# Finding a GOOD vet......



## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Is it really THAT difficult to find a good vet? HONESTLY????? I live in the flippin middle of nowhere and I mean that seriously (it's 1 1/2 hours at 75mph to a STRIP MALL!)....I absolutely do not have access to a lot of the things most of you do. But finding a vet is NOT that hard. They do house calls, they are available after hours, etc. The only problem I have is when my vet goes on vacation! And then the next vet is 30 minutes away (the next town) and 2x the expense, but there IS a vet available! My vet isn't a goat expert, but he's willing to learn. If he doesn't know....he LOOKS it up!

WAITING UNTIL YOU HAVE AN EMERGENCY IS NOT THE TIME TO TRY FINDING A VET!!!!!!

Before you even think about getting livestock, do your research and find a vet in your area that you can work with. Talk with them. Find out what their hours are....what their after hours policies are. Do they have emergency phone numbers? Do they do house calls? Will they sell you the meds that can be administered by YOU at home? Ask what they charge for things.....my vet will tell me what he charges for ANY service...neutering a male llama....dehorning a goat ($8)....spaying a cat....casting and xrays on a broken leg on a horse for 8 weeks! ASK QUESTIONS!!!!!!

Once you find a vet, BE CLEAR what you want when you take an animal in. Tell them what you've already done...vaccinations, home remedies, etc. Just like when you go to the doctor. Give them ALL the info on the animal that you have.....dates, times,....there is no such thing as too much information.

Develop a relationship with your vet! I can walk in or call my vet and say....I'm being told I need this or need to do this. He'll say....yeah, that's a good idea. Or...well....you can...but it's gonna cost this and really isn't necessary. He WON'T sell me something I don't need unless I insist. He'll also tell me if I can get it cheaper at the feed store! I can even walk in and tell him I'm thinking about getting Emus. What do I need to know....and he'll tell me. He'll laugh at me, but he'll give me an honest answer!

Those of you living in more populated areas have more choices on vets. There can't be THAT many bad vets out there. YOU have to be proactive in finding the one that works for you BEFORE you it's an emergency situation.


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## Tenacross (May 26, 2011)

Overall good advise, but not necessarilly as easy as you make it sound. Vets have their way of doing things. It's not always easy to form a relationship with them on your terms and not their's. I've recently tried to form a relationship with two different vets going with the theory that you want to do that before you really need one in an emergency. I'm not totally sold on the results. Neither vet office are bad people, they just base how they do things on the thousands of other dealings they have had with animal owners. If it's a large animal (cow) vet, they base everything on speed, volume and money. That's how their clients are. Anything with goats is sort of a novelty waste of time to some of them. Or it takes a long time for them to take you serious. If it's a small animal vet that works on goats, they are used to clients that do whatever the vet tells them without much questioning. Then of course there is the very real possibility that by doing your own research, you actually know more about something than your vet does. It's all a worthwile pursuit to find a reliable goat vet, but it's not easy.


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

For a few yrs I had a great vet. She even has her own goats. I met with her before we brought them home.
Like Tenacross basically says, the $ is in horses & cattle.
We no longer have goat vets in that office. Except for one way out in the boonies who has been here a few times but her specialty is equine.
There's also one about 50 mi from here.
We do most everything ourselves. If you have a goat in labor & run into problems you have to wing it as no one is going to get here in a timely manner.


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## Skyz84 (Jul 25, 2011)

While it sounds like good advise it is not always so easy.  We live just outside of a big city. Only a mile or so outside city limits. There are dog and cat vets on every corner but not livestock vets. We have found 2 within a somewhat reasonable distance. It's a 1 1/2 - 2 hour drive out into the hill country to get to them. One does farm calls but we are WAY out of his range so I have to meet him at his local clinic in between his farm calls. Last time I went there was a 2 hour wait because he was busy on an emergency farm call He specializes in horses and cattle. He came HIGHLY recommended but I feel like he laughed us outta the clinic for bringing in a limping goat. We saw a different vet that was 2 hours away in another direction. Liked the clinic a lot. They see dogs, cats & livestock. They were knowledgeable about goats and nicely prices but it is a really long drive when you don't own a truck and trailer. Goats have to ride in the backseat of a car next to my toddler.

I'm very busy as a work at home mom with a 3 year old. It is really hard to get away from the house and devoting a whole day to minor ailments for the goats is not always feasible. Not to mention with gas at $4 a gallon driving up and down the hills out into the hill country is a major drain on the budget. Then the opposite end of the spectrum, in a life threatening emergency the nearest vet is 2 hours away? The clinic I like doesn't do after hours care and the one that does farm calls won't drive out to where I'm at. 
My only saving grace at the moment? My dog and cat vet is AMAZING and lives 2 blocks away. We have developed an awesome relationship because of my special needs dogs. She used to own goats too. While she doesn't "treat" goats in clinic if I had a life or death emergency I could always call her and hope she is home. It's not ideal but what are we supposed to do?

Goats really are not a very big "thing" here. Everyone has cattle and horses. I swear it feels like vets don't take goats as seriously as they should.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

> Overall good advise, but not necessarilly as easy as you make it sound. Vets have their way of doing things. It's not always easy to form a relationship with them on your terms and not their's. I've recently tried to form a relationship with two different vets going with the theory that you want to do that before you really need one in an emergency. I'm not totally sold on the results. Neither vet office are bad people, they just base how they do things on the thousands of other dealings they have had with animal owners. If it's a large animal (cow) vet, they base everything on speed, volume and money. That's how their clients are. Anything with goats is sort of a novelty waste of time to some of them. Or it takes a long time for them to take you serious. If it's a small animal vet that works on goats, they are used to clients that do whatever the vet tells them without much questioning. Then of course there is the very real possibility that by doing your own research, you actually know more about something than your vet does. It's all a worthwile pursuit to find a reliable goat vet, but it's not easy.





