# introduced new goat today, he wont settle down



## naomilove (Jan 10, 2017)

Hey guys! Ive only ever had a couple goats and all have been related. I had to put my one female to sleep two weeks ago and wanted to get a companion for her brother (pygmy wether) since he is now all alone. So i finally got the new fence set up today and brought the new goat home (nubian wether). Mine (lundy) is acting very dominant and mean towards the new boy (laddie) which i expected until they get used to each other. Which is why i gave them seperate pastures. However laddie will not stop screaming, he has made himself hoarse from yelling for home. Is this normal? If so how long till he settles? I feel so bad for him. I got him from my neighbors so he can hear his old herd and see the house.... im not sure if thats better for him or worse.

sorry this is longwinded. Thanks for any advice in advance !


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## Luckthebuck234 (Jul 15, 2015)

I had the same experience when I brought home one of my ND does, she was a year old but missed her momma.  They had always been together. It took a week or so before she finally gave up looking for her old herd, after that she became best friends with our doe and they sort of bonded together. He probably just needs time to realize they aren't coming back, probably a couple days to a week(depending). We would do sessions with them together before actually putting them together full time, it seems like you are doing that so good job.:thumbup: He should be fine and most likely they should be good buddies soon


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## catharina (Mar 17, 2016)

Maybe try some distraction--big leafy branches to chew on or extra attention from you?


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## naomilove (Jan 10, 2017)

Thanks! The only goats ive ever brought home before where lundys mom and older brothers but they settled in immediately. But they were also from an extremely abusive situation, so they might have just been to spent to worry anymore. Really thought i was doing something wrong with this guy! I built his new pasture up against the old one so the can sniff and touch if the want to but can get away if needed. Ive also only had pygmies before, this guy looks like a giraffe to me! :slapfloor:


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Are they the same age? Size?

It is normal pecking order, like head butting? Or are they, penning up legs, slamming into the side, drawing blood?
If so, then it may not work. 

Normal slamming of the horns and top goat behavior, is normal. All outsiders are looked at as unwelcome for a while.

At feeding time, the behavior is worse, so separating feed area's like putting 2 different spots to eat, so if one goat is pushed off, the other can go to the next spot to eat.

It can take time, and best to let them hash it out, only if it is normal pecking order behavior. 
Some goats slam pretty hard and you think oh no, they are hurting each other, not always. You may see a little bit of blood around the horns or torn ears from being slammed and trapped from horn slamming. But this can be OK. 
With intact bucks, it can look brutal, but they soon will adapt and know who is boss within the day, minutes or hours. If it gets too out of hand and it has been a day with no resolution, they cannot be kept together. 

What are they doing to concern you, may I ask?


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## naomilove (Jan 10, 2017)

They are not the same size, my boy is a large pygmy maybe 85 lbs and the new guy is a Nubian... if I had to guess 145lbs? Not really sure. My pygmy is just grunting at him and stomping lol I guess to me that's being mean. But I haven't put them together yet off lead the have two separate pastures for now and a sturdy cow panel between where they can touch without killing my fence. My boy has butted the fence one or two times and butted the Nubian once when we introduced them on leads. But I guess it's just normal pecking order. Should I continue to feed my pygmy first and then the Nubian? To show jes still the main man? Lol. I was really worried about the size difference, but when I took mine to get a buddy this is the only one he seemed to like out of 50 some odd goats he met. Yes I'm weird lol but I wouldn't want someone to force a roommate on me without my approval, so it's only fair he got to choose haha :wink: but the are close to the same age, my boy is 8 and the new guy is 7, both wethers.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

No need to separate the goats, just separate feeding spots. Unless the top goat doesn't allow the other to eat at all.
One goat can only push the other off the feed, one spot at a time. So, if it is in 1 spot, the other has no chance to eat at all. 

Yeah, size difference is a lot, hopefully they will be OK.
Do the both have horns or not?

Regular pecking order is fine. They will do it on and off. So if you have them together, watch them for a little while to see how they will be. I hate when they spar but, that is part of a goats character. I seems violent for a while, as you watch you just want to stop them, but if they are not penning legs or causing real harm, they should get the pecking order finished really soon. You will know within the day or hours, if they will get along. I have had my bucks so out of breath, both strong headed, but finally after getting tired and knowing defeat, the younger buck gave in.


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## naomilove (Jan 10, 2017)

Laddie has some sort of eye goo going on, I wanted to treat him before putting them together in case ots contagious.

Lundy (pygmy) has horns and laddie (Nubian) does not. Laddie is a giant lap dog and very submissive to lundy. So I think after initial introductions it will work out( I hope)

Oh are Nubian's boney compared to pygmies? I can clearly see laddies hips and the hollows on his sides. Lundy looks chubby compared. The vet was just out the other week to put his sister down tho and asked to look lundy over and said he's the best looking goat he's ever seen whos had a perineal urthostomy done. So I'm guessing he isn't overweight. Just curious. First non pygmy goat I've had


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Yes, dairy breeds usually look a lot skinnier than miniature and meat breeds. You can post a photo if you're really worried and we can tell you for sure  

Or you can just google Body Condition Scoring and a ton of info will come up. I've always found it really confusing though. I prefer the feel-the-ribs method and the take-a-photo-and-post-it-on-TGS method :lol:


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good idea treating the eyes, what are you doing for them?

