# Thoughts on this ND Buck



## ciwheeles (Apr 5, 2013)

Since I decided to sell my first buck and go with different lines, I've been browsing through bucks. I think I found one I may be interested in and I can at least drive to get this one. I can't believe it took me this short a period of time. :hammer: Either way I can't claim him till January 2014.

His full name is Chenango Hills PV Trickster, and this is his pedigree. His Mother may make the top 10 next year in both AGS and ADGA, but as of right now his grandmother, Chenango Hills Trixie is #10 in milk production, butterfat, and she's number #4 in protein.

I only was sent one picture because the breeder said he had health problems and didn't have any more, but I would be seeing him in person anyway when I go to pick him up.

The only thing that bothers me is a local breeder who I mentioned to I paid 250 for my first buck told me that was way to much to pay for my first buck.. That I should have bought, like, a 150 dollar buck. I'm so lost by that. I thought you should always get the best available?


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Not a good enough pic to really critique him. But, from what I can see, he doesn't look too bad. Get the best you can at what you can afford! I wouldn't recommend going into debt for your 1st buck, but if you could afford it, then go for it.


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## luvmywaggintails (Nov 18, 2013)

I agree with kccjer, get the best buck you can afford. He is the one who will improve your herd...good luck


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

You should always buy the best you can afford. Maybe that local breeder is just breeding for pets and doesn't care about milk and proper conformation.


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## KW Farms (Jun 21, 2008)

Can't tell anything about him, conformation wise, from the photo. I like that his granddam has a good milk history. Make sure his dam has a good udder though...as well as good udders on the sire's side.

As for the breeder telling you to get a cheap first buck. They are so totally wrong. Get the best buck you can get! I wouldn't take any advice from them...they don't have a clue.


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## ciwheeles (Apr 5, 2013)

That's what I hate about that photo. If it were from the side that would be better than nothing, but it's all the breeder has till his daughter can take pictures for him. 

I'm glad it's not just me that thought that comment was off. She's a nice person and I go to her for goat health advice but I was so confused when she told me that. She said her reason was even an expensive quality show buck can throw bad kids.


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## KW Farms (Jun 21, 2008)

That makes no sense. Always buy the best you can afford. Breeders should be aiming to produce kids that are an improvement over their sire and dam.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

of course even an expensive buck can produce not so great offspring if bred to inferior does (like ones who are really bad conformation wise). A buck can only improve so much in one generation. But that doesnt mean you cant strive to improve. And the only way to do that is to get the best you can.


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## LGFarm (May 30, 2013)

You should always get the best available, for your herd, which won't always be the best buck for my herd or anyone else's for that matter. As a jr buck, that buck is not proven, other then he is fertile, but then again, I am wary of the breeder that you are looking at also.


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## Onion-Creek-Oberhaslis (Sep 25, 2013)

Get the best buck available, but know that the most expensive one is not always the best. Know what you are looking for and be willing to wait or walk away if it is not the best for you. Small farms might sell a little higher because they have less stock. Larger farms might sell at a lower price, but would have a greater variety to choose from and more to clear. Know your needs and choose the best you can afford. Don't let price deter you (low or high). It's your farm after all.


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## ciwheeles (Apr 5, 2013)

My mom really likes him because of his production lines and pedigree. I think he does have really strong lines.

My only reservation would be that I'm still building the foundation of the herd. 2014 will be my first year kidding and showing. I'm wondering if this would be a good production foundation buck..


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

LGFarm said:


> You should always get the best available, for your herd, which won't always be the best buck for my herd or anyone else's for that matter. As a jr buck, that buck is not proven, other then he is fertile, but then again, I am wary of the breeder that you are looking at also.


I saw no mention that the breeder told the poster that he is proven.


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## ciwheeles (Apr 5, 2013)

The breeder himself did actually did breed one of his 7 does to Trickster, and his daughter is using him this month to breed her does, but the breeder never claimed that he was proven (that I saw).


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

since you are in MD im assuming you arent traveling to NY to the Chenango Hills herd?


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## ciwheeles (Apr 5, 2013)

No I would be. I can't get him till January due to the owners daughter already planning on using him. He said that since he hadn't sold the buck and his daughter needed one he promised her she could use him. 

I figured I would go up there and get him with my mom. It's a long drive, but I'm out of college till the end of January and I've made longer trips.


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## LGFarm (May 30, 2013)

StaceyRosado said:


> I saw no mention that the breeder told the poster that he is proven.


