# Jez's udder and belly - your thoughts? SHE KIDDED!!!!!!!!



## Udder Insanity Toggs (Mar 2, 2008)

Well today I finally got a chance to get some better pictures of Jez and her belly and udder. I am still relatively new to critiquing udder conformation, but like in my previous posts, I think her escution is wide enough to have good rear capacity. I also think she has a good MSL and overall development, but i think her teats need more length, as well as to be a little more towards the center, and her fore udder looks to need more fullness and come up to her belly smoothly. I THINK I am seeing a pocket there, but I don't remember her last freshing with one, so perhaps she needs to get a few days of milk on her. She currently has 9 days until she is due, and depending on how you look at her, she looks larger than other times.









Just Jez in the stand eating her breakfast. She normally does not have a sway backed appearance like she does in the picture, but I think the kid(s) is/are getting heavy. She is also leaning forward a little, and I think that is why you cant see the rear udder through/by her leg.









Another of her fore - a little close this time.









Yet another fore - a little angle though, showing her MSL from the front.









Jez's rear udder - again she was leaning forward to eat, so it kind of looks as though it is not as globular as it could be. Even then, I think she is slightly 'square' in rear udder, and she could use more fullness on the left and right.









You can see her width better here. I am hoping for :girl: :boy: , as all of my births have been singles on FF does. (this is technically my second kidding season). She is much larger that she was with her first, a single doeling, of OBVIOUS Nigerian siring. I figure with one of each, I can retain one, and sell the other, so my herd doesn't grow too fast.









Her MSL from under - you can clearly see here how her teats point out slightly.









And finally a very happy Jez glad to be off the stand! Time for a nap!

So guys, please lend me your expertise on her udder, and any guesses on her number/gender of kids. Later in the season when the weather warms, I will have a picture of her show clipped for the summer Fair. Right now it is a clip of necessity only 

Kelly


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## Sweet Gum Minis (Oct 6, 2007)

*Re: Jez's udder and belly - your thoughts? (pic heavy)*

I catch myself judging udders before girls freshen only to have my original thought completely changed so I wouldn't judge her till she's full. Does in partial milk tend to look worse than in full milk. And she looks good now, so she should look even better in full milk.


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## sixshooterfarm (Oct 18, 2007)

*Re: Jez's udder and belly - your thoughts? (pic heavy)*

it looks like it will take just a full udder to look their best, so far it looks really nice, she has a pretty open escutcheon but honeslty I would like to see is a bit more round, she almost has a v shape, but it could just be the muscling on her thighs making the overal appearance look a tad tight. Be careful about the whole pocket thing, I was just taught by a big breeder that those pockets that I thought my does had are actually shelves in the front. Pretty much her udder is so socked on there that the skin kinda folds in, I always thought it was a pocket, but it isent. Overall she looks like a real nice doe and that udder looks like it has some major potential, cant wait to see what it looks like full!


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## Udder Insanity Toggs (Mar 2, 2008)

*Re: Jez's udder and belly - your thoughts? (pic heavy)*

Six Shooter:

The pocket area - I never really felt one, only saw them on other goats and was informed that's what they were "when the fore udder doesn't blend smoothly into the belly". Her fore udder is VERY tight to her body...but I think I understand what you mean. We once had a Saanen cross doe that you could almost slip the tips of your fingers up and under the actual mammary tissue on her fore, almost as though her udder was 'pulled away' from her body. I am assuming that that pulled away thing is the true definition of a pocket? no?
Much different than this doe - hers solidly comes up and then bang! belly. She is also now starting to get a lot more vein-y looking on her udder itself, and her 'milk vein' is starting to get more and more pronounced.

What is worse, a shelf or a pocket? Not used to that term, and would like to broaden my knowledge base 

Yes, Jez has a LOT of muscle to her inner thighs, as well as across her loins. I have seen some VERY open escutions before, even on bucks, and that is something that I would like to improve on. I will be sure to get some pics later on when she has some milk time on her to compare the differences.

I really am excited from both of your replies (Sweet Gum too!!), thanks for bearing with an OVERY excited lady waiting for the first and only kids of the season!

