# Shelter size for 3 NDG’s?



## Erin80 (Jul 11, 2020)

We are getting 3 nine week old NDG’s in mid November. We are starting to build their run and shelter, and I’m wondering how many square feet their shelter should be? We live in Ontario Canada, so our winters can get cold. Any suggestions or tips when building their shelter? Thanks!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Are you talking about their housing for night time as well, or just a shelter for weather during daytime?


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## Erin80 (Jul 11, 2020)

MadHouse said:


> Are you talking about their housing for night time as well, or just a shelter for weather during daytime?


Housing for night time.


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## goatblessings (Jan 6, 2015)

I would make sure water, etc cannot get into the shelter - so it should be higher than the ground around it. Also make the doorway away from the prevalent wind (in our area we point ours southwest). You want to make sure it's big enough for you to go into the shelter to help - and make enough space if you want hay feeders, waterbuckets, minerals, etc . bigger is better - goat math tends to happen. I would walk it out and envision exactly how you plan to manage during the night and winter.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

I like at least 10x10. Use dutch doors as they should never be completely closed in.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Depending on weather, you may have to close them in. Also depending on predators, you may want to lock them up overnight. I'd want at least a 10x20. It is nice to give them room if they do need to stay inside, locked up or not. Also consider if you are going to get more goats or have kids.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

If you make platforms you can add more space vertically. It also helps the lower rank goats to get out of the way of the dominant ones. Make sure there are enough feeding spots for them. If they didn’t grow up together they likely won’t eat side by side.
Some kind of window or clear roof part is nice for the coldest days that are sunny. For flooring we used 2x6 boards with spaces like a deck. That way some of the pee can run through.


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## North FL Nana (Jul 23, 2020)

goatblessings said:


> I would make sure water, etc cannot get into the shelter - so it should be higher than the ground around it. Also make the doorway away from the prevalent wind (in our area we point ours southwest). You want to make sure it's big enough for you to go into the shelter to help - and make enough space if you want hay feeders, waterbuckets, minerals, etc . bigger is better - goat math tends to happen. I would walk it out and envision exactly how you plan to manage during the night and winter.





Erin80 said:


> We are getting 3 nine week old NDG's in mid November. We are starting to build their run and shelter, and I'm wondering how many square feet their shelter should be? We live in Ontario Canada, so our winters can get cold. Any suggestions or tips when building their shelter? Thanks!


We just got two Nigerian dwarfs, the enclosed shelter we built for them is 12' x 12'. It's two steps off the ground with a regular size door. It gives them plenty of room for everything they need.


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

Ventilation is important, no direct drafts, but air movement. Roof ventilation is good. Goats need deep straw to nest in on those frigid winter days. Plexiglass windows for light with wire mesh. (Hardware cloth, not chicken wire). I remove my plexiglass in the summer for more air movement.

One big thing not always thought of is the water. Goats need fresh water, one poop in it and they won't drink it. (And they only poop in full buckets!) If there is no way to keep liquid water due to freezing, they will need it brought to them frequently during the day.

Some people may not have thought about the water. I always bring it up! (My own idiosyncrasy!)

One final note: whatever you decide on, make it preditor (especially dog) proof and easy for you to clean out. If it is a real chore to clean, it won't get done as often as you would like. Then it piles up, and is a real bear to clean. (deep litter is fine as long as when you kneel, your knees don't get wet and it isn't smelly).


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## Mini Oberhasli Owner (Sep 26, 2020)

Goats Rock said:


> Ventilation is important, no direct drafts, but air movement. Roof ventilation is good. Goats need deep straw to nest in on those frigid winter days. Plexiglass windows for light with wire mesh. (Hardware cloth, not chicken wire). I remove my plexiglass in the summer for more air movement.
> 
> One big thing not always thought of is the water. Goats need fresh water, one poop in it and they won't drink it. (And they only poop in full buckets!) If there is no way to keep liquid water due to freezing, they will need it brought to them frequently during the day.
> 
> ...


When you mention roof ventilation is good, can you open up the roof eaves and close the door? Won't all the heat travel up and out and not keep any warmth in? I ask because this is how I have my shed set up and I'm wondering if I have too much ventilation.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Mini Oberhasli Owner said:


> When you mention roof ventilation is good, can you open up the roof eaves and close the door? Won't all the heat travel up and out and not keep any warmth in? I ask because this is how I have my shed set up and I'm wondering if I have too much ventilation.


