# I can't catch a break... another sick goat...



## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Bad luck comes in 3s, right? So I posted about Chanel and her mouth injury. The next day, one of my older does, Dot, somehow injured her vulva. Ya, not joking. She has a massive cut on it and I have no idea how she accomplished that. Gave her Duramycin and banamine. She didn't even seem to notice the injury much. 









Now I have a sick little Autumn. I just got her the beginning of Oct. She's nubian and a couple months old. I figure around 10mos or so. I noticed that some of the other does weren't letting her eat a bunch, and since she is dehorned, she doesn't really want to fight them. And I hate when I have sick goats. I thought it was the beginning of a cold or pneumonia but now I dont know. She has a fever- dont know the temp since I can't find a thermometer anywhere. She feels hot to me and she is shaking like a leaf. And her breathing is very congested. I gave her Zuprevo/DeX this morning. But she has gotten a lot worse. Now she can't really stand and seems to not be able to see me. It seems like her eyes are wide open but no one is home. But she can sense me and snuggles to me. No vet is open at 2am currently. (I work til midnite so for me, this is somewhat normal hrs.) I have given her Banamine 1ml, Duramycin 3ml, VitB complex 3ml oral, and have tried to get some powerade for electrolytes in her.








Currently she is passed out snoring on my lap. I brought her inside where it is warmer since it was easier to bring her to the med cabinet than to be cold in the barn and make multiple trips in the dark.
Any suggestions for other meds I might have missed?


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Oh Dear, the poor mite.
Can you give her Fortified B Complex?
I'm asking about Fortified, because of the extra thiamine in it.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

mariarose said:


> Oh Dear, the poor mite.
> Can you give her Fortified B Complex?
> I'm asking about Fortified, because of the extra thiamine in it.










Mine says it has Thiamine Hydrocloride 100mg per ml. Is 3ml orally going to be enough to start? She doesn't like the taste but I already gave her 2 shots and I hate giving a lot of shots at 1 time.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

That's the high thiamine one I mean.
I hear you on the too many shots, but I've read here that at this age the injectable B-Complex doesn't do much good if it is oral.

How is her breathing? Is she snotty? I'm wondering if this isn't pneumonia? If I had a goat acting like you describe, I'd be thinking pneumonia... But there are so many ways for a goat to die...

I have Resflor Gold I would let you have if I lived anywhere close to you. But I don't. Resflor Gold is a combination of Nuflor and Banamine and it is my vet's go-to for pneumonia.

If it is pneumonia, she needs to be kept warm, so good for you for bringing her inside. She needs strong antibiotics like Draxxin or Nuflor. LA 200 is an OTC medication that is good for pneumonia but not as good as the stuff you can get from the vet. And she needs fluids. by syringe if she can't drink, but you need to be able to keep it out of her lungs. She needs banamine. And B-Complex.

Poor thing. And hugs to you.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

I'm gonna keep her inside. I bought her for my niece to show for 4H. She is such a sweet heart and I donr want to lose her. Her breathing is spotty and she is still really almost wheezy sounding. But she doesn't cry out. She makes this really quiet maa- so quiet I can barely hear her from 3 ft away. I'll give her a shot of the VitB complex this morning. I gave her a shot of the Zuprevo/DeX yesterday that the vet gave me for pneumonia a couple weeks ago. Should I give her another shot of it this morning?


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I don't know what zuprevo is. She definitely needs a good antibiotic for pneumonia.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

I don't know that drug either. But she sounds super bad and I'd be inclined to give her another shot.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

You want to jump on pneumonia fast, which I agree with Mariarose it sure sounds like it. Call around and see if someone with goats has some good antibiotics they can give to you. Or as much as I’m not a “call a vet” over everything person (because I have terrible vets) in this case I would most defiantly call.
As for your other girls. Keep a eye on them. It looks like you might have a major bully on your hands. For the vulva you can clean it and put some raw honey on it. I had a hippie vet that was awesome (before he moved out of state) and I had a doe that tore badly while kidding. He said I could leave her be or just put some raw honey on it. The only bad thing I see with the honey is it’s sticky. So it might make poop and dirt stick to her. My doe healed just fine just looked a bit odd back there. Keep a eye on any signs of infection. I’m very sorry you are going threw all this


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

It's a cattle drug for respiratory issues. I live in cattle country and it's hard to find certain meds thru the vet's office here. It is what they gave me a couple months ago when I had sick kids and they were thinking it was pneumonia.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Online it is being compared to Draxxin. Yes, I'd try another shot, because this is serious.


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## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

Poor baby. I don't have any advice there. I hope she pulls through for you. For the doe with the torn vulva, some Preparation H ointment will help the swelling go down.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Oh good! Draxxin is supposed to be a good antibiotic! I didn’t see you mention a temp. If you can get one and keep her warm or cool depending on what it says. A goat will shake if too cold or too hot. Other then that just try and keep her happy and comfy. Good job being observant and jumping on it!!!!


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

She is trying to eat. She ate some of her grain mix. She actually tried to attack it but was kinda swinging her head around trying to figure out how to get it in her mouth. She gums at the hay and at some apple chips (homemade no sugar or anything). Can't get her to drink tho. I keep syringe feeding her water and electrolytes. She nibbles a bit they just kinda sits and stares at her food. She hasn't peed or pooped so I brought her inside at 1am.

She keeps looking at my dogs if they come out by her and tried to protect her food from them, so I know she is aware. They have no interest in her food, they were coming over because I was sitting next to her. I dont have to worry about them attacking her. I have Pomeranians and they are as big as her head.

I'm gonna call the vet about the Zuprevo to see how often I can give it. I think it was originally 1x every 7days.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

She isn't going to last 7 days...


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

I put a call into the vet. He is in surgery right now but his secretary said he would call me back when done. Now to wait.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Are you still giving her the vitamin B? It sounds like she has the same thing going on as my buck did. He got pneumonia and then got polio. It doesn’t sound like she has the polio as bad as he did but you still want to give a LOT of thiamine because it is hard to get them over it or keep it from getting worse and you do NOT want it worse especially if she has pneumonia. Let me see if I can find what the dose should be with the B complex you have. I had B1 (thiamine) so that’s what I used and it doesn’t take a whole lot. But no I don’t think a trip to the vet would hurt. We can all throw guesses but the vet SHOULD be able to say exactly what is going on and what to do. I hope you get a call soon. The vitamin B though, even if she doesn’t have polio will NOT hurt her at all. It’s actually pretty regularly used on any sick animal for any reason. Let me see if I can find a link for you though.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/listeriosis.html
It says to also treat for listeriosis which is usually a good idea but I think I would hold off on the penicillin till you talk to your vet. Some drugs should not mix, she already has the one antibiotic in her and if the vet thinks there is something else going on he may not be able to give her the drugs she needs because she has had penicillin. Ultimately it is your call but that is my 2 cents.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

I gave her more VitB complex, as well as Duramycin- 2ml 12 hrs after the first dose. I also gave her .75ml banamine since she was grinding her teeth. She keeps making a weird noise- kinda like a huff/snort. 