No, that is correct, he isn't proven and no one said that he is, but for the price on this buckling, the poster could get a very good, conformational correct, proven buck, with udders, genetics, and milk records behind him, and get him shipped in to MD instead of an unproven buckling. That would probably be a smarter move for a starter herd then an unproven buckling.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

whats his price?


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## ciwheeles (Apr 5, 2013)

$1000

It's not going to break me to spend that much, but I want to make a smart decision. That's not chump change. And, I can throw any kind of money at making a herd but if I don't make the right choices that means nothing. Or I guess that's how I see it.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

Oh my for the price you could get some awesome proven even finished Champions. I think my friend has one available. Let me check.


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## ciwheeles (Apr 5, 2013)

Really? That would be pretty cool to have something with great lines that proven..


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## KW Farms (Jun 21, 2008)

The breeder wants $1,000 for that buckling and that's the best photo they have of him...and can't even get more photos for you? Pass...

You can find a proven adult buck from outstanding genetics for that price or less.


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

KW Farms said:


> The breeder wants $1,000 for that buckling and that's the best photo they have of him...and can't even get more photos for you? Pass...
> 
> You can find a proven adult buck from outstanding genetics for that price or less.


Agree wholeheartedly


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## 8566 (Jul 18, 2012)

I agree - pass. For $1000 they should be getting you what ever you want in a timely manner. I don't deal with breeders anymore who can't get me the photos I want. Some assume because of their name they can sell you an $800 animal sight unseen. Nope - not to me.

Plus if the folks are limited on mobility or health I would be concerned about his condition. Meaning that his worm load is high, minerals low, feet not trimmed ...... You didn't mention how old he is either.

Can you get onto Facebook? There are a number of nice bucks on Nigerian Goats For Sale group that are on the east coast. You could even fly them in and not deal with driving if your budget is that high.

And you didn't say what you are trying to improve in your herd. Do you have something specific? If possible look at the offspring of the buck to does that look like yours. I've seen some ugly bucks throw amazing kids.

HTH,


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

here is the group on FB that was mentioned above

https://www.facebook.com/groups/226185690759249/


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## ciwheeles (Apr 5, 2013)

I think I was too nice about the whole he didn't have pictures thing then.. I had said I would maybe send the guy a deposit but I think I should just rescind that. If I can get a proven buck for that price that I could show at the couple shows in the area and improve my herd with that would be worth it. 

Yea, this here is why I need the goatspot. You guys save me from myself. lol


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

yeah dont send him a deposit - thats just crazy for that buck. 

The one I sent you the pedigree on is really awesome.


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## KW Farms (Jun 21, 2008)

I purchased a very well bred adult *S/*B buck this year, awesome pedigree, proven, with daughters that have great udders, one daughter took reserve jr. doe at nationals, and I paid half that price for him. If you're able to spend that much...you could find something super! Take your time and shop around. 

And for that price, the seller should at least have conformation photos and udder photos for you to view.


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## ciwheeles (Apr 5, 2013)

I actually am on Facebook so I will have a look!

Thanks for the link Stacey!



> And you didn't say what you are trying to improve in your herd. Do you have something specific? If possible look at the offspring of the buck to does that look like yours. I've seen some ugly bucks throw amazing kids.


I'm not looking for anything super specific. I don't care about polled or blue eyes. You can't milk either of those things and it does matter either way to a judge! I really just care about conformation. I'm super competitive so I want to be breeding and showing nice NDs.


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## ciwheeles (Apr 5, 2013)

KW Farms said:


> I purchased a very well bred adult *S/*B buck this year, awesome pedigree, proven, with daughters that have great udders, one daughter took reserve jr. doe at nationals, and I paid half that price for him. If you're able to spend that much...you could find something super! Take your time and shop around.
> 
> And for that price, the seller should at least have conformation photos and udder photos for you to view.


Uh really? Wow that is amazing! I need to shop in those circles!


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## J.O.Y. Farm (Jan 10, 2012)

I agree with what has been said.. You can find proven bucks with great lines cheaper then that.. I agree with everyone... Pass..


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## KW Farms (Jun 21, 2008)

And you know what...he wasn't even for sale...I just asked the owner if she'd like to sell and she agreed. If you see something you like, don't be afraid to ask about it. You never know...and money talks.


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## ciwheeles (Apr 5, 2013)

Wow that's cool! Well I'll be smart and pass then. I'll just take some time and find something I like, and since Nationals are in Kentucky next year I can always drive up there and look if I don't have anything by then.


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## ciwheeles (Apr 5, 2013)

Thanks for the help everyone!!


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