# HELP! Acorn toxicity



## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Has anyone else's had a extremely sick goat from eating acorns💔😔..my 5 year old pygmy Bull..name-long story...is in critical condition! We have 7 acres for our 12 goats to forage..as you know forage hasn't come in yet... THEY'VE BEEN EATING ACORNS 💔😓 I've spoken to some people that never heard of acorn toxicity! There's not a snowballs chance THAT I COULD CLEAR ALL ACORNS... the toxicity has affected his LIVER ‼ I knew he wasn't right so I checked his eyes 😔 I couldn't believe what I was seeing! Yellow-jaundice! Vet took blood but it was so funky she couldn't read the blood values! She took some and put it through the centrafuge and there was a bit of his blood at the end but the rest was yellow liquid.. temperature 105.7 He is a strong boy but I don't know if we can beat this..I've liquids 3 times a day, banamine, Nuflor, vitamin B complex, HAS ANYONE HAD THIS HAPPEN 😓‼ We live out in the woods, I'm taking my phone..not sure if I can get to this website while with him but will check in asap..
Yes we have a fabulous vet.. just wondering if anyone else has been through this..12 goats eating acorns..tried to rake up what I can.. but there's much too many..I have him secured in my sick pen...no acorns and he has a port in his neck for iv fluids... 🆘


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Usually when an animal is fed before being set out to browse they don't eat enough acorns to be an issue. I rake up leaves and acorns from two old oak trees and feed that to my small herd every year with no issues ever. Here is a quote from "Goatworld" on signs of toxicity. I hope your little man I pulls through for you. 

"Animals affected by oak poisoning usually stop eating and become constipated with dark, mucus covered stools. Later they may have a bloody or very dark, tarry diarrhea. During this time they get very thirsty, and are commonly found in or around water. Usually they separate themselves from the rest of the herd. They typically lose body condition rapidly, and may get edema, such as bottle jaw. Bloody noses have also been seen. This poisoning does not happen quickly; it may take one to two weeks before you notice changes in the animal"


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## JML Farms (Jan 1, 2021)

I've never heard of a goat getting sick from eating too many acorns, but I suppose it could happen if they consume too many. Is that that his main food source? Do you have free choice hay out? If not, I would offer it to the rest of the goats to discourage any more acorn consumption. I know cows can't handle them well, but hogs get fat on them! They do contain tannins which in large doses could be harmful, however I've never had it happen, and mine eat lots of acorns. Have you looked over you area and see if maybe there is some other type of poisonous plant he could have ingested? Good luck. Keep us posted. I'd be interested to hear what the outcome is. I have however had an issue with some of my goats eating goat weeds (wooly croton) and getting sick from that. Usually they will get diarrhea and loose weight. Once they get a taste for it, they won't stop eating it until they are isolated. Normally they won't eat it, but once they get a taste for it, it's like they become addicted and won't stop.


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

I'm so sorry!
My does ate so many acorns last fall and got fat on them. No issues at all. Makes me wonder if your goat got into something else that's toxic, or possibly had another underlying issue that predisposed him to have this problem? I'm not saying that is the case, just throwing the idea out there in case it might help him, or the rest of your herd.
I make sure that my goats, and especially my does in milk, who have to eat a lot to keep their production up, have access to a variety of food sources. Especially in the early spring or fall, when the forage becomes limited, I make sure they have plenty of good hay so they are not hungry enough to go eat something potentially toxic and make themselves sick. I know that won't help Bull, but it might be something you could implement with the rest of your herd, if you haven't already. Of course, goats are notional and sometimes accident prone, and these sorts of things just happen, despite our best efforts! 
Have you tried using activated charcoal? It might help pull some of the toxins out of his system. It probably won't hurt him, anyway. @happybleats , do you foresee issues with giving him charcoal?
I hope Bull makes it!


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## JML Farms (Jan 1, 2021)

Just thought of this as well. Did your vet check for liver flukes? If u live in an area with snails and slugs, I'd have the vet test for them. They can cause similar issues to what you're experiencing.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Activated charcoal won't hurt at all.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

How did you find out that it was the acorns that caused this? 
Did the vet do a fecal analysis to check for parasites? 
I hope he improves


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## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

I personally haven't heard of acorn poisoning in goats, BUT my vet keeps her goats off the scrub oak in spring because the budding leaves and acorns have the potential to be toxic if consumed in large quantities. I have a ton of oak on my property and I have never kept my goats off of it at any time of year and I've never experienced a problem. However, if you have a piggy of a goat that tends to gorge itself on budding oak to the exclusion of all else, that could definitely cause a toxic reaction. 

However, I'd be investigating other options (like liver fluke) as well. I hope he pulls through for you!


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

JML Farms said:


> I've never heard of a goat getting sick from eating too many acorns, but I suppose it could happen if they consume too many. Is that that his main food source? Do you have free choice hay out? If not, I would offer it to the rest of the goats to discourage any more acorn consumption. I know cows can't handle them well, but hogs get fat on them! They do contain tannins which in large doses could be harmful, however I've never had it happen, and mine eat lots of acorns. Have you looked over you area and see if maybe there is some other type of poisonous plant he could have ingested? Good luck. Keep us posted. I'd be interested to hear what the outcome is. I have however had an issue with some of my goats eating goat weeds (wooly croton) and getting sick from that. Usually they will get diarrhea and loose weight. Once they get a taste for it, they won't stop eating it until they are isolated. Normally they won't eat it, but once they get a taste for it, it's like they become addicted and won't stop.


