# FizzyGoats, Unexpectedly expecting: Petunia



## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

My ND herd queen, Petunia is pregnant, confirmed by blood test. She’s 69 lbs and 1.5 years old and will be a FF. But I don’t know when she’s due. I feel so guilty. She’s my first bred doe, and now because of my mistakes, I don’t even know when to really watch her.

We had a few incidents (one apron and one gate mishap) and I can’t remember when either happened. A fence breeding is possible but not as likely. The last heat I wrote down for her was 04/15 but I could have missed ones after that because she’s not obvious. I feel like I work way too hard to do things right only to get so much wrong.

I’m stressing to get everything ready for kidding, giving myself a crash course on milk testing (realizing I might not get started in time for her to have a chance at a star), and having issues with a buck’s registration through ADGA. If she kids before mid October, I won’t have to DNA test the kids. If after, there’s a slim chance the new buck could be the sire and I’ll have to DNA test, but his registration is stuck in perpetual review in their system. 

Despite all the chaos, guilt, and stress going on in my head, Petunia is as happy as can be. She still climbs on the picnic table with a bit of effort. She’s still queen and still rules with a firm, fair attitude. But she can’t run anymore. A waddling jog is about her max.

I’m guessing she’ll have a single but I have no guesses on the date. I don’t think it’ll be real soon. Her udder, though developing, isn’t large or full. Her ligaments, well, I can’t find them but I know they’re there. Her tail still stands straight up.

I’ve read to watch for her udder to fill, behavior that is opposite her normal nature, seeking solitude, blank stares, and when she’s real close, a string of goo, yawning, getting up and down, and pawing at the ground. Anything else I should watch for?

I’ve also read that once hard labor starts, the kid should be there within 30 minutes. Do first timers sometimes take a little longer? And is hard labor when contractions are consistent and strong or when she starts pushing? Do they push a time or two to get the kid(s) in position before hard labor? I’m not sure when to start the clock. I don’t want intervene if I don’t need to. I don’t want to wait if she needs help. And I have no clue how to tell the difference. 

If you all have any advice, I’d be so grateful to hear it. Of course, guesses on when and how many are welcome as well.

I love this girl to the moon and back. Here’s some photos I took of Petunia the other day. She not positioned correctly (because I couldn’t figure out how to do that) and the lighting is terrible (lots of shadows) but hopefully these will be ok.


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## Calistar (Jan 16, 2017)

Congrats, and what a beautiful girl! Every year I keep hoping I'll get a black and white cow spotted kid like your Petunia. Last year I finally got one, but it was a buckling, so I'm back to the drawing board 😂

Anyway, if you've had Petunia for a while and you're familiar with her mannerisms it will be easy to tell. You've had goats long enough that you know what normal behavior is. The udder fill will be your first sign and it will let you know that you're about 30 days out.

When they're about 8-12 hours out, you'll see the behavior shift. Usually this is in the form of excessive vocalizing, and it's very apparent. A couple of my does aren't as vocal but instead they stay away from the herd, usually either pacing the far fence line or pacing back and forth between the front gate and the back fence line.

An hour or two before go time, there's the amber goo, but sometimes I never see it, so that's not 100%. If you do happen to see it, though, it's a good indicator.

The ligament check has never worked for me. My first doe kidded just minutes after I'd done a final check for the night and decided that "nope, her ligaments say she's not kidding today!"

I don't follow the 30 minute rule hard and fast. I hate intervening if I don't have to. FFs seem to be a mixed bag. Sometimes they take a little longer but sometimes they shoot them right out just like a seasoned doe. I'd say it has more to do with the size/position of the kid and the doe's hips than anything. As long as progress is being made, I let the doe handle things on her own. (Although I will often help pull once she gets the head and front legs out, or if it's a big kid and it's taking her a while but I have enough to grab onto that I can help.) If she keeps pushing, hard, and the kid isn't coming, that's when you have a problem. You will be able to tell which ones are the real pushes.

My best advice is to familiarize yourself with the different birthing positions- I know there are some great diagrams around. Learn which ones are normal and which aren't, and how to fix the abnormal ones in the case of dystocia. If at all possible, have a mentor (or at least a vet) who will come out in case of an emergency, no matter the hour. Even if you don't end up needing them, just the reassurance of knowing there is someone you can call can make all the difference! Also watch some birthing videos on YouTube. Reading about things and seeing diagrams is all well and good, but seeing it in person is a different experience entirely.

I bet she's got at least 2 in there 😉


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Wow she is pretty. For my girls they get 2 hours once the hard labor starts. But all my girls lay down to push. Usually on their sides being very vocal. Its a different sound, deep and gutteral. Mine usually talk to their bellies..😂🤣I know that sounds funny, but they put their nose close to their udder and talk. 
Mine get a huge udder,swollen teats, and they look stiff legged, posty. I know to check on them hourly. They want me close and nuzzle and lick me. So that tells me to stay close.
It will all work out. Dont beat your self up, just be watchful over her.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

FizzyGoats said:


> I’ve also read that once hard labor starts, the kid should be there within 30 minutes. Do first timers sometimes take a little longer? And is hard labor when contractions are consistent and strong or when she starts pushing? Do they push a time or two to get the kid(s) in position before hard labor? I’m not sure when to start the clock. I don’t want intervene if I don’t need to. I don’t want to wait if she needs help. And I have no clue how to tell the difference.


Yes, first timers can take longer than that. My vet says 45 minutes from when hard pushing labor starts. Hard labor is when the doe is actively pushing and not just contracting. They will push a few times to get the kid in position. When to intervene is sometimes hard to decide, but to me after you see a kid bubble coming, the kid should be on the ground within the next few minutes. If I see a kid bubble, I want to see two kid feet in that bubble and the doe to be making progress with each push, or I'm going in to see what's up. This might not be the same for others, but I like to help pull the kids out when they are partially out. I feel like there's no reason to prolong things when a kid is half out. Especially if the kid is backwards since the kid can suffocate if the cord breaks before it's out of the canal.



FizzyGoats said:


> I’ve read to watch for her udder to fill, behavior that is opposite her normal nature, seeking solitude, blank stares, and when she’s real close, a string of goo, yawning, getting up and down, and pawing at the ground. Anything else I should watch for?


Udder fill is a really good one. I used that one the most in my first year. Their udders can get to the point where they just look ready to pop and usually it's within 12-24 of ready to pop time. But of course individual does can be very different in their signs. A good sign I go on is when I decide to put them in the kidding stall and they are content to just stay in there alone. 

How are you with a kidding kit? Do you need any suggestions there?

I know it's stressful, but knowing the way you care for your goats, I'm sure you are going to be as prepared as you can be in under these circumstances. And we've got your back! 🤗


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## Rancho Draco (Sep 29, 2021)

First of all, congratulations! I know it's stressful but take a moment to be a bit excited. Babies on the way! I think at least two as well. With that udder already forming she should be going within the next couple weeks.

What I notice most when a doe is in labor is lots of pacing. My does will pace for hours. Lay down, get up, lay down, get up, nest and lay down again, get up and pace, lay down again, nest some more, etc. Lots of groaning and moaning and talking to their bellies and udder. They also want me to be with them during labor, even my doe who really isn't big on people will cry if I leave her alone. Hard contractions usually go on for a couple hours before pushing starts. When the doe does start pushing, she'll probably be screaming and she'll usually kick out her back legs. I also don't necessarily abide by the 30 minutes rule. If a doe is making progress but is slow, I'll leave her to it as long as she doesn't seem to be in distress. I do have a doe though that always has giant boys so if she is pushing and I'm not seeing progress, I'll help her right away because I know those kids are probably huge. 

Of course, keep in mind that they're still goats and she may have zero signs of labor and you walk away for an hour and come back to find adorable little babies. They like to surprise us like that.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Rancho Draco said:


> Of course, keep in mind that they're still goats and she may have zero signs of labor and you walk away for an hour and come back to find adorable little babies. They like to surprise us like that.


Been there done that. ☝😄


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## Lil Boogie (Mar 24, 2021)

You stressing over it, meanwhile Petunia is like "chew chew chew, burp, poop, pee, waddle waddle waddle, mom tis okie. _Falls over from fat belly not being able to lay down like normal_"


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

Wishing you and petunia the best of luck 🍀🍀🍀
Excited to see her littles when they arrive 😁


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Good luck!


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Thank you all for being kind and helpful. I’ve been feeling so bad about all this that I hesitated making a post. But I knew I needed help and figured if I had to take a few more lumps to get it, then that’s what I’d do. But you all are amazing. I figured you would be but I’m still so grateful for the truly helpful, nonjudgmental people here. I don’t know what I’d do without TGS. 


[mention]Calistar [/mention] Thank you for that wonderfully informative reply! I’ve had Petunia since she was 10 weeks old. She’s sweet but not overly affectionate. For the last few months, she hasn’t wanted to be touched but just recently she’s slowly wanting some love again. Even licking my hand on occasion. 

I have charts on the kidding positions and will watch more videos. I have a vet on notice. He just stocked me up with a bunch of “just in case” meds too. And it’s so great to know she will likely start vocalizing. She is quiet. Even when she does vocalize, it sounds like a whisper. So I’ll know if she vocalizes, to keep a close eye on her. It’s also nice to know I’m not the only one who isn’t great with feeling the ligaments. And I know I’ll be hesitant to intervene, so it’s good to know that as long as progression is happening, I don’t need to. 



[mention]Moers kiko boars [/mention] Thanks, I thinks she’s pretty but I’m admittedly biased. I’ve seen goats talking to their bellies on some of the videos I’ve watched. It’s so sweet. But the vocalizations honestly scare me a little. Hahaha. I’ve never heard my goat makes those sounds. I’ll guess I’ll know it’s serious when I do. I’m so glad you reminded me to look for the posty legs. I’d forgotten about that one. 



[mention]MellonFriend [/mention] Thats a very helpful tip about the bubble and making sure each push makes progress from that point on and the kids shouldn’t be long after that. And thank you for clarifying when hard labor starts. I should know that, I might have at one point, but my mind is going a million miles an hour lately. 

I believe I have most everything for the kidding kit, after having looked at so many lists from here, including yours. I don’t have it all organized yet. It’s just in cardboard boxes right now. What I completely spaced was things for milking, that’s not as urgent but I still feel like I better get started on that right away.

[mention]Rancho Draco [/mention] You are so right. I’ve been feeling so guilty and so focused on getting things ready, that I haven’t even taken time to be excited. I just keep thinking all the ways I am failing Petunia rather than thinking about my beautiful girl having an adorable baby (or two). Thank you for the reminder. Pacing is definitely a sign I will watch for now, pacing and nesting. 
Though like you said, she’s a goat, so who knows what she’ll do. Lol. But it’s still nice to get all these first hand experiences to learn from.

[mention]Lil Boogie [/mention] That made me laugh because it’s so true.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Oh, I almost forgot. I had my first moment of excitement today. I had Petunia on the stand for hoof trimming and she was letting me touch her backend without losing her mind (a bad habit she developed over the last few months). I read that if you place your hand firmly on the lower right side, just in front of the udder, you should be able to feel the baby. 

And I did! I felt a baby move. 

It was bizarre but unmistakeable if you’ve ever felt a baby move inside a human. A hard, rather large something skimmed across my hand and then rolled away. 

That was my first genuine excitement. I’d tried to feel it before but didn’t have the right spot I guess and all I ever felt was rumen and muscle movement, so finally getting to feel the baby was a pretty special moment this morning.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

I am so glad you got to feel a baby and finally felt excited!

