# Calamine lotion on goat?



## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

I was wondering if anyone had used Calamine Lotion on an itchy goat, and if it is ok to use. A google search brought up that it shouldn’t be used on dogs because zinc oxide is toxic to them.
My doe has a mysterious itch, mostly on her sides. We think it is some kind of bug bites. She had it last August too. Last year she bit and chewed a hole in her side that got infected. This year I caught it early and put a t-shirt on her. So she hasn’t created a sore, she just chewed the fur off. But it is agonizing to watch her scratch so much. And with the heat we are having, a shirt is probably making her hotter.
I tried Benadryl, antibiotic/steroid cream, Nustock, Tea Tree oil, and iodine/water mix. Nothing worked. 
So I am wondering, since Calamine is MY go-to for itches, can I try it on her?


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I would think it would be ok since there is a better chance a goat is deficient in zinc than plenty of zinc.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> I would think it would be ok since there is a better chance a goat is deficient in zinc than plenty of zinc.


Thanks for the reply!
I think I’m going to try it today.
I want to wash her with mild soapy water, dry and then put Calamine on.


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## friesian49 (Jul 2, 2018)

Let us know how it goes, as you said, I've used it plenty of times and it could be another option for my girls, if needed. Best of luck!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

friesian49 said:


> Let us know how it goes, as you said, I've used it plenty of times and it could be another option for my girls, if needed. Best of luck!


Thanks.
I made chamomile tea and letting it cool to use as the wash, instead of soap.
I don’t want to dry her skin out.


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

How is it going?


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Tanya said:


> How is it going?


We just finished. It went well.
She didn’t go back to scratching right away, so, fingers crossed.


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

Really praying it works


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Tanya said:


> Really praying it works


Thanks!


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

I made some soap with aloe Vera and goats milk that I used on my dog with unbearable hot spots and it soothed her skin. Have you tried aloe Vera? It might help too. I hope something works for you!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

I have not tried aloe vera. The Calamine seems to be working, at least for a while.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Maybe she needs a cortisone shot from the vet? That cleared up our goat's itchiness/sores that topical treatments and oral benadryl didn't work on.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

21goaties said:


> Maybe she needs a cortisone shot from the vet? That cleared up our goat's itchiness/sores that topical treatments and oral benadryl didn't work on.


I thought about that too.
How many times did your goat have to get this shot?


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

MadHouse said:


> I thought about that too.
> How many times did your goat have to get this shot?


She got it once on May 27th 2021. The vet said it lasted 4-8 weeks. She doesn't have the problem in fall/winter so I'm hoping she won't need it again before fall. Here is the thread: Skin issue


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

21goaties said:


> She got it once on May 27th 2021. The vet said it lasted 4-8 weeks. She doesn't have the problem in fall/winter so I'm hoping she won't need it again before fall. Here is the thread: Skin issue


I just re-read your entire thread.
I could very well be seasonal allegies for Willow too.
The t-shirt stops her from chewing herself raw, just the fur is chewed. Otherwise she would have sores like your May did, I bet.
I will see how it goes this week. If she is still super itchy next week, I think I will ask my vet for a cortisone shot for her.
Thanks @21goaties


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## Tindi (Jul 11, 2012)

Mine have been really itchy because the black flies and mosquitos have been bad this year and they have bug bites. I use horse fly spray and it stops the bugs and the itching


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Tindi said:


> Mine have been really itchy because the black flies and mosquitos have been bad this year and they have bug bites. I use horse fly spray and it stops the bugs and the itching


Do you milk your goats?
I have been using Dairy Boss pour-on on my goats to try and repel flies and mosquitoes. I can’t say it is working extremely well.
But I wasn’t sure about Fly Sprays, if I could use those on milking does.


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

There is a product called Vet's Best Flea and Tick Spray, and I have been using it to treat mites. It is all natural, so you don't have to worry about it contaminating your milk supply. It seems to help keep flies at bay, and does really help with the itchiness. There is a spray and a shampoo. I haven't tried the shampoo yet. I don't know if you can get it in Canada, but I think it would be worth a try. It's working well for me.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Caileigh Jane Smith said:


> There is a product called Vet's Best Flea and Tick Spray, and I have been using it to treat mites. It is all natural, so you don't have to worry about it contaminating your milk supply. It seems to help keep flies at bay, and does really help with the itchiness. There is a spray and a shampoo. I haven't tried the shampoo yet. I don't know if you can get it in Canada, but I think it would be worth a try. It's working well for me.


Thanks @Caileigh Jane Smith . Unfortunately it looks like that is not available here. Just the hot spot sprays for dogs are available form Vet’s Best.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

So, calamine lotion did not solve the itching problem.

Today I went to the vet. He gave me 4 shots of dexamethasone to give once a day for 4 days. He was dithering between a long lasting or short acting steroid. He decided on the short acting because Willow is in milk.
I am keeping my fingers crossed. I hope I can take the shirt off her tomorrow.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good luck.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Willow had 3 of her 4 shots so far. The itchiness is definitely better, but not gone. I still use the Calamine lotion twice a day on her and it helps temporarily, and she still has to wear her shirt, as she wants to chew the spots.
She has better appetite now and therefore behaves better at milking time again. I am hoping these improvements continue after the last shot is done (this evening).


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> Good luck.


Thanks!


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

I hope she heals up completely!

Just FYI, the shot that our May got was long lasting Triamcinolone 40 mg.









Triamcinolone Acetonide | VCA Animal Hospital


Triamcinolone acetonide is given by mouth or injection and is used on and off label to treat Addison’s disease, inflammatory conditions, and immune-mediated diseases. Give as directed. Common side effects include increased drinking, increased urination, and increased appetite. Do not use in pets...




vcahospitals.com





I just noticed a small sore appear on May's belly and she has been scratching more during the last couple of days, but it has been months since she got the shot.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

21goaties said:


> I hope she heals up completely!
> 
> Just FYI, the shot that our May got was long lasting Triamcinolone 40 mg.
> 
> ...


Thanks for the info and the good wishes. 
I hope May’s spot is not going to get bad.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Oh I hope this last shot lasts longer. Bless her heart. I wonder about the aloe vera gel myself. But youve had great suggestions by everyone. Sorry I have no idea.i just hope you find something that works. But,,,,I do love the pictures of her in her Tshirt😁.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

I really hope Willow heals up. It is going to be strange seeing her naked again though.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Have you tried putting a little Neosporin on the raw spot? Calendula oil works extremely well on raw spots also. Long time ago, the next door neighbor had a dog with flea bite allergies. Steroids were used, though the skin became inflamed and itchy again once the course was finished. Secondary infection developed from gnawing at the spots, and the Neosporin helped calm down the inflammation quite well. Still, that little dog gnawed at what was starting to heal until it was all red every once in a while. I loaned her some calendula oil and within a week, the skin was no longer inflamed, dog stop worrying the raw spots and hair started to grow back in.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

NigerianNewbie said:


> Have you tried putting a little Neosporin on the raw spot? Calendula oil works extremely well on raw spots also. Long time ago, the next door neighbor had a dog with flea bite allergies. Steroids were used, though the skin became inflamed and itchy again once the course was finished. Secondary infection developed from gnawing at the spots, and the Neosporin helped calm down the inflammation quite well. Still, that little dog gnawed at what was starting to heal until it was all red every once in a while. I loaned her some calendula oil and within a week, the skin was no longer inflamed, dog stop worrying the raw spots and hair started to grow back in.


That is good to know!
I didn’t do neosporin but another antibiotic cream from the vet. It did nothing.
She doesn’t actually have raw spots because I have a shirt on her. All she can do is gnaw through the shirt and just get the fur off a bit. The skin is not red or raw looking.
But this reminds me to make calendula oil. Thanks!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

FizzyGoats said:


> I really hope Willow heals up. It is going to be strange seeing her naked again though.


Thanks! You are so right!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

This morning Willow had two raw open spots (where the t-shirt ends). Shucks. That means the dex did not work. She is now on Penicillin for the next 7 days, as per vet. He says that if the dex didn’t work, Triamcinolone wouldn’t be working either. And she likely has a secondary infection. I also ordered the same antibiotic/steroid cream that worked for her last year.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Darn, that's too bad. I hope you can figure this out for her soon. I can imagine how frustrating this is.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Have you teied the calendula oil yet? On Thors hot spot, that providone worked really well. Dried it up, and he stopped knawing on it!


