# Would you breed him? (Nigerian Dwarf ppl please read)



## Thecowboysgirl (Aug 28, 2012)

Hi guys

I have a few NDs, some registered, some not. One of my bucks is unregistered. I bred him to one of my registered 20" does last year and she had twins by him, they turned out to be kinda strapping & big but she delivered them okay.

Same buck escaped and accidentally bred a 5 month old doeling who attemped to deliver his kid at 10 months. She had to go in for a C Section to save her, she did survive but the kid did not. It was a singleton the vet said weighed SIX pounds. (and I did not feed her grain while she was pregnant)

I have bought another, registered buck to use on the does I have now (th poor little C Section girl is the farm mascot now) but I LOVE the grade buck, he has some qualities that I just really want in my herd. He is not quite 2 yrs and stands 24" at the withers and is thick.

Question is: do I dare breed this buck to a bigger ND doe...or do I have to buy him a standard doe. Has anyone else had a 6# kid? I did not weigh the twins he had w/my other doe.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

Personally I don't see the point of breeding to an unregistered buck as the kids will never be able to be registered. At 24" he would be considered over height if registered. Most dont breed to over height bucks. 

If he is thick he may have some meat breed in him which is causing the larger kids. 

If you aren't looking to ever register or show then it doesn't matter who you breed your does to I guess. If your does are on the smaller size and more refined dairy types as Nigerian dwarfs should be then I would forgo breeding him to them. If you have a stockier doe then she should be able to handle the larger kids.


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## 8566 (Jul 18, 2012)

I'm with Stacey.
I'm not sure I understand why you want to use him?

What ever qualities you find in him, I'm sure you can find in a nice Nigerian buck. Especially since I think we're talking about structure and not what he does for the udders.

Like you said you can always get a standard size dairy goat to breed him too but that sounds ...... slightly difficult because he seems to break out of your fencing. So if you keep him, I would recommend reinforcing your fences so that he can't get to your Nigie girls.

HTH,


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## milkmaid (Sep 15, 2010)

I understand your liking the buck enough to breed him. The non-papered goats, being less selectively bred, tend to be on the healthier side anyway, and to me that's worth more than wads of paper.
As to whether to breed him to a ND doe...there is ALWAYS a risk when you breed a doe, no matter what the size the buck is. You just have to decide how big a risk it is reasonable to take.
Since he's a bit husky and overheight, I would probably breed him only to a husky and/or overheight doe. JMO.


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## Thecowboysgirl (Aug 28, 2012)

I want to use him because:

he is incredibly hardy-- lives on pasture only and he is sleek and muscular. 

He never needs to be dewormed (all of my goats live on pasture so this is important)

his temperament is outstanding--too much to list here. 

less importantly, he is polled

But he is exacty the kind of goat I want--we are homesteaders, don't show & never will. All I care about is milk for my family from animals who can take care of themselves (sort of). Many of the papered goats I have and have had were just wimpy! Too much inbreeding, I don't know?

Maybe there are lots of backyard folks with grades who aren't managing them so closely so weaker ones die from parasites an parasite resistant ones live on, unlike people w/ pedigreed animals worth 600 a pop who will go to great lengths to keep their animal healthy? (Note: these are just ponderings, and I am NOT passing judgement on anybody for anything!!)

The market for registered goats near me is not really there, so my registered kids won't probably sell for much if anything more than my grades. So for me, being a little over height or unregistered is not a big deal.

My only concern is the safety for the does, who can handle having kids by my superbuck. I love NDs and don't really want any other breed, but I love this buck more so if I have to get him one, I will.


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## Thecowboysgirl (Aug 28, 2012)

Somehow I seem to have lost the long response I just wrote here:

The reasons I kept him (and want his babies):

He is incredibly hardy, stays sleek and shiny on pasture with no help from me. He never needs to be dewormed. Has NEVER had less than "optimal" eye membrane color according to FAMACHA. He has never been less than just radiantly healthy. (just can't say the same for my registered goats)

His personality is just outstanding...he protects kids, is 100% a gentleman for me to do whatever I need to do (hoof clipping ect)

Less importantly, he is polled (still a big plus for me)

We are homesteaders first and foremost...the only reason I have papered goats at all was that I wanted to be sure I got enough good milk genetics in there that it is worth my while to milk these goats. We don't show...nd there is hardly a market for registered goats around here. I probably will not get much more for the papered kids than the grades.


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## Thecowboysgirl (Aug 28, 2012)

Re: Fence break incident, we were new at this when that happened-- hubby did not know how fast a buck would tag a girl and totally allowed it to happen.

We built the bucks a new pasture at the back of the farm with solid, new fencing & top and bottom hotwire. We never open the buck door when the does are out because sometimes the bucks will charge through.

We learned from our $400 mistake!!!


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## KW Farms (Jun 21, 2008)

A 2yo nigerian buck that stands 24" tall probably has something else in him. That is big and if you're already having kidding issues...I wouldn't continue using him. Being unregistered...who knows what is in his genetics. :shrug: If you have registered girls...then i'd definately move this buck along and bring in something better and registered. You can probably find something decently bred for not all that much. :thumb:


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

I think there are lots of healthy registered choices. I know personally I choose healthy goats over lookers. Even if you find a nice unregistered buck that is the right size, I would definitely go with that. Kidding issues are no fun, and strain the does.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I think the one thing we are overlooking here is that the big kid was a single. 

I lost a doe to an oversize kid and she was bred to a small buck with smaller size Nigerians in his background. The kid just simply got lots of nutrition since he was alone and got too big.

If this buck has the traits you are looking for, then there is reason to consider him and it is no guarantee that kids will be too big.


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## kelebek (Oct 5, 2007)

i could see keeping him ONLY if you are going to breed him to bigger girls - i.e. kiko's, boer crosses, ect. Reason being those are meat breeds that can handle the bigger kids. Sounds like your boy has something more in him. But again - what are your intentions ... pet, milk, meat, show - what are you looking for for YOUR farm? I can not see running a registered herd and trying to improve the breed, but breeding to an oversized, unregistered boy. But that is me. At two - he very well could still grow a bit more ;-)


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## milk and honey (Oct 31, 2010)

You might consider making some mini-manchas.. they are supposed to be lovely personality-wise, and good producers... I have NDs that are on the large side, and all are registered.. they have good milk capacity along with that big size too. I also know of some "big time breeders" whos NDs are just under the "standard" hight, and some go over.. but they have the WOW udders. I'd try him again with a large-ish ND doe, or maybe a la mancha???


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