# In labor or not?



## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

I have a 2 year old ff with a due date of December the 9th. Yesterday, the 12th, she had a bunch of clear goo hanging from her back end so I separated her from the other girls. In the shed she keeps getting up and down but isn't moving around a lot. She's eating and drinking well and I took her temperature and it's in normal range. Just checked again and still no babies! Should I be worried? I don't think she's in full blown labor but she is acting uncomfortable. Is this normal?


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

I just really expected babies yesterday after I saw all the clear goo and 24 hours later.... nothing! This is the first time I've ever noticed a goats labor signs. Even with my watchful eye they usually pop them out and I don't see it happen.


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

Goo is usually a good sign that she's going to deliver soon. Is she uncomfortable? Pawing, pacing pressing her head against the wall?

These might help


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

I hope these help, sorry if I posted duplicates but I can't see the videos on my tablet.


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

She did that a few times yesterday. And pawed the ground. I'm just worried I need to intervene bc she hasn't kidded yet. She isn't acting like she is in pain. Just a bit uncomfortable. Thanks for the video!


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

I would be a bit worried if the labour begins but does not progress. Have you the knowledge to go in an check yourself, or shall we hope for a vet? It happens that triplets get stuck in the birth canal.


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

You could wash up, (you and the back side of the doe) trim long fingernails, I put on surgical gloves, get some lube (soapy water, mineral oil, ky jelly, etc) and go in to check, see if she is dialated and see if maybe a kid is stuck. 

Since the weekend is coming and it's hard to get vets, you might want to get your vet on call.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

:up:

If you are are worried for her, you can go in as suggested above and check to see if she is open with a kid at the door, partially dilated or if you go in and hit a wall. Or call a vet out to check her.

If you seen a clear amber tube like discharge, she is close. 

How are her ligs?


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

She still has her ligs. The vet usually works half days on Friday. I'm not at home. Husband says she has diarrhea now. I called the vet and she is actually out of town... I'm not home to see how she is. I'll be home around 2 from work.


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

He's watching her for other symptoms now before he leaves for work.


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

Oh rats, I had hoped she had made progress by now, I was racing out the door when I put up those videos...I'd get a vet involved if you can, otherwise, I'd scrub and glove and check her out. How's her diet? has she been getting calcium in hay or alfalfa pellets? Selenium?


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

She gets a mixed hay that's pretty fresh. And alfalfa pellets mixed with whole grains and BOSS. selenium in her mineral mix but no extra supplement. I don't know what the diarrhea looks like Til I get home. If it's clumpy of full blown liquid.


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## goatblessings (Jan 6, 2015)

With a due date of the 9th I would be very concerned and try to get a vet. Her labor may have stalled - try to go in if she is still open.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

With 150 days gestation. You have a lee way of 5 days. They usually breed 3 days with a space of 18 hr ovulation. Since its her 1st..just be calm..and check her often. Her body will take a little longer than other experienced does. Give her till the 14th at least. K?


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

Moers kiko boars said:


> With 150 days gestation. You have a lee way of 5 days. They usually breed 3 days with a space of 18 hr ovulation. Since its her 1st..just be calm..and check her often. Her body will take a little longer than other experienced does. Give her till the 14th at least. K?


Yea. From the looks of it she wasn't in full blown labor after watching those videos. Though i did see her paw the ground a few times. Unfortunately we were on vacation the week she got pregnant and drove back halfway through to check on the goats(we were campinga little over an hour away) and that's when the buck was acting rowdy. She seemed really shy with him. So it could be later than that.


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

goatblessings said:


> With a due date of the 9th I would be very concerned and try to get a vet. Her labor may have stalled - try to go in if she is still open.


Unfortunately, she is out of town!


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

Is her udder tight and stretched, teats swollen? Is she staring off and spacey? Is she standing with her tail end higher than her shoulders? 
Or,
Just not comfortable and trying to get settled in.
Do you have something for her to stand her front feet up on like cinder blocks or something about 10 inches high to stretch way out to help move the babies into position?


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

GoofyGoat said:


> Is her udder tight and stretched, teats swollen? Is she staring off and spacey? Is she standing with her tail end higher than her shoulders?
> Or,
> Just not comfortable and trying to get settled in.
> Do you have something for her to stand her front feet up on like cinder blocks or something about 10 inches high to stretch way out to help move the babies into position?


she wasn't really spacey but she has been letting me pet her and she typically runs if she even just sees a human. When I get home I'll get some cynder block and see if that'll help.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I would think the vet would have another vet on call. Did you ask?

