# **** huntin with a pack goat



## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

i do alot of **** hunting by myself i hunt with 2-3 hounds at a time and it makes it for a long night with gun lights and **** to carry i am thinkin of a getting a pack goat but have questions can goats see and do well at night as **** hunting is done in the dark my dogs have been around pygmy goats their whole life so the dogs wont mind the goat but it make it easier for me if a goat could carry the dead **** n rifle but i am lookin to only take one goat with me at a time if i train it good enuff will it follow and do what i want even tho other goats are not in the woods with us?


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## Bob Jones (Aug 21, 2009)

I hike at night from time to time. They are more skittish at night. i don't know whether it is the dark alone that makes them nervous or if in fact there are other kritters out that make them nervous. On one hike they were particularly nervous.. turns out we were being followed by a moose. 

The mountain lions may be more active at dusk.

Because of their nervousness, they tend to walk more underfoot than in the day.


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## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

that would be alright i really dont run and go fast when in the woods and in indiana our biggest predature is coyotes i really have never ran into anythang in the woods if i have to i can tie the goat to my belt any other ideas be appreciated


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## ali pearson (Aug 12, 2009)

I don't hunt with my goats but I do walk with them at night sometimes. They stick like glue. But- if you are going hunting right from your house and you take your one goat, and something scares him, he may try to run home. If you are going to put him in the truck and drive a ways to go hunting, and he was raised by you around your dogs and gone walking a lot with you and them, then he would probably stay right with you. He would probably think it was great fun as long as he got some treats.


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## jross (Dec 20, 2008)

I've never hunted '***** before, but I doubt that a goat would be much good for night hunting. Mine really don't want to go out at night. It's either as others have said, that they are afraid of predators, or maybe they just don't see well at night. And even if you had a goat who didn't freak out in the dark, I wouldn't tie my rifle on him. He would probably drag it off going thru the brush and lose it.


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## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

i no people use mules to help them **** hunting in the south so why it couldn;t be done with a goat as far as the goat getin scared and runin away why i said maybe i could tie em to my belt. as far as them not being very helpful at night why wouldnlt they be if i could find a pack that has a rifel holder or tie it up good and sure make it easier for a goat to carry my dead **** than me/ my opinion on it but would like to hear others expeirence with goats at night also?

also my next question is breed i want a breed that is not spooky or high strung and willing to work and less stubborn most people say any kind of breed of goat can and will pack any suggestions for mei myself love boar goats and pygmys i no pygmys can pack but cannot carry as much weight as a large breed but if im only wantin it to carry 2-5 ***** at 10 pounds each i think it could handle it? thanks to everyone with their replys im trien to learn as much as i can before i start this


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## Rex (Nov 30, 2008)

Most of the dairy breeds would work for what you want. Just make sure they are bottle raised or at least very friendly so they will follow along with you with out needing to lead them. I think your biggest obstacle using a packgoat for **** hunting will be crossing the fences. Riding Mules used in **** hunting are taught to jump fences by placing your hunting coat on the top wire so it looks solid to the mule. I guess a goat could be taught the same thing but i would make it a lot harder to keep them in at home.  

If you need to carry up to 50 lbs then you are looking at a goat that weighs about 200lbs. Pygmies are definitely out. I have found that my goats have great night vision and they are moving around camp eating even when it is pitch black. I was just in Ohio two days ago and went **** hunting. Funny coincidence.


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## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

thanks for the ifno i guess i kinda exagerated on the 50 pounds it be more like a rifel bullets maybe a extra light and the dead **** wich weigh 8-20 pounds each but i rarly get more than 3 a night when i walk bymyself and don take the pickup to get to other woods close i was actuly hopin more so a larger frame pygmy would work as they eat less wish costs me less and i really dont have the room for 2 dairy size breeds maybe one pygmy and one dairy size i could fit when i had pygmys before as i have been out of the goat buisness for years now and run chickens all my pygmys ran free on the farm so i guess i will start to reasherch dairy breeds and see if a pygmy could carry what i want maybe


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## Rex (Nov 30, 2008)

you can figure that a goat can carry about 25% of their weight so that will give you a starting point on how big of a goat to get. Assuming of course that their weight is made up of muscle and bone and it's not just a fat goat.


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## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

now your testing my math knowledge great lol :x


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## jross (Dec 20, 2008)

Maybe you could attach an LED headlamp to the goat's horns or head. I'll bet he would learn to use it to see where he's going and what's going on around him.