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Gosh, MadHouse, I am sorry you and Willow are having to continue to deal with this frustration. Virtual hugs for her and you.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

MellonFriend said:


> Darn, that's too bad. I hope you can figure this out for her soon. I can imagine how frustrating this is.


Thanks! I hope the antibiotic is going to do the trick.


Moers kiko boars said:


> Have you teied the calendula oil yet? On Thors hot spot, that providone worked really well. Dried it up, and he stopped knawing on it!


No, I didn’t get any calendula oil yet, but I used polysporin on the raw spots. Iodine didn’t work for her. She loves licking that. 


NigerianNewbie said:


> Gosh, MadHouse, I am sorry you and Willow are having to continue to deal with this frustration. Virtual hugs for her and you.


Thanks NigerianNewbie!


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

Oh, that's too bad! I wonder if Nustock could help?


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Caileigh Jane Smith said:


> Oh, that's too bad! I wonder if Nustock could help?


Nope, it didn’t help. She likes licking it too.


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## K.B. (Mar 15, 2021)

MadHouse said:


> Nope, it didn’t help. She likes licking it too.


 that's too bad!


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## Iluvlilly! (Apr 6, 2019)

Darn, thought Willow would snap back. Sorry to hear that.


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

Rats! Poor baby, I was hoping that the dex would work. Have you used Benadryl orally or cream? I have a recipe for calamine soap do you want it?


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

GoofyGoat said:


> Rats! Poor baby, I was hoping that the dex would work. Have you used Benadryl orally or cream? I have a recipe for calamine soap do you want it?


I have used benadryl (liquid and pills) numerous times since she started scratching. It never did work.
Right now I am using polysporin on the sores, until we get the other cream from the vet. On the itchy spots that she can’t get to I slather calamine, which give temporary relief.
I won’t wash her now, it is wet and cool here now. But thanks for the offer!

I looked at my notes from last year. After she got on antibiotics it took two more days of being itchy. I am still keeping my fingers crossed for the penicillin to work.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

So, I am still in the dark as to why this happens. Last year in early August, and this year in early August.
One of the things I always wonder looking at the sores is, maybe it IS meningeal worm? The new sores that are past the t-shirt are almost in a line. It could be a bug bit her multiple times, and she is over sensitive to the bites. Or could it be m worm? The itchy spots are not all symmetrical and in lines. They are on both sides of her body in different areas, and now on her udder too.
I watch her hind legs all the time. To me she walks normal, never stumbles, jumps up on the milk stand, climbs up her ramp to the balcony, jumps and runs around... all looks normal.
Does m worm sometimes show only in itchy spots?
@GoofyGoat @happybleats 
Thanks


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

The itchy spots from mw is them migrating up the spine...so the goats chews to try to get relief. It won't be the only symptom. 
There could be some type of bug or allergy to a plant she is sensitive to that August brings out?


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

happybleats said:


> The itchy spots from mw is them migrating up the spine


Up from back to front, or front to back? Is there a specific pattern for MW itchy spots?


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Would it hurt to treat for M worm just in case? I mean you don't use chemical dewormers often so maybe it wouldn't hurt just to use one this once?


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

It won't hurt to treat just in case. 
Normal bite pattern is along side of the spine. Or near as they can reach..starting at the tail end as this is where migration starts.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

MellonFriend said:


> Would it hurt to treat for M worm just in case? I mean you don't use chemical dewormers often so maybe it wouldn't hurt just to use one this once?





happybleats said:


> Normal bite pattern is along side of the spine. Or near as they can reach..starting at the tail end as this is where migration starts.


Ok, hers started in the middle. Closer to the ground than the spine. Then some in the front, one right on the spine, now it its at the back. So, not the M worm pattern at all.
I will try and be patient to see if the antibiotic works, before I start thinking about treating for M worm.
Otherwise I wouldn’t know what worked.
Thanks


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Kind of sounds like an immune system problem. I'm wondering if working on super healthy rumen and immune system would help. Really not sure what that help looks like though. The obvious ones like garlic and vitamin C, minerals and other vitamins. The other thought is making sure everything is organic.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Can you take pictures for us? Maybe up close &where we can see the pattern? Who knows, maybe someone will recognize it? Worth a try!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Here she is. She is chewing it.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Definitely somthing irritating her. Won't hurt to treat MW just in case.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Bless her heart. Something is definatley biting her..


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I do agree.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Poor Willow. 😕


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## Tindi (Jul 11, 2012)

I would bath her with a antibacterial shampoo and rinse her really well and put a longer shirt on her. Looks like she is chewing where she can reach along the t shirt bottom.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

This is probably way off but is it possible she has really sensitive skin and the first irritations we’re bites or something that really bothered her and now the shirt itself is bothering her? Maybe rubbing right where it ends or something? The new bumps just look like they’re right at the end of the shirt. Of course, that could also likely be because something is biting her or bothering her and that’s where the protection of the shirt ends. I’m just grasping at straws here. Poor Willow. Whatever it is, I hope for your sake and hers, she heals up soon.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Fizzygoats may be in to something here.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

FizzyGoats said:


> This is probably way off but is it possible she has really sensitive skin and the first irritations we’re bites or something that really bothered her and now the shirt itself is bothering her? Maybe rubbing right where it ends or something? The new bumps just look like they’re right at the end of the shirt. Of course, that could also likely be because something is biting her or bothering her and that’s where the protection of the shirt ends. I’m just grasping at straws here. Poor Willow. Whatever it is, I hope for your sake and hers, she heals up soon.


When I take the shirt off, the first thing she does is start chewing. We have tried keeping it off during our walks. It was no good.
I think it is more likely that the bugs got her there better, and/or that she has been able to reach those spots that were “naked”..


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Tindi said:


> I would bath her with a antibacterial shampoo and rinse her really well and put a longer shirt on her. Looks like she is chewing where she can reach along the t shirt bottom.


The shirt rides up where her leg starts. I pull it back every time I go there.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Have you ever given her sulfur baths or medicated baths?


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> Kind of sounds like an immune system problem. I'm wondering if working on super healthy rumen and immune system would help. Really not sure what that help looks like though. The obvious ones like garlic and vitamin C, minerals and other vitamins. The other thought is making sure everything is organic.


I started daily probiotics now. She gets garlic and vitamin C every day too, and has her minerals and kelp. She also gets daily herbamins.
We can’t get everything organic, but we try our best.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> Have you ever given her sulfur baths or medicated baths?


No. What kind of product do you suggest?
I have medicated shampoo left from our dog who was itchy. Would that be ok?




__





Canadian Medicated Shampoo | Vetoquinol


Canadian Medicated Shampoo is a cleansing antiseptic shampoo indicated as an aid in the treatment of non-specific superficial dermatoses.




www.vetoquinol.ca


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

NigerianNewbie said:


> Have you tried putting a little Neosporin on the raw spot? Calendula oil works extremely well on raw spots also. Long time ago, the next door neighbor had a dog with flea bite allergies. Steroids were used, though the skin became inflamed and itchy again once the course was finished. Secondary infection developed from gnawing at the spots, and the Neosporin helped calm down the inflammation quite well. Still, that little dog gnawed at what was starting to heal until it was all red every once in a while. I loaned her some calendula oil and within a week, the skin was no longer inflamed, dog stop worrying the raw spots and hair started to grow back in.


I am now using my homemade healing salve that has calendula and other calming herbs in it, on her raw spots.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

MadHouse said:


> No. What kind of product do you suggest?
> I have medicated shampoo left from our dog who was itchy. Would that be ok?
> 
> 
> ...


I'd try it.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> I'd try it.


I will try it, if and when it warms up today.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

About the M worm treatment. (I am not convinced she has it but if I don’t see improvement or another avenue I will consider it).
I looked up the doses for prevention and for treatment. As long as there are no neurological symptoms, one can do prevention. 3 days of Ivermectin, then 5 days of Safeguard double the cattle dose.
Treatment is 23 cc of Safeguard for a minimum of 5 days.
My patient is also having trouble with eating. She eats hay and browse just fine. She has been refusing her grain pellets and alfalfa pellets since this all started. I am hesitant to put so much dewormer into her gut. 
We had an extremely dry summer. One rain in all of July. During and after that rain she did not go out to browse until all was dry again. Her itchiness started at the end of July. The rainy time came when she had been itchy for 3 weeks already. I don’t let them out when the ground is wet. And yes, White Tail Deer are around.
And yes, she is still scratching


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

At that time of year, what is out there? I mean like is it high pollen season? Fungus? Mold? If her skin is easily irritated and itchy, what supplements can help with skin? Collagen? Oatmeal?