I think you are doing a great job getting ready!
You are a wonderful goat mom! 
Forgetting to note down dates of mishaps can happen. Those things happen to all of us.
As mentioned above, you are there for her now, and that’s all that counts.

Petunia is so beautiful! 🥰 I am looking forward to seeing her go through the last stages of pregnancy. I am so excited for her kid(s). 
🤗 💜


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## KY Goat Girl (12 mo ago)

I have nothing to offer that anyone else hasn’t already but want to pop in and say “Congrats!” You and Petunia both will do great!  I’ve been waiting a long time for you to have your own kids!


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## Goatastic43 (Jun 11, 2021)

I’m so excited for you! I know it’s not ideal, but exciting just the same! Miss Petunia will do great! It’s pretty easy to tell when they start labor, but some times I’ve had them act fine at night and find kids in the morning! Baby monitors are definitely helpful, not sure if you can do something like that with your set up. Ours always have fast labors. I don’t know what it is about our girls, but once they start, it’s over in like 15 minutes.  But every goat is different and I agree that the 30 minute rule isn’t for every goat. 

Keep us updated and enjoy the experience! There’s nothing like new born kids. It’s just something else. We haven’t had any in almost 2 years now, and I definitely miss it. 

Also, don’t feel guilty! Bucks can definitely be trying lol. We’ve had an accidental breeding before, thanks to a buck who jumped a 6 foot fence (true story!)


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

[mention]MadHouse [/mention] What would I do without you? You are always so sweet and so tolerant of all my bemoaning and ranting. Hahaha. Thank you. I am finally getting excited. 

[mention]KY Goat Girl [/mention] Thank you! It is not how I imagined it, but the goats had other plans that I failed to thwart, so here we go. Lol. 

[mention]Goatastic43 [/mention] That buck would need to be housed in goatcatraz. Wow. And I hope my girl has a fast labor and delivery like yours. I feel like that would be so much easier on her (and me, lol). But I definitely don’t want to miss it. 

I have two cameras in the barn (three if you include the one in the bucks’ section) but I bought a baby monitor because I knew I’d need to listen all night when she got close. This one has a camera too. So now I guess I have four cameras in there. The monitor works in the house until the second I cross the threshold to my bedroom door. Go figure. The only thing I can think of doing is sleeping in my living room when the time is near. I’m just worried I’ll completely miss the signs that she’s getting close. Maybe I just bought the wrong monitor. My house and barn are fairly close. Do you have a brand/type you recommend?


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Aww, Petunia is gorgeous! Can't wait to she what she has! I'm sure she'll be an amazing momma and you an amazing goat grandma. 🥰 I'm so happy you were able to feel one of her babies! That's always such a special and exciting experience. 💗 Are you thinking the daddy to be is Champ?

To me it looks like Petunia's carrying twins (_maybe_ trips). I just went through my kidding thread from last year and if she's anything like my two FFs, she will definitely kid by the end of this month based off of udder development. I attached pictures of my two FFs from last year. Both were exactly one month away from their due dates. Lucy (light buckskin) ended up having buck-doe twins and Dottie (black) had triplets (2b, 1d)!! And I thought they were both having singles. 😂


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## Rysktal (Jan 11, 2020)

She is beautiful!!!!! I haven't experienced kidding yet, but I'm going to stick around here and see how Petunia does ♡


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

These things happen. Don't beat yourself up. I know you take great care of all your animals. I'm sure the kidding will go well. She looks pretty well grown, so she will most likely do just fine. Can't wait to see some cute kids bouncing around! Jelly bean will have playmates that are closer to her size.


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## Goatastic43 (Jun 11, 2021)

FizzyGoats said:


> Do you have a brand/type you recommend?


Unfortunately I’ve never used one myself. Our house is way to far from the stalls to use one. I’ve only heard from others and friend that they are very helpful. Can remember what brand she used. 🤔 I do remember there being a thread on it a while ago.


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## luvmyherd (Apr 9, 2011)

Can't add more advice; it has all been great. But a little experience never hurts, right?
My ChaCha was on her 3rd set of triplets and was having trouble with the 2nd kid. I sat back and watched seeing if she could handle it. She laid down several times and rolled back and forth and lo, got the baby in position and delivered fine. I think it was nearly 40 minutes.
We have had to go in numerous times over many years but try to put it off until we are sure it is necessary.
As to bagging. My Starry night never even looked for sure pregnant. I went out to the barnyard and she was bagged up. I put her in a pen, ran to the house for towels, came out to her baby on the floor.
So, nothing is certain as stated by others.
Your Petunia is absolutely gorgeous and I look forward to seeing those twin does😜
Can't even tell you how many oopses we have had and not one has been disastrous. You are gonna love milking.


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

Awww…she’s a pretty girl!
Take a deep breath, you got this! She looks about a month out so plenty of time. I’m guessing twins.
one thing no one has mentioned yet….make sure you watch this….😁😵‍💫


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

[mention]Dandy Hill Farm [/mention] Those pictures were really interesting. They do look very similar to Petunia. That definitely helps with a timeline. I hope she’s carrying twins, just so it’s not a lonely baby. lol. And I don’t know how you remembered Champ’s name, but that’s impressive. And yeah, I think he’s the sire. We didn’t get Briar, our other buck, until after mid May, so if she kids before mid October, we won’t have to worry about a DNA test. 

[mention]Rysktal [/mention] Thanks. This all new for me too 

Thank you [mention]Cedarwinds Farm [/mention] Petunia is my biggest doe. I’m actually getting ready to breed the other two on their next heat or maybe the one after that. And I am curious if Jellybean will be happy to have some goats smaller than her around or jealous that she’s not the baby anymore. She hangs out with Petunia the most and Petunia is very sweet to her. But I am curious how/if the dynamics will change when Petunia kids.

[mention]luvmyherd [/mention] I’d never heard of a goat moving around so much to reposition a kid between the first and second one. I’m glad you shared that with me. I hope Petunia is more like Starry Night though. Lol. 

[mention]GoofyGoat [/mention] I used to laugh a lot harder at this than I do now. Lol.


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

FizzyGoats said:


> And I don’t know how you remembered Champ’s name, but that’s impressive. And yeah, I think he’s the sire. We didn’t get Briar, our other buck, until after mid May, so if she kids before mid October, we won’t have to worry about a DNA test.


Why thank you! 🤥 Okay, fine. I _really _wish that was the case..... It was killing me that I couldn't remember your bucks' names so I had to do some thread searching. 🙃🤫🤣
While either of your boys should produce some very nice kids, it's nice that you most likely won't have to worry about DNA testing Petunia's kid(s)! 😃


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## luvmyherd (Apr 9, 2011)

FizzyGoats said:


> I’d never heard of a goat moving around so much to reposition a kid between the first and second one.


That was the only time I ever saw a doe work so hard to position babies. She seemed to know exactly what she needed to do.
I hope you get more of a Starry experience as well.🤞


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

It’s funny, we stress ourselves out so much before kidding because we love our goats and we want to do everything right. Except all the stress also takes away some of the awe and joy of a perfectly natural happening…just remember 99% of births are uneventful and wonderful, The reason we stress so much, is because on TGS we hear a lot more about the hard births… than the easy ones…it’s the nature of the beast. This forum helps out folks.

You‘ll do great and so will your girl.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

[mention]Dandy Hill Farm [/mention] You are too funny! I always gets the names of other TGSers goats mixed up. Never feel bad if you can’t remember one of my goats’ names. I forget them half the time. Lol. I’ll have to post some pics of Champ if I can find any good ones. He’s turned out so nice. And the *B definitely doesn’t hurt matters. But Briar is gorgeous too. He’s not a *B, but he comes from great milkers and really nice udders and has decent show lines too. So like you said, either way it’ll be fine, but it’d be nice to avoid a DNA test. 

[mention]luvmyherd [/mention] I’m so impressed you had the wisdom and knowledge to distinguish between, she’s working on it and she needs help. I guess sometimes you have to rely on experience, knowing your doe, and intuition. 



GoofyGoat said:


> It’s funny, we stress ourselves out so much before kidding because we love our goats and we want to do everything right. Except all the stress also takes away some of the awe and joy of a perfectly natural happening…just remember 99% of births are uneventful and wonderful, The reason we stress so much, is because on TGS we hear a lot more about the hard births… than the easy ones…it’s the nature of the beast. This forum helps out folks.
> 
> You‘ll do great and so will your girl.


Wow, this is so true. I have all but drowned the awe and joy of this amazing journey with my sweet girl by stressing. This was very well put and I needed to hear it.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

After practicing on my small goat, Jellybean, I was finally able to find the ligaments on Petunia. It’s not so easy once they develop a muscled rump and an attitude. Jellybean’s ligaments almost felt like a pencil while Petunia’s were rubbery and didn’t feel as rounded, but they were still fairly firm. Hopefully, she won’t be too much of a stinker about me checking. She has recently decided she hates her back end being touched. Some days Petunia loves me, stares up sweetly at me with those big eyes, and wants all the love and comfort I have to offer. Other days, she wants her space.

No significant changes except weight. I weighed her on the 16th of August when the vet was here to draw blood and then weighed her Wednesday this week and she’d gone from 69 to 79 lbs. It’s weird because she looks the same to me. She even took off running and playing with the other does yesterday. Her run lasted about 10 seconds then slowed to a brisk waddle. But for a bit, she enjoyed zommies with her gal pals. She is fairly active for as big as she is, but spends most of her day lying around chewing cud or eating.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

I am so excited about this birth, been waiting for it ever since you joined the group. Starting at the last known heat cycle, the due dates could be approximately 09/12, 10/03, or 10/23. My guess would be during the first week of October and twins. Since it's a goat, she might decide those kids are cooked enough and deliver by this time next week. Whenever she kids, it will be an occasion for newborn pictures and counts added to the kidding calendar. Both you and Petunia will get through this amazing experience with flying colors. Also, there will be a group of members to draw from that may very well wait out the whole process with both of you as the time nears.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

That would have been fun to see Petunia zoom and then waddle! 😂 
I hope there will be more days that she loves attention and love.
When you have a chance, an update picture would be great!


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Oh Fizzy… how exciting and boy mama is pretty. Keep in mind… most times they do just fine without our help. She’s in good condition, well cared for, so don’t stress too much lol. Enjoy the process. And of course you know your Forum family will be here to help if needed.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

☝ Yep


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

I just want to wrap my arms around all of you for a big group hug. Thanks so much! 

Out of those the predicted dates, I’m guessing (and hoping) for the early October one. We’ll see. And thank you for doing all that calculating for me! I also hope it’s twins so the baby isn’t a lone little goat. 

And I will keep reminding myself that most kiddings go fine without intervention. I’m so grateful you’ll all be here if I’m wondering what to do. 

Here’s a pic from today. Her udder is a bit bigger. I need a lot more practice finding ligaments. I definitely can’t go off that because I’m not good at it. She hasn’t given me any signs that she’s close. We’ve still got some time.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

The ligament test can let you down too. Ligaments can disappear and reappear, so it's not always a helpful tool anyway. To me, I think she looks like she'll be waiting a bit longer, but I've been wrong before. 😏 And I think she's got more than one in there.


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

If you haven't already, start watching Blue Cactus Dairy Goats. She has a bunch of kidding videos, and I found them very informative.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

I think there’s somehow milk on the barn floor where Petunia was lying when I went to do a bed check. She’s also making little grunting sounds and licking me. No mucous or other changes. But what the heck is on the dirt here?

