# LGD Tragedy Tonight



## GATA_Goats

I've attached the link to my youtube channel of my transition to farm life, it has video of my naive hopeful narrative and my calmed down reaction. Tonight I had a tragedy which I wasn't ready for. My father-in-law put two brand new (never been with goats, only chickens) LGDs in with my goats and they attacked all of them killing one. My immediate reaction was I fell on the ground screaming and crying. I watched my pregnant doe take her last breath and I couldn't move. These two dogs are only 7 months old and are fine around my chickens, but have never been around goats. I don't know what to do but cry and cry. My father-in-law didn't know, but she is still gone. Can anyone tell me what I am supposed to do? I'm not even sure they need to go to anyone else besides another poultry farmer, or maybe no one will give them a chance if I am honest and tell them what happened.


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## NubianFan

I am so sorry this happened to you. Sorry for the loss of your doe. There is no way you or your father in law could have known, so please don't blame yourselves. I will be honest this is one of my biggest fears of having a predator guard a prey animal, and one reason why I am not sure I will ever be able to have a LGD. I know there are good ones and good situations, but I fear I would not end up with a good one.


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## TDG-Farms

Ug, I hate these kinda posts. Puts a knot in my stomach every time. Ill for go any harsh comments and just say, those dogs can never be put in with livestock again unless someone has some kinda special training technique. Once dogs get a feel for the chase and the taste of blood, they can never be trusted again. A total shame on all levels. Am truly sorry for your loss.


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## ksalvagno

I'm very sorry for your loss.

Since they are only used to chickens, that should be the only thing they guard.


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## GATA_Goats

Thank you all, i've been making videos for my friends who want to start the transition like I did. I want them to see my mistakes and successes so they can learn without as many mistakes. I never imagined I'd make a video where I cried. I want these dogs to have a chance, does anyone know a farm which needs two LGDs for poultry? They are great with chickens, I witnessed that today with my chickens and on the farm that they came from. They don't chase chickens or anything, it was just unfortunate with my goats.


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## ksalvagno

Unfortunately new people tend to not understand that it is critical to know what they are used to guarding. It doesn't matter what type of guard animal. Llamas and donkeys will attack what they aren't used to too.

Any future dogs, make sure they were raised with goats.


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## GATA_Goats

I will, this was an expensive lesson but I will make sure to take more precautions next time.


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## lottsagoats

New dogs should never just be dumped in with a new herd like that, especially young ones or this is the reuslt. You start slowly introducing them to the goats, and you never leave them alone for a long time until you are 100% sure they have accepted/ bonded with the goats as their pack. 

Yes, it's instinct for LGD to guard, but they have to know what they are supposed to guard! Before getting any animal, the new owner should do research into the new species or breed of animal and how to train. LGD have to bond with the animal they are supposed to protect. Bonding takes time, it doesn't just suddenly happen. Puppies are puppies and will try to play. If the animal they are playing with runs, they will attack, it's instinct, that's where the bonding and training come into play. LGD may have the basic instinct to protect but they also need training to sharpen that instinct.

Even adult, experienced LGD may need to learn the new "pack" before being completely trusted with them. I was lucky, my young adult female Pyr was born and raised to 8 weeks in a herd of goats. Even tho she hadn't been with them for several months, she still knew they were hers. She taught her baby sister to accept the goats, and the younger sister and the English Setter taught the older Pyr to accept the chickens, so mine are all round farm dogs. I didn't trust any of them or let them with the animals alone until I was 100% sure they were bonded.


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## GATA_Goats

lottsagoats said:


> New dogs should never just be dumped in with a new herd like that, especially young ones or this is the reuslt. You start slowly introducing them to the goats, and you never leave them alone for a long time until you are 100% sure they have accepted/ bonded with the goats as their pack.
> 
> Yes, it's instinct for LGD to guard, but they have to know what they are supposed to guard! Before getting any animal, the new owner should do research into the new species or breed of animal and how to train. LGD have to bond with the animal they are supposed to protect. Bonding takes time, it doesn't just suddenly happen. Puppies are puppies and will try to play. If the animal they are playing with runs, they will attack, it's instinct, that's where the bonding and training come into play. LGD may have the basic instinct to protect but they also need training to sharpen that instinct.
> 
> Even adult, experienced LGD may need to learn the new "pack" before being completely trusted with them. I was lucky, my young adult female Pyr was born and raised to 8 weeks in a herd of goats. Even tho she hadn't been with them for several months, she still knew they were hers. She taught her baby sister to accept the goats, and the younger sister and the English Setter taught the older Pyr to accept the chickens, so mine are all round farm dogs. I didn't trust any of them or let them with the animals alone until I was 100% sure they were bonded.


