# 3 of my 4 chickens have diarrhea, can someone help me?



## KristiStone

I'm not sure what the cause is, either, but I did lose a hen a couple of weeks ago to salpingitis. I've tried some basic things, like giving milk kefir in hopes of balancing out their gut flora, but it seems like it's not just a gut flora issue. I've added ACV to their water, but I just discovered that I'm probably not putting enough in their 3 gallon waterer (I was only putting 2 tbsp). I'm considering putting some oregano oil (in a carrier oil) in their water as a natural antibiotic, but I'm leery because it's a pretty volatile oil and I'd hate to make a mistake and cause my girls to burn their mouths on the oil.

I have had chickens for a few years, but just in the past year I've started having issues and I honestly don't know how to figure out what could be wrong. I have some sulmet from 3-4 years ago (it's probably expired) if I need to start something today. I could get other antibiotics this week to help if I need to. Our feed stores around here are closed on Sundays.

A little more info, only one of my chickens (Carlota) is laying, and she is one that has diarrhea, but her eggs are nice and clean, so I'm guessing that it's not as bad but I have no real idea. Ethel keeps sitting in the nesting box, but never lays (could she be egg bound? Does that cause diarrhea?). My Carolyne has a pretty bad case of diarrhea, I'd say the worst of the 3. My 4th girl, Mrs. Trumble, isn't having diarrhea, but isn't laying, and she's been my best layer in the last year. It feels like I'm dealing with all different issues with all 4, so I'm kind of overwhelmed. If one of you kind experts could hold my hand so I could learn how to troubleshoot my girls' issues, that would be so great.

Thanks so much.


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## KristiStone

I'm reading some other threads here and googling information, and I'm thinking I should add this information:

We are having quite a warm February. We are in Southern California, and temps have been in the upper 70s and low to mid 80s for the past few weeks. This week, we'll probably hit 90 at least one day. It could be that the girls are drinking more, I suppose. I've noticed so much more watery poop around, though, that it's really concerned me. I've never seen this much before, even last summer.

I've given them (every other day or so) our food scraps, including meat scraps. Could that be throwing off the nutritional balance in the laying feed? I usually feed them this: http://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/natures-best-organic-16-egg-layer-pellets-40-lb, but since they stopped laying, I bought this feed, which they have been eating fine. Not sure if the watery poop/diarrhea has to do with this feed or not, but this is it: http://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/dumor-poultry-layer-16-crumble?cm_vc=-10005

I have been giving them milk kefir mixed with their crumble, about a pint for all 4 once per week. They eat it over a day. I have free choice oyster shell out, and I mix oyster shell into the milk kefir mixture, along with a handful of BOSS.

Please someone tell me what I'm doing wrong, or how to troubleshoot what is going on. I'm at a loss here, and don't want to lose my girls over something that's obvious to someone more well versed than I.

Thanks!


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## ksalvagno

I don't know much about chickens but are you sure it isn't coccidia?


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## KristiStone

I think it isn't, Karen, but if they can have only diarrhea and it can be cocci, then maybe? They are showing no signs of any illness at all, which I think is why this is so confusing for me. I've looked up "causes of diarrhea in chickens" so many times, and try to weed out what it could be, but I'm just stumped.


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## deerbunnyfarm

I thought cocci was the main cause of diarrhea in chickens. Might be wrong, but I doubt, with everything you're doing for them, that it's dietary.


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## ksalvagno

I'd probably treat for coccidia just to be sure.


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## KristiStone

Ok, that seems doable. Since only one is laying, it seems like a good time to do that. I have Wazine and Sulmet here. Will either of those do? What is the easiest way to administer it? I have a 3 gallon plastic waterer that they all share.


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## ksalvagno

I would just follow instructions on the bottle.


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## KristiStone

Thanks Karen, will do that!


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## MylieD

I agree, sounds like internal parasites. I'm not sure on the medication without looking it up. You should check out backyardchickens.com. You will get tons of answers right away and they have the treatment information right as a sticky in the forum.

Also, I wouldn't give them meat. They are more insectivores when it comes to meat. I also wouldn't give them milk products. Birds aren't meant to drink milk. I would think those two things could also be messing up their digestion. I believe their are probiotics that are good for chickens that you can add to the water. I've never had a problem switching food brands, as long as it was layer crumble.

Are they molting or broody? Those things can stop egg laying. Usually it's cold weather that also stops egg laying. If you're afraid of a bound egg, you can clean up, lube up, and stick a finger in to check. One of my girl's had a messy bottom and was just sitting around all puffed up. When I checked her she had a broken egg in her. I fished it all out, cleaned her bottom, and she recovered. Some people give antibiotics, but I didn't. Giving a shot to chickens is a pain. I'm not sure if there's another way to administer them.


