# -Two week old kid with scours-



## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

Hello! I am relatively new to goats and have only had them for a little over one year and know very little about the topic of kids. This year we had one baby that was rejected who is now three weeks old. We had a milking goat who provided us with the babies milk for the first two and a half weeks. We noticed the milking goat, who is the sweetest LaMancha :inlove: , getting a little big and then all of a sudden seeming to lose weight. Two days ago she gave birth to twins haha. We went for the whole milk+buttermilk+evaporated milk as he next route and she has been doing fine. 
On the other hand our family friends dropped off their two week old kid, who’s mother died after childbirth. They weren’t clear, but I think they started off with that formula but changed to the powdered milk replaced from Manna Pro. I’ve heard many bad things about milk replacers and I think the replacer itself as well as the amount they were feeding (8 oz!) caused the terrible scours he has now. They took him to the vet who administered shots (not sure what type) and told them to give him cornstarch and the powdered milk(mix w/ three cups of water and feed). Does anyone know what cornstarch does? He was born on the 12th-13th of April and was 6 1/4 lb as of two days ago. When I first got him he just wanted to sleep and didn’t call out much. I started him on 4 oz of that 3 milk solution and 4 oz/.5 cup of electrolyte water in between feedings. That was two days ago. Then yesterday and today I have been feeding him solely electrolyte water (4oz) every 4 hours. He is so small and gets puffed up every time. Should I do less? His backside is covered in diarrhea which is yellow-dark green.(yellow droplets, collectively green) He found water in the garden and drinks it. His pee is clear and for the most part his scours don’t smell.(they did but now don’t)It kind of spurts out, yellow droplets and his scours are almost bubbly and drip out. When should I reintroduce milk? Tomorrow or when/if the diarrhea goes away? Today he seems to be much better, he calls very loudly and is softly jumping after me. He looks like a boer mix possibly. I’m not sure exactly how to take rectal temp but it started becoming a little chilly so I brought him in and when he sucked my finger his mouth felt a little cold. Any advice?


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

Here is a picture of them. The tan and white one is our first three week old, Serena. The other one with the brown head is Simba, the two week old with scours. (Also we are feeding Serena 8-10 oz every five to six hours, is that fine?)


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

I would go to your local farm store and buy the red liquid in the pig section which is called Scourchek or Scourhalt depending on your area. Treat the scouring 2 week old with one pump twice a day for 3 days in a row.

Boers should gain 0.5 lbs per day minimum so he is very very far behind/undersized. 

I would begin with 2 ounces of your whole milk mixture tonight as it sounds like he really needs the nutrition and you've probably flushed all the powdered replacer from his digestive track by now with the electrolytes so that's great.


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

When you mention that he puffs up - did you mean his belly is distended/firm/rounded out after the bottle or did you mean he fluffs up his fur and is hunched because he is cold after a bottle? 

Be sure they are getting introduced to a LOT of grazing and browsing so they learn, and they should be offered good quality hay right away.


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Make sure when you give the bottle it is 101*F to 102*F. Goats temperature is higher than people, so feed milk at their temp.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

SalteyLove said:


> I would go to your local farm store and buy the red liquid in the pig section which is called Scourchek or Scourhalt depending on your area. Treat the scouring 2 week old with one pump twice a day for 3 days in a row.
> 
> Boers should gain 0.5 lbs per day minimum so he is very very far behind/undersized.
> 
> I would begin with 2 ounces of your whole milk mixture tonight as it sounds like he really needs the nutrition and you've probably flushed all the powdered replacer from his digestive track by now with the electrolytes so that's great.


Do you think he is a boer? His ears fold up and the feet look wrong but his previous owners have no idea. I'll give him milk his next feeding and go to Tractor Supply as soon as I can. Thank you for all your help! 


SalteyLove said:


> When you mention that he puffs up - did you mean his belly is distended/firm/rounded out after the bottle or did you mean he fluffs up his fur and is hunched because he is cold after a bottle?
> 
> Be sure they are getting introduced to a LOT of grazing and browsing so they learn, and they should be offered good quality hay right away.


