# When slowly weaning off of Mom's milk w/ cowmilk how much?



## SlapHappy (Mar 27, 2014)

I have 2, 2 week old doelings. When I tried to wean them from Mother's milk, I started adding some replacer around 1/3. They got scours. 

I was very proactive and discovered it immediately. I would look around in they hay for poop every time I was in the barn. 

I decided to use baby bottles so I could keep track of how many ounces they were eating. I recorded their intake every feeding.

The weaker kid, (Thunder), was very hard to feed and I started calling her the 3 oz kid. She had a very wimpy suck and would usually stop by the time she ate 3 oz. I fed her often (around every 3 hours depending on how much she did eat.) Her sister was drinking 16 oz. and was very robust in her eating. I fed her around 4 times a day.
Thunder started getting scours in the evening on 4/15. I had introduced the replacer into their milk that day; so I tried to get Pedialyte into her and only could get her to eat 1/2 an ounce. 

On the morning of 4/16. Dixie got scours so I started her on Pedialyte also. She drank 20 ounces.

I was not thrilled about having to put Thunder on Pedialyte because she was so thin. I had been feeding her around every 2 to 4 hours of her mother's milk; as to not let her get dehydrated. 

I started adding a tiny bit of molasses to the pedialyte so she would drink it. She then drank her 3 oz. I fed it to her often (around every hour to 2 hours), then by the end of they day she was drinking more and more at a time. I even fed her that night, all night long (every 2 hours because she was drinking so little at a time.)

I also gave them each 2 cc of Pepto Bismol before I started giving them the Pedialyte, and a 1/4 tsp of baking soda in their bottle. I gave them the Pepto Bismol 3 times a day and the baking soda once a day. Once a day I gave them 1/4 tsp of goat probiotics.

They did well with all of this and played well and other than droopy tails seemed to feel good.

This morning 4/17 they were pooping normally. I would have liked to kept them on Pedialye another day but being as Thunder is so thin I chose to start her on her mother's milk. She drank 5 1/2 ounces. I also gave them both 2 cc of Pepto Bismol, to sooth their tummy's before introducing the milk. I waited till the 2nd feeding to start Dixie on he mother's milk and she drank 8 oz. By the end of the Day Thunder was drinking he Mother's milk as robustly as her sister. I did limit their intake to 8 ounces at a time though as to not upset their tummys.

They both did well throughout the day. I gave them both 1/4 tsp of probiotics and 1/4 tsp of baking soda.

I do not want to use the replacer. I want to use cow's milk instead. I know there are strong opinions on both sides of the replacer vs milk debate. Those who have suggested to me that replacer is better;I do value your opinion. I just have to do what I think is best considering all of my research. Milk seems to be gentler on their tummys and Thunder is just too thin to take a chance again on the replacer. 

What percentage of milk should I introduce into the mother's milk. How many ounces of this mixture should I start them on and what is the best way to work my way up to full cow's milk?


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## MsScamp (Feb 1, 2010)

When transitioning from one type of milk to another, start out at 1/4 new milk mixed with 3/4's old milk. Feed that for 2 to 3 days (you can go longer if you like) then do half and half. Feed for another 2 to 3 days then do 1/4 old and 3/4's new for another 2 to 3 days. Finally all new.


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## SlapHappy (Mar 27, 2014)

MsScamp said:


> When transitioning from one type of milk to another, start out at 1/4 new milk mixed with 3/4's old milk. Feed that for 2 to 3 days (you can go longer if you like) then do half and half. Feed for another 2 to 3 days then do 1/4 old and 3/4's new for another 2 to 3 days. Finally all new.


I was afraid of that. I am only going to have access to one more day of Mommy milk.

The woman has been milking the Mommy for me since I got the babies on Monday 4/13. She wants to stop the day after tomorrow.

I think I will tell her what you said and offer to pay her a very good price for the milk. If she could just do it another few days or so; it would be very beneficial for them.


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## MsScamp (Feb 1, 2010)

Cow's milk is not as rich, nor does it contain as much butterfat as either goat's milk or milk replacer so you might be ok if you just mix them half and half for a day, then 3/4's and 1/4. I changed my kids from Super Lamb (30% fat) to ADM milk replacer(28% fat) earlier this year. I did the 1/4 to 3/4's, but only for 1 day and I had no problems with scours, upset tummies, or going off feed. Just something to think about.


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## SlapHappy (Mar 27, 2014)

MsScamp said:


> Cow's milk is not as rich, nor does it contain as much butterfat as either goat's milk or milk replacer so you might be ok if you just mix them half and half for a day, then 3/4's and 1/4. I changed my kids from Super Lamb (30% fat) to ADM milk replacer(28% fat) earlier this year. I did the 1/4 to 3/4's, but only for 1 day and I had no problems with scours, upset tummies, or going off feed. Just something to think about.


Thanks.

If I successfully get them weened on to cows milk for a while; do you think I should slowly start adding butter milk to it.

I know some give cows milk and butter milk and some do not.

In my little town; the only buttermilk I have been able to find is low fat buttermilk. Being from the South; I find that very odd. LOL


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## MsScamp (Feb 1, 2010)

You're going to have to add something to it to raise the fat content - especially if you're planning on using store-bought milk. Babies need the fat to do well. I have never tried to raise bottle babies on cow's milk, so I'm not going to be much help on what to add. I was going to suggest a cup of heavy whipping cream, but that might be too much fat. Hopefully someone who has used cow's milk will chime in and be able to help you.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I have used plain milk and my kids did fine. I have dairy goats though. You will need to feed more than the 10% body weight. There is also a mixture of buttermilk and condensed milk but don't know the measurements on that.


