# How Do You Use Herbs Q/A ~ For Beginners and the Experienced!



## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Hey all!

Wondering if there is anyone here that uses herbalism with their animals!
If so for the fun of it, and because it would be helpful to folks just beginning with herbs and animals, think you all could answer these questions? As many or as few as you want  Feel free to suggest other questions I should add.  Thanks!

-What do you use to de-worm?
-How to you deal with mineral deficiencies?
-What is your favorite herb(s) and why?
-What is working best for you in terms of what herbs you are giving?
-How do you treat fairly common diseases? List disease and treatment (whatever ones are common in your area)
-When do you get a vet or commercial items to heal an animal? 
-What do your goats really like?
-What do you give newborns? 
-How does the way you are raising your goats effect what herbs you give them?
-What herbs to you recommend starting with? List herb and reason

Thanks 

I'll start:
*-What do you use to de-worm? *Fir Meadows DeWorm herbal mix, along with garlic and molasses.
*-What is your favorite herb(s) and why? *Garlic (deworming, is lantibacterial, anti-fungal, anti-inflammatory, and anti parasitic, among a huge list!) cayenne (gets the heart going, moves blood, and is a general first aid treatment as a tincture in ACV, stops bleeding) Echinacea ( the well known immune boaster) 
*-What is working best for you in terms of what herbs you are giving?* What worked really well last winter was giving my goats herbs all winter along with their minerals. They did really well considering that was really hard winter. Herbs were basically all the 'main' herbs...oregano, Echinacea, comfrey, parsley...
*How do you treat fairly common diseases? List disease and treatment (whatever ones are common in your area) *Well, CL I had once...cleaned it out with peroxide and then echinacea tincture. Gave to goat a mix of garlic, echinacea and I think oregano. It healed up very nice, but culled the goat anyways. Lice...ACV with cedarwood Essential Oil actually worked fairly good. Can't do it now since it's cold!*
-What do your goats really like? *Crab-apples, molasses, grain (it's a real treat to them!) and their de-worming mix!  They all (well, everyone but Isabelle) LOVES to get de-wormed! 
*-What do you give newborns? *Cayenne tincture
*-How does the way you are raising your goats effect what herbs you give them?* Because my goats are moved around in bush, they can self-medicate a lot. So I don't need to give herbs as much.
*-What herbs to you recommend starting with? List herb and reason 
*-Echinacea. Immune stimulator, easy to grow, and goats love munching on it
-Comfrey. Full of minerals, easy to grow and goats like it
-Cayenne Peppers. For Cayenne Tincture. Stops bleeding, good for animals in labor, helps get the heart going, helps with energy....
-Oregano. Anti-bacterial, boosts immune system

These herbs have HUGE list of beneficial things they do, this is just a short list of herbs and their uses


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## J-TRanch (Jan 31, 2014)

I will post in a minute! 


Owner/operator
J-T Ranch Dairy Goats
NW KS


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## J-TRanch (Jan 31, 2014)

I use both chemical and holistic methods with my goats. 

-What do you use to de-worm? 
I use GI Soother and DwormA from Fir Meadows LLC --GI Soother for barberpole--DwormA for everything else. 
-How to you deal with mineral deficiencies?
I have replamin right now... Im not experienced enough with herbs to know which to give to bump minerals.
BUT I do give kelp to boost minerals
-What is your favorite herb(s) and why?
Cayenne pepper..LOVE! Has saved many of my goats lives. And Garlic (jumps immune systems--use it for my chickens and my goats for deworming, etc)
-What is working best for you in terms of what herbs you are giving?
I deworm with the herb mixes for most of the year--and usually just in case I use ivomec once a year.
I mash up garlic, cayenne, kelp, olive oil, peanut butter, dworma, gi soother, and another herbal dewormer (I cant think of the name right now) into a dish and give to the goats as a treat..
-How do you treat fairly common diseases? List disease and treatment (whatever ones are common in your area) We thankfully don't have any diseases common around here...None of my goats have ever had a disease either thankfully.. I did have a barberpole problem in a goat I bought (gi soother fixed that up quick!)
-When do you get a vet or commercial items to heal an animal? 
Last resort.
-What do your goats really like?
Kelp!!
-What do you give newborns? 
Cayenne

-What herbs to you recommend starting with? List herb and reason
Kelp-minerals
GI soother- For barberpole
DwormA- For other intestinal worms
Cayenne-blood stopper
Garlic-immune booster and dewormer


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## WalshKidsGoats (Nov 27, 2012)

I'm bumping this thread to get some more opinions on this!


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Thanks! I should of put a different title  Maybe I'll repost and put a different title on it


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

I'll bite!

-What do you use to de-worm? *Fir Meadow GI Soother (for cocci and barberpole) and DWorm A, combined twice a week. *

-How to you deal with mineral deficiencies? *I use lose minerals and copper boluses. I have used herbal minerals but it got a bit expensive for me.*

-What is your favorite herb(s) and why?* Garlic! Does that count, haha! When I add it to their dewormer I can see a difference. When I give it for snuffly noses it has always cleared it up for me.*

-What is working best for you in terms of what herbs you are giving? *The Dworm A and GI Soother has done the trick. Whenever I have pale lids I give an extra dose for a couple of days. Other than needing to chemically treat coccidia in kids, I haven't needed to chemically deworm my adults for over two years. In humid NJ, that's a big deal!*

-How do you treat fairly common diseases? List disease and treatment (whatever ones are common in your area) 
*Coccidia: I do treat coccidia chemically; I have treated it herbally though. When I treat herbally I did GI Sother every 15 minutes for an hour, then hourly until I saw improvement. After that I went to every 3 to 4 hours until the poop was clear. Then I gave it three times a day for three days to be sure it was kicked. It worked on a pretty bad case, but it was too labor intensive for me. I'm still hoping to find an effective herbal preventative so I don't have to treat.*

-When do you get a vet or commercial items to heal an animal? *When it comes to something I have not experienced before, or something that could be life threatening in a short time, I go to my chemicals or my vet right away, and support them herbally through treatment to speed the process.*

-What do your goats really like? *They love their herbal dewormer actually. I give it with a bit of molasses and water, and roll it into a cookie. Yum yum! Some of them took awhile to warm up to it and I had to drench them, but it won them all over in the end.*

-What do you give newborns? *I dip their umbilicals with Nav-All (herbal) which I found works very nicely. Cold kids get GI Soother, and I can attest that I really saw a difference when I was trying to maintain the temps. The Cayenne in GI Soother is what helps keep the blood flowing and the kid I gave it to had a better temp than her larger siblings.*

-How does the way you are raising your goats effect what herbs you give them?* I live in an area that is very rich in worms, with mild weather and lots of humidity. If I lived in a less wormy area I'd be able to deworm them just once a week or less. As it is twice a week keeps their eyelids just right. *

-What herbs to you recommend starting with? *List herb and reason: Raspberry! Give it to your pregnant does through late pregnancy and after kidding. I saw stronger pushes, better contractions, and a faster healing time when I used it. Also, Alfalfa! That's a well known one.  Great for calcium.*


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Nice!


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## kpolenz (Jan 20, 2014)

What a great topic, very interesting and informative. 
Thank you Cider point Kikos for asking the question.
Thank you all for taking the time to answers 
I wonder is there a book about this topic ? if not who is going to write one.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Thanks kpolenz!  I hope more people post 

There is a book on herbs and goats, which helped me a lot, it doesn't do this Q/A stuff, but I really like it 

It is: "Accessible Pet, Equine and Livestock Herbal" by Kat Drovdahl of Fir Meadow (http://store.firmeadowllc.com/product_info.php?cPath=1&products_id=376)

Another one is: "Natural Goat Care" by Pat Coleby. More about minerals though.


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## kpolenz (Jan 20, 2014)

Thank you Cedar Point Kikos for the link, guess which book I have on my wish list.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

I recently started (february 2014) with herbal deworming still learning but ive been pleased so far. 

