# gave Dexamethasone-should we give oxytocin or lute...



## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

we have a doe that is just miserable. have given her calcium-she acted a bit better for a short while. vet gave us Dexamethasone and oxytocin because we asked for it-we just realized we usually use lute after the dex. we are not familiar with the oxytocin----i think we asked for the wrong thing........help !


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

What was diagnosed on your Doe by the vet?

Did she just have kids or?


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

we can feel the kid in thru the cervix, which is not loose-about 2 fingers, but tight. doe has been still and quiet-head against the wall. brought her in and gave calcium 100cc then another 100cc today-we have other does ready to kid/uddered up, leveled out, not eating...etc.... talked with the vet yesterday and she suggested la200 (would have used biomycin), calcium (we have a history with our does needing calcium: calcium deficient hay/feed in our area is common) have had to do the caclium with others in our herd. she also suggested to dose for coccidiosis as we had some loose stool-which could have been from extra corn i had given them when our son had given them some, also. so we haven't dosed for cocci. . it has been a long while since we have induced and feel very green. we are confident she is ready-also, else would the kid be right there that we can feel it when checking the cervix...? we usually talk w/our vet and dose ourselves unless its an emergency which she doesn't feel it is. we are praying she will have 2-3 small ones and not one big one.....


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

When is the Due Date...do you know?



> doe has been still and quiet-head against the wall.


 This is a normal behavior with Does that are getting closer...I have seen them... up to a wall and actually push their head against it.... all night before they kid..... 
If she isn't pushing yet ....she may just be contracting...... and her cervix isn't dilated and ready yet..... A Doe can contract for hours...preparing her body for kidding...if she hasn't pushed or isn't in distress.... I wouldn't give her anything...... unless she is way over Due or has a dead kid at the opening that isn't telling her to dilate or push....

Not sure... as to why... the vet suggested the LA200....unless your does are to early and it keeps them from aborting?

If you have calcium issues ...that is good... to give the calcium...

Glad you didn't treat for cocci...I would get a fecal done for worms and cocci... if their stools stays soft..... Feeding extra corn.... when their systems aren't use to it.... can cause loose stool or watery scours....

I have to say this... but ...it sounds like your vet ....is just guessing things and throwing out the meds ........ that can be dangerous in itself ....


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

yes-she always 'advises' and we go from there. we have had cocci for 2 years after decades of no problem...go figure. maybe we are just being too soft for the doe. we are taking the fecal in tomorrow for testing and will at least be able to know or delete....we have 2 other does in with her and i will be surprised if they haven't kidded by morning....thanks so much for the quick responses. i don't feel so out of control anymore.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Glad you are taking in a fecal sample.... that will let you know.... one way or another... :wink: 


and you are very welcome.... hang in there ...happy kidding and may God bless.... :hug: ray:


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## AlaskaBoers (May 7, 2008)

hm.. hope everything goes well, I'd give oxytocin or just wait with her


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

gave the dex at 11: this morning. going to pray the other 2 does go ahead and kid, and she likes the idea and takes off ! otherwise, we will uxe the oxy tomorrow afternoon....


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

How are your goaties today....?Prayers.. are being sent there.... :hug: ray:


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

Dexamethazone takes 48 hours to induce so give her time. Just because a doe is uncomfortable doesn't mean she is in destress. 

Giving Lute on top of dex is like double inducing. 

I wouldn't give oxytocin unless she is dialated and just not pushing or you will creat contractions and hurt her internally if not dialated!

Soft stools before kidding is totally normal but glad you are getting her stools check


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## comingsummers (May 6, 2010)

How is she doing? Did she give up the babies yet? I hope everybody is doing well!


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

wanted to say that her stool is still loose, almost runny..just not quite lumpy and a a bad odor to it. was with her for hours today and she didn't potty at all...so tonite at 9:30 she does. vet says it needs to be a fresh fecal, so will try again tomorrw.....


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## sweetgoats (Oct 18, 2007)

When is her due date? Did I miss that? I am glad you are getting her stool checked, but I wonder if it is because of all the Calcium that she is getting? What are you using for the Calcium? Just wondering. I gave one of my does CMPK and they hate it and I guess it burns. I would like to figure out something else. 

Good Luck


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

for calcium we inject calcium gluconate subQ. they don't mind much at all, except for weather like this if we don't warm it up to body temperature and they get the cool solution ..... she just kidded-a very big girl she had. had to have a good bit of help ! feces in the bag/ gave mama penicllun procain and will continue for 5 days. they are both doing well...except....when i went to help the little thing nurse....mama has not uddered up-nothing. so we are helping her nurse off the first doe that kidded-yesterday morning. so she is getting a bit of colostrum . came in to find a recipe for something to feed her in hopes to pull her thru tonite and prayerfully mama will be able to feed her tomorrow.......if anyone is up and on here and has some help in what to give the little doe.........thanks in advance


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

Let baby nurse from mom as often as possible, the action will cause her to let down her milk. If you can, while baby is with mom, massage and bump her udder, that too will help. I have a similar situation with my Angel when she kids...teeny udder and I do supplement kids with an ounce or 2 twice a day for the first 2 days, leaving them hungry enough to encourage production from mom.