How bad are the bugs and what detracts those bugs? I recently read that people low on B vitamins tend to be more attractive to mosquitoes.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

ksalvagno said:


> At that time of year, what is out there? I mean like is it high pollen season? Fungus? Mold? If her skin is easily irritated and itchy, what supplements can help with skin? Collagen? Oatmeal?
> 
> How bad are the bugs and what detracts those bugs? I recently read that people low on B vitamins tend to be more attractive to mosquitoes.


That’s interesting. I’m like a mosquito magnet. And no matter what I do, what foods I eat and supplements I take, I’m always low on various vitamin B’s. 


@MadHouse, so the cream that’s now ordered helped her last year, right? I wonder if looking more closely at that cream versus the ones that didn’t work would point you in the direction of what she needs (likely yearly around this time) to help stay ahead of it. 

I hope you can get something figured out. I know when your goats are miserable, you are miserable for them.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

@ksalvagno and @FizzyGoats 
I have been giving her B-complex within this time, but not every day.
(I have decided to do it every day again now.)
I wonder about absorption. One time I gave her a shot of B-complex, then we went for our walk right away. Within 15 min of the walk she peed and it was orange from the Vitamin B. A few minutes later a bug bit her on the belly and drew blood, and she went crazy scratching it.

Thanks for all your well wishes and advice. I hope I don’t come across oppositional. I do appreciate all the advice given to me. I just have to weigh the options, and see what is doable here.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

You’ve never come across oppositional to me and always seemed grateful for input even if it misses the mark. I think we’re just throwing everything we can think of out there and hoping something eventually will stick. You’re there with her, know her, have your eyes and hands on her, so you’ll know if something might be helpful or not. I doubt anyone faults you for dismissing what doesn’t fit and focusing on things that you think might help. 

Definitely keep us updated on Willow.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

FizzyGoats said:


> You’ve never come across oppositional to me and always seemed grateful for input even if it misses the mark. I think we’re just throwing everything we can think of out there and hoping something eventually will stick. You’re there with her, know her, have your eyes and hands on her, so you’ll know if something might be helpful or not. I doubt anyone faults you for dismissing what doesn’t fit and focusing on things that you think might help.
> 
> Definitely keep us updated on Willow.


🤗 Thank you @FizzyGoats !


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Ivomec injectable is used at a prevention of sorts..it kills the deer worm before it can migrate. Since she isn't having neurological issues..I might try that first before safeguard. 

Manuka honey is great for skin issues.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

happybleats said:


> Ivomec injectable is used at a prevention of sorts..it kills the deer worm before it can migrate. Since she isn't having neurological issues..I might try that first before safeguard.
> 
> Manuka honey is great for skin issues.


What is the dosage you have there for Ivermectin only, for prevention?
Is it also 1cc per 55 lbs for 3 days? 
Thanks Cathy!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

We did the dog shampoo bath a few days ago. It didn’t help.
The new cream came in and we started it yesterday. So far no change. We are on day 5 of 7 for the penicillin.
If tomorrow morning she is not less itchy, I will treat her for hookworm.
@goathiker I have read it is one dose of Safeguard for hookworm. Is that what you did? And how long did it take before they stopped scratching?


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Would improvising some type of an e-collar to wear for a few days possibly help her not to be able to reach the itchy areas? Have made them out of 2-4 stacked cardboard pieces, shaped like those rounded neck supports for people, punched holes through both sides of the carboard once fitted to size, and laced together with a shoe string.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

This is a long shot. I use 1 ounce of ACV (raw) with 10 drops of sage essential oil for poison ivy. It really helps the itching and the poison ivy goes away pretty quickly. You will have to put it on multiple times per day. While I know you aren't dealing with poison ivy, I wonder if it could help soothe the skin.

This is also the sulfur dip I was talking about earlier. 








16 oz Lime Sulfur Dip


Lime Sulfur Dip, (16 oz) excellent for Sarcoptic Mange, this powerful solution helps relieve pets of serious conditions associated with non-specific dermatitis and parasites.



www.jefferspet.com


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

NigerianNewbie said:


> Would improvising some type of an e-collar to wear for a few days possibly help her not to be able to reach the itchy areas? Have made them out of 2-4 stacked cardboard pieces, shaped like those rounded neck supports for people, punched holes through both sides of the carboard once fitted to size, and laced together with a shoe string.


This is what seems to be working today. I cut my own favourite dress down for her  !









I am thinking of your design and trying to understand it.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> This is a long shot. I use 1 ounce of ACV (raw) with 10 drops of sage essential oil for poison ivy. It really helps the itching and the poison ivy goes away pretty quickly. You will have to put it on multiple times per day. While I know you aren't dealing with poison ivy, I wonder if it could help soothe the skin.
> 
> This is also the sulfur dip I was talking about earlier.
> 
> ...


Thanks. I don’t have sage EO here, and it seems Calamine is working for temporary relief and soothing. 
My girlfriend just picked up a reecommended homeopathic for itching. We don’t have phones, I could have asked her to pick up sage EO, but she was on the way.


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

She has Summer itch or Sweet itch. 
She needs After bite and you need to address the tiny midges that cause it.
After Bite where she's already been bitten and Cylence to keep the No-See-Ums off of her.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

@MadHouse I know it’s not a funny situation but seeing Willow in that lovely sun dress just made me chuckle. She looks great in it. Now you need to find a replacement for your closet. I can’t believe you cut your favorite dress for her. Oh wait, yes I can. 





goathiker said:


> She has Summer itch or Sweet itch.
> She needs After bite and you need to address the tiny midges that cause it.
> After Bite where she's already been bitten and Cylence to keep the No-See-Ums off of her.


I’d never heard of this. I’m filing this away for a future ‘just-in-case’ with my goats.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

goathiker said:


> She has Summer itch or Sweet itch.
> She needs After bite and you need to address the tiny midges that cause it.
> After Bite where she's already been bitten and Cylence to keep the No-See-Ums off of her.


Is Afterbite ok to be consumed? As she licks everything off if she can.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

MadHouse said:


> This is what seems to be working today. I cut my own favourite dress down for her  !
> View attachment 212084
> 
> 
> ...


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Site seems to be double posting. @MadHouse, you will need to "click to expand" to see the design I drew for you.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Ok, I see how it works now. Thanks so much for the detailed explanation.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

MadHouse said:


> Ok, I see how it works now. Thanks so much for the detailed explanation.


You're more than welcome.


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

Well, I don't have anything helpful to offer, but I hope you can find some solutions!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

FizzyGoats said:


> @MadHouse I know it’s not a funny situation but seeing Willow in that lovely sun dress just made me chuckle. She looks great in it. Now you need to find a replacement for your closet. I can’t believe you cut your favorite dress for her. Oh wait, yes I can.


I chuckled too! She proceeded to dance like a young girl when the buckaroo came out! Here she was, dressed up and so excited, it was great to see she was feeling good!
I would have taken more pictures, but I had to direct the circus.
This is just the pre-dance pee, then I had toput the iPad away.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Caileigh Jane Smith said:


> Well, I don't have anything helpful to offer, but I hope you can find some solutions!


Thanks!
I feel so blessed to have support from all you guys. Even just a well wishing is helpful!


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

MadHouse said:


> I chuckled too! She proceeded to dance like a young girl when the buckaroo came out! Here she was, dressed up and so excited, it was great to see she was feeling good!
> I would have taken more pictures, but I had to direct the circus.
> This is just the pre-dance pee, then I had toput the iPad away.
> View attachment 212101
> ...


She does look beautiful in that dress!


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

Maybe this will be your start to goat fashion wear. You can call Garments for Goats. Or Doe Duds. 