It may or may not be an emergency, but if you were not watching her, you may of missed her pushing. 
if that is the case her contractions may be stalled. 
Not sure, as I am not there to see and check her.

But I am concerned for her.
Didn't you say she has a lot of discharge? What did it look like? and was it long?


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> I would think the vet would have another vet on call. Did you ask?
> 
> It may or may not be an emergency, but if you were not watching her, you may of missed her pushing.
> if that is the case her contractions may be stalled.
> ...


She used to have a partner but he recently retired and it's just her for right now it seems. Her discharge was clear and mostly short. It had a few long pieces here and there yesterday. When I get home I'll update y'all on her. Unfortunately, I also have a sick kid(human)


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Oh wow, she may of been in labor.
with that much coming out.
Check her for peace of mind.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Here is a pic of 1 of my does in labor


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

See how large her udder is? These pictures are about 12 minutes apart. She was 153 days of gestation.


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

Her udders are not large. Not compared to my other goats who kidded recently and she still has her ligaments. She does have pretty runny diarrhea and her temperature is normal. In the mid 102s every time I checked it. We are prepared if need be to put on gloves and see if we can feel anything. But if she isn't ready we shouldn't try right? Wouldn't it hurt her if she wasn't dialated? Her eyelids are very dark pink and we've been giving her gi soother all day bc I figured that can't hurt the diarrhea even if it doesn't help.


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

Her discharge was all clear. No amber colored discharge.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Was the clear discharge as large an amount as the picture of the amber discharge?


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

If you decide to check her. Its alot like a female being examined. Just use gloves, lubricant, and go easy on her. You will feel a mushy opening the allows you to go deeper..or a flat thicker surface that wont let you in. I dont know if you will know what you are feeling? I dont know your level of knowledge with internal anatomy of a goat. Not to sound mean...


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

Moers kiko boars said:


> If you decide to check her. Its alot like a female being examined. Just use gloves, lubricant, and go easy on her. You will feel a mushy opening the allows you to go deeper..or a flat thicker surface that wont let you in. I dont know if you will know what you are feeling? I dont know your level of knowledge with internal anatomy of a goat. Not to sound mean...


My husband was reading about it. Goats anatomy and such on the way home. I'll probably do it since my hands are smaller. No her discharge wasn't like that. Mostly her tail was sticky. And it looked moist. A few longer pieces. None that thick and long though.


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## Sfgwife (Feb 18, 2018)

Kristendanae said:


> My husband was reading about it. Goats anatomy and such on the way home. I'll probably do it since my hands are smaller. No her discharge wasn't like that. Mostly her tail was sticky. And it looked moist. A few longer pieces. None that thick and long though.


It could have been her mucus plug if it was all clear and no amber. Amber is kids very soon color. The plug can come out a day to a weekish earlier.


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## Jubillee (Dec 22, 2017)

Is it possible to have a different due date? Could she have not taken and she was in heat?


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## goatblessings (Jan 6, 2015)

I have had does that did not exhibit the long amber color - until they started to push - if you missed it, her labor could have stalled. I am concerned for her.


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

Jubillee said:


> Is it possible to have a different due date? Could she have not taken and she was in heat?


We thought she may have gotten pregnant her next cycle bc she was in with the buck for close to 2 months after that. She is actually in active labor right now it seems.


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

Ok. So she seems to be in active labor right now. She has diarrhea pretty bad and that coupled with her possibly kidding has me the most worried. I've only have a few does kid but none have gotten diarrhea during. She had a clean fecal a month ago, dark eyelids right now. Her temperature has been good. We've had a bad bought with cocci a few months ago with 2 does and 3/4 kids getting it. She is in a clean pen where we burnt the grass contaminated with cocci and it has been empty for nearly 2 months.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Get a fecal on her again for worms and cocci. Stress can trigger both.You can give her pig scour halt, double the dosage it says on the label, give 2 x a day for 3 days. If her fecal is clean that will stop it.

Are you perhaps feeding too much grain? What are you feeding her?

If she is in active labor and pushing, don't let it go past 30-45 minutes at most. if it does, wash up and go in, she is having trouble, or call a vet.


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> Get a fecal on her again for worms and cocci. Stress can trigger both.You can give her pig scour halt, double the dosage it says on the label, give 2 x a day for 3 days. If her fecal is clean that will stop it.
> 
> Are you perhaps feeding too much grain? What are you feeding her?
> 
> If she is in active labor and pushing, don't let it go past 30-45 minutes at most. if it does, wash up and go in, she is having trouble, or call a vet.


