# And the baby monitor is out in the barn.....



## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

Abigail is my 2 1/2 year old Alpine doe. She was my first goat ever and is such a butt-head, but I love her! She is due this Thursday 3/16 but I'm praying she holds until the weekend.

I went ahead and put the baby monitor in the barn because we have a winter storm headed this way. 4-7 inches of snow and wind chills of -8. I noticed yesterday that she was really starting to stretch and I thought I saw a few (small) contractions. And the doe code has commenced!!!!!

This is her second freshening....the first one was rough. Only my second kidding ever (first was textbook) and her first kid was huge, I let her push too long and came out head and one leg only. It was the first time I have ever had to go in and it was rough on her  I now know to pull how presented (if appropriate) and it was a lesson learned. 

This year I bred her to my blue eyed nigerian buck and hoping for 1. An easy kidding for her and 2. Adorable cute first generation mini-Alpines! 

Abigail's udder has some filling to do so I do believe we have "time" and she isn't too wide. But this is my first time with breeding a full size doe to a mini, not sure what size kid(s) to expect????? Anyone know? 

She seems to be a pretty deep doe and looks to be carrying low in her belly instead of wide.

If I can figure out how to be smarter than my iPad. I will add pictures.....


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

Cellphone photo is sideways


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Good luck 

My Alpine does had normal Alpine-sized kids when bred to a ND.


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

So wishing for kids that will just "slide" right out isn't going to happen???????

Just kidding....well, kinda


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

double post


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## ZebAkers (Nov 29, 2016)

No experience that would help answer your question, but good luck!
Do you mind explaining "_*I now know to pull how presented (if appropriate) and it was a lesson learned*_"? My first goat may be kidding soon, and I would rather know what this means before the delivery than after.


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## jehouck8 (Mar 6, 2017)

My full size alpines who produced mini alpines last year-both there kids were HUGE. BUT..... didn't stay that way. They are both a little over a year and about the size of my Nigerian doe, I'm guessing they will get a bit bigger but not too much.


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

ZebAkers said:


> No experience that would help answer your question, but good luck!
> Do you mind explaining "_*I now know to pull how presented (if appropriate) and it was a lesson learned*_"? My first goat may be kidding soon, and I would rather know what this means before the delivery than after.


At the time this happened, I had always been told that if you have the head and only one leg, then you need to go in and find the other leg. Well, that may easier for someone more experienced, but when I did that, I couldn't find the other leg..... Like no where! I didn't expect (although I really should have expected) her pushing against me while I was inside. We later figured that the kids' leg was directly pinned against the kids body and I just couldn't get ahold of it.

Having been through that already, if this happened again, I would pull the kid out with one leg and head. That's what I ended up having to do anyway and it would have been much less traumatizing for the doe if I just would have done that in the beginning.

Both ended up fine, but my doe was pretty traumatized and rejected both kids. I ended up having to hold her to nurse them several times a day (I wanted to avoid bottle babies) and it took her three weeks to finally accept them and nurse them on her own. I'm praying for a better experience for her this time! I was (still am) such a newbie!


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

jehouck8 said:


> My full size alpines who produced mini alpines last year-both there kids were HUGE. BUT..... didn't stay that way. They are both a little over a year and about the size of my Nigerian doe, I'm guessing they will get a bit bigger but not too much.


Rats! I had such huge hopes for small and easy kids! But then again, my 100% nigerian buckling born last month weighed in at 5 lbs! I guess I shouldn't expected too small. But I was so hoping......


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## jehouck8 (Mar 6, 2017)

Don't feed grain. That helps. 
Just give does alfalfa hay and minerals


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## ZebAkers (Nov 29, 2016)

Realtree2429 said:


> At the time this happened, I had always been told that if you have the head and only one leg, then you need to go in and find the other leg. Well, that may easier for someone more experienced, but when I did that, I couldn't find the other leg..... Like no where! I didn't expect (although I really should have expected) her pushing against me while I was inside. We later figured that the kids' leg was directly pinned against the kids body and I just couldn't get ahold of it.
> 
> Having been through that already, if this happened again, I would pull the kid out with one leg and head. That's what I ended up having to do anyway and it would have been much less traumatizing for the doe if I just would have done that in the beginning.
> 
> Both ended up fine, but my doe was pretty traumatized and rejected both kids. I ended up having to hold her to nurse them several times a day (I wanted to avoid bottle babies) and it took her three weeks to finally accept them and nurse them on her own. I'm praying for a better experience for her this time! I was (still am) such a newbie!


Thanks for the explanation! I will definitely keep your experience in mind at my first kidding...who knows, maybe it will save a life!


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

So the snow storm has started and I went out to add more straw in their pen. Even though she's in a closed up barn, a nice pile of fresh straw never hurt any goat!

