# Best Choice for Livestock Guardian



## saradara12 (Dec 25, 2012)

We will be moving to a larger (10 acre) farm, and the goats (and sheep) will be kind of far from the house and behind a barn where I cant see/hear them. There are a lot of woods around the property, and we have A LOT of coyotes in the area. I think I need to look into getting a livestock guardian animal.....and am wondering what others experience has been? I was reading that pyrs will wander away...that's not good. I do have pet dogs (golden retrievers), chickens, cats and human kids as well. I dont want something that will kill/attack any of those. So....llama? donkey? dog? What do folks recommend/think?
Thanks!


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## fd123 (May 29, 2012)

If you have your place fenced good, a GP will be a GREAT choice!


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## fd123 (May 29, 2012)

As far as not wanting your other animals attacked...id rec getting a puppy and raising them all up together...My GP is VERY PROTECTIVE of her goats...And shes EXACTLY what i needed....I sleep GREAT now because I know my goats are safe! I would put $$ on it..>> If i were to go out and find a dead goat someday from a predator...id put my $$ that my GP would be dead in front of the goat! My GP is worth her weight in GOLD to me!


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## DDFN (Jul 31, 2011)

I had both a llama and a GP. The llama is in with the sheep herd and the GP with the goats. I love them both and have had pretty good luck with both but I really enjoy the llama's work. They are on the side of the property that has to deal with coyotes and every once in awhile a bear and I am very impressed with my llama but it is really just on how they have been raised. Don't think you can get an aged llama that has been used as a pack animal to now be a guard llama and the same for a dog. If you get a GP that has been house raised and not around animals then you would not have the same turn out as with a young pup or trained goat LGD. I am fond of a few breeds but we lucked up with our GP and got her already trained. I would not suggest having a new pup in with the does that are kidding or recently kidded. Hope this helps.


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## DDFN (Jul 31, 2011)

Oh PS not a donkey! I had a friend tell me that they knew of a goat place that got a guard donkey and it actually thought the new kids were a threat and killed them after they were born. But that's just what I heard from a friend no first hand experience as I have never had a donkey.


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

My only experience has been with Anatolians. Even as a 4mo old, we have not had any loss from predators.


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## Used2bmimi (Oct 3, 2012)

I may have already posted this story on a different thread, but here goes! I agree with DDFN. Make sure that you get a guardian that was trained for the job and raised around the animals it is meant to protect. My mother in law decided to get a guard llama to protect her sheep. Went to the sale and bought a really nice big male. She brought him home and turned him out with her flock. He was TERRIFIED of the sheep!! Bailed over the fence and took off. They caught him and tried him in the field next to the sheep. No go. They had him for a long time. He never got better. He would just bail over and through the fence any time the sheep got near him. There are family stories about catching Walter, apparently he wasn't very nice to people either. Finally, he got away when nobody was looking and disappeared into the mountains. They never saw him again. Poor Walter...


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## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

My dog is Anatolian cross and she does wander.
She's never tried the fences, but when we let her out of the goat pen for extended periods of time she does wander to the neighbors, but always comes home. She is in with the goats most of the time, so that's not a huge deal for me.


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## saradara12 (Dec 25, 2012)

@Mimi....that is a very funny story...."poor Walter..."
Thank you all for the feedback...I am leaning toward a dog, but am wondering how I keep it and my pet dogs from wanting to play and be pals. My dogs do farm work with me....fencing, chores etc. Also, if I move the goats/sheep to various pastures, does the dog just go with them? Is he attached to his herd or to his physical territory?


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

We don't have one yet, but after researching we chose the Karakachan dog. They aren't as prone to wander, love kids, and don't bark constantly (only bark when they need to). That's what will work for us since we have nearby neighbors, and since I want him safe with kids


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## Di (Jan 29, 2008)

I have 3 min horses. They are VERY canine aggressive. I would never allow my pet dogs out in the pasture alone with the horses. DH wanted to try to train the horses to like the dogs. I said, no...why change what makes them an excellent guard. If a dog gets close to the fence, they all GALLOP over like "I'm going to kill you! Come on...make my day"!!!

I've heard that you should only use the minimum "muscle" that you actually need. Since Llamas (trained guard animal) eats the same foods as your livestock, it's easy to add them to your herd, they can handle up to a large coyote, anything larger or animals that run in packs, requires a LGD or 2 (do you live in the "wild, wild west). Llamas will protect by gathering the herd and moving them away from the threat...they may stand and fight if attacked...but may be killed by large predators. Pry's will protect your flock, and invite humans in (we already know about the wandering and digging and barking). Anatolians/Maremmas...generally will kill any animal that looks at the flock...they will also protect your home/children/yard etc., you may need some insurance, lol. These are generalizations, of course, if you are a great "trainer" you may avoid some common pitfalls. If not, get a trained or started animal from an experienced breeder. They seldom sell "puppies", they usually keep them for some months for training on their farm. 

I also have 3 alpacas, 1 intact, 1 gelded males (2.5yo), and a female 18mos. Boys separate of course. The female is with my Nigerian does with kids. I got the feeling that Jenny liked the kiddies. She followed them around and they would climb on her when she was cushed. Now it appears she's "guarding" the kids. If you are a stranger, she RUNS up to the fence to see who you are. When we go out to play with said kids, she follows us around and puts her nose right next to ours as if to say "be nice to those babies, are you sure you need to be with my babies?" When I was giving one it's dose of cocci prevention she looked like she was going to spit at me for a minute, lol. One thing we don't do is "chase the babies", we don't usually anyway, but, Jenny doesn't like that for sure! Good girl Jenny!


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## Texas.girl (Dec 20, 2011)

I only know what I have read. There is a herd of goats and a llama on the outskirts of Rocksprings, TX. They all seem to get along just fine. I am sure that pasture sees stray dogs and wild critters often. So my guess is the llama is doing its job just fine.


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## honeymeadows (Nov 20, 2012)

We have a great pyrenees that we got as a puppy from working parents. They are extremely cute puppies! However they do take a long time to mature and get down to work. My dog is now 3yrs old and we really depend on her. There is definitely an inherent drive to protect 'their' herd/flock. We had lost 40-50 chickens to racoons, while the guard donkey slept. Not one lost since we got the dog. I have a hawk family that lives on the property too. They don't come close. However, when she was about 1 1/2 we borrowed a shock collar because she was having some chasing fun both with goats and chickens on occasion. I had to correct her twice. (They are smart dogs). 
Several caveats though: 1) you must have either excellent fencing or run one of those wireless electronic fences. 2) LGD's are a little different than other dogs. They are loving and sweet, yes, but they are very independent and bred for that since they have to make independent decisions about predators. So don't expect an honors student obedience dog. If you say 'sit' - they will think about it and maybe agree it is a good idea (you're holding a treat) and maybe not. 
The dog gets along with the sheep, donkey and other equines by the way. However if my ram starts to harass the does, she will chase him away. Smart dog.


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## honeymeadows (Nov 20, 2012)

One more thing:
you said you have 'a lot' of coyotes. If you have high predator pressure you will need at least 2 dogs to work as a team. Otherwise the coyotes will draw the dog out while the others go in for the attack.


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