# NDG losing hair in patches and losing weight



## Simbas04 (Oct 20, 2013)

Someone please help if you have any ideas about what could be going on or if you have any experience in this matter. A year after we took 2 of our does to a new breeder we began having issues with hair loss. It turned out to be mites and so we gave them ivermectin for a week straight as prescribed by our vet. Then the hair loss began again with our once over weight doe Kiwi (who had begun to lose an excessive amount of weight), but this hair loss was patchy and not how the rest had lost hair before. It really concerned me so I took her to the vet and they did a skin scraping and ran a ringworm test, which came back positive. We placed some fungal ointment on an area which was bald and the hair did grow back after about 2 weeks. This whole time she was separated with my baby boy Simba because they were the only ones looking unhealthy. My vet then prescribed sulfur-lime dip. We did that about twice, each administration 5 days apart, due to the rain and cold weather we had to stop. When the hair loss began again once it got warmer we administered it again. It was the second to the last dose and Kiwi began to cry out. Not a normal goat cry like "I want to be with my family", it was more like a sorrowful, "I am in so much pain" cry. She began to fall over and so we decided this was definitely an emergency. We took her to the vet to be seen right away and while we were there she began to stiffen up even more. Head was back, stargazing and completely stiff. They drew her blood and gave her IV. We left her there to be hospitalized and an hour later they called us to say she had passed away. We had a necropsy done on her, but it came back inconclusive. This was in April. We don't know what killed her, all we know is she was a bit copper deficient. Now my Simba is losing weight. Once an 85lbs goat, now I am able to lift him. He is losing fur in patches and I don't know what to do. Every time I take him to the vet it is the same diagnosis and I just don't want to lose him too... Can anyone please help?


----------



## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Have you had a fecal test done to include coccidia? Have they been tested for CAE, CL and Johnes? When was the last time they were copper bolused? What about BoSe (selenium)? Do you have a good loose goat mineral out for them? What is their diet (what exactly do you feed them)?


----------



## Simbas04 (Oct 20, 2013)

Kiwi nor Simba have had a fecal test. Kiwi did have a BoSe injection when we took her to the vet for her patchy hair loss and that didn't seem to be the issue because nothing drastically changed. In 2010 they had CAE, CL, and Johnes testing, but they havent since I had my girls bred this last time. Within the last 4 months Simba has had a skin biopsy to see why my goats were losing hair and try to see if we could conclude from him what may have killed Kiwi, but it only came back conclusive for mites and when we did the ivermectin again the issue went away for awhile, but now it is back again. I feed them 2 cups of purina goat chow as a group when I put them up at night and there are 7 goats that eat that at once. I feed them orchard hay 1.5 flakes in the morning. And they always have fresh water and a mineral goat block available to them. What is Copper Bolused?


----------



## lottsagoats (Dec 10, 2012)

Mineral blocks are not very good. Goats have to lick so much to get a small amount that it burns their tongues. The loose minerals are better for them.

As for the mites and such-they are probably in your barn, soil and surroundings. Animals with a poor immune system will chronically be infested, which sounds like your 2 are/were.

What breeds? 2 cups of grain once a day doesn't sound like much divided between 7 goats. The stronger will get more and the weaker will get less, if any at all.

Copper boluses (Kopasure) are capsules of copper oxid rods. You measure out the dosage after you open the capsule and give your animal the proper dosage. The copper rods lodge in the folds of the stomach and dissolve slowly, so the goats get a regular dose of copper. A lack of copper will cause skin and hair issues and will suppress the immune system. Zinc is another mineral that can cause skin and hair problems.

Iron and other minerals will block the bodies ability to use copper. Bolusing will help with that.


----------



## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Agree with above mentioned info.

Did you treat their shelter area when you treated them for mites?


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Kiwi could have had Polio, listeriosis or tetanus. the star gazing, stiffening...
http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/listeriosis.html
http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/tetanus.html

Here is my thought..I had a few buck loose hair in patches, skin was soft and pink, no scaly patches...both were getting over illness, had a lot of medication..I believe their body was over taxed....the liver worked over time.

what I would recommend
I would have a fecal done, be sure worms are not an issue
stop ringworm dip, give daily Probios, loose minerals as suggested...
offer electrolytes to encourage more fluid intake to flush the system, be sure to offer plain water too for them to choose
Give daily Fortified B complex shots for support
Check eyes for anemia
http://goat-link.com/content/view/110/107/#.UmSAu5Rxte4
Switch feed slowly to a better quality feed or a mix ( recipe to follow) 
quality hay/alfalfa and green leaves
any one with ring worm use regular over the counter fungus cream..
Basically giving their system a rest, let it heal and renew, balance feed and hay and minerals needed and supportive therapy with probios and Fort. B complex..
Also up date C D &T in case Kiwi had tetanus, if your goat never had CD &T do two shots 21 days apart..its 2 cc sub Q...Tetanus has a few days to a few months incubation time frame!

