# Show Goat Muscles?



## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

The Youth Fair was just two weeks ago and i got in 8th place out of 19. The judge just said to me "He just needed a little more muscle in the front." I worked him out so much before that people that i didn't even know came up to me and said that he was a good-looking goat. In the Youth Barns (the place where we had to keep our animals before the show) it was so cold that the animals were shivering! I put two coats on him but it didn't help that much. I think that he had lost muscle mass in the 4 days that he had been in the youth barns but i don't know. I'm going to the Major Show in Houston so i need to gain those front muscles. Is he weak in the front?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

can you get pics of him ..from front and a side shot?

We may be able to tell you what ...if anything he may be lacking....

Remember....judges have different tastes and preferences....what one judge may like 
another may dislike....it is called the luck of the draw...in judges.... I have seen some of the best looking goats... get kicked down ...because that judge... didn't like something about it... for me... I thought it should of placed in 1st..... I feel it isn't fair ...I believe ...that a judge should go by the book rules ...not there own likes and dislikes...


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## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

toth boer goats said:


> can you get pics of him ..from front and a side shot?
> 
> We may be able to tell you what ...if anything he may be lacking....
> 
> ...


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

pic links, aren't working...


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

I wanna see too! And Im with Pam; judges should go by the book not personal preference.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

> I wanna see too! And Im with Pam; judges should go by the book not personal preference.


 :wink: :hug:


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## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

toth boer goats said:


> pic links, aren't working...


Okay, does this work:


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## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

toth boer goats said:


> pic links, aren't working...


Okay, does this work:


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## AlaskaBoers (May 7, 2008)

how old is he?


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## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

AlaskaBoers said:


> how old is he?


To tell the truth, i don't know. My high school's super intendant saw me show a goat last year and he liked how i showed. I got 6th place out of 22 last year. He gave me this goat and he's going to give me another goat for next year. I think that FeFe, the goat in the picture, he's a little over a year?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Hmm... :scratch: I see nothing wrong with him... :hug: 

Is he intact or is he wethered?


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## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

toth boer goats said:


> Hmm... :scratch: I see nothing wrong with him... :hug:
> 
> Is he intact or is he wethered?


No, he's not hurt or anything. I'm just wondering how he doesn't have as much front muscle as the back?


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## ENC (Jan 3, 2010)

Intact or wethered means "buck" or "used to be buck" 


Evan


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## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

Oh, thanks ENC!  I think that he is a buck. For right now anyway. My sponsor may want to change that though...


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## ENC (Jan 3, 2010)

No Problem, But if you aren't sure just lift up the skirt and peek so to speak. It should be pretty obvious. They are prominent even on a few day old baby. 

Evan


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## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

ENC said:


> No Problem, But if you aren't sure just lift up the skirt and peek so to speak. It should be pretty obvious. They are prominent even on a few day old baby.
> 
> Evan


Does he look good to you, though? I mean, does his front muscle not match the back? My FFA teacher thinks that i messed him up because i didn't get him a second coat in the cold until later. But they didn't sell anymore at the time!!!


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

goats dont need coats to keep their muscle mass - that would be fat that they burn off when cold. So really to muscle him up you need to exercise him. He wont loose that in a few hours of chill  

Many FFA teachers and AG leaders are not up on the true raising of long term healthy goats - they just want them to look good for the fair.

is he on a good roughage diet? does he get exercise daily? the way a goat looses muscle mass is through atrophy. Atrophy is when a muscle isnt used it slowly basically gets absorbed in a way into the body - it shrinks. Another way is through a parasite load like coccidia. But if your goat had coccidia it would be noticeable in other ways and he wouldnt loose weight considerably in just 4 days.


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## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

StaceyRoop said:


> goats dont need coats to keep their muscle mass - that would be fat that they burn off when cold. So really to muscle him up you need to exercise him. He wont loose that in a few hours of chill
> 
> Many FFA teachers and AG leaders are not up on the true raising of long term healthy goats - they just want them to look good for the fair.
> 
> is he on a good roughage diet? does he get exercise daily? the way a goat looses muscle mass is through atrophy. Atrophy is when a muscle isnt used it slowly basically gets absorbed in a way into the body - it shrinks. Another way is through a parasite load like coccidia. But if your goat had coccidia it would be noticeable in other ways and he wouldnt loose weight considerably in just 4 days.