> For a few yrs I had a great vet. She even has her own goats. I met with her before we brought them home.
> Like Tenacross basically says, the $ is in horses & cattle.
> We no longer have goat vets in that office. Except for one way out in the boonies who has been here a few times but her specialty is equine.
> There's also one about 50 mi from here.
> We do most everything ourselves. If you have a goat in labor & run into problems you have to wing it as no one is going to get here in a timely manner.


 I agree....Originally ..Vets didn't go to goat vet school and only a few selected ones are now ..making an effort in learning goats... not only that but.. almost all drugs are off label....If you noticed.. that is why... we are here on the GOat Spot... to team together... through trial and error ..that we have learned on our own... because we couldn't rely on a vet...which is so sad....  
Vets are suppose to know more than us ...but.. most do not.... It is important to find a vet that can help ...when we here cannot help...and to get the drugs needed to treat a goat in need......But ..as mentioned... it is not that easy to find a vet that knows anything about them...so basically.. you will be paying for a vet to try to remedy something... that they do not have a clue on...which is scary in itself.... Not all towns rural or city necessarily have goat vets... This has been new to a lot of vets... as they did not study goats ..they seen a goat that was basically to them nothing.... now there is a boom ...and breeders are seeking help and not getting it or they do get help and the goat is basically a guinea pig... There are those few out there... that do help and know something... or are learning more within books...
Vet costs are outrageous too and they want their money...after they are finished.. with a bad economy... we sometimes do not have the money so... it also makes things hard...
Searching around for a goat vet is smart to do but ..when you can't find one.... This is what TGS is for... helping others... :thumb:


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Mine isn't a GOAT vet! Goats are ruminants. He treats my goats based on that. I still don't understand why this is so difficult. I really don't. Maybe I'm just dense.... 

I do understand the cost thing. I am truly lucky in that my vet runs a tab with most of his customers. Even when I was in Germany and my dog was in the States, he ran a tab for me. That is probably the biggest advantage to a small town vet. 

At the same time, he is the only vet in his practice so if he's on a call with his big money makers (cows.....) I'll have to wait too. That's life, unfortunately. Just like they'd have to wait on us if we got there first. 

This is NOT goat country out here. In fact my vet even told me the other day he was just thinking that he had the perfect practice going....cows, horses and dogs, cats and no pigs. THEN....I start bringing in my goats.


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## KW Farms (Jun 21, 2008)

kccjer said:


> Is it really THAT difficult to find a good vet? HONESTLY????? I live in the flippin middle of nowhere and I mean that seriously (it's 1 1/2 hours at 75mph to a STRIP MALL!)....I absolutely do not have access to a lot of the things most of you do. But finding a vet is NOT that hard. They do house calls, they are available after hours, etc. The only problem I have is when my vet goes on vacation! And then the next vet is 30 minutes away (the next town) and 2x the expense, but there IS a vet available! My vet isn't a goat expert, but he's willing to learn. If he doesn't know....he LOOKS it up!
> 
> WAITING UNTIL YOU HAVE AN EMERGENCY IS NOT THE TIME TO TRY FINDING A VET!!!!!!
> 
> ...


To answer your question...YES it is that hard to find a good vet. It is easy to say that since you have a great vet, one that will work with you and have a personal relationship with you...but put yourself in someone else's shoes...someone who has looked everywhere and cannot find one or someone who has found a vet somewhat familiar with goats, but won't work with the owner...won't give advice or won't give them meds without seeing the goats. I think you would change your mind about how easy it is to get a good, goat vet.

You are lucky you have a vet like that...many people do not...and NO they are not easy to find. There aren't many out there that are goat savvy. So while I agree with you that it's good to try and find a vet and do your research before you get the animals...I also very much disagree in scolding others because they do not have a good goat vet already lined up and have a personal relationship with him/her. Some may have found a great goat vet...but they're located hours away. Another vet may not like to have a personal relationship with their clients. Each vet is different...some don't treat goats at all...some won't give advice over the phone...others won't hand over meds until seeing the animal...your senario is not going to be the same for everyone else.

I'm glad you have a vet like that...I have one similar...not amazing with goats...but decent and he's conveniently located 10 minutes from my home and lucky me I do know him personally, he's seen my goats, he's seen me show my goats, he's been to my farm to look at my horses and goats, and he will give me advice over the phone and hand over meds that I need. Do I think everyone else is going to have this luxury?...ABSOLUTELY NOT.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

I agree with you on trying to find a vet before something comes up. But someone can met with a vet ask the questions and be totaly happy with that vet, but sucks! I met a vet, he was a older man who said he had worked on just about every animal, but mainly horses. Took our pet goat into him, I can not even start to tell you how much of a 'kids' goat she was. She had a salivary cyst. I left her there for him to do sergury on the next day. I had been posting about her here on TGS and Toth had posted telling me that it is best to just use a syringe and pull the fluid out and that goats are very sensitive to anesthesia. I called the vet and it was too late she was in surgery. Got a call a hour later and she was dead. He told me she had trauma and she bled to death. Then the next day my brother went to get her body to save me a fee, and he told my brother her jaw was broke and when he tryed to fix it she died. Since he could not get his story straight, I belive she died from him giving her to my anesthesia. 
I did just find another vet that is honest and took my concerns seriously and for now am happy with him. 
But my point is, just because a vet seems like a good vet when you talk to them, doesnt mean they are not a bad vet. I joined TGS to learn from other peoples problems. Out of the 5 generations of my family being cattle rancers we have only called on a vet 2 times. One for a c section, and the other something to do with a horse, I dont recall what. We can basicaly fix just about any problem there is when it comes to a cow, so why not a goat? I will keep that vets # on speed dial, but before I make that call and drive 2 hours Im going to post that problem here since I think there are more 'goat knowing' people here then that vet. And will try to fix that problem on my own.


