# HELP GOAT BIRTH...one dead



## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

I need help, my 2 year old goat, just surprised us this morning with a dead baby goat, he looks mostly bald with lots of fur on head. He looks fully formed, and like a normal goat, just a runt. My doe is acting like nothing is going on, but she hasn't had the placenta come out yet, just the umbilical cord hanging. She is eating and walking around fine. Every once in a while she pushes, but nothing is progressing. She is a smaller type of myotonic goat, still looks like she is pregnant but im not sure if its another baby or placenta. This is her first kidding.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

I'm so very sorry. To me it sounds like an iodine deficiency caused the still birth. Do you have any Bo-Se or Selenium gel that you can give momma to help her push the afterbirth (or other kids) out? It does not cause contractions. It helps with muscle weakness. Others here will have more complete suggestions for you.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

How is she doing? Were you able to get some selenium for her. I know everything is closed today...


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

mariarose said:


> How is she doing? Were you able to get some selenium for her. I know everything is closed today...


Nothing new, she is doing fine though, she is still eating great. I can't find any selenium at my house, I am trying to get in touch with my goat breeder friends.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

I'm glad she's doing well. Your vet should have Bo-Se, if your vet is open tomorrow. Can I ask what loose minerals you use? Be sure it is high in Selenium and Copper, and has Iodine in it.


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## catharina (Mar 17, 2016)

So very sorry to hear about the stillbirth! I'm glad mom is not grieving too badly! You can get selenium at places like Whole Foods or a health food store too. And kelp is a great source of iodine that goats usually like to eat.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

How are things?

Has she dropped her afterbirth?


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

toth boer goats said:


> How are things?
> 
> Has she dropped her afterbirth?


She has dropped her afterbirth, and still is doing great. I have realized the pen is starting to smell... almost like rotten fish. I looked for any other babies and didn't find any.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

catharina said:


> So very sorry to hear about the stillbirth! I'm glad mom is not grieving too badly! You can get selenium at places like Whole Foods or a health food store too. And kelp is a great source of iodine that goats usually like to eat.


That is great to know about kelp! Didn't know that, I will be sure to always have that in stock now. I am also glad mom isn't grieving, might be because it is her first kidding and doesn't know whats going on. She might have known there was something wrong with her kid too. Her twin sister will be kidding soon, she will probably enjoy being an aunt if her sister decides to share!


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## Goat_Scout (Mar 23, 2017)

Does the mama's rear end have a smell to it, or is it entirely the pen?


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Goat_Scout said:


> Does the mama's rear end have a smell to it, or is it entirely the pen?


That was my question, too.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

mariarose said:


> I'm glad she's doing well. Your vet should have Bo-Se, if your vet is open tomorrow. Can I ask what loose minerals you use? Be sure it is high in Selenium and Copper, and has Iodine in it.


Yes, we give our goats salt rocks (the Himalayan style) we get them at TSC. We also get the Billy Block Berry Bush flavored block. I give them Noble Goat, Goat Feed for grain, and they eat saltines for snack/treat every once in a while. They are always fresh on tons of water too. Is there any suggestions on minerals to get them that'll help with this problem? I will get them as soon as possible tomorrow morning.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

Goat_Scout said:


> Does the mama's rear end have a smell to it, or is it entirely the pen?


The hut she delivered in has a strong smell to it, it might be her... I will go check.


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

What is her temp?


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

https://www.amazon.com/Manna-Pro-Go...8&qid=1514419863&sr=8-2&keywords=goat+mineral
Should I be giving them this?


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

I thought it was much later than the time, I will pick up more minerals right now, if you guys have suggestions?


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Keepsake said:


> https://www.amazon.com/Manna-Pro-Go...8&qid=1514419863&sr=8-2&keywords=goat+mineral
> Should I be giving them this?


It is an OK start. No iodine and very little selenium. This one is better

https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/purina-6-phosphorus-cattle-mineral-50-lb?cm_vc=-10005

This one is quite good

https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/p...all-season-cattle-minerals-50-lb?cm_vc=-10005

This one is just awful. Don't buy this

https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/nutrebeef-cattle-mineral?cm_vc=-10005


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Look and compare the tags. You want high copper, selenium, zinc, and iodine.

There's lots more to learn, like calcium/phosphorus ratio, and looking at ingredients. We're happy to help.
but this is a really good place to start. I kept my links to things that are on the TSC site.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

If you are not going to TSC, let us know where you are going and we'll help you sort those choices.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

mariarose said:


> Look and compare the tags. You want high copper, selenium, zinc, and iodine.
> 
> There's lots more to learn, like calcium/phosphorus ratio, and looking at ingredients. We're happy to help.
> but this is a really good place to start. I kept my links to things that are on the TSC site.