She cant/won't stand by herself and she is really shaky when I help her up. She did finally pee a bit ago. She nibbles a bit then stares or naps. And she keeps drooling. She worries me, but she isn't screaming in pain or gasping like she was last night.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

So you gave Duramycin INSTEAD of the Zuprevo? I don't know that I would have done that...


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Why does that thing sticking out of her vulva look like a prolapse? Is she pregnant? 
Her udder looks like it may be filling or am I seeing things?


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

mariarose said:


> So you gave Duramycin INSTEAD of the Zuprevo? I don't know that I would have done that...


No I gave both. Vet said only do the Zuprevo 1x every 7 days. I figured she would need something more so I gave her the Duramycin.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

toth boer goats said:


> Why does that thing sticking out of her vulva look like a prolapse? Is she pregnant?
> Her udder looks like it may be filling or am I seeing things?


Dot lost her kid at a week old the week before Thanksgiving. She won't let me milk her at all nor would she take another kid. That's why it looks like she has an udder. The cut on her vulva is weird. It is actually cut almost from inside- it is on the inner wall and it has swollen out like that. I know it looks like a prolapse- that's what I thought it was at first too.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Oh my, how terrible. 
Hemorrhoid cream right on that, may help.

But, it may be from infection, as to why it is so big. 
Can you get a vet to look at her?


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

As far as it goes for drinking, try some molasses and warm water or sugar and warm water. They digest warm water better than cold.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

She actually drank 2 bowls of water by herself this afternoon/evening. Made me happy!


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

Glad she is improving


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Watching her late tonight and something is off. I think she might have had a stroke. Her tongue hangs out of the right side of her mouth and she keeps drooling from that side. I tried to get her to stand and she just put her head straight down to the floor at an angle. She seems like she can't hold her head up at all.  I dont want to lose her but I dont know if anything is helping her. 
When she eats she seems like she is starving but when I was paying really close attention it seems like she is pushing food around the bowl and not getting it in her mouth. Almost the same for the water- I had to keep her head up a bit- she kept shoving her nose into the water and I was afraid she was gonna drown herself. I syringe watered her so I know she has liquids in her. She finally pooped around 5pm. Its berries not liquid so I'm hoping that's a small positive. I gave her some nutri-drench and jumpstart to hopefully keep her rumen going. She really liked the nutri-drench. 
I'm going to try to make her an alfalfa/pellet slurry tomorrow and see if I can get her to eat that. Hopefully she will keep hanging on and fighting. She lifts her head up when I go over by her and tries to snuggle her head against me. It makes me sad to see her so sick.


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## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

This definitely sounds like polio. I've never personally dealt with polio, but I believe straight Thiamine is indicated, which has to be obtained from a vet. Until you can get that, she needs high doses of the vitamin B complex you have on hand. I believe that is the only thing that can pull her through. She needs 4cc thiamine per 100 lbs. given subcutaneously every 6 hours. Check your vitamin B bottle to see how much thiamine is in it in order to figure out how much you need to give her in order for her to get enough thiamine into her system.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Damfino said:


> This definitely sounds like polio. I've never personally dealt with polio, but I believe straight Thiamine is indicated, which has to be obtained from a vet. Until you can get that, she needs high doses of the vitamin B complex you have on hand. I believe that is the only thing that can pull her through. She needs 4cc thiamine per 100 lbs. given subcutaneously every 6 hours. Check your vitamin B bottle to see how much thiamine is in it in order to figure out how much you need to give her in order for her to get enough thiamine into her system.


It has 100mg per ml of Thiamine. How much VitB complex should I be giving her?


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## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

This is what I got off of the Tennessee Meat Goats website:

_"I also give Vitamin B 1 (Thiamine) injections, dosing at 5 cc per 100 pounds liveweight for 100 mg/ml thiamine every 6 hours. I start giving thiamine into the muscle (IM) and then change to SQ injections after five days. Thiamine of 100 mg/ml strength is required. The only injectable over-the-counter product with 100 mg/ml of thiamine is Fortified Vitamin B Complex. Prescription thiamine (Vitamin B1) is available only from a vet. Injections get the medications into the blood stream faster, and quick treatment is critical with this disease."_
_http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/listeriosis.html_


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## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

And it looks like you should give it IM, not SQ. Sorry, like I said I've never personally dealt with this issue. I hope your little gal pulls through for you.


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

Sending some prayers


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

My heart bleeds for both of them! Poor things!

If she does not get water into her, maybe you could try with a nipple bottle, and hold her head, carefully watching that she swallows?


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Mmhyronimus said:


> Watching her late tonight and something is off. I think she might have had a stroke. Her tongue hangs out of the right side of her mouth and she keeps drooling from that side. I tried to get her to stand and she just put her head straight down to the floor at an angle. She seems like she can't hold her head up at all.  I dont want to lose her but I dont know if anything is helping her.
> When she eats she seems like she is starving but when I was paying really close attention it seems like she is pushing food around the bowl and not getting it in her mouth. Almost the same for the water- I had to keep her head up a bit- she kept shoving her nose into the water and I was afraid she was gonna drown herself. I syringe watered her so I know she has liquids in her. She finally pooped around 5pm. Its berries not liquid so I'm hoping that's a small positive. I gave her some nutri-drench and jumpstart to hopefully keep her rumen going. She really liked the nutri-drench.
> I'm going to try to make her an alfalfa/pellet slurry tomorrow and see if I can get her to eat that. Hopefully she will keep hanging on and fighting. She lifts her head up when I go over by her and tries to snuggle her head against me. It makes me sad to see her so sick.


That is exactly what our goat did right before she died. 

I'm so sorry, if she is still here then I would try what @Damfino said and get her to a vet.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Trollmor said:


> My heart bleeds for both of them! Poor things!
> 
> If she does not get water into her, maybe you could try with a nipple bottle, and hold her head, carefully watching that she swallows?


