# Udder Question



## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

I'm just curious how long you let your does fill up w/ milk in order to evaluate their udder/take udder pics? I always thought 12 hours but what does everyone else do?? I'm just curious. . . . Thanks!


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

When first freshened, if you bottlefeed, 12 hours should be enough, though I've seen does at super capacity and leaking at just 8 hours. If the kids are new and are being raised by mom, I wouldn't separate them until they are 2 weeks old to judge the dams udder...12 hours is as long as I've gone with my girls.


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## KW Farms (Jun 21, 2008)

I've always heard you wait 12 hours...or overnight.


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

For some reason, it seems like some people wait longer. Is that true?


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

I am bad about getting up in the mornings.... so sometimes it's more than twelve hours. But I know my girls wont get overfull. If it is their first time filling up then I give 12 hours or less so that I know how full they are going to get. Xcell at her peak needed sooner than twelve hours, now she could only be milked once a day if I wanted.

Also for shows the girls do get filled longer than twelve hours so that they are full. I don't overbag, but some people do and it looks sooo uncomfortable. Judges are supposed to take off for it, but I haven't seen it yet.


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Thank you. I don't want to over-fill udders, it does look terribly uncomfortable! I'm looking to buy a new buckling next year and I want one from lines w/ lots of milk and beautiful udders. But I don't want to look at a gorgeous doe w/ a huge udder and then find out she hasn't been milked in two days!! I want it to look like that at 12 hours! (or so)  Maybe I'll just have to ask the breeder when the pic was taken, how many hours of milk, and hope they are honest. 

Oh, the breeder I'm looking at right now is Poppy Patch Farm in WA. They have some beautiful goats!! I like Jane Seymour. She will be bred to a buckling from NC PromisedLand. This buckling is out of Palimony and Legacy Sunday. What do you guys think? Any other does on their website that would be a nice choice?


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Oh, here's their site: http://www.poppypatchfarm.com


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

jane seymour is a beautiful doe!! i saw her once when they still lived in ca i would do it.. even better if the buck is out of palimony


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

I think she is so beautiful too!! I'm going to send a deposit and hope to goodness she has more than one buckling as there is one already reserved from her.


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

shining sand is a beautiful doe too but she is being bred to monty.. i love monty but he's not along the lines of that breeding. semisweet is beautiful! but i am partial to her dam line.. haha she is being bred to palimony's kid too so maybe you could say, if jane doesn't have two bucks i want one from semisweet?? :shrug: 

but jane is tops


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## sparks879 (Oct 17, 2007)

it really depends on what you want to improve in the next few years, my two favorite does of theires are #1 betty boop< i really like how smoothly attached her udder is all the way around, she has a nice medial and a really long smooth foreudder. and #2 merily monroe for her general apearance, she is ver uphill and smooth very high and tight in her withers pretty head and long neck. both does have strong feet and legs.
beth


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Well, most of my does excel in general appearance and dairy character so I mostly want to keep that strong in their genes and breed to improve udders, mainly capacity, teat size/placement, and higher/wider rear udders. I do also love Semi Sweet, she is beautiful! For some reason, I don't care so, so much for Shining Sand, she's beautiful but her udder doesn't look quite as capacious as Jane or Semi Sweet. Marilyn Monroe would probably be my next choice for a buck. 

What do u think of Chickadee??


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## sparks879 (Oct 17, 2007)

chickadee is nice, i would like to see her foreudder a little longer, but she has a nice medial and nice sized/placed teats. I wouldnt worry so much about capacity as i would nice attachments. Capacity is nice to have and it is on the scorecard, but you need to have the attachments first to hold the capacity there. i good quality doe will get the capacity as she gets older. More capacity visually doesnt always mean more milk either. Look for a doe who milks down to nothing, no tissue there. that means there is more room for milk. A lot of does that show a lot of capacity will havea lot of tissue when milked out.
beth


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Oh, okay. Well, I love Betty Boop's udder but her conformation doesn't thrill me. They say on the website that she could be more dairy and have a longer body. So. . . . u think Marilyn Monroe is a better choice than Jane? She is Jane's daughter, so I'll still be getting those lines.


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

I'm thinking I'll get a doeling from them as well. Maybe one out of Pocahontas or Not Quite an Angel (both of them are daughters of Betty Boop). They said that these two does have a longer bone pattern than their dam and hopefully they'll get her incredible udder. Plus, one of them will be bred to a Buttin' Heads buck and the other to Playboy.