I did do my research, I had planned to start working with them tomorrow. I had just arrived from picking them up today. I had left to go to the commissary and had them in separate fenced off areas. I wasn't gone for more than an hour and my father-in-law put the dogs in there while I was gone. You are really not helping, I am upset enough. I have been crying for hours.


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## Goats Rock

There really is nothing anyone can say or do to make you feel better, but, for what it's worth, I am so sorry that this happened.


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## Darlaj

Hugs

I'm sure no one here is trying to upset u any farther... We all know the feeling of a loss of our animal and a certain amount of guilt the we could not save them. 
Information is truley the only way we can help each other on this forum, so we lay it all out there .... Not always does it " sound " the way it was intended to. I have gotten frustrated with responses but step back and re read maybe there was not enough info given. 
I am so sorry for your loss and it's wonderful that u are documenting your process for others to learn  keep up the good work!


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## HerdQueen

Sorry you had this experience. Thank you for being brave enough to post you YouTube clip. ALL of us have plain and simple had something chitty happen in our herds. It all gets chalked up to a learning experience, but by sharing our experiences we hope to spare someone else that hurt. I do not have LGDs but I wouldn't trust these pups with your herd again, but I wouldn't trust any animals with my herd. If you had gotten a donkey the same thing could have happened. I'm sorry for you loss.


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## GATA_Goats

Thank you everyone, after re-reading I understand no one meant that the way I took it at the time. I am sorry for becoming so defensive. I learn so much from everyone here. That night I was blaming myself so badly I wouldn't even allow myself to sleep. I have moved my goats to a near by farm until I can find a new home for these dogs and plan on starting fresh with a puppy.


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## springkids

I am so sorry to hear about what has happened. I've never encountered anything like this before so I can't give much advice. The only thing I can say is I have a Great Pyr and we love her. So don't give up on the idea of a LGD. They are amazing protectors and family pets. I introduced my dog to my goats when she was 4 months old and after a couple of days of visiting the goats she went to live in their pen full time. It does take time for everyone to adjust. The goats didn't like her at all and she was afraid of them. I have heard people say they introduced an older dog without any bad affects but I don't have any experience with that. Again I am truly sorry for your loss.


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## dobe627

I'm sorry you had to go thru this. I too got my Pyrenees as a young pup. But she was born to lgd and raised with goats. I would look for a Pyrenees rescue. Allow them to find the correct homes for them taking the stress of of you.


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## OGYC_Laura

I have mammoth donkeys as guard animals. They lived with my does for one year before I purchased a buck. They all got along fine. The babies were born and all was good. The babies got to be about three months old and I found three dead. after a necropsy on one they found hoof shaped bruises on the internal organs. I had the male fixed and removed them. The vet said to never trust them with babies again!!! I thinks it hurts more when a protector does the damage. Like a break in trust. 
I am sorry for your loss!!!


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## goatgirlzCA

I am so sorry for your loss. My other input would be that two dogs are more likely to get into trouble together than starting with one. We have a 3 year old Akbash/Pyr we got at 4 months old. She used to play and chew on one of the wethers, but not to hurt him - she was a puppy. She is now 3 and never messes with them except pertaining to her food. We got a male last summer who will be 1 in May. He is pretty good with them, but does chase them a little when they go where he doesn't want them to. I had to put him in with the big does because they don't run like the littler ones. They are different personalities, so that's an issue too when getting even 1. But I wouldn't trade them for anything because nothing is going to get in the pens!

Its definitely a learning process and everyone makes mistakes. Big hugs to you ...


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## toth boer goats

How devastating. 

