# Sick goat - diarrhea, lethargic, low appetite



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

One of my does hasn't been feeling good for a couple weeks now. At first it was off and on, and I thought she was improving, but now she's dropping weight. At first it was just diarrhea, then she started spending most of her time in the shed and just nibbling at food. No temperature or neurological symptoms. Has free access to Sweetlix, kelp, and baking soda. I'm guessing it's a parasite, probably cocci - my friend said they can do permanent damage so I want to start treating in the morning, but would like a second opinion first (vet didn't call me back.)


----------



## AmyBoogie (May 20, 2013)

Get a fecal test done for all the worms and Cocci to know for sure. Then you can treat what's wrong. What color are her gums and eye lids?


----------



## enchantedgoats (Jun 2, 2013)

i agree with amy, but go ahead and buy baycox or dimethox for cocci you will need it eventually we all do. use pepto for the diarrhea and keep her hydrated.


----------



## Di (Jan 29, 2008)

Absolutely! Treat her for cocci immediately! Adult does can have a cocci "bloom" and it can and will kill her. Please don't wait...I use Baycox, but that must be ordered online, so don't wait. Start treatment with liquid Sulmet. It's a 5 day treatment. 1ml/5lbs day 1, 1ml/10lbs day 2-5. She should respond quickly. After treatment give her a couple of days of b-complex, or thiamine, if she has very light or white mucus membrane, give her some Red Cell for a couple of days. Good luck!


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I agree.. treating for cocci is not going ot harm her..a fecal would give clear view of worm load...

Check her lower inner eye lids for color...they should be deep pink to red...if they are pale she is anemic...
Get her temp.( 101.5-103.5 is normal range)
is there snotty nose, runny eyes??
I would give her C d antitoxin
Pepto top sooth her tummy and dry her bum
1/2 teaspoon baking soda in enough water to drench
a dose of Probios daily
B complex daily
no feed until you see berries
hay, alfalfa and green leaves only
Electrolytes...

Homemade Electrolytes

A half gallon of hot water
2-6 Tablespoons of Unsulphured Blackstrap Molasses
1-2 Tablespoons of Either Sea Salt, Epsom Salt, Baking Soda or Table Salt.
1 cup of Apple Cider Vinegar


Mix well and drench or let them drink it. Most of mine love this stuff unlike the electrolytes you buy..


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

I have Sulmet, she was dosed in the spring after she kidded. Temp is 102.8, no snot, runny eyes, or vomiting. She has free choice baking soda and does use it. So Sulmet, Pepto, Probios, electrolytes, and B complex, plus check for anemia? I'll see how much of that I can get down her! The closest feed store is mostly dog/cat/horse so they may not have CD antitoxin, but I can go to the vet supply tomorrow. My vet works out of there so hopefully I can grab him for advice.


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

Can someone remind me of the dosing on Sulmet? I remember that it's not labeled for goats.

Also, forgot to mention that she's currently in milk although has slacked off considerably with the change in weather plus getting sick; should I dry her off?


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

sulmet is 1 cc per 5#day one and 1 cc per 10# day 2-5..straight out of the bottle..no diluting..

Drying her up is up to you...if you feel its an extra burden on her system then yes..other wise keep her going, once she is feeling better her milk could increase..

milk with draw for sulfa drugs, such as Albon is usually 5 days,sulmet should be about the same...you can give her milk to chickens, pigs, your garden or use it in soap, freeze and label as withdrawed...for future use of any of these : )


----------



## Di (Jan 29, 2008)

When my doe was sick with cocci, she had a kid on her, he was 4 weeks old. I did pull him and gave him a supplemental bottle so I could dry her off. But, she was a cashmere goat, not a dairy goat...so I figured she needed all her energy to save her life. This was early in my goat keeping so she got pretty sick before I made the correct decision about what was wrong with her. 

She did respond to treatment really quickly. So, you may be able to keep her in milk. You can give it to the dogs during the treatment period.


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

I'll dry her up since she's slacking anyway. Gave the Sulmet, Pepto, and B complex. She did drink a little of the homemade electrolytes, although I'm not leaving it out there since the rest will just drink it. I threw hay since it's rainy and nasty out and she was nibbling at it when I left. Will get CD antitoxin tomorrow. Passed on the Redcell since she only looked slightly anemic and they only sell huge buckets.