COntact the breeder you took them to and see if she is having issues you should be aware of...sounds like you could have brought something home..

here is a recipe for Homemade Electrolytes

A half gallon of hot water
2-6 Tablespoons of Unsulphured Blackstrap Molasses
1-2 Tablespoons of Either Sea Salt, Epsom Salt, Baking Soda or Table Salt.
1 cup of Apple Cider Vinegar

Mix well and drench or let them drink it.

hereis a mix recipe

6 parts whole oats
2 parts calf manna
2 parts BOSS
1 part Beet pulp
mix well and serve one part mix to 3 parts alfalfa pellets

this is a pretty well balance mix...a part is what ever you use to scoop, we used a 3# coffee can 
Best wishes


----------



## Simbas04 (Oct 20, 2013)

Thank you so much everyone for your help! I will be sure to try all of this to see if I can increase the health of my herd! I have one question first though. 5 of my 7 Nigerian Dwarf goats are wethers so I have been concerned that if I give them more then 2 cups of grain I may have to worry about crystals. Is that a concern that should be at the forefront of my mind? I was also told by my vet that alfalfa is not good for goat belly's so I haven't fed that to them for three years unless of course they are pregnant, then I give them an 80-20 grass hay/alfalfa mix. I was concerned about the mites in the surrounding environment but in June when Simba had his biopsy I asked the vet what I should do and they said that the mites were only found on skin and I didn't have to worry about killing them in the barn and kennels and such, just worry about ridding them from our goat's skin and hair follicals. I thought it was odd, so do you guys have any suggestions on what I should use to rid the mites we seem to keep getting?


----------



## Simbas04 (Oct 20, 2013)

The goats are up to date on CD&T as well as their dewormer. Simba even has a rabies shot because after Kiwi died I wanted to rule that out as a possibility because it looked like she died from something neurological.


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Wethers really dont need feed as long as they have access to quality hay/alfalfa and graze...ifyou like giving them some feed a small amount is good and you can top dress it with Ammonium chloride ..here is a good article to read on Urinary Calculi
http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/urinarycalculi06.html
keep ther ratio of Calcium to phosphorus at 2:1 is important to prevent UC...

Your vet is wrong about mites...they do live a few days off their host..long enough to get on another host...I would treat the bedding and pens....
alfalfa is safe to serve...its higher in calcium and can help boost the ratio in favor of calcium..


----------



## alr0002 (Jun 27, 2014)

I saw your post on a forum about treating ringworm. Someone gave us a NDG and we have no experience with them. We have LaManchas and a Nubian/alpine cross. We seem to have a lot in common with your description. I am wondering if NDGs need different minerals, etc. than a normal sized goat? Also could stress cause hair loss? She was fine a couple of days ago and now she has big patches missing along her back and sides. None of my other goats are showing any signs of ringworm. Could her immune system be down and that is what caused it? Could we shave her and wash her with something? She seemed healthy when she came to us a few weeks ago. We just made your recommended electrolye drink? What would you do in this situation, other than give the goat back!! Our first goat that we bought a few years ago came to us with a lot of issues, unknowingly, ringworm being one of them. We got a shampoo from our vet and I have some left over we could use, but I am 8 weeks postpardum with my 8th child and would rather not use that if I can help it. We ended up putting that goat down, sadly, but haven't dealt with ringworm since. The goat we just got (the NDG) was given to someone for meat with another one that she had been with for a while. They butchered the male and got attatched to her and couldn't butcher her, so they gave her to us. Wondering if that could cause stress and hair loss, although from the little experience I have had with ringworm it does look like it: patches on hair missing down to the skin, some flake under exsisting hair, and it pulls right out. We just separated her from the rest today. Thanks for you help.


----------



## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

That may or may not be ringworm. I would shave her and give her a bath. I would copper bolus and give her a BoSe shot. I would also do a B Complex shot. Do you have a good loose mineral out?

Just so people realize. This is an old thread but right above my post is a new question.


----------

