# HORRIBLE Tragedy



## LegendsCreekFarm (Dec 27, 2011)

Last night was one of the hardest evenings we have ever had. Jon came home from work and usually around that time we let our girls out of their enclosure to free range and browse. It rained all day yesterday and the goats were inside their shed and very angry at me because they think I cause the rain and am punishing them. 

Once the rain stopped and the sun came out, I opened their gate and let them free. 30 minutes later, our first goat Ida Nelson came up to the house and started acting really strangely. She was swaying, and shaking and acting drunk. Jon and I brought her inside the barn attached to our house so we could watch her closely, and then noticed one of our 5 month old girls started to act similar, so we moved her inside also. 

When laying Ida down on the floor, I noticed she was foaming at the mouth, and then she started convulsing and shaking, and I saw a pocket of gas on her side. We went online and saw that it was probably bloat. I massaged her stomach, gave her baking soda paste, and she seemed to get better, and stopped screaming. 

We called the vet during this entire process, and they said that they couldn't help us without coming out, and wouldn't give us advice over the phone. We saw that milk of magnesia helps break up the foam, and even though she kept burping out very large amounts of gas, I decided to run to Walgreens and get the magnesia for her, but by the time I got home Jon was very upset, and Ida had passed. 

This entire event happened in only 45 minutes from time of symptoms until she died, there wouldn't have even been enough time for the vet to come, and I think even if she were still alive when I got home with the magnesia, it wouldn't have helped. 

We are frustrated and very sad. She was our first goat, our milker, and was amazing and friendly and quirky. The kid Taffy Davenport was given the magnesia and is doing just fine today, so obviously she didn't eat as much of the bad thing that Ida did. We read that after rain storms if they eat a lot of greens it can happen, and that it happens fast. We simply weren't prepared and had no idea what was wrong. 

I have even read books about preparing to keep goats, I have a whole medical kit with sutures, lidocaine, iodine, gauze, antibiotics, probiotics, syringes, everything needed to help a sick goat, but nothing I read said anything about bloat or milk of magnesia. 

We feel completely responsible, and horrible about what happened to her, and it's so sad to think that yesterday at this time she was alive, happy, and wagging her tail. I want to know what happened to her, how could she die so quickly from something!!????

The hardest part of the entire thing was that we couldn't bury her because our property is on wetlands that feeds into the reserviour that supplies water to most of our state, and we also have a dug well we get our drinking water from. We couldn't burn her because we read that is also illegal here, so we called animal control and they said they couldn't help us, and suggested we bring her into the forest we own (35 acres) and lay her to rest and just allow her to decompose back into the earth. While that was what we ended up having to do, I feel disgusted about just throwing her away like that. We tried calling the only local crematorium for animals and they said it would cost $400 just to do a communal cremation for her and we wouldn't even get the ashes back.

Need some major advice guys. Heartbroken, and can't have anything like this happen again. Does anyone have experience with this?


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## dobe627 (Oct 16, 2007)

Sorry you lost your girl. I always keep bloat reliefifrom hoeggers) on hand as well as gas x. It may not have helped but? ?. At least she knew to come find you and didn't pass alone. Sorry about the way you had to dispose of the body, I usually bury them but understand your situation.


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## fd123 (May 29, 2012)

Ill start by saying that im so very sorry for your loss...as you may have read i lost my favorite girl this past sunday/monday..Her symptoms do sound similar to what happened to my girl...but ....yours happened much faster...ive done alot of reading and talking to seasoned goat owners since the death of my girl. I had NO IDEA of what difference it made allowing goats to eat > wet browse, wilted browse, and pitted fruit leaves, etc..I had fed my girls a few limbs from a wild plum tree that i know for sure did NOT get eaten right away. This causes a toxin to appear which i believe to have caused the death of my girl. She was also very bloated, drooling, crying, and grinding her teeth..Ive read NOT to let them browse until the dew is gone...so...maybe with browse > just being wet or damp "PERIOD" causes a MAJOR DEADLY SITUATION in goats ..??....I dont know...from what ive read it definately sounds like your girl ate something that was poison to goats...Maybe some strange plant that only surfaces after a rain, or a plant that becomes toxic when wet..??.
I tried everything i could think of to save mine...(JUST LIKE YOU DID).. 
Dont beat yourself up over this!! You did all you knew to do!!! YOU WILL LEARN FROM THIS, AS I DID... I have went and stocked up on all types of meds since the death of my girl.. I would definatly have activated charcoal gel on hand, as well as bloat meds if i were you, due to what happened..
Again, im so very sorry for your loss...