----------



## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

I would treat first, but I would also send in a fecal on the chance that it's not cocci, but something else.


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

You can use injectable iron if you dont want to buy a gallon of red Cell. You can also give a mix of 50/50 apple cider vinegar and water..drench 20 cc once a day..this will also help the anemia.


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

She's already getting ACV in the electrolyte mix. Will pick up injectable at the vet as well.


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Its ok to give the 50/50 dose of ACV as well..: )


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

Finally made it to the vet. I got injectable iron and B complex (she's not a fan of pills) but they said there's no CD antitoxin available - not just them, but anywhere in the country. Some problem with the manufacturer. Still waiting for the actual vet to call me back.


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I order cd antitoxin from Jeffers . How's she doing?


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

Seems about the same. Maybe a little more alert, still eating a bit. Not sure if the diarrhea is gone or not because I haven't seen her poop, but her butt is still yucky. Vet finally called and said to give Ivermectin as well as what she's getting, and we can run blood panels if she doesn't improve by next week. He's not worried about CD at this point, said she would be much worse or dead by now if that was the cause.


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I disagree with the vet  She is battling something gut related...CD Antitoxin can at least offer her some protection and faster healing, if you cant get it milk of magnesia will also bind toxins,15 cc per 60#..I would also choose Ivomec Plus over plain Ivomec..cover Liver fluke worm as well...Also be giving her Fortified B complex as a support..and the anemia treatment and probios..

best wishes


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

I can get toxoid but not antitoxin (at least not soon enough to be helpful.) Should I give the MOM in addition to or in place of the Pepto?


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Toxoid is different...MOM would replace pepto...MOM is a laxitive so it wont dry her bum, but binding the toxins causing the runs will actually help...its weird how it does...My goat al recently broke into the barn and got into the feed...two of my does had the runs real bad..plus were off feed, hay, hardly drank a thing...I was giving the CD antitoxin but one doe was so bad, I really thought I might loose her..Began MOM along with everything else and with in a day she began nibbling hay...then day two her poop was thicker...I believe the MOM actually helped her heal faster then CD Antitoxin alone. I would do the MOM once a day for a few days, see how she is feeling..then switch to scour halt or Pepto..Keeping her Hydrated is most important any time a goat is runny..
Best wishes


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

Update: Finished 5 days of Sulmet, gave Ivomec Plus today (wish I knew it wasn't safe for pregnant does - my buck runs with the herd; I'm not concerned about Sweet Pea losing a pregnancy at this point but it means I can't dose my others. And that stuff is expensive to just use once!) She got a shot of iron yesterday, MOM yesterday and today, B complex, probiotics, and electrolytes since Sunday. Switched from pills to injectable B yesterday. She loves the electrolytes and has been eating while I'm there, but still has poopy butt and stands hunched up. So I guess another day or two of MOM then switch back to Pepto. How long should I keep giving the B? Not sure if it's something they can OD on. At this point I'm just going to continue support therapy and hope for a turnaround soon.


----------



## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I would do the B Complex injectable for at least a week.

According to some, Ivomec Plus is ok for pregnant females.


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

I found sources saying it can cause abortion before 100 days. It also has a very long withdrawal time, and I have two in milk.


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

She's feeling better today! Still has poopy butt but she was stuffing her face the whole time I was there, including sneaking out the gate to make a beeline for the feed shed.


----------



## Greenhillzone (7 mo ago)

My does recently passed. Vet said it was cocci and “humonphilus” or something like that. He got that from a stool sample. I wish I would have known about Pepto Bismol. I wish I would have known about the Milk of Magnesium. I wish I knew about so much… What do you do AS SOON as you see diarrhea? 🤷‍♀️


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Greenhillzone said:


> My does recently passed. Vet said it was cocci and “humonphilus” or something like that. He got that from a stool sample. I wish I would have known about Pepto Bismol. I wish I would have known about the Milk of Magnesium. I wish I knew about so much… What d


Very sorry you lost her. This is an old post. Feel free to make your own post with your questions. We would love to help and your own post will attract more members.