Congrats on your baby girl! Would love to meet her!


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

thank you thank you thank you ! makes so much sense !! fell asleep at the computer last night at midnight after coming in from the barn ...going out now to work with them !


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

we gave our doe some more oxy and caclium...udder is forming ! baby is insterested in anything but resting. have been getting some replacer in her belly-going to leave them alone for a while. we only have the two mamas and their babies together, so hoping they will have some good down time and be ready to eat when we go back out. really hoping they have done it on their own ! the fecal for the mama showed a few strongyles, not alot, no coccidiosis, and parasites are not over running. not sure if we are going to panacure after kidding or not. what do you guys suggest ? we have 7 more to kid and four of them look like it should have been last week...we used to give tums for calcium the last round of their gestation, but had read that it is bad in other ways....maybe it was not allowing the body to absorb or use potassium...not sure. i am also looking for a general list of vaccines and their timing. i look thru our records but am wondering what is really needed, good, and just shouldn't from experienced goat owners. we used to show years ago-had some national champions....bottom line is always that we love or goaties and they loves us-no need for papers or ribbons ! i have just been out of the loop of it all, any help on the vaccines would be appreciated-i guess i am interested more so as to what you guys do-i know what our vet tells us to give,,,,again looking for advice from those who know that they know what they know from experience !


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

why are you still giving her oxytocin?


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

vet said it would causeher to pass the afterbirth and therefore the milk would come in. we cant get her doe to nurse off her-will be trying again in a bit-if the doe still wont nurse, will put buck born the day before on her- please let me know if there is another way i should have went-we have 7 more to go. hopefully we wont have this situation again, but if so, i will at least know what to and not to do....thank you


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

I rarely use any drugs pre or post kidding. The only time I have was last year with one doe I gave Dexamethasone to induce her. I find its better if their own bodies go through the natural process.

So she hasnt passed the placenta yet? how long has it been since she had the doeling?


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

she kidded last night between 8:30-9:00 i was surprised to see this morning that she hadnt passed it yet. we do have a history of lack of calcium, probly like so many others, when a mama is carrying multiple kids. but this doe had one big doeling. she is a first freshener and did really well. she is uddering up so will hopefully get her doeling to nurse. thank you


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Glad she is filling in the udder.....hopefully ...she will pass her placenta soon....can't wait to see pics... of the new babies.... :thumb:


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

did you see her kid? do you have eyes on her all the time? because she may have delivered it and ate it (mine do sometimes if I dont remove it from their stall)


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

yes, we had to help her kid, and was with her for hours afterward-and the next morning she hadnt passed it all-did this afternoon and we scooped it up and took care of it. we have had goats eat theirs in the past, also. moreso in the older does.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

oh thats good glad she did pass it


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## minibarn (Jul 20, 2010)

:clap: i'm glad all is well! now we need a birth announcement. i love seeing pics of new babies!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

thank God.... :hug: :hi5: :thumb:


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

would love to give a birth announcement of Girly Girl-had a nice size doeling. the doeling died around 3am monday morning...not sure why-had her in the house with us before-hand----but now her mama is pushing-she started yesterday evening. she hadn't eaten/drank much at morning feeding, but we didn't think tqat was so unusual. she all but adopted the little buck that was in with her (and the bucks mama was in the pen with them) at first we thought she was just bleating quietly to us,and her belly rising and lowering with her bleat... then when she threw her leg out to push......we checked and her cervix is closed. her temp is around 100. she had started to shiver so i put my coat on her and she has a heat lamp. she didnt leave the coat on long. we gave calcium subq drenched her with red cell, plain water and electrolytes. she was beginning to dehydrate. we got her up to mover her closer to the heat lamp, so she isn't 'down'. she had been getting penicillun since she kidded. her afterbirth had gotten wrapped around her leg, so wondering if she might have pulled on it and broke it off, leaving some inside. It feels like we have been living in the barn-2 more does have kidded. one had a cute little doe, but was unable to get the other moving passed the nose....she was so tired and bleating, which she never has before, so we checked to see if she might need some help. one leg was bent back, so got it straightened around and oh my ! the kid kept coming and coming...a buck, over 22 inches, large, no eyeballs in the sockets and his body was like a jell inside. there was no odor like he had been dead for a long time. she is also getting penicillun since we did help a bit. never had or heard of anything like this before. another doe kidded on her own with triplet does. we have a big storm coming around wednesday. our girls have a tendancy to kid with the storms, so maybe the other 5 (6) will kid this week. any advice is greatly appreciated. will talk to the vet tomorrow but heading over to farm king-they usually carry more meds than farm & fleet. please offer anything you think we could do until the vet advises us. when all slows down, we are going to glean all the post for an educational course in goat care-i need a lot of 'refreshers' and it will be a great waya for our children to learn ! thank you again (and again, and again....)