Thanks so much, it's not possible to rake up all the ACORNS on 7 acres... I raked what I could, but I had to close that pasture off! Bull has been sick for 2 weeks now and we just figured out what is going on.. he wasn't getting better, I thought maybe parasites so when I looked at the 😔pink aroma his eyes they were YELLOW, rushed him to the vet again they took blood but couldn't do anything with it because it was so funky from the toxicity! Couldn't get any of the values as to what is going on with his liver‼ he had a 105.7 temperature.. yesterday 104.2 giving banamine and what I told you on my first post.. what is worrying me is he still won't eat! Giving iv fluids a litter 3 times a day and vitamin B complex Nuflor.. I don't know how to get him to eat! I'm bringing a banana today and a orange.. he ate a few. Carrots and took a big mouthful of hay but only once! I just can't lose another goat 😓lost Rose and Onxy two months ago and Clarece from eating horse nettle that was in my hay but I had no clue what it was and TRIED picking out but it was absolutely loaded with horse nettle and she had a very painful death! The toxins bind with the iron in the blood and starves the goat of oxygen! Found her drooling in her hut.. had done everything we could.. but lost her only 4 years old.. I couldn't believe that while I was trying to get rid of the acorns my goats came and right away started eating More acorns.. no free feed, but I have it with bull all day but he's not eating well at all.
🆘🤦😭


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Debra P said:


> Thanks so much, it's not possible to rake up all the ACORNS on 7 acres... I raked what I could, but I had to close that pasture off! Bull has been sick for 2 weeks now and we just figured out what is going on.. he wasn't getting better, I thought maybe parasites so when I looked at the 😔pink aroma his eyes they were YELLOW, rushed him to the vet again they took blood but couldn't do anything with it because it was so funky from the toxicity! Couldn't get any of the values as to what is going on with his liver‼ he had a 105.7 temperature.. yesterday 104.2 giving banamine and what I told you on my first post.. what is worrying me is he still won't eat! Giving iv fluids a litter 3 times a day and vitamin B complex Nuflor.. I don't know how to get him to eat! I'm bringing a banana today and a orange.. he ate a few. Carrots and took a big mouthful of hay but only once! I just can't lose another goat 😓lost Rose and Onxy two months ago and Clarece from eating horse nettle that was in my hay but I had no clue what it was and TRIED picking out but it was absolutely loaded with horse nettle and she had a very painful death! The toxins bind with the iron in the blood and starves the goat of oxygen! Found her drooling in her hut.. had done everything we could.. but lost her only 4 years old.. I couldn't believe that while I was trying to get rid of the acorns my goats came and right away started eating More acorns.. no free feed, but I have it with bull all day but he's not eating well at all.
> 🆘🤦😭


Just google ACORNS toxicity you will find it and he had all the symptoms


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

happybleats said:


> Usually when an animal is fed before being set out to browse they don't eat enough acorns to be an issue. I rake up leaves and acorns from two old oak trees and feed that to my small herd every year with no issues ever. Here is a quote from "Goatworld" on signs of toxicity. I hope your little man I pulls through for you.
> 
> "Animals affected by oak poisoning usually stop eating and become constipated with dark, mucus covered stools. Later they may have a bloody or very dark, tarry diarrhea. During this time they get very thirsty, and are commonly found in or around water. Usually they separate themselves from the rest of the herd. They typically lose body condition rapidly, and may get edema, such as bottle jaw. Bloody noses have also been seen. This poisoning does not happen quickly; it may take one to two weeks before you notice changes in the animal"


He had every symptom, he's lost 6 pounds in a week, I saw something all over his nose which I believe was snotty and blood! WOULD it be ok to give him a banana to see if he will eat?!


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Banana won't hurt. You can also make smoothies for him for calories.


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

I just looked up symptoms of liver fluke in goats, and that could be partially what you're dealing with here. It would at least be worth asking your vet about it. I would think that he could potentially be dealing with fluke AND acorn toxicity, or a toxic reaction to some other plant.
Is he drinking at all? If so, it would be good to keep electrolytes in front of him. Sometimes they like warm water with electrolytes or molasses.
Nuflor can put them off food, and so can feeling sick ...I just went through this with one of my goats. She had a course of Nuflor and then LA-200, and wasn't eating at all. I drenched room temperature flat dark beer (extra stout Guinness was what I could find at the grocery store) and probiotics 3x a day. I tried to space it out so she was getting the probiotics a couple of hours after she was getting the antibiotics. Milk of magnesia and activated charcoal can help toxins move through and be flushed out of their systems. I have used those before when I suspected my goats had eaten something toxic. Molasses is easy to drench and will give energy. Continuing the B complex shots would be good, too.
If he really goes off his food, you could make a thin slurry of alfalfa pellets and drench him with that, if you can get a drenching syringe with a big enough hole for the mixture to go through. I was going to try using a turkey baster to do that with my doe, but she turned around and started eating well enough that I didn't have to drench food into her. You will want to be careful drenching him, so the liquids don't end up in his lungs.
The very best thing to eat would be fresh green leaves. Don't know what might be available to you, but you could try pine, or maybe wild blackberry, invasive honeysuckle, or anything else that's green and isn't toxic.
Hope everything turns out ok!


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## JML Farms (Jan 1, 2021)

Just out of curiosity what kind of oak trees do you have?


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## jschies (Aug 15, 2014)

Soak feed in water until it is soft. Give it to him with a turkey baster. You can mix other things in it like canned pumpkin. You should be able to get nutrients into him that way.


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

happybleats said:


> Banana won't hurt. You can also make smoothies for him for calories.


I was able to get him to eat two small bananas.. ABOUT a cup and a half of alfalfa pellets soaked.. but his temperature is still 104.8 and his eyes are still yellow.. we've given him lots of IV fluids and going to pick more up.. he refues to drink anything, tried some water with molasses nope, tried apple juice nope... Have a call in to my vet😓 this is KILLING me! Yesterday he was butting heads THROUGH the fence.. I have to keep him in the sick pen because of the port in his neck.. I can't let the others trying to find out what it is and take the chance of them pulling it out.. he ate the little bit of grass that's just coming up.. 😓


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

JML Farms said:


> Just out of curiosity what kind of oak trees do you have?


Just the regular kind of oak not red oak but I believe he's sick from eating acorns 💔


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

JML Farms said:


> Just out of curiosity what kind of oak trees do you have?