Cant give any specifics to your questions because I honestly dont know yet. I have Kat's book on my Christmas list. 

I can change the name of this for you. What do you want it called?


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Ummm, I don't exactly know...something that would catch peoples eye a bit more, and get both people who have used herbs and people who want to begin with herbs 

Any ideas?


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## GoatieGranny (Jul 26, 2013)

I am not an Herbalist, but I've taken several classes over the years, and I continue to study herbs almost daily. One day I may go for the title, but for now, I'm just learning about them because I believe they are a cleaner, purer way to treat ailments and boost health.

-What do you use to de-worm? I use Molly's Herbal formula. I also add cayenne and garlic to the herb balls I make. Cayenne is excellent for the blood and helps warm them in the winter. (I don't give cayenne in the summer.) The garlic is anti-fungal, anti-parasitic, anti-biotic, anti-viral and more. It's just all around a great herb. In addition, we have black walnut trees surrounding our barn. Black Walnuts are anti-fungal and anti-parasitic. We have never had to deal with worms...and I'm very thankful for that. 

-How to you deal with mineral deficiencies?
We buy a mineral mix for goats from our local Organic Feed Mill. I also give them Nutritional Yeast, which I mix in with the minerals. They get a couple mouthfuls each day in the summer of comfrey, echinacea, Ragweed or St. John's Wort. They are all full of vitamins, minerals, immune system boosters, etc. 

-What is your favorite herb(s) and why?
In general I really like plantain a lot. It's everywhere, it's great for healing wounds, soothing bee stings, drawing slivers, and it tastes good on salads. But that is for people. My favorite herb for the goats is probably ...oh dear...I don't know. I like them all!! If I had to really push myself to choose one, I guess it would be black walnut because it grows all around us, and keeps the worms away. 

-What is working best for you in terms of what herbs you are giving?
Everything I've mentioned is working well. In addition to herbs, I give raw, organic apple cider vinegar and organic molasses in their water most days, especially in the winter and if they appear to be feeling punk at all. (In heat, end of pregnancy, while in heat, extreme weather changes, if we sell a goat, at birth, etc. Kind of the same as when we give probiotics and baking soda.)

-How do you treat fairly common diseases? List disease and treatment (whatever ones are common in your area)
Thankfully, we've never had any disease. I am working at prevention by building strong immune systems, feeding organic food, etc. so we don't have to deal with illness. 

We did have one situation last summer. Tabby had one swollen teat and a drip of blood on her vulva. I gave her a Usenea and goldenseal tincture for it. It was better in two days, with vast improvement at the end of the 1st 24 hours. I am assuming it was a bladder infection, but whatever it was, the anti-biotic herbs took care of it. I continued to give them to her for a few days...I think it was 5 days.

-When do you get a vet or commercial items to heal an animal? 
We have chemicals on had in case we need intervention. (Anti-biotics, wormers, B-12 in a bottle.) We've not had to use a vet in all the years we've had goats, but I would without hesitation if the goats needed any help that we could not give them. A serious wound or injury would call for veterinary help.

-What do your goats really like?
They love the herb balls I make to prevent worms. (The herb balls also have raw, organic honey in them, which is really good for health.) They love the herbs from the garden that they get in the summer/fall.

-What do you give newborns? 
Only assistance in drinking mama's milk. It has everything they need. If one were to be cold or shivering, I would give cayenne and warm water bolus. 

-How does the way you are raising your goats effect what herbs you give them?
We are using herbs preventatively for the most part. We are using them to build strong, healthy goats who are able to fight off most minor issues due to having strong immune systems. If they should be exposed to a disease, they will have head starts in fighting it due to good health. 

-What herbs to you recommend starting with? List herb and reason
It depends on where you live. I would try to grow your own herbs according to your climate. For our area, comfrey and echinacea are good ones to start with. Chamomile is great for any eye infections or eye injuries. It is also calming if you have a goat that is stressed. Garlic is a good all around treatment for them, too. In addition, Cayenne is very beneficial.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

GoatieGranny said:


> ....I am not an Herbalist....


That's why I want to change the title 

...I bet I'm north of you though  (your location says most likely north of you  )


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## GoatieGranny (Jul 26, 2013)

Cedar Point Kikos said:


> ...I bet I'm north of you though  (your location says most likely north of you  )


LOL!! Right you are!


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Yes!  Then again, I'm north of most folks, lol!


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

sorry for the delay -- I have changed the title as requested  

happy herb chatting


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Thanks Stacey!  Hopefully that will get more responses


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

I have really limited knowledge of herbs. I have used some of Mollie's herbals for preg. goats.
Anyway- where does one purchase the herbs that you all have mentioned? (Besides Fias Co.) 
Is there a web site that has reasonable prices? Thanks!


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

I buy mostly from Fir Meadow. http://www.store.firmeadowllc.com/


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

Ranger1 said:


> I buy mostly from Fir Meadow. http://www.store.firmeadowllc.com/


Thanks! I will check it out!


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

I second Fir Meadow  Very high quality products!


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## GoatieGranny (Jul 26, 2013)

I buy a lot from www.mountainroseherbs.com


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Bump


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

I get my raspberry from Amazon :lol:


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Bumping it up again  Anyone else interested in adding to it?  Or maybe a newbie to herbs have any questions?


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Just bumping this again!


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## LibertyHomesteadFarm (Feb 1, 2014)

I get my herbs from Mountain Rose Herbs.
I use a lot of Wormwood, Garlic, Cayenne, Red Raspberry and Ginger, among others.
I have a recipe for herbal dewormer/tonic on my website: http://libertyhomesteadfarm.com/herbal-remedies/homemade-herbal-animal-dewormer-tonic/ I found several recipes on the web and tweaked them somewhat to fit my needs 

I am also using Garlic Barrier as a natural, organic dewormer.


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## jmez61690 (Jun 16, 2015)

Could someone give me an idea of amounts and regularity of use with your goats? Garlic and echinacea pretty much year round, cayenne in the winter and after kidding, raspberry during pregnancy, is that all correct?


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

Fir Meadow's GI Soother and DWorm A together has been an excellent dewormer for my goats. The only thing I can't seem to prevent naturally is coccidia. I've treated cocci herbally before, but one year it just didn't work quick enough for my liking, and I treated her chemically. Since then, just to be less stressed, I've been preventing it with a dose of chemical dewormer, along with a regular herbal deworming schedule.

Does anyone on here live in a very wormy state, and have success completely preventing coccidia herbally? Like a tincture, or a mixture that is effective?


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## LibertyHomesteadFarm (Feb 1, 2014)

I prevent/treat cocci successfully in SC (very wormy) with "Coccidiosis tea" Recipe here: http://libertyhomesteadfarm.com/herbal-remedies/herbal-coccidiosis-remedy/

It's very easy and is administered on the same schedule as chem. cocci meds.


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

I will have to bookmark that. Do you buy the ingredients from a grocery store, or an herbalist? I know from an herbalist tends to be more effective ... so you give it twice a day for a week, it looks like? How often?


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

jmez61690 said:


> Could someone give me an idea of amounts and regularity of use with your goats? Garlic and echinacea pretty much year round, cayenne in the winter and after kidding, raspberry during pregnancy, is that all correct?


Generally I just give garlic when de-worming, at a rate of 1 TB per dose per animal. (they get dewormer 2x a day for 3-5 days)

Echinacea should only be given for 10 days at a time, otherwise the immune system gets too used to it and echinacea is no longer effective.

I give any herb that I grow in my garden throughout the winter for added nutrition. This includes oregano, thyme, lovage, lemon balm, sweet cicely, basil, comfrey, and more. Besides added nutrients, a lot of these herbs are anti-bacterial, which helps my goats stay healthy. Means of getting it into them is a 5 gal pail with molasses, and probably around a 1/2 cup to 1 cup of herbs. This way I know they're getting it. About a month before kidding, I add ACV to their water as well.

Red Raspberry Leaf isn't something I use with my goats at the moment.

