# gemma is on day 147 and not feeling so great :(



## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

poor girl. as mentioned in my other post i think she was/is quite wormy - scruffy coat and lost a lot of weight. so yesterday i wormed her and gave an iron supplement. 

whereas tje other wormy girl seems brighter today, gemma seems the opposite. she is completely.off her feed today and will only get up when i make her. 

i am not sure whether this is from the worms, or if she has some preg tox (think her feet are a bit swollen) or hypocalcaemia or all three. 

i have given her propylene glycol, cmpk and probiotics plus some more iron supplement. 

i am wondering if i should go to the vet tomorrow and talk about inducing her? 

the funny thing is though she is the first one due, her udder is the least full and she shows no sign of imminent kidding. i know the date is right because i witnessed the mating, and didnt see her come back in.


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

oh also - her eyelids have not improved in colour whereas the other girl is already pinker than yesterday


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## milk and honey (Oct 31, 2010)

Sounds like you've done alot for her.. how about a dose of nutri-drench just to give her some extra energy and vitamins?
Hope her kidding goes OK for you. I'm so sorry for your "wormy" situation.. darn those little buggers!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Not sure, whether to induce her or not, you can talk to your vet and see if it is a good thing to do... Sounds like, she is really badly anemic and it may take her longer to rebuild her blood.... keep up what you are doing ... keep us updated..praying she will be OK.... :hug: ray:


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## 8566 (Jul 18, 2012)

Getting up and down isn't such a big issue I think. Some stay off their feet a lot because of the extra weight.

It's the swollen feet, lack of energy, and poor lid color that hits me.

Maybe add VitB, Calcum, and Sel/E (1 dosage) if you haven't yet. Did you pre-treat her ~ a month ago at all?

Sounds like your treatment is good so far and I'd keep up the Iron/RedCell and toxic treatments .... along with NutriDrench.

I'm leaning towards calcium and vitb.

hth,


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

I can only tell you what I would do. Like the rest said throw some nutri drench in there, I dont know how long she has been like this, but if more then a couple days and it was a goat I was willing to take to the vet, then yes take her. Im sure you are already doing this, but just in case. I had a doe that Im 99% sure passed from worms and her temp started to drop, just watch your girls temp. I hope she gets better


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

well im pleased to say she seems a bit brighter today. actually showed interest when i came into the shed, and was chewing her cud which she wasnt doing at all yesterday. she ate the slughtest bit of food - just picked the fruit and veg out of her bowl but at least its something. i also put a rug on her - thanks jess - cant believe i didnt think of that!


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## packhillboers (Feb 2, 2011)

Do you think she would like to try some molassasses and crushed tums all mixed up together like a candy?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

That is better news...praying she keeps getting better..... :hug:


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## milk and honey (Oct 31, 2010)

I give tums all thru pregnancy..they love the fruit ones!


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

I dont even know if we get tums here ... they have dolomite for calcium and she has been eating that quite well ... 

Unfortunately she has gotten worse. She is now not really able to stand. I got her to stand up once but she went down quite soon after. Tonight I have given B complex, propylene glycol, iron, probiotics and CMPK. She is fighting less tonight when I stab her and drench her which is never a good sign. She ate a couple pieces of her vegies tonight and then nothing else. I have tried bringing her new (and different hay), fresh grass, tagasaste, eucalypt and wattle branches and have found nothing to tempt her. Her udder seems to have emptied?? 

One good thing is she is getting a bit of colour back in her eyelids so I think I am over the worst of the worm/anaemia problem but I now think I have a pretty critical hypocalcaemia/preg tox case on my hands. I am going to talk to the vet tomorrow about drugs to induce. She is far enough along for the kids to survive and I dont like the fact that she isnt able to get up, nor do I want to leave her go without eating.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Can you cut a branch off a bush... that she may eat...sometimes they will eat...tree leaves and brush... when they won't touch nothing else...don't know if you have oat hay? I find... my Goats won't touch Alfalfa when sick... but will eat oat hay... 

Do you think the the paralysis may be from a kid pushing on her spinal cord?