I just got back from TSC. I looked at the labels and decided on two new things, I haven't used before. My phone didn't have data so i couldn't get to links you sent. I am now back home and gave the goats a new mineral block. The females are enjoying it right now. I will send links of what I bought


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Did you get any loose minerals? Loose is much better than block.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

I got this block, It has Iodine, copper, and selenium. 
https://www.tractorsupply.com/tsc/product/dumor-goat-block-333-lb
And i had to go with the MannaPro Goat Mineral I linked earlier because I didn't find any other goat minerals. I also didn't know goats could have cattle mineral, awesome to know since they come in larger bags!! I will order one of the ones you suggested, tonight.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

Suzanne_Tyler said:


> Did you get any loose minerals? Loose is much better than block.


Yes, I got the MannaPro loose goat mineral. In the orange bag.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Blocks aren't of any use. That is why loose kept being said.

If your does are enjoying it, please let us know what you got and we'll be happy to analyze it and let you know what we think, and even more important, WHY we think that.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

Now that I know of the ones they can have I will order those bigger bags that have all the ingredients needed.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

mariarose said:


> Blocks aren't of any use. That is why loose kept being said.
> 
> If your does are enjoying it, please let us know what you got and we'll be happy to analyze it and let you know what we think, and even more important, WHY we think that.


Okay, I will keep that in mind. Thank you!!


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

Also do you guys have any advice for my next doe who seems she will be kidding soon? Her kid/kids have dropped, and I can sometimes see them kicking. She is the twin sister to the first girl who had a stillborn. No discharge yet, she doesn't seem to be nesting, or lying down but neither did my first doe.... but i have felt her bag is full.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Sorry, we posted at the same time. I'm familiar with that block. Your does love it because it is candy.

Now, of the bigger bags, which of those do you think you will order? Don't be afraid to go back to the store and examine the tags in person. I picked out some choices really, really quickly. To try to reach you before you went shopping. Now we have a chance to look more closely, not as cursorily, as we did before.

If you have a chance to compare tags in person, that will help guide you in the future.

Do you have a Southern States in your area? How about a Stockdales? Do you have a Redmond dealer?

Do you have a feed store who can carry Sweetlix, or Co-op, or Cargills?

The more we know of your options, the more specific we can be.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Keepsake said:


> Also do you guys have any advice for my next doe who seems she will be kidding soon? Her kid/kids have dropped, and I can sometimes see them kicking. She is the twin sister to the first girl who had a stillborn. No discharge yet, she doesn't seem to be nesting, or lying down but neither did my first doe.... but i have felt her bag is full.


Give her some of the loose minerals you already bought right away. And give her iodized salt as soon as you can. She'll need the iodine. Morton's table salt is better than nothing, so far as iodine is concerned. Kelp meal is better. Some TSCs have access to those pretty blue salt blocks. They have both some iodine and some cobalt in them. That would be a good answer for you right now.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Oh, I forgot to say. TSC will let you order (but not buy in-store) Replamin Plus gel, and the gun to be able to use it. It has much of what you need, but NOT iodine. If you are ordering from TSC anyway, that is an excellent option for you.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

mariarose said:


> Sorry, we posted at the same time. I'm familiar with that block. Your does love it because it is candy.
> 
> Now, of the bigger bags, which of those do you think you will order? Don't be afraid to go back to the store and examine the tags in person. I picked out some choices really, really quickly. To try to reach you before you went shopping. Now we have a chance to look more closely, not as cursorily, as we did before.
> 
> ...


Not familiar with those places. I do know of a place 30 minutes from my house, the next town over that has a larger feed store. It is called Family Center Farm and Home. They have a great selection in store of goat supplies.

https://www.fcfarmandhome.com/


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

mariarose said:


> Give her some of the loose minerals you already bought right away. And give her iodized salt as soon as you can. She'll need the iodine. Morton's table salt is better than nothing, so far as iodine is concerned. Kelp meal is better. Some TSCs have access to those pretty blue salt blocks. They have both some iodine and some cobalt in them. That would be a good answer for you right now.


Didn't see those at my tractor supply but I know they are at the other feed store I mentioned. I will go up there as soon as possible and pick that up. I already have a goat shopping list forming!!


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

As long as the iodized salt is safe, I will put that out there for the goats. I do have Morton's in the pantry. How much should I give her?


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

I can't seem to find a way to search that site. Perhaps you can send me some links to some items you are interested in and we'll let you know what we like and don't like. And why?

Stockdales has an unsearchable site, too. I don't know why great stores will do that. Do you?


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

mariarose said:


> I can't seem to find a way to search that site. Perhaps you can send me some links to some items you are interested in and we'll let you know what we like and don't like. And why?
> 
> Stockdales has an unsearchable site, too. I don't know why great stores will do that. Do you?