Basically, use what herbs you have  See what they do, try them out with your goats. Herbs in the main won't harm them, so a little experimenting is fine!


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## LibertyHomesteadFarm (Feb 1, 2014)

ThreeHavens said:


> I will have to bookmark that. Do you buy the ingredients from a grocery store, or an herbalist? I know from an herbalist tends to be more effective ... so you give it twice a day for a week, it looks like? How often?


I order my herbs in bulk from mountain rose herbs


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

Awesome. Do you give the tea twice a day every day? Or just for a week? It's it an on and off thing (such as one week with the tea, one week without?)


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## LibertyHomesteadFarm (Feb 1, 2014)

Just give the tea when a kid is showing symptoms, once or twice a day depending on the severity.
I give the wormer on a regular basis, every month or two and I include DE in their feed daily.
This year I have only had to use the tea on 5 out of 15 kids.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

I live near Three Havens and I would love to know if anyone has an effective coccidia treatment thats herbal or even essential oils. 


So does anyone have any tried and true herbs for milk production? I tried red raspberry leaf (dried, cut) and I used comfrey. But it didnt seem to make any difference.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

LibertyHomesteadFarm said:


> I prevent/treat cocci successfully in SC (very wormy) with "Coccidiosis tea" Recipe here: http://libertyhomesteadfarm.com/herbal-remedies/herbal-coccidiosis-remedy/
> 
> It's very easy and is administered on the same schedule as chem. cocci meds.


So how quickly do you see results? do you find that they start to clear up and get solid stools by a day or two?


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## LibertyHomesteadFarm (Feb 1, 2014)

StaceyRosado said:


> So how quickly do you see results? do you find that they start to clear up and get solid stools by a day or two?


I normally see results within a day or at most two. 
I originally used tea bags to brew it, but because the slippery elm soaks up so much liquid, I am now just mixing it all in. It makes it thicker and easier to administer, and they get the benefit of all the herbs.
If I think worms are also a problem, I will also administer an herbal dewormer.

In very severe cases of scours, I will give them senna pods soaked in water as a laxative to clear out the intestines before I give the cocci tea and wormer.

(With one doeling early this spring who had watery scours, I gave two small senna pods and flushed all of the putrid matter from the intestines within minutes (imagine mini floodgates  ) after that, I gave cocci tea and wormer; she was completely cured after the initial "flushing" although I continued for the rest of the five days to make sure)


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## LibertyHomesteadFarm (Feb 1, 2014)

The cloves and ginger in the cocci tea combat the cocci/worms, the slippery elm makes the stools firmer and carries the parasites away, and the cinnamon both combats cocci/worms and the scouring.


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## LibertyHomesteadFarm (Feb 1, 2014)

StaceyRosado said:


> I live near Three Havens and I would love to know if anyone has an effective coccidia treatment thats herbal or even essential oils.
> 
> So does anyone have any tried and true herbs for milk production? I tried red raspberry leaf (dried, cut) and I used comfrey. But it didnt seem to make any difference.


Fenugreek and mallow are good for milk production.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

what is senna pods? 

and thanks for the suggestions on the milk production


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## LibertyHomesteadFarm (Feb 1, 2014)

Senna is a small plant that grows in north Africa. It is a very strong and effective laxative.
Scientific name is _Senna alexandrina_
I found out about it in the "Herbal Handbook for Farm and Stable."

The dose is:
_"Five large pods for an average sized dog, seven for sheep, eight for goat, twenty for horse, twenty-four for cow, soaked in cold water for a minimum of four hours preferably seven hours. Use one tsp cold water per pod. about half a saltspoon of powdered ginger. Before use squeeze all moisture from the pods, then add a little honey. The honey will usually tempt the case to drink the senna. Add ginger in powder form, a pinch to six pods, ditto to ten, a half teaspoon to twenty or twenty-four. Give the senna dose last thing at night at least two hours after food had been taken; can also be given early morning."_


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## KristiStone (Apr 29, 2015)

Oh wow, great thread! I don't use anything just yet, but this is pretty much where I'm going with all of my animals. Thanks for sharing everyone!


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

Have you tried dosing the herbal coccidia treatment as a preventative, instead of a treatment?


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## mrsslick (Jul 8, 2015)

Great information!!


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

This is pretty cool! Is "Herbal Handbook for Farm and Stable." well worth the money? I've been considering getting it for a couple years.

Kat Drovdahl's book is great, I have it and am really happy with it!


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## mrsslick (Jul 8, 2015)

I have the "herbal handbook..." I love it. Bought it on half.com for $4 with shipping. Back then, people had alot of those herbs and stuff growing in their pastures/fields from what I understand, so self medicating was pretty easy but its just as easy to go buy the herbs today or grow them. Im dying for Kat's book!


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

mrsslick said:


> I have the "herbal handbook..." I love it. Bought it on half.com for $4 with shipping. Im dying for Kat's book!


Okay, I'll think about it some more  Kat's book is definitely worth it!!! There's sooo much info in it


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## HeavenViewRanch (Feb 21, 2015)

What can I give a 2 week old goat for pain and inflammation? she got her foot stuck yesterday and won't put it on the ground.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Cayenne tincture/powder, White Willow Bark, Mullien Leaf & Flower, peppermint ( plant and Essential Oil) are all good for direct pain relief.

For inflammation/swelling, comfrey, burdock & calendula are good.


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## LibertyHomesteadFarm (Feb 1, 2014)

ThreeHavens said:


> Have you tried dosing the herbal coccidia treatment as a preventative, instead of a treatment?


I use the dewormer as a preventative, it contains all of the cocci tea ingredients except slippery elm (unless you make dosage balls) plus a lot of other great herbs.



Cedar Point Kikos said:


> This is pretty cool! Is "Herbal Handbook for Farm and Stable." well worth the money? I've been considering getting it for a couple years.
> 
> Kat Drovdahl's book is great, I have it and am really happy with it!


I have found the Herbal Handbook to be very helpful; but because it was written by a Brit, some of the common names of plants refer to different plants than we're used to here in the U.S.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

I ordered the Herbal Handbook...can't wait till it gets here, and I can see what's in it!


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## HeavenViewRanch (Feb 21, 2015)

I found a gel at my pet store that had cayenne and calendula as the active ingredients and put it on her leg all of the swelling is gone and she is starting to use it


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## bornagain62511 (Mar 3, 2015)

ThreeHavens said:


> Fir Meadow's GI Soother and DWorm A together has been an excellent dewormer for my goats. The only thing I can't seem to prevent naturally is coccidia. I've treated cocci herbally before, but one year it just didn't work quick enough for my liking, and I treated her chemically. Since then, just to be less stressed, I've been preventing it with a dose of chemical dewormer, along with a regular herbal deworming schedule.
> 
> Does anyone on here live in a very wormy state, and have success completely preventing coccidia herbally? Like a tincture, or a mixture that is effective?


Can you or anyone give recommendations on dosage and schedule for giving the Fir Meadows GI soother and DwormA for Nigerians in the 45 lbs to 60 lbs range? Should I start with a "loading" dose initially and how often, for how many days? AFter the initial break in period, what is a good maintenance dose and how often to give it? I'm in southern Wisconsin if that matters.

thanks


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

bornagain62511 said:


> Can you or anyone give recommendations on dosage and schedule for giving the Fir Meadows GI soother and DwormA for Nigerians in the 45 lbs to 60 lbs range? Should I start with a "loading" dose initially and how often, for how many days? AFter the initial break in period, what is a good maintenance dose and how often to give it? I'm in southern Wisconsin if that matters.


So for Deworm A, dosage for a 45-60lbs goat is 1 tsp (from 35 - 100 lbs).
Give 3-5 days, two times per day, in a row.
Then 1 to 2 times a week thereafter.
You can double/triple the dose for severe problems. Can be used in a lambar or bottle.

If you think your goat has worms pretty bad, or just want to "clean" them out, try doubling the dose for a couple days.

