# Goat Showing Signs Too Early?



## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

I have two does due here soon. Ila is due next week and Lexi isn't due for about 2 weeks. We bred by just letting the buck out so there is no "for sure," although I tracked heat cycles.
I know Ila's normal signs from her last kidding but am not familiar with Lexi's (she has only kidded once and that was before I took responsibility of the goats).
Anyway, Lexi has been showing signs that labor is imminate. A couple weeks ago her attitude changed so that she barely lets me near her (checking FAMACHA scoring is fun with her, haha). She has isolated herself from the other two goats, this past week or so. Her vulva got pink and puffy about 2 weeks ago or more; it now jiggles when she walks. Her kids, I feel like, have dropped but they seem to be going up and down.
Here's what gets me: her ligaments. They have been very loose for about 2 weeks now! Is that normal? Ila has been a little loose but not "touch your fingers around the tailbone loose."
Today they are gone, she was staring straight at the wall, pawing non-stop, itching her sides, looking extra uncomfortable, and her vulva is extremely loose, jiggley, open, and pink. That's what made me post here. All the other early signs seemed ok, but these I am feeling squirly about. Should I put her in the kidding stall tonight? Is it ok to kid this early? Am I worried about normal things?
Oh, and I haven't seen the mucus plug but I could have easily missed it because I was busy inside all morning.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

If you put her in the stall alone, with your post, she likes being alone. The pawing & star gazing are signs of labor..but not always last minute full contraction labor. Without a picture, to see her build, udder, and view of her its really hard to say. Im just going by your words.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Are you sure about her kidding date?

Sounds like labor to me.


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## mariella (Feb 23, 2017)

When you add a buck into the pen with does that haven't seen one in a while they can come into heat the next day! So the day you put him in is your first due date.


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

My does did not have a mucus plug this year. It was very strange, and my doe Squeaks kidded fine. My other doe had some issues but, I think it is her, not because she didn't have a mucus plug.  I agree with @mariella. My does have *usually* been bred on the first day they encountered the buck.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

Moers kiko boars said:


> If you put her in the stall alone, with your post, she likes being alone. The pawing & star gazing are signs of labor..but not always last minute full contraction labor. Without a picture, to see her build, udder, and view of her its really hard to say. Im just going by your words.


I'll run out and grab some pictures this afternoon.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> Are you sure about her kidding date?
> 
> Sounds like labor to me.


The very VERY first possible day she could have them would be Saturday, so in five days. Although she didn't seem to be in heat and the buck wasn't even interested for at least a few days if not more.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

mariella said:


> When you add a buck into the pen with does that haven't seen one in a while they can come into heat the next day! So the day you put him in is your first due date.


The only thing that confuses me is that I was checking them every day for signs of heat... maybe they went into heat without showing it.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

CaramelKittey said:


> My does did not have a mucus plug this year. It was very strange, and my doe Squeaks kidded fine. My other doe had some issues but, I think it is her, not because she didn't have a mucus plug.  I agree with @mariella. My does have *usually* been bred on the first day they encountered the buck.


Wow I didn't know it was possible for them to not have it!


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

So, this morning her vulva is extremely open (literally open even when she’s not laying down) she’s totally isolated herself except for feeding time but then she went right back away from the others. 
Her kids still haven’t dropped, no visible mucus, but when she walked up a hill it almost looked like something was pushing against her vulva. Could it just be that it’s so loose? It literally puffed out.


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

Green Mountain Farm said:


> So, this morning her vulva is extremely open (literally open even when she's not laying down) she's totally isolated herself except for feeding time but then she went right back away from the others.
> Her kids still haven't dropped, no visible mucus, but when she walked up a hill it almost looked like something was pushing against her vulva. Could it just be that it's so loose? It literally puffed out.


My doe Squeaks had the exact same thing. She didn't prolapse thankfully, and I doubt your doe would. I wonder why both of our does had open vulvas and no mucus plug..:what:
Goats are strange and awesome, aren't they?