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## KW Farms (Jun 21, 2008)

I am so sorry for your loss. :hug:

I lost two to bloat this year. First year we've ever had to deal with it...and of course it had to be two of my favorites that it killed.  I have been hearing about goats dying of bloat a lot this year. I've been keeping baking soda all around their pens and a little in their minerals...it must be working because I haven't lost any for awhile now...but i'm always worried i'll go out and find another dead. It happens SO fast there really is only so much you can do. 

I'd get the baking soda out...a lot of it. Get the MOM and activated charcoal on hand, but otherwise, just try to limit their eating and any hay, make sure it isn't too "hot" or newly baled.


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## 8566 (Jul 18, 2012)

OMG ..... I am so so sorry.

With foaming bloat, it can happen fast and furious. In the past we have treated it with veggie oil and rubbing tummy along with a little pepto mixed in. But mainly veggie oil. We would give a Nigie kid 3cc's and the foaming would stop. We'd sit and rub their tummy and within 20 minutes or so the foaming would start again. We'd give 3cc of veggie oil and rub tummy. We'd keep this up until the kid got better. So far we have never lost one to bloat. I'd give Pepto instead of the veggie oil every once in a while. Not too much pepto. Baking soda never seems to work for me when it's serious bloat.

Below are some remedies for furture reference. I've only used veggie oil because when it's foaming bloat you need to act quickly.

Bloat Remedy #1
Using a syringe, squire 3-4-5 cc of CASTOR OIL down the throat. After administering this successfully, you will have to feed the goat 1/2 cc of Neomycin Sulfate (an antibiotic) to restart the rumen.

Bloat Remedy #2 (Grain Bloat)
1/2 cup water
1/2 cup vegetable or mineral oil
2 tbsp baking soda. Mix well and put into a soda bottle. Use one cup for a full grown goat.

Bloat Remedy #3 - Dill Weed
3 cups water
2 tsps of dill weed (dried)
Get water boiling and steep dill weed in a tea ball or you can strain dill after boiling. Leave dill for about 5 minutes in the hot water, and then cool tea down. Strain dill out before administering dill weed tea orally to goat. Give the tea to the goat via a large 60cc syringe (this will be 2 oz. of the tea at a time), letting them swallow as normally as possible so they don't choke. Give more as needed (until goat begins to burp up the excess gas, relieving pressure on the bloated rumen.

If you don't have dill weed, you can boil dill seed -- use about 1/2 cup of dill seed to 3 cups water to make the tea.

Gas-X

Bloat Remedy #3 Frothy Bloat
1/2 tsp. ground ginger in 2 tbsp. water and shoot it down the throat with a syringe.


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

I'm so sorry about your loss  Don't beat yourself up about it. You did everything you could, who would have thought that would have happened to them


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## DDFN (Jul 31, 2011)

I am so sorry this had to happen to you. Knock on wood, I have only had one try to bloat on me this year but when I first started seeing sign I started hitting with baking soda (even though I leave some out free choice). I keep plenty of Baking Soda on hand as you never know when you may need a lot of it. So sorry for your loss.

I lost my mare about 2 years ago to cancer (well technically she colic'ed from complications with her cancer) and we did not have a way to bury her but we did find a wonderful man that does pet cremations in TN. He only charged $1000 total which included pick up, cremation, certificate of death (poem with her pic on it), leather covered box for her remains and covered shipping the remains back to me (I still drove to pick up just to keep from taking chances of anything happening in shipment). The box even had an engraved name plate. This man was amazing, treated us with respect and her remains with the same respect as a human would receive. I too had called around to all of the local cremations places and they wanted only a little less but would only cremate the hoofs, head and heart! They expected the grieving owners to cut up their beloved pet and still leaving the rest to depose of. 