Even though she wears her (your) clothes well, I hope she gets to run around naked again soon.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

So, @21goaties , do you think your doe has sweet itch?
I think Willow has it.
I looked it up. It is common in horses. They get it at around 4 years old (Willow is 4), and it gets worse every year, for horses anyway. It is an allergy to the midge (gnat) bite. They come around dawn and dusk, and do their nasty biting.
They can’t bite through clothes, which explains why Willow has new bites just past her shirt.
Too bad for Willow that the steroid didn’t work. I will be buying CyLence on Monday. I hope that works better than BOSS pour-on.
For her itchy spots, Afterbite did not work either. So far, Calamine still works the best, but only temporarily.


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## Tindi (Jul 11, 2012)

I use fly wipe or horse wipe after a bath. Bugs are bad this year. Works for me. Love the goat dress, guess its a good excuse to buy yourself a new dress!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Tindi said:


> I use fly wipe or horse wipe after a bath. Bugs are bad this year. Works for me. Love the goat dress, guess its a good excuse to buy yourself a new dress!


Thanks!
My question to you, @Tindi was, do you milk your goats?


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

We added mosquito screen to the barn window screens today, to try and keep the midges out a bit better. I also rubbed Willow down with baby oil (with a couple drops of eucalyptus oil), even under her shirt, because I read the midges can’t bite through oil very well.
Thank you @goathiker , for mentioning sweet itch. I did not know about it.

Willow has wrecked 2 of my favourite dresses now. 
Ah, the things we do for 💕.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

MadHouse said:


> We added mosquito screen to the barn window screens today, to try and keep the midges out a bit better. I also rubbed Willow down with baby oil (with a couple drops of eucalyptus oil), even under her shirt, because I read the midges can’t bite through oil very well.
> Thank you @goathiker , for mentioning sweet itch. I did not know about it.
> 
> Willow has wrecked 2 of my favourite dresses now.
> Ah, the things we do for 💕.


It's good to know you are maybe on the road to figuring this out. Well on the bright side, maybe you can buy yourself two new dresses as a reward to yourself for all the trouble this has caused you. They can be "from Willow" 😉.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

I love that idea @MellonFriend. 

I’m so glad there’s finally hope of helping Willow find some relief.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

MellonFriend said:


> It's good to know you are maybe on the road to figuring this out. Well on the bright side, maybe you can buy yourself two new dresses as a reward to yourself for all the trouble this has caused you. They can be "from Willow" 😉.


That’s ok! I have more in my closet, and I don’t wear them often anyway. And they look better on her!👗 🐐 👗 👨‍🌾


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

MadHouse said:


> So, @21goaties , do you think your doe has sweet itch?


Maybe? We do have a ton of gnats, mosquitoes, flies, etc. Goathiker suggested that may be it on May's thread a while back. We tried treating her with Cylence, Ultraboss, and Bimectin pour on (not at the same time), but it didn't do anything to stop the sores. Maybe it wasn't strong enough or we didn't do it often enough? She last had ivermectin pour on on August 4th 2021. The sores are back now so she needs another shot. But it would be great if I could find a topical that works.


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

The gnats live where there is even a tiny bit of moisture, usually under your water trough. To get rid of them completely you have to make sure that there's no damp spots anywhere. 
They fly about 1/2 mile for food so, sometimes you just have to get the fly sheet made for miniature horses.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

21goaties said:


> Maybe? We do have a ton of gnats, mosquitoes, flies, etc. Goathiker suggested that may be it on May's thread a while back. We tried treating her with Cylence, Ultraboss, and Bimectin pour on (not at the same time), but it didn't do anything to stop the sores. Maybe it wasn't strong enough or we didn't do it often enough? She last had ivermectin pour on on August 4th 2021. The sores are back now so she needs another shot. But it would be great if I could find a topical that works.


Aw, that’s too bad, I was so glad for you that your May was doing good this year. I hope another shot helps her out.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

MadHouse said:


> Aw, that’s too bad, I was so glad for you that your May was doing good this year. I hope another shot helps her out.


Yeah. She was fine while the shot was working and at least it didn't wear off quickly. If it is sweet itch there is no way for us to eliminate the gnats other than topical bug repellent. We are in south ga so it is basically a swamp here. The goats have hoop shelters and live in a huge pasture with woods.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

21goaties said:


> Yeah. She was fine while the shot was working and at least it didn't wear off quickly. If it is sweet itch there is no way for us to eliminate the gnats other than topical bug repellent. We are in south ga so it is basically a swamp here. The goats have hoop shelters and live in a huge pasture with woods.


If giving her a couple steroid shots a year works, maybe you can keep it at a minimum that way. I really hope so for you.
It is hard not to feel doomed with this.
We are looking at every option to prevent this for Willow for the next summers. Our one advantage is our short summers. We usually have the first frost in September.
Here is hoping for May and Willow, that it won’t be getting worse.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

goathiker said:


> The gnats live where there is even a tiny bit of moisture, usually under your water trough. To get rid of them completely you have to make sure that there's no damp spots anywhere.
> They fly about 1/2 mile for food so, sometimes you just have to get the fly sheet made for miniature horses.


I made a prototype of a fly sheet yesterday, from a tablecloth. I put it over her shirt last night. It covers her hind end including the tail, and it has 4 bungees that go around her legs (not too tight). It is to keep gnats from biting her. I was pretty sure this was safe for her to wear in terms of getting hung up on anything. Needless to say, I still was glad to see she was ok in the morning, still wearing it. It looks like a lab coat halloween costume. All she needs is goggles and a laptop. 🥼 No picture, as it is an in-the barn- night gown. Too private! No just kidding, too dark for pictures.
Now she is in heat, and forgets to scratch!! Yay for heats!


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

Aw, she looks adorable in her dress! I’ve been thinking. Neem Oil is a great bug deterrent you can spray it around your pens and in the barn to help keep the bugs away along with lemongrass and citronella. Just spray the area not your girls. (Trees, shrubs and screens etc) it might help minimize the amount of biting bugs that come into their living area. Hopefully you get a hard frost soon to knock them down sooner too. Those poor babies! We’re dealing with armies of red and fire ants and not much is helping but Cedarcide for flying bugs and amdro for the ants. Normally cedar shavings in the barn works but not this year so I feel your dismay! Hang In there!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

How awful, hope you can win the battle.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

GoofyGoat said:


> Aw, she looks adorable in her dress! I’ve been thinking. Neem Oil is a great bug deterrent you can spray it around your pens and in the barn to help keep the bugs away along with lemongrass and citronella. Just spray the area not your girls. (Trees, shrubs and screens etc) it might help minimize the amount of biting bugs that come into their living area. Hopefully you get a hard frost soon to knock them down sooner too. Those poor babies! We’re dealing with armies of red and fire ants and not much is helping but Cedarcide for flying bugs and amdro for the ants. Normally cedar shavings in the barn works but not this year so I feel your dismay! Hang In there!


Thank you. I hope you can keep the ants at bay. Do they bite the goats?



toth boer goats said:


> How awful, hope you can win the battle.


Thanks Pam. I hope so too.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

The coat has worked and Willow got no new bites where the coat covers her at night.
Her latest bites are on her head and neck. At least those she can’t chew, only scratch with her hoof.
I rubbed more baby oil on her last night.
Aloe Vera gel has shown to give her relief on the bald spots. It doesn’t seem to work on new spots that still have fur.
I finally got her picture. Excuse the droppings. It was morning.









My next prototype coat will have her neck covered as well.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

With horses they make face masks & neck coverings out of the fly screen. You might check and see if they have one for mini horses, that would fit her.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

That looks so great. I can’t believe you made that. I’m glad things are getting better for you and Willow.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Nice work.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Moers kiko boars said:


> With horses they make face masks & neck coverings out of the fly screen. You might check and see if they have one for mini horses, that would fit her.


I had a look. They are $300 US, so more for us, and between her getting too hot in the summer in it, and/or wrecking it and/or doing something crazy because it is too weird, I didn’t investigate how small the mini horse one is (she is a medium size goat). They look great of course, but as I said, I don’t know if it would be safe for a goat.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

FizzyGoats said:


> That looks so great. I can’t believe you made that. I’m glad things are getting better for you and Willow.





toth boer goats said:


> Nice work.


