# Does a does production decrease when in heat?



## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Here I am....again....about Heidi.  The last 2 milkings have been a little over half her normal. I pulled her last kid about 4 days ago. She is getting 24/7 hay, plenty of water and minerals and at milking, 8 am and 7 30 pm , 6 cups (a total of 12 cups a day) of 50/50 alfalfa and sweet 18%.

There was one day where she had not had access to 24/7 hay since my husband was doing the chores that day and figured they still had hay from the day before.When he filled it the next morning there was a little left but not much...she is used to having it free choice...could one day of having less hay have done this?

I know I am milking her out....and I massage and bump the bag to get the rest...she acts healthy, has a lot of energy, and is eating/peeing/pooping fine 

I am beginning to think she is a really hard keeper


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

They can go down in production when in heat. They can also go down in production when it is hotter than normal for your area. My girl went down in production when we had that couple weeks of 90+ temps which is very unusual for Ohio.

I'm also seeing some really good things with using Replamin Plus for my girls. I have been giving it to them every other week. Even with the minerals and kelp and good hay and good feed and properly wormed/copper bolused/BoSe, they are still looking even better with the Replamin.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Ok, Thanks Karen...she seems fine otherwise. So how long before it comes back up? I will be looking into the replamin. Where do you get it?

Sooo much to learn, it's unbelievable! Thank goodness for TGS


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I don't know. My girl hasn't come back up in production yet.

I got the Replamin Plus at PBS Livetock. It is a 300cc tube and you have to order the gun to go with it. The gun has a way to give just 5g or 10g or 15g along with larger doses.


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## canthavejust1 (Oct 12, 2012)

I hadn't heard of replamin so I looked it up(I'm a Google fan) it says not for use in sheep and goats because of the copper content. Sheep yes but I wouldn't think whoever wrote the warning would be uneducated enough to still think goats are as sensitive to copper as sheep. The copper level is pretty high in the replamin. How much copper is too much for goats?

Edited to add: I ask because I haven't copper bolused but have been considering it on the new girls. Could this work in place of bolusing?


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Supposedly they are supposed to change that. There is definitely not too much copper in it for goats. Of course just about everything is labeled not for goats anyway.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

True, but how about the manganese? It has that in it and my hay is grown in soil with high levels of manganese which inhibits copper absorption.(along with my hard water  ) I wonder if it'd be too much...

Also, i don't know if you (Karen)were referring to the high temps or from heat...Heidi made it through the high temps fine and it's been cool for almost a week now, so I would think it was from her being in heat? If so, should her production come right back up?


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## HerdQueen (Oct 15, 2012)

Our does have started their fall heat cycles which are stronger then the heat cycles during the summer. And milk has dropped. Her production should bounce back with no problem. They have just got boys on their mind instead of making milk. This morning I had 5 does standing on a box with their rear-ends towards the bucks waving hello. And Cleo SCREAMING at the top of her lungs. Who ever thinks nubians are loud have not met this little nigie and her "singing" voice it would make the straightest hair curl.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

canthavejust1 said:


> Edited to add: I ask because I haven't copper bolused but have been considering it on the new girls. Could this work in place of bolusing?


I'm really not sure. Depends on your farm. I still have to copper bolus but I'm hoping not to have to copper bolus as often.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

NyGoatMom said:


> True, but how about the manganese? It has that in it and my hay is grown in soil with high levels of manganese which inhibits copper absorption.(along with my hard water  ) I wonder if it'd be too much...
> 
> Also, i don't know if you (Karen)were referring to the high temps or from heat...Heidi made it through the high temps fine and it's been cool for almost a week now, so I would think it was from her being in heat? If so, should her production come right back up?


As far as the replamin, you would have to figure out if that would work for your farm. It is working for me. Every farm is different though.

I did mean both. I can't remember, is she an FF?


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

No, she is 5 years old and has had at least 2 sets, probably more....but I can't say for sure...


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Still less..maybe a bit more than half of what she was giving.....counting the days....how long should it be if she is just producing less due to heat?

I mean, I FINALLY get milk... and now this..... :/


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## HerdQueen (Oct 15, 2012)

How was her milk today?


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

My girl's production has not come back up since our heat wave but she is an FF so I'm thinking that could be a part of my problem. I honestly don't know how long it could take to come back up, I would think there is the possibility of it not coming back up. You may have to do extra things to get it back up like milk 3 times a day. Give herbs that help up production.


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## GoatieGranny (Jul 26, 2013)

My Bella went down to 3 cups last winter. I ordered "Mo Milk" from Molly's Herbals, and within 2 days of giving it to her, (sprinkled on her morning carrots), she was back up to 8 or 9 cups in the morning, and has never dropped like that again. I stopped giving her the herbs in the spring. I keep some on hand because I know without a doubt they work great. 

(We only milk once a day and Bella was a FF April 2012 and still going strong.)


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Herdqueen~She gave me about the same as the last 2 days...hoping it increases in a day or two....

Karen~ I will be out of town all day tomorrow, but I may start that Monday or Tuesday if I don't see more production. Can't wait to have more than one doe lactating, then at least you have a fall back!
How long should she be in heat?