Puffed up is like he's bloated, but not extremely. I'd say rounded but not exactly firm. He's so small that anything we feed him makes him look big. It got windy around 6 and he started shivering so I brought him in. He's outside most of the day and has nibbled on grass but has not begun eating/swallowing it. I've offered grain which he chews but doesn't favor. He regularly drinks water and I'll bring hay tomorrow. Serena started eating grass just this week so I'm hoping Simba picks up on that. Thank you!


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

Dwarf Dad said:


> Make sure when you give the bottle it is 101*F to 102*F. Goats temperature is higher than people, so feed milk at their temp.


I've been just feeding them warm milk, is that a big problem? Will it affect them later on? I've been feeding Serena(three week old) lukewarm milk. I'll make sure to bring in a thermometer. Thanks.


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

The milk is hard for them to digest if not warm enough. It sounds like Serena has been able to regulate her body temperature very well and warms the milk more after in her stomach, which Simba can't do well.
No thermometer needed, just warm until a little bit hotter than you would feed an infant.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

Dwarf Dad said:


> The milk is hard for them to digest if not warm enough. It sounds like Serena has been able to regulate her body temperature very well and warms the milk more after in her stomach, which Simba can't do well.
> No thermometer needed, just warm until a little bit hotter than you would feed an infant.


Ok thank you. What thermometer could I use? I only have those ones you stick in meat lol(haven't stuck them in anything). I'm not quite practiced with baby milk


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

SalteyLove said:


> I would go to your local farm store and buy the red liquid in the pig section which is called Scourchek or Scourhalt depending on your area. Treat the scouring 2 week old with one pump twice a day for 3 days in a row.
> 
> Boers should gain 0.5 lbs per day minimum so he is very very far behind/undersized.
> 
> I would begin with 2 ounces of your whole milk mixture tonight as it sounds like he really needs the nutrition and you've probably flushed all the powdered replacer from his digestive track by now with the electrolytes so that's great.


Is this the liquid? And that's how much milk I fed Simba around ten min ago. I fed Serena 10 oz at 6pm so I think she should be able to make it through the night. Usually I feed her 8 oz at 12 but should I try to see if she can last? I'm usually the one waking her up


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

Yep that's the scourcheck that you want! 

Yes I bet Serena could go longer at night at 3 weeks old. Make sure hay and water are available in their night shelter.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

SalteyLove said:


> Yep that's the scourcheck that you want!
> 
> Yes I bet Serena could go longer at night at 3 weeks old. Make sure hay and water are available in their night shelter.


Ok thank you. Serena doesn't recognize water yet but there's grain and starting today I'll bring in hay and water.


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Tasnigoat2 said:


> Ok thank you. What thermometer could I use? I only have those ones you stick in meat lol(haven't stuck them in anything). I'm not quite practiced with baby milk


Those work, if you can see the needle a little over a hundred degrees.
Have you ever checked milk temp for a human baby by dripping some on the inside of your forearm? When dripped for human baby, you should feel no cold or heat. When dripped for goat kids, it should feel a little warm, not hot, just a little warm.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Tasnigoat2 said:


> Ok thank you. What thermometer could I use? I only have those ones you stick in meat lol(haven't stuck them in anything). I'm not quite practiced with baby milk


For taking a goat temp, I have a few of the thermometers that are typically used with an infant. The tip is slightly flexible and the digital reading is fairly quick. I use a dab of lubricant and insert the thermometer into the rectum until it beeps.

For testing the temperature of a liquid, I use a glass aquarium thermometer because I have some on hand from keeping aquarium fish. The meat thermometer would be okay to measure the temperature of a liquid if needed for the milk as well.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

All good advice.

At 2 weeks old, it may be worms. 
I would get a fecal done.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> All good advice.
> 
> At 2 weeks old, it may be worms.
> I would get a fecal done.


They took him to the vet and the vet prescribes cornstarch? I asked them for more information and they said that there was an owner before them who started with the baby and fed it powder milk different from the one they fed it. He was having diarrhea since he got to them. Then they noticed blood in his poop and took him to the vet who gave him medicine for three days. The blood stopped the second day and *the doctor said it was normal for them to have diarrhea". Wow...anyways the milk was also prescribed as well as cornstarch. What's the purpose of cornstarch? His poop (I've noticed today) has blue in it. I'm going to get the scourchek soon and I'll let you know when I get it. I'll do a fecal test as well.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

I have an image of the stool if anyone needs it.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I'm guessing the milk replacer is the problem. I'd do 24 hours of electrolytes and then get him on whole cow's milk from the store.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> I'm guessing the milk replacer is the problem. I'd do 24 hours of electrolytes and then get him on whole cow's milk from the store.


