# Pre Breeding protocol for Doe



## TheGoatWhisperer (Jan 18, 2014)

We are breeding our doe in a couple weeks and I know there is some things that we need to do before breeding and birthing for her health shot wise, vitamin wise, etc...?? 

This is her second kidding but this is her first time birthing with us. Her diet consists of 2 cups of alfalfa, 1 cup Scratch and Peck goat feed, 1/3 cup field peas, 1/4 cup sunflower seeds all twice a day. Should we be changing her diet at all? She has free choice minerals and kelp as well. We are also worming her for cocci right now before breeding as well. 


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Sounds like you are on track! A lot of breeders will give the CD&T vaccine a month before kidding. I think if you're copper bolusing, they recommend you do that before breeding also....but I"m not positive on that one since we don't do it. Hopefully, I'll bump your thread and someone that does the copper will respond.


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## TheGoatWhisperer (Jan 18, 2014)

Oh good!! Yeah she is due for copper I think anyways so we will get that covered  


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## J-TRanch (Jan 31, 2014)

You can copper bolus while pregnant if she needs it. It will not do any harm. 
I suggest replamin which has all the needed minerals. 

You could bump grain a little if she looks like she needs it. 

We do CD&T right after a doe kids, and give the kids their cd&t at 3 weeks and again at 6 weeks.

We also give selenium and Vitamin E gel. Hope that helps!


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

You might up her feed a little to "flush" her. Although if you are breeding her in a couple weeks it might be too late for that. When you "flush" them with more feed, it is basically telling their bodies that there is plenty of feed available for them to raise more kids and increases your chances of multiples. Or....at least that's what I've been told. We never seem to remember to do it. LOL


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## TheGoatWhisperer (Jan 18, 2014)

J-TRanch said:


> You can copper bolus while pregnant if she needs it. It will not do any harm.
> I suggest replamin which has all the needed minerals.
> 
> You could bump grain a little if she looks like she needs it.
> ...


Ok thank you so much!! I'll look into replamin.

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## TheGoatWhisperer (Jan 18, 2014)

kccjer said:


> You might up her feed a little to "flush" her. Although if you are breeding her in a couple weeks it might be too late for that. When you "flush" them with more feed, it is basically telling their bodies that there is plenty of feed available for them to raise more kids and increases your chances of multiples. Or....at least that's what I've been told. We never seem to remember to do it. LOL


Haha wow I've never heard of that method  well she gets plenty of grain and is definitely at a good weight so idk that she needs that. Lol she's such a little piggy.  she even lounges around like one. 








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## J-TRanch (Jan 31, 2014)

TheGoatWhisperer said:


> Ok thank you so much!! I'll look into replamin.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Goat Forum


Great! I LOVE replamin.. I wouldnt 'flush' her or anything else. That could cause toxemia... She looks to be a good weight. I wouldnt feed grain until after kidding...even after kidding limit it a little but feed lots of alfalfa


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

TheGoatWhisperer said:


> Haha wow I've never heard of that method  well she gets plenty of grain and is definitely at a good weight so idk that she needs that. Lol she's such a little piggy.  she even lounges around like one.
> View attachment 83906
> 
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Goat Forum


LOL Yeah, she looks to be a good weight. I had never heard about it either until I got on this forum and several of the breeders on here had mentioned it. I had to ask what it was! We just never remember to try it before breeding so no clue if it really makes that much difference or not. Feeding extra before breeding won't hurt her any if you do decide to try it. But it was recommended to do it around a month before breeding (if I remember right) so at 2 weeks out it's probably too late anyway.


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## TheGoatWhisperer (Jan 18, 2014)

Yeah lol I don't think we will do that. Lol Thinking about cutting back her grain a month or so before she kids as that is supposed to help the babies not be so big? Really not a fan of possibly having a 15 pound doeling and losing it (happened to a friend this morning). I don't want to take her off her grain during the whole pregnancy though...she eats a whole grain diet (lol that sounds funny) so it's not like she's eating a special meat goat formula. I just feel like she needs her grain...idk...


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## J-TRanch (Jan 31, 2014)

TheGoatWhisperer said:


> Yeah lol I don't think we will do that. Lol Thinking about cutting back her grain a month or so before she kids as that is supposed to help the babies not be so big? Really not a fan of possibly having a 15 pound doeling and losing it (happened to a friend this morning). I don't want to take her off her grain during the whole pregnancy though...she eats a whole grain diet (lol that sounds funny) so it's not like she's eating a special meat goat formula. I just feel like she needs her grain...idk...
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Goat Forum


You can give a little bit of grain if you're sure how much. Kids do 70% of their growing in the last month... so toxemia is a huge possibility during that time.