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## MylieD

Oh and free choice oyster shells and grit. You don't need to mix it in their food. They will get what they need.


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## ksalvagno

I fed my chickens raw goat milk daily. The eggs really tasted good.


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## KristiStone

MylieD said:


> I agree, sounds like internal parasites. I'm not sure on the medication without looking it up. You should check out backyardchickens.com. You will get tons of answers right away and they have the treatment information right as a sticky in the forum.
> 
> Also, I wouldn't give them meat. They are more insectivores when it comes to meat. I also wouldn't give them milk products. Birds aren't meant to drink milk. I would think those two things could also be messing up their digestion. I believe their are probiotics that are good for chickens that you can add to the water. I've never had a problem switching food brands, as long as it was layer crumble.
> 
> Are they molting or broody? Those things can stop egg laying. Usually it's cold weather that also stops egg laying. If you're afraid of a bound egg, you can clean up, lube up, and stick a finger in to check. One of my girl's had a messy bottom and was just sitting around all puffed up. When I checked her she had a broken egg in her. I fished it all out, cleaned her bottom, and she recovered. Some people give antibiotics, but I didn't. Giving a shot to chickens is a pain. I'm not sure if there's another way to administer them.


Thank you so much, Katherine!

I am on BYC and have this very same post up over there and am not getting too many bites. I'm actually getting more on the goat site! LOL

I'm thinking I'll quit with the scraps and kefir and use some Probios instead. I can look up the meds and all that on BYC--I didn't realize that resource was there.

They just finished molting, and I don't see that anyone is broody. I figured it might be the short days. I read that chickens need 14-16 hours of light to lay, and I last I looked we were only getting 13. One did start though this past week.

I've been reluctant to check for a bound egg because of how messy her backside is, and because I just lost a hen to salpingitis (happens when the oviduct gets infected with ecoli or some other bacteria). I clipped their feathers last weekend, but they are dirty again, like really dirty, so I'm thinking a bath would only last a day. Trying to go at this internally, if that makes sense.

Thanks so much!


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## KristiStone

I've got oyster shells free choice out, and they are able to get lots of little rocks from our yard, as we have granite soil.

I have read mixed reviews on milk products and chickens. For me, right now, it's not regulating their gut flora, so I'll kick that for now. I thought with the first week that there was some improvement in the diarrhea, but it seems to have come back with a vengeance. :roll:


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## MylieD

I guess it's the lactose that can upset their stomachs, Karen, and I think goat milk is supposed to be better about that? As a lactose intolerant person, I just know how uncomfortable I get. Lol. But there are certain cheeses and things I can eat, so it's probably the same with chickens. I just think of dairy as being a mammal thing, so I don't give it to my birds. I was just throwing it out there as a possibility.

Kristi, quitting all the extras until you have it figured out is probably a good idea. Then you can introduce things back and see how it goes. Mine do love veggie scraps and some fruit. Especially figs. They go crazy for them. But anyway, I would definitely treat for cocci too. If you just happen to have a microscope laying around (or a friend with one), you can look yourself. It's pretty neat and there's tutorials online. The worm eggs are pretty easy to identify, imo.

Yes, you're right, it's the length of daylight. I always associate that with cold weather. Could depend on their age too. My young ones (less than 2 years) lay every day, the others are more scattered. So they could be gearing up to lay soon.

Honestly, I think you'd be able to tell if something were stuck or broken in there. The chicken will be off by herself, off feed, puffed up, and have the messy bottom. If she's running around with the rest like normal, it's probably something else. But I think if you wash your hands good, her bottom good, and maybe wear gloves, then she'd be okay with a check if you think she needs it.


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## KristiStone

MylieD said:


> I guess it's the lactose that can upset their stomachs, Karen, and I think goat milk is supposed to be better about that? As a lactose intolerant person, I just know how uncomfortable I get. Lol. But there are certain cheeses and things I can eat, so it's probably the same with chickens. I just think of dairy as being a mammal thing, so I don't give it to my birds. I was just throwing it out there as a possibility.
> 
> Kristi, quitting all the extras until you have it figured out is probably a good idea. Then you can introduce things back and see how it goes. Mine do love veggie scraps and some fruit. Especially figs. They go crazy for them. But anyway, I would definitely treat for cocci too. If you just happen to have a microscope laying around (or a friend with one), you can look yourself. It's pretty neat and there's tutorials online. The worm eggs are pretty easy to identify, imo.
> 
> Yes, you're right, it's the length of daylight. I always associate that with cold weather. Could depend on their age too. My young ones (less than 2 years) lay every day, the others are more scattered. So they could be gearing up to lay soon.
> 
> Honestly, I think you'd be able to tell if something were stuck or broken in there. The chicken will be off by herself, off feed, puffed up, and have the messy bottom. If she's running around with the rest like normal, it's probably something else. But I think if you wash your hands good, her bottom good, and maybe wear gloves, then she'd be okay with a check if you think she needs it.