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## mommaB (Oct 1, 2009)

I just RECENTLY found a GOOD vet(after having goats for 4 years) who is nice, and will listen to my questions, and will bounce ideas back and forth with me, instead of treating me like I'm a total IDIOT!!!! 

That is awesome that you have a great realtionship with your vet. Unfortunately it's not that easy everywhere. 

Just curious?? Why are you so defensive about the whole thing?? We don't sit here and vet bash. But when an issue comes up, and they will, because there are as many bad, as good, it's nice to have a place to vent where other people understand your frustration.


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## cdtrum (Aug 25, 2008)

We had a great goat vet when we first brought our guys home and then he up and left us  ......moved to another state to start his own practice......It is hard to find a good goat vet.....found another one, he even raises goats....but will only see goats belonging to 4-H kids as he really only wants to treat cats and dogs at his practice.....we now have a great female goat vet, but she is over 1/2 hr away....not sure how it will work if and when we have an emergency here at the farm, she will come out but can only imagine how much it will cost!


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## pennyspasture (Dec 22, 2011)

I agree it is important to have a good vet and not just wait until you have an emergency. I am pretty fortunate that my horses vet will also see my goats. If that isn't good enough I am only 25-30 miles away from Michigan State University's Vet clinic. Location can make a great difference.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

The one thing I hate about vets, is the price, it costs almost as much to save a aniaml as it does a person. But I do understand that school, and all their vet stuff is not cheap. I dont even know if its that there are so many 'bad' vets. I think its the lack of knowing about goats, and like toth said it is trial and err, but I would rather not be the one that they trial and err on. But I think the most important thing is, is that they listen to you. The second vet I found was gun hoe on using anesthesia, and I told him to start of with just a drop. He seen I was freaking out, and he did something different. The first one in my books, was BAD. He messed up, it does happen rather we like it or not, but then he lied!


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

I had my goats 8 years before I found the vet I have now...actually have a second if I need to take a kid to the office but I definately got very lucky with who I deal with now. It's all cattle, equine dog/cat vets here...and the office I deal with now has a vet who owns goats as well as 2 others who are educated enough about goats that I trust.


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## .:Linz:. (Aug 25, 2011)

I found our vet by using the AASRP website - turns out the practice he is with is the same one my best friend takes her cats to and is always saying how great they are. He's only been out once, to do a CAE test on Fiona and the ultrasound for Eclair, but we were very impressed with him. He's owned goats and knows a lot about them. He stayed and talked with us, answering our questions and giving us tips, much longer than the farm call actually took. They were up front with prices, very nice people - all in all, a very good experience, and I will be taking my cat there next time he needs his check-up. 

I know that we've been blessed to find such a good "goat vet" in a mostly small animal and cow farm area after reading people's stories!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

> I had been posting about her here on TGS and Toth had posted telling me that it is best to just use a syringe and pull the fluid out and that goats are very sensitive to anesthesia. I called the vet and it was too late she was in surgery. Got a call a hour later and she was dead.


 :hug:


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

I'm not trying to "scold" or try to be "defensive". Ok....how to word this without getting everyone's ire up....too many times I see a post that says "HELP! My goat is dying! what should i do?" None of us here ARE vets. WE can't physically SEE the animal and have only a description to go by. Then I hear "Oh, I'm so sad my goat died because of....whatever." And I can't help but wonder if it had gotten professional help in time, would it have survived? (I know, you're all gonna blast me now for being insensitive....) 

As for asking if it's that hard....YES, I really was curious if was that hard. I didn't know. And I agree, you can't always tell by talking to a vet whether or not it's going to work out, but it's a start. And you can avoid surprise fees by asking up front what the cost is. I KNOW there are horror stories out there....I'm not disputing that. 

And I guess I could turn the question right back at all of you...why are you all so defensive about answering why it's so hard to find a good vet????


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Nobody's going to blast you. As I already explained; there are no longer goat vets near here.
I now have to rely on equine vet to get me script meds. Many of us order these things on line. Usually off label hence GS info on types & amounts.
Most of us dont have a bank account that covers expensive vet treatments. 
Not only that, unless it's lets say a torn ear I had on my buck. I dont know how to stitch those things & didnt have a staple gun. $181 for her to come out, staple ear & give shot of Exede. The ear was torn badly.
After giving birth to mashed up kid I had vet out for ultra sound to make sure there were no more in there.(cervix was closed) That bill came to only a little less than the doe was worth financially. 
Dilema; Yesterday doe in labor. I know enough that when labor does not progress it's time to check. Would you call vet? Or bring doe in? A rhetorical question.
Kids had to be pulled. By the time a vet would have gotten here those kids which were DOA in the first place I would have had to pay vet for what I could do much timelier.
Im not knocking vets they have their place. We've had to learn to do most of it ourselves.
Offa me soapbox for now.


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## Tenacross (May 26, 2011)

kccjer said:


> And I guess I could turn the question right back at all of you...why are you all so defensive about answering why it's so hard to find a good vet????