LGD's: if they are under 2 years old, they can still have puppy like actions of wanting to chase and play. And need supervising at all times. 
It is sad, they didn't get proper training and supervision when introduced to the goats. I am very sorry. 
Once they draw blood, it is done for them being around goats.
Find them a home without livestock of any kind, as they may do harm to other animals as well.
It is a tough situation for sure. Hard lessons learned.


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## COgoatLover25

I'm soooo sorry that happened to you :'( :hugs:


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## Trickyroo

Im really sorry honey , I wish you didn't have to go through this 
It's a hard lesson indeed , for everyone involved. 
I do feel the same about the pups , I wouldn't ever trust them with livestock.
Again , I'm so very sorry :hug:


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## GATA_Goats

Thank you to everyone. I made contact with the human society and they will be taking the dogs and helping me find them a home. I wish I had the chance to work with them and could put them to work doing what they are supposed to be doing. But what is done is done. It turns out my father-in-law cannot be trusted either. My husband told him not to let ANY animal around the big dogs and to let the little dogs go out into the front yard. Yesterday morning I was out feeding the chickens and turned around because I heard my chihuahua Cindy being attcked. I dropped my basket and ran screaming to her. MyF-I-L let the little dogs out into the back yard. Luckily I got there in time but it was a close call. I just can't trust him. I've moved my goats to another farm and take the little dogs to work with me now, but until we move that is all that I can do.


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## Trickyroo

Oh geez ! That's a rough spot to be in to say the least 
Maybe move your FIL to another place till you can move .
Sorry , but ….


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## toth boer goats

Sounds like your father-in law doesn't care and is wanting the animals killed off, so he doesn't have to have them around. I could be wrong but, that is what it seems.
You are doing the right thing by getting your own place eventually and keeping them away from him. You don't need someone like that around your babies.


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## margaret

So sorry for your loss. We got our LGD as a puppy as soon as he was weaned then when he got used to his surroundings we introduced him to the goats on the leash and let him loose under supervision, and gradually got him used to being with the goats. Sometimes he would play with the goats and chase this them a bit but other than that he did fine and now we trust him with our goats as he is 2 years old.


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## GATA_Goats

Great news today! The two dogs were taken in by the humane society and we found a Great Pyrenees rescue that has a 9 week old puppy. The puppy was born to a Great Pyrenees who was surrendered and has been living on their property with goats! So hopeful about the puppy.


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## GATA_Goats

toth boer goats said:


> Sounds like your father-in law doesn't care and is wanting the animals killed off, so he doesn't have to have them around. I could be wrong but, that is what it seems.
> You are doing the right thing by getting your own place eventually and keeping them away from him. You don't need someone like that around your babies.


That was kind of my suspicion which I didn't want to say out loud.


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## Violetmoon

I would tear that fil a new one!


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## toth boer goats

Glad they were taken.

I am so sorry you have to put up with all this.


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## margaret

Hopefully the puppy will turn out well. Good luck


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## Talron

Do you know if they killed from rough play or if it was a hunt?
I'd personally look for pet homes for them myself. I couldn't have a animal that killed one of my other animals around.

edit: oops I'm late, glad it worked out.


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## ttaylor7

LGDs are like babysitters for your children. You don't pick one up from somewhere and go off and leave it on its own with your babies. I am so sorry that your inexperience and your relative's well-intentioned but ill-informed actions resulted in this nightmare.

Why the dogs were aggressive with the goats could be due to their temperament (were they truly a livestock guardian breed or were they unpapered mostly lgd with a touch of something else -- herding dog? we see a lot of those advertised as being lgds here in Texas and other states), the situation in which they simply got excited and the play escalated (were the does used to dogs being penned with them? did they begin to panic and that set off vicious play/chase/bite instincts - still not good in lgds).

I am so sorry -- I am sure you have the dogs confined -- ask your father-in-law to return them from wherever they came from. Probably that is not possible -- responsible seller/breeders would take them back but many folks don't buy from those serious breeders. Whatever you do, be honest about what the dogs did. But get rid of them. We have purchased goats from herds that had suffered dog attacks like this one (not the guardian dogs, however). Those does took a long time to adjust to our livestock protection dogs.

So sorry. I trust you understand that these dogs are not examples of livestock guard dogs.