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## sparks879 (Oct 17, 2007)

I agree that she could be longer bopdied, but she has done well in the show ring. I know there is some stiff compition at the puyallup fair. I have showed there many times myself. I think a doe out of one of bettys daughters would be a wonderful adition. 
What i would so is pick one thing commen on the majority of your does that you would like to improve and then get abuck based on that trait. Sometimes genetics click and sometimes they dont. Even with does out of the same litter. I had a set of triplet does two years ago, one was absolutly awsome. She won as a int kid all over the place, beating out many kids coming from excellent lines (not that hers were anything to sneeze at) Her two sisters i ended up keeping. Sadly i lost tango the nicest of the three to sudden bloat. But rhythm and trill freshened this past spring very different. trill had nice sized easy to milk teats and a tremendous rear udder, but had a large pocket. her sister rhythm had a smooth foreudder tiny teats and a decent rear udder. Everytime you breed its luck of the draw you never know what youre going to get. 
beth


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Yeah, that's very true. The hard part of breeding animals. . . . 

So, would you pick a buck from Jane or Marilyn Monroe? I'll ask them which one has a better rump as that is something that I would like to see improved in some of our does. Actually, I'd like for a couple of our does to have a little more width in the hocks too, they're not bad but not perfect.


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## goatnutty (Oct 9, 2007)

I personnaly wouls pick one out of Jane if those were my options. To me she just seems like the better doe to me. :?


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Yeah, I do really like the looks of Jane. Marilyn is going to be bred to Twin Creeks BW Rebel W/ Out a Cause *S - This buck is super nice and has proven daughters that are wonderful milkers, I think he has two that are permanent champions now too. Jane will be bred to a really nice buck but he's not proven w/ milking daughter yet. . . . decisions, decisions. . . :? :wink:


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Oh, what about Lil' Miss Sunshine?? They rave about her udder on their website and even kept a buckling from her this year, she's a FF too.


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## sparks879 (Oct 17, 2007)

hmm thatsa tough one, merilyn and jane have some trade offs. I like jans rump better i like ehr dairy chacter, her neck is longer and she has a more refined head. However i think her dam has better teaat placement. 
Lil miss sunshine i think is an outstanding doe in all aspects. I really like her a lot. Her sire monty is an outstanding buck that has done some outstanding things for the nigerian world. I think a buck out of her would add dairy chacter width and better attachments. Her damns line is nothing to sneeze at either.
beth


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

im still all for a buck from jane. to me she is the most complete package/ i would get a doe out of sunshine or semisweet


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## sparks879 (Oct 17, 2007)

Im a big fan of lil miss sunshines pedigree, I really like montys sire and dam. I like her a lot more then jane, jane is a lot heavier then i would like, it could be excess fleshing but theres kujust something there i dont like. she has a short neck and seems thick through the back end. I would like to see her more level her hips more defined cleaner about the stifle and toes pointing more straight. I agree that she has a nice udder, but she just doesnt seem very dairy to me. I think you could potentially gain a lot from using a buck out of her but i think you could possibly lose quite a bit in the dairy department. Something all of your does seem to excell in already. 
this is just my personal opinion  :shrug:


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Is it just me or does Marilyn's udder look uneven? This is going to sound terrible but we were kind of hoping for a blue-eyed buck, simply because blue-eyed babies are easy to sell. I like Lil Miss Sunshine though. I love Marilyn's rump, looks perfect! Just about all of their does look awesome! It's so hard to decide. . . . another one I just saw was Poppy Seed, she has two GCH legs and they're pretty sure she'll finish next year.


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## sparks879 (Oct 17, 2007)

I thought so too for a minute but i think its the way she is set, if you look you can see the hock on the left side but not the right meaning that leg could of been further back then the other, you also cant see the attachment on that side which makes me wonder if she was standing with one leg slight back further or uneven ground. I like poppy seed too. I know blue eyes sell well in the nigies. I have always had alpines and personally dont liek the blue eyes nearly as much as brown.
beth


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## goatnutty (Oct 9, 2007)

I thought Marilyn's udder looked uneven to but I looked at it and think it has something to do with the way she is set up.


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

to me jane's neck is just as long as sunshine's. i admire jane's depth of body and her capacity throughout. she has great legs and though it doesn't count for much, her head is beautiful and her ear set is nice. i wish some of my does had heads like that haha. but if she is bred to palimony's kid i think the babies will inherit nice things from that side and will be a little more dairy in type than mom but for me a buck from that cross would do wonders


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## goatnutty (Oct 9, 2007)

I personally wouls still go with Jane and Playboy even though he is young. His dam and sire seem to be very nice goats and he looks to be nice himself. Not to mention I like Jane better than Marilyn Monroe. I would get a buck from that breeding and a doe from Not Quite An Angel because them the buck and doe won't be half brother/sisters.


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

I do like Jane's udder a lot better than Marilyn's, but her rump is more steep than her daughter. I would mainly like to correct udders in our herd, but rumps are also very important too. . . . I'm thinking I might stick w/ Jane but since a buck is already reserved from her, then have Marilyn or Sunshine as second choice. Jane didn't settle last year, so hopefully she does this year.


