# Alpine Buck pedigree



## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

I'm looking for my Alpine Buck's pedigree. If anybody knows him his name is Fernando I don't know if that is a nickname or what I belive that he has redwoodhill bloodlines but I'm not sure of that. Any help would be welcome. This is him his pen is not usally this bad looking this is what it looks like in monsoon season


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## ArborGoats (Jan 24, 2013)

Is he registered?


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

Yes with ADGA


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## Goat_Scout (Mar 23, 2017)

What's his DOB? Is he American or Purebred? I found a bunch of (Redwood Hill) Alpine bucks on the ADGA pedigree search, but I need to narrow it down some.  Also, none are named Fernando - maybe that was just his barn name?


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

There are 10 pages of redwood hills bucks on file 

http://www.adgagenetics.org/PedigreeSearch.aspx


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## Goat_Scout (Mar 23, 2017)

Suzanne_Tyler said:


> There are 10 pages of redwood hills bucks on file
> 
> http://www.adgagenetics.org/PedigreeSearch.aspx


Are they all Alpine bucks? (sorry, the link doesn't go through for me) I only found one page but they were only Alpines...


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## Goat_Scout (Mar 23, 2017)

Nevermind lol... I searched something a little different and wow, there are 10 pages!


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

The link doesn't work for me anymore either  I think it just brings up whatever you had last.


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

He is 4 year old not exacty sure his DOB just that he's four. I'm not sure on purebred or american. Iv'e been on the ADGA pedigree search as well I can try and get his tatto tomorrow


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Do you have any info on his sire and dam?


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

Suzanne_Tyler said:


> Do you have any info on his sire and dam?


 no I just got him last month and don't have his previous owners number any more


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Well that sucks


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Was it this farm?

https://redwoodhillfarm.org


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

no that's not where I got him from (unfortunetly I love there goats) I got him from a backyard breeder this might be him http://www.adgagenetics.org/GoatDetail.aspx?RegNumber=A001620528


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

Get the tattoo out of his right ear and let us know what it says.


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

If he is the buck with the pedigree that you linked, his tattoo should be: RE: RVW2 LE: C56


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

Okay so I tried to get it but his ears are dark and I can't read it should I take him inthe barn and hold a flashlight behind his ear or? Also if I breed my nonregistered (or so I was told, I swear I can see a 5 in her ear) Saanen to him could the babies be registered as Grade or Experimental(assuming I can get Fernando's papers)


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Definitely try the flashlight trick. You might need to wash his ear. 

You can't register his kids unless you own him or have a service memo from his owner. And since you have lost touch with his official owner that's not possible


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Another thought though. If you are able to find his papers in the AGDA database, you might be able to find the owner. Pretty sure owner's name is given on the paper, and then you should be able to look them up and contact them. 

But that's only if you are able to find the papers.


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

sure hope i'm able to get the papers


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

I do own him but did not get a change of ownership paper


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Yes, but to ADGA that still means that the previous owner owns him. You need word from the official (per ADGA) owner in order to register kids.


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

huh I thought that they could be registered as long as the parents papers are presant. I'll try to track down there phone number. So let me make sure I have this straight if I get his papers and I breed him to a unregistered goat the kids can be registered as Grades. They would have to be tattoed to be registered correct?


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

Yes. And if you can get his tattoos and verify who he is, I can help you out with getting in touch with the registered owners, according to the ADGA. (It’s likely that he has been sold more than once and those owners never registered him but left him in the original owners’ name.)


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

great I'll try and get his tattoo, then after ether of us gets in touch with his original owners I could probably print the papers of ADGA genetics. Now if where not able to get in touch with his previous owners if i'm able to verify tattoos and print his papers then I could register his crossbred kids as Grades? Sorry for all the repeat questions this is the first time I've had to do this and I want to make sure that I don't miss anything.


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## nicolemackenzie (Dec 27, 2014)

If you can't get his papers transferred to you then you cannot register kids as grades.

You could register the dam or doe kids as Native on appearance though.

Do you have an adga membership?


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

You have to have his registration in your name. Otherwise you can consider him unregistered.


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

No. You have to get ahold of the people who are technically still his registered owners and get the papers from them and then transfer him into your name before you can register any kids from him.


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## goatblessings (Jan 6, 2015)

Also if the original owners sold him without papers (less $$) they may want $$ to do this for you.


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Are any of your does registered?


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

Okay 
step 1 contact owners
step2 change ownership
step 3 ?


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## nicolemackenzie (Dec 27, 2014)

Register your does as NOA


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

And the be able to register kids as grade or experimental.


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

registering my doe as a NOA means native on aprence? 
They can be registered with horns just not shown? 
Could someone please explane the NOA thing a little more please?


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## nicolemackenzie (Dec 27, 2014)

Correct, adga doesn't let you show a goat with horns.

To register a doe NOA you need another ADGA member to verify that your doe looks like a dairy goat only containing recognized breeds and no meat genetics. 

I think there's a form on the adga website they can use? Then she gets brown papers with just her name as her pedigree is unknown. She can be bred to a registered buck and the kids can be registered as 50% whatever the sire is.


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

Thanks the doe if not tattooed would have to be tattooed?


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

goatblessings said:


> Also if the original owners sold him without papers (less $$) they may want $$ to do this for you.