She was lying in it, so her udder and legs are sticky with it. But sticky like she laid in milk, not mucous. I touched and smelled it and it’s not thick and there’s no distinct smell. I’m concerned. I know the baby will need that colostrum. And the plug is supposed to still be in. Not sure what to do or why it’s happening. Should I wash her up and spray with FightBac?


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

My goat started leaking some milk an hour before delivery. She was licking the area to keep it clean. She still had plenty of colostrum for the babies. I might spray it just to be safe.


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

Yes, I would wash her and use the fight bac. If she keeps doing this and doesn't have the kid soon, you may put some Elmer's glue over her teat orifices to help them stay sealed. Sounds like she may be kidding soon, though! Exciting!


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Thank you both! I will wash her up and spray her. And if I see it again, I think I have some Elmer’s glue in the house. There were two spots when I came in the barn. That one was just right under her when she got up.


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## Rancho Draco (Sep 29, 2021)

Oh how fun! If she's leaking colostrum, I think you may have babies coming within the week. Now don't tell her this because then she'll hold them in longer 😂 darn doe code...


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

I’m not telling her anything. Lol. 

She’s definitely leaking. She laid down again and soon there was another white puddle under her. And wouldn’t you know it, I don’t have Elmers glue. I can get some tomorrow though. I hurried and readied the kidding stall with lots of thick straw and put her in there after I cleaned and sprayed her udder. Maybe lying on a softer surface will help. She is grunting and uncomfortable though, so I’m sitting in the barn with her for a while. She still doesn’t look ready to me but I want to make sure she’s not going to try to sneak in a baby while I’m not looking.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Doggonit if I don't need to just zip it about when I think other people's does are going to kid. 🤐😄 

If tonight's the night, happy kidding! You've got this!


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Lol. I still am not sure. Other than acting like she MIGHT be in labor and leaking, I still don’t think she “looks” ready. But if it is tonight, maybe you should go around and guess longer than you really think just to give them better luck of having it sooner. Lol.


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## Doe C Doe boers! (6 mo ago)

I completely missed this thread some how!!! Hope she kids soon and can’t wait to see the babies! 🥳 Good luck you got this!


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

I’ve been out here all night. She’s streaming mucous now. So we’re having a baby sometime in the near future.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

This has been our set up most the night. The trash bag and towels are my bed. So far no consistent, hard pushing. Poor girl is getting real uncomfortable though. 

Oh, she just pushed!


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

Oh, yay! Go Petunia! Can't wait to see some babies!


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Good morning FizzyGoats, you'll soon become a Grand Nanny. Seems like the 12th of September was the due date after all and the wait will be over soon. Gosh, her udder filled beyond capacity since the last posted picture yesterday evening. That cute little udder looked full, though wasn't shinny full yet. So, unless things change, the next time she freshens it appears she will fill right before labor. This impending birth will be upmost in my thoughts as the day unfolds and I'll probably be signing in and out of the forum during short breaks throughout chore time.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

It looks like it’s just one. A little doeling. She’s 3.08 lbs. and was born at 4:09 a.m. central time. No help needed for delivery. Phew. Petunia did great.


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

Congratulations you BOTH did great! What a cutie, and a doeling to boot! 🥰🤗🥰🐐


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

Aww, she's a cutie! Congrats!


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

What a sweet looking little face. Congratulations to you and yours. Jelly Bean will have a kid playmate closer in size in a couple of weeks. Since Petunia is the herd queen, this little doeling will have birth right status within the herd. A little princess in the making.

Is that milk foam on her bottom lip?


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

GoofyGoat said:


> Congratulations you BOTH did great! What a cutie, and a doeling to boot!


 I’ll admit I had a moment of panic when I saw something the size of a large potato trying to come through an opening the size of a dime but Petunia did amazing! And the baby presented perfect, two hooves and a nose. So glad my first kidding was one of the smooth ones. 



Cedarwinds Farm said:


> Aww, she's a cutie! Congrats!


 Thank you. She came out with a little sass and spunky too. So that’s always relief. 



NigerianNewbie said:


> What a sweet looking little face. Congratulations to you and yours. Jelly Bean will have a kid playmate closer in size in a couple of weeks. Since Petunia is the herd queen, this little doeling will have birth right status within the herd. A little princess in the making.
> 
> Is that milk foam on her bottom lip?


Aw, thank you. Jellybean has been the most curious, looking in to see the new baby. The other goats act like they’ve seen this a hundred times. Lol. And this one definitely came out with the attitude of a little princess. She wanted fed right away. And yes, that’s a little milk foam on her lips. She’s a hungry girl but not yet great at finding the teat though. And Petunia is so obsessed with licking her that it makes it even harder, but hopefully everyone gets it figured it out. I’m here trying to stay out of the way but assisting as needed.


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## Goatastic43 (Jun 11, 2021)

Oh yay! What a cutie!  Congratulations! I had a feeling I was going to wake up to see Petunia kidded. So what do you think? Isn’t it a great experience to have one born on your own farm?!


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## Dandy Hill Farm (Aug 5, 2021)

Oh my goodness!! Congrats to you and Petunia on the darling little doeling. So glad everything went well. 🥰 Do you know if you'll be retaining her? Do have a name picked out yet?


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## Doe C Doe boers! (6 mo ago)

Oh man how cute is she!!!! Congrats on your first kidding 🥳. Glad everything went well and it wasn’t too stressful! Can’t wait to hear what name gets picked!


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## KY Goat Girl (12 mo ago)

Oh my goodness! How precious!  She’s beautiful! Does she have blue eyes? She looks like a Champ baby to me.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Awe… what a doll!!! Congratulations


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

I’m so excited for you! 🤩🍀❤

She’s arrived and she’s beautiful!! 😍❤🥰

for some reason all of the posts after her leaking milk didn’t load until after I posted a minute ago. But now I’m all caught up on the smooth kidding and the pretty little princess 😊


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Goatastic43 said:


> Oh yay! What a cutie!  Congratulations! I had a feeling I was going to wake up to see Petunia kidded. So what do you think? Isn’t it a great experience to have one born on your own farm?!


It was such an amazing experience! I am so glad I was there for it. Petunia was very calm through it all and only yelled a little at the end. She’d sleep cuddled up to me for a while. Then she’d move and move again and eventually come back to cuddling with me. The actual birth was scary and wonderful. Being there to catch the baby, break the sac, and feel that first breath. Wow. Just wow. 



Dandy Hill Farm said:


> Oh my goodness!! Congrats to you and Petunia on the darling little doeling. So glad everything went well.  Do you know if you'll be retaining her? Do have a name picked out yet?


I was set on selling all the kids this first freshening but the bottom really dropped out of the market around here, so we’ve been reconsidering. I guess it’s a wait and see type of thing. No name picked out yet. 




Doe C Doe boers! said:


> Oh man how cute is she!!!! Congrats on your first kidding . Glad everything went well and it wasn’t too stressful! Can’t wait to hear what name gets picked!


 Thank you!



KY Goat Girl said:


> Oh my goodness! How precious!  She’s beautiful! Does she have blue eyes? She looks like a Champ baby to me.


 I am not sure what color her eyes are. I don’t know why it’s hard for me to tell. Lol. Champ is definitely the sire. We only had him when she would have gotten pregnant, so that saves a DNA test, which we would have had to do if she delivered any time after mid October. 



happybleats said:


> Awe… what a doll!!! Congratulations


Thank you!


Petunia is very attentive (maybe a little too attentive). She is such a good mama. Oh and she passed the placenta just a few hours after kidding. 

Is there anything special I need to be doing for mama or baby? I just finished cleaning the barn and came inside to give them some down time. Baby is active and already trying to run and figure out how to bounce (not even close, but trying). I’ve seen the baby pee and it looked good. Petunia is eating, drinking, peeing, pooping, and obsessing over baby. I gave her a little warm molasses water right after kidding and am leaving her alfalfa pellets and grain in front of her and she nibbles here and there. I of course have hay and minerals in the stall as well as water. 

Should I be doing something else? Anything special I should watch for to make sure mama and baby are doing ok?


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Did you iodine the umbilical cord? Ither than that,, sounds like a Perfect.birth! How are you? Isnt it amazing? ( and addictive)🤪😂🤣


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Sounds like everything is going well. Dipping the umbilical cord a few times as it dries up is good idea (you may have mentioned that and I missed it) deworm mom with in 24 hours. Steal a little colostrum if You can. I usually do this after baby has had a full 12 hours. Freeze it for emergencies. 
congrats again…


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## Rancho Draco (Sep 29, 2021)

Congratulations! I too was expecting some cute baby pictures this morning and Petunia didn't disappoint! What a wonderful little girl! I'm so happy that you that you were able to be there for the birth and that it was smooth. Has the little girls umbilical cord been dipped?

ETA: I see that I was beat to that question 😂


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

FizzyGoats said:


> Should I be doing something else?


I highly recommend a midafternoon nap, on a softer surface than your straw bed from last night.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Thank you all!

I sprayed the umbilical cord with iodine, really soaked it, twice. But I didn’t know to continue to do it, so that’s good to know. Maybe I’ll try to steal some colostrum this evening. What do you freeze it in? And do you filter it? I need to wash Petunia’s legs and back side, so maybe I’ll try then. I also gave her a double dose of LOH and gave herbs and essential oils yesterday. Plus I gave her vitamins c just a few hours ago. I will keep up a good regimen on all that. When should I check fecals to make sure she’s not having a parasite bloom? 

The little doeling is getting better at finding a teat and Petunia is getting better about not licking her right out of nursing.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

NigerianNewbie said:


> I highly recommend a midafternoon nap, on a softer surface than your straw bed from last night.


Lol. That sounds like a really good idea.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Super huge congratulations! 🥳 I'm so glad it went smoothly for you and her! The little baby is so sweet. 🥰😍 Petunia is sounding like she is being a very attentive momma. I hope you can find some time to give yourself a nap today.



FizzyGoats said:


> Thank you all!
> 
> I sprayed the umbilical cord with iodine, really soaked it, twice. But I didn’t know to continue to do it, so that’s good to know. Maybe I’ll try to steal some colostrum this evening. What do you freeze it in? And do you filter it? I need to wash Petunia’s legs and back side, so maybe I’ll try then. I also gave her a double dose of LOH and gave herbs and essential oils yesterday. Plus I gave her vitamins c just a few hours ago. I will keep up a good regimen on all that. When should I check fecals to make sure she’s not having a parasite bloom?
> 
> The little doeling is getting better at finding a teat and Petunia is getting better about not licking her right out of nursing.


I'm not sure about filtering the colostrum, but I did just to strain out any debris. Freezing it in an ice cube tray is convenient way to do it. Definitely keep up with the herbs and EOs for her and I would do a fecal within four or five days, to be sure it's working. Kidding was the time that herbs failed me, and I learned that I needed to chemically deworm at this time in order to keep their numbers down.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

What a cutie pie!


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

Oh congratulations! I didn’t want to say it last night but I thought baby was on the way. So glad everything went smoothly and that you got a beautiful doeling.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Congrats, so cute.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Thanks [mention]MellonFriend [/mention] I will watch her carefully and check her fecal in a few days. I’ll have to check and see what I can get near me for chemical treatment just to be prepared. I did drift off watching the barn cam while lying on the couch. I only slept about ten minutes and woke up in a panic thinking I’d slept hours and needed to check the baby. 



ksalvagno said:


> What a cutie pie!


Thank you! 

[mention]BloomfieldM [/mention] I know you didn’t say it outright, but I understood what you weren’t saying. Lol. 



toth boer goats said:


> Congrats, so cute.


Thank you!


