# Vaccinate or not?



## janeen128 (Dec 31, 2012)

I'm in a decision making point for my herd, wether to vaccinate or not. My herd is now a "closed" herd until I need a new buck. I've herd that the vaccines are not proven and can actually cause more harm them good. I will be testing my herd yearly for diseases, maybe twice a year, but wanted to get your thoughts and opinions. 

Everyone is healthy and they all tested clean in June... I'm thinking of not vaccinating, and just testing, since vaccines can sometimes cause the disease itself.


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## packhillboers (Feb 2, 2011)

Depending on what type of vaccine it is you're thinking on. We only do a CD-T vaccine here and nothing else. The Clostridium perfringens and the C &D type of that bacteria is something we feel is quite important to prevent and feel that the risk of NOT vaccinating for it is higher than any risk that the vaccination would possibly cause. This is what I've concluded to be best for our place and area after reading about the C & D type of that bacteria. It is a very bad and painful thing for goats to get. I was late this year in getting their annual booster and got all nervous as all of the goats were seeming to be bloated more than usual. Good to read about all vaccinations and there is a lot of info. The C & D type is going to be present even in a closed herd because it isnt something contagious but i think is from the soil and dirt. I think that is what I am understanding on it..


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## Tenacross (May 26, 2011)

Do not skip the CDT vaccinations.


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## packhillboers (Feb 2, 2011)

We do vaccinate every year in January just before all the lush green grass grows. It helps in preventing enterotoxemia (over eating or pulpy kidney) disease. The bacteria will multiply to out of control amounts inside goats digestive system when a goat's diet is rapidly changed or has eaten too much rich grains or green grass. Vaccinating C-D will help prevent these bacteria from exploding in out of control numbers but the diet is also important to control also to prevent enterotoxemia. We also believe the T(tetnus) is very important to vaccinate especially since we do wether our little guys.


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## WarPony (Jan 31, 2010)

I give mine CD&T shots. I've considered giving them the pasteurella (pneumonia) vaccine this year, but haven't decided for sure. I give them to my bred does in the last month of their pregnancy in order to ensure the kids have some coverage from birth. I give them to the kids at 8 and 10 weeks, then again at 6 months. After that the does only get them just before kidding, and i booster if one needs some kind of procedure done. My bucks get one in the spring, wethers are usually in pet homes or the freezer long before any more would be needed but any companion wethers get poked when their buck buddy does.


Vaccines do work, though some may work better than others the fact that small pox has been wiped off the face of the planet (except for small samples being held in freezers in high security labs) pretty much proves they work. Some are significantly more effective than others because of how the different vaccines work. Some cause a mild case of their disease to cause immunity. Some just cause the body's immune system to be stronger against the disease (depending on if it is a live virus or killed, that sort of thing). Some cause a false positive in tests to see if the animal has it, because the tests are for the antibodies that the virus causes. But vaccines in general are very effective at preventing disease. 

But they can also cause false positives for some diseases, some can have bad reactions on occasion, and some are recommended very frequently and I have questions about whether or not we should vaccinate as often as we do. I used to have my dogs tested to see what their antibody titer levels were (that is what shows how much resistance they have to diseases they have been vaccinated against) and discovered that the shots they claimed I needed every year, sometimes twice a year, my dogs still had preventative titer levels 4 and 5 years later! Then we had a bit of a financial crisis and i stopped testing, but now I only do the shots for my house pets every 3 years when law requires they get their rabies.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I only give CD&T vaccines.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I only give CDT too. The clostridial diseases and tetanus is so easy for goats to get so I feel that I would prefer to prevent it.

Ultimately it is your decision. There are plenty of people who do not vaccinate. Everyone has to decide what they can and can't take a chance on.


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

CDT here too. 
The problem with vacs such as CL is they come up with false positive results when tested.


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## janeen128 (Dec 31, 2012)

I think CDT is it then... I'll do that next week. Under the skin right? I did it before several months ago... but wanted to make sure


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## TDG-Farms (Jul 12, 2013)

CDT is all we do here. I have a friend that does an 8 way like a month before kidding or something like that.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Yes do it SQ.


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## janeen128 (Dec 31, 2012)

ksalvagno said:


> Yes do it SQ.


Thanks!


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## enchantedgoats (Jun 2, 2013)

we do cdt and rabies.


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

All right, gonna go against the flow here, haha! I do not vaccinate. I'm just not comfortable with them. Buyers are more than welcome to vaccinate any animals they buy from me -- I expect that.

I do not see that the CD vaccination works, as the anti-toxin is still used on a regular basis by those who vaccinate. I use activated charcoal as a "CD antitoxin" when needed (if they get into poison or gorge themselves on something they weren't supposed to). I do have the anti-toxin on hand, if needed, and it did help one of my little girls who got into something she wasn't supposed to. Coincidentally, out of all the kids that got into the harmful substance, the only ones who needed the anti-toxin were the ones I had vaccinated. The others bounced back very quickly. Possibly a coincidence, but still.

There's no right or wrong here, just what works with your herd. Since I drink the milk and eat the meat from my goats, I'm just not comfortable filling them with the vaccinations ... the preservatives in there can be scary. I have talked to some breeders who do not vaccinate, and they said they have found that the more generations they got away from vaccinated animals, the hardier the animals are.

Again, not attacking anyone's practices, but there is a different way to do things.


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## janeen128 (Dec 31, 2012)

Well, I just talked to my vets secretary and they advise against vaccination, and to just keep the CD antitoxin on hand....


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## packhillboers (Feb 2, 2011)

Well... I suppose if you ever get a problem with it in your herd, then you will know what to do.


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## janeen128 (Dec 31, 2012)

packhillboers said:


> Well... I suppose if you ever get a problem with it in your herd, then you will know what to do.


Yeah, still torn after I spoke to her. They don't like it because many of the goats and sheep they see that have been vaccinated are sicker then the ones that are not vaccinated.


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

In the end this is YOUR choice. I side with your vet on this one, but you do what is best for your herd, end of story!


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## MsScamp (Feb 1, 2010)

ThreeHavens said:


> All right, gonna go against the flow here, haha! I do not vaccinate. I'm just not comfortable with them. Buyers are more than welcome to vaccinate any animals they buy from me -- I expect that.
> 
> I do not see that the CD vaccination works, as the anti-toxin is still used on a regular basis by those who vaccinate. I use activated charcoal as a "CD antitoxin" when needed (if they get into poison or gorge themselves on something they weren't supposed to). I do have the anti-toxin on hand, if needed, and it did help one of my little girls who got into something she wasn't supposed to. Coincidentally, out of all the kids that got into the harmful substance, the only ones who needed the anti-toxin were the ones I had vaccinated. The others bounced back very quickly. Possibly a coincidence, but still.
> 
> ...


I agree 100%, and I do not vaccinate either. I just don't see the point. I vaccinated back when I first started raising goats and I lost the same number of kids as I currently do with not vaccinating. I also did a lot a research and everything I read that was not published by a goat raiser said that CD&T was pretty much useless as a preventative against overeating. I also discovered that using CD&T antitoxin negates the vaccine, and they need to be re-vaccinated if it is used. I do not see the point of wasting my time and money, not to mention stressing the kids, vaccinating for something that the vaccine is not going to prevent.


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