Tamara Taylor
Patteran Akbash Dogs and Turkmen Kangal Dogs since 1985
Patteran Dairy Goats (Alpines and Saanens) since 1976
www.patterandairygoats.com


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## Trickyroo

I glad the dogs were taken and that you found a new dog.
BUT , why were they surrendered ? Was the new pup introduced to the goats and played rough ? I would want to know even though its still young. 
Just my :2cents:


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## GATA_Goats

Trickyroo said:


> I glad the dogs were taken and that you found a new dog.
> 
> BUT , why were they surrendered ? Was the new pup introduced to the goats and played rough ? I would want to know even though its still young.
> 
> Just my :2cents:


The mother of the new dog was surrendered because she was pregnant and the owners thought she was fixed. I haven't picked up the new pup yet. When I surrendered the two that killed my doe I made sure it was made clear what happened. I hoped to work with the original two and they would have been good dogs if my FIL had not put them in the pen with the goats. I understand that LGDs are not "ready made" products but he did not. I know how to work with animals and train dogs. I trained previous dogs in agility, I just did not have the opportunity because of what he did. It was unfair to Belles and her unborn kids as well to the two dogs. I having been praying for The Lord to help me find forgiveness and wisdom in this whole situation. The two dogs were working on a poultry farm and I witnessed it, they learned fast on their first day and never had the chance for a second day.


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## Trickyroo

Sounds good  I wish you all the best with your new pup and your goats :hug: 
I hope you stick around and let us know how the pup is doing with your goats  If you have any extra pictures of your goats and of the pup when you bring him home…….we can certainly put aside some time to view them.  Didn't want to sound pushy , lol.


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## GATA_Goats

Trickyroo said:


> Sounds good  I wish you all the best with your new pup and your goats :hug:
> 
> I hope you stick around and let us know how the pup is doing with your goats  If you have any extra pictures of your goats and of the pup when you bring him home&#8230;&#8230;.we can certainly put aside some time to view them.  Didn't want to sound pushy , lol.


No! Not at all, I appreciate your help! I'm no expert so I would love your input!


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## Trickyroo

Nothing expert about it , we are all picture addicts :lol: :grin:


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## GATA_Goats

ttaylor7 said:


> LGDs are like babysitters for your children. You don't pick one up from somewhere and go off and leave it on its own with your babies. I am so sorry that your inexperience and your relative's well-intentioned but ill-informed actions resulted in this nightmare.
> 
> Why the dogs were aggressive with the goats could be due to their temperament (were they truly a livestock guardian breed or were they unpapered mostly lgd with a touch of something else -- herding dog? we see a lot of those advertised as being lgds here in Texas and other states), the situation in which they simply got excited and the play escalated (were the does used to dogs being penned with them? did they begin to panic and that set off vicious play/chase/bite instincts - still not good in lgds).
> 
> I am so sorry -- I am sure you have the dogs confined -- ask your father-in-law to return them from wherever they came from. Probably that is not possible -- responsible seller/breeders would take them back but many folks don't buy from those serious breeders. Whatever you do, be honest about what the dogs did. But get rid of them. We have purchased goats from herds that had suffered dog attacks like this one (not the guardian dogs, however). Those does took a long time to adjust to our livestock protection dogs.
> 
> So sorry. I trust you understand that these dogs are not examples of livestock guard dogs.
> 
> Tamara Taylor
> 
> Patteran Akbash Dogs and Turkmen Kangal Dogs since 1985
> 
> Patteran Dairy Goats (Alpines and Saanens) since 1976
> 
> www.patterandairygoats.com


The reason the dogs were aggressive was because I had not had the chance to work with them yet. When I left to go get groceries I them all separated. While I was gone my Father in Law decided to put the dogs in with the goat. Your condescending tone is offensive but O have to consider the source when you can't take the time to get a grip on what actually happened. My FIL did not go get the dogs so he cannot bring them back. I at no time left the dogs unattended with any animals, I personally witnessed the dogs working at the farm they came from. If I'm guilty of anything, it's of being low on eggs and leaving to go to the store. I'm sorry you feel the need to act superior to people who are going through heart ache.


