# What should a 4h wether look like?



## ()relics (Dec 25, 2010)

Ok how many times have you heard it or asked it yourself? 








Not every buckling born will turn out to be a show prospect wether, That Is A Fact....So what would you look for? Pictured above is one of our 4H prospects. He was born 11/7/10. He was left with his dam for 100 days and now he lives with the rest of our show wethers and a few younger bucks, today he got to go outside for some Sun. Is he a winner? 
So I thought I would post a picture of him and let everyone give their "oral reasons", kind of like a 4H judging class...I have my own list of faults and strengths but I am not going to post them...at least not right now. So if you want to take a crack at the judging racket here is your chance.
The only thing I will say is he is 150 or so days old in the picture and he weighs 58#. He is in winter fur, unfitted/clipped. In the picture he is standing slightly uphill and unposed...


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## ()relics (Dec 25, 2010)

...let me add: There are alot of things you will not be able to "see" but there are somethings that clearly stand out. Try to hit the obvious because that is all you really can do when judging an animal this young from a picture, none the less....


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## Bellafire Farm (Jan 5, 2010)

LOVE the muscle extension down his rear leg! My daughters market wether is totally lacking there...and I remember the judge last year stressing the length of the muscle in the rear leg...wanting it as close down to the hock as possible. This guy looks really good for that! :thumb:


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## AlaskaBoers (May 7, 2008)

no accuracy without front and back pictures


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## GotmygoatMTJ (Apr 25, 2009)

He definitly has the wether style. But you can never really tell when they have hair. Long bodied, long necked, good rear and brisket I believe is what they are looking for now. Sheep.


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## ()relics (Dec 25, 2010)

AlaskaBoers said:


> no accuracy without front and back pictures




















Remember this is a starter wether 150 days not a finished market animal. He is 60+ days away from showing and he will fill out...Judge him as a prospect...The pictures are again unposed and he is standing about 8' away from the camera.


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## ()relics (Dec 25, 2010)

...And everyone is being so nice...I could find several things that I don't like in the first picture alone...I didn't say he was our Best I said he was 1 of our Prospects...


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

I think this post is better off is you do give the pros and cons strengths and weaknesses of this wether. If you want people to learn you need to teach them and visually is always best.


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## RunAround (Feb 17, 2008)

Well, they are all "Show prospects." And imo every goat can be shown, that way the owner/handler learns how to show and what they should be aiming for in future generations.

I know nothing about Boers, just that they are used for meat... so I would say he looks tasty.  :laugh:


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

IMO he could use a thicker bone, sitting at roughly 120 days or so he should have a nice thick frame to pack the muscle onto, and i think his hair gives more appearance to the bone. I'd also like a wider fuller chest on him to fill out. he's got a decent length to him, but i'd like longer because that's where the money is. 

he does have a nice hindquarter and that meat stretches down to the hock, so he should develop a nice HQ. the elbow seems to have the same going on but i cannot be sure with all the hair going on there


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## ()relics (Dec 25, 2010)

SDK said:


> IMO he could use a thicker bone, sitting at roughly 120 days or so he should have a nice thick frame to pack the muscle onto, and i think his hair gives more appearance to the bone. I'd also like a wider fuller chest on him to fill out. he's got a decent length to him, but i'd like longer because that's where the money is.


Thats the first problem he has...Fine boned front side. Although his loin is heavy and carries muscling his front is slightly fine boned. From the front I like to see them HUGE. His knock kneed appearance is a camera trick but the front picture clearly shows that he is not real heavy. He is actually the longest wether from this year's crop and with his long neck he looks even longer when set up. 
Another correct observation: his hair is obstructing my view, and if I keep this wether and show him I will make sure to trim his hair so it Continues to obstruct your view of his lighter bone structure Forcing the judge to come over and put his hands on him...and hopefully also then touching his neck...You always want the judge in front of/touching YOUR animal.
I suppose you are right in saying every wether can be shown. BUT why waste money feeding a wether that is simply a market animal, and will always be no matter how much feed(read money) you dump into him. I only like to feed wethers, or any animal, that in my opinion has a chance to win. The trick would be to pick the best wethers to feed out and slaughter the rest....Kind of like a dog show. Sure you can take your yard mutt but would you really stand a chance against a pedigreed show dog?? Maybe other breeds are different and have wiggle room for inferior animals but the when looking at and judging MEAT goats, specifically Boers, genetics has alot to do with winning.
More than likely this wether is going to be shown by a 4Her and he will do OK...if he happens to fall into the middle weight class he may win his class but he would not compete against the big boys...No Matter how much I feed him. 
His advantages Might outweigh some of his size issues but that would depend on the judge....imo.....