I have been using a syringe to get liquids into her mouth. We somewhat dealt with that fall 2017 when I had goats go down with barber pole worms. I nursed 1 back from death and she had kids this last summer. I'm hoping I can do that with Autumn.
I set the bottle I was using for my bottle baby next to her when I came in and she started nosing that. I gave her some milk and she was trying to slurp that up faster than she was water. I think the milk will help since at least it is some nutrition and calories plus the liquid to keep her hydrated. It isn't like I don't have the milk to share with her- I have make bottles anyways. 
She is definitely having issues trying to get anything in her mouth. I got some pellets wet and and put the mush in her mouth. She can swallow and gums the pellets to eat them. I took away her hay because she was having issues with it- she was getting it stuck on the right side of her mouth and she couldn't get it to move to where she could chew or swallow it.


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

Hay is definitely really important, maybe try and blend some up into a mush or something.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

What about using beet pulp as a source of fiber while she is having issues eating the hay? No personal experience using it myself and admit I am only asking this because I have read about it being used by others on this site and I know it has a high fiber content.


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## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

She may be able to swallow alfalfa pellets soaked in water, made into a slurry, and fed from a large syringe with the tip cut off. Hay could definitely choke her if she can't swallow. Poor baby.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

I'm thinking she's already making a slurry from roughage/alfalfa pellets, so more hay stuff would just be making life more complicated for her. She's working this like a champion.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I would also treat for listeria, slack jaw is a good indication of it.
Penicillin should be used for listeria.
Penicillin, 10 cc per 100 lbs 1 cc per 10 lbs, you want high doses to cross the barrier. Also give banamine or Dex for brain swelling.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Is she anemic?

I would try all the treatments (medications and dosages) that have been recommended.

Here's a link to some liquids you could syringe feed her: http://www.goatworld.com/articles/potions/index.shtml


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

Please do not give water in a nursing bottle. Even though it sounds like the right thing, it will cause water intoxication and can kill her.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

We have been doing the VitB complex 5cc every 6 hrs today. She was more awake and alert earlier and her fever was down then too. But her fever is back again and she seems out of it again.
She was really interested in the milk/alfalfa pellet slurry we made up. We had to spoon it into her mouth and she kept trying to eat the spoon. But that was a couple hrs ago. Now she keeps trying to curl into a ball and put her head by her belly. I have been trying to keep her from curling since I can't get her to straighten her neck out. She hasn't peed in awhile (since before 4pm) or pooped since then.
I've been trying to keep banamine shots 1cc every 12 hrs. B is every 6 and gave her penicillin a bit ago with her last Bshot. I dont have much penicillin tho. Store was out when I looked tonight and vet is closed til Mon. Should I give another of Duramycin before bed? She seems to be breathing better but the weakness and drooling seems to be getting worse. She can't control her mouth much- it's like feeding a 3mo human pureed baby food. Most drools out but some seems to be staying in.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

I found the following, "Since bacteriostatic drugs may interfere with the bactericidal action of penicillin, it is advisable to avoid giving Duramycin 72-200 in conjunction with penicillin." here https://www.drugs.com/vet/duramycin-72-200.html

So I'd stick with whichever you've been giving for as long as you can before switching to something else


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

Keep fighting for her, I think what your doing seems to be working, her fever on the other hand could be causing her other problems. Does anyone know if there is anything you can give for a fever in goats?


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## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

^ Banamine will help with the fever.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Damfino said:


> ^ Banamine will help with the fever.


Do I dare dose more than 1cc every 12 hrs? Or is that going to make her too weak to recover or worse?


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## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

I don't know on the banamine question. I give it at a rate of 1cc per 100 lbs., and I've only ever given it every 24 hours and no more than three days in a row. But for a case like this I don't know if every 12 hours would be better. I hope someone chimes in who knows more about it than I do.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

From here: http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/goatmedications.html
*Banamine (FluMeglumine)* - Use no more frequently than every 12 hours (stomach ulcers are possible) unless goat is dying, justifying the risk. Dosage is 1 cc per 100 lbs. body weight IM.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I wouldn't do more than once every 12 hours.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Goat Rock says: "Please do not give water in a nursing bottle. Even though it sounds like the right thing, it will cause water intoxication and can kill her." Of course everything that is too much or too little is harmful! I got the impression that the poor thing could not eat or drink enough, just trying to get hold of something, with an involuntary shaking head. If it is a nerv injury, I thought it might be difficult for her to swallow properly as well.

How ARE the poor goats doing now?


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Not better or worse. She isn't eating on her own and keeps drooling but she hasn't gotten worse. She still hasn't cried out like she is in pain. I'm still pushing alfalfa slurry and water and some milk. Continuing with the VitB 5cc every 6 hrs. Banamine at 12hrs.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

*Holding my thumbs* - what do you say in English? Crossing my fingers?


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Trollmor said:


> *Holding my thumbs* - what do you say in English? Crossing my fingers?


Thanks


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

The water in a bottle thing is because of which stomach the water would go into, not because @Goats Rock wants to restrict fluids. When sucking from a bottle, with the head position that entails, the water would go into a place that milk is supposed to go into. Whereas, swallowing from a syringe or a pan does not shunt it to the same place. Kid digestion, it'll drive me crazy.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Can we see some more pictures of her? Maybe that will help us think of ideas. You can increase the Vitamin b shots to twice that much.....at this point it is probably worth a try. You can't overdose on vitamin b. What type of syringe are you using to feed her with?


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

Mmhyronimus said:


> Thanks


I think what your doing seems to be working,, hopefully she pulls out of it soon so you can get some rest and hopefully some peace.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Hm, now I am at a loss of English words!  I meant a nipple bottle made from soft material such as pliable plastic, and when nipple in the goat's mouth you squeeze gently. You can also use a injection tub, of course without the sharp end. Gently squeeze the liquid into the goat's mouth, at the side. Check carefully that she really swallows, if necessary gently bend her head up and down. Only when one mouthful is properly swallowed, you can squeeze in more water.

The liquid will not reach the "milk stomac" on a fully grown goat, since it has already regrediated to a small piece of hide.

If a grown-up goat is suckling from the bottle, well prove me evidence that she (he) really does! So far I have never seen that, in spite of giving many of my loved ones water in this way. Once I had a goat who could actually drink juice from a glass, but only one. (Her name was Hei∂rún, named after the saga goat of Valhall.)