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

FizzyGoats said:


> Thanks [mention]MellonFriend [/mention] I will watch her carefully and check her fecal in a few days. I’ll have to check and see what I can get near me for chemical treatment just to be prepared. I did drift off watching the barn cam while lying on the couch. I only slept about ten minutes and woke up in a panic thinking I’d slept hours and needed to check the baby.
> 
> 
> Thank you!
> ...


Can’t jinx it 😂🤣😂


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

So now for my list of random questions. 
I mean, you all know me, you know this was inevitable, right?

1. The breeder I got her from said to make sure I milk her twice a day, every day to keep her even and to hopefully avoid mastitis. I plan on doing milk test so this isn’t an issue, but do I start now? Do I give her a few days? (The kid will be dam raised but I am going to attempt to get her to take a bottle to prepare for test days.)

2. Petunia is a bit red and swollen. Can I put something like Preparation H on her to help? 

3. …Oh man, my brain went dead. I could feel the questions slipping away as I was typing, like a flashing low battery light on my coherency. Well, to be continued. Probably.


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

My goat who kidded without assistance didn’t really need anything applied to her lady parts. I just cleaned ( very very gently, mostly wrung out a rag over the area with some patting) with nice chilly water to help with the swelling. My doe that needed intervention I did use preparation H and it did seem to help.


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

You can apply some witch hazel 😊


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

On colostrum: I freeze in one oz portions in freezer bags. Breast milk baggies are perfect but not everyone has that laying around lol
No need to filter. It’s usually pretty thick . Just clean her udder and teat and your hands of course.
I would do 3 days of LOH 2x a day as protection against parasite bloom.
unless you want milk, justkeep watch on her udder and if it becomes uneven, milk her then. Usuallly a week or so in the baby learned there are two sides and will do that work for you. Singles can be challenging though. If you want milk you can milk however, I would just keep her even for now, but once baby is 2 weeks old she can be penned in a safe area for the night and you milk mom in the AM and let her have baby the rest of the day. First few nights will challenge your heart strings as neither will like being separated.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Thank you so much!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Congratulations!!! I am so happy with you that Petunia kidded and all went well!
The little girl is adorable 🥰! I am glad Petunia is a great mom too!

I treated my does with LOH acute dosing (4x a day double dose) for two days, then did a fecal.

I milk some colostrum out on the second day as well and freeze in ice cube trays.
I had to milk one side from May’s udder until her kid learned both sides.
Once you are ready half wean (over night) you can also tape her teats, then there is no separation needed.

I think it will be hard to train the baby to a bottle, if she has the real thing right there. My girls wanted nothing to do with the bottle, only once one got really hungry she accepted it.

I hope you are sleeping well tonight! 😴


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Thanks. I slept like a rock. I stumbled to bed at 8:45. Didn’t even make it to 9. Then I slept straight through the night, which is unusual for me. I didn’t wake up until 4:50 a.m.

Trying to figure out a new routine is causing pandemonium in the barn. I don’t know how you all make milking your herd look so easy. I don’t have it down at all and keep forgetting steps. Petunia hates being touched on her udders and backside. She refuses to eat now while on the stand, which is where she always eats breakfast. She bucks and kicks when I’m cleaning her and putting on (or taking off) my make shift soft rope hobbles, and the hobbles were an after thought and not working properly, so I need to do some tweaking. I definitely don’t have a system down. The funny thing is, while I was milking her, she was fine. Still wouldn’t eat, but she just stood there during milking. I just evened her out this morning. She wasn’t too lopsided. I took about three ounces from one side. And I did save it and freeze it. 

I attempted bottle feeding the baby while Petunia was on the stand eating her dessert (sunflower seeds with some coconut oil and LOH). Thankfully Petunia will eat that and I put her breakfast in her dish in her stall and she eats it in small nibbles throughout the day. The baby didn’t really suckle, but the nipple I used drips, so it did get some and started figuring out that it wasn’t all bad. I’ll try again tomorrow and I think I might stay with the drippy nipple. Ha, after writing, ‘drippy nipple,’ it seems like it should be the name of some strange alcoholic drink or something. Anyway, even though that wasn’t the nipple I meant to use, I think it worked in my favor. 

Getting off the stand and back into the stall is another round of chaos. The does are trying to rush into the milk room, even though they’ve always gone in one by one and always in the same order. Suddenly, they’ve forgotten that. And while they’re trying to storm the milk room, Petunia is losing her mind because she doesn’t have her baby even though I’ve showed her repeatedly that the little one is in my arms. I’m using my legs like a defensive soccer player, blocking this doe then that doe from going in the milk room, while holding the baby with one hand and dragging Petunia, who is frantically searching for the baby I’m holding, out of the milk room. Add in some circus music and you’ve got a show. 

Even though it’s hectic, I’m still really happy. The baby gained about 0.4 lbs in a day. Everyone seems happy and healthy. And in the end, that’s all I really care about.


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

Aw, you'll get the hang of it. I like to lock my does out of the barn entirely at milking time. So they have to come in from outside, then through a stall door to get to the milking stand. That way I can sort the one I want into the stall, and can then bring her to the milk stand without getting mobbed by all the others.
I would try tying Petunia's legs down to the stand. Though if she's not kicking while being milked, you may not need to hobble her at all.
That photo is adorable!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

That all sounds about right for the first milking and routine change 🤪 🤣!!
I think you are doing a great job, and it will all fall onto place.
My May did not really eat grain for a bit after kidding, and I heard that is not uncommon.
Once Petunia’s hunger kicks in, she will be so much better. Right now all she can think of is her baby. 🥰 💕 
I am so glad you had a good sleep!

That is such a sweet moment you captured! 🥰


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

The routine will come, don't worry. I always feel like a circus act juggling who goes where and when at milking time until the goats (and myself) have the new order figured out. That picture is just gorgeous. 🥰 
How did you feel actually milking for the first time? Did you struggle with the technique at all?


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

The drippy nipple is a good idea, but if baby is t hungry, they’ll hold out. Lol
My first bottle baby was hungry and had really good suction action, but the bottle level didn’t seem to hardly go down. After a day or so, I cut the tip off so he could eat a decent amount. They make the hole so tiny!
Good luck with your milking venture! Eventually a new routine will be the norm! 🍀🍀🍀
And of course, I agree that pic is great of your adorable little doeling 💕


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## Rancho Draco (Sep 29, 2021)

That sounds like a perfectly normal start to a milking routine 😆. They'll figure it out. Every doe that I've milked has refused to eat while being milked for the first few days. I have had a couple does that would throw the bowl rather than eat during milking which, although makes the chickens very happy, is an extremely annoying habit. They eventually calm down as it becomes more of a routine. Mine also rush the gate when figuring out the routine. Mine settle down after a few days of the routine but if you can manage to hold a spray bottle, that would be a good tool to train them not to rush the gate.


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

The first 2 weeks were the hardest for me after kidding. Then things started to get smoother


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Well you all have made me feel so much better about the circus that I call milking time. It’s one of those things that you think you’re the lone screw up in because everyone seems to do it so effortlessly. Such a relief to learn a lot of you started out with similar chaos. 

The first actual milking was sort of hilarious. She stepped in the bucket, of course. She was antsy and I didn’t have any hobbles set up. So I stood behind her, bent over, hugging her to blindly milk her, and just hoped I hit the bucket. Very rarely did. Lol. The second one, which was this morning, I had her hobbled because she’s so bad with the washing that I have to just to get her clean. But the actual milking went great. I sat on a small upside down bucket off to the side and that improved my aim greatly. And she stayed very still, even widened her legs to help me out. That gives me hope. I’ll find out tonight. Right now I just want her up there twice a day. I don’t really care how much of a mess we make of it. She and I are learning together. 

The actual technique of squeezing the milk out of the teat took some adjusting as I’ve only ever milked a cow before. Not the same as a dwarf goat. Lol. And even that was years ago. But once I figured it out, it was quite enjoyable. Of course, I’m not emptying her out right now, just getting her used to it and keeping her even.

I did witness the baby nurse from each side today. So that’s good. The baby got to play in the barn and in the pen while I cleaned their stall. She had a blast. It was so hard to get back to cleaning because I just wanted to watch her. She is trying very hard to jump and twist and run and not so great at any of it yet.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

The mess will reduce greatly as both you and her get better. Although, I still accidentally shoot milk onto the walls sometimes. 😄 

I think there is probably nothing more enjoyable to watch than a baby goat learning to jump. 😀


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

I dont do dairy, milk. But the chaos of being torn between doing all the extra work, or watching those new babies is torment. I swear it takes me at least 2 hours to do a 30 minute clean up! And you have to touch, pet pick up and snuggle each & every kidd. Dont want Anyone to get jealous!.🥰


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

I’m in love with this baby’s color.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

[mention]MellonFriend [/mention] I had to laugh when you said you sometimes still squirt milk at the wall. I know I’ll having aiming mishaps for years to come.  And yeah, watching a baby learn to jump is about as adorable as it gets. It’s so neat to finally experience it. 


[mention]Moers kiko boars [/mention] Yes! It is so hard to walk away and do chores. The baby is addictive. And I only have one. I keep snuggling baby, then mama, then baby, and so on. 


[mention]BloomfieldM [/mention] I love her color too! I was hoping for one colored like the dam, but her color is so gorgeous that I’m not at all disappointed. 

So question for all, when do you let mama and baby mingle with the others? I’m thinking of inviting one in at a time tomorrow to meet the baby. 

And when do you let them go out on pasture? I am definitely not considering this yet. Just curious of the timeframe others choose because Petunia wants to forage. She’s very happy when I bring her branches. But I can’t let her out because she won’t go without her baby and it’s way too dangerous for the baby. It’s such a tiny little thing. And there’s ditches and ponds and numerous dangers. I even worry about aerial predators. The pen has netting over it so I’m fine with her staying there for quite a while longer. But mama is sick of hay and pellets and wants to go pick her favorites from the buffet she’s used to. Should I just hold the baby and take Petunia for little walks?


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Those questions, only you will choose. I have several deliver around the same time. So my mamas & kids are together. Day 1 mom& babies alone in a birthing pen. Day 2 they are in a barn with others. But its a small paddock with chicken wire over the bottom on the fence. The kids are about 2 weeks old before mine are in a pasture. And still again, its with a group around their age. 
So I cant help you there. I do wish you the best. Im sure you will do just fine.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

FizzyGoats said:


> So question for all, when do you let mama and baby mingle with the others? I’m thinking of inviting one in at a time tomorrow to meet the baby.
> 
> And when do you let them go out on pasture? I am definitely not considering this yet. Just curious of the timeframe others choose because Petunia wants to forage. She’s very happy when I bring her branches. But I can’t let her out because she won’t go without her baby and it’s way too dangerous for the baby. It’s such a tiny little thing. And there’s ditches and ponds and numerous dangers. I even worry about aerial predators. The pen has netting over it so I’m fine with her staying there for quite a while longer. But mama is sick of hay and pellets and wants to go pick her favorites from the buffet she’s used to. Should I just hold the baby and take Petunia for little walks?


You can start integrating baby with the other members of the herd pretty much right away. I like to do it at about four days old so that baby has the coordination enough to get away if the other herd members decide to be mean. Have your squirt bottle ready! Give any offenders a good squirt if they show aggression to baby. Introducing one at a time is a good idea so that it doesn't get too hectic for you. I also like to be holding baby when I first let the does back together because usually there will be a bit of fighting between the does and it's best to get the baby out of the way until that calms down. 

As far as letting them out in the pasture, my does were fine if I watched baby while letting them get some pasture time, but Petunia might not be cool with that. Could you let Petunia and baby get some pasture time with your supervision? Baby should stick pretty close to her momma.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

FizzyGoats said:


> Should I just hold the baby and take Petunia for little walks?