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## Darlaj

I think u have done everything right ! Everyone starts with little experience .... How ever not everyone has a meddling FIL who jumps in and screws everything up! 
Something's are just out of our controll!good luck with new pup I know you will do a wonderful job with the training


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## toth boer goats

Remember, keep it friendly, keep it fun. 

GATA goats, is trying to warn others of this mistake that took place and needs a big hug and our support, there is no need to put the blame where it does not belong.

Always read and reread posts to verify what is being said, before responding, as it may hurt another, if the response is pointing fingers the wrong way.

This experience has been a horrible ordeal and isn't GATA goats fault, she lost a beloved goat and unborn kids, which never can be replaced. 
Never imagined her FIL would put the pups in with the goats, while making a quick run to the store and back, no fault of her own.
Have a heart and be kind to someone who is devasted because of someone Else's bad actions.


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## Trickyroo

Thank you Pam ! No , she doesn't need any negative comments.
She is devastated and completely torn up over it !
She came here for understanding and a shoulder to lean on. And to share her experience with us in hopes to save someone else from the same horrible tragedy.


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## ciwheeles

I'm so sorry you lost your goats.  :hug:

It sounds like you did your research and did everything right. It's not your fault that your FIL put the dogs in with the goats. No one can control what someone else decides to do, and it sounds like your father in law just isn't buying into keeping your animals safe. That's not your fault at all. 

I hope you're successful in training your new dog. It sounds like you've done all the research and have a good idea of what to do.


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## crownofjules

Oh my goodness! I am so very sorry :tear: My heart is torn for your terrible, tragic loss.


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## GoatieGranny

Oh my dear! My heart aches for you and all the pain you've been through. I am praying that you will find peace and comfort after you've had time to grieve your terrible loss. 

Could your FIL be experiencing memory problems or impaired judgement issues? It may not of been an intentional act of cruelness. Just throwing that out there for you to consider as you search your heart for strength to forgive him. 

Big goatie (((HUGS))) to you, sweetheart. Hang in there!


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## toth boer goats

Trickyroo said:


> Thank you Pam ! No , she doesn't need any negative comments.
> She is devastated and completely torn up over it !
> She came here for understanding and a shoulder to lean on. And to share her experience with us in hopes to save someone else from the same horrible tragedy.


Your welcome.


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## GATA_Goats

LGD journey update!




Thank you for everyone's warm wishes and words of encouragement. You have helped me gain understanding this week. I'll post my next video when I pick up the puppy and my new Saanen! We have decided to add them to the herd of dwarfs to get more milk production.


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## Trickyroo

:hi5: You go girl :snowbounce:


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## GATA_Goats




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## toth boer goats

Sounds Awesome.


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## GATA_Goats

Hey again, my two goats are back at the house but they are terrified of their pen. They have been escaping and screaming if I put them in it and then leave. This is where they slept last night after escaping. I'm worried about two nights from now though, we will have snow and freezing rain in Georgia. They can't sleep there if it's snowing. BTW, the goats are fine if the gate to their pen is open and they are fine if I'm back there with them. Any ideas on how to let them know their pen is their safe spot again?


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## ksalvagno

It is just going to be slow. Spend a lot of time in there with them.


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## GATA_Goats

Does anyone think it would be a really bad idea to lock them in their shelter tonight? My husband wants to but I'm afraid they will go bizzerk and possible hurt themselves. We are a matter of hours from freezing rain and the snow will be here by 6 am tomorrow. I've put straw and munching hay under the house and under the patio table hoping they might go to either one of those places. But still, I'm afraid.


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## MsScamp

How about leading them to the shelter and seeing how they react? I am under the impression that the attack took place in the pasture, rather than the shelter? Is that correct? If that is the case, they may not associate the shelter with the attack and they could be ok with it. All you can do is try. I do, however, agree with you about shutting them in if they show signs of freaking out. That would not be a good situation. I am sorry for what has happened and hope things work out for you and your goats.


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## GATA_Goats

They have an enclosed pen area with the shelter being inside that area. Their shelter is built with a swinging door that latches but leaves an entrance way just big enough for them to come and go. Since I've had them back at the house they panic when I put them back there and escape from the pen no matter what we do. My husband wants to screw in a piece of plywood over the opening to keep them completely in the shelter.