She has only been getting an ounce or 2 of grain mixed in with her alfalfa pellets each day. I'll get a fecal Monday and give her scour halt.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

:great:


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Any babies yet? Is she in labor? How is she?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

How are things?


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## lovinglife (Jun 6, 2013)

A picture might help.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Really concerned here.


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## Ron at BFAD (May 2, 2018)

I don't know if its to late to do this, but when i was a lad and had goats my father and his father shared some information with me. I'm 68 now so i guess it's been a little while now. As my goats would get ready to kid, my dad said to feed them rye grain. And it would help with delivery, needless to sag my kids come flying out. Last kidding didn't have rye grain but had rye flour so fed it to the doe a couple of days before and they still flew out its an old farmers trick but seems to work.


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## Denise lynn (Dec 1, 2019)

Kristendanae said:


> I have a 2 year old ff with a due date of December the 9th. Yesterday, the 12th, she had a bunch of clear goo hanging from her back end so I separated her from the other girls. In the shed she keeps getting up and down but isn't moving around a lot. She's eating and drinking well and I took her temperature and it's in normal range. Just checked again and still no babies! Should I be worried? I don't think she's in full blown labor but she is acting uncomfortable. Is this normal?


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## Denise lynn (Dec 1, 2019)

Yes, that is normal for some goats. The clear thickish fluid is normal too. They can all be a little different each time they kid. When she is ready they start getting up and down, pawing the ground, wandering off to a quiet spot. They start straining and some will make blubbering noises, already talking to their babies to come. I had one that just kidded that acted like yours for two weeks before she kidded. Had two big bucks, so she was miserable.


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## Denise lynn (Dec 1, 2019)

Invest in a vial of oxytocin. It is cheap and that is what the vet would give her unless you want surgery. I use after some kid if they have a difficult birth and may have retained placenta or a dead kid. It also helps if u have one that isn't making milk. Some their timing is off on milk coming at the same time they Kidd. Oxy will help them come into milk. I know a breeder who always gives a penicillin and oxytocin shot soon as they kidd, just to be proactive. My dog wasn't having her puppies, not pushing. One vet wanted $700 for a c section. My old vet told me to give her an oxy shot and a few minutes later the puppies finally started coming.


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## Denise lynn (Dec 1, 2019)

This will be my third post, so hopefully I will be a member now, have had goats since the 70's. I have raised dairy, angoras and now Boer which I put some dairy on them. I have 47 breed stock plus kids. Still calling the vet sometimes. Most vets are woefully ignorant about goats and give bad info. Hard to find a goat vet.
Good luck


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Thats why we help each other on TGS! Its from experience & love of the goats! Please help all of us learn. It is important. For some...this is all they have! :up:


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## FoxRidge (Aug 26, 2016)

Any news?


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## Wild Hearts Ranch (Dec 26, 2011)

Denise lynn said:


> Invest in a vial of oxytocin. It is cheap and that is what the vet would give her unless you want surgery. I use after some kid if they have a difficult birth and may have retained placenta or a dead kid. It also helps if u have one that isn't making milk. Some their timing is off on milk coming at the same time they Kidd. Oxy will help them come into milk. I know a breeder who always gives a penicillin and oxytocin shot soon as they kidd, just to be proactive. My dog wasn't having her puppies, not pushing. One vet wanted $700 for a c section. My old vet told me to give her an oxy shot and a few minutes later the puppies finally started coming.


Oxytocin causes contractions, which can be painful and even dangerous if the cervix isn't dilated. Shouldn't be used until they're already in labor - I've only given it afterwards to help pass the placenta. And giving antibiotics to a healthy animal "just because" is a major factor in antibiotic resistance. Since penicillin-class meds are used in humans as well, you could potentially risk worse infections in yourself as well as your animals.

When I have a doe who's overdue I only use lute to induce. All it does it destroy the corpus luteum, which stops the production of progesterone and triggers normal labor. Much easier on them, I've never had any complications with that method. Some people also use dexmethasone, but steroids have a wide range of effects on the body and I prefer to only use it when it's specifically indicated. However, if you have to induce the doe early for her own sake (such as toxemia), dex will help mature lungs in the kids. I believe it needs to be given 24-48 hours before the lute though, to allow it as much time to work as possible. You can give it to the kids after they're born too, but their chances aren't as good if they're already having trouble breathing. I lost two this year that were premie (not induced, I think the doe was rammed.)


