# How to bring a new goat into herd?



## top_goat (Sep 16, 2014)

Next week I'm bringing a new doe into my small herd of 2 does and one buck. "Totsie" is due to kid next week, and I am to acquire her after that (breeder is keeping the kids). Although I have confidence in this breeder that they take care of their stock and try to produce and sell healthy stock, I'm still concerned that maybe I should quarantine this new doe for a bit before introducing her to the other two does. 

Any wisdom out there on this? Quarantine or no? If so, about how long? How far away should my quarantine pen be? Anything else I should know? She'll be my first "post-partum" doe, as we're still awaiting kids from the other two. We use a more nutrition oriented approach to our goat health rather than chemical wormers, most medicines, ect. 

Thanks so much!!!


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## harleybarley (Sep 15, 2014)

QUARANTINE! She's going through an awful lot all at once - kidding, losing the kids, moving.. She may be healthy and well-cared for, but her immune system is being taxed. And fighting for herd status on top - nah, quarantine her.

She might have worms that your goats don't, simply because she's from another farm (and if they worm differently, that makes a difference, too). I don't like to worm my goats, but I worm newcomers so they don't bring in something my goats haven't "seen."

With the cold weather, I'd quarantine in the barn, but prevent nose-to-nose contact. If you can keep her out of the main area but in sight of it, that would be ideal. The further the better, in case she comes down with a cough or other airborne germs. I prefer a month quarantine with blood testing and close observation.


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## top_goat (Sep 16, 2014)

Thanks so much HaleyBarley! We're small and don't really have a barn, but we'd thought of putting her in what used to be our dog run. It's about 8'x8', with a top to protect from rain and unwanted climbers (we have lots in our area!). It's about half-way between the house and the goat pens. 

As for chemical wormers - do you have any suggestions? 
Also blood tests...what should I try to test for? I know this breeder tests for CAE and a few other things, and I'll get the certs on that...

Thank you for your help!


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

Yes definitely get the copies of the actual paperwork showing she is CAE, CL, and Johne's tested negative fairly recently. You won't need any blood tests on your own if the breeder has that.

I'm not sure how the weather is where you live, but she'll need a little shelter & deep bedding to keep warm by herself in the dog kennel.

The stress of kidding, removing kids, and moving to a new home will be a lot for her and can cause a bloom of parasites. Ask the breeder if they automatically deworm after kidding - many do. If not, I suggest Valbazen as a broad spectrum general dewormer for post-kidding. 

Will you be milking her?


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## top_goat (Sep 16, 2014)

Thanks, SalteyLove -- Yes, we will be milking. In fact, that is *the* reason we're acquiring her: milk for health issues. We live in east/central Texas, about 90 miles south of Dallas and north of Houston. Weather has turned quite frigid (nights in the 20's), so I'm deep bedding all my animals with a combination of pinestraw (free for the raking, pine cones and sticks removed...) and hay straw. My young buck is alone in his paddock as well, and he's currently got about 12 inches of bedding which he seems to like quite well.

I need to contact the breeder anyway to discuss pick-up, so I'll check on these other issues. When I purchased my buckling from her, she gave me an information packet regarding worming and vaccinations. I'll ask for a similar "handout" for Totsie. Thanks for sharing your knowledge!


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## harleybarley (Sep 15, 2014)

8x8 is a little snug for a full-size goat if that's her house AND exercise space. (We try to give 200 sq. ft. exercise space per goat), Make sure she can see the other goats so she isn't lonely. If she gets cabin fever, maybe you could take her on walks?


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## top_goat (Sep 16, 2014)

harleybarley said:


> 8x8 is a little snug for a full-size goat if that's her house AND exercise space. (We try to give 200 sq. ft. exercise space per goat), Make sure she can see the other goats so she isn't lonely. If she gets cabin fever, maybe you could take her on walks?


