# Disbudding???



## TBM (Jun 8, 2019)

I have another newbie question. We are picking up our sweet little nigerian dwarf kids next week. I have just learned about disbudding. It freaks me out...is this necessary???


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## PetLover (Apr 26, 2019)

TBM said:


> It freaks me out...is this necessary???


Well that depends if you like goats with horns or not?
Pros. (with horns)
1.U can use them as handles
2.They can protect themselves a bit easier

Cons.
1 they can hurt you with them
2.And then u have no handles to catch them
3. It makes some people feel bad when they hear the little ones.
But in the long run it is up to you!
Did this help?


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## Huskins’ farm and ranch (Jun 14, 2019)

We have a herd of horn goats and have had very little problems. One problem we have had is heads get suck in fences.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

It is necessary if you show in ADGA shows.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

PetLover said:


> Well that depends if you like goats with horns or not?
> Pros. (with horns)
> 1.U can use them as handles
> 2.They can protect themselves a bit easier
> ...


I get mad almost every day that I can't use them horns as handles. Mine are disbudded, if I did it again (if I had new babies), I wouldn't disbud them. But I also wouldn't introduce horned goats to E&F, I like all my goats on a level playing field.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Huskins' farm and ranch said:


> We have a herd of horn goats and have had very little problems. One problem we have had is heads get suck in fences.


LOL that is what always scares me. I'd probably break out the tennis balls.

EDIT: I've also seen someone take a piece of wood or stick, something thin but strong-ish, and duct tape each side to a horn, so it's a horizontal bar. They can't get them stuck in fences if they can't hook with them.

View attachment 159929


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)




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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

The horns on a goat also help to keep them cool. Down there in your neighborhood you should keep the horns, unless you are planning on showing.


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## CCCSAW (Jul 11, 2019)

I have some with some without right now. Without is definitely easier to handle for shows and such especially with kids. But with definitely makes it easier to grab my one stubborn goat when I need to check something on her. My 2 without horns actually seem to be the meanest, or at least the bossy-est. And in my opinion getting head butted with out horns hurts just as much or more then getting head butting with horns. Worst part so far for us with horns is make sure you have a stand or at least a way to tie the goats up. A horn digging into you leg while your trying to check something on a goat that doesn't want to be looked at is no fun.


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## TBM (Jun 8, 2019)

PetLover said:


> Well that depends if you like goats with horns or not?
> Pros. (with horns)
> 1.U can use them as handles
> 2.They can protect themselves a bit easier
> ...


Yes! Thank you!


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## New-goat-mom (May 21, 2017)

I love goat horns. They are beautiful, and yes, help the goat cool down (I live in Texas), and protect themselves. My goats have never once tried to harm anyone with their horns. Even when my obnoxious Nellie went through her bratty phase she would push you with her forehead and the front of her horns but NEVER try to stab you with them. We put a stop to that really fast, though! My Eliza is horrible for getting stuck in fences...she needs a stick of shame. But yeah, that said, accidents do happen. It is very much just personal choice.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> View attachment 159931


Only make sure the stick can be adjusted when the horns grow!

I prefer horns on them. A head in a fence can be just as bad as a pair of horns, if the bad luck means to make the goat get stuck. But in case of a predator, horns are a plus! They are also beautiful, and can, after the goat is dead, be used for a nice memory on your wall, or making music instruments.

I had a mixed flock, and those born without horns were, in average, a little more bossy. As if they were making up for the defect!

For using horns as handles, an extreme example (do not try to mimic, unless you are very skilled!) is shared by Damfino and her very close friend Sputnik.

https://www.thegoatspot.net/threads/sputnik-my-personal-assistant.201841/#post-2180711


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

TBM said:


> I have another newbie question. We are picking up our sweet little nigerian dwarf kids next week. I have just learned about disbudding. It freaks me out...is this necessary???


Disbudding is a choice.
Depending on the goats age and horn size will tell you if disbudding is even possible and safe. Normally it's done between about 5 days old until a couple of weeks old depending on the size of the buds.
You can do it later but that comes with risks. Chances are, if you're picking up weaned kids they'll be too old and have horn buds too big to disbud.

I have horned, disbudded and naturally polled goats in my herd, and for the most part they all get along just fine. There's the occasional butting and such as herd dynamics change but if you keep an eye on things it should be fine either way.
To prevent them from getting their head stuck I suggest 2"x3" fencing instead of the 4x4 fencing and then it's too small to get heads into even as babies. If you choose the larger field fencing just keep a pair of bolt cutters handy so you can get a goat out quickly if need be.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Trollmor said:


> Only make sure the stick can be adjusted when the horns grow!
> 
> I prefer horns on them. A head in a fence can be just as bad as a pair of horns, if the bad luck means to make the goat get stuck. But in case of a predator, horns are a plus! They are also beautiful, and can, after the goat is dead, be used for a nice memory on your wall, or making music instruments.
> 
> ...


Yes, of course - observation of the stick often to make sure it is taken off and re-adjusted when needed.