Oh, of course we don't restrict fluids!!! Dear me, we all try to help a sick goat! (console):hug:

Vitamin B goes out through the kidneys, so if she is only urinating normally, you can overdose that.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Sadly Autumn is not at her most photogenic. The black stripe on her back should follow her spine. She keeps having her head crooked to the side like in picture 1. She doesn't let me try to straighten it. She seems to have little control of her bottom jaw. She is a little crabby since I readjusted her. She keeps wanting to sit on her left side but I dont want her to get side sores from sitting on 1 side too much.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

The syringe is just a basic 6cc syringe.


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

I'm starting to think maybe it is a nerve thing. I'm going to do some research.


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

Unless she had a stroke. Sending some prayers


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Thanks so much for the pictures! Poor baby. Can we see a picture of her lower eyelid? Here is an example:








The membrane under her eye should be dark pink. I couldn't remember if you had said if she was anemic or not.

I think you will have an easier time feeding her and be able to get more into her (she needs a LOT of fluids, a lot more than can be realistically syringe fed!) if you can get a drench gun that looks like this. It is easier to stick the nozzle down the side of her throat.










Also, if this is possible, when the vet opens she needs sub-q fluids from the vet to hydrate her, and/or to be tubed with fluids.

@TCOLVIN do you have any ideas? I know you have saved many sick goats.

@Mmhyronimus you are doing a great job in your efforts to save her!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Have you been doing penicillin every 6 hours along with the B? You want to treat for polio and listeriosis. Very important to do every 6 hours around the clock.


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

Saw this, possibility?


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Syringe, not tub, thank you for the word! Beautiful colour, here we call that black stripe "ale" (ål). (No, I got it wrong, I mean the fish that looks like a snake, and that breeds secretly in the Saragasso.)

Poor Autumn, she has not got anything into her "våm" for a long time! And her head, and your description, I think it is a brain damage. If she stubbornly wants to lie on the one side, I would guess it is more uncomfortable for her on the other side. I guess you have already padded her up with towels to make her lie more comfortably. She glides off the towels, right? To me it seems as if she has little control of her head and legs as well.

PS Ah, listeria? I have never seen that (thank goodness!!!), but the symptoms are very close, aren't they? What does your vet say about listeria?

Eyelid: You can also check the colour in her mouth for the same reason. Both places to be more sure.


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Trollmor said:


> Hm, now I am at a loss of English words!  I meant a nipple bottle made from soft material such as pliable plastic, and when nipple in the goat's mouth you squeeze gently. You can also use a injection tub, of course without the sharp end. Gently squeeze the liquid into the goat's mouth, at the side. Check carefully that she really swallows, if necessary gently bend her head up and down. Only when one mouthful is properly swallowed, you can squeeze in more water.
> 
> The liquid will not reach the "milk stomac" on a fully grown goat, since it has already regrediated to a small piece of hide.
> 
> ...


Over here we say "drench". They sell drench "guns", big syringes with long tubes, on veterinary supply web sites. I use a 60 ml syringe with a plastic nozzle on it like the one I used for feeding myself through stomach tube.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

I can do a little more penicillin. I have very little left. She doesn't slide off the towels. I actually have 1 behind her so that she doesn't decide to snuggle the heater too close and burn herself. She is still aware of around her. If I show her the spoon with the slurry, she will raise her head and try to eat. I do have a dench gun but I have been using the syringe so that I know she is swallowing on her own. She tries putting her head in the water bowl but can't seem to suck the liquid into her mouth- almost like she can't control her tongue. I have been making her stand up and she can somewhat support herself but she has no real balance.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Oh, thanks for that word, Dwarf Dad! If alone, I would have thought that a 'drench' would be used for getting liquid out of the body, not into it ... (blush)

Now when I have seen the pictures, I understand that Autumn needs much more both liquid and nutritionthan can be administered in this way.

And, probably, some strong medicine.

Hm, no real balance, poor Autumn! Now, I can only "hold my thumbs".


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

In the one picture of her face it looks like her jaw is off centered like she has no control of her jaw. Does she open her mouth?


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Does your vet have an emergency number @Mmhyronimus ? Maybe you could tell them you have a goat that needs penicillin and fluids right now? I would say use the drench gun to feed liquids. You can still tell if she is swallowing. If the vet won't help until tomorrow then you will have to drench her with a LOT of fluid in addition to the other medication. It says here: http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/stomachtubing.html that a 100 lb goat needs 1 gallon of fluid daily in order to survive.

That is good if she can support herself at all.

Good luck!!


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Trollmor said:


> (Her name was Hei∂rún


A quick side note... I'd be really, really interested in how that name sounds. Can you spell that in a way that we could phonetically sound that out in American English? If not, I understand. Totally my fault I don't know.

OK, back to immense concern over the poor wee one...


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

21goaties said:


> a 100 lb goat needs 1 gallon of fluid daily in order to survive.


This is correct. My only caution is that is spread out over several hrs, not a single sitting. That will lead to water intoxication for the poor dear, no matter WHICH stomach it goes into.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

She is napping now- I know feeding wore her out. I'll wake her up in a bit and drench her with more water, electrolytes, but I'm not going to count milk as liquids for her. Honestly I'm hoping that is working more for energy/calories since she isn't eating a lot of the slurry.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

You could also drench the slurry if it is watery enough.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

I got this penicillin from a neighbor with cattle. Is the dose the same? This says 2ml per 150 lbs on the bottle. It's the same 300,000 units per ml as the penicillin I usually use but this has the 2 types of penicillin- benzathine and procaine.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

This thread I found says it is safe, same dosage (1cc per 10 lbs every 6 hours) https://www.thegoatspot.net/threads/dura-pen.171883/

Reading this page will be very helpful to you (it lists how to treat listeriosis): http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/listeriosis.html


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

toth boer goats said:


> I would also treat for listeria, slack jaw is a good indication of it.
> Penicillin should be used for listeria.
> Penicillin, 10 cc per 100 lbs 1 cc per 10 lbs, you want high doses to cross the barrier. Also give banamine or Dex for brain swelling.


Should I do the 10cc of the Dura-Pen for a dosage then?


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Mmhyronimus said:


> Should I do the 10cc of the Dura-Pen for a dosage then?


If she weighs 100 lbs then yes. The dosage is 1cc per 10 lbs every 6 hours.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

K. I'm thinking she is around 45-55. I'm going to start with a dose of 4 as to not give too much.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

4 is too low. Never underdose Penicillin, not ever. I'd give 6 if you think there is a chance she is over 50 lbs.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

mariarose said:


> 4 is too low. Never underdose Penicillin, not ever. I'd give 6 if you think there is a chance she is over 50 lbs.