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

we have also been giving her probiotic paste--


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## comingsummers (May 6, 2010)

I don't have any advice to give, but I wanted to say how sorry I am to hear about your losses. I hope someone else will come on and give you some ideas.


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

thank you for caring  we are holding on to her and doing the substitute for cpmb and praying her thru till we can get the vet out . we are so concerned about her pushing still. she wont eat or drink much, so we are drenching her....she is on her 7th day of penicillun.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

For the doe who is pushing - keep up the penicillin just in case of a retained placenta. I would give 1cc per 10lbs for 5-7 days. yes its a lot but necessary too.

If the vet can do an ultra sound to see if its another kid (dead maybe?) thats causing her to be down and pushing that would be best. 

Have you tried bumping her?


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

thank you not sure what to do when the vet doesnt think it is an emergency except do what we can. we did get a vet over a few hours ago. Girly Girl was getting dehydrated and weak....he said she has a tear in her vagina right in front of her cervix. normal temp. he gave her saline w/some calcium i.v. dex. vit. b and calcium orally. we had been giving her calcium, a mixture of molasses, karo and water, and drenching plain water since she wasn't interested in drinking much. as far as he could tell, no babies left inside. he is not sure if we can save her. she does seem to like having the other does' babies with her. we also got some 'nutrition drench', dont remember the name and too tired to go out and read it !  she has been getting 6cc 2x penicillun for 5 days and we will continue for 5 more days at least. we will check in with the vet in the morning and they will tell us what to do from here. we have a storm coming that is to bring high winds and up to 12 inches of snow-we get snowed in with 2 inches and some wind! so we want to be sure to have on hand whatever we may need by tuesday-and since we have 5-6 more to kid, well, we just need to have what we may need for a few does at least. thank you again. tami


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

girly girl is crying a bit-good sign. drinking just a little. thinking some banamene (sp)? might be good. our oldest daughter took care of this part of our herd- now she has her own busyness with 3 children and one on the way. i am trying to pick up on it here. i feel more confident being able to bounce things off others who know by experience. thank you. we are waiting for the vet to call back with instructions from here on with our doe. we have a few others losing their mucus plug..  we are staying positive and getting excited over the rest of our girls ! 4 have kidded and the only one with no hard situations was the one who kidded on her own with triplets !! we are now to get up to 18" of snow at the rate of 2 inches per hour, so i have today to get anything we may think of needing for the rest of kidding. we will likely be snowed in for days, though i did have the thought that we could ride our horse to the vets if we needed something we didn't have.....depending on how bad the wind was....so rather than panick, will be planning. did need to ask if it was allowed to copy posts off here. we are likely to loose internet as well, so thought i could save some of the info to have on hand.....thank you again-


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Prayers for her...

Be careful with the Banamine..it can lower her temp..... if she is low to start... I wouldn't use it...but ...if she is normal...it will help boost her appetite and give energy...also good for pain and swelling.... :hug:


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

thank you the vet changed and said no banamine because he had given her dex last night. before we could do anything else for her, she passed away. our youngest daughter laid girly girls head on her lap till she passed. it was an experience. she went downhill fast when we took the little buck out of the pen . her doe had died and she all but had adopted the little fella. i wonder if she mourned and maybe even kept pushing hoping for another baby. ??? i know it sounds silly... none of the vets could say a thought on her pushing. the one vet checked her well and there was nothing... our regular vet said she had seen something like this when the goats had cat potty around their feed. we do have cats in the barn with a littler box but you never really know.....rather than to have an autopsy now, she said if this happens like this again, we will do one . you have all been so helpful. with some down time between kiddings (hopefully) we can gleen on here some more.


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

So sorry she's gone  You did what you could for her :hug:


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## farmgirl42 (Jan 3, 2010)

So sorry to hear of your loss. :hug:


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I am so very sorry.... you lost her...you tried so hard......... that has to be.... so devastating ....my heart goes out to you.....  :hug:


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

We have 2 more does and 1 buck. totaling 7 does, 2 bucks. lilac kidded with triplets on her own ! we have our oldest kidding right now i believe, but when we went out to go to the barn, we got lost in the snow storm and ended up way off the path and had to back track to the house. we have 6ft. plus drifts and it is to keep going like this until tomorrow afternoon. electricity went off once, but was back on soon. praying it stays on all night. will have pictures on tomorrow if internet hold outs ! wondering if anyone else is kidding in this storm? we are illinois between the quad cities and kewanee....?


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## wild hills (Jan 23, 2011)

another large buck-single birth. this fella is bigger than any of the others in the barn born previously ! only help we gave was my husband and i encouraged her..oh, and i helper her push....didnt realize what i was doing till it was all over! she did seem to appreciate it ! have to take a sled to the barn-snow is 4ft plus from here to there-nice when we get there-no wind, and the mixed aroma of horse, hay, goat, and leather...mmmmmm good !


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