# Gave the pneumonia vaccine booster



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

We once again used the Once PMH IN vaccine....48 goats and sheep in 22.5 minutes lol...we worked as a team...hubby and son did the 7 bucks while my daughters and I did the does..then we all finished up doing the sheep...

After fighting pneumonia in a few does and almost all the kids!! Im glad to have the vaccination done...fingers crossed it does its job!!


----------



## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I hope it works for you.


----------



## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Wow you must have been super organized to get it al done in 22.5 minutes, Im impressed!


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

it was kind of fun...we got all the sheep in one pen and does in another...the pens have a loading shoot attached....the bucks were in three other pens ..... I mixed the medication, then we started the timer, we drew up 7 syringes and my husband and son went to treat the boys...then as we gave each doe the medication..my other daughter kept the syringes coming..it worked like clock work..then the guys came back over our area and we did the sheep...one daughter kept the meds coming and the other and myself gave it as my son grabbed a sheep...we medicated and hubby pushed them out of the pen so we didn't treat the same one twice lol it was actually quite fun...our blood was pumping to get it done in time...once the meds are mixed you have 45 minutes to use it..so we are told...lol. I am so glad its done and Yes...I hope it helps!! we have seen enough illness for one season!!! A friend said big ranchers are loosing 30-40 goats a day up north where she lives...I cant imagine..two killers reported..worms and pneumonia..

I didnt have our fecal done today..the day got away from us..but I hope to have it done the next day or two...I need to see if our wormer is still effective..


----------



## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Cathy I just love it!
Nothing like a plan like that.
During blood draw here there were 3 of us. All tubes had name of animal.
One to hold one to draw & the other handling tubes.


----------



## goatblessings (Jan 6, 2015)

Cathy - I'm interested in finding out more about this vaccine. Could you tell me how it works and where I can get it?
thanks - always learn so much on the Forum!


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

you can order from Jeffers..we got ours from a local vet supply store in our area...it comes in two viles...one sterile fluid the other a powder...you mix them together activating the live culture..you then have 45 minutes ( per the info we received) to dose it...you draw up 2 cc and remove the needle, replace with nasal cannula...hold the goats head up...put the nasal connula up the nose and push vaccine up the nose...the pneumonia virus lives in the nasal so it makes sense to treat via the nose..you can do 1 cc up each nasal side or 2 cc up one side...with us doing so many we elected doing 2 cc up one side...last year we did 1 cc per side..
be sure to get the nasal cannulas...best to have one for each goat...


----------



## goatblessings (Jan 6, 2015)

Thank you so much for the info!!! What do you think of the Bovi-Sera injection versus this method? We had such a nasty wet year here I am trying to think ahead. We didn't lose any, but don't want to contend with the constant worry and monitoring and injecting if at all possible......


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Im not sure if one should be chosen over another..bovi sera is an immunity booster while the vaccine is just to prevent (i hope) pneumonia, and if Im correct only certain strains..since we have dealt with pneumonia last summer and again this summer, we elected to vaccinate. I have been thinking about getting Bovi sera just to give my goats a immune boost..This year has been the worse in my ten years! texas producers are loosing goats and sheep by the dozens!! its crazy...I want to do all I can to insure the health of my goats...


----------



## lottsagoats1 (Apr 12, 2014)

It's been a bad year all over the country. People who have never had health problems in their herds are having them now, me included. Weather? Chemicals? GMO's? I don't know but I wish it would stop!

Hope the vaccine works for you.


----------



## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

I just got my PMH IN in from Valley Vet yesterday! Plan on giving it to the entire herd for the first time next month. 

Anybody know if it is a one time initial vaccine or is there any boostering sequence for the first time use?


----------



## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

One time deal. That's what sold me on using it


----------



## milk and honey (Oct 31, 2010)

Interesting...also love the organized 'treatment line'! I sure wish I had others to help with my animals...


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

we had a few develop fevers after the vaccine...we gave b complex and banamine and held off antibiotics to see if it passed...it did. : ) Im not at home right now but hubby said everyones doing great. I am so ready for a break....we are in triple digits this weeks...hot hot hot...


----------



## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

Vaccines can be hard on the body sometimes, glad it passed! Hopefully the vaccine will help protect your herd, it's been a bad pneumonia year from what I've heard.