Glad you posted that. I wasn't sure.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

K. I gave her 2ml more so she has 6ml of penicillin. I also got 2 cups of water into her and some more slurry. She actually lifted her head up to eat the slurry. I tried but I couldn't get the slurry to push through the drench gun so I'm gonna keep spoon ffeeding that to her.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Penicillin is a pretty safe drug to give and not OD on. You are doing a fantastic job with her!!! I think you mentioned you gave her Dex in the beginning (correct?) it so did you see any improvement after giving it?
I agree on the fluids. Dehydration is something that can very possibly kill faster then whatever she has going on. Hopefully you can get ahold of a vet tomorrow and at the very least give you some Ringers. You could try and tube her. If your neighbor has cattle maybe they have a calf tube you can use. It is the perfect size for your girl. 
Another thing that can be used to lower a fever is aspirin. I’m honestly not sure if that is a good idea in this case or not. I’m not really seeing how it would be bad but wait for someone else to chime in on that one. Just trying to think of some ideas for you (hugs)


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

I did see an improvement of her breathing with the Dex. She is whistling out of her nose today but I will keep wiping it and cleaning it for her. I did ask the neighbor about a tube but they only do feeder cattle so dont have one. She keeps sticking her mouth into the water bowl to keep her mouth wet but I keep moving it away when I'm not next to her because she can't control her head very well and I'm afraid she will drown herself. 
She keeps fighting and so will I. She is such a sweetheart. I normally wouldn't be willing to bring any of the bigger goats in the house around the dogs but I have no worries from her since she is very gentle.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Five liters on a gallon, right? Five liters a day, even if she weighs 100 kgs (which I don't think the goat on the pictures does, maybe 30-40 kgs?) it sounds very much to me. I weigh 50 kgs, and I am doing fine on 1,5 - 2 liters a day, except when I work very hard in hot weather, or have a high fever.

(First time I hear someone fear the goat would harm the dogs. I never experienced either.)


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Trollmor said:


> Five liters on a gallon, right?


No. 3.79 liters is 1 gallon.
45.3 kilograms is 100 lbs. you are correct that this doeling is around half of that. So no, she does not require 1 whole gallon but around half of that.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Most livestock require far more water than we give ourselves. It is my opinion we ourselves require far more water than we give ourselves, but that is a different discussion...


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Trollmor said:


> (First time I hear someone fear the goat would harm the dogs. I never experienced either.)


My dogs are less than 10 lbs. They are tiny. That's why I worry about my goats hurting my dogs. I have a sheep that stomps cats to death and I have 1 goat that stomps on chickens and kills them.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Mmhyronimus said:


> My dogs are less than 10 lbs. They are tiny. That's why I worry about my goats hurting my dogs. I have a sheep that stomps cats to death and I have 1 goat that stomps on chickens and kills them.


mg:

Also I just thought of something...not sure if you already figured this but....if she is around 60 lbs that would be 9.6 cups of water/electrolytes spread out during the day.


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

I can't remember if you mentioned that you might have given her an injection of Vitamin A -D and E? 

(Mariarose, thanks for helping me out about the bottle and water, I'm on an I pad and sometimes don't fully explain what I meant to say).


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Goats Rock said:


> I can't remember if you mentioned that you might have given her an injection of Vitamin A -D and E?
> 
> (Mariarose, thanks for helping me out about the bottle and water, I'm on an I pad and sometimes don't fully explain what I meant to say).


I have been giving her a couple squirts of the nutri-drench. I think she is feeling a bit better now. She actually lifts her head and tracks people moving around her.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Great! Keep it up! I hope the vet can help you tomorrow. Just a heads up, some people on here informed me that the nutri-drench burns the lining of their throat, so you don't want to give it too much.
Also slow improvement is good. Sometimes they will make a sudden fast, drastic improvement right before they die (like a last effort) so slow is good.


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## NicoleV (Dec 12, 2015)

I'm a little late on this thread, but this reminds me of a case of polio. The whole blindness, but "being able to track a spoon of molasses thing" and wanting to snuggle while being crippled. It was a friend's wether. He was down, sub normal temp, couldn't control his movements, neck all twisted. He was around a hundred lbs. We have him 10cc penicillin twice a day and if I remember right, at least 6cc fortified b vitamin like you had 4 times a day. I also drenched him with a liter of water and corn syrup. And even though he was "blind," every time I put the drench gun with the corn syrup water by his head he would turn his head to it like he knew it was there. After the first penicillin and 2 vitamin b shots he was up and with the herd trying to eat within a few hours. He was recovered within 3 days.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

mariarose said:


> A quick side note... I'd be really, really interested in how that name sounds. Can you spell that in a way that we could phonetically sound that out in American English? If not, I understand. Totally my fault I don't know.
> 
> OK, back to immense concern over the poor wee one...


I will be glad to! But, I think I have answered this in another thread? Maybe you can start a new thread for these cultural and linguistic questions, and alert me so I find it?


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Mmhyronimus said:


> My dogs are less than 10 lbs. They are tiny. That's why I worry about my goats hurting my dogs. I have a sheep that *stomps cats to death* and I have 1 goat that *stomps on chickens* and kills them.


Oh, dear, what animals! Congratulate them that they are not mine! I would have put them in the freezer faster than quickly!


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## LockeEstates (Nov 25, 2017)

First, she is beautiful. I have LaManchas and I lost one I loved dearly please have the vet look for parasites quickly. The one I lost the parasite attacked her red blood cells and she had good days but at the end she refused to stand and died in my arms. I was giving her Red Cell every day. But it didn't seem to help.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

LockeEstates said:


> View attachment 141047
> First, she is beautiful. I have LaManchas and I lost one I loved dearly please have the vet look for parasites quickly. The one I lost the parasite attacked her red blood cells and she had good days but at the end she refused to stand and died in my arms. I was giving her Red Cell every day. But it didn't seem to help.


I did give her Valzaban on Fri. I couldn't find my bottle of Prohibit- elsewise I would have used that. She is light pink so I have been using Red Cell also.


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## LockeEstates (Nov 25, 2017)

I just don’t want to see someone else go through what I did it was heart breaking.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Mmhyronimus said:


> I did give her Valzaban on Fri. I couldn't find my bottle of Prohibit- elsewise I would have used that. She is light pink so I have been using Red Cell also.


Does your vet do fecals (to identify what type of parasite (s) she has and thus the type of dewormer to use)? If she is light pink she is probably not sick due to worms, but it could easily happen.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

LockeEstates said:


> I just don't want to see someone else go through what I did it was heart breaking.


