# What could this lump be??



## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

This golf ball size lump has appeared in my goats throat. It feels like something is stuck in the right side of her throat. She seems to be eating hay fine. What could this be?


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Could this be goiter??


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

goiter would be under the chin where the neck meets the body...looks a tiny bit low for CL but I cant say for sure... how old is she..how long has she had the lump


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I've hade her about a 1 year &/12 and she was about 8 months old when I got her (guessing) i went out if town for the weekend and just noticed it today. It wasn't there before I left


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

she has a sweet face!....Have you had CL on your property before? I would keep a close eye on it for it becoming soft and loosing hair...


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

http://goat-link.com/content/view/101/96/#.VDxctvldW_g

Looks like it is too low for CL. It could be something stuck in her throat, but since she's still eating ok probably just keep a close eye.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

No I've never had cl here before. She my favorite little goat and loves to be milked will chase you down to be milked


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

well shes a doll!!....I agree...keep a close watch...as I stated before its a bit low...but be cautious...


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Should I take her to the vet in the morning or just watch it and wait?


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## packhillboers (Feb 2, 2011)

Thyroid?


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Keep a eye on that. This guy I've been helping getting started with goats has a cl positive doe and she has one pretty much right there. I'll see if he will send me the picture again since I deleted it


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Ok here's another picture of it. I'm worried sick about it now


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

If you are that worried then take her to the vet. That way you will know for sure. Sometimes waiting can be worse than actually knowing


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Until you find out if it is an abscess and have the pus tested, I would not panic about it.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Do cl lumps pop up that quick and get that big in just a few days?


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I haven't had CL so don't know.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

No they do not grow over night....they dont get soft over night either, Cl is carried in thebody once exposed and can take up to 2 years to form a cyst.....I wouldnt panic...you dont want the vet to lance it until its ready.. he may choose to remove the whole cyst, which can be done, but in its location I would not recommend it....lancing it too soon can cause infection..you also can not clean it enough and it can return....If this is CL then you need to wait until the center is soft...again..it is a bit low from what i can see..and can be a sticker cyst, can be an abscess or another sort...if its hard...and has hair...its not ready to burst...once it is, then test the puss to confirm...CL is not the only kind of cyst goats get...


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## J-TRanch (Jan 31, 2014)

Happy bleats said exactly what I was going to via my vet ! 


Owner/operator
J-T Ranch Dairy Goats
NW KS
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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Ok I'll just wait then


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## nannysrus (Jun 21, 2014)

To me it looks to low to be CL. 

I would just keep an eye on her and make sure she doesn't have any difficulty eating or drinking . I had a doe a few months ago get a lump right there. We ended up taking her to the vet to be lance because I wasn't comfortable lancing that location with her jumping around. She has ended up having a very large thorn in it. The vet said had we of given it a few more days it would have come out on its own. 


Samantha

"5 minutes of fresh air is equivalent to 5 mg Valium"


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Thanks


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## loggyacreslivestock (Mar 5, 2013)

My neighbor just got rid of one with a lump there that was CL positive. She had the lump for months- it kept getting larger until it was about baseball sized. The vet biopsied it, because she didn't think it was CL, but it was. 

Good luck.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I've inspected it several times today. I swear it feels like it's attached to the throat kind of like this picture. I'm hopeful that it's not cl. I really love this little goat and it would be heart breaking.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Ok hers might be a little higher up but still a bit close. It could totally be nothing but I would still keep a eye on it. If it looses hair get her away from any other goats. If you are that concerned about cl you need to get your goats tested. That's the only way to know for sure.








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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Maybe its just one side of the thyroid glad swelling? usually both will with iodine def. but it wont hurt to try to treat...to see if this is the problem..Paint iodine on her tail web...where there is no hair...if it absorbs over night then you may have you problem : ) you can introduce iodized salt or kale in her daily diet...


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

happybleats said:


> Maybe its just one side of the thyroid glad swelling? usually both will with iodine def. but it wont hurt to try to treat...to see if this is the problem..Paint iodine on her tail web...where there is no hair...if it absorbs over night then you may have you problem : ) you can introduce iodized salt or kale in her daily diet...


Lol you beat me to it. I was out watering and I started thinking and was gonna suggest that  
But it won't cause a issue if that's not the problem 

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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Do you mean like the iodine I use to dip the babies naval cords in?