Just the regular kind of oak not red oak but I believe he's sick from eating acorns


jschies said:


> Soak feed in water until it is soft. Give it to him with a turkey baster. You can mix other things in it like canned pumpkin. You should be able to get nutrients into him that way.


Thanks, my husband is at the store I told him to pick up pumpkin and I will mix that with the soaked alfalfa pellets..is that ok..or just the pumpkin? I truly appreciate your advice 💔‼


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## jschies (Aug 15, 2014)

You can mix it. I haven't used pumpkin before but many others have posted about using it.


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Caileigh Jane Smith said:


> I just looked up symptoms of liver fluke in goats, and that could be partially what you're dealing with here. It would at least be worth asking your vet about it. I would think that he could potentially be dealing with fluke AND acorn toxicity, or a toxic reaction to some other plant.
> Is he drinking at all? If so, it would be good to keep electrolytes in front of him. Sometimes they like warm water with electrolytes or molasses.
> Nuflor can put them off food, and so can feeling sick ...I just went through this with one of my goats. She had a course of Nuflor and then LA-200, and wasn't eating at all. I drenched room temperature flat dark beer (extra stout Guinness was what I could find at the grocery store) and probiotics 3x a day. I tried to space it out so she was getting the probiotics a couple of hours after she was getting the antibiotics. Milk of magnesia and activated charcoal can help toxins move through and be flushed out of their systems. I have used those before when I suspected my goats had eaten something toxic. Molasses is easy to drench and will give energy. Continuing the B complex shots would be good, too.
> If he really goes off his food, you could make a thin slurry of alfalfa pellets and drench him with that, if you can get a drenching syringe with a big enough hole for the mixture to go through. I was going to try using a turkey baster to do that with my doe, but she turned around and started eating well enough that I didn't have to drench food into her. You will want to be careful drenching him, so the liquids don't end up in his lungs.
> ...


Nope he won't drink anything and I never thought about the liver fluke! I'm going to ask my vet to check for that THANKS FOR YOUR ADVICE ♥ AND I WILL LET YOU KNOW WHAT SHE SAYS ‼😓


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Debra P said:


> Nope he won't drink anything and I never thought about the liver fluke! I'm going to ask my vet to check for that THANKS FOR YOUR ADVICE ♥ AND I WILL LET YOU KNOW WHAT SHE SAYS ‼😓


Just texted about LIVER FLUKE to my vet.. he has all the symptoms.. but also has symptoms of acorn toxicity... But I think maybe you may be on to what is going on with him! Truly and sincerely APPRECIATED


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## JML Farms (Jan 1, 2021)

If it is liver fluke, you can treat him with valbazen. (found at most feed stores) Dosage amounts can be found at vet.cornell.edu they have a great dewormer chart for goats. They recommend 2ml/25lbs orally for valbazen. It would be a good idea to go ahead and get fecals done on your other goats too. Know your enemy.


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

I hope you can get to the bottom of what's going on with him! Sometimes, health issues seem to snowball...one brings on another.
He definitely needs liquids. I'm glad you have a port in him to help keep him hydrated. 
Eating grass is great! At this point, anything you can get him to eat or drink is a good thing. Can you maybe bring him out into your yard or somewhere to graze, since he did eat some grass?
Getting his fever down will help him want to eat. Do you have more doses of banamine you can give him? The vet should be able to help you with dosage frequency and amounts. 
I know how stressful these issues can be. Hang in there!


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Debra P said:


> Nope he won't drink anything and I never thought about the liver fluke! I'm going to ask my vet to check for that THANKS FOR YOUR ADVICE ♥ AND I WILL LET YOU KNOW WHAT SHE SAYS ‼😓


He is o


JML Farms said:


> If it is liver fluke, you can treat him with valbazen. (found at most feed stores) Dosage amounts can be found at vet.cornell.edu they have a great dewormer chart for goats. They recommend 2ml/25lbs orally for valbazen. It would be a good idea to go ahead and get fecals done on your other goats too. Know your enemy.


I spoke with my vet and she told me that she took a feces sample and sent it out..it was so confusing because but I'm glad they've already done that and sent it out.. SHOULD be back 🔜 and I will keep you all updated. Made some alfalfa pellets soaked and last night he ate about a cup and a half.. just taking pieces of hay at a time... maybe the Nuflor has made him not feel like eating... this is so confusing..on the one hand I know he's in critical condition.. but I've seen him butting heads THROUGH the fence with the others.. when I gave him the alfalfa all the others came running ( 🤦 I've learned very well now YOU CANT FOOL A GOAT!) Anyway he didn't want the others to get his food so he was swinging his head to make them scat.. this is very confusing.. just gave him his vitamin B complex and banamine, iv fluids since he refuses to drink..tried molasses water, apple juice.. nope so more fluids.. will keep you updated. Any suggestions WELCOME ❣🙏


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Caileigh Jane Smith said:


> I hope you can get to the bottom of what's going on with him! Sometimes, health issues seem to snowball...one brings on another.
> He definitely needs liquids. I'm glad you have a port in him to help keep him hydrated.
> Eating grass is great! At this point, anything you can get him to eat or drink is a good thing. Can you maybe bring him out into your yard or somewhere to graze, since he did eat some grass?
> Getting his fever down will help him want to eat. Do you have more doses of banamine you can give him? The vet should be able to help you with dosage frequency and amounts.
> I know how stressful these issues can be. Hang in there!


He does want to eat grass..btw thank you for your post.. but we live in Rhode Island and there's very short grass only in some places.. STILL too early for grass🤦 I wish I could buy fresh grass..yes I have a whole bottle of banamine, and vitamin B complex..I'm going to try finding probiotics and electrolytes..I have a huge bottle of probiotics but I've had it for 3 years does the powder go bad? I have no idea if it goes bad..it's in a cool place in the shop..