Kelly


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## Udder Insanity Toggs (Mar 2, 2008)

*Re: Jez's udder and belly - your thoughts? (pic heavy)*

Well today is day 150 for Jezebel - I calculated (Thanks FiasCo!) by the first day that I put them together and witnessed breeding, however she may have had a 5 days heat, so I am adding a few more days to her just in case. She ran with the buck from that point until she hurt him in late November, then she went back in with last year's kids, so really I guess COULD I have quite some time left to wait :hair:

She does appear to have dropped a little, and is showing more loin and hollow under it (happened about 5 days ago), and her udder continues to grow, but has not become hard or tight. She is getting more veining to her udder every day, and her 'cha cha' looks a little more droopy over the last 3 days. She is still eagerly eating her grain and hay, but is laying down considerably more.

Unfortunately I went in for massive oral surgery (I am the toothless wonder right now :sigh: ), and will not be up to par for some time. FORGET talking on the phone, I sound like a cross between daffy duck and having a mouth full of marbles.

My boyfriend has witnessed one normal unassisted birth, and was a FULL TIME hand in a complicated twin delivery last year, however the sight of blood makes him weak. The idea of having to go in frightens him, as he is 6'4", and has rather large hands. I have a friend who has birthed everything from foals to puppies, and also raises rabbits, so I have her on call in case I am drugged :help: and need more help than I am able to do.

I am dying to get some beautiful kids, and am SOOOO Jealous of the ones already born on the board!

Kelly


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

*Re: Jez's udder and belly - your thoughts? (pic heavy)*

I know how you are feeling with the mouth surgery....my dentist was nice enough to prescribe a few vicadins...woo hooo...talk about sounding like daffy duck! :ROFL: Jez sounds as though she's getting pretty miserable...babies soon I hope. :girl: :boy:


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## Udder Insanity Toggs (Mar 2, 2008)

Well she did it! Two nice healthy kids! Both are Black and white Sundgau's, :boy: :girl: . The buckling has a TINY white spot on his forehead, and the doeling has a white splash on her poll. Buck kid is about 11lbs, doe is about 6. I will get them on the scale later to confirm the weights, but they sure are wonderful  ! Jez is wonderful too - talking to her babies and loving them to pieces. Only problem is that she wants them together ALL of the time and they want to look around separately.

I think we are going to keep the buckling and wether him as a pet. My neighbor WANTS him to stay here, and since she and her son were right there for the births - what is another goat after all!? Her son (he is only 6, but was VERY into the births and whole process) named the doeling Tinkerbell, and he also tried to suggest a Transformers name for the boy. We settled on Barricade (the police car Transformer). So far we only have one fair picture of the little buck kid and mom (little girl is hiding behind Jez), but now that things are all cleaned out and settled in, I am sure we will have more pics tomorrow.









Please dont mind Jez's haircut - she kept moving while I was clipping and she got some pretty short spots. HE IS SOOOOOO BIGG!!!!

I AM SOOOOOOO HAPPY!!!! :stars:

Kelly


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

Congratulations!!! I was right too!! WooHOO a boy AND a girl!!! I like the name Tinkerbelle also...way too sweet!! AND HE IS A BIG BOY INDEED!!! :stars:


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## Muddy Creek Farm (Oct 5, 2007)

Congrats!!! Those look like some big kids! :stars: 

Your clipping goats already? I need to clip soon for a show in early April but I am afraid my goats will become popsicles!


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

oh they are beautiful! Congratulations :dance:


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## Sweet Gum Minis (Oct 6, 2007)

Congratulations!!!! Beautiful colors!!!! Huge kids too. Wonderful!!!


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## NightHawk (Mar 9, 2008)

Very cute kids! They're adorable!


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## Tog Lovers (Oct 10, 2007)

They are adorable!!! Congrats!


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## PACE (Oct 8, 2007)

Thay are splendid!!! The buckling looks huge, especially compared to his lil sis :hug: Have fun with them :leap:


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## sweetgoats (Oct 18, 2007)

Congratulations, on your babies :girl: :boy:


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