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

yep...: )



> Severe iodine deficiency can be treated more quickly by painting 7% iodine on a hairless part of the goat's body such as the tailweb.


tennessee meat goats


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I have 10% providone-iodine . Is that the same thing?


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Im not sure, might be a bit strong...maybe dilute that a little??


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## gwith (Aug 12, 2014)

If this were CL, what would be the timeline from finding the lump, to growing to full size, getting soft, loosing hair, and to bursting?


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

gwith said:


> If this were CL, what would be the timeline from finding the lump, to growing to full size, getting soft, loosing hair, and to bursting?


Good ?s I've been wondering this also


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

There really isn't a timeline. It can take a few days or a few weeks.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

slow..lol...CL does not pop up over night...hereis a quote from http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/3800800



> primary wound infection, lymphatic and haematogenous dissemination, and secondary infection of lymph nodes and various visceral organs.


I havenot seen any article telling a time line from start to finish..I have read it can take up to two years for CL to bring a cyst once exposed...some say it last in the ground for 5 months, which dosnt sound bad until you figure it takes up to two years for cl to show its head...how many were exposed and the spread begins...its a hard cycle...You can pull blood and see but then, not all goats will end up with a cyst even if exposed?? there are more questions then answers but one statement we should remember is...not all cyst are CL...
the progression steps of CL are the lump appears, grows slow, looses hair, becomes soft, bursts.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

how did the iodine test go? If the irodin absorbed fairly quick then you may have a iron deficiency


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

There was only a small trace of the iodine left this morning. I took her to the vet and just got her back home. Initially I was only gonna have blood drawn to send to waddl but the vet insisted on sticking a needle in not expecting to get anything because it was so hard but liquid runny puss came out and it smelled terrible. I told them to take a culture to send off instead since she had already opened it. So now I just have to wait and see I guess. They put her on an antibiotic in the mean time. I'm hopeful that it's just an abscess instead of Cl. Since it wasn't cheesy also I read that cl puss doesn't smell. Is that correct??


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Not sounding like cl at all. Cl puss is soooo thick that, say that lump was cl, at that stage you would have got nothing in the needle. It's actually a good way of testing a abscess on if it's cl or not. I would still, if your concerned about cl, get your goats tested. If you would still keep your goats if they had cl or not I would say save your money but it sounds like you were freaking there. 


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Lily at the vet


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Aww , Lily is just precious  
Keep us posted , I'm praying for good news for Lily !


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## Scottyhorse (Feb 11, 2013)

Liquid and smelly puss sounds like pus from an infection to me... She might have something stuck in there.


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## kmarar (Oct 13, 2014)

My wether had a lump that looked like that after receiving a vaccine shot in the neck. It was a mild allergic reaction an went away on its own after a few days. It wasn't leaking any puss or anything though.


I do commissioned hand drawings of pets (especially goats!) check out my site kennamarar.wix.com/creativecommissions


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I agree..sounds like and infection... CL does not smell..maybe an infected sticker or thorn...

I would also begin to offer iodized salt or kelp...since she absorbed most the iodine...


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Since the vet poked it a couple times with the big needle I have put her in a pen away from the herd until I get the results back from the lab .She's miserable in there alone and I feel sorry for her


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

poor girl..she doesnt understand..but you are wise to pen her away from everyone..just give her a little extra TLC ..b complex would be good for stress too


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Wishing you good luck with those results ! Prayers its not CL !


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## sweetgoats (Oct 18, 2007)

Poor thing. She is so sweet looking. That face is just so cute. Praying all is fine.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Just went out to check on her and her whole upper neck/ jaws on both sides are swollen and she acts like its painful ???? She looks like I did when I had my wisdom teeth removed.






yesterday she was normal acting no pain. All they did was stick the lump with a 16 g needle could that have caused this?


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

poor baby...Any fever?? looks like the infection may have spread...I would give her Banamine.. I would also start antibiotics...Penicillan 1 cc per 20# sub Q....be sure to pull back the plunger and check for blood ..see blood , re adjust and trya again...


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

They gave her antibiotic Excede yesterday and told me to give her another dose of Excede Sunday . I do have penicillin should I also give that? I'll go check her temp now


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

If she were mine I would....Im not a fan of long acting meds for goats..their metabolism is too fast...and with her swellingup like that..I would be concerned...