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

Debra P said:


> He does want to eat grass..btw thank you for your post.. but we live in Rhode Island and there's very short grass only in some places.. STILL too early for grass🤦 I wish I could buy fresh grass..yes I have a whole bottle of banamine, and vitamin B complex..I'm going to try finding probiotics and electrolytes..I have a huge bottle of probiotics but I've had it for 3 years does the powder go bad? I have no idea if it goes bad..it's in a cool place in the shop..


I understand about the shortage of grass. We've greened up here in Missouri in the last few weeks, but before that, it was pretty sparse. Any green stuff you can find for him, like pine branches, might be helpful. That's great that he's still eating the alfalfa! Having his herd nearby and 'competing' with him for food is probably good for keeping his spirits up. Sounds like you're doing a great job!
Is there an expiration date on the probiotic powder? If not, I'd go ahead and give it to him. Honestly, even if it's past expiration and still looks fine, I would still give it to my goats. Might not be as potent, but I wouldn't think it would hurt him. But maybe that's just me.


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## JML Farms (Jan 1, 2021)

Has he been wormed recently? It wouldn't hurt to go ahead and give a dose of valbazen if you don't get fecal results soon. Verify with your vet that the fecal test will show liver flukes. The valbazen will also take care of any other worms he may have.


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

JML Farms said:


> If it is liver fluke, you can treat him with valbazen. (found at most feed stores) Dosage amounts can be found at vet.cornell.edu they have a great dewormer chart for goats. They recommend 2ml/25lbs orally for valbazen. It would be a good idea to go ahead and get fecals done on your other goats too. Know your enemy.


We haven't gotten the results back yet, checking for liver fluke and my vet wormed him while he was there... last summer was very wet so buying hay wasn't easy... but we did find one man that will set aside 300 bale's...😱 BELIEVE it or not STILL FINDING HORSE NETTLE IN MY HAY😭..one of my triplets died a HORRIFIC death from horse nettle..tons of it in the hay! Who sells this poison to feed goats😠..got another person who sells hay and I keep finding the leaves, stems and some flowers in some of my bale's which is set aside for me to pick every leave stem flowers out! Why😠 WOULD people who sell hay ALLOW horse nettle to grow in the field! These are mature plants, big prickly stems... I've been rescuing goats for 8 years never until last year have I gotten poison in my hay! It's only april 1st and we only have 10 bale's left..I can't feed them as much as I want..I will start feeding the bigger meal before they go out to pasture.. going to find or build something to put a bale in for free feed.. have to make something that won't get rain on the hay.. thanks truly for every single post helping me..bull sends his love


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Caileigh Jane Smith said:


> I understand about the shortage of grass. We've greened up here in Missouri in the last few weeks, but before that, it was pretty sparse. Any green stuff you can find for him, like pine branches, might be helpful. That's great that he's still eating the alfalfa! Having his herd nearby and 'competing' with him for food is probably good for keeping his spirits up. Sounds like you're doing a great job!
> Is there an expiration date on the probiotic powder? If not, I'd go ahead and give it to him. Honestly, even if it's past expiration and still looks fine, I would still give it to my goats. Might not be as potent, but I wouldn't think it would hurt him. But maybe that's just me.


I do have lots of pine branches that I have been giving all my goats, BUT now he turns his face away.. I think the Nuflor isn't helping his appetite! I'm giving him vitamin B complex and banamine.. my vet is going to try taking blood to see what is going on... She took blood the first visit BUT as she watched it going in she said it wasn't good enough to test.. she said it was too funky Probably because of his liver! I'm hoping she sees him tonight or tomorrow to see if it looks any better.. thanks so very much ❣


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Debra P said:


> I do have lots of pine branches that I have been giving all my goats, BUT now he turns his face away.. I think the Nuflor isn't helping his appetite! I'm giving him vitamin B complex and banamine.. my vet is going to try taking blood to see what is going on... She took blood the first visit BUT as she watched it going in she said it wasn't good enough to test.. she said it was too funky Probably because of his liver! I'm hoping she sees him tonight or tomorrow to see if it looks any better.. thanks so very much ❣


Ohhh and yes we purposely made the sick pen right where he can see his buddies...I put a collar and leash on him and took him out hoping he would eat next to the others..nope not interested but that's when he started looking for fresh grass..I helped pick what I could but it's very short still


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

Don't know what sort of resources are available to you, but here you can buy bags of chopped alfalfa or Timothy hay at farm stores like Tractor Supply. You can buy alfalfa or Timothy pellets, too. Those might be an option to help stretch your hay out for a few more weeks. 
Do you know any horse people? Horse nettle is dangerous for horses, as well as goats, so they might be able to direct you to a better hay supplier. Or you can ask at your local feed store. When people hear that you're feeding hay to your goats, they assume that any old, weedy hay will do. And sometimes it WILL, just not if it's loaded with potentially toxic plants. 
It is hard to find hay at this time of year, but I hope you can get something!


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

Debra P said:


> I do have lots of pine branches that I have been giving all my goats, BUT now he turns his face away.. I think the Nuflor isn't helping his appetite! I'm giving him vitamin B complex and banamine.. my vet is going to try taking blood to see what is going on... She took blood the first visit BUT as she watched it going in she said it wasn't good enough to test.. she said it was too funky Probably because of his liver! I'm hoping she sees him tonight or tomorrow to see if it looks any better.. thanks so very much ❣


When my goat wasn't eating, we looked up the side effects of Nuflor, and saw that it can suppress appetite. I would recommend drenching flat, dark beer. It will help keep his rumen going.
How long of a course of Nuflor is he on, and how often are you giving it?
Did the vet give you any input on continuing the banamine dosage if his temperature remains high? I did 1 cc per 100 lbs., every 12 hours for as long as my doe had an elevated temperature, per the vet's recommendation. I think I only had to do that for about a day and a half or 2 days, so she got a total of 3 or 4 doses of banamine. I took her temperature morning and night, before I gave her another dose. The banamine definitely perked her up, but that is a pretty heavy dose, and you do not want to give that much long term. You probably will not want to dose Bull that heavily, since his system is already overloaded, what with his liver not working well. Hopefully your vet can give you advice on this.