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## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

so can goats see at night or not?


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## Rex (Nov 30, 2008)

Birchhatchery said:


> so can goats see at night or not?


I don't think there has ever been any night vision studies done on goats :? but in my experience I'd say yes, they can see at night.


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## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

sweet now time get goat pen ready n do alot of reasherch on trainin one i dont plan to get goats untile early spring i think im gonna go with one that is just started on grain/hay


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## Huckleberry (Mar 12, 2010)

I have always thought animals with square or rectangular pupils have great night vision?


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## Bob Jones (Aug 21, 2009)

from wiki answers:

Goats (and most other animals with hoofs) have horizontal slits which are nearly rectangular when dilated. This gives goats vision covering 320 - 340 degrees; this means they can see virtually all around them without having to move (humans have vision covering 160 - 210 degrees). Consequently, animals with rectangular eyes can see better at night due to having larger pupils that can be closed more tightly during the day to restrict light. Interestingly, octopuses also have rectangular pupils. 

But then I've never heard of anyone packing an octopus at night either.

Goats horns can actually make them go blind, negating the effect of the rectangular pupil.

Pig stuck his head in an empty bag of calf manna and couldn't get it off. He knocked over the BBQ grill, and didn't even think to just stop in his tracks.


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## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

so its unkown if goats are able to see at night


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## Nanno (Aug 30, 2009)

Goats can see just fine at night. They have huge expanding pupils like horses. We take our goat walking all the time at night and he has no trouble at all, even crossing cattle guards by balancing on the little support bars underneath that are practically impossible for a human to see at night. He sticks closer to us at night than in the day, but he's not nervous and he has no trouble avoiding obstacles in the path, walking on top of rock walls, or spotting a tasty weed ten yards away that looks higher than its neighbors.


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## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

also i hear most people use weathers for packing What about a buck? if i have no does around will a buck just be to stubborn and to hard to handle? Horns Or No Horns?


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## Bob Jones (Aug 21, 2009)

There are some folks here who have had bucks. I think they just neutered them. They probably had a good reason. Most will say that bucks have an odor that wethers don't have, and behavior can be more aggressive.

Horns or not is a personal choice. Those who remove horns cite safety reasons around novices and children. Those who don't just have cooler looking goats ;-)

The horns may help cool the animal, and may give it a bit of protection if it is on its own for any reason. Plus they can scratch their own butt.

You will find many posts in the archives on these subjects.


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## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

sounds good


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## Rex (Nov 30, 2008)

Bob Jones said:


> Goats horns can actually make them go blind, negating the effect of the rectangular pupil.


OK, Bob. I'll probably regret asking this...... but why do a goats horns make them go blind?


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## Bob Jones (Aug 21, 2009)

Rex said:


> Bob Jones said:
> 
> 
> > Goats horns can actually make them go blind, negating the effect of the rectangular pupil.
> ...





> Pig stuck his head in an empty bag of calf manna and couldn't get it off [because of his horns]. He knocked over the BBQ grill, and didn't even think to just stop in his tracks.


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## Rex (Nov 30, 2008)

Bob Jones said:


> Rex said:
> 
> 
> > [quote="Bob Jones":1gz8p55u]
> ...





> Pig stuck his head in an empty bag of calf manna and couldn't get it off [because of his horns]. He knocked over the BBQ grill, and didn't even think to just stop in his tracks.


[/quote:1gz8p55u]

Shaking my head slowly....... I missed that one completely. LOL


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## ryorkies (May 4, 2010)

Birchhatchery said:


> sweet now time get goat pen ready n do alot of reasherch on trainin one i dont plan to get goats untile early spring i think im gonna go with one that is just started on grain/hay


Goats are herd animals. They do not like to be alone.


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## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

im getin 2


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## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

when i get my young goats what is the first thing that i need to teach it besides let it bond with me and get use to guns n hounds?


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## Bob Jones (Aug 21, 2009)

Pig knocks on the door when he wants to go back in the pen.

I was going to teach Larry to steal beer from the next campsite over.


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## idahonancy (Dec 13, 2008)

It is much easier to teach them to wear a halter or collar and walk on a lead if you start early. Tie them out, at times make it a short tie but don't leave them unattended when they are young. They need to get use to being patient and waiting. All the behaviors that maybe counter intuative to a goat like gentle manners start early. No pushing and no jumping on humans. Playing can teach them alot about what is an acceptable behavior to you. Just start with zero tolerance for bad behaviors. Always remember the play behavior will someday be demonstrated by a 200 lb goat. Good luck. IdahoNancy


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## feederseaters (Nov 8, 2009)

jross said:


> Maybe you could attach an LED headlamp to the goat's horns or head. I'll bet he would learn to use it to see where he's going and what's going on around him.