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Yes...we even had a few cases in our sheep..who were spared last summer...but all seems to be settling ..thankfully...


----------



## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

I wonder if they got a little sickly after you gave the vaccine because they were starting to be sick ????? I remember last year when this hit you, my herd was about a month behind you. I lost 3 about a week apart, every time the weather changed and after the third I gave the vaccine and (knocking on a big piece of wood right now) have yet to have a issue with any of them even after giving the vaccine.


----------



## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Glad it passed Cathy and they are well now !
Such a scare , especially when your not home !
Im contemplating about the vaccine myself..


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

That could be Jessica...would make sense...no one got ill last year when I gave it....


----------



## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Ohh I thought it was last year they had the die effect. Dang now you have me worried lol although I did buy a few goats from the time I did the first dose back In October, and instead of tossing 7 doses away I just went ahead and gave to the first 7 I did. I didn't notice a side effect but to be honest the second time around I wasn't really paying attention like the first time. 
When asked about vaccines I always said cdt for sure then if you have a issue with something then vaccinate for that. I'm not so sure I feel the same way any more. I think if I was asked again I would say for sure pneumonia. I didn't bring any new goats into the herd for 6 months when it hit me. There wasn't even a chance to save the ones I lost. They were totally fine, the one I gave loves to the night before she died and the buck was bouncing around playing with the others, by morning they were dead. As much as I am so very sorry with what happen with your goats happy bleats I'm happy you started your thread because I honestly would have been lost if it wasn't fresh in my head


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

That is just one more thing that makes this forum awesome...all though our happy times help, usually the hard ones help more, makes us alert ...honestly Gillian dieing so fast last summer( fine all day then dead in less then two hours) alerted me to a problem much faster then if she lived...I may have focused on her and lost the others...this summer we were ready...I get giggled at when others hear we pull our goats up to have a temp done twice daily and we walk and check everyone several times a day for any sign of illness...but I know no other way to stay on top of it...last year was so scary...

I just got back from my sisters, she was having some scary tests and so I wanted to be with her ( all turned our great)...and I tell you my hubby and kids are awesome...we had one little lamb fall ill and my 13 year old vet to be..caught it..she called me to make sure how to treat and she went to work on her...today is day four of treatment and she is doing great...everyone looked great...I even left a list of names and descriptions of all the goats for my husband to go out twice a day and do a head count!...lol..they worked like a team!! AND they figured out why our 2 gallon a day Saanen was only giving a cup or so...her adopted doe from last season is back to nursing mom!! oh yah..baby is penned up!!...its good to be home!!!


----------



## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Let them giggle, your goats are staying alive  and you know I read about silent pneumonia, now down and dirty reading but kinda looked over it before all this and it was said they basically die fast but Oh my goodness there is no stressing how fast that really is. Every morning I look out my window while having coffee and if anyone is laying out sun bathing my heart jumps in my throat and I open the window and yell at them lol husband gets annoyed but that's ok


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Yep..I agree...


----------



## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Oh i do too ! I nearly had a heart attack looking up at their pen and seeing a couple of them sprawled out in the sun like they were dead !
My feet couldnt move fast enough as i screamed at them ! They look up at me as if i had two heads and just lay back down , lol.
How dare they lay there so relaxed while my heart is in my throat !

I don't think any of us can say they didn't learn something or at least walk away with a better or deeper understanding of illness when a beloved pet , animal is lost. We've all been there done that , and we apply what we have learned to our present and future animals and that makes the lost ones spirit live forever IMO.


----------



## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Well, the good thing is we will learn if the nasal vaccine works well. For now I'm sticking with the tried and true that I know is reliable. Plus it contains the Blackleg vaccine that I must give anyway. Everyone's area is different though. Once we figure out what works well and where, we all can help more people.


----------



## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

I was going to use the 'tired but true' lol the only reason I didn't was it needed a booster and I needed something right then. I might change later on, I have to admit the 10 doses is a pain with my goats and the set up I have......not to mention my very large buck was not all that impressed having something shoved up his nose lol it too my husband and dad to hold him and me to give it, of course for a hour after I had to hear about the smell


----------



## goatblessings (Jan 6, 2015)

So I think I am going to try this out! Do you know if there is any danger in giving it to pregnant does? Trying to time everything to perfection :laugh: this year!