Hmm. Speaking only for myself, I was trying to be nice to vets. There is a reason why a doctor is said to "be in practice". Because if they haven't practiced, they aren't much use. It's not all their fault. Graduation from vet school doesn't make them all knowing. Unfortunately. The stories I have heard from experienced breeders about thier experiences with vets and goats is hair raising. The most common one being "there is nothing you can do". And I'm not just talking about private veterinary practices. I'm talking about State University Vet Schools. Read this article.
http://motesclearcreekfarms.com/asp/art ... Deaths.asp


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

I think your main point of, when you go into goats, look up a vet # Make sure they atleast seen a goat before, and ask around town about that vet is a VERY GOOD IDEA! But there is still going to be those goats that I post about trying to save on my our own. I can not speak for everyone, but my money has a limit, The bills I have for my kids (human) needs will always come before any animal I have here. I got goats to make money, I have a degree in nothing so can not afford day care. This will sound very messed up im sure, but I only have a handful of goats that I think would be worth calling a vet for, but I will do what I can for the rest till the end. I am not scolding you in any way for the post you made, I even think it is a good one, Im just explaining why I have, and will post problems about my goats, and I hope others will too just so the rest of us can learn from it, or even give the vet an idea of what might be wrong with our animal.


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## Hobbyfarmer (Sep 7, 2011)

Thanks Linz. I had never heard of the AASRP. There is no one listed in private practice around me. But I did get the email of someone at a local university. She's already emailed me back with a vet I have never heard of only 15 minutes away. They don't have a website and there's very little info online. So I would never have found the on my own. Can't wait till tomorrow to give them a call. Great tip :leap: 

kccjer: Unfortunately no it isn't that easy. That's great you have built such a wonderful relationship with your veterinarian. However you are the exception not the rule.


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## .:Linz:. (Aug 25, 2011)

Glad you found a lead! I don't remember where I found the link to that website - it was either here, Homesteading Today, or Backyard Herds, lol. But I thought it was great and mentally filed it as something to know and share.


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## mommaB (Oct 1, 2009)

> Is it really THAT difficult to find a good vet? HONESTLY????? I live in the flippin middle of nowhere and I mean that seriously (it's 1 1/2 hours at 75mph to a STRIP MALL!)....I absolutely do not have access to a lot of the things most of you do. But finding a vet is NOT that hard. They do house calls, they are available after hours, etc. The only problem I have is when my vet goes on vacation! And then the next vet is 30 minutes away (the next town) and 2x the expense, but there IS a vet available! My vet isn't a goat expert, but he's willing to learn. If he doesn't know....he LOOKS it up!
> 
> WAITING UNTIL YOU HAVE AN EMERGENCY IS NOT THE TIME TO TRY FINDING A VET!!!!!!
> 
> ...


Your whole post was very condescending IMO. There are a lot of people here who have been raising goats for a long time! And total their knowledge DOES equal to MORE than a lot of vets have pertaining to goats. Nothing compares to years of hands on experience. There are not a lot of meds labeled for goats, most are off label. 
Every situation is unique, and people can't be judged by posts they make asking questions on how to deal with certain things. SOME people don't have access to vets period! And that is what this board is all about! A place to ask questions and learn as much as possible about the animals we all so dearly love! There will always be frustrations, and like I said it's nice to be able to come to a place to vent where(hopefully) everyone understands you!


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## Guest (Mar 1, 2012)

Well said Tisie. It truly is SUPER hard to find a vet that has ANY grounded knowledge of goats that will be any help to us. PERIOD. Most want to treat them like a miniature cow, and those that have had goats any length of time know that the ONLY similarity a goat has to a cow is milk and a ruman. Goats metabolize things faster than a cow (and hence, most drug and wormer doses have to be WAY higher, generally DOUBLE the cow dose). I worked at a vets office up until I had kids, and..wow, the LACK of knowledge about goats KILLED me!!!!!!!!!!!!!! They do VERY VERY LIMITED scientifical or drug research or studies partaining specifially to goats, so there is barely any formal training, medicinal, nutritional or health information available to a vet regarding goats (most of them are probably hitting google on there off time when one of us has a questions). The only info we have is from tried and true GOAT farmers doing the foot work for us. Also LARGE majority of vets only care to work with small animals, or LARGE livestock and will refuse goats all together. Most vets are also unwilling to "work" with a farm and dispense meds that we use on a regular basis etc. Unless a vet has raised goats for the last 15 years... I would double check EVERY MOVE THEY MAKE... cause otherwise you pay $$ for ineffective or deadly treatment. 
And I also agree that your attitude about the whole subjuct and all of us who have balked at a vet, does seem rather condescending, as if we go squawking for help without getting our butts off the chair. Most of us have raised goats for YEARS and have either been working with (or trying to), or searching for vets and are experiencing there knowledge (or lack there of) FIRST HAND!!


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## Guest (Mar 1, 2012)

I do want to add, that it is still VERY wise to look for a good vet in advance and that was good advise.. but if we dont find one, do you expect us to just NOT ever get a goat at all, especially when most information that is any good is found on the WWW anyway????


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## Steve (Mar 12, 2011)

I think the best thing to do with any animal is to expect something will happen to it.Sickness, injury or death.Finding a vet is something that should be done before you get the animal,if you want to take it to the vet.I will not take one to the vet.

I raise market animals,if i take them to the vet for anything my profit is gone.I had a doe with what looked like CL.I did not take her to the vet to test her,i loaded her on the truck with the rest i was going to sell and off she went.She was a good doe and i raised her from a weanling.I hated to sell her but i hated to lose money or take a chance with her spreading anything to the rest of my herd.

We have vets that will come out for house calls,but many dont like to, or are busy with a herd of cattle doing vaccines or castrating it is hard to get them when needed.I have learned over the years with cattle and continue with my goats to do what you can for them yourself.You will lose some and its terrible when it happens,but you wont break the bank and be disappointed with someone else that didnt know any better.