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Here are some threads that talk about flushing if you're interested in reading them. One of them actually says a couple weeks before breeding. The last one you'll have to get to the 3rd page before you get to any info.

http://www.thegoatspot.net/forum/f217/litter-sizes-173014/

http://www.thegoatspot.net/forum/f217/checklist-do-before-breeding-171181/

http://www.thegoatspot.net/forum/f217/breeding-more-doelings-170971/

http://www.thegoatspot.net/forum/f219/merry-oaks-march-kidding-thread-163547/index3.html


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## J-TRanch (Jan 31, 2014)

Before breeding is good since they will lose weight during breeding season. We always do that but not during pregnancy since toxemia


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## TheGoatWhisperer (Jan 18, 2014)

She gets her grain dished out in her own dish so we know how much she gets. We have a small herd. lol Thinking I'll take out the peas and maybe just give her scratch and peck, alfalfa, and BOSS. Definitely gonna cut out the grain when she gets a month out. And I will look at these threads.  


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## J-TRanch (Jan 31, 2014)

TheGoatWhisperer said:


> She gets her grain dished out in her own dish so we know how much she gets. We have a small herd. lol Thinking I'll take out the peas and maybe just give her scratch and peck, alfalfa, and BOSS. Definitely gonna cut out the grain when she gets a month out. And I will look at these threads.
> 
> Sent from my iPhone using Goat Forum


Sounds like you're on the right track ! Just make sure she doesn't get overweight! 
BTW I LOVE your herd name!


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## TheGoatWhisperer (Jan 18, 2014)

Thank you!! Yes we are watching that. She was pretty thin when she came to us but has been putting on about 5-10 pounds a month since about June. She now weighs 195 pounds and looks near perfect. She's slowed down in her gain as well. 

I was wondering when I take her off grain I can still give her her alfalfa pellets right? How much would you offer her of that? 

Haha thanks about our name!XD It was my dads crazy idea but we have all grown to really like it! Lol!

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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

yes, alfalfa pellets are ok all the way thru. You can continue to give her a little grain all the way thru also. She will need the energy. And that way after she kids you already have been giving her grain so it won't be nearly as hard to up it again for her milk production.

For your CD&T shots. If you give the doe her booster a month before kidding, she passes the antibodies to her kids in her milk. Then you give the shot to the kids at 6 weeks and then their booster 3 to 4 weeks later. That is the protocol MOST of the experienced breeders on this forum use. Here is an article that explains the protocol for both vaccinating before kidding and after kidding. http://www.sheepandgoat.com/articles/CD-Tvaccinations.html


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## TheGoatWhisperer (Jan 18, 2014)

Ok so can she have as many alfalfa pellets as she wants or? Thank you for clarifying on the CD&T, that's helpful.


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## sassykat6181 (Nov 28, 2012)

Just my 2 cents..... The kids grow the most in the last month or so. If you cut her feed, her body will take the energy from her fat stores and can lead to ketosis. I keep everyone on their maintenance ration until kidding. Cutting back her feed will not control the size of the kids


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## J-TRanch (Jan 31, 2014)

TheGoatWhisperer said:


> Ok so can she have as many alfalfa pellets as she wants or? Thank you for clarifying on the CD&T, that's helpful.


She will eat a ton of alfalfa pellets, I would just dish out some and give the same amount. Be very very careful with feeding grain throughout and watch out for toxemia for sure... it's a killer. Most people do stay away from grain completely until after kidding just because of the fear. 
I'm on a facebook group with tons of breeders who refuse to feed grain unless they need it. Alfalfa gives enough energy and what they need, especially pellets.

We have always given babies CD&T at 3 weeks of age, then again at 6 weeks. It's what breeders all told me at the ADGA show I went to.


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## J-TRanch (Jan 31, 2014)

sassykat6181 said:


> Just my 2 cents..... The kids grow the most in the last month or so. If you cut her feed, her body will take the energy from her fat stores and can lead to ketosis. I keep everyone on their maintenance ration until kidding. Cutting back her feed will not control the size of the kids


Yep! And if you feed too much it could cause toxemia...theres a super fine line on feeding grain especially in the last month of pregnancy. As long as shes not really overweight, you should be fine.


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

http://www.goatworld.com/articles/pregnancy/pregnancytoxemia.shtml

Excellent article explaining Pg Toxemia and ketosis and the causes and treatments


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## TheGoatWhisperer (Jan 18, 2014)

Thanks so much guys  this helps a lot! 


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