## Overthehill (Apr 14, 2013)

okay, twice a day. Thanks Nancy. Do we just milk enough to relieve her because the kid is so young?


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Yes Id say so for now at least. Hopefully experienced dairy folks will chime in.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Many times we have to milk mom in the beginning until baby can drink more..The milk will not taste great the first few days as it has colostrum in it but by now you should be able to drink her milk..the thing about goats is you can milk her completely out and she will still hold on to enough for baby however We usually just milk until the udder is nice and loose but not empty... Sounds like you have a good milker there...


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Question is, do you want to eventually milk her? If you want to milk her, then start milking her twice a day and milk her out. With only one kid, you won't even have to separate at night.


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## Overthehill (Apr 14, 2013)

For real, I don't have to separate them? I have another goat who is a Nigerian Dwarf mix. She kidded almost 4 weeks ago to another doe. I started separating them at night - but guess what? Sunny the ND mix has learned how to unlatch the stall door and get out her baby. Unfortunately Sunny has very small teats and a weak stream. It takes us 10 minutes to get only a few tablespoons, unlike our Pygmy Star with the engourged udder. 
We were getting discouraged but of course we are real green horns too. So - I can still milk or try to milk both goats and not separate them from their kids because they only had one each? That would be great.  Thank you Karen and Cathy. And Nancy


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I have not known a single kid to be able to drink enough milk to make mom milkless. When I have had a single kid, I never bother to separate. I really want mom to make as much milk as possible.


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## janeen128 (Dec 31, 2012)

I have a kinder that kidded last Wednesday, she only has one kid too. She usually is really great on the milk stand, however I tried it w/o the baby being right there, and no way would she go for that.... So now baby gets tied to the milk stand too with momma, and now she is her good old self... so you may want to try that to calm her down... I milk her just once in the evening mainly for relief, but her milk is good now, so I might separate at night and milk in the morning starting tonight. I think I have a little piggy of a boy on her, I know he's getting his fair share I normally just milk my kinders once a day anyway, because I did it twice a day for about a month and I didn't get anymore milk... but your little gal might be different


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## Overthehill (Apr 14, 2013)

Janeen, thanks. I will try that. Maybe I can hold the kid near her so she can see her. She is still very young and Mom is very protective of her. She hasn't hit the terrible toddler stage like the other kid has. 
You see, Karen , I like your idea because we only have a small goat shed for them and not a lot of out buildings so the idea of keeping the kids together with the mothers is less stressful for everyone. So I have Sunny with her 4 week old kid right now and they are both pleased as punch. We will try to milk her tomorrow. We will also milk Star ( with the new kid) in the morning and in the afternoon because she has so much milk. Sounds like it will work.


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## Overthehill (Apr 14, 2013)

Update, we milked Star this morning ( the one with an engourged udder) and that went fine - except the the struggle towards the end. We also milked Sunny ( the one with the older kid) and we just got a few drops. We kept them both in with their kids. 
Sunny has small teats. I am wondering if we shouldn't even bother and wait for her second freshining. It's too bad because she will actually jump up on the milking stand and stay still, while Star fights us. Is there any way to switch personalities? 
Should we wait until her second or continue to try? 
Thanks again


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I find first freshening sets them up for future freshenings..I have a beautiful Lamancha who doesn't give much milk at all..def. a pet quality doe...her first freshening she was a brat on the table and we had 19 to milk so we decided to let her raise her doeling...now she just does not produce milk..enough for baby but not for us..I could be wrong...but I think I would message her and increase her feed a little at a time...might even try to milk her three times to stimulate her udder into thinking baby needs more milk....


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## Overthehill (Apr 14, 2013)

Okay I will do that Cathy. You know, I'm not sure what breed she is. I got her from my son. He got her from a farmer and the farmer told him she was a Pygmy. He got her at an auction. So- I doubt it. She is not cobby and has bright blue eyes. Her built is very different from my full pygmy. 
Her doe was born with blue eyes also. I know Nigerian Dwarfs have blue eyes. So I am assuming she is a ND/ Pygmy mix ( maybe) I made a video of her and her kid. This was around 2 weeks after the doe was born. It wasn't long after this that I had to bathe her and spray her tail with Bluecote because of the discharge and the flies. She is fine now. Do you think she is a ND/Pygmy mix? It might help me determine if she will be a good milker. I hope the link works.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I really don't see any Pygmy in her but without knowing her background, she could easily be a mix.

How much are you feeding them per day? When my Nigerians are in milk, they get 3 measuring cups of feed per milking. So 6 measuring cups of feed per day.


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## Overthehill (Apr 14, 2013)

I might not be feeding them enough. I am feeding them twice a day 
( now) Almost 2 cups of feed 1/cup of Boss and loose minerals. They also get alfafa hay mixed in with regular hay. Not counting treats like apples / raisons etc. I was giving them just feed in the morning and hay and treats. Now that they are in milk we feed them twice a day. Sunny the ND mix was bred with a full tiny pygmy , so Freya , her doe, is definately a ND\PYgmy mix. Star my pygmy was bred to another small pygmy, so her doe , Fiona, is full pygmy. Star will be a good milker. Sunny- as you can see in the video has very little teats and is not a good milker. Most of the goats around here are Boars and Pygmys with some Nigerians and Myo( sp?) - um fainting goats.


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## Overthehill (Apr 14, 2013)

I meant each feeding , not total.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

LOL..that was cute....I see Nigerian and Togg in your girl based on the blue eyes and small stature (nigi) but also her color and markings (togg)..but thats just a guess...
she is pretty by the way and that bouncing baby is adorable..
try messaging and milking 3 times a day and up her feed too by feeding her at all three feedings..increase the amount slowly..see hwo it goes..if you see ploppy poop then back off on the amount of feed a little and go slower as she adjust..


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## Overthehill (Apr 14, 2013)

Thanks Cathy. I don't see pygmy in her either. She very thin - not skinny, but slight. She is not cobby like a Pygmy. Yet, I am fairly new to goats so I am not familiar with the breeds. She came from Ohio - up near Zanesville. I don't know why they were sold as Pygmys. 
Anywho, it was an auction and people in the area will cut down their herd and bring them to the auction. There are a few Amish farms in the area too. What do you think of her udder? Thanks again.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

no, she is not cobby...and I dont think she is thin either..Pygmy are chunkier my nature so might make her seem thin being with pygmies..Dairy goats will have that dairy look..(think a jersey cow lol) Hips show ..she looks in good condition to me..as for her udder.. teats do look small and her rear attachment isnt great..but not terrible to cause saggy issues..Im sure those tiny teats are hard to grasp...some times a ff will be tiny like that..when we milk them ..once they udder has a bit of give we grab a bit of udder with the teat...give a bit more to hold on to. her udder does have nice shape...when feeling the udder if you feel any hardness in there that would be congestion and will prevent a good amount of milk..messaging will help that..a good empty udder should deflate like a balloon lol..


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

The teats do get a little bigger with milking.


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## Overthehill (Apr 14, 2013)

Thanks Karen. That's good to know. I believe she could have originated up near your neck of the woods.


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## Overthehill (Apr 14, 2013)

Thanks Cathy I didn't see your post. We will massage the udder. She does look like a toggenburg in the face. I checked and there are toggs up near where we got her.


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