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Temp is 103.6 and I gave her 3 cc of pen g


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

temp is only .1 higher then normal ( 101.5-103.5) which is not necessarly a fever since goats can run high and low a few points....were you able to get her banamine? 1 cc per 100# once daily for three days.. Be sure to follow up with probioitcs 3-4 hours after antibioitcs to keep good flora in her gut


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I have some on the way from a friend.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

pictures of the swelling. The discoloration on her hair is iodine from where I wiped her down yesterday.


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## Summersun (Apr 24, 2014)

Could be an allergic reaction to the Excede. I know a lot of horse owners who will not use it because of allergic reactions from it. Banamine and benadryl will help.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I emailed the vet pictures and she also mentioned a possible allergic reaction from the Excede .


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## Scottyhorse (Feb 11, 2013)

I wonder if at this point it would be best to lance and drain the abscesses to get all that infected gunk out of her body...?


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I will if you think that's best. I really just don't want to have to take her back to the vet unless I absolutely have to. They charged me $250 yesterday just to poke her with a needle and to send culture to the lab!


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Hummm, I didnt even think about allergic reaction! Sometimes if you bother a cyst too early, before its ready to lance you can cause infection,...Give her a big dose of Benadryl...see if that will help....poor girl...


EDIT: On the lancing...I think I would wait to see what the Lab says...


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I have Benadryl tablets. How many should I give her?


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## Scottyhorse (Feb 11, 2013)

Yeah, wait to see what the lab says, but it looks like the infection is spreading very rapidly which is pretty concerning to me.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I will continue giving her the pen g and no more Excede .


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

She can have 2 Benedryl tabs, it's a high dose so drop to 1 after the first dose.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Ok . earlier she was so swollen that she couldn't get any sound out when she tried but now she won't be quiet


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## Scottyhorse (Feb 11, 2013)

Do you know when you will get the lab results back? Really curious to see what they say.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

The vet said possibly Saturday or Monday at the latest. Most of the swelling under her neck is gone and she is acting like herself again.


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Thats great !


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Good.news....positive thouggts for negative results


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

happybleats said:


> Good.news....positive thouggts for negative results


I saw Good news , then the word positive &#8230;&#8230;&#8230;.made my heart sink there for a minute ! 

Praying for that NEGATIVE result


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

OH sorry Tricky : ) didnt mean to scare you!!


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I got another email from them vet about the other swelling. 
She said she talked to Dr. Wester about possibilities for her swelling and aside from a reaction to the antibiotic (which is pretty rare), the only other possibility they could think of was perhaps during the fine needle aspirate, some of the proteins that were walled off inside the abscess may have gotten in contact with blood vessels under the skin and induced a systemic reaction to the proteins since her immune system was already primed against the bacteria in the abscess.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

UGH...no news on the actual test?


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Nope the wait is driving me crazy. Hopefully I will find out the results tomorrow. Really don't want to have to wait until Monday.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

The vet also told me that an abscess usually appears 1-3 months after coming in contact with cl but also admitted this was her first possible case of CL . Is this true?


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

from papers I have read...it can take *up to *2 years...Ill have to find that article...but that doesnt mean it cant show up sooner...but if I understand CL ....I would think it would take longer then 1-3 months from contact...its the bodies way of walling off infection....thats just my thought on it...


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I called to see if Lilys results from the test we back and it's NOT. They said to check back Monday


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Bummer....


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

happybleats said:


> OH sorry Tricky : ) didnt mean to scare you!!


No problem  It made me read the whole post twice , lol. 
Then i was happy again


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I was up all night reading everything I could find on the web about cl abcesses . The wait is stressing me out!! Most everything I find says that the pus has no real odor and is very thick and then I found two other sites that say the pus is runny and is foul smelling. I know the only definite way to know is from the test but just wondering if anyone has ever had an abscess that tested positive and was very stinky??


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

when we dealt with CL we never tested...the pus was thick, and gross but did not smell...some cl can be more liquid with blood...depends in what stage the puss is removed I think..but still should not smell...there is a thread on here...a huge cl discussion...have you read it?


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Ok. There wasn't any blood in the pus they sucked out. And No I haven't ?


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

http://www.thegoatspot.net/forum/f186/cl-discussion-150100/


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

K thanks


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Lilly's lump has doubled in size already.