I do not know your area but I do know her in TN local shelters have a cremation service for their animals. You may have been able to ask them about using their service (even if they can not return the cremains). Around here we have such soft grounds and natural springs we normally will dig a spot in our manure pile (above ground level) for when we lose a duck, turkey etc (very small animals) and let it decomp within the pile. 


Once again I am sorry for your loss.


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## Randi (Apr 22, 2011)

:hug:


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## luvmyherd (Apr 9, 2011)

I am so sorry. Having lost a few we tried so hard to save this year; I know how it hurts. We had one go down in the morning. We treated her with all the usual stuff and she was gone by afternoon. Just such a shock as, up until then, I had never lost one that I had gotten to.


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## Stacykins (Mar 27, 2012)

LilBleats, if we could have those remedies as a sticky in the health section, that would be aaaamazing. 

I am so sorry for your loss. Been there this year, a bottle baby who I'd had from nine days old, she was my special girl. Bloat took her from me too.


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

This is not your fault. These things are a tragic part of life ... you gave her a beautiful, wonderful home :hug:


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## Willow (Jun 12, 2011)

So sorry for your loss! What a sad story. I'm going out a check my goats and replenish the baking soda.


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## 8566 (Jul 18, 2012)

Hi StacyKins,

I would love to but don't see an per say health section ....
I also have a sheet/html page that lists a bunch of drugs and what they are used for. That one's real nice for newbies too.

Hint?
:whatgoat:


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## DavyHollow (Jul 14, 2011)

I'm so sorry for your loss, I had a similar crazy freak accident happen recently and it sucks.

I feel like the government and animal service places just try to rip animal lovers off, it makes me angry.

So sorry you had to go through this.


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## luvmyherd (Apr 9, 2011)

DavyHollow said:


> I feel like the government and animal service places just try to rip animal lovers off, it makes me angry.


I get beside myself with anger at the new *animal protection* laws. They recently cost me 4 goats!!!!!!!! Nobody would give us any advice over the phone. They could not prescribe without seeing an animal. And the only one who would see us had an appointment two and a half weeks away. By then our sick goats were either dead or recovered. We are on our own here. :veryangry: 
Not trying to step on your grief LegendsCreekFarm. This is just such a sore spot with me. It seems like you faced some of this, by your post.


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## Tenacross (May 26, 2011)

Legend.
If your goats are not current on CD/T vaccinations, you need to vaccinate them. You should have CD *antitoxin* on hand to administer if you see this again. Enterotoxemia can be the secondary killer to come along for a bloated goat. Hard to say if it would have saved your beauty, but still, good to have.


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## LegendsCreekFarm (Dec 27, 2011)

All the goats are current on CDT. They aren't due for shots again until December. 

I read through everyones stories and I am shocked at how often bloat happens. I have read SO many good books on raising goats, and none of them talked in depth about bloat. 

The kid "Taffy" who was showing symptoms was a lot better yesterday, but all 3 girls seem very sad and distant, and they keep looking for Ida. Although I bottle fed them, they looked up to her like mom since she was an adult and kept them all as a herd. 

While I think animal protection laws should be enforced, veterinarians and other pet services (like cremation) should not be able to capitalize on people like us going through such grief. Then they turn around and tell me it's illegal to bury or burn, and what are we left with? Having to line to pockets of these businesses.

I went to school for awhile to become a vet. I can perform minor surgeries, castrate, suture, and almost anything else that isn't major on the farm. The first thing they taught me was that being a veterinarian is hard, and you should never let compassion take over you and do favors for customers because they will just rip you off. While I can see this happening since people like to take advantage, I wonder how they can get away with charging $300 an hour for a house call.

