# Thick Placental sacks?



## Frosty1 (Jul 12, 2011)

This is the first year that I've lost any babies, and it's been both for the same reason. 

The first doe, (a first timer) had her twins sometime in the wee morning hours a few days ago. When I found her, one baby was active, and one baby was dead, still in the sack.

The next doe, an experienced mother, just kidded with quads (my first ever!) today. I had gone out to check on her and found a bubble with nothing inside already partly out. I wasn't entirely sure what it was, so I went in for towels and to check. When I came out, no more than 10 minutes later, she had triplets out, that had clearly come out right after each other. One baby was practically under her, still in the sack. I broke the sack and did my best stimulating, swinging, and even giving him artificial respiration, but he didn't make it.

For one thing, I can't help but blame myself for going back inside when I did, or I would have been there for the kid. :tears: For another, why were the two kids this year unable to break the sacks? Is there some mineral deficiency that causes thick sacks?


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## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

I'm sorry for your losses. Yes, thick amniotic sacks are a sign of selenium deficiency.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

very sorry for you loss....I agree with Salty on possible cause..


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I'm so sorry for your loss. I also agree with Salty.


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

Were the sacks discolored in any way? What kind of hay do you feed? 

I've heard of 2 causes.
fescue hay
selenium deficiency

I think it was in 2012, we had a doe that kidded a single buck kid, and his sack didn't break, and it was very thick and hard to break. I think it had a yellow look to it, it was also very hard to see through as well.
The hay we were using that winter was fescue/mix. We did supplement the doe with selenium e gel, before, during and after pregnancy, but there is always the chance she still didn't have enough.
Kid was fine, but wouldn't have been if I hadn't been there to get him out of that sack.


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## NyGoatMom (Jan 26, 2013)

So sorry...please don't blame yourself...:hug: we all do the best we can. I agree with Saltey...


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## Frosty1 (Jul 12, 2011)

Thank you everyone. I feed coastal hay. I'm not sure I can even get fescue here, so I definitely haven't fed it. It could be selenium deficiency, though. I supplemented her with selenium gel about a month before she kidded, but I suppose she may still be deficient. I'll definitely give her some more.

The other three babies are doing well, two boys and a girl. They're feisty and really cute! Mama's taking good care of them, too.


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## packhillboers (Feb 2, 2011)

I did not realize that selenium deficiency could cause thick sacks. That is interesting. I am not sure if it is a sure thing or not but the fescue grass has been determined to be a cause of thick sacks in horses and possibly cows as well if they eat it in their latter duration of pregnancy. We took our mini mare completely off of the fescue grasses as we wanted to be sure there would be no thick sack birthing issues since mini horses seem more prone to delivery problems. I do have one doe that has had thicker sacks that if I was not present at the time, I feel the baby may have died. This mamma doe has had triplets and I sure had a tough time getting that sack open even after it bounced on the ground. We have supplemented with selenium and vitamin E throughout pregnancies here with our goats. I am not sure if wild fescue is a problem in Florida like it is in other parts. There is a type of fescue that fights off the mold spores that supposedly are the problem for livestock. This maybe something worth reading about if you have more ongoing issues with thick sacks in your herd. I am also not sure that this is a problem for goats as it is for horses. I do wonder as we have had thick sacks that won't easily break open and we do have a large amount of the wild fescue grass in our pasture.


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## doecygoat (Jan 18, 2013)

This is interesting! Had no idea...thanks everybody.


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## canyontrailgoats (Jan 4, 2014)

Use Bose instead of the gel, it's prescription strength and lasts longer in their system. You'll need to get it from your vet. Do you offer loose minerals?


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## chrisarvor (Sep 23, 2011)

*minerals*

i am new to goats but i was told how important the mineral block is for them ,do you have one in with goats ,must be sad to lose them like that 
Do you buy selenium in powcer or tablets for goats??


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## canyontrailgoats (Jan 4, 2014)

Selenium is given by a Bose shot from your vet, or through a gel bought from livestock supply magazines. And a loose mineral mix is way better than a block, the blocks are close to useless


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## wndngrvr (Dec 10, 2011)

I got some loose selenium from Caprine supply that I saw on another site as a recommendation. I have it out as free choice along with free choice minerals, kelp and baking soda. I have'nt used BoSe for several years now and things seem to be going well. I try to stay away from shots as much as possible. Didn't know selenium caused a tough sack, was always concerned with White Mus. Disease - weak limbs in babies. Learn something new all the time. Anyone with Nigerians probably allready knows what drama queens they are - they think a shot is going to kill them - or else mine are just spoiled.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good advice.

I am very sorry.


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## lottsagoats1 (Apr 12, 2014)

BO-SE lasts in the system for 21 days. The gel and other oral Selenium lasts 24-36 hours, max.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I was just reading that Fescue hay can cause very thick sacks and fat umbilical cords and longer then normal gestation, leading to larger kids...ect...

http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/fescue.html


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