So I did two full days of it and now am doing the solution of milk+buttermilk+evaporated. Is that fine or too rich? Today was the first full day back on milk and no better. There are what seems like blue green flecks in the stool but he's so fast now.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I would do the scourchek.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> I would do the scourchek.


Ok, we are leaving now to get it. He sounds much weaker today and hasn't gained any weight. He is still 6.25 lb
They are both drinking water now but he seems much much weaker.
Also how much milk should I feed him? I'm doing 2 oz every 4 hours but he seems ravenous.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

You need to slowly up that. I'd go to 2.5 ounces, then 3 ounces.


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

For boer bottle kids I use close to 20% of their body weight in ounces per day, so he would need 20 ounces over a minimum of 4 feedings (but the more smaller feedings, the better).


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> You need to slowly up that. I'd go to 2.5 ounces, then 3 ounces.





SalteyLove said:


> For boer bottle kids I use close to 20% of their body weight in ounces per day, so he would need 20 ounces over a minimum of 4 feedings (but the more smaller feedings, the better).


Ok I'll increase it, thank you very much


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

I gave him 1 pump of this five minutes ago. Hopefully he feels better.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

Lots of improvement today! Diarrhea is still there but it actually looks like stool instead of just watery green stuff. We were able to clean him up and he hasn’t gotten dirty and his cries are back to full audio 
He’s also really good at drinking and I’ve slowly upped the oz to 2.5 so by tomorrow night I’m hoping we can do 3!


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

Hooray! What wonderful news! Scourchek for the win against bacteria!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Great news!


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

SalteyLove said:


> Hooray! What wonderful news! Scourchek for the win against bacteria!





ksalvagno said:


> Great news!


(woot)


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good to hear. 

It is double the dose it states on the label it says for pigs, for goats. 2 x a day for 3 days.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> Good to hear.
> 
> It is double the dose it states on the label it says for pigs, for goats. 2 x a day for 3 days.


So today is the last day and he still has diarrhea. Color has changed COMPLETELY and it isn't covering his legs. It's more like actual stool then just water but still has mucus in it. Should I treat for longer? He's drinking a bit over 3 oz now and we are continuing to increase the amount


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Are you putting a big pinch of baking soda in his first bottle? I'm thinking you probably need to give daily probiotics.


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Tasnigoat2 said:


> So today is the last day and he still has diarrhea. Color has changed COMPLETELY and it isn't covering his legs. It's more like actual stool then just water but still has mucus in it. Should I treat for longer? He's drinking a bit over 3 oz now and we are continuing to increase the amount


I can't help with the scours, sorry. 
You know that in a matter of weeks, if you let him do that, the pretty rose bush will be a tiny nub.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> Are you putting a big pinch of baking soda in his first bottle? I'm thinking you probably need to give daily probiotics.


No, just the scourchek. I have probiotic powder, should I be adding some in?


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

Dwarf Dad said:


> I can't help with the scours, sorry.
> You know that in a matter of weeks, if you let him do that, the pretty rose bush will be a tiny nub.


You mean he will eat it? LOL
The older one, Sabrina, eats whatever can fit into her mouth at this point. Some favorites include dirt and chair stuffing. I removed the chair but I'm not sure what to do about the dirt. The only think she doesn't love is GRASS. If only I could make her love it haha. She actually chews it and swallows it if I give her some but she doesn't willingly go out there and pull at it.
Also I've been making sure the milk is 100
Thanks for that advice!


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Rose bush is a delicacy in goat diet. That is the go to item when goats are loose. Of course they love hibiscus, too. Gerber daisies, gone. Almost any flower you want, they want more.lol As far as I know, all of the day lillies they have eaten are not harmful to them, lilies of the valley are bad for them, as are azaleas and rhododendron. Gardenia is somewhat toxic, my goats will eat a little then stop. I have had one that did not stop at a little and got pretty sick, I had to treat with activated charcoal, MOM and probiotics. I think he taught the others to only eat a little.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

Dwarf Dad said:


> Rose bush is a delicacy in goat diet. That is the go to item when goats are loose. Of course they love hibiscus, too. Gerber daisies, gone. Almost any flower you want, they want more.lol As far as I know, all of the day lillies they have eaten are not harmful to them, lilies of the valley are bad for them, as are azaleas and rhododendron. Gardenia is somewhat toxic, my goats will eat a little then stop. I have had one that did not stop at a little and got pretty sick, I had to treat with activated charcoal, MOM and probiotics. I think he taught the others to only eat a little.


