# Doe never developed an udder



## rhawks (Sep 21, 2014)

I'm sorry I feel like I'm posting questions all the time recently.

I have a French Alpine that kidded on Monday. This is the second year she's had kids. Last year she had multiples and was a great milker, produced almost a gallon a day for 8 months, then I dried her up. On Monday she had only one kid but it was a big buckling. No problems during labor or anything.

The problem I have now is she's never developed an udder, there's no milk but maybe a tablespoon. I increased her grain intake, she has alfalfa hay, and I've been massaging her udder area regularly. I've also left the kid with her to stimulate too. The vet gave me oxytocin on Wednesday (soonest I could get in with the holiday). We gave her 1ml on Wednesday, 1ml on Thursday, and 1ml on Friday. Still nothing.

I'm just wondering if anyone else has dealt with this and if anyone has any other ideas.


----------



## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

When was her due date?


----------



## rhawks (Sep 21, 2014)

Suzanne_Tyler said:


> When was her due date?


We're not sure. We had tried breeding her starting in November and for several months but was unsuccessful (buck was too young). We ended up moving the end of January/beginning of February and just left the buck with her. So we had no idea when she was due. Each of my goats kidded one month apart, she was the last to go. We weren't even positive she was pregnant until about 3 weeks ago when we actually saw and could feel the kid move.


----------



## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Oh my, oxytocin after she is closed isn't wise. do not give her anymore. 1 cc is really too much for milk letdown, it is suppose to be 1/2 cc IM.

I would get a fecal for worms and cocci to see where she is at and treat her if needed. 

How is her inner lower eyelid coloring?

Does she have lice or mites?

Does she have free choice loose salt and minerals?

Any selenium or copper deficiencies?

Did she drop her after birth within a reasonable time? Was her kid strong on it's feet shortly after birth?

Is she eating and drinking OK? If she is not drinking enough, she cannot produce milk. 

How much grain and what kind?


----------



## rhawks (Sep 21, 2014)

toth boer goats said:


> Oh my, oxytocin after she is closed isn't wise. do not give her anymore. 1 cc is really too much for milk letdown, it is suppose to be 1/2 cc IM.
> 
> I would get a fecal for worms and cocci to see where she is at and treat her if needed.
> 
> ...


We were administering the oxytocin based on the vet's prescription. 
Her eyelid color is good, no lice or mites. Yes she has free choice minerals. No deficiencies that I know of, I do use copper boluses. Yes she dropped her afterbirth within an hour of the kid. He was very strong, acting like he was several days old instead of a newborn. She's eating and drinking normally. I feed Kalmbach milk and meat feed. She's getting about 2 cups in the morning and 2 cups in the evening. Now that I don't think she's ever going to let down I'm going to be decreasing it.


----------



## rhawks (Sep 21, 2014)

Here's momma


----------



## rhawks (Sep 21, 2014)

The new one is the black one. He was 2 days old here. The others were 4 weeks old. He's a big boy.


----------



## Goat_Scout (Mar 23, 2017)

I'm sorry that this is happening. I have no clue other than to say that I've heard of cows doing the same thing, but usually their milk comes in 4 days to 2 weeks after calving.


----------



## Damfino (Dec 29, 2013)

Don't give up just yet. While I've not had anything this extreme, I do have a doe that takes several days to a week for her milk to come in properly. This year I had to bottle feed her kids a few times during the first week because she simply didn't have enough for them. Keep stimulating the udder and milking. 

Is there any possibility she could have dried up with mastitis last year? This can damage the udder and make it unproductive. You may want to run a mastitis test on the small amount of milk that you are getting just to be sure there isn't an underlying infection that needs treatment.


----------



## rhawks (Sep 21, 2014)

Damfino said:


> Don't give up just yet. While I've not had anything this extreme, I do have a doe that takes several days to a week for her milk to come in properly. This year I had to bottle feed her kids a few times during the first week because she simply didn't have enough for them. Keep stimulating the udder and milking.
> 
> Is there any possibility she could have dried up with mastitis last year? This can damage the udder and make it unproductive. You may want to run a mastitis test on the small amount of milk that you are getting just to be sure there isn't an underlying infection that needs treatment.


I did check for mastitis, she's negative. That was one thing I was concerned about.

I've been bottle feeding the kid from the start. He doesn't drink much before he runs back to mom so he's getting some from her but it's very little.


----------



## rhawks (Sep 21, 2014)

Goat_Scout said:


> I'm sorry that this is happening. I have no clue other than to say that I've heard of cows doing the same thing, but usually their milk comes in 4 days to 2 weeks after calving.


Well that at least gives me a little hope. Maybe she's channeling her inner cow.


----------



## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Make sure you keep the kid just a tad hungry. The more he nurses the more it will help her. It's kinda a catch 22 with ones like this. You need to feed the kid but the more the kid nurses the more she should make. How much to feed the kid so he's a tad hungry? I have no clue and always just guess and do the best I can.


----------



## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

I have to ask, meat feed? What is that exactly?

If she is stressed, that may make her not produce well. 

Also feeding a 16% protein, and nitrogen diet.
Which is in nobel goat grower.

Calfmanna is a milk pellet and may help her.