Personally, I give it when I think my does need it. So say before breeding, before kidding, after kids are weaned, etc. Any new goats get wormed for the full 5 days before entering the herd as well. 
I don't do the 1 or 2 times a week dosing, but I do rotational grazing, so that helps a lot.

Hope that answers your questions!  Can't say anything about GI Soother, since I don't have it


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Bumping this up again!

This year I put parsley roots & leaves in ACV to give to my does.
Parsley is good for the reproductive system, contains large amount of calcium and is a general tonic. ACV is along great tonic and supposedly helps you get more does, not sure if that is true though!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

This is interesting. Starting to do herbs and essential oils for myself too.


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## valleyhavengoats (Aug 29, 2015)

So I am completely new to herbs, with feeding garlic do you just chop up a clove and other herbs do you just feed as is?


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Yes, you want to chop the clove as much as possible. Doing so releases the sulfur & allicin compounds, which are the two main ones in garlic. The more you chop, the more it's released, and the stronger it gets.


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## valleyhavengoats (Aug 29, 2015)

So do you want it strong or not very strong? I was thinking of planting a herb garden just for the goats so they can eat what they want and need it. Does that sound like a good idea?


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## GoatMama123 (Sep 9, 2015)

This is an amazing thread guys. I know someone or two briefly touched on it, but does amount and dosing depend on weight? My girls are very small right now (Under 25lbs). How do you mix up the ratio from fresh to dried? Is garlic powdered what you guys are referring to or minced/ cloves.

Anything the can NOT have?

Very interested in how you are administering the Cheyenne pepper


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

valleyhavengoats said:


> So do you want it strong or not very strong? I was thinking of planting a herb garden just for the goats so they can eat what they want and need it. Does that sound like a good idea?


I think the stronger the better - you'll need less if it's stronger.

A goat herb garden sounds great! I sometimes let my goats go through my herb garden - depending on the time or year - and they'll pick and chose what they want.
This fall some of them really liked my wormwood plant, picked it pretty much clean!



GoatMama123 said:


> This is an amazing thread guys. I know someone or two briefly touched on it, but does amount and dosing depend on weight? My girls are very small right now (Under 25lbs). How do you mix up the ratio from fresh to dried? Is garlic powdered what you guys are referring to or minced/ cloves.
> 
> Anything they can NOT have?
> 
> Very interested in how you are administering the Cheyenne pepper


Dosing...that is a hard one. Here are some tips from Kat Drovdahl's book:
-in acute situations, give herbs every 2-3 hours. This keeps the herb in the system
-Pain levels will give you valuable information. If the pain level is going up, increase the amount of herb(s) given. If the pain level is going down, gradually decrease amount of herbs given.
-In general, continue herbs for at lest 3 days past last symptoms
-Herbs do not work like drugs that are only given 1 or 2 times per day
-For chronic conditions, dosing 2-3 times per day is good

Dosing powdered herbs (weights are in pounds)
15-20: small pinch
20+: 1/4 tsp
35+: 1/2 tsp
60-70: 1 tsp
100-200: 1/2 tbsp
200-400: 1 tbsp
400+: 1/8 cup
800-1200: 1/4 cup

If feeding a group, add all weights together and dose accordingly. (i.e. lambar feeding 8 kids, 4 weigh 13lbs, 2 weigh 10, 2 weigh 14. Total weight 100lbs, so dose would be 1/2 tbsp.)

For cut, sifted and fresh herbs, you will need to feed 2-4 times as much.

Tincture doses: please note that tinctures are very strong. And diluting them is probably a good idea, because they're generally not the best tasting  Again, weights are in pounds.

Up to 20: 5 drops or 1/4 tsp
20-35: 2 cc or ml
35-75: 3-4 cc
75-150: 5 cc
150-225: 7 cc
At 1000: 30-35 cc

Infusions: these are very strong herbal teas- the real thing! 1 tsp pwd herb or 1 tbsp cut/sifted herb or 2 handfuls fresh herb to a pint of water. Look up further instructions on how to make them.

whole pint/250 ml to a horse or cow
two pints/ 1 quart / 1/2 liter for the larger draft breeds
1/2 a pint / 1 cup / 125ml: large pig, pony or mini version of larger livestock
1/4 pint / 1/2 cup / 65ml: alpacas, standard dairy goats, sheep, very large dogs, etc
1/4 cup / 35m: mini goats/sheep, med-large dogs, weaner pigs, young calves/foals, etc
1/8 cup / 15-20mls: small dogs, rabbits, cats, young kids, lambs, etc. divide by half for animals 3lbs or lighter



GoatMama123 said:


> Is garlic powdered what you guys are referring to or minced/ cloves.
> 
> Anything they can NOT have?


We were talking about cloves getting minced, yes 

Well, there are herbs you will want to be careful with with pregnant animals. Take Lavender for instance; it works with the body to get contractions going. Suitable for labor, not so much in early pregnancy.
There are also herbs that, if they are by roads etc, will pick up heavy metals and chemicals. And then there are herbs you'll want to be careful with animals that have certain ailments.
In general, I don't think there are any _herbs_ that are big no-no's for goats. ( of course, nightshade, etc are poisonous )

Hope this helps!


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## valleyhavengoats (Aug 29, 2015)

Okay so now a question about essential oils. Who has any experience with coconut oil? Some of my goats have dandruff and I read on another website that coconut oil can help. I did rule out mites, lice, mineral deficient.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Coconut oil itself is super moisturizing. ACV could also maybe help with dandruff 
Essential Oils can also be very helpful, depending on what ones you use.


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## valleyhavengoats (Aug 29, 2015)

What is acv?


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## FloatnRockRanch (Feb 7, 2015)

Apple cider vinegar. Following...excellent thread.


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## valleyhavengoats (Aug 29, 2015)

I will give it a try.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Sorry, valleyhavengoats! Yes, it's apple cider vinegar.


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## valleyhavengoats (Aug 29, 2015)

No worries Cedar Point Kikos. Do I just pout it on them? Also I know it's good to put in the buck and wether water but what is the ratio acv to water?


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Use a spray bottle, it's less of a mess & you can either mist or spray a stream.
Start at a ratio they'll drink...for my does it was about 1/2 cup for 3 gallons.
Some people do 1 c to 5 gallons. Or 1 c to 100 gallons.


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## valleyhavengoats (Aug 29, 2015)

Okay thankyou! My boyfriend was sceptical of all this till I showed him this post and found articles about it online. He went out last night and bought garlic and more coconut oil and also acv. Haha he said he will build me a raised garden for the herbs in the spring. Yay!


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Bump!


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I have started using Ess. oils in the care of my goats...I still use western meds of course...but hope to do more and more natural as I learn about them. Its not easy going from what you KNOW works to something new...well new to me lol...


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Neat! I never really considered using EO's with my goats...how do you do that?


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

I used cotton balls with lavender eo on them placed around the barn to calm down all goats and people presnet at the first few milkings, first kidding, etc. I also use lavender on goat cuts and bee stings, herbal wormer, herbal tincture (we are about to start making that ourselves), red raspberry leaves in the grain for pregnant does, ACV cut with water in a spray bottle to both clean hooves and help with hoof rot, tea tree oil on places where you pull a tick off a dog, vitamin e gel on cuts, etc.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Ive used several as a GI soother...some for rumen upset...wounds..in udder balms...ect....


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

We used Tea Tree to aid in the recovery and prevention of Pink Eye this year.


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## MoonShadow (Mar 1, 2015)

This is so great!! Im taking a course in herbology and natural medicine and I really like going natural with my animals so this is really helpful!!!


