# Horns and No horns in the same herd?



## JanetM (Mar 13, 2013)

As I have posted recently we just brought home a new little guy Clancy-4months old. We have 2 year old pygmy/ND crosses already. When we went to get Clancy the intention was to get 2...but someone had already placed a deposit on the other horned goat. All of ours have horns and we have never had any issues with that. We have been looking for another horned buddy for Clancy without any luck-our goats are pets so we don't really want to spend hundreds of dollars on one.

Anyway...Clancy had a buddy at his original home that is still available BUT he is naturally polled(both Clancy and his buddy will actually be bigger than our current 1yr wethers when grown)...would it be very unfair to the no horn goat to put him in with ours?

How many have mixed horn/no horn herds? and are there more problems? 

Thank you for everyones input.


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## Texaslass (May 15, 2013)

I've kind of been wondering this too. 
I think it depends on the goats themselves, their personalities. Some goats with horns could be mean and try to beat up one without horns, while others may not care. We've had Nigerians with horns in the same pen with disbudded Alpines, and they usually left each other alone, but that could've been a size difference.
Now I have my first disbudded Nigerian doe, and I wasn't sure I should get other Nigerians with horns and put them with her. She'a also pretty small for a ND though, and she doesn't seem like the type to dominate, so that's also part of the reason I'd be worried about her getting beat up.
I'm kind of thinkng out loud here, hope I said something helpful.


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

I know breeders who have a mixed herd and no problems, but it does depend on the goats.


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## red78232 (Mar 22, 2013)

JanetM said:


> As I have posted recently we just brought home a new little guy Clancy-4months old. We have 2 year old pygmy/ND crosses already. When we went to get Clancy the intention was to get 2...but someone had already placed a deposit on the other horned goat. All of ours have horns and we have never had any issues with that. We have been looking for another horned buddy for Clancy without any luck-our goats are pets so we don't really want to spend hundreds of dollars on one.
> 
> Anyway...Clancy had a buddy at his original home that is still available BUT he is naturally polled(both Clancy and his buddy will actually be bigger than our current 1yr wethers when grown)...would it be very unfair to the no horn goat to put him in with ours?
> 
> ...


 I think it depends on each goat also. We have one ND doe w no horns and the other 5 have horns, 3 Pygmy, 1 nd wether & 1 boer/kiko wether. She holds her own w all of them.


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## JanetM (Mar 13, 2013)

Do the goats actually know they don't have horns?

I have read they head butt with and without horns...so it wouldn't it basically be the same either way...I mean if you have a goat with a bullying personality then it wont matter to that goat if he has horns or not or if the others have them or not correct? Just talking myself thru this.

And at this point its been 3wks would Clancy realize this is guy is his old buddy?


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## xymenah (Jul 1, 2011)

I had three with horns and one without at one point. The hornless doe(her name was Bell) was the queen. She was a calm queen, not aggressive at all. However I had one doe(her name was Betty) I had to sell because she tried to kill Bell the moment she saw her. And by kill I really do mean kill. Betty lifted Bell off the ground with her horns and sent her flying into the air. Once she hit the ground she skid a few feet on her side then Betty proceeded to gore her in the gut. This all happened within seconds of Bell entering the pen so be careful when introducing them.


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## OakHollowRanch (Jun 6, 2013)

We ended up selling our disbudded Nubian buckling to someone with 5 horned does. I hope they are watching carefully to make sure he is okay!


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## Friggs (May 9, 2013)

I've had mixed Nigerians and never had any issues, both with does and bucks. They've had plenty room and not been overcrowded.


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## peggy (Aug 11, 2010)

I have a hornless herd but have had a couple wethers that ended up with horns. Believe me..... they knew that they had horns and knew how to use them. I find that they have a more bossy disposition than the other goats. I sold the one and the one I am keeping will be banded after the bug season. Just my thoughts, I would not have horned and hornless together. Although you will get many answers from others that have raised them successfully. But then I prefer hornless goats for various reasons.


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces (Apr 7, 2013)

I do not mix horned goats with dehorned goats. I have seen horned goats rip other goats eyes out, some are mean and will bust your leg, horned goats know they have them, and most will use them to their advantage.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

xymenah said:


> I had three with horns and one without at one point. The hornless doe(her name was Bell) was the queen. She was a calm queen, not aggressive at all. However I had one doe(her name was Betty) I had to sell because she tried to kill Bell the moment she saw her. And by kill I really do mean kill. Betty lifted Bell off the ground with her horns and sent her flying into the air. Once she hit the ground she skid a few feet on her side then Betty proceeded to gore her in the gut. This all happened within seconds of Bell entering the pen so be careful when introducing them.


 That is awful


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

I think it depends a lot on the personalities, but also the type of horns they have too...my older Nubian I bought disbudded as an adult, my younger nubian is naturally polled, and my Kinder is horned (avatar pic). But her horns curve back over her head and neck...they do not stick straight up...

She does know she has them but she is a lot smaller than my oldest nubian and my younger one knows her place...so it works out ok...

As you can see in my siggy pics, Dallas has a lot bigger horns than Booker. They work it out, but Dallas LOVES to use them on Booker...just to "show off"..