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Caileigh Jane Smith said:


> Don't know what sort of resources are available to you, but here you can buy bags of chopped alfalfa or Timothy hay at farm stores like Tractor Supply. You can buy alfalfa or Timothy pellets, too. Those might be an option to help stretch your hay out for a few more weeks.
> Do you know any horse people? Horse nettle is dangerous for horses, as well as goats, so they might be able to direct you to a better hay supplier. Or you can ask at your local feed store. When people hear that you're feeding hay to your goats, they assume that any old, weedy hay will do. And sometimes it WILL, just not if it's loaded with potentially toxic plants.
> It is hard to find hay at this time of year, but I hope you can get something!


Thanks for your suggestions... I certainly will go pick up the timothy hay I do have alfalfa pellets but I can't give that to me wethers.. can they eat Timothy hay? Would that hurt my boys? I know I can get hay stretcher but I don't want to give them too much because of the molasses.. but the chopped timothy hay Sounds good.. just don't know if it's ok for my boys.. any idea? Thanks sincerely for your suggestions.. I truly appreciate all of you trying to help ❣❣❣


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Timothy hay will be fine to give to whethers. It has about 10% protein and a balanced calcium to phosphorus ratio.


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## jschies (Aug 15, 2014)

How is he today?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

How are things?


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## JML Farms (Jan 1, 2021)

Any updates?


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

JML Farms said:


> Just thought of this as well. Did your vet check for liver flukes? If u live in an area with snails and slugs, I'd have the vet test for them. They can cause similar issues to what you're experiencing.


Guess what my vet BELIEVES MY BOY HAS...LIVER FLUKE! At first we thought acorn toxicity... but now my vet BELIEVES it's liver fluke 😔🤦 his blood work came out much better EXCEPT FOR THE ANEMIA! I do have red blood... SHOULD I start giving him for the anemia? Any suggestions WELCOME..we used valbazen for the worming.. suggestions? Any are welcomed..I'm doing everything possible to keep him going..he's now eating, and drinking the electralytes and probiotics..any suggestions WELCOME


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Definitely give the Red Cell. Glad you figured it out.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Anemia treatment:
Daily red cell, 6 ml per 100 lbs
Daily B-12 shots, preferably the prescription concentration from your vet. Dosage for the 3000 mcg kind is 4cc per 100 lbs
High protein food
Green leaves


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## JML Farms (Jan 1, 2021)

Glad you are on the road to recovery! It will take a while for him to be back 100% but at least he’s got someone that cares enough for him to go the extra mile. So does this kinda ease your mind about acorn toxicity?


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

All the above suggestions are great! Sounds like you're on the right track. I'm glad you were able to figure out what was really going on.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

How's your boy doing? Still on IV fluids?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Glad all is well.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

@Debra P here is the post you were having difficulty locating


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

JML Farms said:


> Glad you are on the road to recovery! It will take a while for him to be back 100% but at least he’s got someone that cares enough for him to go the extra mile. So does this kinda ease your mind about acorn toxicity?


I am Unbelievablely sorry.. I couldn't find this thread to update you all..bull had a port with iv fluids for a solid week..my vet didn't expect him to make it this far but we've gone the extra mile doing everything possible to keep him going ☺i UNDERSTAND he's not Completely out of the WOODS BUT HES ACTING LIKE A GOAT AGAIN 🐐☺ He's eating on his own, no more fever, they pulled the port pulled ( Cara my vet told me that they've never had a goat on iv fluids this long) one solid week..he's feeling much better.
I was thrilled to watch him eating with the others and getting his hackles up and butting Gidget because she got too close to his hay☺I gave him probiotics and electrolytes while he was sick..he just drank it up because I mixed it with apple juice..vet is coming to get more blood but last week they checked his blood and everything was much better! ❣💯 coming this week to take more blood.. praying it's even better! I'm sorry I couldn't locate this thread..I wanted to update you all and I want to thank all who chimed in❣ I appreciate you all..I'm going to upload this picture of Bull BEING a real goat again..he's not Completely out of the woods until we see pink back in his eyes ❣ thanks for your help❣ sincerely ❣💯


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

NigerianNewbie said:


> @Debra P here is the post you were having difficulty locating


THANK YOU SO MUCH ❣


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

NigerianNewbie said:


> @Debra P here is the post you were having difficulty locating


Wanted to share this picture.. taken two days ago ☺


Damfino said:


> I personally haven't heard of acorn poisoning in goats, BUT my vet keeps her goats off the scrub oak in spring because the budding leaves and acorns have the potential to be toxic if consumed in large quantities. I have a ton of oak on my property and I have never kept my goats off of it at any time of year and I've never experienced a problem. However, if you have a piggy of a goat that tends to gorge itself on budding oak to the exclusion of all else, that could definitely cause a toxic reaction.
> 
> However, I'd be investigating other options (like liver fluke) as well. I hope he pulls through for you!


Still don't know exactly how this happened but it may have been liver fluke 🤦we still aren't sure.. please look at my update.. things are much better.. I'm going to upload a great picture of my boy being a goat again ☺❣ it


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## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

I'm so glad to hear he's doing better! I hope he makes a full recovery!


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## JML Farms (Jan 1, 2021)

Glad to hear! Keep us posted. We can all learn from each others experiences.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Glad to hear!


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Debra P said:


> THANK YOU SO MUCH ❣


You're welcome


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

@Debra P - here is your thread

Whoops - I see you found it already!


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Great to hear that he is getting better! You're doing such a good job!


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Debra P said:


> THANK YOU SO MUCH ❣





JML Farms said:


> Just thought of this as well. Did your vet check for liver flukes? If u live in an area with snails and slugs, I'd have the vet test for them. They can cause similar issues to what you're experiencing.