Petunia would let any of the other critters know how she felt about her newborn being approached. If she isn't ready to introduce the little one yet, being in your arms would be a safe snuggle place while Petunia sorted things out and hopefully could browse for a little while. Sometimes, it is hard to determine when any first time mother feels comfortable enough to be less possessive and protective of the babe without watching what unfolds.

Petunia getting out for a little while to walk around and eat some brush would be good for her physical and mental health. Would also allow her to flex her herd position sooner than later. I personally would give this idea a try and if necessary, shuttle the little one back to the bonding pen and separate Petunia from the herd back with her doeling and try again the next day.


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## KY Goat Girl (12 mo ago)

I usually wait til about 3-4 days old and then put the mama/baby(ies) out with the others. Mama will put other goats in their place if they get too close for comfort. And since Petunia is hers queen, that’s all the better.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

I let my mamas have yard time (outside of the fence) with their kids a couple times a day, until I felt the kids had enough possession of their legs to get away from the other goats. During the yard time, I stayed with them and watched.


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## Rancho Draco (Sep 29, 2021)

I kick my momma's and kids out of kidding stalls on day two. They're out with the herd pretty much right away. Mama's are protective of their babies. I also put out little shelters for the babies to get into. My favorite thing to use for this is a big plastic dog crate broken down into the top and bottom pieces. They're sturdy enough to get beat up a bit by the goats and you can usually get them used for a good price.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

I second that about the little shelters! For the first week my babies slept a lot. They love curling up in small spaces, like a crate or box.


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

I try for 2 days bonding in the stall and then let them out. That also depends on how mama and babies are doing tho. If the babies are weak then I wait longer. But a healthy, active little baby should be able to walk out with mama a little bit. Mom will go slower and not be as worried about staying with the rest of the herd. She’ll mosey along grazing bits here and there, nosing baby, nursing baby… you’ll be a little surprised how well they can keep the little ones with them. 😊
Walking with them the first day to put yourself at ease wouldn’t hurt a thing tho. 
and mom will probably like a little shelter to tuck her baby into so she can go graze… then come back bawling like crazy cus she can’t find where the little one went 😅


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

If they aren't comfortable with the herd, or other herd members are being too rough with the kids, I like to let the mamas loose to graze around the yard under supervision. It gives them some fresh food and gets the kids out into the sunshine. I actually covered several things along this topic in a video, if you're interested! It's a bit long, so feel free to skim...or skip entirely.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Thank you all so much. I will have to figure out some little shelters for the baby. For today, when I’m out with them, like now, I will open up the small pen to the buck and turkey pens, which are connected and empty during the day (they all go to what we call the bachelor pasture every day). But it’s still a much smaller space then just letting them out to pasture with the other does. Jellybean and Jasmine each came in for a little visit at separate times. They looked at the baby but never even got close. Then after a few minutes of finding nothing better to eat on this side of the fence, they wanted out again. It was strange interactions in that there were none. Petunia ignored them, they ignored the baby. Petunia didn’t seem upset or worried if they were closer to the baby than she was, which happened a few times. 

Archer also got to meet the baby. He was very interested and had to learn to give a respectful distance as he has a tendency to want to mother the baby. I have to teach him that job is already filled. So it was a good training time for him too. 

Milking this morning, well my little bit of milking to even her out, went great. No hobbles used. No fuss. I am slow though. I’m going to have to get faster when I’m actually milking. 

[mention]Cedarwinds Farm [/mention] That video was wonderful! I had to laugh at the goat wearing your hat and walking away with it. The information was really helpful!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Awww!!! She is sooo cute!!! 🥰 
It sounds like everything is going great!!
Goats seem to have very subtle body language. I bet Petunia, Jellybean and Jasmine were all talking away, silently.
When May had her first baby a couple of years ago, and she came out to the herd for the first time, after the initial settling of the hierarchy, Willow (who was in milk at that time) went up to her and checked out her udder. To me it looked as if she said “So you got one too now?” 😂 

I am glad your milking went so well, and that Archer is learning to respect the fact that this baby has a mother already!
You are doing great!!


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

No interactions is a good thing! I had a feeling your happy little herd might be integrate well since they've had new goats introduced to them in the past. 

You will get so much faster at milking as you do it more. 👍


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

So cute 😊


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Just look at the little "Lady Cinder" exploring around, crossing over a wooden obstacle and learning to follow Petunia. Did Petunia give the other herd mates that Clint Eastwood "go ahead, make my day" look or something? It's great no one felt the need to rattle herd hierarchy and Archer is such a well behaved young man for understanding about not mothering the newest addition.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

[mention]MadHouse [/mention] Your description of Willow checking May’s udder made me chuckle. And you’re absolutely right. There could have been communication going on that I was oblivious to. 

[mention]MellonFriend [/mention]I hope I get faster and better. This evening I squirted myself twice.  I can’t even blame Petunia. She was standing perfectly still. The cats were more interested in me than usual when I came inside afterward. 




toth boer goats said:


> So cute


 Aw, thank you. 

[mention]NigerianNewbie [/mention]It’s so funny you said that. One of the names I was considering is M’lady Cinder. Petunia’s line follows a royal theme (she’s Princess Petunia) but I can’t decide if I should stick with a more floral or botanical theme to follow Petunia’s name a little more closely. I think this poor thing is never going to have a name.  And I didn’t see Petunia give anyone a look but she could have. She seemed like she was comfortable with them and it was nothing special to have them in the pen. The only one she told to back off was Archer and that was because he startled the baby when it was napping by going over to check on it. All she did was give a grunt and get in between them but he got the message and put his head down like he was sorry and backed up. 


Petunia is a good mom but sometimes she and the baby lose track of each other. The baby seems to have inherited Petunia’s very quiet voice, so sometimes they don’t hear the other one calling for them. I’m hoping they get a bit better at keeping track of each other over the next week or so. 

The baby was super cute today. She ran to me when she saw me one time. That was a first. And she worked hard to get up on the outdoor dog bed (maybe five inches high) and was so proud of herself once she succeed that she hopped around atop it like it was a trampoline. That had me laughing pretty hard. 


I’m sorry to be asking a question in nearly every post, but you all are the only goat people I know. So, here’s another one for those who milk. How quickly does it have to be chilled? Milking is my first step at both feeding times. Do I need to immediately go strain and chill the milk? Or do I finish my feeding chores (20-30 minutes), then take the milk in?

And one more, what’s the average timeframe for it to change from colostrum to milk I can use and consume? I know milk tests can’t be in the first five days because there could be residual colostrum, so I’m assuming about 5 days but not sure.


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

I chill immediately after milking plus or minus 10 min. I strain and put in pint jars and into a freezer for 60 min to rapid chill. I’m a germaphobe though so I also pasteurize. I tried keeping my milk bucket in the freezer in between milking but it warmed to fast to really chill my milk as I was milking


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

FizzyGoats said:


> I’m sorry to be asking a question in nearly every post, but you all are the only goat people I know. So, here’s another one for those who milk. How quickly does it have to be chilled? Milking is my first step at both feeding times. Do I need to immediately go strain and chill the milk? Or do I finish my feeding chores (20-30 minutes), then take the milk in?
> 
> And one more, what’s the average timeframe for it to change from colostrum to milk I can use and consume? I know milk tests can’t be in the first five days because there could be residual colostrum, so I’m assuming about 5 days but not sure.


You go ahead and ask any and all questions you can think of! That is what we are all here for! 🤗

I would chill the milk as quickly as is feasably possible. I am lucky enough to have a refrigerator literally within two steps of my milking stand, so I milk, strain into a jar and put it in the fridge right away. I think milk taste and long lasting good taste are very positivley affected by rapid cooling. 

I'm not 100% sure on colostrum timing, but five days sound right to me. Might be one of those variable things though.


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## Rancho Draco (Sep 29, 2021)

I make sure milking is the last thing I do for chores so that once I'm done with the last goat I can head inside and strain the milk. I strain it into 1/2 gallon jars and put it in the fridge. I try to make sure milk isn't out more than 15-20 minutes or so but if I'm training in a new milker or someone needs medication or I'm plain old busy and set the milk bucket on the counter and forget to strain it for two hours sometimes it sits out longer. 😅


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

I take the milk in right after milking to be strained and put in the fridge. If it sits out longer though, we have never noticed an off taste or smell, nor did we ever get sick from it. We used to rapid chill it in the freezer, but too often we then Would forget it in the freezer.
But, we don’t have so much milm that it sits in the fridge long, so maybe that’s why we don’t ever get an off taste.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Thank you all. I will continue bringing it in right away to strain and refrigerate it. Then I’ll head back out to finish feeding and moving animals to their pens. 

And you all must have arms and hands of steel. My muscles get tired (usually my hands and the shoulder of the arm that reaches across the goat) and I only milk for a few minutes.

The baby is continuing to steadily gain weight. I gave her a pinch of Fir Meadows GI soother because yesterday (at a whole 2 days old) she was already trying to nibble things off the ground after watching mom. Half the things she was trying to eat were not edible. I attempt bottle feeding her after every milking. I pour a little straight from bucket to bottle. She still hates it, screams at me, gets milk every where but down her throat, and then immediately goes and nurses mom when I put her down. She’s such a stinker. But so adorable.


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## Rancho Draco (Sep 29, 2021)

MadHouse said:


> We used to rapid chill it in the freezer, but too often we then Would forget it in the freezer.


I tried chilling in the freezer when I first started milking but I ruined a few jars after forgetting them in there and having them freeze. 



FizzyGoats said:


> And you all must have arms and hands of steel. My muscles get tired (usually my hands and the shoulder of the arm that reaches across the goat) and I only milk for a few minutes.


It's a great exercise for the hands and arms. It is a bit difficult though when you are starting out. I'm always a bit sore after the first couple days of milking for the season.


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

Milking muscles kinda like gardening muscles or riding muscles… will have to break them in at the start of each season 😂


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

You might have to check your body posture you milk in. I found it helped a lot to get a chair that can be adjusted in height. Another thing that can help is to teach your hands to switch sides, so each hand gets to do a slightly different movement
But yes, as the others said, it takes a few days for the muscles to get used to milking.

I was going to say about your question when you can drink the milk - you can taste it, and when you like the taste, you drink it! Colostrum is not bad for you, it just has a flavour some of us don’t enjoy, but others don’t mind.

Yes, they nibble things off the ground, and mom’s teats get dirt on it too all the time. Great idea to start her on herbals!


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## Doe C Doe boers! (6 mo ago)

Cedarwinds Farm said:


> If they aren't comfortable with the herd, or other herd members are being too rough with the kids, I like to let the mamas loose to graze around the yard under supervision. It gives them some fresh food and gets the kids out into the sunshine. I actually covered several things along this topic in a video, if you're interested! It's a bit long, so feel free to skim...or skip entirely.


I didn’t know you had a channel! I just subscribed lol.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Her channel is awesome! I even watch videos on animals I don’t even have because they videos are all so fun and informative. 


So today, I took Petunia and baby out for three brief field trips. About 45 min to an hour each. There was also some herd barn time while the tractor was in use. It was weird because Thistle and Petunia fought practically the whole time. Thistle (at the end of her heat cycle) acted very bucky and Petunia didn’t appreciate it. It was all hormones with those two. But everyone was good with the baby, though baby has to learn not every goat is mama. She’s already getting much better about staying with Petunia when they’re out. Petunia keeps herself and the baby separate from everyone else. 

Today the baby jumped off a log, befriended a beast, nibbled on things, and figured out she matches the tree bark.