----------



## TripleShareNubians (Nov 5, 2021)

This is an old Post but early on if I'd have seen those type of symptoms I would have treated for the worms and Coke I or check for them and obviously given the pig spectoguard for diarrhea, but I also would have given two doses of la 200. Why? Because there's a thing called anaplasmosis that mimics some of the other conditions that that would treat and it wouldn't hurt to give it.
When I'm an adult doe go off like that I also give bovi sera. It is great and helping them when they're struggling with something.


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

TripleShareNubians said:


> This is an old Post but early on if I'd have seen those type of symptoms I would have treated for the worms and Coke I or check for them and obviously given the pig spectoguard for diarrhea, but I also would have given two doses of la 200. Why? Because there's a thing called anaplasmosis that mimics some of the other conditions that that would treat and *it wouldn't hurt to give it.*


It absolutely can. Antibiotics are going prescription only next year due to overuse because it creates resistance and they shouldn't be given unless there's a solid reason to believe they have a bacterial infection. Two doses is insufficient which makes resistance even worse. They should receive a full five day course. Spectoguard is an antibiotic too.
There's also a risk of crashing the rumen with antibiotics, particularly if they're already compromised. I lost a doe to that when I jumped to antibiotics prematurely because her diarrhea was slow to clear up after worming. 

In this case the doe recovered but did end up aborting a couple months later. Probably unrelated to the ivomec+ because she also did so two other years when she wasn't treated. Out of five pregnancies she only had live kids twice. I got a microscope to run fecals a year and a half after this post which confirmed that she was chronically wormy and I eventually lost her to them. Both of her daughters were too and I just culled them for it this year.


----------



## TripleShareNubians (Nov 5, 2021)

Wild Hearts Ranch said:


> It absolutely can. Antibiotics are going prescription only next year due to overuse because it creates resistance and they shouldn't be given unless there's a solid reason to believe they have a bacterial infection. Two doses is insufficient which makes resistance even worse. They should receive a full five day course. Spectoguard is an antibiotic too.
> There's also a risk of crashing the rumen with antibiotics, particularly if they're already compromised. I lost a doe to that when I jumped to antibiotics prematurely because her diarrhea was slow to clear up after worming.
> 
> In this case the doe recovered but did end up aborting a couple months later. Probably unrelated to the ivomec+ because she also did so two other years when she wasn't treated. Out of five pregnancies she only had live kids twice. I got a microscope to run fecals a year and a half after this post which confirmed that she was chronically wormy and I eventually lost her to them. Both of her daughters were too and I just culled them for it this year.


yes but I lost one because we kept thinking it was worms or coccidia and it was anaplasmosis and if you're going to take it to the vet and get a testgopd,l. a two-dose round of la 200 is what my ver told me to use for anaplasmosis. It's not enough and the window that it cured I guess didn't work


----------



## TripleShareNubians (Nov 5, 2021)

They are going to kill a lot of animals places where you can't easily access vet care by making everything prescription. I'm not advocating jumping to it but not everybody has the option of getting a blood test for antipastosis quickly


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

TripleShareNubians said:


> yes but I lost one because we kept thinking it was worms or coccidia and it was anaplasmosis and if you're going to take it to the vet and get a test a two-dose round of la 200 is what my ver told me to use for anaplasmosis


Many vets are not up to date on current recommendations. I use Tennessee Meat Goats' dosing for pretty much everything. It's not just a matter of what's needed to treat their acute condition, it's about preventing resistance in ALL bacteria that the treatment kills even if they're not the target. Bacterial infections generally cause different symptoms from worms including fever, and for GI infections I prefer sulfa class meds.


----------



## TripleShareNubians (Nov 5, 2021)

TripleShareNubians said:


> They are going to kill a lot of animals places where you can't easily access vet care by making everything prescription. I'm not advocating jumping to it but not everybody has the option of getting a blood test for antipastosis quickly
> 
> 
> Wild Hearts Ranch said:
> ...


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

TripleShareNubians said:


> They are going to kill a lot of animals places where you can't easily access vet care by making everything anti-prescription. I'm not advocating jumping to it but not everybody has the option of getting a blood test for antipastosis quickly


It's a tightrope. You are correct about that, but at the same time overuse is making them less effective, including for those people who don't have access to vets and just throw antibiotics at everything willy-nilly. If they stop working we're ALL screwed. I wish they'd come up with a solution that made vets more available for people such as online access that includes the ability to prescribe. As of now they cannot do so and any of those sites that ask you to pay for vets can't do more than advise you based on over the counter treatments, which is pretty useless IMHO. However, vets do have the ability to authorize prescriptions (which you can order online if need be) as long as you are an established patient per legal requirements. In my state that means that they see one of your animals at least once a year. If you can find one who's willing to do so it's worth driving a few hours that time in order to have access to meds the rest of the year.