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## SlapHappy (Mar 27, 2014)

Someone (I can't remember who @ the moment), said you should weigh them then multiply that weight by 16 to get weight in ounces, then multiply that be 10-12, (I did it by 12), to get how many ounces to feed them per day.

They each weigh 10 pounds. If my calculations are correct @ 4 feedings a day; they should get 8 ounces a feeding? I am horrible @ math and just want to double check.

I put 1/4 cows milk in their bottles (2 oz). Does that sound right.


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## SlapHappy (Mar 27, 2014)

If they do well w/ that today. I am thinking of adding 1/4 buttermilk tomorrow. That would be 1/2 mother's milk and 1/2 cow/buttermilk. Does that sound right?


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## SlapHappy (Mar 27, 2014)

I am also going to ask the store managers in the area to start stocking whole buttermilk.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

No. You pour off a certain amount of milk and then add a certain amount of buttermilk and condensed milk. You will have to do a search on that recipe. You don't want to give them too much buttermilk.


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## kc8lsk (Jan 10, 2014)

If you want to go to plain cows milk you can just give them a little more last year I raised all my baby boys on plain cows milk the girls got goats milk only and they grew just the same. They all were stunted last year because I didn't give them enough milk but that is another story. No matter what just make sure you give them enough milk this year I followed a different schedule and my new babies are almost as big as last year's baby's already at 11 weeks. If you want I could post a schedule of my bottle feedings this year just make it your own and don't forget to check your babies often.


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## Haviris (Oct 7, 2007)

I use regular whole milk, nothing added, and I feed as much as they want at each feeding. Never had a stunted kid. I had a kid (nigerian) with sore mouth that barely ate, she was like your Thunder, and even she grew out ok.


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## SlapHappy (Mar 27, 2014)

Haviris said:


> I use regular whole milk, nothing added, and I feed as much as they want at each feeding. Never had a stunted kid. I had a kid (nigerian) with sore mouth that barely ate, she was like your Thunder, and even she grew out ok.


Maybe Thunder had a sore mouth and I didn't know it.


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## sbaker (Nov 11, 2012)

I'm using whole milk for my 1 1/2 week old right now. I've heard to take about two cups of milk out of the gallon, then add one cup of buttermilk and one can of evaporated milk. So far my guys have been doing great on this.


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## lottsagoats1 (Apr 12, 2014)

I use either goats milk or goat milk replacer on my kids and they grow out just fine. Right now the 3 bottle kids are on 50/50 goat milk/kid milk replacer and you can't tell the bottle kids from the dam raised kids. I feed my kids as much as they will eat, up to 20 ounces, 4 times a day. 

I found that for me, the trick to using milk replacer is to use only replacer made for kids (or lambs but you have to add copper somehow because lamb replacer has none) and make sure it's made with milk products, not soy.


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## SlapHappy (Mar 27, 2014)

Today I fed them each 8 to 10 ounces of 4 ounces milk then the rest Mommy milk, w/ 1/tsp baking soda, 3 times. They have seemed to to well w/ that. Tomorrow I will be giving the 1/2 milk and 1/2 Mommy milk. Then the next day I will no longer have Mommy milk so they will be on milk. If I see they are doing ok w/ that; I will start increasing their intake till they get to the point of drinking all they want up to 20 ounces 4 times a day. I am trying to do everything as gradual as possible because if they get scours again; I do not have Mommy milk. I will also be doing as sbaker suggested, "take about two cups of milk out of the gallon, then add one cup of buttermilk and one can of evaporated milk".

They seem to be doing very well; playing a lot, wagging their tails and such. I don't like limiting their milk but I just want to be very careful and not mess up their tummy's. Once they are on the milk full time, being fed more and, doing well, I will be soooo relieved, knowing they are eating well and thriving. 

Thanks for all of the advice.


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## SlapHappy (Mar 27, 2014)

I want to give an update.

Everything worked like a charm. I made sure to add 1/4 tsp of baking soda to every feeding and give them 1/4 teaspoon of probiotic a day.

The woman who gave me the goats, called yesterday and told me a couple of other goats gave birth, on of which is producing way too much milk so she is giving me more goats milk and it even has some colostrum in it; so they are back on half cow milk and half goat milk.


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## SlapHappy (Mar 27, 2014)




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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Glad they are doing well. Only do 1 bottle per day with baking soda though. Plus you only need to do a pinch of baking soda. 

Are these boys? Once they are older and you are worrying more about UC, don't keep baking soda out. It deactivates ammonium chloride.


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## MsScamp (Feb 1, 2010)

Awwwww, they are darlling!


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## SlapHappy (Mar 27, 2014)

ksalvagno said:


> Glad they are doing well. Only do 1 bottle per day with baking soda though. Plus you only need to do a pinch of baking soda.
> 
> Are these boys? Once they are older and you are worrying more about UC, don't keep baking soda out. It deactivates ammonium chloride.


I haven't been giving them baking soda @ all the last few days.

Thanks for the tip. I was unsure on how much to give them. Should I continue w/ baking soda but just a pinch a day?


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

If they are doing fine, I wouldn't bother. I only use baking soda when I feel there is a tummy issue, otherwise I don't give it to the goats.


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## SlapHappy (Mar 27, 2014)

They are now 27 days old and so far so good. 

I love them very much.


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