Tried it. Attempt failed. Re-evaluating variables. Will test again.

I strapped my head lamp to my "lead researcher" Birch, he dis-agreed with this new contraption I outfitted him with. He protested slightly, but proceeded with the experiment in the name of science. GOOD GOAT. 
(Phase One : SUCCESS)

Birch and I walked the property at night with much progress. Many goat cartwheels and side kicks later the excitement wore off and hunger set in. It was very difficult for even a seasoned scientist to concentrate on the task at hand when all those crab apples were on the ground. LETS HEAD BACK GOAT
(Phase Two: SUCCESS DESPITE DESTRACTIONS)

I put my research partner back into the pen still sporting a shiney new headlamp on his head. EVERYONE was excited. All the other goats needed to check out Birch's new BLING. (BAD IDEA)
Birch headbutted the hell outta Acorn right smack into the electric spool. SPLAT!!!!
(Phase Three: FAILURE- Broken Light, angry goat, hopes dashed)

PLAN B: Purchase 4 headlamps, one for each goat.
To be continued......... :idea:


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## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

i got a freind who is goin to have oberhaslis crossed with boar goats do you think they would work good?


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## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

what yall think?


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## Bob Jones (Aug 21, 2009)

I have no idea. I just pack em, don't breed em.


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## ryorkies (May 4, 2010)

Sorry. I do not know either.
would depend on what the kids inherit from each of the parents.


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## jross (Dec 20, 2008)

I think that would be a good combo (Oberhasli x Boer). Obers tend to be a bit small, so maybe adding Boer would put some size and brawn into them. 

I think the main thing is getting their heads screwed on straight, no matter what breed they are. This means making sure they bond with you at a very young age. I think it's a bad idea to leave the kids with their mother when they are babies. This makes them bond with her instead of with you. They need to be bottle fed by a human (not necessarily you) from the start. Then you can teach them to lead and to let you get ahold of them whenever you want without shying away. Start hiking with them at a very young age. The main thing is to teach them to follow you wherever you go. And make sure they learn to never attack or challenge people, even little kids. Other useful things are to stay behind you when you are hiking (not easy), come when you call or whistle to them (a bribe of an orange peel works wonders), and stop doing things you don't want them to do (eat certain things, get onto the road, mug you for your lunch, etc) when you tell them not to. If you have ever trained dogs then goats should be about the same. It's all about simplicity of commands, patience, and consistency.

I think putting a halter on them when they are young and using it to teach them to lead is a good idea. They can resist you or drag you around with just a collar, but they can't with a halter. When they get older they shouldn't need halters any more.

My goats sure don't like gunfire. Maybe it hurts their ears. I try not to shoot right near them. What do you use to shoot racoons? A .22 rifle shouldn't hurt their ears, and I think they would learn to tolerate it. But shotguns and centerfire rifles might just be too loud. I know dogs learn to ignore shotgun fire, but I'll bet it damages their ears over time. It sure has damaged mine.

If you get Carolyn Eddie's book, Practical Goatpacking, you will find lots of good info.


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## idahonancy (Dec 13, 2008)

My 3 Ober boys go pheasant hunting. A 12 gauge doesn't bother them. One will stop eating, come to alert, and look around but the other 2 don't seem to care at all. Cruiser goat is interested in the dog when she goes on point. He walks right over to see what it is she is pointing at. I have a flushing goat and a pointer dog. 
IdahoNancy


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## Birchhatchery (Oct 18, 2010)

thanks for the info sounds like this is very possible to do


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## vigilguy (Dec 12, 2008)

Bob Jones said:


> There are some folks here who have had bucks. I think they just neutered them. They probably had a good reason. Most will say that bucks have an odor that wethers don't have, and behavior can be more aggressive.


I know I am hijacking this thread -

Having borrowed a buck for three weeks to breed with my doe, I can say without reservation, that they definitely DO have an odor! I will NEVER own a buck and keep it here at my place. You could smell him 100 feet away if you were down wind from him.

His behavior? Well, he wasn't aggressive towards us, but the disgusting peeing on his face, among other things, was enough to make me appreciate wethers! :lol:


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