One having horns and the one without is a disadvantage, so be careful there if they spar.

Nubians are a bit on the thinner side, however, if too thin, it may be worms or cocci. Getting a fecal would let you know.


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## Dayna (Aug 16, 2012)

I think if one had to have horns its best that its the smaller one like in your case. The bigger one is twice his weight so if he had horns and was aggressive at all it would be trouble.


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## naomilove (Jan 10, 2017)

The scoring is confusing lol. For his eyes I'm using a saline solution rinse and putting a natural antibiotic in them. It's been clearing up over the last couple days. 
If I can get them to upload I'll put a couple pics on here


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## naomilove (Jan 10, 2017)

Here's another angle of laddie. He's a hard one to get a decent picture of


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

He is cute!


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## naomilove (Jan 10, 2017)

They are both super sweet. I'm pretty sure they both think they are lap dogs


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Nice goaties. 

The nubian is a bit on the thin side, can you get a fecal for worms and cocci?

Do they have out free choice loose salt and minerals?


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## naomilove (Jan 10, 2017)

I can try to get a fecal done. I just moved and am having a horrible time finding a vet for the goats. The one that came out to put Effie down for me only did it because he was in the area for a golf tournament and brought the shot with him. They have salt, I never keep minerals... my previous vet didn't want lundy on any extra because of his UC tendencies but I could get some for laddie and give to him outside the fence.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Any vet can do a fecal.

Goats need loose salt and minerals, it isn't just table salt. It has selenium, copper and a lot of good things they need and must have.

Ammonium chloride for the boys, helps to prevent UC or feeding a 2-1 feed ratio.
Some grains such as nobel goat grower from tractor supply has it in there.


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## goatblessings (Jan 6, 2015)

Agree with above. Loose minerals and a fecal..goats tend to "blow worms" in a stressful situation such as a move. Watch that your horned goats doesn't try to ram him in the belly. My friend lost 2 to that situation. Good luck - cute boys!


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## Luckthebuck234 (Jul 15, 2015)

Great advice given, and they are very cute!!


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## naomilove (Jan 10, 2017)

I've asked the regular vets near me when I was trying to get Effie help before putting her down, none will do a fecal without doing an exam and none well do an exam because they don't work with goats.

They have a salt block and I'm looking into getting minerals for laddie. Like I said lundy isn't supposed to have them as per his vet. Every time he's been on anything but salt, hay, apples, carrots and celery he's gotten a blockage and had to have surgery. He is on dl methionine, never had any luck with the AC, four blockages while he was on it. But crystal free for four years with dl methionine and diet change. 

I've been giving laddie a natural dewormer to see if it's worms or if he's just thin. I've worked with other types of animals with worms and they always act starved, he would rather skip a meal and have you hold him lol if he had the choice


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

What town and state are you from? Maybe someone can help direct you to a good goat vet.
Or I can try to search for one.

Check the inner lower eyelid coloring, you want to see dark pink/red. Or a good pink color. Compare the 2 goats. It is called a famancha score. If they are pale pink to white, the goat needs worming. If your goats are pale or white, let us know and we will direct you on what to do. 
Natural wormers are not good if they have a full blown case of worms. It must be a chemical wormer such as Ivomec or Valbezen if it is tapes. Do you see any worms in their stool?

Treating for cocci won't hurt, it is worse to wait longer if it is cocci, as it destroys the stomach lining, the longer is is left untreated. It damages the goat so they cannot absorb nutrition and won't ever be OK again. Cocci doesn't always show scouring in adults, but does show rapid weight loss. So if you can get a cocci treatment, that would be good let us know what kind is available to you at the feed store. 

The blocks are no good, still get the loose salt and minerals. If you can't get the goat minerals, get a good copper and selenium cattle mineral.


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## naomilove (Jan 10, 2017)

His eyes have neen been a normal dark pink from day one. Think his thinness is more to do with him being docile and not fighting the old herd for enough food. 

Thanks for all the help. Think im getting off of here tho... this site gave my phone and my tablet a virus :sigh:


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Glad the coloring is good.

Feed him separate. I would still get a fecal so you know for sure if it may or may not be worms and cocci.

I am sorry if you did get a virus. I have reported your post about it and hopefully we can check into it. 
I am so sorry for the inconvenience and hope it will be resolved soon. 

Can you contact an administrator on TGS?


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## Guest (Feb 6, 2017)

naomilove said:


> His eyes have neen been a normal dark pink from day one. Think his thinness is more to do with him being docile and not fighting the old herd for enough food.
> 
> Thanks for all the help. Think im getting off of here tho... this site gave my phone and my tablet a virus :sigh:


Are you getting pop ups? We're currently working on that issue and should have something in place before the end of the week.


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