# Assess this udder



## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

No rear shot, sorry.


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## kelebek (Oct 5, 2007)

It is hard to tell, but seems like it could have better teat placement and bigger teats. Looks like has a medial line - but could be fuller on the back side. Front attachment looks weird to me ..... 

But I am NO expert by any means!


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

I'm not that great at this but,

She could have a smoother fore udder. It looks like she has a shelf or pocket.

Her teats could point down more. If she had a wider rear attachment then that would help with teat placement.


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## Sonrise Farm (Sep 18, 2008)

I'm not sure you spelled the title right . . . I thought poor Anna's udder was getting cursed or something so I came to see what the fuss was about . . . :ROFL: . . .sorry, I'm not going to put my foot in my mouth about the udder.  It almost looks like spirit's . . .except her's has waaaayyy bigger and longer teats.


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

Nope, not Anna's udder, another doe for sale (Grace and Kibale were sold on me, even though the breeder said she would wait until I came up this week :roll: long story) so I am still looking to add to the collection though. 

This is a saanen doe for sale but I honestly think the breeder wants too much for her. She is either horned or scurred (cant remember which, I looked at a few of her goats), this one had by far the best udder of all her animals (some were awful) but she wants $400 for her. I dont think she's worth it because:

a) she's horned/scurred which means I cant show her without taking them off
b) she has that pocket in the front of the udder, and her front attachment needs to be smoother
c) teats are a touch small, although a good shape
d) my mentor (old guy who used to run a commercial goat dairy in US) always tells me to look at the direction the teats point, and that tells you if there are attachment problems. When teats point way forward, like this udder, the rear attachment is weak. 

So I have a feeling I wont be getting this doe, but I was curious to hear what you thought of the udder. Interesting, because you guys basically said just what I was thinking. 

Your udder quality is so far advanced compared to ours. I will take some pics at our royal shows in feb and april to show you what I mean. The best goats here would probably stand at the bottom of your classes.


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## sparks879 (Oct 17, 2007)

I dont want to be mean, but i want to be honest on how i feel about this udder. Based on that alone i wouldnt get her. I dont know how old the doe is but her attachments are very poor. Not only does she have the pocket in the foreudder, but she is carrying her rear udder way too low, causing her entire udder to slant foreward. which is what is causing her teats to point out and foreward. I can see her rear udder exactly but judging by the angle of it its very narrow. If you look at the side attachments they are already starting to look stretched out. I would be worried that over the years this does udder is going to fall more and she is going to bang it around with her hocks....causing briseing and scar tissue to build up.
I know its a little harsh, but just wanting to be honest here.
beth


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## Amos (Oct 2, 2008)

Talitha, to assess means to judge or put worth upon, something like that..


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## goatkid (Jan 17, 2009)

I would not pay $400 for that doe. She lacks height and attachment in the rear udder and smoothness of blending to the foreudder. Around here, thst's what you would call a commercial dairy goat and those go for $150. For $400, you can get a doe kid or yearling from good bloodlines that's been correctly disbudded.


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

goat kid ... here, commercial unregistered does sell for $300 on the export market, registered does sell for $500 or more, thus the domestic market is priced similarly. 

And as I said, your udder quality is so different to ours. Believe it or not, this is a very good udder by Australian standards. Actually, if you remember Anna's udder, I dont think I have ever seen one like hers, ever. That is why I will put up with the parrot mouth. But I digress - give me a few minutes and I will upload 'typical' commercial goat udders.


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## PiccoloGoat (Sep 10, 2008)

yeah some aus udders are pretty bad compared to americas lol
I assume thats why you want the american nigis over here keren?


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## Sweet Gum Minis (Oct 6, 2007)

She needs more height and width in the rear area of attachments. That would hoist that udder up where it should be. Therefore removing the heavy front appearance. Her teats, from what I can tell, don't actually look bad. The placement of the udder makes them look foreward a bit more than they would be if the udder was up higher in the rear.


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

Piccolo, one of the reasons, yes. 

SGM - thanks, I see what you mean


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## PiccoloGoat (Sep 10, 2008)

lol
Any progress with the nigis?


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## Anna (Oct 17, 2007)

I didnt take the time to read all of the replies, but I just wanted to say that for me in a commercial dairy goat, the first thing I'm going to look at is the teats, and I'm not sure of how acurate the picture is, but it looks like I would have a hard time comfortably hand milking this doe. I have a doe with tiny little teats, and though I can do it, it took me forever an my hands still cramped up on me. LOL.


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## Nupine (Nov 13, 2007)

I personally would not pay $400 for this doe. The teats are awfully small and there doesn't seem to be much attachment in the rear. Rear attachment and teat size are some of the most important things IMO and this doe rather lacks them. Would be a reasonable commercial milker, but not at that price.
Ashlyn


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## crocee (Jul 25, 2008)

With Kerens permission could someone please paint some lines on that udder to show what a medial line is, where the attachments should be, and all other pertinent info. I am trying to learn but I have no idea what your talking about.


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## Di (Jan 29, 2008)

Keren, where do these "export market" goats go when you sell them? Can you import "semen" from the US? How much would a doe that's good enough to go to the National show cost you? Just curious, sounds like you could make decent money selling kids on the export market from "any old doe". Is that why the quality is slow to improve?


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

crocee, go ahead. I didnt buy the doe. 

Di, many of our export goats go to Malaysia. 

Yes, in the boers and dairy goats, as long as they have 'breed character' they will sell as unreg'd and it doesnt matter what their parentage is.

'Show quality' doe kids start at $600. Most breeders will not sell adult does. 

I spent quite a while trying to organise to get semen and embryos from US (Boer semen and Nigi embryos). I hit a brick wall when I discovered our AQIS regulations state that any US animal which donates reproductive material for import to Australia, must be euthanased and the brain examined for scrapie. So basically that means, no we cant import repro material from the US into Australia, because no one in their right mind would let me harvest semen or embryos and then kill their top animal.


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## sparks879 (Oct 17, 2007)

Ok lets see if this helps. The yellow lines are the medial or msl, medial suspensory ligament. This is the line divideing the two halfs of the udder. This ligament holds the udder up and ouff of the hocks. There is no rear attachment picture for the doe, but even from the side you can generally tell if its good or poor. In this case is attached way too low, causing the entire udder to slant foreward. Giving the illusion of poor teat placement. But its actually the entire udder slanting foreward because of the rear attachment. attchaments are all represented by red lines. The foreudder is not extended at all causing a pocket, basically as it sounds there is a hole or pocket in the foreudder, the attachment is actually back further then the tissue of the udder. The weight of the milk is already taking a tole on this does poor attachments the attachments on the sides of her udder are all stretched out.


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## crocee (Jul 25, 2008)

Thank you sparks. I think I see what everyone is saying. I found a picture that gives the terms after I asked for an explaniation. Your lines help me to see what I should be looking for.


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## ozarksvalley (Nov 22, 2007)

Here's an idea of a stronger medial suspensory ligament. This udder isn't the greatest but it's an idea. You might try to look at the other "udder" topics to get an idea, also.


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