I discovered that she had somehow broken into the pen that I use to store hay and she was standing up on top of the plywood shelf that I store a bale of hay.....it's about 3 feet up. She didn't have a care in the world and was munching away! I guess the hay in her hay feeder just wasn't good enough!!!! She just looked at me like "Try to stop me!"

I get it....I've been there as a pregnant mamma. She is SOOOO pregnant!


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

Here's a few pictures from this morning. We are still getting the snow, but that's not the big deal....the wind chill is in the negatives  Boo! Hiss!

Her udder is not screaming "full", but she has been holding her tail weird and I have never been able to figure out what people meant when they said "feel the ligs", well, her tail is completely sunk in and I can wrap my fingers around to meet around the tail head..... I think I understand now!

I'm hoping she will hold on until her due date of Thursday....or Friday! Friday would be good! What do ya'll think? And again, the photos were with my cell phone, so they're sideways.


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## ZebAkers (Nov 29, 2016)

^I thought this was a good explanation about feeling the ligaments. Again, no prior experience, but I keep hearing that once the ligaments disappear and you can wrap your fingers completely around the spine that you only have 12 hours at most to wait. But there are exceptions to every rule of course, and I have also heard a lot say that the ligament test is bogus. Regardless keep an eye out, stay warm, and good luck!!


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

ZebAkers said:


> ^I thought this was a good explanation about feeling the ligaments. Again, no prior experience, but I keep hearing that once the ligaments disappear and you can wrap your fingers completely around the spine that you only have 12 hours at most to wait. But there are exceptions to every rule of course, and I have also heard a lot say that the ligament test is bogus. Regardless keep an eye out, stay warm, and good luck!!


That's a great video! Thanks for sharing! Explains it soooooo much better


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## minibarn (Jul 20, 2010)

She's looking close! Hopefully she'll wait for warmer weather tho. I hate when the windchills cause it to be so cold even inside my barn. It's well below freezing outside here right now and also a few degrees below freezing inside my barn! If the wind would die down the barn stays warmer. Good luck with your girl!


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## jehouck8 (Mar 6, 2017)

Could you plug in a heater?


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## groovyoldlady (Jul 21, 2011)

Do you have a garage or basement you could bring her into? I know many folks here who bring their preggos into the basement for kidding. I haven't had to do that yet because we usually kid in April (This year June -bleh!). However, we do usually keep the babies in a pen in our garage until it's warm enough for them to be outside.


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

I really don't want to run a heater into the barn. It's a very old barn with very old wiring. I'm more afraid of a barn fire than them being cold. And I really think our garage would be colder than the barn. It's a detached garage and very, very cold concrete floors 

We have plywood put on the walls of the barn, so they have kinda a double walled barn. And also, they have a very good build-up of bedding, so that adds some warmth. I just worry about the air temperature and kids being born wet..... wind gusts are hitting 35 mph......


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

I'm heading out there to add more straw and give everyone some hot water....

She just needs to give me 48 more hours.....and go on her due date. That's not too much to ask for. Is it? :sigh:

And I told my husband that we are breeding to kid in April of next year....Ohio Marches are just too unpredictable!


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

I took some hot water, and added more straw to their pen. I also took my patio thermostat out (I'm a bit obsessive) and it looks like it's hold right above freezing in their pen. Which will change tonight without the sun. But that's good news! It's -1 with windchills outside and it's about 33 inside their pen :fireworks:

Here's what I found when I went out there..... I'm convinced that she is just loving this attention and deep-down, knows how worried I am in the house. All the while, she's all snuggled up with her buddy


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## JK_Farms (Nov 12, 2016)

Aww that's so cute!!!! you can tell in her eyes that she knows shes driving you crazy!!


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

JK_Farms said:


> Aww that's so cute!!!! you can tell in her eyes that she knows shes driving you crazy!!


It makes me nervous! I'm pretty sure she's plotting to keep me up tonight with the baby monitor.....

The scene from the Doe Code of Honor just came to mind.......


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Yep.


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

All is quiet out there this evening....except for some coughing that I'm hearing 

We got a temp on her this evening because of the coughing I was hearing through the monitor. 102.2, so that's good!

I'm thinking its worms, and I had to get a new vet (one that knows and understands goats) so I have an appointment for my initial patient set up next week and they will check a group fecal then for me.

In the mean time, I am picking up some Vet Rx tomorrow.....just in case it's a cold from this horrible and crazy weather!!!! 50's/60's one day and grass is growing and now -10 and snow everywhere!!!!!

But she is resting comfortably out there in her straw nest and I think maybe a restful night.......


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

Her udder has grown dramatically! The angle is weird because she decided to walk away 



Her cough is still persistent though. I got some vetrx and gave it to her. It seemed to help somewhat, but she is still coughing (and her wether buddy). Anything else I can do to help her?

She is eating and drinking and moving like a normal (very pregnant) goat.....


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

Abigail is in labor! Of course I have to take the kids to school....go figure! Say a prayer that she does okay without me!!!!!!