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

TripleShareNubians said:


> well she's not a vet and my vets been raising goats her whole life so thanks I'll trust her advice.


She has more experience than many vets, and I've had vets kill animals through mistreatment or undertreatment. I don't blindly trust them because they have a piece of paper. I don't always follow her advice on everything but in terms of dosage it's the best information I've found.


----------



## TripleShareNubians (Nov 5, 2021)

Sorry buried my reply Tennessee meat goat says she's not a vet and my vet has been raising goats for whole life take my advice with a grain of salt if you want but I'm saved one and I've lost one. One cuz I didn't know and one cuz she was treated. 
The only reason I mentioned the antibiotics is that the post said it was reoccurring. That is what made me think of anaplasmosis because it will come and go them being sort of like they have coccidia or something until it kills them. Whereas if you treat them early it doesn't take a lot and they get better. I've had it a long time it's a whole nother battle


----------



## TripleShareNubians (Nov 5, 2021)

Wild Hearts Ranch said:


> She has more experience than many vets, and I've had vets kill animals through mistreatment or undertreatment. I don't blindly trust them because they have a piece of paper. I don't always follow her advice on everything but in terms of dosage it's the best information I've found.


I agree she's good and I've used her stuff especially on lysteriosis. There are many vets you're right that I wouldn't trust and I've learned a lot from people like happy bleats and the Tennessee meat goat and a couple of other sites over the years. and you're right it's probably best to people check with a vet but you're also going to have to make calls more often than not based on your own knowledge base because you don't have time or you can't contact one or can't reach one in time so you have to learn conditions and treatments. I have high powered antibiotics that I have at my place but I never use them until I talk with my vet first, but some of the basic ones you have to learn the self-diagnose some of those conditions and be on top of your goats but it is a balancing act just like wormers have been overused and are causing great problems especially in the midwest here with barber pole


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

TripleShareNubians said:


> Sorry buried my reply Tennessee meat goat says she's not a vet and my vet has been raising goats for whole life take my advice with a grain of salt if you want but I'm saved one and I've lost one. One cuz I didn't know and one cuz she was treated.
> The only reason I mentioned the antibiotics is that the post said it was reoccurring. That is what made me think of anaplasmosis because it will come and go them being sort of like they have coccidia or something until it kills them. Whereas if you treat them early it doesn't take a lot and they get better. I've had it a long time it's a whole nother battle


Worms reoccur too - in her case for her entire life, as is common with goats that do not have good resistance. I was not as experienced then and probably could have done better by her if I had been, but genetics are genetics. Animals that are chronically wormy will drive up resistance to wormers if you have to treat them often and they are shedding high numbers of eggs which can put your other animals at risk, even if they are not as susceptible themselves. Especially kids.



TripleShareNubians said:


> I agree she's good and I've used her stuff especially on lysteriosis. There are many vets you're right that I wouldn't trust and I've learned a lot from people like happy bleach and the Tennessee meat goat and a couple of other sites over the years. and you're right it's probably best to people check with a vet but you're also going to have to make calls more often than not based on your own knowledge base because you don't have time or you can't contact us in time so you have to learn conditions and treatments. I have high powered antibiotics that I have at my place but I never use them until I talk with my vet first, but some of the basic ones you have to learn the self-diagnose some of those conditions and be on top of your goats but it is a balancing act just like wormers have been overused and are causing great problems especially in the midwest here with barber pole


One of the goats that was killed by undertreatment - by a very experienced vet who should have known better - did indeed have listeriosis. TMG's treatment protocol is the gold standard and the only animals I've known to survive were treated that way, which is one of the reasons I always keep dexamethasone on hand as well as many other prescription meds that I know how to use correctly. My point was about people who do not and may not ever have had a relationship with a vet and do not use medications appropriately. If a vet is willing to approve prescriptions based on that once a year appointment they will make sure that the person does.


----------