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## GreenMountainNigerians

I have no experience or good advice for you but I do want to say my heart goes out to you and your goats for suffering this tragedy. And thank you for sharing. Some of us without LGD knowledge can learn something from it. Hugs and prayers for you and your sweet goaties.


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## teejae

My heart breaks for your loss 
When we first bought a Maremma there was little info about these types of breeds in Aust. as our dog importation laws/Quarintine(we dont have rabies in this country) are very strict so LGD's were very rare and expensive $$ anyway by chance a bloke that my husband knew from work had purchased a pair of Maremmas for breeding and we ended up with a male pup.This dog was put in with does and kids and bonded quite well and was also very protective of me and had proven this by guarding me from a dingo x feral dog attack and would do the rounds of our 550 acre property at night.He was worth his weight in gold! He sadley died of old age and we have had 3 more dogs since and our latest Lulu is just fantastic with the herd now and will also guard the chooks(Aussie speak for chickens...lol)and us.So yes your pup will bond with your goats and introduce it always under supavision,teejae


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## milkmaid

I am SO sorry for your loss.  :Hug:

I have seen a lot of people say (and not just in this thread):


> If a dog once gets a taste for blood, it can never be trusted around livestock again.


That statement is thrown around all the time, but IME that is a total myth. It is true there are some dogs of some breeds that can never be trusted around livestock. But I have a little experience with dogs. Dogs are capable of overcoming a habit, with patient training. ATM we have a husky/lab that used to kill every chicken he could get his teeth on, and now can be fully trusted to run free with them even if we're not there. He used to chase the goats, biting their necks, and never does anymore (though I still judge my goats too valuable to leave with him unattended). *It took a lot of time and work, but it can be done.* The main thing is getting the dog "conditioned" to being around livestock without chasing. I believe there are other chicken owners with similar experiences. There are other breeds that I know would be easier to work with than half husky - such as purpose bred LGDs, probably.
Every dog is different, and we all have to make the decision we think is best - whether to try to work with the dog in the hope it can come around, or to give it up to another home where there aren't any temptations. I wouldn't attempt training a super-high-prey-drive dog to control itself around livestock; that wouldn't be fair.
Here's hoping that your new puppies work out!


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## GATA_Goats

I agree with you milkmaid, the dogs aren't a loss cause. I would've tried to continue to work them if my goats weren't terrified of them. I think because the dogs are physically bigger than the goats makes it more it intimidating to them. It would be easier to start fresh with something that poses no threat to them. I've been thinking about those poor dogs a lot and I know they will find a good home because they are very good dogs.


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## MsScamp

GATA_Goats said:


> My husband wants to screw in a piece of plywood over the opening to keep them completely in the shelter.


I would not do that under any circumstances. I would bring them in the house before I shut them up in a shelter they are terrified of. Would it be possible to put up a pen in the basement or garage? What about other outbuildings that are neutral to them?


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## GATA_Goats

They are under the table now. We do not have a garage or basement. I tried to put them under the house but they went back under the table. I am getting them out here this weekend because this is just not safe. They need proper shelter and the one that is built, they are terrified of.


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## Goatman43

We are very sorry for the loss of your Doe and the unfortunate situation you are in regarding the re-homing of your dogs. On our farm we have alpacas, chickens, miniature donkeys and Boer goats. We also have a very large dog (American Mastiff weighing 186 pounds) We had the dog first and have kept her away from the animals simply because she thinks all animals are toys and she wants to play...however she has no idea how large she is. Our yard is fenced as are all of our pastures where we keep the other animals. If our dog ever got out of the yard and into the pasture, it would be disastrous for the animals. Our dog is a house/yard pet and just by the virtue of her size, protector of our home. She is the sweetest dog I've ever owned but I would not trust her in the pasture.