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## Kaneel (Oct 7, 2012)

I currently have two hornless Pygmy/ND does in with two horned Boer mix does(their horns are tipped). Let me tell you, they know they have horns, and they will use them. However, it all depends on personality. My littler Boer doe had been bullied most of her life by a huge wether that had been in the pen with her, so when he left and she got the whole pen to herself, her confidence went through the roof, which caused her to get very territorial against other goats. Now she is a huge bully to the little ones, however she doesn't dare try and butt my other Boer doe. My other, bigger doe, has been spoiled rotten her whole life. She hardly bullies the little ones, except for when they have something she wants, or when they are in her way. 

Now, just today, I introduced my 10 week old disbudded ND doeling into their pen for the first time, and things went quite well! She has a very dominating personality, so my big doe never touched her, and my little boer doe let her be for the most part, which is odd since she goes out of her way to be mean to the pygmies. Of coarse she tried to hook her with her horns, however the doeling knows to avoid them, and comes right back with a tail wagging butt! I think she confuses them, she is so little, and they know she is a baby, yet she's so feisty! They don't quite know what to do with her so they all kind of leave her alone lol.

So, the lesson here is, it depends on the personality


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## Texaslass (May 15, 2013)

They're so cute, those little feisty ones!  I had a tiny little ND named Pochahontas. I got her for my B-day one year. She was three weeks old and weighed like 4 lbs (I'm just guessing, I don't really know how much she weighed) amd she tried to head butt our German shepherd! It was so cute to watch such a tiny thing being so tough. She also tried to but a rabbit we had a the time. Poca. was in a playpen and we put the rabbit in with her to see what she'd do, and Bam! So we didn't leave him in there.


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## MsScamp (Feb 1, 2010)

JanetM said:


> How many have mixed horn/no horn herds? and are there more problems?
> 
> Thank you for everyones input.


It depends on the goat, but my herd is both horned and non horned and I have had no problems because of it. 6 out of 40 does, 2 out of 26 yearlings, and 4 out of 34 kids do not have horns. 3 of the non-horned girls are up near the top of the herd hierarchy, and they take no crap off anyone!


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## silveira_ranch (Jun 14, 2013)

I have a mixed herd and they are fine.


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## lottsagoats (Dec 10, 2012)

I had a mixed herd of disbudded full sized dairy goats, Nigerian Dwarfs and horned Boers. One old Nigerian doe was the herd queen and ruled with an iron hoof. The disbudded does had heads as hard as the horned Boers and could take care of themselves against the horns.


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## JanetM (Mar 13, 2013)

Kaneel said:


> (their horns are tipped).


what does "tipped" mean?

Willie my oldest wether has horns that go up & then curve to the outside...but he has such a laid back personality I have never seen him "use" them-even on Clancy the new one or when Ducky was brought home...Willie acutally seems to know Clancy is little as when he does butt him he seems to do it with alot less force then when he does Ducky.

Ducky's horns curve back to his head and looks like that are gonna go down from there not out. He is the bully-he is actually getting better but I have been very consistent with getting onto him when he is being to rough with the little one.


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## Texaslass (May 15, 2013)

Pretty sure it means to cut the very tip of the horn off so it's not sharp.


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## JanetM (Mar 13, 2013)

Thank you all for the responses and I'm pretty sure we are going to go get Clancys polled buddy...

Our older 2 are doing better with him-even Ducky-he was/is the bully(we continue to monitor him & if he gets alittle too much step in & stop him)...but Clancy still wants to be "with" them-eating, laying & sleeping...he has his own safe area away from them for sleeping & eating...but he will still stand on the edge & watch them eat and "talk" to them he wants to be included. 

Im thinking with his own buddy it wont be such an issue and Ducky might not feel so threatened by Clancy. And when the older 2 do finally accept him I dont see him being "buddies" with them I just see them tolerating him. 

Please if my thinking is wrong...somebody correct me-I just want to make sure Im doing right by them. I would rather re-home Clancy then have him be lonely, miserable and always just watching from the outside so to speak.


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## Texaslass (May 15, 2013)

I think they would be fine together. Just take it slow when you introduce them.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

Didn't you say they were together before? I bet they'll remember each other...I had some chickens that I sold to a woman in the city. Well, she got caught after 4-5 months and told they had to go....she brought them back and my entire flock not only acted like they could care less, but the hens went to roosting in the EXACT same spots they had before they left!

Anyway, what i'm saying is...I'm pretty sure a goat is at least as smart as a chicken


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## JanetM (Mar 13, 2013)

NyGoatMom said:


> Didn't you say they were together before? I bet they'll remember each other
> Anyway, what i'm saying is...I'm pretty sure a goat is at least as smart as a chicken


yes they were buddies at his original home...we just didnt get him then coz of the no horn thing.


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## Texaslass (May 15, 2013)

NyGoatMom said:


> Didn't you say they were together before?


I meant go slow introducing the polled one to the others in the herd.


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## Pixie13 (Mar 2, 2013)

We have a mixed herd. They all get along really well.


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