Thanks! She seems to be better.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

I had asked Kristie at LOH for advice about a topical itch reliever. She suggested spraying her Guardian Extract on it and then sprinkling LOH Back on Tract on the wet area. I ordered the Guardian extract. In the meantime I tried spraying Vetericyn on her sores and then dusting with B.O.T. Maybe it will speed up healing.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

MadHouse said:


> What is the dosage you have there for Ivermectin only, for prevention?
> Is it also 1cc per 55 lbs for 3 days?
> Thanks Cathy!


1 cc per 40 pounds sub q...once a week for 3 weeks. Sorry to s long. Covid has me in the hospital


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

happybleats said:


> 1 cc per 40 pounds sub q...once a week for 3 weeks. Sorry to s long. Covid has me in the hospital


Thanks Cathy.
I feel terrible for you. I somehow thought something was up. Sending healing prayers for speedy recovery! ❤ 💜


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

happybleats said:


> 1 cc per 40 pounds sub q...once a week for 3 weeks. Sorry to s long. Covid has me in the hospital


Oh Cathy, I hope you feel better soon!


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Be aware that injection of ivermectin is well known to cause resistance in parasites of goats. Duramectin is the only generation cleared for injection.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Get well soon Cathy. 
We are praying for you.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

The sores on Willow’s side are looking a lot better. They are just bald spots now, and I am applying Nustock every 3 days or more often. She is still itchy on her head and neck.
The poor girl had a limp on her front leg too, which is getting better (no swelling, no fever, no signs of pain when moving her joints). I take them for a walk every day and I think it helps a lot.
She has not had a lucky last two months, but hopefully is on the upswing now.

Neighbours brought over branches yesterday.
First she wasn’t even going to check them out. She has been rather tired the last week. (Today she is looking better.)









But then she woke up and joined the party.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Im glad she decided to.join the limb party! Shes a pretty girl. I do hope whatever it is stops attacking her.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

She’s already all dressed up, and I’m glad she’s enjoying the party today. Pink is a great color on her. I hope she stays on the mend and heals quickly!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Thanks ladies! 💜


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)




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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

FizzyGoats said:


> She’s already all dressed up, and I’m glad she’s enjoying the party today. Pink is a great color on her. I hope she stays on the mend and heals quickly!


She has a lovely wardrobe of colorful and functionable clothes, doesn't she. I also hope she stays on the mend as well.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

NigerianNewbie said:


> She has a lovely wardrobe of colorful and functionable clothes, doesn't she. I also hope she stays on the mend as well.


Thanks!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Unfortunately she is having a fever tonight and is uncomfortable.








Help please! Fever returned on day 4 of antibiotics


My doe Willow has a fever tonight. At 5:30 pm, at supper time, she was bawling loudly, like she never does. I rushed there and thought she had a belly ache. I massaged throat and rumen, and she burped a few times. I checked her temp. and it was 104.9 F She went to lie down and stared up. Then...




www.thegoatspot.net


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Is this going on again? Get a dark beer drench in her. Give her probios. Once the pressure is releived, its sounds like she needs Draxxin. 1cc per 100 lbs. Then a second injection in 10 days. To me it sounds as though she has more than one infection.


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

Poor thing! She’s had a rough time lately! I hope the vet can get it sorted out! ((HUG))


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Thanks @Moers kiko boars and @GoofyGoat . I will keep updating on the other thread.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

How. Is she this morning? Any better?


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Moers kiko boars said:


> How. Is she this morning? Any better?


She seems happier right now. Eating some grass, resting, chewing cud.
We are waiting for the vet.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Awww good to hear! Please let me know what the Vet says.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Moers kiko boars said:


> Awww good to hear! Please let me know what the Vet says.


I gave the update here:








Help please! Fever returned on day 4 of antibiotics


My doe Willow has a fever tonight. At 5:30 pm, at supper time, she was bawling loudly, like she never does. I rushed there and thought she had a belly ache. I massaged throat and rumen, and she burped a few times. I checked her temp. and it was 104.9 F She went to lie down and stared up. Then...




www.thegoatspot.net


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good to hear.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

I dosed the herd with Valbazen tonight. If Willow has Liver flukes, they all may have it.

The good thing today was, she was “naked”, shirt free all day. 
The bad thing today was, she has pink eye now. Because her latest itches are on her head by her ear, she got herself sand in her eye. I am treating her for pink eye. I tried to tie a bandana around the eye, because she keeps scratching it. But it won’t stay on. At least in the barn she can’t put more sand into her eye overnight.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Naked  Willow girl, keep your modesty now that you aren't wearing your pretty clothes. Good news you were able to obtain the Valbazen, I truly hope it is the missing puzzle piece. Oh my goodness, she has tried out the latest trend in headwear now also. She must be a fashion diva in goat form.  Keep getting well Willow, I'm rooting for you. 💕


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Here she is this morning, naked Pirate Pearl.









I have her on grass, so no more sand gets rubbed into her eye.








The bandage does not stay over her eye long, she rubs it on the fence post.
She can see her friends.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Well at least some of her problems are getting better.😅 The nude pirate look suites her! 

How's her apatite?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Poor girl, hope she gets better soon.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Thanks all!
Her appetite has been good. She still gets her protein lunch bucket, while I give her B complex, Red Cell and check her temp.


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

Willow dear Willow. Did your momma not teach you that its bad manners to scratch sand in your eyes? Poor girl. Good she is naked though. Even though I am sure she was the envy of all goat?


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Tanya said:


> Willow dear Willow. Did your momma not teach you that its bad manners to scratch sand in your eyes? Poor girl. Good she is naked though. Even though I am sure she was the envy of all goat?


My dear Willow is such a good girl, but she won’t listen to me about not scratching!
She is so busy rubbing that poor eye, it makes me sick and I have to walk away. 
She is the envy of all goats, but not because of the clothes! It’s the lunch bucket they all want! Baha!!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Ok, so my vet emailed me. He found a vet clinic that has Fasinex (triclabendazole) in stock. Apparently, this is the best dewormer for liver flukes as it gets all stages including the larval stage. It is unfortunately only available on emergency drug release in Canada, but this one clinic does have enough to spare for 4 goats. If I want he can put in a prescription and could get it from them.

I asked him in return, if it makes more sense to send in either blood or stool to test for liver flukes 10 days after I gave Valbazen. Then, if she is positive, order the Fasinex.
Have not heard back from him yet.

Any opinions? Order this for Willow, or for the whole herd or test first? The tests are very expensive here, so I would probably only do Willow.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

With Willow being the only one who seems to have a problem, I would only do Willow.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> With Willow being the only one who seems to have a problem, I would only do Willow.


Do you mean, only give her another dewormer, or only check her for liver flukes, or both?


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

ELISA blood work is 99% accurate in detecting liver fluke, though it is expensive. Fecal testing depends on the life stage of the liver fluke (same for other worms) and liver fluke can be easily mistaken for barber pole because of the similarities in the eggs. Snails transmit liver fluke and correcting or avoiding environmental exposure if possible lessens infestation risks. Immune response seems to play an important role in keeping parasite tolerance in check also.

Willow has been ill, receiving antibiotics, recovering, and is more susceptible and vulnerable. And/or it could be her immune response is naturally more weak than the other goats. It's possible Willow needs the Fasinex to help in the recovery from liver flukes and the other goats would be okay with Valbazen alone.

Gosh Madhouse, this seems like one of those between a rock and a hard place situations.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

If you choose to test, I would only do Willow. If you choose to get the prescription med, I would only do it for Willow. I'm assuming no one else is having any problems.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

As you know, I’m not a wise voice of experience so I don’t know what I’d do, but my guess is, I’d likely treat Willow and just Willow. I’d probably only do the pricey test if there are possible scary side effects from the medicine (and I have no clue if there are since I’m not familiar). The only way I wouldn’t treat, is if she seems like she’s fully recovering. And then, I’d likely pay for the test to make sure I’m right. 

If the other ones start showing symptoms, you’ll likely recognize it much quicker, then you can treat them. They either may not have it or their system was able to handle it or they were less affected and the Valbazen knocked it out. 

This is certainly a tough decision. 

My two cents isn’t even worth that, so I’d say go with your gut, go with whatever gives you peace of mind and feels right. 