Yes, he's on a good roughage diet, even though the sponsor (the one who gave me my goat) wants me to get another type of food for him later. He gets exercise daily except for 6 days before the Youth Fair. Usually I work him out 8 minutes forward and 2 minutes backward on the treadmill.

Also, he did lose about 5 or 6 pounds from the 4 days of cold, so, yeah, you're right about the fat thing


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

well keep up the work he may need more exercise time. To build muscle you need to go further each time and stretch the limit so that it actually increases the muscle instead of just keeping it at the same size. Or change up the routine a bit. Do one exercise before the other - kind of working muscles in a different way. Thats why those that strength train will change things up on a weekly or monthly basis. They dont want to plato


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Maybe feed him more.. to keep up with the demand of burning off the food..... because of exercise....He may be burning off more energy than what is consumed... :wink:


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## heathersboers (Sep 5, 2008)

To me he looks to be bout 3-4 months old-Just my opinion- He does need more conditioning, meaning more feed. a show feed with higher protein will pack on the pounds as well as some good alfalfa hay- You can put his feeder higher up to make him jump up to eat -to build those chest muscles-Also if you could teach him to be a "pack" goat- We tie (2)10 lb sacks over our bucks backs and walk them all around the yard-they have to use their leg muscles-whick builds them. I would keep him feed at all times-4H shows want a more or less 'Chunky" goats-but not overly fat-here is a pic of what wins around here-He is a son of our buck Trax and pulled Champion.


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## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

heathersboers said:


> To me he looks to be bout 3-4 months old-Just my opinion- He does need more conditioning, meaning more feed. a show feed with higher protein will pack on the pounds as well as some good alfalfa hay- You can put his feeder higher up to make him jump up to eat -to build those chest muscles-Also if you could teach him to be a "pack" goat- We tie (2)10 lb sacks over our bucks backs and walk them all around the yard-they have to use their leg muscles-whick builds them. I would keep him feed at all times-4H shows want a more or less 'Chunky" goats-but not overly fat-here is a pic of what wins around here-He is a son of our buck Trax and pulled Champion.


Thanks! I'll probably do 35 mph for 7 minutes then 40 for the last then increase by the few days. Your goat looks nice! What place did you get?


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## LomaVerdeBoers (Oct 4, 2009)

He looks about 5 months old to me. I don't think he is getting enough different types of exercise, the treadmill can only do so much. :chin: It is making him lose fat weight in the areas your trying to gain.

Raise his feeder as mentioned and if he is on a nipple waterer raise it up and put a step in front of it so he can use his front quarter muscles everytime he takes a drink. We bury old used tires half way in the ground in their pens, they like to jump up and do tricks off of the tires, it's a great way to build muscle. :thumb:

If he is still intact he should be *bigger* than that in my opinion.


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## AlaskaBoers (May 7, 2008)

Ok

so a treadmill, will condition him, not really make muscle- they need adrenaline to really push themselves. try using a track dog or unknown person to scare him and get him running, just jogging will only burn fat.


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## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

AlaskaBoers said:


> Ok
> 
> so a treadmill, will condition him, not really make muscle- they need adrenaline to really push themselves. try using a track dog or unknown person to scare him and get him running, just jogging will only burn fat.


The only problems with that are these:

1. He's REALLY stubborn! He WILL NOT walk unless there's another person near him. Even the owner says that it's hopeless getting him to individually walk
2. Don't have any track dogs where i am
3. (goes with 1) There's not that much space at the Ag Farm; well, except for the "parking lot". It's not enclosed very well either...Wow, the Ag Farm doesn't provide much....

And you had such good ideas too! Maybe i can run him near the road with another person running after him? I'd better get a longer leash! It would seem that i have a lot of excuses huh? Where i am, is really small. You probably couldn't even spot it on the map XD


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## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

LomaVerdeBoers said:


> He looks about 5 months old to me. I don't think he is getting enough different types of exercise, the treadmill can only do so much. :chin: It is making him lose fat weight in the areas your trying to gain.
> 
> Raise his feeder as mentioned and if he is on a nipple waterer raise it up and put a step in front of it so he can use his front quarter muscles everytime he takes a drink. We bury old used tires half way in the ground in their pens, they like to jump up and do tricks off of the tires, it's a great way to build muscle. :thumb:
> 
> If he is still intact he should be *bigger* than that in my opinion.