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## Hush Hills Fainters (Oct 27, 2010)

Wow... I hope your vet is always available. But like others have said we are not vets here but collectivly there is a lot of experience...and when you are down to your last hopes with saving a beloved animal , why not get all the possible help you can within seconds...rather then waitin for a call back in the middle of the night...I finally found a great vet who is willing to work with me not make me look like an idiot...but prior to them the last knowledgible vet almost killed my bottle baby by saying she was only sick due to the nonexistant lice she had...they gave me a prognosis while refusing to do a fecal...or even really examining her..so finding a great goat vet is not as easy as it may seem to those who have one. I have to go to a different state to even get someone to look at my goats...so between what they know and what I know along with all the wonderful people here who are more then willing to offer as many suggestions as asked. I think it is safe to say there will be more healthy happy goats and goat owners. We should all use what we know and experiences we have had to help others in need of help instead of putting them down for asking...remember SOMETIMES it is a last resort!!!


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## bessmiller (Jan 23, 2012)

I am going to brag on my dad a little bit here. My father is a small animal veterinarian, and a darn good one. When I purchased my first goats he was honest with me and said that most veterinarians (himself included) do not do any extensive studying on goats--he said he only took one class on them in school. That really baffled me! But anyway, if my dad doesn't know much about a particular animal or ailment, he hits the books and learns. Thus he has become quite knowledgeable about goats in order to help me out when I need it. I think that is an awesome quality in a veterinarian--adaptability and the desire to continue to learn. That, among other things, is why he has clients who have been with him for longer than I have been alive, and why to this day I run into people who say, "Are you Dr. Barger's daughter? Let me tell you, he was so good to me and my animals!"

It really is hard to find an excellent vet. And for my own sake, since I live quite a while away from my father now, I am learning all that I can about taking care of my goats in medical emergencies (and preventing emergencies in the first place). That is one reason I am so glad I stumbled upon TGS and all of its experienced goat breeders!


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## sunshinegoat (Feb 7, 2012)

My husband and I moved out to the western part of our state. There are numerous horse vets but no one seems to know anything about goats. I was working for a small animal vet recently and asked her a simple question regarding a new goat I purchased and I saw fear cross her face...
My husband and I were vet techs at a 5 doctor large and small animal hospital where one of the vets grew up with dairy goats. I was feeling bad about not having a goat vet out here but upon talking to all the vets and neighbors it seems we are armed with more information than the horse/small animal vets around. It is our first kidding season and I feel pretty prepared  Our girls are due this weekend, they look good and are settled into their birthing stall without any complaints...wish us luck and thank you all for all the great information!!!


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## freedomstarfarm (Mar 25, 2011)

It is always best to have a few vets lined up for when need be. 
Talking to local goat 4H groups can generally point you in the direction of a goat vet. 
*That doesn't mean that they or any other vet in the area is a good goat vet. I have known people who's goat vet gave them suggestions or medications that are way off for how a goat needs to be treated. Not that long ago a member here took a few kids to a goat vet for disbudding. It was close to massacre and although the kids lived they were severly burned. This was a goat vet.  
*** So although you can do great research and trust a vet your own knowledge and the help of others with past experience are the absolute most valuable!!
I am lucky to have access to 2 good goat vets. One is local just over a half hour away but he has very limited office hours and only does prearranged farm visits. The other is over 2 hours away and will do farm calls but they are not inexpensive. I read and learn more everyday to prepare myself to handle different situations. I try and do most vetting myself.


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## sunshinegoat (Feb 7, 2012)

Just wanted to add...we have established relationships with a few vets out here but are going into it knowing, as they have said, they do not specialize in goats..in an emergency situation that we cannot handle they are on our speed dial


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## Steve (Mar 12, 2011)

Preventing as many emergencies as possible is the best thing you can do,getting yourself prepared is the next best.Im not talking about just meds or equipment.You need to be prepared mentally and emotionally,dont panic and do what you can for any animal that needs help.

I do agree it is hard to find a goat vet that will work with you.I tried to get some sulmet for a little buck who had coccidia overload.Of course they wanted me to bring him in do fecals all that,the 3 vets offices i talked with thought i was an idiot,and didnt think i knew what was wrong with him.They all asked how do you know he has coccidia?I said i did a fecal count,they looked like how do you know how to do that?
I then told them i have a microscope and know what normal should be.They still would not give me sulmet,so i told them i will go elsewhere.Next day i got it from our feed mill,no questions asked.

Im not saying they didnt know what they were doing,i know what they were trying to do,trying to get me to pay $100 vet bill for a $50 dollar goat.


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## sunshinegoat (Feb 7, 2012)

I agree with Steve..most vets won't treat without seeing the animal. Having worked in a vet hospital I have seen how they operate. I have worked for vets who just need the money and they will do all the unnecessary things in order to jack up the bill then treat them for the simple stuff they should have in the first place. I have also worked in hospitals where the vets know you know what you are doing and will dispense meds no problem once they know you.. I wish there were more vets like that!
We had a little buck last year who almost died and may have if we brought him somewhere that didn't know what to do. I had a friend who got a goat from the same place and her doe did die when she brought it to the vet for treatment. The buck cost next to nothing and to bring him into the vet would have been well more than his worth. We treated him ourselves and he made it. Learning how to run your own fecals will save you lots of time, aggravation and money. We have resources and places like TGS that can be very helpful in those situations and the more you learn the better you can treat yourself.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

> We have resources and places like TGS that can be very helpful in those situations and the more you learn the better you can treat yourself.