Good advice -- thanks! We're modifying that original plan of housing her in the dog pen...mainly because it's too far from the dogs for *my* comfort. We've had a cougar prowling at night for the past month, and I'd really like everything a bit more centralized so the pups can do their job! (They're only about 12 months old themselves.) We're building a new stall and small pen (total 8'x16') in the 25' buffer zone between the doe and buck pens. I figure we'll need it in the future for kidding or transitioning other newbies. Per your counsel, I'll look at this to see if I can scrape out a bit more excercise space. It's an irregularly shaped plot with a number of mature trees and some yaupon holly for forage...

The arrangement of the 3 pens (buck pen, then buffer zone, then doe pen) is such that when we close the goats in their stalls for the night, there's a corridor which allows the dogs to patrol freely between the two pens. My hope is that putting Totsie in this location (rather than in the former dog pen) will put her within eyesight and converstaion distance of both pens, hopefully facilitating her safely getting acquainted with the other goats and also with the dogs during the quarantine period. I also plan to walk her at least 2x daily. My hope is that this will give her exercise while beginning the transition of her diet to the primarily forage (over purchased hay) my other goats enjoy, and also facilitate her bonding to me all at the same time. We have just under 10 acres of wonderful mixed woodland...but minimal fencing (we've only been on the land a year...it's a work in progress!). The two existing pens are HUGE-- roughly 100x100, but I still allow my current 3 goats to enjoy several hours a day of free-range. They know their boundaries and have come to expect this time each day! They typically range back and forth between "the glen" and the house. I get quite the scolding when I come home from errands and they've been confined to their pens for a few hours (They're not spoiled or anything!!!). Although they have ample forage in their pens, they're eager to get out. I've come to believe "the grass is greener" saying had to have been penned by goat owners! Except in our case, it's "the yaupon is tastier..."

HarleyBarley (and others) -- thanks so very much for your counsel! If you see any other possible glitches to my plan, or think of anything else that might help, I'd be very appreciative if you share it! --Lisa


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## harleybarley (Sep 15, 2014)

Figure she wants to go home and find her kids. Build for escape-proof (and cougar proof). If that's less than 200sq'., so be it. Sick pens are _small_, but the longer they're in a small pen, the more stressful it is. I had a goat get a lump - quarantine - 2+ weeks in quarantine waiting for the culture; I was glad I had a large quarantine pen. A 2-goat quarantine pen is a lot more flexible if you can swing it. It's great that she'll be able to see her new friends from her pen!

My (limited) experience buying goats is that most are not lead-trained. You may need to spend some time patiently training her.

Has she been around dogs before? She might find dog-patrol scary if she's not used to it.

Make sure the trees aren't a bridge for escape or predators.

I don't change a goat's diet when she arrives - if I can get her hay and grain brand and feeding schedule, I keep everything the same for the first 2 weeks. I let her rumen have "normal" while the rest of her settles into her new world.

Spend quiet time with her in quarantine. New goats are cats - don't chase them. Let them get interested & come to you (offer treats if necessary_. You'll be her first friend on the farm, and that can be a good thing. Calm, quiet and peaceful is how you make goats feel safe and ready to be part of your farm. I try to avoid shots and forced handling until she's comfortable with me - best if that's done at the old farm the day before she comes home.

I'd plan to lock everyone in together for a week or two before she free ranges. You want her sticking close to her new herd if fences don't keep her with them. Don't put her in and lock them down - lock them in for several days first. She doesn't need to be joining the herd when everyone is cranky about losing forage privileges. A 2-goat quarantine pen would let you put one of the "old" goats next to her at the end of quarantine; let her bond to one and then put them both back into the herd.

It's really handy to have a separate facility that's easy to sanitize. But I prefer to birth in the barn they know as home. Too different/too far is a "move" and can stress them enough to lose the pregnancy. If you want that to be birthing pen, maybe fence it to their pen a month before births? They'll explore it on their own.