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Tomorrow will tell us what you need to do. Don't worry , your going to handle it great either way. :hug:


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

fingers crossed....My vote is NOT CL...


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## Scottyhorse (Feb 11, 2013)

I agree with NO CL. Has gotten too large too fast.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Thanks for being positive. I really hope you're right. I'll let ya know as soon as I find out in the morning .


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## gwith (Aug 12, 2014)

Hopefully it is not CL, but what is done if it turns out to be CL?


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

Praying for your girl...


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

gwith said:


> Hopefully it is not CL, but what is done if it turns out to be CL?


gwith....if it is CL there are a few options. Since the pus itself is what is contagious, quarantining the animal until after the cyst has burst and is healing is one way. You can keep the animal then if you want. You just have to really watch for any new cysts.

You can sell the animal. Hopefully with full disclosure.

You can butcher the animal. If the CL isn't too advanced, the meat will still be ok. An animal with advanced CL (had it for a long time) will have cysts inside as well. That means less meat.

The thread happybleats posted has a LOT of info in it.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

any news on her results??


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

No. I woke up and called first thing this morning then again at lunch time and they said lab is still working on the results


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Just talked to the vet again and now they say the lab is saying they haven't received the sample yet so she said to check back tomorrow at lunch time to see if the lab has received it is not then I have to take Lily back in for another culture for them to send it back off on Wednesday


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Maybe you can make sense of that crazy auto correct


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Very frustrating!!


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

Augh, that's awful!


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Im so sorry your going through this Erica4481 :hug:
Prayers for Lily :hug:


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

UGH....how frustrating....

hows her swelling today?


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Pretty big. I'll get a picture in the morning. How long should I continue the pen g


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I would go for 5 days and see how she does...she may need longer..


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Today will be the 6 th day


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

As long as there seems to be infection...I would go longer...maybe 10 days...be sre to follow up with probioitcs 3-4 hours after each shot...: )


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

waiting to hear back from vet to see if I have to take lily back


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## nannysrus (Jun 21, 2014)

Oh my goodness poor baby!!! 




Samantha

"5 minutes of fresh air is equivalent to 5 mg Valium"


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Just heard back from vet. They said they called waddl lab and they said that they are still going through the mail. I'm a little p.o. Because i noticed on my bill I was charged for overnight but found out that they just sent it through regular mail. STUPID!


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Just found out that lab still hasn't received the culture so will be taking lily back in the morning to give another


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Poor lilly!! I sure hope it doesnt make it worse...the swelling looks localized back around the lump...I would keep her on pen for a bit longer since they are doing another sample...


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## Scottyhorse (Feb 11, 2013)

Could it be a waddle cyst?


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Can they get wattle cyst without wattles?


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

They can get wattle cyst even if wattles were removed..but not if there were never a wattle...( is that proper english lol)


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Hehe....she never had wattles.


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## takethelead (Dec 18, 2013)

I've been stalking this thread and I really hope you find out soon what it could be. Lilly is so cute!


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Just left the vet's office pus is still runny and stinky. I took the sample to the post office myself and overnighted it so that I know it will get there


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

takethelead said:


> I've been stalking this thread and I really hope you find out soon what it could be. Lilly is so cute!


Thanks


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

fingers crossed!!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good luck


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## takethelead (Dec 18, 2013)

erica4481 said:


> Thanks


Your welcome


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## takethelead (Dec 18, 2013)

Any news?


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

No from what the vet said I don't think they will test it until tomorrow. So hopefully I will find out results tomorrow or Monday again.


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

How is she doing otherwise ?


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

sending good thoughts!!!


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

She is doing great and acting completely normal.She just hates being away from the rest of the herd but she's getting lots of love and attention and extra treats I somehow forgot to mention that she is 6 weeks pregnant .


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

erica4481 said:


> No from what the vet said I don't think they will test it until tomorrow. So hopefully I will find out results tomorrow or Monday again.


Good grief! I sure hope they get it to you today! I keep hoping I'll see where you got the results and it is negative. Where you keep saying the pus "stinks" I'm still betting it's not CL.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I hope to find out today too but I'm not gonna get my hopes up again. If it is CL does that mean her babies will have it too or not?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

It all depends on if they were exposed to the goo.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

toth boer goats said:


> It all depends on if they were exposed to the goo.


Do you mean while they are inside of her or once she has them?