Katherine, I've read that cats can be lactose intolerant too. Something about when they are adults, they no longer produce the enzymes needed to break down the lactose, or something like that. I've heard that goat milk is somehow acceptable for all animals, but I haven't looked into it myself, only heard that it doesn't have the same effect because of the fats in it. I could have that wrong.

No microscope available, and no vet that will work with me on the chickens. I hate to medicate without understanding the problem, but that might be my only choice in case they end up getting worse and I lose them.

None of the chickens are hiding or exhibiting any issues that indicate illness, except that icky diarrhea. Here is a slideshow if you'd like to see my chickens just hanging around the farm: http://s63.photobucket.com/user/WeatheredsPics/slideshow/Animals/Chickens Diarrhea larger photos

I'll make an effort to rule out egg bound for the one chicken. I've checked my chickens before, they just weren't dirty like this last time.


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## MylieD

Those are some beautiful girls. Looking at them, they look healthy, have nice looking combs, maybe it really is just a dietary thing with the meat upsetting their stomachs. Their butts aren't even that messy. When mine had the broken egg, her butt was caked with mess. And you would think parasites would make their combs floppy and pale. I don't /think/ it would hurt to wait it out a couple days and see if there is any improvement when they are off scraps and kefir. I'm not an expert or anything though, but it's what I would do.

I had one with a tough to get out egg and she was doing the crouching thing, just sitting in the nest, not looking too good. So, I doubt that's what is wrong. A warm bath and some vaseline in the vent helped with that problem. It's funny too when they have egg problems. With both of my girls, as soon as the eggs or pieces were out, they were back to normal immediately.

I'm going to get a microscope soon. I borrow my friend's when I need to check the goats. It's weird but I get a kick out of looking for them. Your vet won't do a fecal if you bring in the poop? It's the same as any other fecal, so it's not like it's something special because it's a chicken.


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## Greybird

I don't think your chickens' butts look too bad, especially if they are laying. Some more pictures of droppings would be helpful, but, based on the one I saw, I don't think you are dealing with any truly serious health issues. It looks like they might be drinking too much water. Are you perhaps giving them excessive amounts of salt? Birds (except sea birds) have very little tolerance for it.
I would cut out all dairy products. I know, I know . . . lots of people give it to their birds and it doesn't seem to cause any harm, but it is not the least bit natural for them and they can only partially digest it. Probiotics that are meant for birds would be good for them. Fruit, vegetable and grain-based snacks are great, and so are insect treats. Crickets, grasshoppers, mealworms, and all types of spiders are excellent. Earthworms, snails, etc, not so much. They are a good protein source, but they can also contain parasites - especially wild ones that come from areas already populated with poultry or waterfowl. 
Chickens can digest small amounts of meat with no issues. They will happily catch and eat frogs, lizards, baby mice, etc, and I have also seen them catch and eat minnows that ventured too close to the edge of my pond. I would not feed them any fatty meat trimmings or anything with added salt, but small amounts of very lean meat won't hurt them - it's just not anything that they need. Too much protein is very hard on their kidneys; in fact, it could cause the exact symptoms that your birds are displaying.

With chickens, simple is better. A balanced, non-medicated poultry feed, clean water, clean grit, a place to take dust baths, sunshine and shade, a place to get out of the rain and a safe place to sleep and lay their eggs - that's really all they want or need.
All treats should be in moderation.


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## KristiStone

Ok, more poop.


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## MylieD

That all looks like normal poop... What did it used to look like?


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## MylieD

Here's a poop picture compilation: http://chat.allotment-garden.org/index.php?topic=17568.0


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## NyGoatMom

Looks like normal poop. How old are they? Have they ever been dewormed? And also, have you checked for lice/mites?
ETA: Wazine is useless...it only kills roundworms. I suggest Ivomec or Valbazen. I can give you the dosages if you want them. Also, goat milk is great for chickens...lots of probiotics,calcium and protein, since they are domesticated, they have been drinking cow/goat milk and eating human scraps for a loooonng time. I would suggest leaving calcium out free choice instead of mixing it.