I know this pain well already. We lost 13 in Fall of 2017 to barber worms both does, kids and pregnant does. We couldn't get on top of them. Since we moved, we have been hitting the worms harder with the Prohibit and that seems to be working. I haven't asked my current vet if he does fecals yet. I need to do that. I know my last vet has and I had him run some fecals right after we moved but that's quite a distance for me to get stuff to him now. He found barber worms, cocci, and another one that I can't remember the name of currently.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)




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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Mmhyronimus said:


> I know this pain well already.


I think we all do. (console)Btw how is Dot doing? She sort of disappeared when we learnt about Autumn ... :hug::hug:


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Dot is doing good. The swelling is going down. Its healing away. Autumn seems to be doing better. She still doesn't like shots but I dont blame her- 2 every 6hrs and 1 every 12 hrs. She keeps lifting her head and looking around. She still doesn't want to stand up and won't eat solids yet. She "plays" in her water bowl- seems more like she is trying to keep her mouth damp and rinse it out then actually drinking the water. But she has drank about 20oz so far.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Glad Dot is doing better and that Autumn is drinking! Did she drink the 20oz just today? Do you think she still needs tubing or sub-q fluids?

Have you been holding her up periodically? Can she hold herself up if you pull her up? You don't want her legs to be damaged from being down for so long. You could try a sling, you can make one out of a sheet wrapped around her belly. But you will probably need 2 people to hold it up, unless you have something else you could rig it up with.

You are doing great and I sure hope she recovers.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Yeah, a sling might make it easier for her stomac to accept any food. By now, I fear her stomac bacterias could be damaged or even dead. The very best way to restore that is to give her a "chewing ball" from a goat in full health - but they usually do not want to give them away ...


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

I have been holding her up every couple hours. She tries to hold herself up but her legs just dont have the strength. I have been giving her a dose of jumpstart daily- it has microorganisms in it, hopefully that will keep her stomach running somewhat. I can try to see if I can get one of the other does to donate her cud.- do you think I could blend it up so I could give it to her in slurry form? She hasn't stopped drooling yet and cant keep food in her mouth the best yet.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Maybe you could try the Dex again? Did you talk to the vet? 

And yes if you get the cud you could blend it into slurry form. Probiotics (the gel kind for ruminants) should work as well though. Is she peeing and pooping?


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

21goaties said:


> Maybe you could try the Dex again? Did you talk to the vet?
> 
> And yes if you get the cud you could blend it into slurry form. Probiotics (the gel kind for ruminants) should work as well though. Is she peeing and pooping?


She has been peeing. She didn't poop yesterday(Monday) but I'm thinking she didn't have enough intake to really create a poop. The day before (Sunday) she had a very big poop- and all was berries no liquid. We are slowly trying to increase her food uptake.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Thinking a lot of fine Autumn, wishing her well! I guess industrial "cud balls" might do the same job; main thing she gets the right kind of microbes in her entire stomac, and some nice material as well for the bacteria to work with! She looks really empty on the pictures. :hug::hug:


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

I didnt know anything about industrial cud balls. I'm always learning something knew on here.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

I didn't neither, but, as you say, one learns as long as one lives!


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

@Mmhyronimus how is everything today?


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Probios (brand name of a probiotics/gut flora/gut fauna gel) is so common and so easy to get here, that I can only imagine that other ways to handle this issue get ignored? We also have other things that are much less common, such as flat dark beer (dark beer is not common to a lot of people here) and rumen boluses. Perhaps one of these other products is similar to "Industrial Cud"
@ksalvagno can you give us a link to rumen bolus? I don't want to suggest something you don't recommend...


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

https://www.pbsanimalhealth.com/products/rumen-yeast-caps


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Autumn is doing ok. She is lifting her head a lot and her neck is straightening out. She is kinda drinking water by herself. We have passed liquid slurry up to baby food paste. So that is good. We are pushing more liquids since she seems to be getting dehydrated easy. She gets meds every couple hours. She is sick of needles and being poked. I made up some "magic potion" that was suggested from the goat world site. She liked that. It seemed a bit thick so I thinned it down with a little warm water so that my drench syringe would suck it up. 
She still doesn't want to stand up or even really try. I have been holding her up multiple times a day and making her try to hold her weight on her legs. She is peeing but so far no poop since Sunday. I'm hoping the oil in the magic will help to get her going again.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Mmhyronimus said:


> Autumn is doing ok. She is lifting her head a lot and her neck is straightening out. She is kinda drinking water by herself. We have passed liquid slurry up to baby food paste. So that is good. We are pushing more liquids since she seems to be getting dehydrated easy. She gets meds every couple hours. She is sick of needles and being poked. I made up some "magic potion" that was suggested from the goat world site. She liked that. It seemed a bit thick so I thinned it down with a little warm water so that my drench syringe would suck it up.
> She still doesn't want to stand up or even really try. I have been holding her up multiple times a day and making her try to hold her weight on her legs. She is peeing but so far no poop since Sunday. I'm hoping the oil in the magic will help to get her going again.


Glad she is still here and you are amazing for taking care of her! Poor goatie.

I said this before but not sure if you saw it.....if she is near 60 lbs she needs around 9.6 cups of liquid per day (spread out of course). Did you ever talk to the vet about her? Sub-q fluids will also help with dehydration. Straight thiamine (also vet prescription) should help as well. And just curious....did you try the Dex again?
I know all the shots must hurt.  But she needs them.

That is great that she liked the "potion"! For drinking you could also try Gatorade, powdered goat electrolytes, Bounce Back, etc. Just some ideas. At this point I would say everything is worth a try.

For her to poop she is going to need some food like soaked alfalfa pellets/ground hay mush. Maybe you could make it to the consistency of the baby food or mix it together? You could also try tempting her with as many (safe for goats) foods as possible to see if she shows any interest. If you have a Tractor Supply or similar store near you they have a lot of chopped hays, etc for horses that you could try to soak/grind up and feed to her.

Also daily probiotics (I know you said you were giving jumpstart but I would also give some Probios or other probiotic labeled for ruminants). Have you been hearing any rumen sounds? Sounds like a stomach rumbling, I'm sure you've heard it in your other goats. If not the rumen boluses linked above by @ksalvagno should help (they are for cows, you just pour the contents in water and syringe feed). The problem is that if a goat's rumen shuts down it kills the goat if you can't get it going again. I read on an old thread here that with down goats you need to massage their left side (where the rumen is) to help get it going. Also to not give a down goat grain, as they can't digest it when down. Ground hay pellets/hay/fresh greens are okay. There are other tips for getting a goat's rumen back in order, maybe some others will chime in.