Hopefully you’ll be able to talk to your vet again and figure out the best course from here. Willow is sure lucky to have you.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

@ksalvagno @NigerianNewbie @FizzyGoats 
Thanks so much for your input. It is very helpful.
💜


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

This is what the vet said this a.m. I requested a dose for Willow.
_If Willow has liver flukes, it is more likely to be the deer fluke Fasciola magna, which doesn't mature in domestic livestock and remains as a roving larval stage. Valbazan is less effective against this type of fluke compared to the fluke of domestic livestock Fasciola hepatica. The Fasinex that they have at Southeast Vet is only allowed into Canada on emergeny drug release and they have to account for every ml used so they usually bring in based on pre-order and don't always have extra. We could wait the 10 days, but I can't guarantee they will still have Fasinex available at that time._


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I agree, treat Willow.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Two good things today with Willow.
She eats a LOT and started eating alfalfa pellets again.
And, the jumped on the ramp in her stall, which she hadn’t done since she hurt her leg.
Yay!
She is still very itchy and scratching her eyebrow and other spots on her head and neck.
We don’t think she has pinkeye, but still continuing to treat her eye for it twice a day.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

That's what we want to hear, Willow! You keep eating all those goodies your mama puts in front of you and you will be feeling 100% in no time. 😇


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## Iluvlilly! (Apr 6, 2019)

Yay!! Hoping she continues to get better! 🙂


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good to hear.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

I don’t think this is the right time to dry her up. I had been milking as much as she normally gave, but she is making more milk right now. She was obviously very uncomfortable tonight. I had to tie her and milk her out. Poor thing. She wanted to run away. I feel awful. It is my first time drying up a doe.
She had been doing so well, I hope she is better in the morning. 
I am going to postpone the drying up. It is too much all at once.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Doesn't making more milk, or an increase in production, mean a doe is getting more healthy? I mean, that's a good thing possibly. Right? I know how to milk, read a crowd of post about does in milk, just never had a doe of my own. Bless her heart for becoming engorged, and bless your heart for feeling awful. She'll be better, more than likely, in the morning. Kind of seems like she isn't wanting to dry off either. 🌺🌼🌻💙


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Maybe a change in routine wouldn't be such a good idea right now.

I haven't dried any does up yet either, but I'm planning on taking it slowly when I do. What method were you trying?


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Thank you @NigerianNewbie and @MellonFriend, for your kind words. ♥ 
She is indeed ok this morning.
I think my mistakes were
One: Trying to dry her off right after she was fed a high protein anemia diet.
Two: Trying to dry her off at the same time as being so stressed and dealing with all her other issues.
I thought it was in her health’s interest.

Anyway, she was happy to come into the milk room, ate heartily and showed no signs of discomfort this morning. 😅 

@MellonFriend , I was doing it the slow way. I was still milking her twice a day, and left some milk in the udder every time.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Willow and her friends hanging out. Her left eye (the right one when you look at her) is the one that she scatches. It is looking better now. She is currently 🥰 lovesick.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Awwwww...she wants babies!!!!😍😍🥰🥰🥰🥰


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I feel sorry for her, she will be ok. 

She is cute.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Thanks @Moers kiko boars and @toth boer goats !
I sure hope she will be itch free soon and in condition to be bred in November. We shall see.

I dosed her with Fasinex on Tuesday. If the itching is due to liver flukes, how long do you think it would take to go away?


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

Oh I hope the fasinex works and poor Willow stops itching! You’ve done great with her! Fingers crossed soon she’ll be in shape To breed, I can’t wait to See a healthy happy mom and babies.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

I would say at least 10 days. It depends on what stage of infestation she has. There are 3 stages.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Moers kiko boars said:


> I would say at least 10 days. It depends on what stage of infestation she has. There are 3 stages.


Thanks @Moers kiko boars !
My vet thinks likely she has deer fluke (Fascioloides magna), and those would stay in the goat as larvae.
Of course, all of it is guess work.
I appreciate your input and will sptry and be patient.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

GoofyGoat said:


> Oh I hope the fasinex works and poor Willow stops itching! You’ve done great with her! Fingers crossed soon she’ll be in shape To breed, I can’t wait to See a healthy happy mom and babies.


Thanks @GoofyGoat !


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Hey I understand. Patience Is Not my best quality. Its a fight.for me...lol 24 hrs it should be healed! Right? Lol😂😁


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

I hope this solves it for Willow. You both need a break from the issues. I hope she’s healthy and happy and you get to remember what it’s like not to have to worry so much.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Moers kiko boars said:


> Hey I understand. Patience Is Not my best quality. Its a fight.for me...lol 24 hrs it should be healed! Right? Lol😂😁


Right!!



FizzyGoats said:


> I hope this solves it for Willow. You both need a break from the issues. I hope she’s healthy and happy and you get to remember what it’s like not to have to worry so much.


Thanks @FizzyGoats !


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## Goatastic43 (Jun 11, 2021)

Your doing great @MadHouse! Sending encouragement! Hope the Fasinex makes all the difference for Willow!


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

My fingers are crossed that the Fasinex does the trick and you get rewarded for all your hard work!🤞


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## Iluvlilly! (Apr 6, 2019)

I hope this is the answer! Your doing great Willow is a lucky goat!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Thanks so much @Goatastic43 @MellonFriend and @Iluvlilly! 
Your support helps immensely!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Good luck with the meds. I hope it does the trick.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good luck. 👍


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## Goatastic43 (Jun 11, 2021)

@MadHouse How is Willow doing?


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Goatastic43 said:


> @MadHouse How is Willow doing?


Thank you for checking on us.
Willow still scratches her eyebrow and now has pinkeye that appears to be painful. We are on day 3 of treating her for it. She continues to scratch and rub her bald spots that are on her neck, chin, ear and eyebrow. No open sores.
Other than that she eats well, has normal temperatures and digests well.
I am halfway in drying her up, with no more problems concerning full udder so far.

As far as I can gather, the cause for the itching is either sweet itch (allergy to gnat bites) or liver flukes (which she was treated for with two dewormers, one week apart), or something else. I am hoping to get clues as to the cause by watching the weather. Sweet itch gnats are supposedly active at 50*F and up and between dusk and dawn. Our evenings/nights are still warm enough for them. If the itching will stop while we still have warm weather, I would know it was not sweet itch.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Have you tried Benadryl?

Try a colt size face mask, to detour her from scratching.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> Have you tried Benadryl?
> 
> Try a colt size face mask, to detour her from scratching.


Yes, I have tried benadryl a number of times. It didn’t do anything.
Looking at face masks now.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

It has been two weeks since Fasinex, and Willow still has the crazy itchies, plus new spots.
My vet is suggesting skin scraping to check for mites. These were his words:

*I have my doubts that her skin issue is related to the flies. Reactions to flies are usually more localized to where the flies bite and don't tend to rotate. Flies like to bite animals in the same place repeatedly. Plus with flies you tend to get welts and thickening of the skin.

One possibility is mites. Mites can cause itching which leads to rubbing and hair loss. With mites we also tend to see more randomized patches of affected skin and the head and neck are often affected. With mites you also see less dramatic skin lesions, unless they are so itchy they are traumatizing the skin. We could do some skin scrapings to look for mites.*

I have not seen a single scab the whole time, but willing to try and see if mites are the issue. I have read skin scrapings are not always conclusive, so I would rather just give Ivermectin injectable and see if it helps.
What is your opinion?
Pictures below of her eyebrow spot that has moved up to her forehead now.









__
Sensitive content, not recommended for those under 18
Show Content










Neck spots









Under the chin

__
Sensitive content, not recommended for those under 18
Show Content










Wouldn’t that be something, if the whole time it was a simple thing, mites. Without scabs I thought it can’t be mites.
I feel like a fool that I haven’t treated for mites yet!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

The vet also mentioned it could be zinc response dermatitis. I had the same thought (thank you @Moers kiko boars) and have started last week, giving her a 25 mg zinc pill once a day. He suggested giving her 1 gram of zinc sulfate daily, but I don’t know where to get that. I may just give 2 x 25 mg daily. Any thought on that?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Have you checked the pharmacy for it.

I am very concerned about the eye swelling. What did the vet say on that.
It may be something in there.


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

I think it’d be easier to treat for mites than protect against every fly bite, so it’d actually be nice if that was it. Zinc wouldn’t be a hard issue to solve either. Hopefully the skin scraping will give you an answer. 