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

A note, we did not put Tea Tree into the eye of our goats. We dabbed a little bit under the eye, being careful to avoid their actual eyes.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

MoonShadow, what course are you taking? I'm into herbalism as well and have taken a couple courses


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Bumping


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## MoonShadow (Mar 1, 2015)

Cedar Point Kikos said:


> MoonShadow, what course are you taking? I'm into herbalism as well and have taken a couple courses


I didn't see this until now, Sorry about that. I'm doing a correspondence course through the 'Herbal Healers Academy'. But I'm not sure If I will continue with with course, I may fine another course to do because the person who developed this course is also very much into conversing with spirits, spirit guides, dead people, things like that to help with her healing and herbalism which I don't believe in.(Yes, I know and understand that a lot of people who do herbalist are very much into spiritual things like such as well, I've done a lot of research on spiritualism,herbs and natural path medicine in the past and know that they all are heavily linked in a lot of cases) I'm a christian so yes I do believe in demons but not dead people, I believe these so called spirits are demons deceiving people, because God says when you die your soul goes back to God and you sleep till Jesus returns. I know to most people this might not be a big deal, just read it and get your certificate and move on, but the fact that these practices are in my home and Im reading them is cracking open a door and I don't want to mess around with that. Even if I looked over the spiritual stuff and only took away the herbal knowledge into they still have some required and non required exercises they want you to do as in burning herbs and meditate, clearing your chakras and clearing bad spirit energies especially after communicating with spirits, clearing away any bad spirits that may be around you and things like that. Because of what I believe and what I know I cannot and will not do the required spiritual practices which may and probably will hinder me in completing the class.
I know not everyone is Christian or believes in God but I though I would give a head ups to anyone who may feels the same way, before you spend the money getting this course, if ever you where interested or are looking into it. Because even though I did research to find a good course I did not know these things would be in the course when I got it and it did not say it would be at the time I purchased it, I don't know if it does now because I haven't checked. Anyways sorry for the long post, I'm probably going to be labeled as the crazy Christian now!! Lol oh well.


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

MoonShadow said:


> I didn't see this until now, Sorry about that. I'm doing a correspondence course through the 'Herbal Healers Academy'. But I'm not sure If I will continue with with course, I may fine another course to do because the person who developed this course is also very much into conversing with spirits, spirit guides, dead people, things like that to help with her healing and herbalism which I don't believe in.(Yes, I know and understand that a lot of people who do herbalist are very much into spiritual things like such as well, I've done a lot of research on spiritualism,herbs and natural path medicine in the past and know that they all are heavily linked in a lot of cases) I'm a christian so yes I do believe in demons but not dead people, I believe these so called spirits are demons deceiving people, because God says when you die your soul goes back to God and you sleep till Jesus returns. I know to most people this might not be a big deal, just read it and get your certificate and move on, but the fact that these practices are in my home and Im reading them is cracking open a door and I don't want to mess around with that. Even if I looked over the spiritual stuff and only took away the herbal knowledge into they still have some required and non required exercises they want you to do as in burning herbs and meditate, clearing your chakras and clearing bad spirit energies especially after communicating with spirits, clearing away any bad spirits that may be around you and things like that. Because of what I believe and what I know I cannot and will not do the required spiritual practices which may and probably will hinder me in completing the class.
> I know not everyone is Christian or believes in God but I though I would give a head ups to anyone who may feels the same way, before you spend the money getting this course, if ever you where interested or are looking into it. Because even though I did research to find a good course I did not know these things would be in the course when I got it and it did not say it would be at the time I purchased it, I don't know if it does now because I haven't checked. Anyways sorry for the long post, I'm probably going to be labeled as the crazy Christian now!! Lol oh well.


Thanks so much! That's the problem I have too, when it comes to holistic medicine.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Way to go for staying with what you believe! Thanks so much. I agree with you 100%.

I find it so disappointing that a lot of the herb courses dwell on that kind of stuff. It makes it so hard to actually find good, wholesome herb courses that won't "crack the door open".


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Found this thread on a different pack goat form about minerals. A good read.

http://www.packgoatcentral.com/forums/showthread.php?tid=980


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## wndngrvr (Dec 10, 2011)

Interesting posts. I liked Pat Colby's book. I was going to treat myself to the book by Kat Drovdaul but didn't like the reviews on it. I try to get my girls out into the woods every day I can -I think they do best getting their own and have noticed that they go after different things depending on the time of year. We are lucky to have that situation. They are really after the black berry leaves right now. I do buy a few things from Molly's herbals and have been very happy with them. I like her mixtures because she lists everything in them. 
I went to Fir Meadows site but couldn't see what was in the mixtures so was reluctant to order from there. 
I have had good results with Molly's arthritis mixture for a doe that had a badly broken leg and it gets sore for her especially with weather changes. Mix it with peanut butter and honey -yummy cookie balls. I know this works as my doe was holding her back leg up but doesn't do that if she has her "cookie". Also use her tincture for pain and the immune booster tincture. - Trying vitamin C right now for a cough situation along with the immune booster.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Kat's book is definitely worth getting. Lots of info in it!

I'm truly disappointed that Kat removed the ingredients from her website. It kind of wreaked the whole aspect of using herbs, especially her mixes.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Bumping


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## GoatMama123 (Sep 9, 2015)

How much garlic and Ceyenne are you guys doing?

Mashed garlic or does garlic salt count?


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

I use about a 1tsp of garlic per goat. If you feel like they need more because they're fighting something or have a heavy worm load give more.
Cayenne in a tincture is about 1ml per goat kid. Powdered Cayenne is about 1/2tsp or less per goat. For my own powdered cayenne since it's MUCH hotter then store-bought!

Mashed garlic is really good. Garlic salt I would stay away from since it's not pure garlic and they're probably won't need the salt.


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## GoatMama123 (Sep 9, 2015)

What about garlic powder...not garlic salt? I mean fresh is best but it's what I have on hand.


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

This year I've slightly changed my program. Twice a week, any goat who isn't pregnant gets a somewhat high dose of GI Soother and Dworm A twice a week. Since you cannot (or should not) double dose pregnant does, I am giving the pregnant does a careful dose of GI Soother and Dworm A three times a week. They are all doing well on this program thus far.


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

GoatMama123 said:


> What about garlic powder...not garlic salt? I mean fresh is best but it's what I have on hand.


No, I don't think so. They say that garlic loses most of it's properties within 15 of it being ground up hence why it is best to feed it whole.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Bump!


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

I use the following mix for cocci preventative and treatment, if it's caught early enough. 

1 part cloves
1 part cinnamon
1 part slippery elm
1 part ginger
1/4 part cayenne

Mix it all together and store in a cool, dark place. Start giving to kids at one week old, three times a week-more if it's raining. I give every day that it rains. Doseage is one pinch up to 20 pounds, 1/4 tsp up to 40 pounds, 1/2 up to 60 pounds, etc. 
If the cocci is caught early, this can also be used to treat cocci. Give double or triple dose 4 times daily for first day, (more if needed) then normal dose 4 times daily until runny poop has been gone for two days.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Thanks for posting! Looks like it would work well.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Bump!


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## heidi2016 (Feb 24, 2016)

A good place to look would be fir meadows or fias co farms or weed'em and reep all have lots of good information. http://fiascofarm.com/ http://www.firmeadowllc.com/store/c1/Featured_Products.html http://www.weedemandreap.com/category/backyard-farming/goats/


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Bump!


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

I need to read through this thread again.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

Currently using essential oils to treat staff infection on udder and belly. Will keep you posted.


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

A fun sort of update - we ran a fecal on the doe herd, and the vet reported very low numbers. Encouraging since I deworm herbally!


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## redbarnfarm-goatherd (May 14, 2016)

Any herbal helps for pregnancy toxemia? I have two weeks to go until due date. In 20+ years never had a doe with this situation and she is my best and strongest. Urine test shows maximum ketones, still walking around wanting to eat but not eating..... getting thinner. Have given nutri drench and calcium and molasses. She likes kelp and is still drinking water.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Bumping, hopefully someone has some answers!


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Bumping!


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## lilaalil (Sep 5, 2014)

Nice thread! I'll play...

*-What do you use to de-worm? *Land of Havilah herbal wormer. I've had goats for a year and a half now, and have not had to chemically treat them yet, despite living in wet, warm, Hawaii, notorious parasite breeding ground. Partially that is because their forage stays long enough that they never eat near the ground, but whenever I do see some sign of trouble, I go for the herbal wormer and it always clears up.

