# Breeding all year round?



## cypressfarms (Aug 2, 2009)

I'm totally new to goats. I have 10 kiko does that will be delivered around labor day, and a couple of other percentage does. So do most people run their buck with the does year round, or only let the bucks with the does a certain time of the year? I've heard that most meat breeds can kid year round, but I'm not sure of this. Any advice/help would be appreciated.


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## AlaskaBoers (May 7, 2008)

its easier to know when does will be kidding, kikos, boers, and other African breeds can breed year round. 

If you want fall butcher kids breed the does in the fall-winter for spring/summer kids, they should be market weight by fall again. 

Keep the does and buck separated until you want them to breed, its also easier to put 2-3 in at a time instead of all 10 that way you'll know whos due when, and the buck isnt over working himself. you can also buy a marking harness and that will give you estimated breeding that you can write down...records are key and make everything easier.


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Not many breeders let the buck run with the doe all year. If you plan your breedings & write down when they were covered you have a pretty good indication of when they are due like Katrina basically said. 
This yr we are fortunate to have our own buck so you're ahead of the game as far as timing goes! 
Two or three will go in with him for a couple weeks, then the next two or three.
No more 6 does kidding in 4 days some at the same time; no no no never again!! :hair:


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## jdgray716 (Aug 8, 2008)

I have learned it depends on your preference. I know very good breeders that do keep their does with a buck year round. They normally have several does in different pens but a small herd is different. The down fall is knowing when they are going to kid. However, when they get close in time you will learn to tell depending on the doe. There are also the days where you wait and wait to find out they are over YOUR due date and are on their own. :scratch: Others hand breed and it does have many advantages, however if you do not have the ability to do that you do not have the ability to do so. Most meat breeds will bread year round but it depends on the breed as well and doe as well. Some will also take breaks even when with the buck year round so again it depends on the doe. Another thing to remember if you do not run your buck with your girls you may want to get a friend for him so he does not get lonely. That is in most cases a must with one buck. Good luck and let us know what you decide. :thumbup:


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

its the same case as with cattle - if you want your kids born at a certain time of the year, when weather/pasture conditions are optimal, and if you want a tight kidding season, and a narrow age range on the kids/weaners etc, then keep the buck separate until 5 mths before you want the kids born, turn him in for 6 weeks for breeding then remove. Most people do this. 

I do know some people who run the buck with the does all year round, and surprisingly you dont get kids all year round - you get a few born at odd times, but for the most part, they stick to the traditional kidding time around spring. You will have a greater spread of ages in the kids, and also the odd ones kidding at irregular times.

Dairy folks tend to hand breed when they see the doe in season; so they have an exact due date. If you have a restricted breeding season you will have a rough idea of due dates; if you run the buck with the does all year round, you will have to rely more heavily on watching udders develop etc. which you should be well versed in from cattle


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## cypressfarms (Aug 2, 2009)

Thanks Keren,

The same farm I'm getting the kiko girls from also has a few young kiko bucks as well. Trying to decide
if I should get a kiko buck from him as well, since my % boer buck wont be breeding age for 6 months or so. Either way, I'll probably section off an area to keep the bucks away from the does. It does make much more sense to let the buck in with the does for several weeks to have a rough idea when the does will be kidding.


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

I've used boer bucks as young as 3 mths old to cover does, it depends largely on the individual animal. But I think probably your best bet is to leave it, just get the does, and settle in with them, get to know the way they think and act and use those months to get the feel of things. 

The other thing is I think you are far better off with the Boer buck over the Kiko does; I know Kikos are pretty highly thought of in America but tbh they are not much more than your Spanish goats, and they are fantastic for crossbreeding with boers but there is less to gain by keeping them pure.


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Good advice Keren :thumb: Take time to get to know your does real well. You might even see something, a weakness that could be improved in your breeding program.

Our Boer buck is almost 6mos old & rarin to go...over the next few weeks he will have his first few does. :greengrin:


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## jdgray716 (Aug 8, 2008)

keren said:


> I've used boer bucks as young as 3 mths old to cover does, it depends largely on the individual animal. But I think probably your best bet is to leave it, just get the does, and settle in with them, get to know the way they think and act and use those months to get the feel of things.
> 
> The other thing is I think you are far better off with the Boer buck over the Kiko does; I know Kikos are pretty highly thought of in America but tbh they are not much more than your Spanish goats, and they are fantastic for crossbreeding with boers but there is less to gain by keeping them pure.


Amen, Kiko crossed with boar in my opinion is much better then most, not all, the kiko pure breed goats I have seen. I would keep the kids crossed 50/50 for sure and there are those that want percentages to get there Genemaster done. You can read about that at the Kiko site, association. I have one kiko cross still but got rid of the rest, I wanted more meat and muscle personally. There is a lot of dairy influance in Kiko. They are not a bad breed, just not what I wanted.

