# Help now please early kids? No bag?



## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

*Help now please no bag..update!!!!she gonna have 4??*

Ok so my registered oberhasli doe kidded twins last night during a storm. She wasn't due till the 19th and that was a witnessed breeding. So surprise went I went to the barn this morning. Anyway! She had moderate toxemia which was being treated per vet with Bcomplex 5cc every other day and 1/2cc banamine plus molasses and all. Ok so twins look pretty good one is sure smaller than the other and is trying to stand but hasn't. The larger is standing. My main problem now is! She has laaarge teats and NO bag?? Kids can't get their mouth on them. colostrum was really thick and sticky yellowish too they both gobbled down a bottle so I know they hadn't nursed since being born. I last checked her at 10pm and zero signs of anything obviously but were dry and trying to stand at 8. She's still working on passing placenta I see a push here and there. Sooo do I milk what I can and bottle feed them a few days and keep trying teach them nurse from Mom? Or just milk and bottle raise? Mom looks good she was eating and attentive to them. Will she get a bag?? This doe is new to me so I have no history. Was more less a rescue. I'll retest her ketone levels but she seems well. Sorry if that's all over the place but I thought we had couple weeks left.  I'll take a pic of her udder lack there of in a few.


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

The kid that won't stand is probably selenium deficient. Is he the one on the left in the photo? Do you have BoSe or selenium/vit e gel to give him? Was the doe supplemented with selenium while pregnant?

She was probably bred on the cycle before the one you saw her bred on. Was she running with a buck?

I would leave the kids with mom and supplement with the bottle as needed. A lot easier for all involved.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Make sure they nurse whether bottle feeding or nursing on mom.


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

No she was being quarantined in another pen previous to the sighted breeding. She had access to loose minerals block minerals and baking Soda all the time. The smaller kids feet are still mushy like and is currently in the house getting his body temp to level out. They both were bottle fed the colostrum and the larger one is trying to find the end of her tear nonluck yet even with help.


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

I don't know why my pics keep going sideways ugh


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

These teats will be nurseable, once the kids figure it out. Milk her a little, help the kids onto a teat and supplement with the bottle if needed. 
Was she bred to an Oberhasli?


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

She was bred with my full blooded spotted Nubian buck. I'll keep trying help them Nurse from mom. I'm not sure why she doesn't have a bag. could she still possibly fill up? Her teats hold quiet a bit but never had one that hasn't been a big bulging udder...


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

He's trying


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## capracreek (Apr 5, 2016)

Really glad to see the little one trying - hope all goes well. Birthing will stimulate milk production so I would milk her to keep it going until the kids figure it out. That way they are still drinking her milk.


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

Holy cow!!!! It's been hours and she just had a third!!!!


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## TeyluFarm (Feb 24, 2016)

Wow! That's certainly a surprise for you!


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

So the new little girl seems well, I called my vet for some more Bose and their checking their trucks but not sure if they have any in stock right now, what else could I use to give them a little boost? Is it 1cc Bcomplex? My brain is fried right now


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Give 1/2 cc orally since she was just born. It will help wake up her brain.


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

Ok y'all she has another water bag.....


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

All 3 are up one I'm keeping one to bottle make it easier for Mom. Not sure if there's a 4th coming????


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Actually hopefully another then you can have a buddy for bottle baby.


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

At what point should I go in? She's not stressing a whole lot but she stopped. Progressing


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

On my way to the vet now they're going to dispense thiamine...this girl has my stomach in knots


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## groovyoldlady (Jul 21, 2011)

O crud. Now you're not home... Just when I was getting really sucked in to this saga!

If she hasn't had another by the time you get home I would bounce her and make sure there's no one else hiding in there. If you think there's another kid then DO go in. She's been kidding for a crazy long time...

I betcha her bag will fill more once she's finally done kidding.

And those babies DO need BoSe. Does the vet really not have any? Can they get it from another vet?


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

They said they didn't have any but the thiamine would be as good would it not be??


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## groovyoldlady (Jul 21, 2011)

Not for the leg weakness - the bent pasterns are a clear sign of a Selenium deficiency...


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

Ok they're all standing but wanted to boost this one on the bottle he's just not as vigorous than the others


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## groovyoldlady (Jul 21, 2011)

Ahhhh. Ask the vet to explain to you what he's hoping the thiamin will do. That way you know what sort of improvement to look for. ;-) Keep us posted on wether it's 3 or 4 babies and how mom is doing...


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

The vet wasn't there at the office or I would have but I trust her. Might be like a next best thing from what the rejectionist said, but said to use it with the B complex. I'll update as soon as I get back home.


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## groovyoldlady (Jul 21, 2011)

How are they all doing. Any more babies?


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

The biggest boy is doing great! the girl and little boy still need some assistance with eating but are doing good. both pooped which is great. I'm keeping the one boy on a bottle and will be going to another homestead nearby when he's ready. Mom looks well, I did have to help extract the placenta after about 8 hours of just a small amount present with no will to push it out. Started her on tylan this morning as precaution. He bag really hasn't grown much. Seems her teats hold the majority. Which for hand milking isn't bad but still makes it tricky for the kids. We'll see how that goes... keeping fingers crossed for the next couple days!!


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

The girl


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Cute!


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

Keystones are now negative but mom is developing an infection. I figured as much given how long it took for the placenta to come out which I had to help with. I do believe it's all out as it was huge. Cross fingers the infection doesn't get bad.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I would start her on antibiotics and flush her.


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

Yup I'll be flushing her in the morning after I get a uterine bolus. She's eating drinking and licking her minerals but I'm very worried sthat she's not producing milk. She hasn't bagged up her teats have been filling until tonight when I did a last check on babies. I've been milking a few ounces in a bottle and feeding one, but after about 4 squeezes she was empty like absolutely nothing as was the other side which the other two has been nursing from. So after the small one ate I figured I'd see if the girl wanted any (I haven't been supplementing her today as she's been finding the teat) and she gobbled down 2 ounces! Not sure what to do to get her producing.....luckily i have two other does with 2 week kids that I can milk but really don't want to bottle feed 3 babies!!! Been there done that! Ughhhhh this one has been a rollercoaster.


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

Cute sweaters! I understand the not wanting to bottle feed. I'm feeding 5 right now. But I have 15more kids I plan to keep, if they are does, so 20 bottle kids.


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## catharina (Mar 17, 2016)

Those kids are just SO adorable!!!! Did you know you can get selenium pills at health food stores? Or does it have to be injectable? Seems like it would still be better than nothing.

I hope your doe gets better!


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## sandhillfarm (Feb 25, 2013)

oh my word 20?!! I'm now supplementing the girl as well that makes 2 bottle babies lol. 
The injectable is more effective fast acting I guess.


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

They're still in with her right? Is she letting them nurse/are they nursing?


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