Is her eye swollen from rubbing it while she’s scratching that spot above her eye? 

Poor Willow. Don’t worry, your mom is going to figure this out, one way or another.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Really doesn't look like mites, but I agree that it's worth a shot. Maybe the skin scraping will reveal something after all. Zinc is a good idea too. One of my buck had a bout of strange balding this past spring and zinc and injectable ivermectin cleared it up. It certainly wasn't all the same symptoms Willow is having, but maybe, just maybe it will work.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

MadHouse said:


> He suggested giving her 1 gram of zinc sulfate daily, but I don’t know where to get that.


Zinc sulfate can be found in the vitamin section or online in a powdered form. Zinc sulfate is the supplement zinc with sulfur, combined. Is the 1 (one) gram a weight? If not, 1 (one) gram would be 1,000 mg. That many mg sounds extremely excessive, so hopefully the amount recommended is a weighed value.


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## Kaitlyn (Jan 20, 2021)

Best of luck with you and Willow, I can only imagine how frustrating it must be to still not know. I’m not knowledgeable enough to offer advice, but I do hope she recovers soon!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Thanks for all your replies!



toth boer goats said:


> Have you checked the pharmacy for it.
> 
> I am very concerned about the eye swelling. What did the vet say on that.
> It may be something in there.


No, not yet, but I will.
The vet hasn’t been here since the pinkeye, but he saw the pictures. I am treating the eye twice a day, and opening it up wide. There is nothing in there, as far as I can see. It is swollen and squinty right after one of her rubbing sessions. In between it doesn’t look so bad.



FizzyGoats said:


> I think it’d be easier to treat for mites than protect against every fly bite, so it’d actually be nice if that was it. Zinc wouldn’t be a hard issue to solve either. Hopefully the skin scraping will give you an answer.
> 
> Is her eye swollen from rubbing it while she’s scratching that spot above her eye?
> 
> Poor Willow. Don’t worry, your mom is going to figure this out, one way or another.


I agree!
Yes, that is why her eye is swollen. She rubs it a lot.
Thanks!



MellonFriend said:


> Really doesn't look like mites, but I agree that it's worth a shot. Maybe the skin scraping will reveal something after all. Zinc is a good idea too. One of my buck had a bout of strange balding this past spring and zinc and injectable ivermectin cleared it up. It certainly wasn't all the same symptoms Willow is having, but maybe, just maybe it will work.


That’s what I thought. 
I am weighting on the vet’s opinion how accurate a skin scraping is, and might just skip thta and give her injectable Ivermectin.



NigerianNewbie said:


> Zinc sulfate can be found in the vitamin section or online in a powdered form. Zinc sulfate is the supplement zinc with sulfur, combined. Is the 1 (one) gram a weight? If not, 1 (one) gram would be 1,000 mg. That many mg sounds extremely excessive, so hopefully the amount recommended is a weighed value.


Thanks. I will have to look into that.



Kaitlyn said:


> Best of luck with you and Willow, I can only imagine how frustrating it must be to still not know. I’m not knowledgeable enough to offer advice, but I do hope she recovers soon!


Thanks so much @Kaitlyn !


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Good Job @MadHouse for staying on top of this. You will find the solution, and teaching all of us along the way! Thankyou!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Ivermectin injectable was given to her today, sq. I am curious, but not holding my breath.


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## Goatastic43 (Jun 11, 2021)

I hope this is the solution! You’ve been such an awesome goat mamma for her, you both deserve a break!


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

Of course she is a good momma... she even gave up some of her wardrobe... all good goat mommas do that.... 😁


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Have you given her a sulfur bath? There is special sulfur shampoo and you would thoroughly lather up and you leave it on for a period of time and then rinse. What is the type of zinc in the tablets you are giving?









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www.chewy.com


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> Have you given her a sulfur bath? There is special sulfur shampoo and you would thoroughly lather up and you leave it on for a period of time and then rinse. What is the type of zinc in the tablets you are giving?
> 
> 
> 
> ...


I never did try the sulfur bath. I looked it up when you first suggested it, and I could only get it on amazon.ca for $80. I looked at the ingredients for that and Nustock, and decided not to spend the money on sulfur bath when Nustock has 73% sulfur too, and was doing nothing for her.

I have been giving her chelated zinc tablets.
I am going to town today and will look what other forms of zinc I can get.
I have looked up the zinc powder you had mentioned in another thread @ksalvagno , that you are using, but it is not available in Canada.

Edited to say that I have continued to use Nustock every 3 days all this time, for hair re-growth on all her spots, just not on the face.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

https://www.pharmacompass.com/health-canada-drug-product-database/zinc-sulfate



Canada
Virtual Booth
Digital Content
*ZINC SULFATE*
PDF Supplier PDF
Dosage Form*POWDER*
Dosage Strength*6.6MG/G*
Approval Date
Brand Name*QUENCH LYTE*
Application Number*2229713*
Packaging Presentation*2/10/15 KG*
Regulatory Information*OTC*
Country of Registration*CANADA*


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## daisymay (Feb 13, 2017)

my mare gets sweet itch, its horrible. she was out on lease and lost her mane and most of her tail and her underbelly was bald,bleeding and just ouch(they didnt put anything on her  )...mtg worked for awhile(sulfar) but now she is allergic to it which i knew she would be since her dam was. i cant use a sweet ich blanket because she would ruin it in less then a day.

I bought farrier wifes salve and now im trying that. i also use swat mixed with antibiotic opintment,bag balm for her underline. hope you figure out something!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

NigerianNewbie said:


> https://www.pharmacompass.com/health-canada-drug-product-database/zinc-sulfate
> 
> 
> 
> ...


Thanks for looking that up @NigerianNewbie ! I see that it is an electrolyte powder for horses. One gram of it has 6.6mg zinc sulfate.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

daisymay said:


> my mare gets sweet itch, its horrible. she was out on lease and lost her mane and most of her tail and her underbelly was bald,bleeding and just ouch(they didnt put anything on her  )...mtg worked for awhile(sulfar) but now she is allergic to it which i knew she would be since her dam was. i cant use a sweet ich blanket because she would ruin it in less then a day.
> 
> I bought farrier wifes salve and now im trying that. i also use swat mixed with antibiotic opintment,bag balm for her underline. hope you figure out something!


I am so sorry your mare gets sweet itch! That is terrible. I hope your new salve works.
When you look at the pictures of Willow’s bald spots in post #181, does it look similar to what your mare’s spots look like?


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

MadHouse said:


> Thanks for looking that up @NigerianNewbie ! I see that it is an electrolyte powder for horses. One gram of it has 6.6mg zinc sulfate.


You're welcome @MadHouse, and yes, I also noticed the gram to mg equivalent. Is this a product you would be able to obtain for Willow? I hope so.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

My vet is ordering the QuenchLyte for me (seemed to be the only way to get it). In the meantime I have been giving her a 25 mg pill daily for 7 days and then 2x25 mg for 8 days. Now I am pausing to see if there is a change in the itching. I will give it once a week now. I also ordered Replamin again, and will start her on that. She did have a copper bolus in September and is getting free choice minerals as well as free choice kelp with Herbamins. I will see how I work the QuenchLyte into it.


NigerianNewbie said:


> You're welcome @MadHouse, and yes, I also noticed the gram to mg equivalent. Is this a product you would be able to obtain for Willow? I hope so.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

I do hope this works for Willow. I will miss her dresses though!.😁


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Moers kiko boars said:


> I do hope this works for Willow. I will miss her dresses though!.😁


I hope so too! Now that the temperatures have dropped she doesn’t even have to wear her fly sheet at night. It is nice to see her Au Natural!


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

That's good to hear. Willow's probably happy to be in her birthday suit again. 😆


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)




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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

The vet was out this morning. He did skin scrapings and looked at them right away. There was nothing showing, but I am to give the second shot of Ivermectin tomorrow anyway, just in case.
Then her took 3 samples for biopsy from her eyelid, her eyebrow and the bridge of her nose (her latest scratching sores). We are hoping the stitches stay in, with all her rubbing. I am to use betadine/water mix to spray the cuts.
The results should be in in one week. Fingers crossed that we will get an answer to finally kick this mystery dermatitis.
It is cold here, and the vet is certain now, that it is not sweet itch. But he too is flummoxed.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

So she still has it even with cooler weather? Probably should do an allergy panel on her like you would a human. Not sure that is done in the animal world though.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

ksalvagno said:


> So she still has it even with cooler weather? Probably should do an allergy panel on her like you would a human. Not sure that is done in the animal world though.