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## Doe C Doe boers! (6 mo ago)

She is so stinkin cute 🥰! Glad the introduction went good!


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Awww baby fits in perfectly!💕


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

Thistle.. I love that goat name. Any thoughts on one for the little gal?


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Awwwwww! What a beautiful little girl! 🥰 
Wow, Petunia and baby had quite the day! So many things to learn and discover.
I am glad the re introduction to the herd went so well, other than the two hormonal does fighting.

I love the pictures. Especially the one with the beast! 
It always looks absolutely clean in your barn.
How do you do that, AND take “brief“ hour long field trips with baby goats?


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

JellyBean has grown so much; in the pictures she looks pretty close to possibly growing to a similar size as the other girls considering her age. I was pleasantly surprised to see she was taller than the imagination version in my head. (halfway between the babe and the shortest doeling)

The babe sure is a nice piece of eye candy with her distinct coloration. And what really looks like might be blue eyes. Only saw just a side view of a single eyeball though. Does she have blue eyes and is she polled?

Glad to hear other than hormone issues (to be expected this time of year) the introductions and herd time is going so well.

Archer does look like a beast in comparison.


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## KY Goat Girl (12 mo ago)

Aww! Baby is adorable!  
I’m dying to see Petunia’s udder at a 12 hour fill.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Doe C Doe boers! said:


> She is so stinkin cute ! Glad the introduction went good!





Moers kiko boars said:


> Awww baby fits in perfectly!


I was relieved no one tried to put the baby in its place. I’m sure that’ll come later. Lol. 



BloomfieldM said:


> Thistle.. I love that goat name. Any thoughts on one for the little gal?


 I have about a hundred thoughts on it but nothing has settled yet. 

[mention]MadHouse [/mention] The barn looks clean because as luck would have it, I had just finished cleaning it before everyone ran in to get away from the tractor “chasing” them. I feel like usually, my barn or pen is littered with goat poop in every picture. Almost like they will only give me a photo op if there’s copious amounts of poop in the picture.  And the field trips are the fun part, my break from chores, and I’ve admittedly taken way too many breaks lately. 

[mention]NigerianNewbie [/mention] Jellybean hit a growth spurt, but has stalled and has coccidiosis again. And yesterday was a hard day for my sweet little Beany. It was her first day without a bottle after a gradual decrease. She cried and cried like I forgot her. Broke my heart. I gave her lots of extra love, which she is always happy to take. Still, her cry made me want to cry. 

The baby does have blue eyes. She’s so pretty. She is not polled so disbudding will happen as soon as she has little nubbins. Still can’t feel any yet. 




KY Goat Girl said:


> Aww! Baby is adorable!
> I’m dying to see Petunia’s udder at a 12 hour fill.


Me too.  Though that won’t happen for a few weeks yet.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

My mom always enjoys being show pictures from you farm, so I've been sharing all the photos and your current goings on with her. I told her that you were still considering a name for the baby and that you were thinking something floral and royal. Well this morning my mom told me that while she was milking, an idea randomly flew into her head, how about Queen Anne's Lace? You could call her any of the individual words or add "y" to them. So she could be Queen, Queenie, Lace, Lacey, and so on and so forth. Just an idea! 😉


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Adorable 😊


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

@MellonFriend , I love that your mom is part of the TGS family through you!

@FizzyGoats I am so glad you are taking all these breaks with mom and little one. This is the time to hang out with baby! She’s never going to be this little again. 💜


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## Rysktal (Jan 11, 2020)

Loving this thread, your new baby is the cutest ND kid I've seen this year! (And I have had a bunch of my own hahaha)


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

[mention]Rysktal [/mention] Lol. Thank you. 

[mention]MellonFriend [/mention] That’s an awesome suggestion. Please thank her for me. I’m giving that one some serious consideration.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

FizzyGoats said:


> [mention]MellonFriend [/mention] That’s an awesome suggestion. Please thank her for me. I’m giving that one some serious consideration.


I told her what you said, and she was very tickled! 😊


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

FizzyGoats said:


> Her channel is awesome! I even watch videos on animals I don’t even have because they videos are all so fun and informative.
> 
> 
> So today, I took Petunia and baby out for three brief field trips. About 45 min to an hour each. There was also some herd barn time while the tractor was in use. It was weird because Thistle and Petunia fought practically the whole time. Thistle (at the end of her heat cycle) acted very bucky and Petunia didn’t appreciate it. It was all hormones with those two. But everyone was good with the baby, though baby has to learn not every goat is mama. She’s already getting much better about staying with Petunia when they’re out. Petunia keeps herself and the baby separate from everyone else.
> ...


That barn though . . . 🤤


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Aw, thanks! It’s really not at all fancy. 


Ok y’all, I’m trying not to let my worry wart grow to a worry mountain. The baby gets overheated easily. She’s a baby, so I get it. She pants, mouth open and I get worried. Petunia doesn’t always pay attention to where she is, gets distracted, and moves a bit too much and too fast for the little gal (at least in my opinion). Now I’m restricting their time out a bit more to just a few hours in the morning and in the evening, much to Petunia’s dismay. The thing is, it hasn’t been that hot. But we’re about to start a record breaking heatwave next week. Will she be better at regulating her body temp soon? 

She’s doing really well though. She’s five days old and has gone from a birth weight of 3.08 lbs to this morning’s weight of 5.07 lbs. She’s very active and I laugh so hard when she does the sideways run and jump. Today she tried very hard to play with Jellybean, who usually wants nothing to do with her, but Jellybean actually put her head down and gave a gentle play tap back to the baby. It was pretty adorable.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

When Caramel’s kids were born it was hot here too, (likely not as hot as where you are), but I was worried too. I had a fan running outside, directed at the kids’ “snuggle box” that was in the shade.
I let mom out to graze, and I supervised the kids, sometimes they stayed there, or they would go with mom.









Great to hear baby is so active and playing with Jellybean already!
So nice that Jellybean is gentle with her!
Baby goats are amazing, aren‘t they!?!? And funny!


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

FizzyGoats said:


> Aw, thanks! It’s really not at all fancy.
> 
> 
> Ok y’all, I’m trying not to let my worry wart grow to a worry mountain. The baby gets overheated easily. She’s a baby, so I get it. She pants, mouth open and I get worried. Petunia doesn’t always pay attention to where she is, gets distracted, and moves a bit too much and too fast for the little gal (at least in my opinion). Now I’m restricting their time out a bit more to just a few hours in the morning and in the evening, much to Petunia’s dismay. The thing is, it hasn’t been that hot. But we’re about to start a record breaking heatwave next week. Will she be better at regulating her body temp soon?
> ...


I feel that worry wart turning into a worry mountain. It’s hard and honestly I worried about my babies so much when they were little and fragile it was difficult to enjoy them. It got much easier for me the bigger and healthier they became. I’m sure it will get easier for you too, just hang in there and keep loving those goats.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Thank you both. It’s really not that hot here, yet. Next week will be a different story and we’ve had a good breeze and I have a lot of shade. Though I can see why she’s overheating. She’s all over the place. She’s like a little wind up toy that just goes like crazy until she’s tired and drops. 

I’m out here on a nice cool morning, enjoying my coffee and watching the goats. She bounces and runs all over. She covers way more distance than the does with her tiny legs and runs circles around them. She just did about a half dozen laps around the base of the tree in the picture with her and Petunia. Then had a nice rest for about ten seconds. 

I tried to get a picture of Jellybean playing with her but it’s too far away to be a good one and their sessions are brief. So if I’m not ready with the camera, this is the kind of pic I get. Lol. 

I have to keep the turkeys up while the baby is out anyway because they are mean to her and stress her and Petunia. So letting Petunia and baby out all morning and after evening milking/feeding will work out for both temp regulation and giving the turkeys about half the day to be out and about.


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

Aww, she's just darling! I've fallen behind on your thread, so had to read through and try to catch up on the latest details.
My babies will sometimes start to overheat, too. But they do gain better heat regulation abilities in a few weeks. I like to kid in April and May for that reason, as the temps aren't typically too hot or too cold. But I know this was an unplanned kidding, so you're just doing the best you can. She looks great! It sounds like you're getting the hang of milking! I'm glad you and @Doe C Doe boers! are enjoying my videos. They're kinda fun to make.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

That’s amazing that the little one is so active already!
She is so very cute! The picture with Jellybean gives a good idea of they play. So nice!
Petunia looks great too!
I’m glad it is working out with the cooler times of the day, and the different species getting their browsing time.
Hopefully by the time the heat wave comes, baby will be able to regulate her temperature better.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Aww 😊


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Lovely pictures and story. The babe has a personality as distinct as her coloration. I am curiously waiting to see if the physical aspect of development will also be as remarkable. Not wanting to hurry time, it will be a while before her conformation matures.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

[mention]Cedarwinds Farm [/mention]I will keep a close eye on her when the heat wave hits. I do hope to time the other two does to kid in March. 

[mention]MadHouse [/mention] I had no idea how active they were so early. And Petunia seems to be doing well. I’m still trying to figure out how much she needs to eat to keep some weight on because she sure thinned out once that baby was out. 

[mention]NigerianNewbie [/mention]The little lady is quite a character. And I have no idea what color she is. I understand the basics of horse and dog colors, but goat colors confuse me and I have a lot to learn. But I am excited to watch her grow and see how she unfolds and matures.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

FizzyGoats said:


> And I have no idea what color she is.


Maybe CountyLineAcres could help with identifying the coloration.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

@CountyLineAcres ..could answer that!


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

When my goats first kidded, I was shocked at how thin they looked! I think it was largely due to how big they were for the last month of gestation so the comparison was shocking😅
It’ll take her a little bit, but she should bounce back fairly soon 😊


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## CountyLineAcres (Jan 22, 2014)

She’s a bit interesting! Do you happen to have a few bucks narrowed down as potential sires?


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

[mention]CountyLineAcres [/mention] Luckily, I know for certain her sire is Champ. He’s the only one we had at the time. He’s technically gold (looks white) but was gold with abundant white as a kid. Petunia (baby’s dam), has always been black and white and color has not changed. 

Here is the sire.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

The little one jumped on the stump today and was very proud. She hopped back and forth between the two sides of it. She was out grazing with the entire herd yesterday. And she can sometimes convince Jellybean to play. Jellybean has never been one to play much, but she gives in on rare occasions.


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## Rancho Draco (Sep 29, 2021)

Aw what a cutie. I love it when new kids start getting strong enough to jump up. They're so fun to watch.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

I love watching their achievements! 
She is doing a great job growing, and learning to be part of the herd!
😻
She is sooo cute!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

What a cutie pie!


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

I love their sense of accomplishment when they do something new. They gotta show it off for a little bit 😂


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## BarnOwl (Sep 6, 2020)

Congratulations on the new baby!!! She is absolutely beautiful. The last few months have been a whirlwind, and I've only been on the forum sporadically. I was so excited to see that you had a kid on the way. I am trying not to talk myself out of letting my girls have a date this October, and it is encouraging to see how well things went for you. Do you think you will breed your other does soon?


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

Everyone is looking great! Hopefully the heat isn’t too bad


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Yes, I’m loving this stage of her learning something new, being so proud of herself and showing off repeatedly (until I get the camera out, then she stops). It’s like her legs are made of springs. She is so much fun! And so friendly, she’ll walk right up to you and ask for pets and cuddles. 