As for her standing, that is great that you are holding her up. If you could make some sort of sling or brace that would hold her up (support her body), that should really help with getting everything working. Here are some ideas I had or found in old threads:

You could drape her over a square hay bale or two. Or put a sheet under her and hoist her up between 2 square bales.
When down her legs need to be massaged around every 2 hours to keep them from "falling asleep" and weakening/losing muscle strength.

Putting a towel under her, and poking holes in the two ends, then tying them to something above her (think a playpen with a hammock suspended in it). Sorta like this (from here: http://chickenmashfarms.blogspot.com/2014/03/make-your-own-goat-sling.html):










But of course it doesn't have to be hung so high. Just high enough to hold her up. If she can't hold her neck up then hay bales or stacked towels may help, or making it against a wall.
Another example (from here https://edenhills.wordpress.com/2011/10/21/goat-physical-therapy/):








From an old thread:


ISmellLikeGoats said:


> What I did to make a sling:
> Take a plastic burlap style feed bag and an old ratchet strap. I cut the straps off the ratchet and sewed them to the bag, one under the arm pit, one under the flank, and one around each side of the chest and flank so they can't fall out. I used a regular sewing machine with a straight stitch and then zig-zagged the crap out of it.
> 
> My doe was heavy, over 100 lbs, I used ratchet straps on my fabricated sling. I'd pick up one end of her and pull it tight, then the other end and pulled tight, then used the ratchet to help me lift her up. I put a 2x4 across the corner of the pen to attach the ratchet straps to.


Good luck!! (console)


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

I have been drenching her with liquids alot. We have been doing 8 cups of water and then 2 cups of other liquids- sometime Gatorade, some milk, powerade, other goat electrolytes so she gets different flavors. 
The food I'm feeding her now is alfalfa flakes and goat pellets with milk added to create a slurry/paste. Her stomach is rumbling constantly. I have been putting some probiotic powder in her slurry stuff. 
I have her in the house and nowhere really to hang a sling. It's easier for me to have her in the house so I can both hear her as well as check on her more often to push water and liquids. I'll see if I can have hubby help me figure out a place to maybe hang some sort of sling. 
I did give her another shot of Dex Tuesday morning since she was sounding kind of congested. She was not a fan of that one. She hasn't run a fever for 24hrs so I am going to cut back the banamine to every 24hrs instead of 12hrs that I have been giving her.
I did talk to the vet on the phone- couldn't get her in anywhere since they are booked to the moon already until after New years. (Unless I wanted an emergency call out and I can't afford that- this month has been one disaster after another...) He said that I seemed to be on the right track and to keep giving her the meds and working with her and to call if I need help. He said to make sure to keep up with liquids and keep offering her food whenever I can to tempt her to continue fighting. The secretaries at the front desk are probably getting sick of me calling, I've called to ask alot of questions. Unfortunately, he doesn't always know much since goats aren't his main expertise.
I unfortunately have experience with the whole teach a goat to walk again- it wasn't fun but I remember most of the exercises that I did for Mama when she couldn't walk for 6wks- (pinched spinal nerve from bad first time labor- I wasn't there for the labor, I just got to pick up the pieces.) I'm making sure when I stand her up that I'm going through and moving all the joints and bending and stretching her out to keep her from cramping up. Whenever I'm feeding or giving her water I make sure to rub her down, especially over the areas of the shot to keep blood moving since she doesn't move around much by herself. I'm helping her to try to find her balance and hopefully I can get her up and moving before the New Year! It's going to be a long road but I am going to keep staying positive!


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

None of us could do any better. You are fantastic.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Wow.....thats amazing! She's lucky to have you. Thanks for answering my questions .

Keep us updated! I really hope she recovers.


Mmhyronimus said:


> I have been drenching her with liquids alot. We have been doing 8 cups of water and then 2 cups of other liquids- sometime Gatorade, some milk, powerade, other goat electrolytes so she gets different flavors.
> The food I'm feeding her now is alfalfa flakes and goat pellets with milk added to create a slurry/paste. Her stomach is rumbling constantly. I have been putting some probiotic powder in her slurry stuff.
> I have her in the house and nowhere really to hang a sling. It's easier for me to have her in the house so I can both hear her as well as check on her more often to push water and liquids. I'll see if I can have hubby help me figure out a place to maybe hang some sort of sling.
> I did give her another shot of Dex Tuesday morning since she was sounding kind of congested. She was not a fan of that one. She hasn't run a fever for 24hrs so I am going to cut back the banamine to every 24hrs instead of 12hrs that I have been giving her.
> ...


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

rumen - thanks for the word! Should be sounds at least every 2 minutes. But Autumn's rumen is most probably more or less empty, judging from the photos. I prefer to use a stetoscope, for better convenience when waiting for the sound.

And yes, you are doing a wonderful job! Me too, I prefer to be able to hear my animals, especially when they have problems. Excellent that your vet seems to be "a friend of both humans and of animals"!  Also here, the vets usually know little about goats. But we still have our "king of goat veterinary medicin", Karl-Erik Hammarberg, a vet who teaches goat medicine at the veterinary school. He once said to me, that he prefers the goat owners to make their vets to call him, rather than the owner call him directly. "So I can teach them, that is better for the future." He is now retired, but still active. If nothing else helps, maybe your vet can give him a call (mind the time difference!) or a mail.


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

How is she today


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

She is the same so far. I brought Titan my premie bottle baby in today and let him talk to her for abit while I was making his bottle. She perked up for a little bit but didn't want anything to really do with him. He had fun running around her and then chasing my puppies. 
When I was making lunch today I found some treats in the freezer that I tempted Autumn with. I always freeze dandelion blossoms incase I decided to make wine during the winter- I thawed out a couple of those and she gobbled those down instantly. I think she was happy with something other than the gruel. I tried some hay after that but she was having to many issues trying to get it in her mouth still.  She kept her head up for quite awhile today instead of instantly putting it back down like she had been doing. She still won't put any weight on her legs- she does a little on the front, but nothing for her back end. 
Hubby said she wasn't really hungry when he went to feed her tonight. She ate quite a bit this morning though so I told him not to push her too much. I have been feeding her at 9a, 11a, 2p, 8p, and 1a. She doesn't eat alot at each sitting but she is slowly eating.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

I don't have experience in this (other than what I have read), does anyone know how fast a goat with polio/listeriosis should respond to treatment?