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

> Do you know if there is any danger in giving it to pregnant does?


safe for pregos..per info ...:greengrin:


----------



## goatblessings (Jan 6, 2015)

Thank you thank you thank you!!!!:hug:


----------



## Debra55 (Jul 14, 2015)

Can you tell me more about this silent pneumonia? I keep having coughing goats, it goes away for a couple days so I think Ive figured it out and then it comes back. I took temps and the only one that did have a temp was the only one not coughing!

Do you think vaccinating for pneumonia is a good idea even for those not having major problems with it? Are there any down sides?


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

This is our second summer fighting pneumonia...it was not near as bad as last year!!...I believe the vaccine helped reduce the cases (almost all our cases this season were our unvaccinated 2015 kids) the few who were vaccinated last year who got ill this year had a much milder case. I feel the vaccine (which goes up the nose, not the shot) was worth it since we were dealing with it..if your goats are coughing a lot...it could be allergies to lung worm and everything between. If they run fever or sub temp...I would treat with Nuflor ( and banamine in high temp cases) and vaccinate when everyone is well. If I had one or two cases I would just chalk it up to reg. Pneumonia..but several warrants vaccination IMO. To check for lung worm, collect fresh poo from everyone and wrap in a single layer of gauze,,,twist tight to close...and float in room temp water over night...if lung worms are an issue, you should see worms or larve floating in the water..Benadryl is good for allergies and easy enough to try a few days to see if it helps...I would of course rule out the more scary stuff like pneumonia and lung worm then if all is well treat for allergies ...

here is some info on Interstitial Pneumonia ( silent pneumonia)
http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/pneumonia06.html



> Interstitial pneumonia is the most common type to occur, quickest to kill, and often hardest to diagnose in goats. Death can occur in 12 hours or less. Example: At night the goat appears healthy, but in the morning it is down and dying. No runny nose and no fever -- just a goat that is off-feed, may or may not occasionally cough, and standing away from the herd because fluids are building up in the lungs (not sitting or laying down, unless it is already at death's door), but may not appear to be seriously ill. The only clear diagnostic symptom is high fever and it may not be present when you discover the sick goat. High fever peaks quickly and then body temperature rapidly drops below normal, possibly misleading you into diagnosing the problem as ruminal. Sub-normal body temperature is often a sign of ruminal problems. Body temperature under 100*F should be considered critical, regardless of the cause of the illness.
> 
> If high fever is present, it must be brought down quickly; fever-reducing medication and appropriate antibiotic therapy must be started immediately. If fever is not present but all other symptoms indicate pneumonia, antibiotic treatment is also essential. (This is an exception to the "no antibiotic usage if fever is not present" rule.) If the illness has progressed far enough, the goat will try to sit down, moan with discomfort, and immediately stand up --- because fluid has begun to accumulate in the lungs and abdomen and its kidneys are shutting down. A goat in this condition probably cannot be saved but you should try until efforts prove either successful or futile. A goat that wants to live can overcome amazing obstacles. However, once the lungs fill with fluid, survival is unlikely. If you cannot save it, do the right and humane thing and put the goat down to stop its suffering.


----------



## Debra55 (Jul 14, 2015)

Thanks for replying to my question. I am still dealing with what I am pretty sure is pneumonia coming back again and again. I have decided to go ahead and vaccinate the well ones and vaccinate the others once they are better. I have read that there can be bad side effects. One person said they needed banamin to pull their goats through. Is there a place to order that or is it prescription only? I want to be ready in case of bad reactions


----------



## Debra55 (Jul 14, 2015)

Also I don't think I have access to Nuflor only LA200 which I read in that link is not the best option. Any other suggestions?


----------



## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

If using the injectable then it needs to be given well over the ribs away from any legs. Otherwise it can make the closest leg very sore. The nasal doesn't have that side effect. There's no reason for a reaction to be so bad that you need a major painkiller.


----------



## Debra55 (Jul 14, 2015)

Oh ok the one from Jeffers I think is the nasal one


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

the once PMH *IN *is in nasal...you _CAN_ use the Once PMH *SQ* in nasal as well...but only in goats 3 months old and older...the IN can be 3 weeks and older....