*-What is your favorite herb(s) and why?* I honestly don't know much about herbs yet, but I think raw garlic is wonderful. I have used it successfully to treat some weird chronic infection that my daughter had, so I now believe everything good anyone says about it  Well, within reason. I make garlic/ ginger paste and add it to my herbal wormer to supercharge it.

*-What is working best for you in terms of what herbs you are giving? *When I see signs of trouble, like pale eyelids, I try follow the "actue" dosage instructions on the Land of Havilah website; basically dosing them multiple times a day for a few days and daily for a few days after that.

*How do you treat fairly common diseases? List disease and treatment (whatever ones are common in your area) *I am lucky to not have had to deal with much so far. I do have a doe that keeps getting staph bumps on her udder (extremely common here in Hawaii). I apply tea tree oil and it is gone within a few days.

*-What do your goats really like? *Kelp with vitalberbs added, and the forage I cut for them. They are insanely picky about treats, so I have to drench them with just about anything I want them to take. They are developing a taste for the wormer drench though; some now like it, and some have resigned not to fight it. I have hopes that someday I will be able to just make dosage balls and not have to drench anymore.

*-What do you give newborns? *No newborns yet, but I will mostly leave them to their moms, besides dipping their cords, unless they show signs of trouble.

*-How does the way you are raising your goats effect what herbs you give them? *I don't offer my goats any herbs besides the wormer right now, because they tend to turn up their noses at just about everything. But keeping them as naturally as possible, clean and uncrowded, means they need so much less treatment. I am not good at dealing with sick animals (or people) so I try very hard to prevent problems. Keeping a very low stocking rate (5 goats right now on over an acre) is very important to me, as is keeping them well-fed. I make sure they have lots and lots of green stuff that they enjoy eating, both the low-quality forage inside their pen, and high-quality, tasty stuff that I cut for them around my property and the neighborhood and give to them in a special "branch-feeder" to keep it off the ground. I also supplement with alfalfa pellets and a little grain, depending on how much forage I am cutting for them. I think good-quality green food serves many of the same functions as standard herbs.

*-What herbs to you recommend starting with? List herb and reason *
I think anyone could start with a pre-mixed herbal wormer from any of the main companies (Land of Havilah, Fir Meadows, Molly's Herbals) and give it a shot. It may help you stretch out the time between using chemical wormers, or it may replace them completely, depending on your situation. Of course you have to keep an eye out for parasite problems, but you have to do that when using chemical wormers as well. The less you use chemical wormers, the less wormer-resistant worms you are breeding. Chemical worming is also said to be hard on the goat's body. So even if you can stretch it out, that is a good thing. It's a small investment to give it a try.


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Does anyone use aloe vera when disbudding? I'm thinking I'll use it next year, wanted to kow if anyone else does


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Just realized I didn't ever answer the questions.....

*-What do you use to de-worm?*
I use quite an assortment of herbs. Molly's Herbals, fresh garlic, rosemary, oregano, thyme, cilantro, pumpkin seeds, random spices (cumin, coriander, cayenne, etc). I have found that pretty much any strong herb is great for preventing worms, so whatever herbs are currently in the garden I give them.

*-How to you deal with mineral deficiencies?*
I'm still working on figuring it all out with mineral deficiencies. I'm currently doing copper bolus, selenium/e gel, and of course, loose minerals. I just got a herbal animal keeping book (_The Herbal Handbook For Farm And Stable_) and it has a big list of different plants and herbs and the minerals they are high in, I'm definitely going to be doing some of those.

*-What is your favorite herb(s) and why?*
My favorite herb is either red raspberry leaves or (and I guess this really doesn't count because it's not an herb..) garlic. Red raspberry leaves, because it's an all around great herb for lactating and birthing and animals so great for dairy goats. It boosts milk production, can start contractions (only use it small amounts on a pregnant doe unless trying to get her into labor!) and boosts the immune system. Garlic is also good for milkers because it is anti-bacterial, great for mastitis. It's also immune boosting, and a good parasite prevention.

*-What is working best for you in terms of what herbs you are giving?*
As mentioned above, red raspberry leaves and garlic are awesome. I use them a LOT. I also use whatever herbs are in season. Nettle (yes, it's the stinging kind, we get it dried through our food co-op) is high in iron and boosts the immune system and milk production. I use it a lot also, but not as much as the other two.

*-How do you treat fairly common diseases? List disease and treatment (whatever ones are common in your area)*
Only having had goats for two years, I haven't had a ton of experience with diseases other than the typical parasites and coccidia.

*-When do you get a vet or commercial items to heal an animal? *
Usually when I have no idea what is going on. I've taken goats to the vet twice, once when my wether got parasites (yeah, that was probably the silliest thing I've ever done :lol: I had had goats for only a few months) and the other time was when my buckling got poisoned. I had read somewhere that goats _never_ throw up. Don't ask :shrug: As for commercial items, I've used chemical wormers a couple of times, once on a bad case of cocci, another of barber poles, and once to treat lungworm.

*-What do your goats really like?*
They like pretty much all the herbs I give them. Sometimes they turn their noses up at the garlic, but that just means they don't need it. Other than that, they will eat nearly any herbs I poke at them. Oh, forgot about the Molly's Herbals wormer and the tincture. :roll: Nobody but the buck will eat that stuff...

*-What do you give newborns? *
Usually not a lot. I make sure mom is happy and healthy, and babies should be good. She does all the dirty work  I do give mom nettle, red raspberry leaves, some form of wormer, probiotics and molasses.

-How does the way you are raising your goats effect what herbs you give them?
I like to do everything as natural as possible. If they don't want to eat it I usually don't force the issue. If their body tells them it's poison, I'm happy to leave it at that.

*-What herbs to you recommend starting with? List herb and reason.*
Probably my favorites, garlic and red raspberry leaves. Two awesome all around herbs for the aforementioned reasons


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Bump


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## bornagain62511 (Mar 3, 2015)

For deworming I use these 2:

http://www.firmeadowllc.com/store/p91/Herb_Mix_DWorm_A_%E2%84%A2_16_oz_%28parasites%2C_m ycoplasma%29.html

http://www.firmeadowllc.com/store/p436/Herb_Mix_GI_Soother%E2%84%A2_Cocci_Diarrhea_Barber pole_Ulcer_support_16_oz.html

Everyday mineral/vitamin supplements, I mix 2 lbs. of the kelp, 8 oz. of the kop-sel, and 8 oz. of the better daze, along with about 4 oz. of himilayan or celtic sea salt, and give this my goats, one or two small scoops (probably a tablespoon or 2) per day, no other mineral supplements are needed, but I do give a selenium/vitamin E gel once a month just in case, although Kat from Fir Meadow says these should meet all their needs, and she's a master herbalist who's been raising goats for many years:

http://www.firmeadowllc.com/store/p445/Herb_Mix_Kop-Sel™_16_oz.html

http://www.firmeadowllc.com/store/p90/Herb_Mix_BetterDaze™_8_oz.html

http://www.firmeadowllc.com/store/p181/Kelp_Icelandic_Organic_2_lbs.html

Pre birth care for pregnant does, the last 3 or 4 weeks before due date:

http://www.firmeadowllc.com/store/p453/Herb_Mix_Pre-Pare™_8_oz.html


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

For preg. Toxemia..you can feed a juice made from equal parts carrot and celery..and through in a few garlic cloves. Also 60 cc of a 50/50 mix of molasses and water...takes the place of propolyn glycol (sp)..that stuff is nasty.


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## MoonShadow (Mar 1, 2015)

I think One of my wethers has UC, I saw drips of blood(on the ground not coming from the goat) along with what looked like diluted blood-pee in the snow. I've been giving them all a good dose of AC once or twice a week but It seems that may not have been good enough.
So far he's acting normal(was peeing strong and normal a few days ago when I saw him)but I haven't seen Him pee yet today(EDIT: saw him pee it was wasn't a lot, but it was a stream). My mom will get stone from time to time and she recommended I maybe try "Stone Breaker" because it work super well for her(chanca pedra mainly). So I wanted to know If all the herbs in this are safe for goats, I know celery seeds are and I believe chanca pedra but I don't know about the rest?