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## Tbs4life2000 (Mar 10, 2016)

Good luck Abigail!


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## ZebAkers (Nov 29, 2016)

Ahhhhhhhhh!! Good luck! I'll keep my fingers crossed, can't wait to hear how everything turns out!


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

I came home to a string of amber goo about 5 inches long. This is it 

No signs of pushing and she is chewing her cud.


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

Argh! This girl is loving how much she is driving me crazy!

So to do a timeline:

7:00 am - Mucous plug lost and very, very stick tail
8:10 am - Got home and about 5 inches of goo (amber colored) and some pretty good contractions and stretching
9:30 am - More goo, but she knocked it off
10:15 am - even more goo and this is a thicker strand hanging down about 6-7 inches

Which brings me to right now....alllllll she wants to do is stand at the hay feeder and munch away. No pushing, no distress, nothing.

This is my first doe that has actually had discharge and I thought that amber goo meant kids really soon? I'm trying to leave her alone as much as possible and not interfere too much. Listening with very close ears to the monitor and checking on her about every 45 minutes to an hour.

Sigh......


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## minibarn (Jul 20, 2010)

Wow! Hopefully she'll start pushing very soon. Have you seen her push at all? If there's nothing more happening within the next hour I would definitely try to go in and see if there's a stuck kid. I had a bad experience where my doe had a string just like that but no other signs of labour. I waited till the next day to help her and by then triplets had died. Don't want to scare you....just don't wait too long like I did.


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

I washed up and went in finger deep. There's a kid there. ....I feel a nose and two hooves. She just needs to PUSH!


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## minibarn (Jul 20, 2010)

Is she pushing yet? If not, and you know the kid is in proper position, I would gently but firmly pull the legs. She may push as you start pulling.


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

minibarn said:


> Is she pushing yet? If not, and you know the kid is in proper position, I would gently but firmly pull the legs. She may push as you start pulling.


That's what ended up happening! I waited as long as I could and so I went in....she didn't like me inside so she finally pushed. Twin little boys!


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## minibarn (Jul 20, 2010)

Awesome! Congratulations! So glad all turned out well for you!


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

Both boys are doing well! To explain more, Abigail just wasn't pushing, like at all! She would push HARD one time and then go look for food through the straw. The 15 minutes would go by and she would push once more HARD and then quit. I'm wondering if she was scared because she had a very tough kidding last year as a FF?

Anyways, I called my vet from last year and he told me that he would either come out, I could bring her in or we could wait. But he did suggest that I wash up and feel for kids.

So I did and I'm not very good at it! I felt a nose and two hooves so I thought that was fine.... but then after 30 more minutes, I decided to go back in and either that would get her to push me out and then the kids, or I would grab what I could find. That time I could only feel a bubble? Where did the nose and feet go?

That got her to push!!!! She meant business then. After about 5 pushes, I saw two hooves and a nose so I broke the bubble and grabbed and pulled, very slowly, side to side and downwards. First kid out!

Not 5 minutes later, 2nd kid was born. 

Both were a great size, she had zero difficulty getting them out, it was just getting her to push......

I only went in because it had been 5 hours of her passing the amber goo and she had been having contractions but only pushing intermittently. And I did wait an entire hour after I saw her first real push. 

I am a big fan of letting them do this themselves....but I made a choice to intervene. 

I've been in the house for a while now and she hadn't passed the placenta yet....will check soon. But she turned her nose up to warm molasses water and just wanted plain warm water, grains and hay. She is cleaning both kids non-stop and has nursed them several times (with me holding her). Last year, she rejected the kids flat-out, so this is a huge improvement!

I decided to give them some time and space all alone.

Here are the boys.....I have to admit, I am so very bummed that they're not girls. I love, love the coloring and the eyes. One even had double wattles and I am a sucker for that! Again, sorry for sideways photos. I have to remember to start holding my phone the other way!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Adorable, congrats. 

You did all the right things. If ever you feel something is not right, go in and check.


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## groovyoldlady (Jul 21, 2011)

Oh my goodness. They are SO handsome!!!! Glad everything went well!


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Yay!!!!!! :leap: Congrats, they're adorable!!!!!


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## Tbs4life2000 (Mar 10, 2016)

Congrats!


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## ZebAkers (Nov 29, 2016)

CONGRATULATIONS!!!!!!!!!!! That is so exciting :fireworks:

So glad that everything went well, those baby boys are adorable!


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## cbrossard (Oct 4, 2014)

Yay! So glad all turned out OK! How big are they??


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## Realtree2429 (Feb 4, 2017)

cbrossard said:


> Yay! So glad all turned out OK! How big are they??


I will get an actual weight on them this weekend. But they were definitely bigger than a nigerian kid, but smaller than an alpine kid!!! Yay! I would say maybe 3/4 the size of the alpine kids we had last year.

They definitely came out easier! Once she decided to push that is :smile:


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