Not being an expert on building at all, I just wanted to say, there are lots of variables that come into play, what keeps a shed warm, but the ventilation in the roof is so it doesn't make a draft at goat level.
I have 3 duct fans stuck in the gaps below the roof, and while for sure they pull out heat, they do pull out moisture, which is so important. I read that moisture and cold is even worse than just the cold.


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## Mini Oberhasli Owner (Sep 26, 2020)

MadHouse said:


> Not being an expert on building at all, I just wanted to say, there are lots of variables that come into play, what keeps a shed warm, but the ventilation in the roof is so it doesn't make a draft at goat level.
> I have 3 duct fans stuck in the gaps below the roof, and while for sure they pull out heat, they do pull out moisture, which is so important. I read that moisture and cold is even worse than just the cold.


Thank you for your reply! Yes, I agree with keeping the humidity out, but it seems at the cost of heat with our setup. Granted, I have resisted closing their door all winter as long as the wind isn't blowing in to acclimate them. However, our mild winter is gone and the polar vortex is headed our way this weekend, and the projected temperatures will feel somewhere near -30F with windchill. I just posted in another thread, if there is a temperature that might be too cold, even for my furry cold weather acclimated dwarf goats that have been running around outside in single digits the past week, such as 40 or 50F below? I threw in a bale of fresh straw yesterday and they each have their straw filled dog kennels to crawl into inside of the shed. I am trying with great reserve to not set up a spot in the basement...
@MadHouse, I was just talking to my husband about your setup the other day. We like the idea of putting clear panels on the roof to allow the winter sun to warm them in the shed. I am inspired by you, doing what you are doing far north of us!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Mini Oberhasli Owner said:


> Thank you for your reply! Yes, I agree with keeping the humidity out, but it seems at the cost of heat with our setup. Granted, I have resisted closing their door all winter as long as the wind isn't blowing in to acclimate them. However, our mild winter is gone and the polar vortex is headed our way this weekend, and the projected temperatures will feel somewhere near -30F with windchill. I just posted in another thread, if there is a temperature that might be too cold, even for my furry cold weather acclimated dwarf goats that have been running around outside in single digits the past week, such as 40 or 50F below? I threw in a bale of fresh straw yesterday and they each have their straw filled dog kennels to crawl into inside of the shed. I am trying with great reserve to not set up a spot in the basement...
> @MadHouse, I was just talking to my husband about your setup the other day. We like the idea of putting clear panels on the roof to allow the winter sun to warm them in the shed. I am inspired by you, doing what you are doing far north of us!


Thank you @Mini Oberhasli Owner !
I am to tell you by my "Bob the builder" partner that the clear roofing was what the hardware store could order and it went with the metal roofing (same company). We installed it ourselves, and found it handled a lot flimsier than we would have liked. The south wall clear plastic is insulated greenhouse material that we had leftover. It is available in 1, 2 or 4 chamber (price goes up of course). The clear roofing sheets and the greenhouse sheets are seperate "systems" that need different edging etc to install.
The upside of the clear panels is that the barn warms up during the day. It seems to really save their hides. The downside is, the cold comes in through it at night.
That polar vortex is coming through here too. My Nigies I know will be fine. My Mini Nubian is getting a new sweater. Small spaces are great, make sure the friends can snuggle in there together.


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## Gooseberry Creek (Jun 3, 2020)

I did this for my buckling house. I just finished another one for my ND girls but still need to paint it.. The Lamanchas have their own space lol.
Buck House- You could make shutters or boards that can come off during the summer. We are super hot and humid here so everything needs to be open. I have hardware cloth across the front and wire on the sides which I will be replacing with hardware cloth due to the fact we have coyotes, bobcats, stray dogs etc. Its big enough that I can probably get another buck or two later on. I shut the door and latch it with a carbiner at night for their own protection.









Inside..we made them a little Hay feeder from some old freezer shelves and wood. There is an acre of wild grape vines and other stuff behind their pen that we are fencing off that they will be able to browse in a few times a week.


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## HD Ridge (Sep 4, 2021)

Like the design of your structure, Gooseberry. Thanks for the pictures.
I might build one like it as our climate is probably similar.


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