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## KristiStone

MylieD said:


> That all looks like normal poop... What did it used to look like?


I was thinking that too when I was taking the photos, but I've been seeing so much of the runny variety lately, it got me worried. It's looked runny for as long as I can remember. Part of what I was seeing, I'm sure, was my sick chicken's poop (I lost her to salpingitis a couple of weeks ago), so I was sure that I'd quit seeing so much of it since she passed, but nope, it seems like I'm seeing a lot more of it lately!



MylieD said:


> Here's a poop picture compilation: http://chat.allotment-garden.org/index.php?topic=17568.0


Thanks! Ha ha, I was thinking of this thread when I was taking photos of all the poop this morning!



NyGoatMom said:


> Looks like normal poop. How old are they? Have they ever been dewormed? And also, have you checked for lice/mites?
> ETA: Wazine is useless...it only kills roundworms. I suggest Ivomec or Valbazen. I can give you the dosages if you want them. Also, goat milk is great for chickens...lots of probiotics,calcium and protein, since they are domesticated, they have been drinking cow/goat milk and eating human scraps for a loooonng time. I would suggest leaving calcium out free choice instead of mixing it.


The red one is almost 4 and the black ones are closer to 5 years old. They have never been dewormed that I know of, but someone else owned the black ones before me. I've had them since October 2014.

I have checked them for mites, probably months ago, though. I have some of this on hand, would it be useful in this instance?
http://www.jefferspet.com/products/jeffers-ivermectin?sku=JVBB

Great to know about the goat milk. Will separate the calcium/shells from the feed promptly. Thanks Stephanie!


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## dreamacresfarm2

What they eat will effect their poop too. Have then been getting fresh greens from the yard?


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## KristiStone

dreamacresfarm2 said:


> What they eat will effect their poop too. Have then been getting fresh greens from the yard?


They did a few weeks ago, but it was organic lettuce that we got to a little late (not icky, just not the freshest). None since then, though. Scraps have been out for the taking, though, and I'll be removing those from my daily offerings.


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## NyGoatMom

KristiStone said:


> I was thinking that too when I was taking the photos, but I've been seeing so much of the runny variety lately, it got me worried. It's looked runny for as long as I can remember. Part of what I was seeing, I'm sure, was my sick chicken's poop (I lost her to salpingitis a couple of weeks ago), so I was sure that I'd quit seeing so much of it since she passed, but nope, it seems like I'm seeing a lot more of it lately!
> 
> Thanks! Ha ha, I was thinking of this thread when I was taking photos of all the poop this morning!
> 
> The red one is almost 4 and the black ones are closer to 5 years old. They have never been dewormed that I know of, but someone else owned the black ones before me. I've had them since October 2014.
> 
> I have checked them for mites, probably months ago, though. I have some of this on hand, would it be useful in this instance?
> http://www.jefferspet.com/products/jeffers-ivermectin?sku=JVBB
> 
> Great to know about the goat milk. Will separate the calcium/shells from the feed promptly. Thanks Stephanie!


I'd say they are due for a deworming! Also, at that age they will slow down laying....I am not sure about dosing for that product but I bet you can get the dose on BYC...ask Dawg53 if he is still on there.


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## NyGoatMom

Dust them and their coop with python dust....I do all 50ish of mine every spring!
Clarifying, the Ivomec would be oral for deworming, the python dust for lice/mites.


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## sassykat6181

Our chickens get all the kitchen scraps...including meats and chicken. They get yogurt, soured milk and goat milk. 
Those poops all look normal. Lack of laying most likely is due to having just gone through a molt. Now would be a perfect time to treat for parasites


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## KristiStone

sassykat6181 said:


> Our chickens get all the kitchen scraps...including meats and chicken. They get yogurt, soured milk and goat milk.
> Those poops all look normal. Lack of laying most likely is due to having just gone through a molt. Now would be a perfect time to treat for parasites


Thanks Kat. I was thinking that too, but....

Is it possible that the need to worm is location-based? I'm asking around to my long time chicken raising friends and in FB groups for local chicken owners, and none of them worm at all. It seems like no one worms around here because they don't see the issue in their chickens here, and it's hard for me to think that all of them are completely remiss in their chicken raising. I have heard that mites are an issue here, so I'll be looking into that for my girls.

What are the prime conditions for worms to thrive? It's super dry here, and maybe that's why? Also, I'm not really seeing that my girls are exhibiting any indications that they are sick in any way, and with all that "super strain" talk, I'm reluctant to do a "just in case" worming. The diarrhea seems to be letting up, I'm seeing less of it now that they aren't getting daily scraps and extras.