I know that's done on dogs. A bit expensive from what I hear, but it might be worth it, if it came up with something.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

We will wait for the biopsy results first. There is still hope those have the answer!

I talked about the possibility of allergies with the vet. He didn’t say there was an option of a panel.
One of the things I noticed looking at all my notes is that this all started after we got new hay. The vet said allergy to a certain hay is a possibility, but would more likely be respiratory. Or that there could have been mold in it, but why is none of the other goats affected? And again, mold would cause respiratory issues, or bloat or diarrhea, but not dermatitis, as far as he knows.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

MellonFriend said:


> I know that's done on dogs. A but expensive from what I hear, but it might be worth it, if it came up with something.


Everything we have done is expensive. It is just the way it is. We will keep trying until we are broke.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

ksalvagno said:


> So she still has it even with cooler weather? Probably should do an allergy panel on her like you would a human. Not sure that is done in the animal world though.


Yes, she still scratches, and the temps are going to 20*F at night. I am glad it is now apparent that it is not sweet itch, but we want this crazy itch gone already!!


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

It seems like solving this is/has been a really slow process of elimination, the hardest, most expensive, most draining method. Poor Willow, she’s had eye patches, dresses, and now stitches, not to mention a lot of ointments and medicines. I really hope the biopsies come back with something. An answer, any answer, would at least let you focus on prevention and treatment, and give you the relief of finally knowing what it is you’re dealing with.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

More possible causes were eliminated with the results of the biopsy. 
It is NOT cancer, bacteria, parasites or autoimmune disease.
That leaves zinc deficiency which I am working on, or allergies.
The vet is working on getting prednisone, which seems to be hard to get a hold of right now.
He did not answer my question about allergy testing.

Meanwhile Willow is still scratching and rubbing her head and other spots. All In all she is scratching less, but still has opens her raw spots every couple days. I am not showing you what she looks like, because it looks awful. But her actual eye looks so much better.
Let’s hope she will stop scratching over the next little while.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Too bad the biopsy didn't tell you anything, but at least it rules out some of those serious things. Prednisone sounds like a good angle, just wish you could find a way to figure out the cause!


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

So. Willow was given prednisolone one week ago, and no changes. I think now it is only zinc deficiency left as a cause.
Her itchiness has been slowly getting better. She is getting zinc in 3 forms. Weekly as a pill along with Replamin +, daily as a horse supplement and a little bit of QuenchLyte. Because of the zinc/copper ratio being off for goats in all of those supplements, she also gets 4 tablespoons of hemp seeds daily, which are high in zinc. I know that is a lot of zinc, but I feel that it is working.
I think one of the big problems was our well water, which didn’t allow her to absorb zinc and copper. For the last 10 days she has been drinking rain/dew water, and now Horse Hydrator filtered water.

She is still scratching some, but not nearly as bad as she used to. Her eye looks so much better, almost back to normal.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Thanks for the update, I was wondering how Willow was doing these days. A water filter is a good shot. Hopefully that and the zinc will clear it up!


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## Goatastic43 (Jun 11, 2021)

Yay! I hope she continues to improve! I’m glad your at least making progress now!


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## Tanya (Mar 31, 2020)

Go Willow


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## FizzyGoats (Apr 14, 2021)

I’m so hopeful that you finally have the mystery solved! Willow and you deserve a nice relaxing vacation after all this gets settled.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Thanks everyone for your support!


MellonFriend said:


> Thanks for the update, I was wondering how Willow was doing these days. A water filter is a good shot. Hopefully that and the zinc will clear it up!


I hope the same thing!


Goatastic43 said:


> Yay! I hope she continues to improve! I’m glad your at least making progress now!


Me too!


Tanya said:


> Go Willow


Yes!


FizzyGoats said:


> I’m so hopeful that you finally have the mystery solved! Willow and you deserve a nice relaxing vacation after all this gets settled.


What is that word with the v ? 😂


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Glad things are good.


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Willow had steadily improved with the zinc supplements. She had slowly slowly stopped scratching.
I was totally on my own, guessing what and how much zinc to give her. Because I was afraid of poisoning her, I had slowly started decreasing her zinc/copper supplements. Up until this week she still got daily QuenchLyte (electrolyte that contains zinc), daily hemp seeds as well as weekly Replamin + with an additional zinc pill. Some of her bare spots had still not grown in yet. On Friday I noticed she had a tiny blood spot on one of those furless areas…. Sliding back. 
Now I have started giving her 3:1 zinc/copper powder (for horses) again, daily, in addition to the other things.
I did some more research, and it could be that she has hereditary zinc malabsorption, in which case she will just have to always be supplemented.
I researched the signs of zinc toxicity again:
“Clinical manifestations included *inappetance, loss of condition, diarrhoea with dehydration or subcutaneous oedema, profound weakness and jaundice*.“ 
She does not show any of those signs.

Willow has never had a great coat, and never had winter wool. I am starting to think she came here with this zinc deficiency (I got her as a yearling).
Another thing is, that I had tried breeding her last year, and she has had trouble settling. Same this year. Zinc deficiency can cause infertility too.

Not a very happy update. Bit hopefully, it is still fixable, if I continue with the supplements.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Wow. That is good you have it figured out but will be a lot of work.


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Well that's not horrendous news. At least it sounds like you have your answer. I'm sure you've thought of this, but have you looked into if there are any vitamins that aid in zinc absorption? 

You may have thought of this too, but if it is indeed hereditary malabsorption, that sounds like a she should not be bred even if she were capable of it to guard against passing this trait to her offspring. Am I correct?

I'm so sorry Willow has to deal with this, but at least she has such an amazing goat mom to help her overcome her issues. 💗


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Thank you! 💜 

I am not 100% sure I HAVE the answer, since it was all a process of elimination.
I am trying to stay calm and observe.
The hemp seeds she eats every day contain amino acids that are supposed to have a positive effect on zinc absorption. I could up those a bit.
Yes, the breeding question occurred to me too. Both of her first two kids (born 2019) had good coats. I read the chances of passing it on are 50/50. 
I doubt she took at her last breeding, but we shall see.


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## Goatastic43 (Jun 11, 2021)

Glad she is improving. That would be sad if you can’t breed her anymore, but hopefully all turns out ok.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

☝ I agree.


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## daisymay (Feb 13, 2017)

thats great you found something! too bad u cant find anything for my mare and her no-see um allergy


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

daisymay said:


> thats great you found something! too bad u cant find anything for my mare and her no-see um allergy


I feel for you! That is terrible, especially to watch them scratch, and feeling so helpless.
For the longest time I thought Willow had that same allergy. At that time I went ahead and ordered her 2 handmade goat fly masks through Etsy. They arrived the other day, and they are lovely, but of course now I don’t think I will need them for that.
But I was ready to invest in a really good sweet itch fly sheet for her (glad I waited). From all I have read, a sweet itch fly sheet, worn 24 h a day, stalling her at night, with the finest screen you can find (gnats can get through regular mosquito screen) on the window, spraying the stall and screen with neem oil mix, those all in combination, might make the most difference. 
I wish you good luck for next summer. Hope you find something that helps her.


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## daisymay (Feb 13, 2017)

thank you, she rubs the fly sheets off, even if i did put hot wire around her stall and run she would get them caught on the blackberries. I bought a turtle sheet and it ripped the first day. i am going to try neem oil. the pyranna fly spray doesnt even slow the horse flies down so i doubt it works for the little nasty bugs anymore. i bet those fly masks are cute, i was wanting to get one for my buck who is cream


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## MadHouse (Oct 3, 2019)

Aw, shucks, that too bad.
This is a link to the goat fly mask








Goat/sheep Fly Masks With & W/o Horns Dual Adjustable - Etsy Canada


This Horse Riding & Farm Animals item by MagesTreasureChest has 177 favorites from Etsy shoppers. Ships from United States. Listed on 09 Jan, 2023




www.etsy.com


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