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Wild Hearts Ranch said:


> Oxytocin causes contractions, which can be painful and even dangerous if the cervix isn't dilated. Shouldn't be used until they're already in labor - I've only given it afterwards to help pass the placenta. And giving antibiotics to a healthy animal "just because" is a major factor in antibiotic resistance. Since penicillin-class meds are used in humans as well, you could potentially risk worse infections in yourself as well as your animals.
> 
> When I have a doe who's overdue I only use lute to induce. All it does it destroy the corpus luteum, which stops the production of progesterone and triggers normal labor. Much easier on them, I've never had any complications with that method. Some people also use dexmethasone, but steroids have a wide range of effects on the body and I prefer to only use it when it's specifically indicated. However, if you have to induce the doe early for her own sake (such as toxemia), dex will help mature lungs in the kids. I believe it needs to be given 24-48 hours before the lute though, to allow it as much time to work as possible. You can give it to the kids after they're born too, but their chances aren't as good if they're already having trouble breathing. I lost two this year that were premie (not induced, I think the doe was rammed.)


 Please listen to this. Very important.


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

Thanks for all your help. She had one that was dead and another that didn't last a full 12 hours. She is about to pass and I'll probably just have the vet put her down. I really don't know what I'm doing wrong at this point. I try to be extremely hands on and am constantly cleaning their pens and bowls. Keep mineral out and give them herbal dewormer 2 times weekly. But am not afraid to give them chemical dewormer if needed. Am constantly getting fecals to check and make sure everyone is good. They are in my care and depend on me and i have no idea what went wrong and I'm failing them. The vet said maybe "milk fever" I guess I just got lucky the first 2 years with not having any issues and now I've had multiple one die. I'm just at a loss.


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

I think the babies were early bc the ones lungs didn't sound developed and she was choking on milk. I guess I could've stressed her out and caused her to have them early. She didn't really like being handled and always ran from me.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Milk fever is treatable.
Calcium drench. 

Did the vet give you anything for it or recommend something?


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

toth boer goats said:


> Milk fever is treatable.
> Calcium drench.
> 
> Did the vet give you anything for it or recommend something?


I gave her calcium drench which I had on hand and I don't know if it helped or not. Her temperature was good earlier today and she was eating and everything. Now she's on her side crying out and her temperature was 93 and she has diarhea still.


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## Denise lynn (Dec 1, 2019)

Wild Hearts Ranch said:


> Oxytocin causes contractions, which can be painful and even dangerous if the cervix isn't dilated. Shouldn't be used until they're already in labor - I've only given it afterwards to help pass the placenta. And giving antibiotics to a healthy animal "just because" is a major factor in antibiotic resistance. Since penicillin-class meds are used in humans as well, you could potentially risk worse infections in yourself as well as your animals.
> 
> When I have a doe who's overdue I only use lute to induce. All it does it destroy the corpus luteum, which stops the production of progesterone and triggers normal labor. Much easier on them, I've never had any complications with that method. Some people also use dexmethasone, but steroids have a wide range of effects on the body and I prefer to only use it when it's specifically indicated. However, if you have to induce the doe early for her own sake (such as toxemia), dex will help mature lungs in the kids. I believe it needs to be given 24-48 hours before the lute though, to allow it as much time to work as possible. You can give it to the kids after they're born too, but their chances aren't as good if they're already having trouble breathing. I lost two this year that were premie (not induced, I think the doe was rammed.)


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

I'm so sorry about the kids and your doe having such a rough time of it.
It's heartbreaking when things go so wrong.
Can you try to warm her up and give her some flat dark beer. Wrapping her in An electric blanket might help.


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## healthyishappy (Mar 6, 2019)

Ron at BFAD said:


> I don't know if its to late to do this, but when i was a lad and had goats my father and his father shared some information with me. I'm 68 now so i guess it's been a little while now. As my goats would grt ready to kid, my dad said to feed them rge grain. And it would help with delivery, needless to sag my kids come flying out. Last kidding didn't have rye grain but had rye flour so fed it to the doe a couple of days before and they still flew out its an old farmers trick but seems to work.


How much did you give them???


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

Im sorry you lost the kidds. You did not do this! Part of our raising goats is loss. Things happen that we have No Control over! Please dont blame yourself. Just put your efforts into helping your doe
Has she passed her afterbirth yet,? Is she warm? Sometimes with the loss of blood she will need warmth and b vitamins. Hang in there..