Alfalfa is a good hay for her now.

Keeping her kids on her and stimulation by massaging/ gently bumping helps. You can milk her and feed it to her kids too for stimulation. 
Give her a little time, she may start in milk. 
Proper feed helps as well, make sure she gets plenty of water.


----------



## lottsagoats1 (Apr 12, 2014)

There are certain grasses that will cause a female mammal to not produce milk, maybe she got into some in the hay or browse?


----------



## rhawks (Sep 21, 2014)

toth boer goats said:


> I have to ask, meat feed? What is that exactly?
> 
> If she is stressed, that may make her not produce well.
> 
> ...


Here's the feed she's on, it's 16% protein.

















Sent from my SM-G925V using Goat Forum mobile app


----------



## DawnStar (May 19, 2013)

Fenugreek is an herb women use to put on milk, wonder if goats can have it?? They also call it 'greek hay/ alfalfa'. I would probably deworm. And copper bolus (if she is due). Most feed store also carry a multi vitamin gel-- I would give her a dose, then wait and see.....


PS AgriLabs MFO--IS AWSOME, if her body was depleted of ANY nutrients, this will help! Sometimes mommas having really big babies (all of ours were just as big this year!), puts them under stress that we humans cant really detect until its almost too late. We are going to start giving our does a dose after kidding, after we almost lost one doe due to post-partum issues...


----------



## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

DawnStar said:


> Fenugreek is an herb women use to put on milk, wonder if goats can have it?? ..


Fir Meadows carries an herbal mix called Milk Maid to increase milk production. I'm pretty sure it has fenugreek.


----------



## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Do you know what kind of animal fat they are using in that grain?


----------



## rhawks (Sep 21, 2014)

toth boer goats said:


> Do you know what kind of animal fat they are using in that grain?


No. This is what was recommended to me since I don't show my goats. I had tried a few other feeds, sweet feed included, but my goats eat this the best. Here's what I got from the site
















Sent from my SM-G925V using Goat Forum mobile app


----------



## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

All looks good.


----------



## mariella (Feb 23, 2017)

Has she been tested for CAE?


----------



## rhawks (Sep 21, 2014)

mariella said:


> Has she been tested for CAE?


No

Sent from my SM-G925V using Goat Forum mobile app


----------



## mariella (Feb 23, 2017)

I would test her for CAE and see if that's the problem.


----------



## rhawks (Sep 21, 2014)

I think we're headed in the right direction. It's been a slow process but she's finally developing an udder. I was able to milk her and got 4 cups. Her udder is still small, nothing like it was last year. I don't think I'll be breeding her again. 
Thanks everyone for your thoughts, advice, and encouragement.

Sent from my SM-G925V using Goat Forum mobile app


----------



## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Good to hear and you are very welcome.


----------



## Clover the Goat (Jul 28, 2017)

It could be that she had the kid to early or she just did not develop an utter... keep me posted and the kid is precious i just want to hug him!


----------



## Clover the Goat (Jul 28, 2017)

Or u clould try bottel feeding ‍♀


----------



## rhawks (Sep 21, 2014)

Clover the Goat said:


> Or u clould try bottel feeding ‍♀


I am bottle feeding. She finally developed an udder last week. We're almost getting as much milk as last year now. It was very strange. No udder to almost full capacity overnight.

Sent from my SM-G925V using Goat Forum mobile app


----------



## Clover the Goat (Jul 28, 2017)

Wow! Thats good thats weird about the utter hows the kid doing?


----------



## rhawks (Sep 21, 2014)

Clover the Goat said:


> Wow! Thats good thats weird about the utter hows the kid doing?


He's great. Still really large for his age and a complete sweetheart.

Sent from my SM-G925V using Goat Forum mobile app


----------



## Clover the Goat (Jul 28, 2017)

Aww! My goat ( Clover ) is skinny and and has bottle jaw im not a goat pro yet wat do u suggest?


----------



## Goat_Scout (Mar 23, 2017)

Clover the Goat said:


> Aww! My goat ( Clover ) is skinny and and has bottle jaw im not a goat pro yet wat do u suggest?


I'd start a separate thread for her, then you would get more answers about how to treat her. Have you dewormed her? That could be one reason why she's thin.

And Welcome to The Goat Spot! Glad you joined us! :7up:


----------



## Clover the Goat (Jul 28, 2017)

We have him on a de wromer supplement and we are deworming him Sunday sadly he has bottle jaw and is a runt and he might possibly pass its only a maybe but can u teach me how to do a thread and do u know any cures for bottle jaw? My email is [email protected]


----------



## Clover the Goat (Jul 28, 2017)

Here is wat he looks like and his bottle jaw


----------



## Latebloomerar (Jan 16, 2016)

Thank you for sharing. I had no idea something like this could happen. This year will be my first to have goats and breed them. Good to know.


----------



## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Clover the Goat said:


> We have him on a de wromer supplement and we are deworming him Sunday sadly he has bottle jaw and is a runt and he might possibly pass its only a maybe but can u teach me how to do a thread and do u know any cures for bottle jaw? My email is [email protected]


Start him on red cell and copper bolus.

Is he eating?

Have you gotten a fecal done?

What are you using to worm him? What dose?


----------