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

Unfortunately, a horned goat may not get a chance to live as long a life as an unhorned one. Around here, most of the horned goats get sent to the sale barn and the meat guy buys them. No one wants horns. Can't show them, not even 4-H pack class. 

Disbudding at the early age it should be done is harder on the disbudder (human) than the disbuddee (goat kid). They yell louder about being confined than the actually burn. A correctly working disbudder is hot enough that there is only 15 seconds of burn time per horn bud. The nerves are killed so that pain is over quickly. 

Disbudding is a personal preference, but look to the future. Will you keep that goat it's full life? If not, what is the market for horned vs. unhorned goats in your area?


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Goats Rock said:


> Unfortunately, a horned goat may not get a chance to live as long a life as an unhorned one. Around here, most of the horned goats get sent to the sale barn and the meat guy buys them. No one wants horns. Can't show them, not even 4-H pack class.
> 
> Disbudding at the early age it should be done is harder on the disbudder (human) than the disbuddee (goat kid). They yell louder about being confined than the actually burn. A correctly working disbudder is hot enough that there is only 15 seconds of burn time per horn bud. The nerves are killed so that pain is over quickly.
> 
> Disbudding is a personal preference, but look to the future. Will you keep that goat it's full life? If not, what is the market for horned vs. unhorned goats in your area?


I think that if we're talking about pet goats, hopefully to stay with you forever, not getting showed, and no young kids to possibly get injured by horns -- it's a good idea to leave them horned. But you are very right, it's a personal preference, and if you aren't planning on keeping your goats know that if you have to sell them they may not go to the good "pet" home you want them to, as most people UNFORTUNATELY do not want horned goats.


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## ScottE (May 4, 2019)

Disbudding is a pretty hot topic with strong emotions on both sides that can lead to forum threads needing to be shut down.

For all of the above reasons I prefer to leave horns on our goats. I look at it like declawing cats or cropping tails and ears of show dogs. I dont believe in either of those activities either , but I understand why its done.


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Dwarf Dad said:


> The horns on a goat also help to keep them cool. Down there in your neighborhood you should keep the horns, unless you are planning on showing.


Word choice was a little harsher than I wanted.
"Should think about keeping the horns" unless you are showing sounds more like what I meant to say. Words have a way of tricking me these days lol.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Everyone has their reasons for keeping or not keeping horns. Both ways are fine. You have to do what is best for you and your farm. No one should be made to feel bad whether they want horns or not.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

ScottE said:


> Disbudding is a pretty hot topic with strong emotions on both sides that can lead to forum threads needing to be shut down.
> 
> For all of the above reasons I prefer to leave horns on our goats. I look at it like declawing cats or cropping tails and ears of show dogs. I dont believe in either of those activities either , but I understand why its done.


In Sweden it is illegal to castrate or dehorn without sedation, and cutting dogs' tails or ears is totally forbidden.

You must put marks in the ears of certain species, though, like cows, pigs, sheep, and goats. It is not allowed to tatoo them instead. This strucks me as illogical, I guess it takes a political debate to do something about it.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I agree, I for one, will not disbud.
That is just what I prefer.

Others will have their opinions on it, which I respect. But may not agree with.


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## friesian49 (Jul 2, 2018)

The two girls I have now are my first goats and the breeder I got them from did not disbud and was strongly against the practice. I didn't know any better, but figured with anything on an animal, you treat them right and all should be good.

I've had the girls for about 1 1/2 years and have had no issues. Got them at 4 months so they did get the heads stuck (for seconds) in the fence for about a month or so. Nothing major. They don't use them on anyone other than each other, when they push the other around or do the whole rearing up and smacking horns thing. I did buy noodles in case I needed them as cover, but haven't so far - was thinking more of when I was doing their hooves, but now they are good with being tied to fence while I do it. 

I think I'd buy one that was born without horns naturally, but I don't think I'd get them disbudded. I liken them to declawing a cat - give them enough cat trees and stuff to claw naturally and trim them and no issues. Not that I'm trimming the horns, but you know what I mean! 

But my girls are just pets, they don't leave the property and anyone going in the pasture gets warned about poop and the girls DO have horns. Just in case they can't see the obvious!


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## groovyoldlady (Jul 21, 2011)

Doesn't goat breed also play into this? My understanding was that dairy goats are a little more likely to "use their heads" (in the negative sense) than meat or fiber breeds. So ADGA said, "No horns". But I see fiber and meat goats with horns all the time at the various fairgrounds we visit... My assumption (probably based on a serious lack of caffeine when I was attempting to think) was that those breeds - usually Boers and Angoras here - are less likely to try to head butt or hook someone.


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## friesian49 (Jul 2, 2018)

My girls are Boers and they are really easy going - except around some dogs - they will actually give the gate or fence a small headbutt if the dogs get too close - one has never been inside the pasture or near them when they are outside of it to see how they'd react then. Headbutting each other - all the time. Me? No.


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