The mix contains-
chanca pedra (phyllanthus niruri) 
Hydrangea root (Hydrangea arborescens) (thank you buck naked boars, I was pretty sure this one was a no but wanted to double check!)
Celery Seed (apium graveloens)
Burdock seed (arctium lappa)

EDIT: everything seems a bit better today, pee stream seems stronger, no bloody tint to the pee. I have been giving large doses of AC and Chanca Pedra tea since yesterday. Been watching my sheep as well, for GP, since he has never really had a strong stream. (he's 12yrs) 
The rest of the wethers and the buck seem fine, no problems, so we shall see how things turn out.


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

No on hydrangea. Not sure about the rest.


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

I'd like to start making my own herb mixes. It's expensive to buy them from fir meadows. I think her products are great but I could save a lot making my own. This is a great thread!!! Would love recipes (I saw one) for mixing up herbs to use.


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## Buck Naked Boers (Oct 15, 2012)

Cathy that's great to know about natural option for prop glycol yeah that stuff has to be nasty!! Thanks for sharing that info!!!!!


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## aaacres (Jan 8, 2016)

GoatieGranny said:


> I am not an Herbalist, but I've taken several classes over the years, and I continue to study herbs almost daily. One day I may go for the title, but for now, I'm just learning about them because I believe they are a cleaner, purer way to treat ailments and boost health.
> 
> -What do you use to de-worm? I use Molly's Herbal formula. I also add cayenne and garlic to the herb balls I make. Cayenne is excellent for the blood and helps warm them in the winter. (I don't give cayenne in the summer.) The garlic is anti-fungal, anti-parasitic, anti-biotic, anti-viral and more. It's just all around a great herb. In addition, we have black walnut trees surrounding our barn. Black Walnuts are anti-fungal and anti-parasitic. We have never had to deal with worms...and I'm very thankful for that.
> 
> ...


I use Molly's Herbal formula as well and I was wondering how much garlic do you use?


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

StaceyRosado said:


> Currently using essential oils to treat staff infection on udder and belly. Will keep you posted.


How did this turn out? Which essential oils did you use?


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Does anyone know of or do natural selenium supplements?


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Bumping this


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Compiled a bunch of interesting articles on my website, feel free to check them out!

http://cedarpointkikos.com/minerals/

http://cedarpointkikos.com/essential-oils-animals/

http://cedarpointkikos.com/health/

While not all herb related, they are either health related or just plain interesting


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## Cielo1558 (Sep 14, 2017)

Cedar Point Kikos said:


> Hey all!
> 
> Wondering if there is anyone here that uses herbalism with their animals!
> If so for the fun of it, and because it would be helpful to folks just beginning with herbs and animals, think you all could answer these questions? As many or as few as you want  Feel free to suggest other questions I should add.  Thanks!
> ...


@cedarpointkikos, I've always been big into herbs for my children and I. My husband talked me into a small goat farm and I would love to do the same for them. By chance could you give me dosages, I recently ( received a free goat and she was small, in her travels got worm bloom and cocci) even though I'm giving her kelp, oregano and free choice minerals, she still doesn't look amazing! So I'm wandering if I'm giving her enough? I'm new on the goat spot


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

Sometimes if they're down when you get them you just have to go the chemical route. Is she anemic? I'd start her on a specially formulated herbal mix - I use Molly's Herbals.


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## Cielo1558 (Sep 14, 2017)

Suzanne_Tyler said:


> Sometimes if they're down when you get them you just have to go the chemical route. Is she anemic? I'd start her on a specially formulated herbal mix - I use Molly's Herbals.


We took her to vet, when we noticed. Vet said she had worms and cocci. Vet said she looked good otherwise but she just seems to be getting worse. Since being on goat spot , we are now ordering fir meadows deworming mix. I've trying herbs along with her grain, last couple of days she looks better but is not gaining weight! The rest of our goats look and act healthy , they have started a small cough we believe due to all the rain. We do keep the little one separated.


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## Suzanne_Tyler (Jul 19, 2014)

If she has worms and cocci you need to treat it. Did the vet say what kind of parasites? 

Is she anemic?

What is her poop like?

What are you feeding her?

How old is she?


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Cielo1558 said:


> @cedarpointkikos, I've always been big into herbs for my children and I. My husband talked me into a small goat farm and I would love to do the same for them. By chance could you give me dosages, I recently ( received a free goat and she was small, in her travels got worm bloom and cocci) even though I'm giving her kelp, oregano and free choice minerals, she still doesn't look amazing! So I'm wandering if I'm giving her enough? I'm new on the goat spot


Not sure what page, but I did make a post with dosages somewhere on this thread  If you have time, I would suggest reading through the whole thread.


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## Cedar Point Kikos (Oct 16, 2013)

Bumping


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## Champion Fence Jumpers (Feb 10, 2020)

Just wondering which herbal dewormer is the best: Fir Meadows, Molly’s Herbals, Land Of Havilah, etc. Which one do y’all use, and which one is the MOST effective. Thanks!


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

Champion Fence Jumpers said:


> Just wondering which herbal dewormer is the best: Fir Meadows, Molly's Herbals, Land Of Havilah, etc. Which one do y'all use, and which one is the MOST effective. Thanks!


I haven't used Land Of Havilah, but between the other two, definitely Fir Meadows. Also, you use less than 1/3 as much of Fir Meadows, which makes it much easier to dose.


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## Champion Fence Jumpers (Feb 10, 2020)

@Ranger1 
Can you send me a link to the stuff you use? I can't seem to find it.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I use LOH and have been super happy with it. She recently revamped her formula and I have seen nothing but red lids!


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

https://www.firmeadowllc.com/store/..._supports_body_in_foreign_matter_removal.html


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## Champion Fence Jumpers (Feb 10, 2020)

happybleats said:


> I use LOH and have been super happy with it. She recently revamped her formula and I have seen nothing but red lids!


Great! I am kind of leaning more for LOH but just wanted to see which one really is the best. Have you used Fir Meadows?


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

I have not used Fir Meadow, so sorry, but I LOVE Land of Havilah's parasite formula. It's easy to use and works great! I just mix it into my grain (which it sticks to because it is textured) and they eat it right up! I'm using so many more exclamation points than I'm used to!!!

Cost should be something to consider too. I don't know how they compare, but I feel like there was a reason I went with LOH...


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## Champion Fence Jumpers (Feb 10, 2020)

MellonFriend said:


> I have not used Fir Meadow, so sorry, but I LOVE Land of Havilah's parasite formula. It's easy to use and works great! I just mix it into my grain (which it sticks to because it is textured) and they eat it right up! I'm using so many more exclamation points than I'm used to!!!
> 
> Cost should be something to consider too. I don't know how they compare, but I feel like there was a reason I went with LOH...


Haha! Sounds like LOH is really good! I think I am going with it. Thanks!


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I have not used Fir meadow..heard lots of good stuff about her herbs..but I do love LOH.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

I use Fir Meadows. Simply because one of my goats doesn’t do as well on LOH (it irritates his throat). While it does work for me, I still think LOH is the superior formula. Fir meadow has two different formulas, DWA and GI Soother, and you have to use both. LOH is both of them combine, and more!!


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## Champion Fence Jumpers (Feb 10, 2020)

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> I use Fir Meadows. Simply because one of my goats doesn't do as well on LOH (it irritates his throat). While it does work for me, I still think LOH is the superior formula. Fir meadow has two different formulas, DWA and GI Soother, and you have to use both. LOH is both of them combine, and more!!


Alright thanks!


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## Driver (Nov 11, 2019)

2 new NDG(10weeks old) all they seem to like to eat is alittle hay some grain very little milk. Having a hell of a time getting them to eat herbal dewormer loh and garlic.