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

CaramelKittey said:


> My doe Squeaks had the exact same thing. She didn't prolapse thankfully, and I doubt your doe would. I wonder why both of our does had open vulvas and no mucus plug..:what:
> Goats are strange and awesome, aren't they?


Yes they are!


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

I just put her in the stall. Poor thing hates to be left alone so she's kinda stressed... but I guess it's best to get that over with now before she's actually pushing. 
I gave her plenty of straw to bed in, hay, a little bit of feed (she already got fed this morning but since she was trying to isolate I think she didn't get quite as much as she usually does), and plenty of clean water. 
I'll keep y'all updated; thanks!


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

CaramelKittey said:


> My doe Squeaks had the exact same thing. She didn't prolapse thankfully, and I doubt your doe would. I wonder why both of our does had open vulvas and no mucus plug..:what:
> Goats are strange and awesome, aren't they?





CaramelKittey said:


> My doe Squeaks had the exact same thing. She didn't prolapse thankfully, and I doubt your doe would. I wonder why both of our does had open vulvas and no mucus plug..:what:
> Goats are strange and awesome, aren't they?


Just out of curiosity... how long before kidding did her vulva open up?


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

She has started star gazing, her tail is constantly going up, down, and side to side, she’s itching her sides, pawing at the ground a bunch, and is still pretty standoffish. Her kids seem to be lower this afternoon. Also, I think I see a mucus plug coming. I see a little white shiny thing in the tiny opening. Definitely not a hoof, though.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

White shiny thing at the opening?
Are you sure she isn't having kidding issues? If there is something right there then she is open.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> White shiny thing at the opening?
> Are you sure she isn't having kidding issues? If there is something right there then she is open.


It's very very tiny and it looks to be mucus. I'm going to check on her at least every 30 minutes to see if it's the mucus plug making its way out. She didn't have any trouble last time but I will definitely keep my eye out. Isn't the thing to look for (to tell if they are having kidding issues) if they push for more than thirty minutes without progress? She hasn't had any severe contractions yet so I'm not really concerned. 
And what do you mean by "open?"


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

Here's a picture of my doe Squeaks. She kidded about 24 days later. The vulva would open more when she was laying down but, it stayed open most of the time. The vulva would appear open one day, and close the next. It was all very random. Here's a picture. Does your doe look like this? By the way, she had two healthy twins. She was a smaller doe bred to a purebred Nigerian Dwarf buck who wasn't known to have super large kids. Her kids were a normal size.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

CaramelKittey said:


> Here's a picture of my doe Squeaks. She kidded about 24 days later. The vulva would open more when she was laying down but, it stayed open most of the time. The vulva would appear open one day, and close the next. It was all very random. Here's a picture. Does your doe look like this? By the way, she had two healthy twins. She was a smaller doe bred to a purebred Nigerian Dwarf buck who wasn't known to have super large kids. Her kids were a normal size.
> View attachment 180305


She is more open than that. I'm glad your doe had a happy kidding!
You can kinda see it here. She wasn't very willing to let me get close to her backend. She just now started having white mucus. Ila's mucus plug was clear but I'm eating dinner and will then go and check her again. It's 8:30pm here so I'm hoping she either has them soon or waits till the morning!


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

This is her tonight. The mucus was gone when I went out there but then it immediately came back. This doesn't look like the mucus plug to me (tell me if you think I'm wrong). Ila is starting to look a little " odd" but I left her out because I know her signs and I know she likes to take her good ol' time. She may have had a little contraction but I'm not worried about it happening tonight. I hope they both wait until daytime!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Just keep an eye on her.


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

From my experience, (And most likely, yours too! ) the mucus starts pale yellow, and gradually deepens to red which means you are close to lil' terrorists! I've never seen white in a mucus plug before...but every doe is a little different. She is looking good to me.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

CaramelKittey said:


> From my experience, (And most likely, yours too! ) the mucus starts pale yellow, and gradually deepens to red which means you are close to lil' terrorists! I've never seen white in a mucus plug before...but every doe is a little different. She is looking good to me.