----------



## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

The essential 2 plus P is injected.


----------



## Debra55 (Jul 14, 2015)

ok thanks y'all for answering all of my questions! Im sure I will be back with more lol


----------



## Debra55 (Jul 14, 2015)

All of the ones I am seeing online are the injectable version


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

http://www.jefferspet.com/products/once-pmh-in


----------



## Debra55 (Jul 14, 2015)

Thanks! not sure how I missed that one. They sell the injectable one too so I guess I must have just scrolled past it. Once everyone does not have a fever they are ok to give the vaccine to right?


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

yes..once they are well they can have it...once you mix the two viles you have to use it pretty quick...I believe we were told in 45 minutes since its a live vaccine...be sure they send the nasal inserts


----------



## Debra55 (Jul 14, 2015)

happybleats said:


> yes..once they are well they can have it...once you mix the two viles you have to use it pretty quick...I believe we were told in 45 minutes since its a live vaccine...be sure they send the nasal inserts


ok thank you will do . no snot, coughing or heavy breathing this morning so maybe we are getting somewhere


----------



## Treva Brodt (Jan 11, 2019)

Hopefully I can revive this thread, I can see that it is older. First I would like to know if you all that used the nasal vaccine are satisfied with the result/effectiveness. Secondly, I have miniatures and the pneumonia vaccines are mostly targeted toward cattle. Vaccines aren't necessarily weight specific but there is a huge difference between cattle of any age and a 35 pound miniature goat. Has anyone used the vaccine on the Nigi's or Pygmys? My kids from last year are all 8 months and older so, do you think it is safe? The help line at Jeffers isn't for vet med questions and off label medications also, it will be difficult for me to find a vet that is really good with goats. I am open to suggestions. From what I've read the dose for injection is the same nasal spray so, do you all think it is safe or at least do the benefits outweigh the risk? I had one case of pneumonia last year and I feel lucky to have saved the little fella. My anxiety/ability to overthink everything kicks into overdrive when fall hits Ohio. Warm one day and freezing rain the next. I know they can tolerate the cold but I worry about the drastic changes in temperature (as much as 30 degrees in 24 hours) and the wet. Thanks in advance for your help. This is only my second winter with goats and not too many health issues which I credit to the suggestions and shared knowledge I've gained from using this site.


----------



## SalteyLove (Jun 18, 2011)

I highly recommend Once PMH nasal vaccine and I think it will be perfectly safe for your miniature goats. I've given it to some fairly young Boers with no ill effect.


----------



## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

I am 100% satisfied with the once PMH IN. I can’t even tell you how many years I have been using it now but the only case I have had since using it was last year on a buck that I was super super late on giving his vaccine (bucks now get a injectable vaccine because it’s too hard for me to man handle them on my own) and then my sons wether which after I went back threw when kids got the vaccine I realized I some how totally missed him. So I am sold that it is really worth giving.
I agree with salteylove, I have also given it to young kids, some as small as 35# and they have been fine. I wouldn’t give time new borns or anything but I wouldn’t think weaning age nigis would be a issue


----------



## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Since its safe for kids (i think 3 week old) i think nigies are safe too. 2 cc (1 cc per nostril) is the dose regardless of size. It was very effective here.


----------



## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

I'm sold on ONCE IN. 2 ml per animal, no matter the size. I put the entire dose in one nostril, rather than half a dose in each nostril
There's a more recent thread about Pneumonia vaccines. I'll try to find it. If I do, I'll edit this post with the link
Here's one.
https://www.thegoatspot.net/threads/pneumonia-vaccine.201031/
Not the specific one I was thinking of, but good. If I find that specific one, I'll post it here again with another edit.
Finally found it
https://www.thegoatspot.net/threads/pneumonia-a-vaccination-to-consider.201593/


----------



## Treva Brodt (Jan 11, 2019)

Just another quick question. I've paid for express shipping for other vaccines but since the PMH IN comes unmixed with the dilutent separate are extreme temperatures an issue?


----------



## goatblessings (Jan 6, 2015)

No not an issue. You mix a saline type solution with dry vaccine, so not needed to be cold/overnighted.


----------



## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

(thumbup)


----------