Man... I am sorry she is so down...... :hug:


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Oh man Im so sorry, I was so happy at first when I read she was doing better 
I agree with you, GET THOSE KIDS OUT. She is your girl and you have so much time invested into her. Let us know how things go, I keep thinking, but have no advise other then make sure she is getting fluids, might be why her bag has gone down. Im so sorry


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

pam i have tried branches of wattle and eucalypt trees, my bay leaf tree, fresh green grass, rose leaves, oat hay, alfalfa hay, meadow hay. she will mouth something new each time i bring it to her but not actually eat it. fluid level was ok yesterday but slightly dehydrated today and still unable to stand and no interest in food. i am going to call the vet when they open.


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## 8566 (Jul 18, 2012)

can you glove up and go in?
Do you have calcium drench or something similar?

Maybe the kids aren't positioned right and you need to do some shifting. Not sure about the udder. I've only lost udder capacity on cloud bursts.


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

the cmpk is giving her all the calcium she needs. its actually.called calcigol here but i thought you guys would be familiar with the term cmpk. its sub q solution containing calcium, magnesium, posphorus, potassium and glucose. 

i am 100% positive she has not gone into labour otherwise i would not hesitate to go in as i have assisted hundreds of births. 

i have not experienced a cloudburt before. are there usually complications like this? i didnt think so. she has shown no signs of labour nor has she passed any fluid. 

i just worry about udders deflating like this. i have seen it in very very sick goats for various reasons


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

> pam i have tried branches of wattle and eucalypt trees, my bay leaf tree, fresh green grass, rose leaves, oat hay, alfalfa hay, meadow hay. she will mouth something new each time i bring it to her but not actually eat it. fluid level was ok yesterday but slightly dehydrated today and still unable to stand and no interest in food. i am going to call the vet when they open.


 Oh wow... :hug: 
To get food into her...do you have Alfalfa pellets? If so ...soak them to make it to where you can get it into a 60cc syringe and slowly feed it to her...that way... she will get food... she has to be getting weak from not eating...and her Rumen may be effected by it....you can put electrolytes or other things in the mix .. that will go through a syringe...make a small batch at a time and what you do not feed...throw it out and make a new batch each time... :hug: ray:


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

i lost her guys, i will post details soon when i am not so upset, im just a mess right now. 

she was carrying quads and although full term we didnt manage to save any of them.


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

I'm so sorry, keren. Words cannot express ...


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## milk and honey (Oct 31, 2010)

Oh.. SO Sorry... that's tragic


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

we believe she had a very bad case of preg tox and combined with weakness from the worm burden was too much for her. when i took her to the vet she actually seemed reasonavly bright and thevet was quite positive. she gace her anti inflammatory and pain relief and said keep up with what we are doing, and to try to get her through till monday before inducing. i agreed and found this vet (who i had never been to before) to be excellent, thats the one good thing to cone kut of all of this is i think i have a pretty good new vet. unfortunately when we got her home she went downhill fast, scarily fast. her temp dropped below normal and we didnt get it back up. she got progressively weaker and more unresponsive. i held her until her heart stopped. 

as soon as she was gone we cut in and delivered the kids. the vet had palpated two, well we delivered four. their total weight was 11.55kg or 25.4lbs. so no wonder she was so ill. unfortunately i believe the kids had died about an hour prior, as her body was shutting down i believe the blood/oxygen supply to the kids was cut off. they were very meconium stained so they had stressed. none had a heartbeat when we delivered them, and even though it was futile we still attempted to atimulate and revive them, of course it was to no avail. they were beautifhlly formed, three doe kids and a buck kid. 

we buried her and her babies under a tree in my backyard.


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## packhillboers (Feb 2, 2011)

Oh Keren, 
I am so sorry for your loss.


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## 8566 (Jul 18, 2012)

Big Huggs and I hope the most beautiful flowers grow under that tree.
:angelgoat:


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

:hug: :grouphug: I am so sorry for your losses, how terrible!! :tears:


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## J.O.Y. Farm (Jan 10, 2012)

So sorry for your loss :hug:


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I am so sorry keren ...you tried so hard.....  :hug:


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## Di (Jan 29, 2008)

Just tragic, so sorry for your loss. :hug:


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