She did check for liver flukes but it came back negative..we still believe he ate too many acorns.
ACORNS do a job on the liver..if it isn't from acorns then we have no clue what happened but this little boy is 5 years old and never once has been sick! But he's certainly making up for that! I'm trying to upload a picture for you good people..I'll try again ❣❣💯THANK YOU ALL! I PRAY I HAVEN'T MISSED ANY OF YOUR ADVICE IF I DID IM EXTREMELY SORRY IM HAVING A HARD TIME NAVIGATING THIS SITE..🤦 didn't realize the caps were on Anyway I'm trying to upload a picture for you all great people ❣ thanks so much for your advice










Damfino said:


> I'm so glad to hear he's doing better! I hope he makes a full recovery!


Were you able to see the pictures I uploaded..I'm still not sure how to use this website.. thanks so much for your goodwill ❣💯


NigerianNewbie said:


> @Debra P here is the post you were having difficulty locating


How did you find this? I'm having trouble navigating this website.. but thanks so much for finding this for me.. I uploaded a couple pictures, I don't know if anyone can see them.. I just opened it but there wasn't anything that said post.. hope you see the pictures

















JML Farms said:


> Glad you are on the road to recovery! It will take a while for him to be back 100% but at least he’s got someone that cares enough for him to go the extra mile. So does this kinda ease your mind about acorn toxicity?


Actually I never thought ACORNS were toxic, but we still have no clue what happened to my boy.. he's 5 years old and never had one day sick in any way.. BUT HE CERTAINLY MADE UP FOR THAT 😳... He could be predisposed for liver problems, could have been flukes, we still don't have answers... His fecal came back negative for flukes 🤦 you bet I will do anything I can to help this boy live many more years ❣he's Absolutely precious and he's now acting like a goat, instead of hiding in his hut ☺ I can't say he's Completely over this, yup he's eating and doing everything goats do BUT I am waiting to let him out of the sick pen UNTIL HIS EYES PINK UP! I let him out to be with his buddies but I put him back in the sick pen UNTIL I get the ok from Cara my vet.. fabulous people in this practice.. Cara was so busy she hired a second vet lyndsey who's fabulous too.. grateful I have 2 LOVING and wonderful vets.. f I can navigate this site I will update you all especially if we ever find out what did this.. you are lovely people and I'm blessed to have found your site❣☺


Debra P said:


> THANK YOU SO MUCH ❣


Thank you


JML Farms said:


> Glad to hear! Keep us posted. We can all learn from each others experiences.


I certainly will keep you posted..I just wrote a reply but I couldn't find how to post it🤔 sorry but I'm having trouble navigating 🤦 and I still don't see anything that says post 🤦🤦🤦


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Damfino said:


> I'm so glad to hear he's doing better! I hope he makes a full recovery!


Ohhh my GOSH so am I.. he's not Completely out of the woods but he's doing everything he always did and he lost a good amount of weight.. looks like he is putting it back on❣🙏


SalteyLove said:


> @Debra P - here is your thread
> 
> Whoops - I see you found it already!


Thanks 😊


ksalvagno said:


> Glad to hear!


😊🙏🙏🙏🙏Tons of praying went up for this boy..I think GOD wanted to get rid of me and my begging 😊😊😊


JML Farms said:


> Glad to hear! Keep us posted. We can all learn from each others experiences.


I certainly will ❣ and I hope you all know that I replied to what you all said and Please know how much I appreciate your advice and care❣🙏...I never see anything that says post..are you all getting my replies?


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

Thanks for updating, @Debra P ! I'm so glad to see Bull looking happy again!


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Debra P said:


> How did you find this?


I went to the tab named popular, (right hand side of the tab named new post) and scrolled down until it was located.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

So glad he is getting better!


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Caileigh Jane Smith said:


> I'm so sorry!
> My does ate so many acorns last fall and got fat on them. No issues at all. Makes me wonder if your goat got into something else that's toxic, or possibly had another underlying issue that predisposed him to have this problem? I'm not saying that is the case, just throwing the idea out there in case it might help him, or the rest of your herd.
> I make sure that my goats, and especially my does in milk, who have to eat a lot to keep their production up, have access to a variety of food sources. Especially in the early spring or fall, when the forage becomes limited, I make sure they have plenty of good hay so they are not hungry enough to go eat something potentially toxic and make themselves sick. I know that won't help Bull, but it might be something you could implement with the rest of your herd, if you haven't already. Of course, goats are notional and sometimes accident prone, and these sorts of things just happen, despite our best efforts!
> Have you tried using activated charcoal? It might help pull some of the toxins out of his system. It probably won't hurt him, anyway. @happybleats , do you foresee issues with giving him charcoal?
> I hope Bull makes it!


Want to UPDATE YOU AND THE OTHERS! You people are fabulous ❤...just saying ‼❣My vet came today and COULDN'T BELIEVE HOW GREAT BULL MY LITTLE GOAT IS DOING ❣ They told me that this is the first time ever that they had a goat on IV fluids..I wish I could post a video of him yesterday butting Timmy and Gidget! brother and sister against THE MIGHTY BULL😁 Nope he still takes no crap❣nope not our boy..vet told us once again this is miraculous 😁‼ little does Car know how many FERVENT PRAYER went into our boy..HIS EYES AREN'T YELLOW TURNED PINK❣😁‼ ONCE AGAIN...we still aren't positive what happened and you may be right, he could have been predisposed for liver problems.. but he's out of the SICK WOODS.. AND SOON ILL BE PUTTING HIM BACK WITH HIS BUDDIES ❣IM OVER THE 🌚🌝🌚 THANK YOU LORD! I do understand that we don't always get the answer we wanted but I know the character of my LORD, I would accept anything HE decided but in the meantime I did everything possible to keep him alive ‼‼ if we ever find out what happened I will update you beautiful people ❣ can't thank you all enough for your suggestions for your comfort and love for all things GOATS😁❣🙏👍


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

NigerianNewbie said:


> I went to the tab named popular, (right hand side of the tab named new post) and scrolled down until it was located.