@Mmhyronimus you are still doing the injections of Penicillin, Fortified B Complex, and Banamine?

Does she still have a fever?

You treated for pneumonia, correct?

The only thing I can think of is to switch the Banamine if that is still being given to Dexamethasone, like it lists here: http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/listeriosis.html

I also think some sort of sling/goat wheelchair/neck support would really help.

You said she liked the dandelion, that's good. I wish there was some way to get fresh green forage in the winter. Maybe try your local feed store and see if they have Chaffhaye or something similar?


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Negative on the chaffahye, I have checked numerous places. She is still getting all of the meds. She hasn't run a fever in a couple days now. And I dosed her with DeX yesterday since she was sounding congested again.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Look MOM! I'm gonna chase food tonight! Well, around the bowl at least!
When I came home from work tonight I gave her a couple more dandelion heads. She dropped one on the floor in front of her, and before I could pick it up for her she was scrounging around for it and picked it up. So I figured I'd try the bowl of dry food and see how that went. She is eating some of what she catches. She keeps sticking her tongue out on the side of her mouth instead of to the front so I think that is what is making it hard for her to grab food. (I tried but couldn't get a picture of her doing that.) She doesn't want to let me steal the bowl back so I'm just gonna let her chase the food and nibble to her hearts content. At least it's a positive sign!


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

Sending some more prayers, she looks like she is responding better. Keep up the good work.


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Having a little more energy, she really looks wonderful - compared with earlier photos! :hug:

But, not being hungry, eh? I would rather suspect that her energy is not enough for eating and processing the food.

Do not forget to offer her something for her rumen - fresh leaves if you can. After all, goats are more twig eaters than grass eaters. Of course together with those rumen bacteria you give her.

Let me see, nice leaves, what are the words in your wild language --- Ash, espen, mountain ash, willow, apple tree, pine ... If possible not spruce or oak, they are slightly toxic, not dangerous for a healthy goat, but Autumn still struggles for her life.

And thanks for the photos, really wonderful to see her hold her head up and being able to use her eyes!


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

You are doing so good! What would other people say? "It's just a goat". My foot!


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

I'm totally gathering dandelions this year and freezing them. Brilliant.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Go Autumn!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Keep up the good work.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Any update?


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

I came home from work tonight and she decided that she was sick of sitting down so she got up all by herself! Just this morning I was lifting her up and holding her up since she couldn't put weight on her back end.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

YAY!! :clapping:

Hope she continues to recover! Any improvement with eating/drinking?


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

21goaties said:


> YAY!! :clapping:
> 
> Hope she continues to recover! Any improvement with eating/drinking?


Yep. She started eating hay this morning and drinking last night. Now she is walking around my house exploring and trying to eat anything she can fit in her mouth. She really likes green lettuce. I got a meat tray from work with all the fancy lettuce on it and she is just loving the lettuce.


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Mmhyronimus said:


> Yep. She started eating hay this morning and drinking last night. Now she is walking around my house exploring and trying to eat anything she can fit in her mouth. She really likes green lettuce. I got a meat tray from work with all the fancy lettuce on it and she is just loving the lettuce.


Your hard work is paying off!


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

Yay, I love happy endings.


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

Awww I've browsed through this thread and am so glad she is improving! You might look into a supplement called Dyne and see if it's something she can handle. Power Punch is pretty good too. We use these on the occasion we have a sick goat, especially with pregnancy toxemia. We've given it to a few weaned kids who took weaning hard this year, and they loved it. They got excited when they saw the syringe coming and would grab hold - all I had to do was push the plunger on it lol. Goats Prefer Goat Probiotic Power from TSC is a good probiotic that has added vitamins/minerals.


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

HoosierShadow said:


> Awww I've browsed through this thread and am so glad she is improving! You might look into a supplement called Dyne and see if it's something she can handle. Power Punch is pretty good too. We use these on the occasion we have a sick goat, especially with pregnancy toxemia. We've given it to a few weaned kids who took weaning hard this year, and they loved it. They got excited when they saw the syringe coming and would grab hold - all I had to do was push the plunger on it lol. Goats Prefer Goat Probiotic Power from TSC is a good probiotic that has added vitamins/minerals.


I've heard good things about the power punch from a lot of show people around here. And I use the Goats Prefer Probiotic alot!


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## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

This is such happy news! You did a great job pulling her through the crisis. Now I just hope that all the other sweet, sick little goaties on this site can have their own Christmas miracles too!


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

What a miracle! Sooo glad to hear - and the photos talk for themselves! (clap):goodjob::great: Honestly, I did believe she was dying. Very good job, both of you!

And exploring the house! I guess you will even be happy over the droppings she forgets all over your mats and furniture ...


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

This is truly wonderful.


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

:goodjob::clapping:


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Fantastic news! Keep up the good work. Don't stop treating. You want to continue a few days past being 100% better.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

That is absolutely fabulous!! :coolmoves:


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Great news! That sure makes all of that hard work more satisfying.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

:goodjob::clapping::great:


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Can ̶w̶e̶ correction, _I_ have an Autumn update?


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

21goaties said:


> Can ̶w̶e̶ correction, _I_ have an Autumn update?


*I* will read it with great interest! If with photo, I will look very carefully at it.

And Merry Christmas, Autumn!


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Autumn is doing great! We moved her out of the house this weekend and moved her to the barn. She has her own pen. She has been eating good, both hay and pellets and drinking water by herself. I've still been giving her a bowl of milk 2x a day when I feed my bottle baby. I will put a picture up later when I get home from work.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

WAY TO GO AUTUMN! :great:


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

I had been having a hard time believing that a goat could recover after being down/not drinking or eating due to past bad experience so this story gives me hope/motivation to keep fighting if it ever happens to one of our goats. Yay Autumn!


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## Mmhyronimus (Sep 8, 2017)

Autumn was all full of kisses tonight! She was happily eating and was hoping I had treats. She is very full of kisses and getting fatter again. Look at her little buddha belly!


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## 21goaties (Mar 13, 2018)

Sweet lil goatie. :goatkiss:


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## Firsttimegoatmom2018 (Feb 8, 2018)

Doing so much better. Congrats, your hard work paid off. In only vets tried as hard as you


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Yay @Mmhyronimus !


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Thank you for the update!


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## Trollmor (Aug 19, 2011)

Hard to believe it is the same goat! :hughighfive):welcomeback:


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## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

What happy outcome! Merry Christmas!!!


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

:coolmoves::great::goodjob:


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