 :wink: :thumb: :greengrin:


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## taelir (Nov 29, 2011)

kccjer, I'm envious that you've had such an easy time finding a decent vet.

As far as the AASRP goes, even THOSE vets aren't all that great sometimes. I called one in my area just to ask about developing a relationship with him, and was talking to him about various stuff (like wanting to buy a bottle of BoSe to keep on hand for emergencies)...he really was about as rude and unhelpful as he could be. For a vet that's supposed to specialize in small ruminants, I was HIGHLY unimpressed. I eventually found a vet that was kind enough to order me the BoSe, but that was one vet out of dozens.

And like others have said...part of the reason TGS exists is that a vet isn't the end-all, be-all when it comes to medical advice. I know when it comes to our livestock (we run large numbers of feeder cattle in addition to my goat herd here at the house), we would gladly take advice from an old farmer or rancher over a vet 9 times out of 10. They've just had more real-world experience in most cases, and we're generally going to get an answer faster. Heck, just last year we had a calf with a severe prolapse...if we'd had to wait for a vet, it would have been at least an hour or two. We didn't have that kind of time. An old cattle rancher friend came out within 20 minutes and helped us make the decision on how to handle the situation. 

I have no problem working with vets. They do serve a needed purpose and they do have their place. But please don't think that people here are ignorant or silly for asking advice here when an emergency comes up. It's not fair to judge someone's situation when you're not the one in it, y'know?


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

I absolutely do NOT think anyone is silly or ignorant for asking advice! I do it too! It just really does amaze me that vets are that hard to come by. It was true curiosity that prompted that post and not sarcasm or any of the other things I've been accused of. I just truly feel that at some point you have to realize that a vet or prior knowledge is kinda necessary before investing in animals welfare. That's my personal opinion....getting the animals and then trying to figure out how to treat them is just kinda backwards and not really fair to the animals....


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

I should also add that after reading the difficulties and prices so many of you face.....I am truly, truly blessed with my vet. I know I love him and appreciate him but now I KNOW how truly lucky I am with him. I wish everyone could have access to a vet like him.....


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## taelir (Nov 29, 2011)

Yes and no...I agree that the heat of the moment isn't the absolute BEST time to be learning, but it is what it is. What matters most is that the animal gets treated (and we all know not every animal can be saved) and the owner gains some experience and knowledge through it.

So...how about convincing that vet to move halfway between NW KS and central KS? :wink:


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## luvmyherd (Apr 9, 2011)

Steve said:


> Im not saying they didnt know what they were doing,i know what they were trying to do,trying to get me to pay $100 vet bill for a $50 dollar goat.


Funny you should say that. We had a vet for many years (since the '80s) who said just that to us the first time we called him. Only the other way around. "I hope I can help you, Rod. I would hate to see you pay $100 for a $50 goat!"Needless to say, we loved him. He never saw one of our goats but would trust us to give meds and would diagnose over the phone. He retired just a few years back. :tears: Everybody around here with livestock knows his name and remembers him.
Since him, it has been a series of veterinarians. We finally found one 40 minutes from us who would give (sell) us meds though reluctantly. He really acted like he resented us doing our own diagnoses. The last time we called him we were told that he had to see the animal. (This was a Nubian with a retained placenta. We knew what she needed. Loading her into the truck for that long of a ride would have been traumatizing in her condition; not to mention costing more than she is worth.)
We ended up traveling 70 miles to an equestrian hospital that slid us in as an emergency since it was a holiday weekend.
We raise our goats for milk and meat. We love them and give them a good life but they are livestock, not pets. Vet visits or *farmcalls* are out of the question. But if I can save a goat by coming on here and asking questions and finding out what treatment/medication is indicated you better believe I am going to do it. We realize that we are pretty much on our own. And we handle most things ourselves. But knowing that there is a $20 medicine that can save my animal (say some B1 for polio) and I cannot get it without a $100 office call; GETS MY GOAT!!!
I have a good friend who is a vet. (Unfortunately, she lives on the other side of the country now.) She openly admits that we know more about goats than she does.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

^^^ your first vet is what I would love to have, giving you rx when you need it instead of driving for ever to have them first inspect the goat. The small animal vet we have here will not do that, I even told him I would sign some kind of a waver saying if the animal dies it is in no way his fault, but no. Hopefuly I have found a vet like you had, he seems to be down to earth, doesnt want to work on anything other than horses, but will if needed, and was very impressed that I was there and helping while pulling the one kid and giving the c section. 
Now I did want to bring something up to you guys that do have a hard time with vets (it goes for me too). There might be a class where you are at to be a herdsmen. My dads friend is a herdsmen and has a cert for it and gave me all his notes from his classes and it teaches you so many cool things. Its for cattle but a lot of it could be used for goats. It even tells you how to remove a cancer eye, and he said if you have the cert vets are more willing to let you treat your own animals. Just thought I would share.


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Now THERE's an idea Jessica! I would never have thot of that, but it makes a whole lot of sense. And since a lot of what applies to cattle applies to goats also (ruminants) it does seem that it would work. That would be an excellent compromise to the vet issue in most cases....most....


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

It is just amazing the things that this covered 30 years ago, and has to be better now a days. For example on what I read today (still going threw thousands of pages), the longer it takes a baby to be born the less chance it has of living past 3 days. And it does cover a lot of 'just cattle' stuff, like how to preg check, no way you would get your hand in a goat butt lol. The main thing I wonder is if now it covers A.I.ing. But in your case having a good vet, would probably not be worth the money (I have no clue what this would cost). With me, even though I THINK I found a good vet (fingers crossed), I would still love to learn this stuff and have hands on with it.