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## nannysrus (Jun 21, 2014)

"If" she has CL as long as she had no open or draining abscess' then she won't pass it to the kids. They have to come into contact with the bacteria which comes from the pus of the abscess. 


Samantha

"5 minutes of fresh air is equivalent to 5 mg Valium"


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## nannysrus (Jun 21, 2014)

I can be passed threw the milk of they have a abscess in their udder and it ruptures and contaminates the milk or if she has one in her lungs that she is coughing/sneezing and releases the pus. 

Those two scenarios from what I have read are not very common.


Samantha

"5 minutes of fresh air is equivalent to 5 mg Valium"


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

No once they are born. So let's say she has cl and let's say that lump is cl (not really sounding like it to me) it will burst and the puss that is in it is what will spread to other goats. So if the kids are exposed to that puss they will get it. But simply being in her? No.


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Its going to be ok , I just know it


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

The kids within her will be fine.
After the kid are born, she has and CL abscess on her udder, lungs, or on any lymph node area's, which pops and the goo from it leaks out, then yes, the babies are subjected to it and will get it.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

No news today so I guess it will be Monday when I get the results.


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

You poor thing :sigh: We are all keeping our fingers crossed for a negative result .


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Prayers sent, hoping it is negative. I know the wait is killing you. We feel your pain.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Just received really great news!!!! It is NOT CL!!! I actually missed the phone call but the voice mail said its what sounded like trupiala pyogenic bacteria....lol I have no idea if that's how you spell it or pronounce but she said it needs to be lanced drained and cleaned. Is that something I can do myself or should I take her back in to vet?


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Just talked to vet again they want another $200 to remove the abscess!!


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

If you have the stomach you can do it your self. Basically all your going to do is stab it and push all that crap out and I myself have been very pleased with shooting some tomorrow up in there once you get the gunk out. I'm not gonna lie it's gross and they scream but something that needs to be done and I'm sorry but not $200 worth of being that hard to do 


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

She called back again and said that they could lance drain and flush for $50 but she recommends doing surgery to remove whole thing because it could come back and that's $200. I guess I'll just pay the $50 and hope it doesn't come back first .


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

That is the best news :stars::wahoo::hugs:
Im soooo happy for you :hug: You've been through heck and back waiting for these results :thumb: Im very interested in seeing what others think about removing it or just lancing and draining it. Personally i think you can do it yourself if you have the stomach for it. Some people rather not , and thats just fine too. IMO , fifty isn't bad to have them do it. Im going to google what they diagnosed it to be . Would love to hear what Goathiker says about it 

Oh Jiiiiill……...:thinking: :-D


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I can definitely do it my self with y'alls help I have the stomach to do it just need to know what to do .its soft and squishy now instead of hard like it was.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

not hard at all..just gross lol..it is hard to cause the pain..but its needed...I googled trupiala pyogenic bacteria and only found aliver type abscess?? strange..
but so glad its not cl!!
You maybe able to open it with a large g needles...?? but to lance....I would do as I did for CL...

DO BE MINDFUL OF THE JULUAR LOCATION!!! 

I would start with disifected tools...soak in alcohol
a strong helper to hold her 
razar 
syringe
weak iodine solution for flushing and cleaning
lotsof paper towels to catch the yuck...since you are not truly sure what it is..not reason to take chances

wear gloves
use the razar to make a quick slice through the layers of skin...not too big..just enough to drain, hold a wad of paper towels and squeeze the gunk out by going under the cyst and pushing upward...once you have got all out that you can....flush with the weak iodine solution...fill the syringe up and flush away...until you feel you have cleaned it well, clean the area well when done with the iodine solution....I would go back a few times a day for a few days and flush again until the walls of the cyst has thinned...


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Ok. I think it's actually spelled trupella


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

I got the same thing Cathy , lol. 

You can do this Erica  I always found draining abcesses fun when i worked at the vets , lol. Fun , fun , fun  
You can totally do it. You can order surgical blades if you want to go that route or pick a few up at a surgical place. It sounds like its ripe to lance now. Flushing it is key to help clean out the yucky stuff and have it heal nicely , so you will have to be vigilant of that part.
Good luck and let us know how it went


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Got to see if I can find someone willing to hold her if not then I'll just take her in to have it lanced by the vet.
She is currently back out with the herd and very happy about it


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

We used a blade from a box knife..new and without the holder..just the blade...worked just fine...do be careful as they are sharp : )

If you end up having the vet do it..which is perfectly fine...be sure to continue her care with flushing a few times a day for several days...: ) tetanust antitxon wouldbe a good idea and banamine : ) 

best wishes...