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## Kristendanae (Aug 29, 2019)

Moers kiko boars said:


> Im sorry you lost the kidds. You did not do this! Part of our raising goats is loss. Things happen that we have No Control over! Please dont blame yourself. Just put your efforts into helping your doe
> Has she passed her afterbirth yet,? Is she warm? Sometimes with the loss of blood she will need warmth and b vitamins. Hang in there..


She passed as well. We tried warming her with heated blankets but she was too far gone. It was such a cold day here.


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## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

What a heartbreaking thing to happen, and right before Christmas! First off, this was not your fault. Sometimes bad luck happens, and for some reason it usually happens all at once. 

Calcium deficiency (milk fever) is possible. It would explain the lack of contractions. If the doe was unable to push, labor would not have proceeded as normal. I'm guessing the first kid in line was the one that was dead on arrival? 

For future reference, if you see strings of clear goo but nothing happens within half an hour or so, do as Goats Rock suggested and have a feel inside. Sometimes the doe can't push because of calcium deficiency, and other times it's because a kid is positioned wrong. A kid in the birth canal stimulates strong contractions (it's why a doe contracts reflexively when you put your hand inside). But if the kid is laid wrong and can't get into the birth canal, it won't stimulate strong contractions, which is why you might see labor fizzle out or not really even start at all. 

In either of these cases it's very important to help the doe by reaching in after the kids. It sounds scary but thank goodness with goats it's usually pretty straightforward and doesn't take a ton of strength or special skill (although it helps to have small hands). If you think your doe might be in labor but nothing is happening, it's ok to take a quick feel inside to be sure. If she's in labor the cervix will be open and introducing your hand will stimulate contractions. You'll feel some part of a kid either in the passage or stuck at the end of the passage. If she's not in labor you'll have a hard time getting much more than your fingers inside, you'll hit a dead end, and no harm done by having a quick feel other than your goat might be kind of mad at you. 

Once again, I'm sorry this happened but it's not your fault. I'm sure you didn't cause it by making her nervous. Any time an animal gives birth there's a chance of something going wrong. I hope your other kiddings have happy endings.


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## Moers kiko boars (Apr 23, 2018)

You did everything you knew to do. Its an awful feeling to lose something you love and are wanting to see. It is part of being human. We try to do all we can. The best we can. Sometimes we dont win. Please take this education and apply it . You have grown immensly in your knowledge of goat birthing. Its a risk for all of us.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I am so very sorry. 

Sometimes, no matter what we do for them, we cannot save them. 

There is a lot of good advice given.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Goats Rock said:


> You could wash up, (you and the back side of the doe) trim long fingernails, I put on surgical gloves, get some lube (soapy water, *mineral oil*, ky jelly, etc) and go in to check, see if she is dialated and see if maybe a kid is stuck.
> 
> Since the weekend is coming and it's hard to get vets, you might want to get your vet on call.


Mineral oil??? Some old people used an egg white. If you do not have commercial lubricant.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Moers kiko boars said:


> Here is a pic of 1 of my does in labor
> View attachment 167255
> View attachment 167257
> View attachment 167257


Typical, feeding between contractions.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Kristendanae said:


> Thanks for all your help. She had one that was dead and another that didn't last a full 12 hours. She is about to pass and I'll probably just have the vet put her down. I really don't know what I'm doing wrong at this point. I try to be extremely hands on and am constantly cleaning their pens and bowls. Keep mineral out and give them herbal dewormer 2 times weekly. But am not afraid to give them chemical dewormer if needed. Am constantly getting fecals to check and make sure everyone is good. They are in my care and depend on me and i have no idea what went wrong and I'm failing them. The vet said maybe "milk fever" I guess I just got lucky the first 2 years with not having any issues and now I've had multiple one die. I'm just at a loss.


Thank you very much for sharing! Maybe some other doe can be helped. GOOD LUCK next time! :hug::hug:


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## Ron at BFAD (May 2, 2018)

healthyishappy said:


> How much did you give them???


Give them about a 1/4 cup a day and either mix it in their grain or just pour it in their feed box. You know goats. If its good and in front of them they'll eat it. At one time i even had my feed mill just add it to the feed that i was feeding them for about 2 weeks before kidding. Hope this helps.


healthyishappy said:


> How much did you give them???