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Yeah, but it's still something that can be put out there for anyone that asks. And quite honestly....my vet is getting up there in years (don't tell him I said that LOL) and won't be around forever. I might need this someday if I can't talk my nephew into taking over his practice......


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## GoatGirlMO (Aug 13, 2010)

I stumbled upon this topic and wanted to put in my two cents...

It's true that we don't go to "goat" vet school. It's also very true that goats are NOT little cows and NOT dogs.

However, we DO learn enormous amounts of information about basic physiology that pertains to ALL mammals. We learn what drugs are contraindicated. In my school, we do learn quite a bit about goats, but it is tucked into our everyday lectures "And small ruminants differ from the ox..." Or "Goats differ from sheep...." 

So even if a vet doesn't "know" about goats, he does "know" about the drugs you are using. He does "know" about ruminant physiology. He "knows" how particular drugs work to fix one problem but shut down another physiological system.

The problem I see between producers and veterinarians (and something I hope to fix once I'm out) is that the producers have gone so long without a medical professional that they are used to doing this all on their own. .That is fine, but here is where the issues arise:

A producer comes in, requests oxytocin to have on hand. The veterinarian has never seen the goat that needs the oxy, but sells a bottle anyway. Producer goes on her merry way, goat gets better, all are happy. Someone in the exam room sees this, reports it to the licensing board, the vet cannot produce proof of a doctor-client-patient relationship, vet loses license. 

You can say that you've heard of that happening, but it is happening in these days. Vets are really feeling the crunch because of antibiotic over-use/resistance and drug abuse. To sell someone a drug when they do NOT have a doctor-client-PATIENT relationship (as in, the vet has seen THAT animal in the past couple of months) is very dangerous for the vet. More and more vets are losing their licenses over things like this. It does NOT take a goat dying, like so many think. It takes the wrong person hearing about or seeing the exchange and running to the state board.

Also-- older, more experienced goatkeepers definitely have figured out what drugs work and what don't. They know what therapy works and what doesn't. But, they may or may not be "in the know" about new therapies and drugs. They may be using a drug that isn't used anymore for various reasons. The doctor typically will know about these new contraindications, therapies, or drugs. 

I also see people complaining about vet costs. Obviously I don't like them either!! However, if you consider the numbers:
I was lucky enough to have a full-ride scholarship to undergrad, but let's say there is an average undergrad debt of $25,000.

I just signed a loan for my first year of vet school+living costs (very difficult to work a job big enough to cover rent, utilites, gas, groceries, books, supplies, etc.): $38,000. And the cost of tuition goes up each year. 

So let's say there is an average debt of $200,000 just to get a DVM. Then you have to actually practice, and we all know it takes money to make money when you have a business. 

It costs the vet the same amount of money whether he is treating a dog or a goat. So yes, it is unfortunate that it costs $100 for a $50 goat, but that is just what it is. 

*Off my soap box now.

I don't think anyone was bashing vets (quite the contrary) but I wanted to give some insider info from someone who is sitting on both sides of the fence. I've been raising goats for 15 years now and obviously don't know it all, but I am lightyears ahead of my classmates, AND I've been a producer (lol--like I said before!) so I see and have felt the deficiency in goat vets. But I think the trend is slowly changing.


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## luvmyherd (Apr 9, 2011)

GoatGirlMO said:


> A producer comes in, requests oxytocin to have on hand. The veterinarian has never seen the goat that needs the oxy, but sells a bottle anyway. Producer goes on her merry way, goat gets better, all are happy. Someone in the exam room sees this, reports it to the licensing board, the vet cannot produce proof of a doctor-client-patient relationship, vet loses license.
> 
> You can say that you've heard of that happening, but it is happening in these days. Vets are really feeling the crunch because of antibiotic over-use/resistance and drug abuse. To sell someone a drug when they do NOT have a doctor-client-PATIENT relationship (as in, the vet has seen THAT animal in the past couple of months) is very dangerous for the vet. More and more vets are losing their licenses over things like this. It does NOT take a goat dying, like so many think. It takes the wrong person hearing about or seeing the exchange and running to the state board.


Thank you for confirming that. It is just what I went through three weeks ago. I asked the lady who finally sold us the drugs about it and asked if anyone realizes that this "doctor-client-PATIENT relationship" rule is insane for livestock. She said it is an ongoing battle. They have clients who literally have thousands of horses. The only reason they went ahead for us was because it was a holiday weekend and I guess there can be exceptions for emergencies.

I highly respect the veterinary field. I do not expect nor even want free veterinary care. I would happily pay for a doctor's time to sit down and be filled in on new therapies and ideas. IF said doctor will also listen to what I know so we can come to the best treatment. But I cannot, even if I wanted to, take every sick goat in for an office visit.
I understand the money thing. My kids went to college. They are all in debt. And it only stands to reason that people are going to be willing to spend more on pets than livestock. It would be great if the State would give crash courses or something so laypeople can learn the basic medical needs of their particular animals and maybe get certified to recieve controlled meds. Just rambling and I do thank you for your comments.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

I totaly get what you are saing about needing to go in and have the vet see the animal. Lets use an example on what I was trying to explain on the 'handing over meds'...... I have right now 49 does, lets say they are selenium def. and they are all not exspelling their after birth, it would be nice if I could call the vet and tell him what is going on and him give me a bottle of bo-se, or even take one doe in, but to have to take 49 goats a hour and a half away (thats the closest vet, the one I found is actualy 2 hours away) is not going to happen. Thats an example of what I was trying to get at, I know there are rules for a reason, probably because one stupid person messed up in some way. But also what I was trying to get at with the herdsmen is that its kinda like being a nurse and having a dr. over see what you are doing.