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

How big of a cut do I need to make if I do it myself?


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Is it highly possible that the abscess will return if I don't have it surgically removed? I don't want to spend that much if not really necessary . But I do want to do whatever is best for lily .


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

not too big...less then 1/2 inch maybe...just big enough to get things flowing..and you can stick the tip of a syringe in there to flush...

not really knowing what the cyst is...its hard to say it willor will not return...flushing is key...if you flush until the wall of the cyst is thin..then you know you got the bacteria causeing the cyste and hope it doesnt return....if it does..then you can discuss with your vet about removing it..


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

I would do the lancing at home and if it does come back , then take it up with your vet at that time. You might save yourself the $200. 
It may not come back  Im thinking it may feel good to her once you lance it , the pressure will be released. Then , she just may stand for you to flush it out. After that , you may be able to do the flushing yourself  Do you have a milk stand you can put her on ?
Put it up against the wall so you only have one side to worry about.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Ok I'll pick up something to do the cut with in the morning


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

It will be fine .....:hugs:


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Yep :hugs:


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

I agree $50 isn't bad if you can't do it yourself. I also agree with going that way. I would do it the same way. I'm guessing what they said is just a really fancy way of saying it a kind of infection which with any infection if you don't get all the nasty out can come back. With you saying it smelled badly I would put her on antibiotics and if the vet is going to stitch her up talk to him/her about leaving a drain hole at the bottom then you can get some sterile solution and spray in there and keep flushing it for a bit. 


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

;-):wink:


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I got Lilly's abscess lanced drained and flushed several times. It didn't take but a small nick and all that stuff came running out. I thought I was gonna throw up my lunch from the smell and I have a strong stomach. That stuff was rank. She didn't mind the cutting or squeezing the pus out but wanted no part of the flushing. I didn't have any help to hold her but she's a good goat and got it done


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Oh then that sucker was totally ready to be drained. But great job and sorry it smelled so bad  


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## nannysrus (Jun 21, 2014)

I can't believe it got that big without rupturing itself. 

I have only lanced and drained one myself. I have a really strong stomach while I am doing something. I can do just about anything but when I get done I have to be done and put my mind elsewhere or I start gagging and getting nauseated thinking about.

Where you lanced I will probably close back up quickly so be prepared to bust it open when you go to flush it. 


Samantha

"5 minutes of fresh air is equivalent to 5 mg Valium"


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Awesome job !!!! Good for you  That must have felt real good to Lily to have that lanced and the pressure released ! Yeah , she was probably like "OK , thanks Mom , never mind about the flushing" lol.
Tomorrow it will need to be opened , and I'm sure she won't like it , but the worst is behind you , the rest will get easier to do once she realizes its going to happen regardless


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Great JOB!!! : )


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Should I infuse with pennicillin also after flushing like over night or not?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

You can, but just the flushing daily, will do the trick for a few days.
By flushing it daily 2 x a day you are keeping the bacteria down. Make sure you give it a squeeze each day until no more pus comes out or bad odor.
Try it for 4 days and see if all seems OK.

Giving her antibiotics SQ may help too, as you work on the flushing daily for a little while.
Iodine/water, light tea color, is best to flush with. Use a good size syringe so it provided more flushing power.

Good job, on the operation.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Ok I'm using a 60 cc syringe for flushing


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

She still has swollen tissue that still looks like a lump on her neck but I have squeezed everything possible out and will continue to but will it eventually go away completely after it heals and look like normal flat skin ?


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

It should  It will be swollen for a bit yet , but will go down .
Like was mentioned , a good mix to flush with is iodine and warm water. Use enough iodine to make a light tea color  
You will be amazed on how fast it will heal ! If you still see a swollen area , she may have another pocket that may need lancing as well.
But give it some time , you will see either healing or another pocket start to swell like the original one did. You will just have to do it again.
Your a pro at this , so you will be fine  Once you see the healing and she is doing well , your going to feel so good about what you did for her  Its a amazing accomplished feeling for sure


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

the walls and area of the cyst will stay thick for a few days..with CL it usually took 3-4 days before the walls thinned and were ready to heal...it might have some scaring..