Make sure the bucks can't get to Totsie. Goats can go into heat pretty quickly after birth, especially if they don't have their kids. The earliest I've seen was a month, but she was in heat _hard_.

HTH!


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## top_goat (Sep 16, 2014)

Wow -- great advice! Thanks! I'm heading out today, planning (among other things) to get a big bag of dried apricots (my goats turn backflips for dried apricots or prunes...also banana peels and grapefruit rind!!!) I also got an email back from breeder yesterday re: worming, diet, etc. YES she's worming (much appreciated!), and she gave me details on Totsie's current diet. Finances won't permit me to duplicate it exactly, but I think I can come pretty close. 

I know that between milking and other bonding activities I'll be spending a lot of time with Totsie over the next several weeks. But that's what I did with the others, and she deserves no less! I read an article last nite in one of my books on goat massage...didn't know I'd been doing that all along with my three. They now come to me when they need "skin time". 

Dogs...yes, she's accustomed to Pyrs. I have Pyr/Anatolian crosses, so the concept of dogs is ok...it'll just be the transition to new ones. I plan to work on formal and gradual introductions...one dog at a time on lead...as often as necessary for reciprocal comfort and calm! My girl pup in particular can be a bit ADHD -- she's crazy for our goats and really good with them, but her exhberance might overwhelm our newbie, so I plan to take extra pains with her. 

Blessings!


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## harleybarley (Sep 15, 2014)

Top-goat, that's fantastic!

Is the article on goat massage online? Could you share a link? I'm intrigued!


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## top_goat (Sep 16, 2014)

I read the article in Goat Health Care: The Best of Ruminations 2001-2007 by Cheryl K. Smith. Lots of good stuff in there -- it's one of my "Top2Go2" books, Pat Coleby's Natural Goat Care being the other. This particular article was actually written by Terry Smith, RN. I'm not sure if there's anything online or not: when I googled "goat massage" all I came up with was letting kids walk all over your back! There are some pretty entertaining videos on YouTube, but I didn't find this or any other articles.

If the copyright police wouldn't get too upset, I'd be glad to scan the article and either post it up here or email it to you. I'm so new to this site, I don't know if the moderators permit posting of published materials like this...don't want to spoil relationships with such a great resource as this site by commiting a major faux paux! :worried:


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Don't post anything that could be copyrighted. We wouldn't want any problems. Thanks for posting where the article is.


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## harleybarley (Sep 15, 2014)

Thank you! I have both those books (love Coleby's especially!) I'll have to dig mine out and give it another look!


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## top_goat (Sep 16, 2014)

ksalvagno said:


> Don't post anything that could be copyrighted. We wouldn't want any problems. Thanks for posting where the article is.


Heard and heeded. Thanks!


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## top_goat (Sep 16, 2014)

harleybarley said:


> Thank you! I have both those books (love Coleby's especially!) I'll have to dig mine out and give it another look!


Page 217: "Goat Massage 101" )


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## top_goat (Sep 16, 2014)

Progress Report: I am SO excited! I shared my need and all the great advice I'd been getting in this forum with my adult son. We brainstormed a bit and came up with a plan to build a 12'x 8' shed for Totsie accompanied by an exercise pen the same size!!! We (or should I say, HE) worked on it today and has the shed fully framed, using shipping pallets and used lumber, in the buffer zone between my buck pen and my doe pen. Tomorrow we put the roof on (donated tin!) and build the fence...then we're ready for Totsie. I don't have a camera, or I'd post a picture, but trust me -- it looks awesome, and it's providing her nearly twice the minimum recommended area! 

Huge thanks to all of you who factored into this discussion, and major kudos to my son, David!


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## harleybarley (Sep 15, 2014)

top_goat said:


> We (or should I say, HE) worked on it today and has the shed fully framed, using shipping pallets and used lumber, in the buffer zone between my buck pen and my doe pen.


 That is wonderful!! I love me some goat kids, but when a human kid makes you proud, that's really special!!


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