❣❣❣🙏🙏 Thank you so very much.. you are the best goat people I've talked with or should I say posted with... HE'S ALIVE AND WELL🙏❣😁My vet came today and COULDN'T BELIEVE what she was seeing.. she said this boy was on DEATHS door... and now he's outside playing with his buddies and winning THE BUTT HEAD GAME😂❣IM OVER THE 🌚 MOON IN COMPLETE JOY AND I THANK MY LORD FOR HEARING MY PRAYERS😂🙏❤. YOU ARE ALL lovely people and I thank you all for your suggestions and help😘❤❣🙏


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## JML Farms (Jan 1, 2021)

Glad we could help. I've learned a lot from the folks here too.


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

Debra P said:


> Want to UPDATE YOU AND THE OTHERS! You people are fabulous ❤...just saying ‼❣My vet came today and COULDN'T BELIEVE HOW GREAT BULL MY LITTLE GOAT IS DOING ❣ They told me that this is the first time ever that they had a goat on IV fluids..I wish I could post a video of him yesterday butting Timmy and Gidget! brother and sister against THE MIGHTY BULL😁 Nope he still takes no crap❣nope not our boy..vet told us once again this is miraculous 😁‼ little does Car know how many FERVENT PRAYER went into our boy..HIS EYES AREN'T YELLOW TURNED PINK❣😁‼ ONCE AGAIN...we still aren't positive what happened and you may be right, he could have been predisposed for liver problems.. but he's out of the SICK WOODS.. AND SOON ILL BE PUTTING HIM BACK WITH HIS BUDDIES ❣IM OVER THE 🌚🌝🌚 THANK YOU LORD! I do understand that we don't always get the answer we wanted but I know the character of my LORD, I would accept anything HE decided but in the meantime I did everything possible to keep him alive ‼‼ if we ever find out what happened I will update you beautiful people ❣ can't thank you all enough for your suggestions for your comfort and love for all things GOATS😁❣🙏👍


I am so, so happy for you all! I had my own doe get sick a short while back, and I know many people were praying for her recovery. I fully believe that played a huge part in her recovery. The vet said she had a 50/50 chance. She is looking better every day. I am glad that Bull looks like he'll recover, too!


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Yay! So glad he’s doing better. Now you can finally breathe again, lol.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

So glad he is doing better.


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Caileigh Jane Smith said:


> I am so, so happy for you all! I had my own doe get sick a short while back, and I know many people were praying for her recovery. I fully believe that played a huge part in her recovery. The vet said she had a 50/50 chance. She is looking better every day. I am glad that Bull looks like he'll recover, too!


May I ask what happened with your doe... Poor sweet animals depend on us.. and I always put extra effort in saving them... Especially prayer to the only true GOD OF ISRAEL ❣🙏 how is your does now? I'd love to know why she was sick.. my vet didn't even give us a 50 Percent chance! She pretty much BELIEVED he wouldn't be able to get better with his liver being so unbelievably compromised! I thank you so much for your care about my boy.. please if you're able let us know what is going on with your doe.. I will keep her in prayer for sure❣❣


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> So glad he is doing better.


Thanks so very much ❣❣❣I'm still kinda shocked because I checked his eyes YESTERDAY and they were still white...I opened his eyes today and saw THAT BEAUTIFUL COLORS...PINK❣


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> So glad he is doing better.


Thanks so very much ❣❣❣I'm still kinda shocked because I checked his eyes YESTERDAY and they were still white...I opened his eyes today and saw THAT BEAUTIFUL COLORS...PINK


FizzyGoats said:


> Yay! So glad he’s doing better. Now you can finally breathe again, lol.


Éxactly! I can tell your a goat lover as I am❣yes I can take a nice deep breath now and I will be letting bull back with his buddies as soon as my vet ok's it.. thanks for your care about bull..yup I know it's a crazy name for a goat but he does have markings and colors of a heffer so I let my friend Steve name him ❣😁


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Debra P said:


> May I ask what happened with your doe... Poor sweet animals depend on us.. and I always put extra effort in saving them... Especially prayer to the only true GOD OF ISRAEL ❣🙏 how is your does now? I'd love to know why she was sick.. my vet didn't even give us a 50 Percent chance! She pretty much BELIEVED he wouldn't be able to get better with his liver being so unbelievably compromised! I thank you so much for your care about my boy.. please if you're able let us know what is going on with your doe.. I will keep her in prayer for sure❣❣


Ohhh and you know exactly how GOD can do what we can't especially how very sick he was! this is the most wonderful news I've gotten since Valentino recovered from a HORRIFIC bear attack! Cara didn't think Valentino would make a full recovery.. little does she realized that we pray for healing of GOD and don't just leave it up to anyone..prayer is the best thing we can SUPPORT our beloved goats with ❣😁🌅🙏


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Debra P said:


> Éxactly! I can tell your a goat lover as I am❣yes I can take a nice deep breath now and I will be letting bull back with his buddies as soon as my vet ok's it.. thanks for your care about bull..yup I know it's a crazy name for a goat but he does have markings and colors of a heffer so I let my friend Steve name him ❣


I love the name Bull for him. It’s perfect.


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> So glad he is doing better.


Thanks so very much 💓 when I found out his liver was damaged I was beside myself in what I can do to help him..GOD DID THE REST🌅💓🙏😁


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> So glad he is doing better.


Thanks so very much I appreciate you all so much 💗 my boy is going to live! 🙏😁💗🐐


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

FizzyGoats said:


> I love the name Bull for him. It’s perfect.


😁🐐❣ Thanks so very much.. sometimes I wonder what people think when I tell them his name 😅 but he's extremely independent and for a part pygmy he's extremely STRONG.. THANK GOD HE WAS STRONG ENOUGH TO GET THROUGH THIS DEADLY LIVER THING! WE still aren't sure what happened.. could have been liver flukes or acorn toxicity.. they have been eating a lot of acorns so I'm s bit scared to allow him back in the pastures.. we have 4 different pastures.. almost 10 fenced in acres for them to EAT BAD THINGS! Ohhh no I mean to forage 😅😁❣so I certainly can't take up almost 10 acres so I'm going to have to trust that if he did eat too many acorns that he no longer will eat any..yeah right we ARE TALKING ABOUT GOATS😁😁❣❣


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

JML Farms said:


> Glad we could help. I've learned a lot from the folks here too.