[mention]BarnOwl [/mention] I was wondering about you and your does the other day. I was planning on breeding them all this month. Obviously Petunia didn’t work out that way. The other does, I told myself I’d do their next heat, but I just let one pass and the other one is currently in heat and I’m not having her bred this cycle. I really am thinking their next one. We’re predicted to have a harsh winter, so I wanted to give myself a few more weeks and kid in March instead of February, not that there’s any guarantee that the weather will be better. I think I’m nervous and stalling, even though I’ve now been through one. I’d never purposely not know my doe’s due date, but as much as I fret, I think having the first one like that actually helped me. I never really knew when to amp up fretting into full blown worrier mode. So if you have yours bred in October as well, maybe we’ll be kidding buddies. 

[mention]BloomfieldM [/mention] The heatwave isn’t too terrible. The heat index is supposed to get in the triple digits today. So far, it’s worked out to let mama and baby be out with everyone the first half the day and then put them in the small pen/barn area for the afternoon and evening.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Ohhh that sounds like a wonderful plan. Ive tried that for a few years, no kidding in February. That month our highs & lows are extreme. We can go from 72° to -29° in a day. I.honestly dred that month for kidding. I have 12 does in with 3 bucks ( seperate.pens) put in August. Then Ill add 7 more does in October. All with the hope of no February kidds. 🤪😂 It will be the first year it works, if it does. Lol I keep trying, and all my bucks think its a great plan too. Just hasnt worked yet!😂🤣🥰


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## BarnOwl (Sep 6, 2020)

FizzyGoats said:


> [mention]BarnOwl [/mention] I was wondering about you and your does the other day. I was planning on breeding them all this month. Obviously Petunia didn’t work out that way. The other does, I told myself I’d do their next heat, but I just let one pass and the other one is currently in heat and I’m not having her bred this cycle. I really am thinking their next one. We’re predicted to have a harsh winter, so I wanted to give myself a few more weeks and kid in March instead of February, not that there’s any guarantee that the weather will be better. I think I’m nervous and stalling, even though I’ve now been through one. I’d never purposely not know my doe’s due date, but as much as I fret, I think having the first one like that actually helped me. I never really knew when to amp up fretting into full blown worrier mode. So if you have yours bred in October as well, maybe we’ll be kidding buddies.


I admire that you can tell when your does are cycling. I am ashamed and embarrassed to say that I can't tell when mine are in heat--even after reading a lot on forums, books, ect. They never seem to act any different. I thought that when the bucks matured that they'd hang out at the fenceline and cry for each other or show interest. But nope. The only thing they cry for is me--when they see me coming at meal times, lol. My original plan was to do a "handbreeding" when the does went into heat, but since I would just be wildly guessing when they were in heat, 🤣 I'm just going to put them together for a couple weeks in October and see what happens. I won't know the exact due dates, but I suppose I should be able to guess within a couple of weeks. I'm aiming for March babies also (if I don't chicken out). If my set-up were better, I would think about winter kiddings when parasite loads were lower.


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## Rancho Draco (Sep 29, 2021)

BarnOwl said:


> I admire that you can tell when your does are cycling. I am ashamed and embarrassed to say that I can't tell when mine are in heat--even after reading a lot on forums, books, ect. They never seem to act any different. I thought that when the bucks matured that they'd hang out at the fenceline and cry for each other or show interest. But nope. The only thing they cry for is me--when they see me coming at meal times, lol. My original plan was to do a "handbreeding" when the does went into heat, but since I would just be wildly guessing when they were in heat, 🤣 I'm just going to put them together for a couple weeks in October and see what happens. I won't know the exact due dates, but I suppose I should be able to guess within a couple of weeks. I'm aiming for March babies also (if I don't chicken out). If my set-up were better, I would think about winter kiddings when parasite loads were lower.


If you have your bucks on site, you can bring your does to the buck for while each day and watch to see if they are in standing heat or not.


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## BarnOwl (Sep 6, 2020)

Rancho Draco said:


> If you have your bucks on site, you can bring your does to the buck for while each day and watch to see if they are in standing heat or not.


That's a good idea. We could definitely do that. One of the main reason I wanted to have our own bucks is because I wasn't sure if I'd know when the does were in heat, and I thought it would be convenient to have them on site.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Moers kiko boars said:


> Ohhh that sounds like a wonderful plan. Ive tried that for a few years, no kidding in February. That month our highs & lows are extreme. We can go from 72° to -29° in a day. I.honestly dred that month for kidding. I have 12 does in with 3 bucks ( seperate.pens) put in August. Then Ill add 7 more does in October. All with the hope of no February kidds.  It will be the first year it works, if it does. Lol I keep trying, and all my bucks think its a great plan too. Just hasnt worked yet!


To be fair, your bucks are probably a big fan of any breeding program.  I hope it works out and one of the does put in there in Aug wasn’t sneaky and waited until September to breed. I guess that’s only if you left them in. It does sound like a good plan. Here’s hoping you have a kidding free February!



BarnOwl said:


> I admire that you can tell when your does are cycling. I am ashamed and embarrassed to say that I can't tell when mine are in heat--even after reading a lot on forums, books, ect. They never seem to act any different. I thought that when the bucks matured that they'd hang out at the fenceline and cry for each other or show interest. But nope. The only thing they cry for is me--when they see me coming at meal times, lol. My original plan was to do a "handbreeding" when the does went into heat, but since I would just be wildly guessing when they were in heat,  I'm just going to put them together for a couple weeks in October and see what happens. I won't know the exact due dates, but I suppose I should be able to guess within a couple of weeks. I'm aiming for March babies also (if I don't chicken out). If my set-up were better, I would think about winter kiddings when parasite loads were lower.


Oh gosh, you don’t need to feel ashamed. Some does are really hard to tell. Petunia gets to where she doesn’t want me petting her, Thistle spend all her time as close to the boys as she can get, driving them nuts, and Jasmine (normally not affectionate) becomes very affectionate to me and then calls a pathetic lonely cry to the boys. So all mine give signals. They also flag with their tails a lot more. If they didn’t do these things, I’d have no clue. Even with signals (sometimes stronger than others), I miss noticing a heat here and there. 

I originally wanted to do winter kiddings too because of parasites. Like you, I just didn’t think my set up would properly house newborns in really harsh conditions. And now, after seeing how long it takes a doe to dry off just one baby, I’d be terrified of missing a birth and the baby getting frostbite. And Petunia was obsessively cleaning that little thing and it still took a while to completely dry.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

@BarnOwl I have a doe that does not show her heats. 
The buck was on the other side of the fence, and this doe had many days of hanging out near him. When the buck was part of the doe herd in the summer, she often wanted his attention, not in any recognizable pattern, so that was all confusing!
The only thing I could go by was a tiny bit of discharge. Then I marked that down and watched for the next heat about 21 days later. Somehow it worked and I was able to hand breed her twice. The first time she tried to not go in with him. It took her a while to become comfortable enough to let things happen. 
So, don’t be embarrassed! Some does like to be mysterious!


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## KY Goat Girl (12 mo ago)

So does the little princess have a name yet?


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

Name! Name! Name! Name! The masses demand a name! 😂


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Lol. We joke she’s the nameless goat. I don’t know why we just can’t settle on one out of the many we like.


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

She’s so dang pretty!!! 😍💕🥰









😅


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

Boer Mama said:


> She’s so dang pretty!!! 😍💕🥰
> 
> View attachment 238040
> 
> 😅


Ooooo good choices


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

FizzyGoats said:


> Lol. We joke she’s the nameless goat. I don’t know why we just can’t settle on one out of the many we like.
> View attachment 238039


It’s a big task. She’s a special goat


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

Arianell: Silver (Welsh) - my suggestion


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Aw, thank you all for the suggestions. Even if they are so good they’re only making this harder.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Shes just mystical!🥰


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Aww 😊


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Before the little one fell asleep in my lap today, I saw her burp up and chew cud. I haven’t seen her eat anything, nibble and mouth - sure, but I didn’t think she was eating anything. I guess I was wrong. I had no idea they started that so early. Does this mean it’s time for me to make a creep feeder? 

She’s 11 days old now and weighs 7.30 lbs. At this rate, she’ll catch my little runt Jellybean soon.
View attachment 238148


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)




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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

So precious.
I was surprised too, with my babies, how early they chewed cud.
If she can get hay right now, I don’t think she needs a creep feeder.
I made one for the triplets, because their mom always ate the best hay from both feeders in the stall real quick. May and Clifford shared theirs nicely.


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

She’s getting so big! She looks so much like my doeling from Sybil (Arabella) they could be sisters. Too cute😁🥰


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

I have feed in a creep feeder once mine are a week old. But I usually have 5 or 6 little ones running around. I notice mine putting their faces in moms feed bowl. So thats when I set it up. 
She is precious!💕


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

FizzyGoats said:


> Does this mean it’s time for me to make a creep feeder?


Did you mean for hay or for grain? I assumed you meant hay.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Aww so adorable 😊


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

Do you have an idea on what kind of creep feeder you want to set up? Jellybean might sneak in and share her food! 😅


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

I am actually worried Jellybean will sneak in and eat, and she may be little, but Jellybean has a big appetite. 

I’m not sure I can make one the baby can get in but Jellybean can’t. 

Is it really bad for them to not be creep fed grain? I can start offering her some in the milk room while I’m milking Petunia, but I know that doesn’t give her a lot of time to eat. 

[mention]MadHouse [/mention] I was thinking for grain. She can reach a few of the hay feeder and nibbles on that sometimes.


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

I’ve not crept fed my kids at all so far. Their mamas usually are happy to let their kids eat (less they have to nurse to provide the calories). I did start letting the kids in ahead of everyone else for awhile, to give them a few minutes to chow down before the mamas came in the pen to eat. Since my mamas are mainly only nice to their own kids 🙄
But I’ve recently just left everyone out until I get all the piles distributed and then let them all in. I was tired of the kids rushing me while trying to out feed out…
I think she’ll probably eat quite a bit during the time you are milking her mama. I’d go with that idea and see how it goes 😊

eta: the kids rushing me are 7 months now, so a lot different situation 😅


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

FizzyGoats said:


> I am actually worried Jellybean will sneak in and eat, and she may be little, but Jellybean has a big appetite.
> 
> I’m not sure I can make one the baby can get in but Jellybean can’t.
> 
> ...


I've never done a creep feeder. My kids get offered grain while their moms are eating and then I take it away. Takes a few weeks, but they catch on.


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

So freaking precious. My dam raised babies just ate when mom ate until I started putting her on the sand then I just fed them on the floor of the milking room. My doeling still eats there on the stand. Start em out young


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

That makes me feel better. Thank you, all. Again. 

I made goat cheese for the first time today! It was chèvre but crumbly (oops) but so delicious and we used it on pita with some chicken, spinach, tomatoes, and olives. I also had a glass of chocolate goat milk with some freshly baked cookies for dessert. 

Now I just need Petunia to give me more milk! It’s so delicious. That baby needs to share a little more.  Or I need to get better at milking. I’m not getting much.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Thanks for sharing the precious moments! I love the pictures of the big does with baby! That is so sweet that Thistle babysat!! 🥰 

All the kids that I had so far were not interested in grain until half-weaning time, but my triplets are just ready now (3 months old). I had put it out in their kid room, and they nibbled a bit and spilled most of it. Now they are eating it on the stand. My single boy Clifford is chunky as it is and won’t need grain.


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

I think peak milk production is at 4 weeks but I’m also sure she’s holding back for baby. I had one set of dam raised babies and I never got much out of her till about 4 weeks in.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

I can’t wait until peak production!

I give the baby a small dish of soaked (then dried) alfalfa pellets and grain. So far, she doesn’t care about it at all. I do see her eating while out and about with the others and she eats hay, one little strand at a time. It’s quite cute. 