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

true her rump seems steep but she looks underposed in the picture too, and hopefully playboy can fix that


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Yeah, her rear legs look kind of scrunched underneath her. I can't tell what Playboy's rump is like but his dam's seems nice. His dam has some wonderfully long teats! Hope he passes that on to his kids!


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

yes his momma is purty! haha


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

VERY purty!  They said she freshened w/ the highest, widest rear udder of their herd, so that's pretty awesome!


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## Muddy Creek Farm (Oct 5, 2007)

I've seen SunDay in person, several times actually. I just have to say my FAVORITE doe of theirs is Zoey - I LOVE that doe. Everytime I see her she drops my jaw. Another favorite doe of mine is LTE Callilily, I would have to say that she is probably the nicest goat I have ever seen  Ok, sorry for the rambling!!

I like Semi Sweet the best of their does BTW.. :greengrin:


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## sparks879 (Oct 17, 2007)

I am in love with Zoey as well. Judging from the picture she looks to have a higher and wider rear udder then snday, but its hard to tell from a picture. Zoey oozes with dairy charecter and over all just correctect confirmation. She looks like an alpine in miniature...which is what i look for in nighies. She is long deep level has a beautiful head and neck and is very striking. Her udder couldnt be nicer, it is very plaesing in shape and size, she has ideal teat placement and size. probably one of the nicest foreudders and medials on a nigie that i have ever seen.
beth


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

ok I was just looking at the pictures etc but I dont see a Zoey :shrug:


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## sparks879 (Oct 17, 2007)

http://www.promisedlandfarm.net/Zoey.htm
beth


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

confused :? I thought you were talking about Poppy Patch not Promised Land :scratch:


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

She is gorgeous!! Wow!  I like her a lot! 

Stacey: The original post was about Poppy Patch, but then we started talking about their new buckling, Playboy's genetics. He is from the PromisedLand herd and we're just admiring some of their animals. :greengrin:


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

oh, I just cant keep up :GAAH:


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## Muddy Creek Farm (Oct 5, 2007)

And if you can believe it, Zoey is even more beautiful in person  I see alot of similarities between her and CowGirl (half sisters) but Zoey excels her in the udder department, although they have alot of the same strengths.. I saw her finish as well, Zoey has always caught my eye.


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Chelsey: So, if you would pick a buck kid from Poppy Patch, you would get one from Semi Sweet? What do u think of Jane Seymour or Marilyn Monroe? Just curious what your thought was. . . .


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## Muddy Creek Farm (Oct 5, 2007)

Well I love Semi Sweet the best, then Thumbelina (really like her), Jane and then Marilyn. Of course whenever you are judging from a photo they could look totally different in "real life".

Hope that helps!!! :greengrin:


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Okay, I am still so very lost in deciding who to get a buck from. . . . :? I want to improve overall attachment, capacity, teat length and placement, (pretty much everything to do w/ udders!) Also, levelness in the rump and shoulders. Blue eyes would be a neat plus for selling kids. I don't really want to spend more than $300-350 (but will if we have to).

Based on that, what do u guys think? It's so hard because everyone has such different opinions but I'm so TORN with making decisions! :help:


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

and you definetly want one from poppy patch??

i would say iff you were going to spend more to go to pholia farm.. their one place i plan on getting a buck from in a few years. she used to live like an hour from me but her goats are pretty much used for milkers, so udders are amazing.. 

go to pholiafarm.com and look up harriet.. i looove that doe


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## Muddy Creek Farm (Oct 5, 2007)

Sorry about the difficult decision  I have no idea about Poppy Patch's prices, but just try to get the best buck you can afford, it is sooooo worth it!!


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

i agree with chelsey.. buy the best you can. he's half the herd


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Yeah, I definitely want to do that! Another breeder I was looking at is Caprinos: http://www.quailrunhollow.com
They are a new breeder close by w/ a lot of goats, they had quite a few shipped from Ohio. . . . they have a buck from Pholia Farm too. My favorite doe of theirs is Vanity Fair, but no udder pics. . . .

It's between Poppy Patch, Caprinos, and Pholia Farm. For some reason, I favor Poppy Patch. . . . I like that they have really popular bloodlines shipped in from all over the US.

Thanks for the help everyone! I'll figure it out eventually!


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

well don't rush into anything, and were all here for help

the other herd has a doe from jane in milk so you can see the kinds of udders thrown
and their buck riopt is the littermate to the doe i absolutely love harriet at pholia farms

i dont think you could go tooo wrong with any


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Thanks everyone. . . . I just was looking at Marilyn's picture - is that moonspots or no? I honestly have a hard time distinguishing moonspots. . . . What do u think? I like her coloring and am kind of leaning more towards her now. . . . love her foreudder, very smooth.


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Are they moonspots??? :wink: Anyone?


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

i dont see any


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## capriola-nd (Jul 6, 2008)

Okie, thanks! So, those spots are just regular ol' spots?


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

i think so, but i'm just as bad at it as you are haha


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