If not I will look into the "Mo Milk" Thanks goatieGranny!


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

I found a couple of cool links....
http://goatkingdom.tripod.com/milk-secretion

http://www.aces.edu/pubs/docs/U/UNP-0111/UNP-0111.html

So I hope that is all it is, is estrus :worried:


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Ugh....still not up to what it was....could it be because I took her last kid? Hoping tomorrow in the am it will be better. I am going to have to try that MO Milk from Fiasco Farms...

Does anyone know _how long_ production can decrease when it's due to heat? Is it a week?? More, less?

Thanks


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Started MO Milk this am . Will update on production levels....

I hope this works!


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## HerdQueen (Oct 15, 2012)

Another thought I had about the production loss. Is maybe she has always been dried up early, so now it is her bodies habbit?


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Good question....I don't know. But she had her kids may 2nd, and it's now only been 3 months?? Or would she dry off around the same time each year as long as her kids were gone?
So much to learn , it's unbelievable! LOL.... I think I have a good thing going, and wham! Another twist in the road! 

If she is used to drying off early, can that be changed? I gave her 2 tbsp of Mo Milk this am and 1 tbsp this eve. I have not decreased her feed, she is getting 12 cups of 50/50 alfalfa and sweet 18%, along with 24/7 grassy hay.
I'll be giving her 1 tbsp per feeding daily. I hope to see improvement soon!


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## janeen128 (Dec 31, 2012)

I have a kinder doe Patti, that when she is in heat she gives me a lot less milk, but about a week later she's gets back up there... I notice during her heat she doesn't eat much either....


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Boy, I thought that was it but it's been too long now. I think I have one more shot wit this Mo Milk....gosh, I wish she wasn't my only milker, I won't let that happen again!


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## HerdQueen (Oct 15, 2012)

Another thing to try. When I notice my does dropping I give them probiotic plus, it does seem to give them a bump.

Also maybe next freshening if she gives you a doeling keep her on as long as you can, and see if it improves?


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks, will try that today....and next year I plan to have at least 3 in milk if possible


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

7 days on Mo Milk update....Heidi is giving me about 1/4 more than what she was before the herbs.I hope to see more improvement....

She is getting 1 tbsp 2 x a day sprinkled on feed.


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## janeen128 (Dec 31, 2012)

That's a start in the right direction


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## GoatieGranny (Jul 26, 2013)

That's great. Going up in production is better than going down!  I had Bella on it for over a month to be sure she would keep it up...and she did. More than ever.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

I think HerdQueen is right...I think she was dried off by september....I bought her last August and she was only being milked once a day...I remember asking her why and she said cause she'd been milking since April....so her body is probably used to that pattern. I am going to continue the Mo Milk as long as she keeps up producing any.I'll be glad if next year i can have at least 2 in milk!Heidi is paying the way for everyone right now....LOL


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

GoatieGranny said:


> That's great. Going up in production is better than going down!  I had Bella on it for over a month to be sure she would keep it up...and she did. More than ever.


Oh....how much increase did you see? And how long did it take to get it?


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## GoatieGranny (Jul 26, 2013)

NyGoatMom said:


> Oh....how much increase did you see? And how long did it take to get it?


Within a few days she went from around 3 cups up to 8 or 9 cups. The first day after giving her the Mo' Milk, she went to 4 cups, then 5, then the bigger jump to 8 or 9....I can't remember which for sure. She's giving us 12 cups now which is more than ever. I only milk once per day as her previous owner did. She was a FF in April of 2012 and has been giving us milk ever since. Awwww, she's so sweet!


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

^^wow! I am not seeing that kind of increase...  I would love to though!! But I am still getting some, so that's better than none!


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## GoatieGranny (Jul 26, 2013)

NyGoatMom said:


> ^^wow! I am not seeing that kind of increase...  I would love to though!! But I am still getting some, so that's better than none!


There are probably a lot of different variables that influence the outcome, but you're heading in the right direction. Maybe you could increase the herbs a wee bit....?

I always cut up carrots and sprinkled the herbs on top of them....like sugar on cereal. The goats went nuts over them. LOL.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

ok, I can try that...I'll start giving 1 1/2 tbsps a feeding


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Ok Heidi is officially giving me only 3 1/2 pints a day...as a last resort, I am sticking her doeling back on her during the day to see if that helps her production.

I really think it is just her being used to being dried off this time of year...does anyone know how you can, or IF you can, increase length of lactation in a doe over five?


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## janeen128 (Dec 31, 2012)

NyGoatMom said:


> Ok Heidi is officially giving me only 3 1/2 pints a day...as a last resort, I am sticking her doeling back on her during the day to see if that helps her production.
> 
> I really think it is just her being used to being dried off this time of year...does anyone know how you can, or IF you can, increase length of lactation in a doe over five?


I don't know.. So sorry! For your sake I hope so. I would just keep milking her for as long as you can though.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Oh I am Janeen....even if it is only enough for my friend to have. I can drink cows milk....she can't. Her and her husband were so happy to find she could drink goats milk, I am trying to keep her in it for as long as possible!


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