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Ok so I'm still flushing 2-3 times a day and having to peel scab to open it up every morning. But I'm still squeezing out a little puss every morning. It has gone down from a golf ball size to maybe a large marble size. Do I continue to this routine or is it gonna have to be removed completely. I'm flying out of town to tExas for 10 days on the 21 and won't have anyone to care for her medically so if its likely she needs more done I need to get it taken care of before I have to leave.


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Im thinking if your still getting puss out , you may need to use a stronger flush , JMO though. If your not using the iodine/water mix made to a light tea color , it may not be powerful enough. Just a thought. Since your going a way for a bit , i would try using the mix and flush it out a couple more times then what your doing , its a lot i understand , but maybe giving it a stronger punch it will be enough to take care of it while your gone. I feel that since its gone down so much , your doing great , but l think there are a few pockets of puss left .
Good luck with her , keep us posted  Have a nice trip !


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

When was the last course of Penicillin ? Not infused but ingested…
She may need another course of it , JMO.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I've been using the iodine/water tea colored since the 1st time. Ok I'll keep doing it and hopefully it will be gone before I have to leave.


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

erica4481 said:


> I've been using the iodine/water tea colored since the 1st time. Ok I'll keep doing it and hopefully it will be gone before I have to leave.


Good !!! I forgot what you were using and didn't want to go back and re read the older posts , lol. Sorry  
Maybe give her another course of penn&#8230;.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Ok I'll have to pick up a new bottle today and then I'll start her on another round


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Its really good to have regardless


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I agree..you are doing great....since you are still getting pus, I would keep flushing until the day you fly out and then let her rest..usually it takes 3-4 days maybe 5 to clean out..hows the walls of the cyst look? thin or thick?


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Still feel kind of thick & hard


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

humm..you can use Essential oils too...there has been great success using frankincense ..1-2 drops rubbed on location...or diluted oregano...( oregano is a hot oil so dilution is necessary)...rubbed 2-3 times a day


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Are you pulling away the scabbed parts ? I find once the area is clean from the scabby areas and bleeds a bit , it heals nicely.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Yes I peel off all the scab every morning to open it back up so I can insert the syringe tip to flush


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I think it would heal good if not for the continuous puss every day.


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Here's a pic I took a few mins ago after flushing






.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Man erica! I just read this whole thread...how awful what you have gone through! So happy it's not cl....any goat that chases you down to be milked is a keeper


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

I know this is a pain , but could you take a better picture with the hair smoothed away from it. Im trying to see if there is any discoloration around the wound.
That may tell us if there is another pocket there maybe….it looks good otherwise.
You made a great incision BTW


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I will try to get another better picture


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

First pic is before opening it back up 2nd is after opening with puss and 3 is after flushing


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

So strange the puss is still there.....how long has it been?


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

NyGoatMom said:


> Man erica! I just read this whole thread...how awful what you have gone through! So happy it's not cl....any goat that chases you down to be milked is a keeper


Even after all the penicillin injections , cutting, scab picking, squeezing and flushing she is still happy to see me and comes running to have it all done again. Shes just a wonderful little goat


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Awwww...


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Erica , I'm thinking she has another pocket on the left side ( using the above picture ). The dark area makes me think thats another pocket. It won't hurt 
( ok it will , the poor baby , bless her heart ) to lance that spot to be perfectly sure . This is just my opinion though. You did a great job Erica , don't be discouraged :hug:


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

erica4481 said:


> Even after all the penicillin injections , cutting, scab picking, squeezing and flushing she is still happy to see me and comes running to have it all done again. Shes just a wonderful little goat


Awww , she is a keeper for sure  What a big heart she has !
It shows what a awesome goat momma you are Erica ! Im not just saying that either , your gentle touch and wonderful care goes a long way


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Aww....thanks
Ok so should I just make the incision bigger or just cut another hole on the dark spot?


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

I think I'd cut a new hole.....


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

erica4481 said:


> Aww....thanks
> Ok so should I just make the incision bigger or just cut another hole on the dark spot?


I would just do a second cut over the dark area. Wait a bit , lets see what others suggests though. But my gut feeling is that its another pocket.


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

NyGoatMom said:


> I think I'd cut a new hole.....


Steph , do you feel its another pocket ?