Now I hate my own wether so let me hit his strong points, to make myself feel better:
-he has a really really long neck. The trends for wethers are moving to long necks.
-he transitions well from his poll through his withers and chine to his tail head giving him a very clean top line.
-he carries alot of mass potential from his chin to his plate, very clean, and then all the way along his belly, Very clean underside.
-His loin is average but because he is slightly long legged his muscling stands out more.
-he moves very easily. His topline stays level and everything follows straight and true with his shoulders...can't see that from a still picture.
So those are his + points imo...will they outweigh his -points? we shall see. I would put him above average at the 4H level and near last in a classic or jackpot show, unless it was a class of yard mutts...again jmo...


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

> Well, they are all "Show prospects." And imo every goat can be shown, that way the owner/handler learns how to show and what they should be aiming for in future generations.


 I agree...it is a great learning tool... especially if.... they are just beginning.... plus ...if you get a real good judge.. they will point out ...what he is or isn't lacking..... so you will know what to look for...the next go around...... even an animal that you may think is real good...may not be to that judge at that show...the same with the breeding class...it is the preference of the judge...which.. isn't fair... :doh: they should go by the rules ....but ...I have seen.. that some do not... :wink:


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Yeah the first thing I noticed is lack of width in the front. He's not oustandingly wide in the rear either.
Nice enough length though IMO.
I thought meat goats were suppose to have sort of a bulky gait to them? Inotherwords, they arent very graceful on the move.
We dont bother to show wethers they all get sold for meat.
I will however take a muscley doeling to the meat class if she does not qualify for the regular ABGA classes, ie not enough pigmentation on ears tail or head.
A couple of them have done pretty well considering the class is made up of wethers.
A few years back we did sell wethers to FFA & threw in a chunky doeling. They all did extremely well taking all top ribbons but doeling took Overall Grand. :thumb:


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## ()relics (Dec 25, 2010)

nancy d said:


> I thought meat goats were suppose to have sort of a bulky gait to them? Inotherwords, they arent very graceful on the move.
> We dont bother to show wethers they all get sold for meat.


I have found that in the lighter weight classes that alot of the judges, at least that I have shown under in the last maybe 2 years, prefer an easy moving wether. Reason being that they are still growing and need to easily be able to move to and from the feeder, because technically they aren't finished wethers but starter wethers that will return to the feedlot, just my theory. But the heavyweight class movement seems to be of little importance. Although I still believe if you have the easiest mover in the ring the Judge spends more time looking at your wether. Those big brutes that struggle along do not impress me...I would sooner have a smaller straighter wether. As I said this boy will show best in the middleweight class, so If i don't sell him I will stall him to make sure he doesn't get too big before show time....but what do I know I am not a judge....As anyone that seriously competes knows: you keep alot of prospects but few turn out to be Real winners...I have 6 -2010/2011 prospect wethers but maybe only 3-4 will ever see a show ring...the rest will just go to slaughter with the rest of the commercial boys.


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## SDK (Jun 26, 2008)

every goat should have ease of movement, beit market or breeding. just look at it from a maintenance standpoint. a goat that doesn't have fluid movements and isn't put together well enough for ease of movement isn't going to have a productive life,costing you more money.


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## ()relics (Dec 25, 2010)

SDK said:


> every goat should have ease of movement, beit market or breeding. just look at it from a maintenance standpoint. a goat that doesn't have fluid movements and isn't put together well enough for ease of movement isn't going to have a productive life,costing you more money.


I would agree and in breeding animals it is Very important and also the lighter weight classes. Not so much in big finish market classes as the Big boys really only have to walk on and off of the trailer for slaughter. They are not being judged, at this point, on their efficiency but rather their carcass.Big carcass=more meat and you can't taste how fluidly they moved when they were alive..again JMO...based solely on how judges seem to work in the shows I attend.


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