Oh my
We have a whole row of rose bushes. We are going to move these two to the farm and with the bigger goats in a few months maybe? When they are almost weaned so their delicacy won't be in reach haha


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I would honestly get a vet involved.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> I would honestly get a vet involved.


Ok, I'll make an appointment. His stool is different again today. It's not as diarrhea like but more like Sabrina's. It's still mucusy but is in one pile now that sticks together. It's also orange...
I'm doing probiotics


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Did you have a fecal done to include coccidia?


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> Did you have a fecal done to include coccidia?


I actually wasn't the one to take him to the vet. I can ask the previous owner what was up. He's made major improvements since the scour check but maybe it is Coccidia or something like that
He's is three weeks old today


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I'd have a fecal done to include coccidia before doing any further treatment. Plus a vet check over wouldn't hurt.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> I'd have a fecal done to include coccidia before doing any further treatment. Plus a vet check over wouldn't hurt.


Yeah that makes sense. I'll make an appointment asap. Wouldn't want it to be coccidia:/


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

So I noticed today, his stool is completely solid! The only this is that there is this mucus bubble thing that comes right before it and it’s slimy and today I saw two red dots in it. But at least no more diarrhea!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Great his stool is getting better. I'd still do the fecal to include coccidia.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> Great his stool is getting better. I'd still do the fecal to include coccidia.


Ok thanks


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

A vet check is still wise.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

I’ve been doing probiotics for the past few days and his stool is ok now! It’s like clumped berries and the mucus has significantly decreased. He’s getting 4.5 and today I’m going to give him 5 oz of milk. Vets near us don’t take farm animals but there’s one 10 mi away that we will call. Thank you guys so much!


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

We’re having another problem:shrug:
I just noticed today that Serena’s eyes are redder and when she blinks it seems like her inner eyelid doesn’t match up with her blinking. It looks irritated and I’m not sure what the problem is. Both stools on both babies are good now but we are still going to the vet check up.


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Get vet to check Serena's eyelids. I don't remember the name for the problem, but it is an eyelash that is pointed inward toward eyeball.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

Dwarf Dad said:


> Get vet to check Serena's eyelids. I don't remember the name for the problem, but it is an eyelash that is pointed inward toward eyeball.


Ok thank you. I'm really concerned. It doesn't happen all the time, only when she looks a certain way and she doesn't have tears.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Yes, vet time.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Agreed.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

I think she banged her head or something got into her eye that day. She’s 100% fine now. It was also very rainy but they were in their shelter at that time(still outside)
Simba is now drinking 7.5 oz and Serena is drinking 11. They eat grass and ALL the leaves they can find. And yes, roses.
Can I convert them to normal milk now instead of the mix by slowly introducing it? Also we are trying to take them to the farm, which is about two miles from where I live, but they need to be off of milk until maybe one time a day? This is because we only go there about one time a day. How many months old would that be? Serena is 6 weeks tomorrow and Simba is 5 weeks today.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

Simba!


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Most on here like to wean around 12 weeks. You could probably cut one bottle per day now. Just make sure they are still gaining weight.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

Dwarf Dad said:


> Most on here like to wean around 12 weeks. You could probably cut one bottle per day now. Just make sure they are still gaining weight.


OK, I may just start doing more and doing it less frequently until I can get it to one bottle. Thank you


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Tasnigoat2 said:


> OK, I may just start doing more and doing it less frequently until I can get it to one bottle. Thank you


Just keep weighing them if you can. You can use this to keep track if you need something quick and easy to print out:


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good advice. 

She is cute. 

Glad she is OK.


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## Tasnigoat2 (Apr 29, 2019)

Update: Simba is now 5 months old and is healthy and thriving. He loves to eat and we are off the bottle! Such a sweet boy:run:


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Glad he is doing well.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Very good to hear.


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