I have a wooden ramp that he has to climb up it every time he wants to eat. He keeps knocking it over, that log, so that i have to constantly pick it up for him to eat but i guess it's working.


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## AlaskaBoers (May 7, 2008)

if hes not walking, you should probably get him to, have you tried a choke chain or prong collar? Seems soon as i try that they snap out of the "Im to good for this!" mode. 

I dont have a track dog either, I just let the goat play with each other, big pens, and lots of natural browse (they like trees so theyre standing on their back legs reaching) Does he have others in there with him?


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## KW Farms (Jun 21, 2008)

I agree, without training him to walk on a leash, you're not going to get very far in his conditioning. Another thing, some goats just can't put on as much muscle mass as others, even with a lot of working he may not gain that muscle. You've gotten some good advice so far though. I would definately get him on some kind of meat and/or show goat feed if he's not already.


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## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

AlaskaBoers said:


> if hes not walking, you should probably get him to, have you tried a choke chain or prong collar? Seems soon as i try that they snap out of the "Im to good for this!" mode.
> 
> I dont have a track dog either, I just let the goat play with each other, big pens, and lots of natural browse (they like trees so theyre standing on their back legs reaching) Does he have others in there with him?


My Ag teacher used a taser....


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## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

KW Farms said:


> I agree, without training him to walk on a leash, you're not going to get very far in his conditioning. Another thing, some goats just can't put on as much muscle mass as others, even with a lot of working he may not gain that muscle. You've gotten some good advice so far though. I would definately get him on some kind of meat and/or show goat feed if he's not already.


I haven't walked him on a leash for 4 months XD. I only use one if we're going somewhere unfamiliar to him because she tends to go a little insane...and i mean literal! He goes berserk! He'll run and jump and all kind of things. But i always stay near him because he also tends to run back and forth to me.

Yeah, i got a Show Goat feed. But it may be that he's only picking out the things he wants in it. What Show Feed do you advise? I think i use grains? The one with corn, seeds, something else? I forgot. When i go to the Ag Farm in an hour, I'll tell you


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## heathersboers (Sep 5, 2008)

Him going berserk and jumping is what he needs!!! We feed grain feed-It is 18% protein-, but give my opinion- Like the others said-If you can't get him walking on a lead-its hopeless. You have to start with a good built goat from day one also.In one of your first posts you said he may be over a year old-To me he doesnt look that old, but if he is-he may have had cocci, or just stunted. he should be a LOT bigger than that even with no conditioning at all. I would search for the 4-H market wether guidelines-They should help with what to feed and how to condition a goat, but by the way you post about the AG farm, you dont seem to have anywhere for him to excercise (run and jump). Are they all in stalls??


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

how to check a goats age...
click on link....and scroll down....
http://www.smallstock.info/tools/sheep/aging.htm


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## Flow&FeFe (Jan 20, 2010)

heathersboers said:


> Him going berserk and jumping is what he needs!!! We feed grain feed-It is 18% protein-, but give my opinion- Like the others said-If you can't get him walking on a lead-its hopeless. You have to start with a good built goat from day one also.In one of your first posts you said he may be over a year old-To me he doesnt look that old, but if he is-he may have had cocci, or just stunted. he should be a LOT bigger than that even with no conditioning at all. I would search for the 4-H market wether guidelines-They should help with what to feed and how to condition a goat, but by the way you post about the AG farm, you dont seem to have anywhere for him to excercise (run and jump). Are they all in stalls??


FeFe will only walk when someone is behind and in front of him so it's fine if he can't lead. But i'm getting me friend ot run after him in the pasture (not where the cows are of course). And i'm making him go 50 mph on the treadmill now and when i'm done, he's panting. So i let him rest then practice setting him up. And yeah, we only have stalls for the goats. They have minuature pastures attached though so that they can run and play. But we're remodling it so it's huge. :laugh:


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