Any help?


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

1. Whole cloves (goats take them as treats)
2. Whole cloves coated in molasses or honey
3. Suggestion #1 but tossed with feed
4. Suggestion #2 but tossed with feed
5. Crushed or chopped garlic in feed
6. Suggestion #2 but crushed or chopped in feed
7. Crushed garlic mixed with a teaspoon of applesauce
8. Crushed garlic mixed with a teaspoon of mashed bananas
9. Crushed garlic mixed with a teaspoon of pumpkin puree
10. Suggestion #7, #8, or #9 with Slippery Elm Powder added
11. Crushed garlic mixed with a bit of flaxseed meal and molasses to form a ball
12. Suggestion #11 can be shoved into the mouth of a goat a few times forcefully if they don't like it at first
13. Suggestion #11 can also be tossed into feed, or broken up slightly, then mixed with feed.
14. Garlic can be put into a peanut hull
15. Take a banana slice about an inch thick, scoop out the middle leaving a bit on the bottom, stick the clove in (or crushed garlic) cover the top, and offer to the goat or forcefully put into the goats mouth until they realize it is tasty.


In emergency (non-regular) situations

16. Crushed finely and mixed with water to drench carefully
17. Crushed finely and mixed with juice (carrot, fruit) to drench carefully
18. Crushed finely and mixed with olive oil to drench carefully or feed from a spoon



As for the herbs, most of these methods work for them too.


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## Driver (Nov 11, 2019)

Hoping they'll like some treats soon. Is 10 weeks to young to drench?


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

You can drench them.


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## Driver (Nov 11, 2019)

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> You can drench them.


Can I drench loh herb and garlic at same time?

Mix loh and garlic with water and maybe blend


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Yes you just have to blend the garlic finely!


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## Driver (Nov 11, 2019)

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Yes you just have to blend the garlic finely!


Welp I drenched the little ladies. They weren't very willing participants but it done. They spit out some but anticipated they'd do that and made a bit extra.


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## Driver (Nov 11, 2019)

So this is the plan moving forward loh parasite formula 1x weekly along with garlic. Is this a good starting point for preventive care for my 10nweek old NDG. Anything I should add?


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## Nigerian dwarf goat (Sep 25, 2017)

Sounds great! If you would like you could add essential oils, but it isn't necessary!


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## Driver (Nov 11, 2019)

Nigerian dwarf goat said:


> Sounds great! If you would like you could add essential oils, but it isn't necessary!


Which EO would you add for weekly preventatives?

Thanks!


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## MellonFriend (Aug 8, 2017)

Here is a thread on EOs that might be of interest to you. It's very long, but very helpful. https://www.thegoatspot.net/threads/using-essential-oils-to-worm.188848/#post-2008853


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

I just skimmed through this whole thread! What interesting and helpful stuff! I did not know this was here. 
Question: if you give your milk goat raw garlic, do you find that the taste comes through the milk? I have a doe with a cough, and I'm thinking garlic could give her a boost, but I am leery of nasty garlic milk.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Some people say that the taste carries through, but most people say that it doesn’t!! You would have to try it yourself!!


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Some people say that the taste carries through, but most people say that it doesn't!! You would have to try it yourself!!


I guess I'll give it a shot on a day when I'll be the only one drinking the milk, in case it tastes bad.


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

So this is my first year of using herbal dewormer (I'm using Molly’s), and I've been doing frequent fecals to determine if it's effective or not. I started out having my vet do fecals, but this last time, I sent the samples off to Meadow Mist. I asked for a Baermann test on one doe, because she had been coughing a bit. I think I'll stick with Meadow Mist until I feel confident to start doing my own fecals, as her breakdown of the results is very helpful.
Anyway, the lung worm FEC is fairly low on the doe that got the Baermann, but her cough has actually gotten worse the past few days. She has 2 types of lung worm; Dictyocaulus & Muellerious. I got the fecal results last night, and this morning I started treating her with mullein leaf, oregano, and a dose of Molly’s weekly formula & tonic (the one that does NOT contain wormwood) morning and night. I do not have any fresh garlic, but I'll start using that when I get more tomorrow. I also gave her a little zinc this morning, since I know that is an immune booster.
Does anyone have further recommendations? I am trying to avoid using wormwood or any other strong herbs, since my sister- in-law, who is pregnant, is drinking the milk from this doe, and several young children are drinking it, as well. I will use something stronger if I have to, but I am hoping to avoid that. I am also not averse to using chemicals, I was just really hoping to avoid that.
Also, should I be concerned that coccidia levels are 'significant' in 2 of my goats? One of them is a pregnant doe, the other 1is a nearly 3 month old kid. They haven't really shown symptoms. I am assuming that maybe Molly’s isn't that effective against coccidia, and maybe I should either add something to it or switch to something else. Thoughts? Attached is a screenshot of the report from Meadow Mist.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Molly's is a terrible wormer in my opinion. It does not treat coccidia either. You may want to treat chemically for the coccidia - herbal wormers have a harder time fighting it - but Kochi Free and essential oils such as OnGuard from DoTerra work well in my opinion.

If you want to avoid wormwood, keep using Molly's and add fresh raw garlic and weekly essential oils. https://www.thegoatspot.net/threads/using-essential-oils-to-worm.188848/


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Molly's is a terrible wormer in my opinion. It does not treat coccidia either. You may want to treat chemically for the coccidia - herbal wormers have a harder time fighting it - but Kochi Free and essential oils such as OnGuard from DoTerra work well in my opinion.
> 
> If you want to avoid wormwood, keep using Molly's and add fresh raw garlic and weekly essential oils. https://www.thegoatspot.net/threads/using-essential-oils-to-worm.188848/


Thanks for responding! Have you ever treated lung worm? If so, what did you use? I'm going to go read through the thread on EO's, now.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

Only suspected lungworm, cleared up with Garlic, thyme - preferably garlic barrier for the concentrate.


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> Only suspected lungworm, cleared up with Garlic, thyme - preferably garlic barrier for the concentrate.


Thanks! I have thyme growing in my garden, so I'll add some of that. What is garlic barrier?


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

It’s a concentrate of garlic. Usually for garden management.

But to be extra cautious you could just treat them with Ivomec drench.


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> It's a concentrate of garlic. Usually for garden management.
> 
> But to be extra cautious you could just treat them with Ivomec drench.


I really appreciate your prompt responses! I will look into using Ivomec...my main concern is milk withdrawal times. I am thinking that if I don't notice improvement after a few days of using herbs, then I will turn to something else. The essential oils are a good thought. They are just so expensive! It feels like a big initial investment.


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

You probably won’t notice improvement after a few days of herbs - plus with lungworm, the scarring can last forever.

Ivomec’s milk withdrawal isn’t crazy.

Essential oils are a good investment - they last so LONG!!


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## Cedarwinds Farm (Dec 2, 2019)

NigerianDwarfOwner707 said:


> You probably won't notice improvement after a few days of herbs - plus with lungworm, the scarring can last forever.
> 
> Ivomec's milk withdrawal isn't crazy.
> 
> Essential oils are a good investment - they last so LONG!!


I am concerned about scarring, too, and will be running another fecal soon. Amazingly, her cough improved a lot after only a few days of dosing. I am wondering if there are environmental factors at play, too, since it rained a lot and there is a lot of mold growing right now. I really appreciate the input, and I'm continuing to look into my other options. I am considering going with Land of Havilah, since I corresponded with her, and with several other Master Herbalists, and they assured me that the amount of wormwood that would come through the milk should not be a problem. I will, of course, have to let everyone who's drinking the milk know, just to be safe. Has anyone else read studies/have experience with pregnant women or small children drinking milk from goats dosed with wormwood?


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## NigerianDwarfOwner707 (May 17, 2018)

I’ve seen garlic get rid of coughs in days, even when we don’t know the cause.

LOH is formulated to be a safe amount of wormwood - however, you can always just dose it after you milk, as it only stays in the system about 4 hours due to goats’ fast metabolisms.


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