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## LibertyHomesteadFarm

lottsagoats said:


> New dogs should never just be dumped in with a new herd like that, especially young ones or this is the reuslt. You start slowly introducing them to the goats, and you never leave them alone for a long time until you are 100% sure they have accepted/ bonded with the goats as their pack.
> 
> Yes, it's instinct for LGD to guard, but they have to know what they are supposed to guard! Before getting any animal, the new owner should do research into the new species or breed of animal and how to train. LGD have to bond with the animal they are supposed to protect. Bonding takes time, it doesn't just suddenly happen. Puppies are puppies and will try to play. If the animal they are playing with runs, they will attack, it's instinct, that's where the bonding and training come into play. LGD may have the basic instinct to protect but they also need training to sharpen that instinct.
> 
> Even adult, experienced LGD may need to learn the new "pack" before being completely trusted with them. I was lucky, my young adult female Pyr was born and raised to 8 weeks in a herd of goats. Even tho she hadn't been with them for several months, she still knew they were hers. She taught her baby sister to accept the goats, and the younger sister and the English Setter taught the older Pyr to accept the chickens, so mine are all round farm dogs. I didn't trust any of them or let them with the animals alone until I was 100% sure they were bonded.


Yep.


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## Lily's Mom

I keep my LGD's (Pyranese) seperate from my goats. They patrol the farm but I keep them out of the pasture.
Don't be afraid to sell them as guard dogs and get a pair you can integrate slowly or keep seperate. My pair gets the job done without having to be in with the goats. Also, maybe try a different breed and get them from someone that raises LGD. If you can forgive them spend time training them. If not that would be understandable too. So sorry for your loss.


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## GATA_Goats

Lily's Mom said:


> I keep my LGD's (Pyranese) seperate from my goats. They patrol the farm but I keep them out of the pasture.
> 
> Don't be afraid to sell them as guard dogs and get a pair you can integrate slowly or keep seperate. My pair gets the job done without having to be in with the goats. Also, maybe try a different breed and get them from someone that raises LGD. If you can forgive them spend time training them. If not that would be understandable too. So sorry for your loss.


I have already given them to the Humane Society with full disclosure. I actually never intended for the to be in the goat pen , my Father in Law did that while I was at the store. I have since got a new dog, a 10 week old puppy, who I named Freedom. So far I have been able to work simple commands and he takes supervised visits with the goats and chickens. I feel so bad for the other two dogs because I never got the opportunity to work with them. They would have been great working dogs.







This is a pic of my husband and Freedom on day one, my husband thinks everything is a baby! He will even pick up the goats like that!







This is a pic if the surviving two goats getting used to the much colder temperatures in Tennessee!

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## cteague

Is it better to put a pup in with ur goats and let them bond. Or an older dog introduced a little at a time that has already been trained?

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## GATA_Goats

cteague said:


> Is it better to put a pup in with ur goats and let them bond. Or an older dog introduced a little at a time that has already been trained?
> 
> Sent from my SCH-S738C using Goat Forum mobile app


From everything I read, you don't want to throw them in there without an introduction period. Puppies still like to play, they may bound at a kid playfully and the kid will most likely run. This can lead to chasing which you don't want. The pups need to bond but respect the goats. Freedom (my new pup) was head butted twice while I was there, He got butt hurt about it but now he knows. I also want to be there to protect him. He is still just a little guy who wants to play. And if you saw my video, my Father in Law put two trained LGD in with unfamiliar animals and I lost my pregnant doe. LGD's are like children, all of them are different.

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## MoKa-Farms

I am SO sorry for your loss. :tear::grouphug::hug:


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## cteague

K thank u. Sorry for the loss of ur babies.:-(

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## GATA_Goats

[QU OTE=MoKa-Farms;1623713]I am SO sorry for your loss. :tear::grouphug::hug:[/QUOTE]

I just watched my video and made myself cry again, so embarrassing. But I will leave it up and hopefully someone will see it and think twice about the process to get and train an LGD.

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## GATA_Goats

Update! Meet Freedom, my new LGD! He is working out great. We run the perimeter 2-3 times a day together and he is now running it on his own. Night and day difference from the first go around!

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## nchen7

how great!!! glad you found one that worked out for you. 

I think it's time to start a new thread following the SUCCESS of your new LGD!


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## lottsagoats

Does your FIL suffer from early dementia? Like maybe he just doesn't understand? I would be very worried about him with my animals, he sounds very unstable. Touchy situation him being your father in law and all.

Glad you got the dogs a good home. Have fun with the new pup! I LOVE the Pyrs, they are great dogs.


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## happybleats

very Sorry for your loss..how heart breaking that must have been!...Sounds like your new pup will work out fine..


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