They where going to sell him with the papers included but they couldn't find the papers


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## goatblessings (Jan 6, 2015)

If they are the owners on the paperwork, they would have to contact ADGA and get new papers, then sign the transfer at the bottom to you.


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

There is no reason to register the does as NOA unless you want to show. And as they have horns, they can't be shown anyway. 

Only one parent needs to be registered for kids to be registered as recorded grade.
Scenario 1: You have two unregistered goats. If you breed them, the resulting kids cannot be registered.
Scenario 2: One of your goats is a registered Alpine(can be any breed except Nigerian), and the other is not. If you breed them, the doe kids can be registered as 50% Alpine(or any other breed if that's what the registered goat is, except Nigerian-actually, I think there may be another breed that can't be registered as a grade too, but I don't remember.)
Scenario 3: One goat is registered NOA, and the other is a registered Alpine(or any other breed, see above) doe kids can be registered as 50% Alpine. The NOA status is only helpful for showing your does, not for registering their offspring. 
Scenario 4: Both goats are registered and all kids can be registered. 

For any of this to happen, the registered goats must be registered in your name, not simply registered.


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

thanks, can the bucklings not be registered (unless both parents are)


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## nicolemackenzie (Dec 27, 2014)

Adga does not register grade Bucklings.

The only mixed breed boy they will register is a 50%/50% cross between two Americans two purebreds or an American and a purebred. They would be experimental.


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## nicolemackenzie (Dec 27, 2014)

True about the NOA. I didn't think of that.


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

goat girls said:


> thanks, can the bucklings not be registered (unless both parents are)


Basically, yes. So you're first generation of kids are 1/2 Alpines, let's say. If you breed those registered, recorded grade, 50% kids to a 100% registered Alpine buck, their kids will be 3/4 Alpines and does can be registered as such. Breed those kids to a 100% registered Alpine buck again, and kids will be 7/8 Alpine. The 7/8 Alpine does can now be registered as American Alpine-bucks have to be 15/16 Alpine before being registered as American Alpine.
Purebred, or French, Alpines are slightly different-they are Alpines that have always been registered and have never had any unregistered goats in their lineage. Though recorded grade came be bred up to American Alpines, Americans can never be bred up to Purebred or French.

Hope that makes sense.


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

nicolemackenzie said:


> Adga does not register grade Bucklings.
> 
> The only mixed breed boy they will register is a 50%/50% cross between two Americans two purebreds or an American and a purebred. They would be experimental.


So if I got my doe registered as a NOA Saanen doe she is not considered Purebred or American? If she is considered one of the 2 I could breed her to Fernando (if I get his papers) and register all the kids as experimentals?


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

No, as a NOA she is not considered American or Purebred. As I said before, the only reason to register a doe as NOA is if you want to show her-it has no impact on registering her kids. 
You don’t have to do anything with your Saanen doe to register kids, as long as they are sired by a registered buck.


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

k I think I got it all. Even though I couldn't register the buckling but would tattooing them be considered a permant source of identification (I raise pack goats so I would need a premanet indentity for going out of state)


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

okay so more questions
If I breed a NOA doe to a non registered buck could the doelings be registered as NOA. If I register my doe as NOA what would I tattoo her as sense I have no idea what farm she came from or what number kid she was. And lastly could someone post a photo of a tattoo from a pink eared goat so I know what it looks like


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

You could register the kids as NOA, but you could do that without having the dam registered as NOA anyway. Anything can be registered as NOA as long as someone will sign the form stating that they look like x breed. 
The tattoo would be your personal tattoo, I believe, because yes, you have no idea where she came from.


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

so I wasn't able to find Fernando's previous owners number. I can't get his tattoo cause he will not hold his head still and he's to big to stratle. So new game plan
become ADGA member 
register a few does as NOA 
Register doelings as NOA 
Next time I buy goats get registered and get papers


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

Yes, none of my goats like me to handle their ears and bucks are the worst. Can you tie him up to the fence with a very short leash-like have his head tight to the fence-and check for tattoos? 
Are you wanting to show these does that you want to register as NOA, or why do you want them registered?


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

yes I would show two of them the only to that I would register. Does the ADGA member that would have to say that they look like x breed have to see them in person or could it me a picture


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## catharina (Mar 17, 2016)

Wow, your buck has traveled some distance as you are in New Mexico & Redwood Hills is very near me in Northern CA! They have wonderful bucks of various dairy breeds--I hope you can eventually trace your buck back to them. We used to get our does bred there & just love them & their goats. Eventually you will need to restrain him to trim feet, vaccinate or something where someone can help you look for that tattoo! I hope he has one! 
Good luck!


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

So new question, where to get the tattoo set the cheapest I can find it is $50.00 It has the tattoo gun, 5oz green ink,Letters 0-9 and the letters a-z is this a good price


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

Sounds about right. I recommend the 5/8 with the ear release.


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

Thanks


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

Does anyone see a tattoo sorry the second one is blurry


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## nicolemackenzie (Dec 27, 2014)

Hmm I don't see anything and his ears are pink so should be fairly easy to see. Did you check with a flash light?


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## nicolemackenzie (Dec 27, 2014)

Do you have a picture of him? Those ears are huge


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

the ears are one of the becoming NOA Does
this is her


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## goat girls (Dec 13, 2017)

This is the Buck


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## nicolemackenzie (Dec 27, 2014)

Handsome fellow! And lovely gal


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