EXACTLY..I was brand new to caring for goats right years ago and I learned by reading all goat related text.. I think it's better than reading a book because these people know how to help there goats and when even they have questions..I always kept up on what people do for certain illnesses.... you help lots of newbies telling people with sick goat's how to help them and I thank all of you wonderful people ‼❣


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## Feira426 (Dec 11, 2019)

They usually won't eat enough acorns to make themselves sick unless they don't have enough food otherwise, so unless he just loves acorns or something, I think you should be okay. I'm so glad he's doing better! Sure seemed like it was a close call, whatever it was. Poor Bull. So glad you were able to help him pull through!

As for site navigation, what are you using to access the site? On my phone or my computer, to find threads that I've started, I just have to click/touch my profile picture near the top right corner, then click/press "My Profile" (right at the top of the list), and then click the link that says "Discussions." This should show you all the threads you've started. You can also receive email updates for threads you follow, including the ones you've started, and you can access the thread directly from the email update. But since the site is in the middle of a transition, I'm not entirely sure how to currently set up email notifications...


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

Debra P said:


> May I ask what happened with your doe... Poor sweet animals depend on us.. and I always put extra effort in saving them... Especially prayer to the only true GOD OF ISRAEL ❣🙏 how is your does now? I'd love to know why she was sick.. my vet didn't even give us a 50 Percent chance! She pretty much BELIEVED he wouldn't be able to get better with his liver being so unbelievably compromised! I thank you so much for your care about my boy.. please if you're able let us know what is going on with your doe.. I will keep her in prayer for sure❣❣


Thanks for asking! And once again, I'm so glad Bull is recovering! You can read all about my doe here. She pulled through and is much better. Is she dilated...uterine infection, LA-200 dosage?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

So glad things are good, thanks for the update and glad we helped.


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Feira426 said:


> They usually won't eat enough acorns to make themselves sick unless they don't have enough food otherwise, so unless he just loves acorns or something, I think you should be okay. I'm so glad he's doing better! Sure seemed like it was a close call, whatever it was. Poor Bull. So glad you were able to help him pull through!
> 
> As for site navigation, what are you using to access the site? On my phone or my computer, to find threads that I've started, I just have to click/touch my profile picture near the top right corner, then click/press "My Profile" (right at the top of the list), and then click the link that says "Discussions." This should show you all the threads you've started. You can also receive email updates for threads you follow, including the ones you've started, and you can access the thread directly from the email update. But since the site is in the middle of a transition, I'm not entirely sure how to currently set up email notifications...


Thanks so much... I truly appreciate you telling me how to navigate


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Just a complete update..
BULL IS ONE HUNDRED PERCENT FABULOUS ❣ just wanted you all to know.. never give up ❣💘we brought our boy for his check up...both my vets gave me Absolutely no hope in saving BULL😁 These are two of the very best goat vets in New England.. and they couldn't tell me that he would be ok.. nope nobody BELIEVED that Bull would live through his liver shutting down😖 I was horrified, I had just lost my two beautiful girls, Rose 🌹 and my sweet Onxy.. mother and daughter 😣 and when I saw Bulls eyes..we rushed him to the vet..I've told you most of the story but I wanted to tell you all ... never give up hope❣ we brought Bull into the vets..they were astonished! They asked if I had the wrong goat 😁..his first appointment he was weak and extremely sick.. critical.. but he is one hundred percent back..Cara was giving me iron shots for bull each Friday..I was giving him red cell for more iron..Cara told me he no longer needed the iron shot but I stopped the red cell too..he started going backwards.. nope not allowing you to die on me little boy..so I started giving him the iron( red cell) and he came right back..I started weaning his body off the red cell slowly.. first I was giving him 8 cc next week went to 6cc and next 4 cc daily...now he's down to 2cc's 😁❣ and he doing Fabulous playing butt head with his buddies..a lesson learned..I had two critical goats.. Valentino SHOULD not have lived through a bear attack...Cara admitted when he healed that she didn't believe he would live through the sewing up of the shredded skin! But he did and I spent just about every waking moment with him..I had lots of medications and I had to flush all wounds 3 times a day..Cara now calls Valentino her little miracle goat...now she has 2 little miracles 😁 I have thanked GOD FIRST..so much prayer went into Bulls recovery ❣😁 and my answer was yes I have enough goats up here for now😁❣


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Picture of my little miracle ❤


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## Debra P (May 8, 2019)

Just so you know how BADLY his liver was...his SKIN PEELED OFF HIS NOSE AND EARS😁 BUT now it looks like baby skin and fur🙏 PRAISE GOD 🙏 AND THANK YOU GOD FROM SAYING YES!


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## JML Farms (Jan 1, 2021)

Amen! What a story! Thanks for sharing an update!


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

In terms of acorns -- they are high in tannins, too much can cause poisoning and yes, if left untreated, that can target the liver. Liver flukes are great at hiding and don't always show up in tests--but I would expect him to have quite a bit of weight loss with that as well. Do you have any standing water or ponds?

Glad he is doing better. With the fever it sounds like there may have been multiple issues going on.

To help his liver recovery fully, I recommend getting him on milk thistle herb or this blend: Herb Mix FreshStart™ (Liver, GallBldr, Kidney support) 8 oz


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

So glad he's made a full recovery! I was just thinking about him the other day and I was about to ask for an update! So thanks for that!


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## Feira426 (Dec 11, 2019)

I’m so glad he pulled through and is feeling good again!


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

He looks so perky! I know you put a lot of work and love into making sure he recovered. Good job!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Fantastic news!


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Amazing news! He looks so happy and like a total sweetie pie. Thanks for the update.


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