This morning it is yellow. Exciting! I haven't seen any hard contractions, maybe a few light ones but it's hard to tell. She is showing all the other signs: pawing, star gazing, biting at sides, mood changes, her kids have dropped, her udder is full, I can't find her ligaments, she's really looking uncomfortable (poor girl can hardly lay down)... we're definitely getting closer! I now just need the mucus plug and some contractions and we'll be good to go!


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

Another question (Lexi is confusing me!) so I know a contraction is when the tail bone goes up, the tail goes up/arches, the vulva sinks in, the legs get posty, and the neck stretches and bends in weird ways. Lexi is showing all of those plus grunting, grinding teeth, pawing, and breathing heavily but her vulva is not sinking in. Do you think it could be a contraction?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Sure sounds like possible labor.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> Sure sounds like possible labor.


So you think she can have contractions without the vulva sinking in?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Yes


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Wellll? Any babies yet?


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

Moers kiko boars said:


> Wellll? Any babies yet?


Nope, and the yellow mucus has stopped. But contractions are getting harder so I'm hoping to see the mucus plug here soon or for her to start pushing.


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

Sounds like she is ready! Keep us posted! :clapping:


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

I hope all goes well. She should be getting down to business.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

It’s nighttime and yet again... no kids. It’s ok that the discharge has stopped?


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Have you gloved up and checked if she is or has dialated at all?


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

Moers kiko boars said:


> Have you gloved up and checked if she is or has dialated at all?


No. I haven't ever actually done that before, through my years of goat breeding and raising I've never come across any troubles. I know how to help a kid in the wrong position but I've never checked for dialating. I thought the ligaments were a way of checking that. How do you do it?


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

I saw one big contraction this morning... I have a feeling about today, but we’ll see!


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

Sounds like she is ready to go! :happygoat: See any major signs of mucus? As soon as contractions start, that means the kids come! I really hope everything goes well with her.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

CaramelKittey said:


> Sounds like she is ready to go! :happygoat: See any major signs of mucus? As soon as contractions start, that means the kids come! I really hope everything goes well with her.


Her mucus stopped yesterday and this morning she was really trying to get out of the stall. I decided to put her out and keep a real close eye on her. As soon as I put her out, the mucus started again. I'm going to put her in as soon as I see any signs of the mucus plug, regular hard contractions, or anything like that. 
Thanks so much for the help! I will keep y'all posted. (;


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Strange, I would glove up and see if she is open. 

I would of expected kids on the ground by now, especially if they were true contractions. 
Unless it isn't true contractions you are seeing. 
However, it is concerning you had mentioned she was pawing the ground. 

If you do not know how to check her, I would get someone to check her.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> Strange, I would glove up and see if she is open.
> 
> I would of expected kids on the ground by now, especially if they were true contractions.
> Unless it isn't true contractions you are seeing.
> ...


I don't have anyone to come check her and we can't afford a vet bill right now unless a total emergency. I have taken fecal samples before. Do you insert your finger(s) like you do for a fecal (except into the vulva) and then see how open she is? How open should she be?


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> Strange, I would glove up and see if she is open.
> 
> I would of expected kids on the ground by now, especially if they were true contractions.
> Unless it isn't true contractions you are seeing.
> ...


her contractions have just gotten really severe so I would probably wait a little bit anyways.


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

When exactly was she due? I'm glad major contractions are starting! Anything else? Mucus?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

She needs to be checked right away.
Get a vet out.

This doesn't seem normal and we are not able to do hands on, it is impossible to say. What is happening.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

CaramelKittey said:


> When exactly was she due? I'm glad major contractions are starting! Anything else? Mucus?


Well I thought it was in like two weeks but apparently I missed her heat cycle. There is a red liquid lookin thing on her vulva, it's not like pure blood, that's the waters breaking right? My other doe showed all these signs and the next thing to happen was the mucus plug and then some hours later a kid. She has been having mucus pretty consistently since yesterday.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> She needs to be checked right away.
> Get a vet out.
> 
> This doesn't seem normal and we are not able to do hands on, it is impossible to say. What is happening.