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

I think you should go ahead and lance the dark area. Odds are its another pocket of puss. Once you have that area flushed out along with the first once , its going to heal real quickly for you  Im thinking it would be healing up nicely by the time you leave for Texas


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Ok I'll work on it in the morning


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

erica4481 said:


> Ok I'll work on it in the morning


Keep us posted


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

I have an inkling it is...why else would it keep oozing? Besides, at this point, it won't hurt to check...


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

NyGoatMom said:


> I have an inkling it is...why else would it keep oozing? Besides, at this point, it won't hurt to check...


Im glad you came back  Yeah , i feel the same way , just hate to put another hole in her . She's being so amazing with all this surgery ! But , its got to be another pocket like you said. After this one is lanced and cleaned , i feel it will heal up in no time


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Thanks!  Let's hope it will!


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Erica , didn't you vet mention that these puss pockets could be deeper and thats why he said it might be a good idea to surgically take them out ? Not that you need to do that , your taking great care of her , just thinking maybe you might have to go a tiny bit deeper with the cut.
I have been involved in so many threads , i forgot , sorry.

But , so the same as you have done with the first one , lets see where that gets you  That first cut looks great but raised more then i would like to see…….thats just my opinion though. Makes me think there was something underneath , a bit deeper down. But like i said , after you do the second one , I'm thinking you will have gotten all of it 
I don't like to suggest going deeper without someone else's input first .


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

No I wasn't told why .


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

you can only go as deep as the cyst wall thickness to open it so it wont hurt to be sure you are through all layers...a second cut may produce more pus, maybe a secondary cyst within that one cyst...you may need to flush more often?? but sounds like the cyst maybe producing more pus ...you may need to add Pen to the flush to add a bit of kick to it...


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Hows your baby doing today ?


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

She didn't want to cooperate with the cutting at all and I was scared that with all her jumping around I was gonna cut something else. The only person around to help hold would be my mother in law and she's just not much help do I gave up and just flushed it several times today and then infused with penn. and also started the round of penn. injections


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Awww , so sorry  If you can , try again tomorrow , but do it matter a factly so she doesn't expect it , thats all i can say. Or hopefully someone else can give you a hand. It will only take a second to do the cut , I'm thinking , so once its done , you can squeeze as she jumps around and flush it  Or , you can keep squeezing it , flushing it and maybe it will rupture the other pocket. Lets see what others suggest.
Don't give up , its a minor setback honey


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

I'll try again tomorrow


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

erica4481 said:


> I'll try again tomorrow


:thumb: :hi5:


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## nannysrus (Jun 21, 2014)

I use a syringe like pictured above. Use a triodine and water solution to fill the syringe up. I stick the tip in as far as it will go. Take gauze and put pressure around the opening cut and slowly squeeze the mix in. You want it to balloon up and let the mix set in there for a bit and then squeeze it all back out. I do that a couple times and then the third time I just flush it out and then I put pen g inside the abscess.

Samantha

"5 minutes of fresh air is equivalent to 5 mg Valium"


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Hoping tomorrow will be successful!


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Fingers crossed Erica..you got some good advice here!!


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

I agree with the second cut. Also a thought for you  after flushing it I would put some tomorrow in it (the mastitis med) I had a calf with a nasty abscess last fall and used the tomorrow and was pleased with it.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Tomorrow antibiotic is not a bad idea : )


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Great idea !!!


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Something came up early this morning so didn't get a chance to work on lily but just got home and was gonna get started.....I removed the scab and then squeezed and for the first time no puss came out. Should I still cut it open again??


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Does it feel like there is still stuff in there. From the picture it looks like there is so if it feels like it I would


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## J.O.Y. Farm (Jan 10, 2012)

Jessica84 said:


> Does it feel like there is still stuff in there. From the picture it looks like there is so if it feels like it I would
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Goat Forum


I agree, I would too  better to get it all out and get the infection cleared out (if it is an infection)


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

I would , better be safe then not IMO 
Good luck :thumb:


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Agreed...clean it out good...and be gone with it!


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Jessica84 said:


> Does it feel like there is still stuff in there. From the picture it looks like there is so if it feels like it I would
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Goat Forum


It's just very hard


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## erica4481 (Mar 26, 2013)

Ok I'll get it done then


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

if there is still swelling and pus, then yes get it open and try the Tomorrow antibiotic cream for masitisis..: ) Im sorry..I hate that for both of you...


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