It’s official, this morning’s weigh in put her at 9.03 lbs so she’s heavier at 2 weeks of age than Jellybean was when we got her at 11 weeks old. 

Question (again) for you all. When do you stop daily weigh ins? And do you go to every other day afterward? 2 x’s a week? Weekly?


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

After 2 weeks I went to every other day until 4 weeks. After 4 weeks I just did twice a week until we hit 20 lbs which I read was a good weaning weight. 
You could probably stop or cut way back since Petunia is clearly making enough and the little one is growing well. I mainly kept mine for so long because of the bottle babies. Had to use the weight to determine their bottle amounts. Then I wanted to compare with my dam raised babies.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

If she is growing well, then weighing once or twice a week is fine.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

With all my kids, I only weigh a at birth. Then at 1 week. Unless bottle babies. Then once a week. Until 20 lbs. After that weight ,its much easier to see if they are gaining or loseing.😁 Well sometimes it is. Ive had a few that would look thin, and they would weigh the same. Then wait a few days and weigh, they had gained. I guess, mine get chunky, then grow in height so they appear thinner. Then get chucky and slowly get thinner looking as they get taller!🤣 I forget to measure height. 🤷‍♀️


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

I have a few more questions. Also, I just, a few minutes ago, decided to name the baby Lavender. 

1. Is it ok to start taping the dam’s teats at night now? 
Lavender is now 11.46 pounds and 3 weeks old today (birth weight was 3.08 lbs). She’s a chunky monkey and I’m nervous about taking her overnight milk supply. But I want to do milk test in the next few weeks, so I need to get her used to not always being able to nurse. 

2. I watched this tutorial on taping the teats. Does it seem like a pretty good method? Any extra advice or tips you’ll like to share?






3. Do you start with a full 12 hour treat tape? Or should I tape them right before I go to bed and then work up to 12 hours?

4. After teat taping, should I go back to daily weighing to make sure it’s not negatively affecting her? Right now I do every other day and was thinking I’d start doing twice a week. But now with changing things up, I’m not sure if that’s wise.


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

I’m afraid I can’t advise on successful teat taping after my own recent failure. When I was bottle feeding I went to no over night feedings at 3 weeks. I’m a softie but I would probably work her up to it over a few days, maybe that’s just me.
Also you would probably feel more comfortable weighing her more often initially. Give you peace of mind.


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

Lavender is a beautiful name for the beautiful little girl 💕
I also don’t have experience with taping overnight, but I don’t think my goats nurse at night either. Just really early in the morning. So, if you tape before you go to bed, lavender can get a night cap, then if you go out early to milk, she won’t be delayed very long for breakfast.
I’d probably go the route and work up to full 12. Lol


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

FizzyGoats said:


> I have a few more questions. Also, I just, a few minutes ago, decided to name the baby Lavender.
> 
> 1. Is it ok to start taping the dam’s teats at night now?
> Lavender is now 11.46 pounds and 3 weeks old today (birth weight was 3.08 lbs). She’s a chunky monkey and I’m nervous about taking her overnight milk supply. But I want to do milk test in the next few weeks, so I need to get her used to not always being able to nurse.
> ...


1. I think Lavender (I love the name! 😊) is at a good weight! I think it is fine to start sharing her milk.

2. That looks like a very efficient way to cover the teat. I never thought of anti chew spray.
I use less tape than that, and it works, but I use band aids instead of tape over the orifice, because I feel it is easier on their sensitive skin. 

3. I think either way is fine. After Caramel kidded, she did not let the kids nurse first thing in the morning, because she was too excited about getting her milk stand food. So she came to the stand with a rather full udder (which was handy, because I needed milk for Leela), and that was without taping.
I started with a full 12 hour “milk fast” at 3 weeks with all the kids this year, just because that way I could keep the same milking time, and not get yelled at (by Caramel), for changing the routine. Also, the bottle baby had to wait 12 hours overnight, so that was why I chose to do 12 hours right away.

4. I think the weighing is for your own peace of mind, so you decide how often you weigh, until you feel more relaxed about her growth.


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## Rancho Draco (Sep 29, 2021)

I separate overnight starting at two weeks old so I think she is plenty old enough to start ☺


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

1. She should be absolutely old enough to start. 

2. I like to take the tape all the way up to where the teat meets the udder. I find that way the baby can't get the tape completely in her mouth and then there less of a chance she can rip it off. I also don't prefer to use a piece of tape that goes completely around the top, because even with leaving some slack for expansion, I found that I didn't really leave enough, and the doe was a little uncomfortable by morning. I prefer to do one peice around the front and one around the back to allow for two expansion points. 

3. I do a slow work up to allow the baby to learn to be hungry and to do more of a slow stretch on the udder. I do eight hours, the next day ten hours, and then twelve the following day.

4. I personally wouldn't worry about it. Three weeks is definitely old enough, but if you are worried you certainly can check her for the first few days. Is she eating hay now? By three weeks generally babies are and so when she's not getting milk overnight, if she nibbles on hay, at least she has something in her tummy.

I also want to point out that when you milk Petunia in the morning it is absolutely fine to milk her completely out. No need to be tempted to leave some for Lavender. I just recently heard someone say the udder is a river, not a lake, so a doe can never be truly "empty". 😉

I can't wait to see 12 hour fill pics!


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Thank you all so much! I feel like I can make a plan now. 

[mention]MellonFriend [/mention] Thank you for the tip of milking Petunia out completely. I was concerned about that. You must be a mind reader.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

FizzyGoats said:


> Thank you all so much! I feel like I can make a plan now.
> 
> [mention]MellonFriend [/mention] Thank you for the tip of milking Petunia out completely. I was concerned about that. You must be a mind reader.


You're welcome! I know that tip would have been nice to hear when I started milking, so I figured I'd pass that on to you. 😊


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Teat taping did not go well. For all Petunia’s wonderful qualities, patience on the stand is NOT one of them. After wasting a dozen pieces of tape on various attempts where she’d kick or hop and the tape would end up on her hoof or fur, I gave up and separated her and the baby last night. I put Lavender and Jellybean in the stall. She and Petunia could see each other and called for each other for about 45 minutes before settling down and going to sleep. 

This is all teaching me a lot. I need an entirely different set up for milking. I need real hobbles that keep her from kicking and hopping around. I have been attempting to use soft rope dog leashes but the only way I can attach them is wrapping them around the legs of the stand. Depending on how many times I go around the legs, it either gives too much leeway or not enough room to even keep her feet on the stand. I also need a bigger stand. The only comfortable way for me to reach the teats is kneeling on the ground beside it. I couldn’t even milk Petunia out this morning. She went through two helpings of food and wasn’t interested in more and was hopping around at the end. I kept going, moving the bucket as needed and using one hand to continue milking through her shenanigans so she didn’t get away with it. I didn’t stop until we could finish on a good note, but it was a bit exhausting. For her and for me. 

I got just under a pound of milk from her. That’s the most I’ve had in one milking. I should have and could have gotten more if I knew what I was doing. 

I’m grateful Petunia snuck this kid in on me. Otherwise I’d be doing this with all three does at the same time. I feel bad she’s dealing with my learning curve, but it’s better than all of them dealing with it together. And she sort of volunteered to go first.


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## Rysktal (Jan 11, 2020)

Awww, Lavender! Great name!


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## Rancho Draco (Sep 29, 2021)

I think separation is so much easier if you have the room for it. After the first couple days of stress over a change in routine, I think my does are glad to have a break from their kids and be able to actually sleep at night. It's also a good time to offer extra goodies for the kid if you would like to. 

These are the hobbles I use for my goats. I'm not sure if they would be small enough for a Nigerian though. https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0042L8F4...imm_J0N0N05QPEB7WC2QDB7X?_encoding=UTF8&psc=1


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

At least lavender has jellybean to cuddle with 💕
They’ll calm down after a few nights and she’ll also get better on the stand for you. You’ve got this! 😁


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Separation is so much easier. Once I was able to go that route, that's the way I now prefer. You'll get the hang of all this!


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

[mention]Rancho Draco [/mention] thanks. I think I’ll go ahead and order those and hope they fit NDs too. I tried the taping tonight but have a feeling I might be going back to separation. 


[mention]Boer Mama [/mention] I am glad Jellybean is good with her. Sadly, they are pretty close to the same size. And thank you for the vote of confidence. I don’t have it figured out yet, but that’s why I bug all of you so often. 


[mention]MellonFriend [/mention] I agree, separation is easier, which I can say after finally taping Petunia’s teats tonight. I’ll be shocked if the tape is still on in the morning. It was a bit of a messy tape job and there was a lot of hopping around (from her, and I suppose me, trying to keep my tape aimed true with her movements).


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

FizzyGoats said:


> I think I’ll go ahead and order those and hope they fit NDs too.


I have the same hobble. It works for my ND.

Let us know if the teat tape stayed on!


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

Dude I have been there. Not only did I need hobbles but I needed additional tying of the hobbles so she couldn’t kick them off. Even placing them in the correct location she could kick them off. My other goat the dog leash thing is the only thing that will work and I had my husband add eye bolts to the stand to tie it to so I could pull it tight enough. These FF do not want to give it up. Hang in there you WILL find a set up that works I promise.


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## Boer Mama (10 mo ago)

Eye bolts would be a great idea… I might have to try that when I get around to making someone in my herd a milker 🤣


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

Boer Mama said:


> Eye bolts would be a great idea… I might have to try that when I get around to making someone in my herd a milker 🤣


I have learned you can’t have too many options when tying up goats 😂


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## GrumpeeOldMan (6 mo ago)

I also have a pregnant doe and have a little thought she will be due in November, I guess we will see


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

MadHouse said:


> I have the same hobble. It works for my ND.
> 
> Let us know if the teat tape stayed on!


 That’s good to know. Thank you. 
The tape stayed on. I was shocked. 



BloomfieldM said:


> Dude I have been there. Not only did I need hobbles but I needed additional tying of the hobbles so she couldn’t kick them off. Even placing them in the correct location she could kick them off. My other goat the dog leash thing is the only thing that will work and I had my husband add eye bolts to the stand to tie it to so I could pull it tight enough. These FF do not want to give it up. Hang in there you WILL find a set up that works I promise.


 This makes me feel so much better. This morning was another fiasco. I got a lot of milk from her. She stepped in the bucket half way through. I was frustrated and dumped that in another dish and washed the bucket and kept going and still had a lot of milk. Then she stepped in it again. She was the worst she’s been. I got mad. She got anxious. The room looked like a dairy crime scene with milk spattered everywhere. It was a disaster, and I am overly tired and overly emotional, so my patience is not what it should be right now. Thank you for sharing and understanding. I might have to try the eyebolts. 




GrumpeeOldMan said:


> I also have a pregnant doe and have a little thought she will be due in November, I guess we will see


Congratulations! Don’t let my bumbling scare you. It is really wonderful.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

I was glad to hear the teat tape stayed on and there was lots of milk!
So sorry to hear it was another disaster and Petunia stepped into the bucket twice 🙈.
I would have lost it too. I have yelled at a doe before, if it makes you feel any better. Of course it didn’t help matters.

One of the things that helps save the milk is to milk into a cup, and pour it from the cup into the bucket that is located in a safe place, not anywhere near the doe. 
I have had does step into the cup or kick it, and I have an extra cup stored in the milk room for that reason.


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## BloomfieldM (7 mo ago)

Oh the foot in the bucket… it’s like a game. If she gets it in… she wins! Bramble did that to me a bunch until I figured out the tie down regimen. 😂


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