Why do you say that? I don't see anything wrong. I said she just started hard contractions today. 
If I am correct her waters just broke and she is having consistent contractions now. They just started today. Yesterday I believe was fake labor because her ligaments came back this morning and then they totally disappeared this afternoon when she started the hard contractions. She is acting normal other than the normal discomfort things and contractions. She isn't acting sick.


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

I hope all is well.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Contractions do not last for days. 

If her water broke yesterday, she should have babies on the ground. 
Within a short time after that happened. 

Hope things are OK.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> Contractions do not last for days.
> 
> If her water broke yesterday, she should have babies on the ground.
> Within a short time after that happened.
> ...


I don't believe it was her waters, just discharge. Today she has the full contractions: vulva sinking in, tail folded over her back, yawning.... if she doesn't have them by tomorrow we will get help. I think she's been doing some fake labor because her ligaments came back but they are gone now. 
Thanks!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

When they break their water, you will see a huge wet spot with slimy goo in it. 

OK, full contractions means labor to me, especially her having them for a long time and days. 
Again, I would honestly have a vet check her, if you won't.
I am very concerned for her.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> When they break their water, you will see a huge wet spot with slimy goo in it.
> 
> OK, full contractions means labor to me, especially her having them for a long time and days.
> Again, I would honestly have a vet check her, if you won't.
> I am very concerned for her.


I am too. I'm going to feel in her and I've done a whole lot of research to prepare myself for a kid in the wrong position. I've had instances with other animals in labor where just the action of going in with lubricant on made the babies pop out immediately. Also breaking the waters (usually not on purpose) made the babies come with ease. 
I know they are different animals but I'm hoping that that is all she needs and that there is nothing else wrong. 
I'll keep you updated.


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## K Brooke (May 9, 2018)

How are things going?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Any news?


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

I talked to a vet and he said it’s all ok and normal. If she starts pushing and can’t get them out then I can go in and help but now it’s not necessary. 
He said she is in stage 1 of labor and to leave her out of the stall except for night time. I’m going to be watching her very closely. 
Thanks for checking back!


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

I'm a little nervous the kids may be stillborn since it has taken this long. I sure hope that isn't the case. Any pictures?


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

Green Mountain Farm said:


> I talked to a vet and he said it's all ok and normal. If she starts pushing and can't get them out then I can go in and help but now it's not necessary.
> He said she is in stage 1 of labor and to leave her out of the stall except for night time. I'm going to be watching her very closely.
> Thanks for checking back!


Good idea. Keep a good watch on her. Even if there isn't anything wrong, you don't want to miss the babies, right?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I answered you in the other thread.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

CaramelKittey said:


> I'm a little nervous the kids may be stillborn since it has taken this long. I sure hope that isn't the case. Any pictures?


Yes, lots!


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

CaramelKittey said:


> Good idea. Keep a good watch on her. Even if there isn't anything wrong, you don't want to miss the babies, right?


I have been trying to catch a labor for YEARS! I'm always minutes from seeing it and it's so disappointing but I'm determined this year!


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

She looks good. The vulva isn't open anymore, which was the case with my doe Squeaks when she got ready to have them.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

CaramelKittey said:


> She looks good. The vulva isn't open anymore, which was the case with my doe Squeaks when she got ready to have them.


Yeah it's off and on.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Her sides are dropped, as if the kids are working in the birthing canal. 

Were her sides up and bulged out prior? Big belly look?


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> Her sides are dropped, as if the kids are working in the birthing canal.
> 
> Were her sides up and bulged out prior? Big belly look?


Yes and they dropped about a week or two ago. Here she is about a month ago.


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## Sfgwife (Feb 18, 2018)

Green Mountain Farm said:


> View attachment 180703
> 
> 
> Yes and they dropped about a week or two ago. Here she is about a month ago.