If you are doing meat, then I would go this crossing. You may also want to check out the TMG or Texmaster in time if you are doing meat. You can read more on them at my site and my links page will direct you to Onion Creek Ranch. I would not worry about it right away but if you are looking for heavily muscled meaty goats that is an option I would look into for sure.


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## cypressfarms (Aug 2, 2009)

jdgray716 said:


> Amen, Kiko crossed with boar in my opinion is much better then most, not all, the kiko pure breed goats I have seen. I would keep the kids crossed 50/50 for sure and there are those that want percentages to get there Genemaster done. You can read about that at the Kiko site, association. I have one kiko cross still but got rid of the rest, I wanted more meat and muscle personally. There is a lot of dairy influance in Kiko. They are not a bad breed, just not what I wanted.
> 
> If you are doing meat, then I would go this crossing. You may also want to check out the TMG or Texmaster in time if you are doing meat. You can read more on them at my site and my links page will direct you to Onion Creek Ranch. I would not worry about it right away but if you are looking for heavily muscled meaty goats that is an option I would look into for sure.


Are you saying that a kiko crossed with a Texmaster would yield better kids for meat? I had looked at the Onion Creek Ranch's website - very nice. I think I'll just get settled in and get used to the new to me animals. Then after a year or so when I start to learn - then I can make better decisions on which way to go with my herd. I picked kikos because I've read so many good things about them, but as with everything in life, there is no one solution to any problem.


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## jdgray716 (Aug 8, 2008)

To be honest anything crossed with the texmaster would yeild better goats for meat. The question is would your does be ok with a buck that size? Really that is a question Suzanne could answer better as she knows the breed better then I. SHe invented it. SHe is very reseptive to questions, just email her. However, I have seen these bucks, they are HUGE. I am going to be getting the TMG in the next year from her or Pat but the Texmaster are even bigger and every goat I have could be doubled in size and still not get the muscle etc you get on a TMG or TexMaster. A TMG buck may be better if your does are smaller. Again Pat or Suzanne could answer that better. Let me know if you need their info and I can send it to you. Have any more question, let me know I know the breed pretty well but the breeding on the Kiko is a bit of research I have never had to look into. If you do email either of these gals, let me know what comes of it. I would like to know.


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## jdgray716 (Aug 8, 2008)

Ok, scratch that. I just decided to call... LOL

Your does would handle it fine. Because the of the body length and hight you'd do fine. With the TMG you will get more meat, the Texmaster will give you a greater carcus but may be not as much meat. However, if you are questioning it, it was recommended you start with a Texmaster, they are cheaper, once you see the outcome and decide to make the investment in the TMG, you would do better. If you are confident in the thought, go ahead with the TMG. They have more meat. They are closer to the ground and wider, so you would not have the hight a Texmaster brings but you would get the better outcome to be honest.

I do want to add, Don't listen to all you hear about this breed. The Texmaster is not a cross between a Myotonic and a Boer. Like the Tennessee Meat Goat this breed started with Suzzane Gasparotto. It involves the TMG and there is a formula for the Texmaster. If you do not buy from Suzzane Gasparotto or Pat Cotton you will be buying from someone who did. And if they are not registered though their registry @ Pedigree International, they are not true Texmaters. They are a genetic make up of there own and the exact recipe, though you can get them elsewhere once bought from Suzzane, it lies with her still to this day. Pat is the only other person who knows this recipe and it is not perfected until the 7th generation. That is how long it takes to cross to the formula only these two breeders know and have. So if you go with the Texmaster goat you will need get it from one of these two breeders or someone who already has, but you will never get a registered Texmaster unless it's roots and blood line has started with Suzanne herself as the registry is pattened by Onion Creek. These are the facts on this particular breed. 

Hope that helps and if you need to know more or have other questions let me know and I will get them or give you the addreses needed to talk with the breeders directly.


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## jdgray716 (Aug 8, 2008)

Bringing back up, wanted cypress to see.


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## cypressfarms (Aug 2, 2009)

Thanks jdgray,

Since I've already put a downpayment on a percentage boer buck, I'll start with him. After I start to learn more and get used to the goats, I'll most likely make a switch to something that will provide more of a meaty frame. The TMG's and texmasters do sound interesting, though.


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## jdgray716 (Aug 8, 2008)

Cool, well I will tell you until you see one in person :shocked: there is nothing like it. After seeing the TMG :drool: I was in love  . They will be my next purchases in the year to come. :wahoo:


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