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

I agree, I won't have a vet that has to see all goats in order to get medication. We sure had a rough time finding a vet. The one locally who knows about goats wanted to charge me for: Inspecting all animals <$45-50>, Travel/farm visit <$40>, individual animal/ sick animal exam <$35+>, then meds on top of that.
ALL THAT just to get a pregnant doe Bo-Se! That was last kidding season. OMG no way! That's when I ordered selenium e gel for goats from Jeffers. Sure it may not work as fast as Bo-Se but no script needed and it's easier to dose and not worry about overdosing, plus some of them eat it like candy LOL
Oh and I live maybe 2 miles from that vet's clinic.

Last year this same vet wanted $40 for that if I brought her in!

Well I found another vet that would do it for like $20.

When our buck got sick I remembered this vet, and called and they told me to bring him in. I like this clinic/vet he did everything he could think of and sure we paid a LOT of $$, but we had all sorts of tests, fecal, skin scrape, etc. done on him.
The only thing this vet didn't know was, goats have to have a lot of copper like horses. He sees a lot of sheep and is used to their copper needs. I didn't correct him although I feel I should have. 
I am glad we have a vet we can go to, it's hard to find one, everyone here is either horses only, dog/cat/small animal or horse/cattle.

Oops meant to add:

Before we took the buck in, I called asking if there was any way I could get thiamine for him, we couldn't get enough in him from B Complex. 
Since we'd had the doeling checked we were considered established customer, and the vet asked me the symptoms, etc. and gave me the thiamine, and also another shot which is a steroid.

I'm sure if I asked for Bo-Se for pregnant does, I could get it from them. But we're happy using the gel for now.


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## mommaB (Oct 1, 2009)

Fortunately I found an absolutely wonderful vet!!! :leap: Sooo happy! I totally understand the Doc/ patient relationship! I work in a doc's office, and it's the same! Can't RX to people you haven't seen, or for a problem you haven't seen them for. 
But I think where the vet I found differs, Is that HE offered to come do a farm call. He want's to come meet ALL of the animals, and SEE our herd management. Thus establishing pt. relationship, and seeing each animal! WOW!! What a concept!! Fabulous!!! Aaaannnndd The farm call is only 65 + his time! VERY fair IMO! I explained to him right off the bat, that I KNOW my animals! I don't know everything(why I need a vet!) But I wanted someone who would listen, and bounce things back, and EXPLAIN why something won't work? I want to learn, from experiences. What drove me crazy about the last vet was every time I would say something they would totally ridicule my management, and act like I was a complete MORON!!

Anyhow Thank goodness for great vets! When you can find them! So here is my shout out to:
Michael A. Foss, DMV
http://www.hoodriveralpinevet.com/foss.html


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## GoatGirlMO (Aug 13, 2010)

And I understand what each and every one of you is saying. Believe me, I do. I was lucky enough to be born into a family that had an excellent doctor-client relationship and the doctors were comfortable enough to fudge on the patient part. We could walk in and ask for just about anything. Then they stopped ALL food animal EVERYTHING and we could no longer do that. 

So we searched. I can't even count the number of vets we currently use for all of our animals... wait. At least eleven spread over six clinics. It is a pain in the rear and difficult to establish that d-c-p relationship when we don't have one vet. We use the University and it is 2 hours from the farm. We use a large breed specialist for our dogs-- he is 3 hours away. Driving far is no fun and gets to be expensive. Our local vet does farm calls pretty reasonably and he still balks at giving us specific meds. So frustrating. We definitely price shop and that does hurt our relationship with some vets, but most of them understand. 

^^Not arguing, just rambling and venting myself :-D

I did want to make one comment about the herdsmen being like nurses-- very true, and the d-c-p relationship is supposed to protect that. But even in a doctor-nurse-patient, the doctor still knows the patient. AND the nurse has also had pharmacology and physiology and knows about this stuff. 

So my best advice is to learn as absolutely much as you can about the GI physiology/repro physiology/ endocrinology/ and drugs and the contraindications and what they do to the physiology of the goat-- prove to the vet that you know it, and go from there. I will say that after all the years I've spent with the goats, I still--everyday-- have an "ohhhhhhhh" moment when a professor explains why a drug worked/didn't work in a situation where I tried it. 

And go easy on the vets when they won't sell you a drug. For the most part (because there ARE those jerks out there, but luckily they are few and far between) they are just trying to protect themselves. To be very honest, as a 24 year old newly minted DVM (if I get there!) with $200,000 of loans that I have to pay back-- I'm going to be protecting that license with my life. Even as an older vet, I still will be protecting my livelihood. I may fudge on that patient part, but I'll be all up in your business about your program :-D


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## mommaB (Oct 1, 2009)

^uummm when you are done with school, you should totally check out my area! Just sayin :wink: Would be nice to have another vet who is on "both sides" of the fence! :hi5:


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## groovyoldlady (Jul 21, 2011)

I live in a small town in rural Maine. I just "found" an awesome vet, first try. He owns alpacas and is knowledgeable and VERY easy to work with. I'm so sorry that other folks have such a hard time finding a good vet.

If it makes anyone feel better, my eldest daughter is having a horrible time finding a decent pediatrician - and she lives in a good-size metro area. She has been scheduling interviews left and right! (The moral of the story is: There are good and bad and mediocre docs in every field!)


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## Violetmoon (Nov 14, 2013)

I called 5 vets before I found one willing to castrate my Thyme. And the vets I called were equine vets. I would be taking him to their office but they all stated that they do not work on goats.


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