I get being scared to go in and check her but this has been going on for days now. Be brave and just do it. If you feel a "wall" stop. But if you can go in and feel an opening then labor has stalled and you will most likely be dealing with dead for days kids that MUST be gotten out one way or another and a dam that will most likely be getting deathly sick very soon. The hard contractions and then nothing means to most of us that something is wrong. At this point i think it IS an emergency since you are not willing to at least check to see if this doe is dilating.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

Sfgwife said:


> I get being scared to go in and check her but this has been going on for days now. Be brave and just do it. If you feel a "wall" stop. But if you can go in and feel an opening then labor has stalled and you will most likely be dealing with dead for days kids that MUST be gotten out one way or another and a dam that will most likely be getting deathly sick very soon. The hard contractions and then nothing means to most of us that something is wrong. At this point i think it IS an emergency since you are not willing to at least check to see if this doe is dilating.


It's not that I'm not willing, believe me I actually kind of want to because I think it would be interesting, I'm just doing what my vet said to do. I explained in great detail what was going on to him (and I trust him because he's very knowledgeable about goats and has always done the right thing with them) and he said not to interfere yet. 
Thanks for your concern but I'm trusting my vet who knows exactly what's going on. 
I can't thank y'all enough for all the help you have offered! Kidding season is exciting but stressful, haha! 
I've actually got another doe who has dropped kids and is looking close too - exciting! 
And please don't worry about Lexi. I'm checking her constantly and studying her for signs of anything other than just being a little uncomfortable. If she does, I'm going right back to the vet.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good luck.


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

How is she progressing? Any more mucus?


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> Good luck.


Thank you! (thumbup)


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

CaramelKittey said:


> How is she progressing? Any more mucus?


A little more mucus and things seem to be progressing smoothly! She's acting fine and dandy, other than being in some discomfort. She's out with the others and I'm putting her in at night (we're supposed to get some cold weather tonight... weird weather here recently!) I'm keeping a very close eye on her, hopefully I'll catch this kidding!


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

I hope you’ll catch this Kidding too! Any babies yet?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

How are things?


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

Anything yet? :waiting:


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

Lexi gave birth to two healthy doelings and one buck yesterday afternoon! (Surprise! I thought she had a single kid!) Everything went like clockwork and they are all doing great! I kept in touch with my vet from when I first posted here til she kidded.


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

CaramelKittey said:


> I hope you'll catch this Kidding too! Any babies yet?


I DID catch it! I couldn't believe she went into active labor right before my eyes but boy was I happy about it!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Aww, too cute, congrats.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Oh such pretty kidds. I hope Mom is doing well. So glad you were there and got to support her. Congrats!


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

Moers kiko boars said:


> Oh such pretty kidds. I hope Mom is doing well. So glad you were there and got to support her. Congrats!


Yes, she's doing great! Thanks!


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> Aww, too cute, congrats.


Thank you!


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

Congratulations! They are beautiful! And you got two doelings too! Will you be keeping those adorable little things? :clapping::kid3::kid3::kid2:


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

CaramelKittey said:


> Congratulations! They are beautiful! And you got two doelings too! Will you be keeping those adorable little things? :clapping::kid3::kid3::kid2:


Sorry for just now seeing this! We are not sure if we will keep them or not.


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

Green Mountain Farm said:


> View attachment 182211
> View attachment 182213
> View attachment 182215
> Lexi gave birth to two healthy doelings and one buck yesterday afternoon! (Surprise! I thought she had a single kid!) Everything went like clockwork and they are all doing great! I kept in touch with my vet from when I first posted here til she kidded.


They are so adorable. Congratulations


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

How are the babies doing now?


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)

CaramelKittey said:


> How are the babies doing now?


Great! Two are already spoken for!


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## Green Mountain Farm (Dec 31, 2019)




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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Cute!


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## CaramelKittey (Oct 31, 2019)

They are so adorable!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Aww


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