No idea, I will send links to some I am interested in.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Keepsake said:


> As long as the iodized salt is safe, I will put that out there for the goats. I do have Morton's in the pantry. How much should I give her?


Put it out free choice, but separate from your minerals that you gave. This is only a stop gap measure, just for right now. We'll figure out better as this goes forward. But right now, your pregnant doe needs iodine.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

mariarose said:


> Put it out free choice, but separate from your minerals that you gave. This is only a stop gap measure, just for right now. We'll figure out better as this goes forward. But right now, your pregnant doe needs iodine.


I will be right back, I bought a new mineral separator because goats have to be goats and break everything! :haha:


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

I'd like to invite you to read a thread I started on minerals. Here it is.

https://www.thegoatspot.net/threads/excellent-minerals-you-know-how-i-love-me-those-minerals.194612/

There are others, and you are welcome to read and follow them. I thought this would give you a good starting point.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

mariarose said:


> I'd like to invite you to read a thread I started on minerals. Here it is.
> 
> https://www.thegoatspot.net/threads/excellent-minerals-you-know-how-i-love-me-those-minerals.194612/
> 
> There are others, and you are welcome to read and follow them. I thought this would give you a good starting point.


Thank you, I will read this. I have a feeling I will be staying up all night because my other pregnant doe is "baaing" and refuses to come out of the hut. She is not interested in the loose
minerals.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Sounds like an exciting night ahead for you. Does she want the iodized salt, or not tonight?


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

mariarose said:


> Sounds like an exciting night ahead for you. Does she want the iodized salt, or not tonight?


I have the iodized salt out there for her, I also have the loose minerals in a separate bowl. She isn't interested in any of that. I gave her some grain she is eating fine!


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

You might want to look into giving kelp instead of iodized salt.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

Suzanne_Tyler said:


> You might want to look into giving kelp instead of iodized salt.


I think she would like that, I don't think I have kelp though. Do you know of any other goat-friendly foods with iodine for tonight? I will get kelp tomorrow.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

I can put extra iodized salt on a saltine... i know she would eat that.


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Keepsake said:


> I think she would like that, I don't think I have kelp though. Do you know of any other goat-friendly foods with iodine for tonight? I will get kelp tomorrow.


I can't think of anything other than a cobalt block. But I don't think one day will really matter.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

Okay, good to know. I gave her saltines drenched in salt, she ate 3 fine.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

A lot of iodized salt did fall of but she ate most.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

Okay guys, Angel, my current pregnant goat, is limping now... there is nothing in the pen that could've hurt her. Could this be sign of labor? She is outside more than I remember she goes out during the night now.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

I *HEARD OF* a doe start limping on a rear leg because of a nerve being pinched by the kid. But I can't see a front limp from a pregnancy. When was the last time her hooves were trimmed? Any signs of foot rot? Limping can also be caused by zinc and/or copper deficiency.


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

mariarose said:


> I *HEARD OF* a doe start limping on a rear leg because of a nerve being pinched by the kid. But I can't see a front limp from a pregnancy. When was the last time her hooves were trimmed? Any signs of foot rot? Limping can also be caused by zinc and/or copper deficiency.


Hooves were trimmed about a week or two ago. She no signs of foot rot.. she was fine ten minutes ago. She is just now limping on her front left.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

She may just have stumbled and twisted it. Pregnancy never made ME clumsy...Oh no, not me...


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## catharina (Mar 17, 2016)

I would give the pregnant doe the things you are giving the other--though if she delivers now it won't do anything for the kids. Did you take away the Hymalayan salt? It looks nice but is really mostly salt, & if they have that they may use it instead of the stuff they need.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

I believe I was toppled by some lint once...


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## Keepsake (Apr 8, 2017)

Yes Himalayan salt has been gone for a week or two now.


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## catharina (Mar 17, 2016)

mariarose said:


> I believe I was toppled by some lint once...


I went to prenatal yoga & got stuck between my big belly & the wall--teacher had to rescue me!


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Now THAT is a word picture!


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## catharina (Mar 17, 2016)

mariarose said:


> Now THAT is a word picture!


 I also nearly got trapped in the bathtub but finally managed to flop over onto my hands & knees & escape. I was all belly--& that wasn't even the twins.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Your fault for being so tiny. No place for the baby to go except out and about.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

@Keepsake She's probably fine. Let us know what's what tomorrow.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Limping? Are her ankles swollen? If so, pregnancy toxemia possibly starting?


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## goatblessings (Jan 6, 2015)

Agree with Toth. Keep a close eye on her ankles all the way up to the knee for any swelling. Check for any heat in the hoof/ankle area. Make sure she is utd on selenium as well for her kids and ease of kidding. You can get ketone strips from Wal-Mart to check.


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