We don't pay most doctors $300 an hour, even without medical insurance, it makes me sick that they charge this much. It feels like some people only go into the veterinarian field to make a profit. What happened with animal welfare? 

I haven't been able to sleep since Ida died. Been having bad dreams and all. I just feel like there is something we could have done if we were just prepared. Now I have to lock my 3 girls up every morning until the sun dried up all the dew because I am not risking anything happening to the rest of them. 

Thanks everyone for helping and lending thoughts. I have said it before and I will say it again, no book can offer what we get from this message board, and I wouldn't be able to get through any of this without you guys!


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## Willow (Jun 12, 2011)

Thank-you for sharing your sad story. I learned something about bloat and will be extra vigilant with my goats. I have been lax about waiting for the dew to dry - feeding extra rich weeds from the garden - and providing constant baking soda. I believe that your sharing this story has saved the lives of other goats. :hug:


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## freedomstarfarm (Mar 25, 2011)

:hug: So sorry for your loss. 
Was her belly hard and big? It also kinda sounds like listeriosis to me with the drunk walk and the foaming mouth. http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/listeriosis.html If her belly was big and hard then bloat was most likely the cause but if no big belly read this on listeriosis.


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## Mandara Farm (Sep 12, 2010)

:hug: I'm so very sorry to hear of your loss, and the way the animal 'welfare' people treated you. That's so disgusting. I do, however, agree with Willow. Your posting about the tragedy will save other lives. I've cut and pasted all the remedies posted here and intend to get them ASAP to make sure I have it all on hand if I need it, because like you, I thought I was prepared too. Not so. But I will be now because of this thread.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Great advice given...I am so very sorry for your loss... my heart goes out to you  :hug:


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

I am so very sorry that you lost Ida :sigh: :hug: 

I've lost 3 adults and 3 kids in the 13 years since I starting raising my goats... regardless of the cause, there will always be the question "Could I have done more?"

In your case however, Ida and Taffy may have hadsomething that you could not have known going on that caused them to suddenly have these symptoms.

You are so right with saying that reading doesn't always prepare you for when these things happen, experience as well as experience of others is what ends up helping with knowledge as well as recovery at times.

The sadness will linger with you for quite sometime, your other girls will also mourn.... it really helped me to just be with mine when the losses I've had happened, they need the comfort too :hug:


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## milk and honey (Oct 31, 2010)

Just want to add my own condolences for your loss. I hope that time starts to take some of the sting out of your memories of your special goat... and brings better times to your mind. Life is just more intense with these lovely creatures living with us and under our care. Both the joys and sorrows... Again, I'm so sorry.


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

my goats get turned lut before the dew dries ... i really dont think thats a problem. it IS however important to make sure they have a belly full of dry hay before turning out onto rich pasture. so sorry for your loss.


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## DDFN (Jul 31, 2011)

I am actually very lucky to have a great semi-retired vet as a friend/resource to call any time. She still does part time work in our area since her retirement is not enough to take care of all her rescues and the fact she loves helping those in need! She is just a little over cost which we keep telling her she needs to charge more. She came out to do a gelding years ago and there were complications. Needless to say we loaded up and went to the local vet school (she use to work there too) and she kept trying to refuse money for the work she already had done for us that day (horses teeth floating, vaccinations large and small animals, sedation, part of a gelding etc). I did get her to take a chunk of cash but she handed a part back and said to use it at the vet school. She enjoys helping people that are low income and even does the coggins pulls at local sales (which does not pay much at all)!

I do have to say I wish there were more vets like her to go around! On the other hand the clinic I use to work at charges now an arm and a leg to get anything done whether its in house or farm call. 

Best thing to do is just ask a lot of questions here on anything that can happen in a herd in order to be prepared for it in case it ever happens to you. That is actually why awhile back I posted about my buckling choking and how to handle it. Even though we had already got him saved and treated I wanted to help spare awareness to those that had never been exposed to that or heard of it happening. 

Once again sorry for your loss but hopefully your other babies can adjust to her no longer being there to follow.


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