Anyway, I hate to be a pest about this and I'm so thankful for all the great information that I've received in this thread, but I'm feeling some serious reservations about medicating without knowing for sure.

Still waiting on the microscope a friend can perhaps loan me if she can find it. Honestly, I think I just need my own.


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## MylieD

I rarely worm mine, tbh. I have an issue with worms with my goats, one in particular, so I try to be careful with worming. My chickens just don't seem to have an issue with worms.

Hopefully you can get your hands on that microscope and find out for sure one way or another.


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## sassykat6181

I never wormed my chickens when I lived in Massachusetts, they were almost 7 when I rehomed them. We moved to South Carolina last summer and I got new birds in October. I noticed round worms in ones poop a few weeks ago and wormed everyone. They had just started laying. Different climate here, no hard freeze. Must be the difference for me.
Where are you?
MidAmerica Ag Research in WI does all sorts of fecal testing, including poultry. They check for all types of worms and cocci. It's $5 per sample.
I just sent in my goat and horse samples and had results emailed back in a few days.


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## KristiStone

MylieD said:


> I rarely worm mine, tbh. I have an issue with worms with my goats, one in particular, so I try to be careful with worming. My chickens just don't seem to have an issue with worms.
> 
> Hopefully you can get your hands on that microscope and find out for sure one way or another.


I got it! The friend that was looking for it found it, and because her son is no longer being homeschooled, she asked if I would pay $10 for it.   



sassykat6181 said:


> I never wormed my chickens when I lived in Massachusetts, they were almost 7 when I rehomed them. We moved to South Carolina last summer and I got new birds in October. I noticed round worms in ones poop a few weeks ago and wormed everyone. They had just started laying. Different climate here, no hard freeze. Must be the difference for me.
> Where are you?
> MidAmerica Ag Research in WI does all sorts of fecal testing, including poultry. They check for all types of worms and cocci. It's $5 per sample.
> I just sent in my goat and horse samples and had results emailed back in a few days.


Ahh I see, so it can be regional. I'm in SoCal, Riverside County, Inland Empire. Not a lot of rain, and we do get in the lower 20s in the winter, but I don't think we get hard freezes either.

I'm happy to say that I've gotten a hold of a microscope for cheap, so I believe that I'll be doing my own fecals in the near future if I can figure this thing out. That will be helpful to know for sure what I'm looking at.


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## KristiStone

Here's the one I got--anyone know if it's good?
http://www.amazon.com/Radical-School-Student-Biological-Microscope/dp/B0045ZXM2Y


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## MylieD

What's the strength on it? I think you need 10X and 40X to see anything. Here's how to do fecals, if you haven't seen it yet:

https://fiascofarm.com/goats/fecals.htm


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## KristiStone

MylieD said:


> What's the strength on it? I think you need 10X and 40X to see anything. Here's how to do fecals, if you haven't seen it yet:
> 
> https://fiascofarm.com/goats/fecals.htm


I've got a 10x and a 15x eyepiece, and the objectives are 4x, 10x, and 40x. Will that do?

I *thought* I read FiasCo Farms page, but it was for fecal float tests. I might be confused, is it the same thing, just different parts of the test? She was talking about test tubes.... :dazed:


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## MylieD

Yes, it's the objectives that matter. That link is for the fecal float test? I'm confused as to what you're asking.


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## KristiStone

MylieD said:


> Yes, it's the objectives that matter. That link is for the fecal float test? I'm confused as to what you're asking.


Sorry about that!

I believe that she is doing a float test because she talks about floating eggs, but honestly, what do I know. The reason I'm confused is because it seems like it's many more steps to do that particular test than to just smear poop on the slide and add saline (or whatever solution you are supposed to use) to thin it down, cover and examine on the scope. I've watched a view vet videos tha demonstrated it that way, and it seemed pretty straightforward. FiasCo Farms' explanation involves test tubes, strainers, and other things that I was hoping to get away with not having before I can take a look at my girls' poo.


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## MylieD

Oh, I get ya. I haven't done a fecal on a chicken, so I thought it was the same way. You're probably right. I should learn how to do it that way. I did a dog and we did the float as well, that's why I assumed, but you know what they say. ;-)


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## KristiStone

MylieD said:


> Oh, I get ya. I haven't done a fecal on a chicken, so I thought it was the same way. You're probably right. I should learn how to do it that way. I did a dog and we did the float as well, that's why I assumed, but you know what they say. ;-)


It's all good---we all just do what we are used to. I'll let you know how it goes, or if I decide the float is the way to go, though!


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