It usually depends on when i woke up and realized the date is close. I tried to give it 2 weeks before but the one who got the flour mixed into her grain was only 3 or 4 days before. Now since i grow rye i just use it in my mix and everything gets it always, cows, goats, sheep, pigs, chickens and ducks. Don't know what it does for eggs (maybe that's why their all splatted on the wall) not. just a funny thought. But everything seems to eat it and nobody's saying they don't like it. But now i just mix all my left over grains other than that for planting together, rye, wheat, oats, spelts, soy (roast in the oven), corn, milo, millet, buckwheat, quinoe, chia and anything else I've grown and depending on whose getting it, molasses for cows, goats and sheep and figure each grain adds its own benifits.


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## Denise Troy (Aug 31, 2019)

Damfino said:


> What a heartbreaking thing to happen, and right before Christmas! First off, this was not your fault. Sometimes bad luck happens, and for some reason it usually happens all at once.
> 
> Calcium deficiency (milk fever) is possible. It would explain the lack of contractions. If the doe was unable to push, labor would not have proceeded as normal. I'm guessing the first kid in line was the one that was dead on arrival?
> 
> ...


If I see this, and I feel inside..do I use the kid puller? Is that the time to call the vet, or does she need more time? So, if I'm reading this all right..you are not recommending to give oxytocin? And, I've only watched videos on milk fever..any extra clues on how to know in person if it's happening? My baby monitor comes Monday...they aren't due until end of Jan, feb 1...but, I'm still checking ligaments just to get a feel, and get them used to it. Any other tips? I'm sorry to highjack this thread...but, I'm trying to learn. I am soooo sorry for your loss. I can only imagine how tore up you and your loved ones must feel after going through the pregnancy process. I just pray the new year brings you better things ahead.


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## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

If you reach inside and feel kids, you can usually just pull them out with your hands. The only ones that have defeated me are the ones with severe head back. I bought a kid puller in case I ever get another one of those nightmares. Most of the time you can reach in far enough to find the feet and head. Make sure they belong to the same kid! Unless it's backwards, try to position the kid with the front toes forward and the head resting on the knees. If the kid is backwards, get both hind hooves into the birth canal and then pull the legs downward. Get breech kids out as quickly as possible so they don't inhale amniotic fluid.

If you suspect a doe is in distress and you don't feel comfortable pulling kids yourself, it's always ok to call a vet or an experienced goat mentor. I do not recommend giving oxytocin unless you know for sure what you're doing. If you give it when the doe is not dilated, you could cause serious problems. A vet would know whether it was safe to give. A vet should also be able to tell if a goat is showing signs of calcium deficiency and could give calcium injections to prevent the doe from crashing after delivery.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Damfino said:


> Make sure they belong to the same kid!


This can be tricky sometimes; take it easy, do not rush!


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## Denise Troy (Aug 31, 2019)

Trollmor said:


> This can be tricky sometimes; take it easy, do not rush!


And my doe is going to let me reach inside her to do this...I saw that I Tie her up?


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## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

Most of the time, the doe will let you reach inside, especially if she's already laying down. If she is getting up and down and moving around too much, it is helpful to have someone hold her still for you. I have never had to tie up a goat with delivery complications, but I would do it if I needed to. It's better than having her run off with a kid half out! (I think someone on here had their doe run off with a breech kid partly out and of course that kid didn't make it.) 

If your goat is kind of wild then she should be contained in a small area where, if she does try to run off during delivery, she can't actually get away from you. I don't usually lock my goats in during delivery since my favorite place for them to have kids is on the clean grass in an open area, but my goats are also very tame like pets. They like me to be there when they kid and don't object to a little help if needed. If my goats were skittish I would try to make sure they were contained in a small area when they went into labor.


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## Denise Troy (Aug 31, 2019)

We made a kidding pen today...my Pygmy is a bit skittish..perhaps I’ll have her go in there. But, Busty, my Nigerian Dwarf mix..she’s better...we have no grass, so it’ll be on the clean straw in the barn..but she loves it in there...it’s her home. And then I can keep Stormy in the pen, out of the way.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Denise Troy said:


> And my doe is going to let me reach inside her to do this...I saw that I Tie her up?


Most of the times the doe understands that we try to help. TALK with her in the first place!

(Say Hm - hm - hm, and "ask" with your hand what is acceptable.)


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## Denise Troy (Aug 31, 2019)

I usually rub them and say, it’s ok, it’s ok...that sort of thing..but I’m sure any words would do.....


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

So, how did it end?


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