# What does all this gibberish mean on my bucks pedigree??



## KLSpoultry (Dec 14, 2008)

Just got my first pair of Nubians papers in the mail. My bucks papers came with the free pedigree, now my question is, what does all this mean??? :scratch: 

Examples: ETA, PTA, D/AV, DHIR, DIM, MILK, DCR

Also his grandma on his sire's side has this after her name: 1*MSGCH PTI 88 72

and what does it mean when they have negative numbers??

his sire has a *B by his name as well, what does that mean?

I feel so silly asking because I'm sure they'll end up meaning something obvious. :doh:


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## liz (Oct 5, 2007)

Not sure what they all mean, but the * are for milk production

With all of those letters, numbers and symbols I'd say you got yourself a heck of a boy!


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## Thanatos (Mar 16, 2009)

My guess for grandma is 1 star milker senior grand champ. not sure about the PTI, but the numbers look to be linear scores.


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## goathappy (Oct 5, 2007)

ETA: Expected Transmitting Ability, that is figured through milk, appraisal and show records, I'm not exactly sure how it is figured
PTA and PTI: I think its like ETA I can't remember what hte P stands for :doh: These are not appraisal scores, appraisal scores are different. An appraisal score on a pedigree looks something like this: 3-05 90 VEVE for a doe, and three letters on the end for a buck.
D/AV: never seen taht
DHIR: Dairy Herd Improvement Registry, aka official milk tests
DIM: Days in Milk aka how many days the doe was in milk for that lactation before her lactation was ended, most go to 305
SGCH: Superior Grand Champion, a doe who has her SGCH means that she has received her Superior Genetics designation(SG) while she was a GCH or a CH, if they are not a GCH or a CH then SG just comes up in front of their name. SG animals are in the top 15% of their breed in the country, and SG is figured through show, milk and LA scores.
1*M: Means that the doe earned her milk star either through 1-day test or from a full lactation on DHI testing. 1*M means first generation star milker, 2*M means 2nd generation star milk etc etc.
*B: Like *M but for bucks, it tells you that a buck comes from a milking background that was on official test and his ancestors have earned their ratings. Bucks get their *B status if 
1) the dam of the buck has her *M status and the sire of buck has his *B
2) the dam of the buck has her *M and the sire's dam has her *M
3) the dam has her *M and the sire of the buck has a +B status.
+B means that a buck has three milking daughters from different dams who have earned their *M's on test, or a buck can earn a + if he has two sons from two different dams that have earned a +. If a buck has had both daughters and sons that have earned those ratings, then he gets two ++
CH: a doe or a buck who has earned her permanent championship through showing
GCH: a doe who has earned her permanent championship plus earned her milk star is a GCH, a buck gets his GCH if he earns a plus after becoming a permanent CH.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

wow Sarah....that is alot of info......no wonder KLSpoultry....couldn't make heads or tails out of it.......they sure have alot of different abbreviations for the dairy breed.... great job.... :wink: :greengrin: :thumbup:


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## goathappy (Oct 5, 2007)

Thanks Pam  I'm sometimes jealous of meat goat breeders, you guys don't seem to have half the terms to memorize that we do :lol:


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

> Thanks Pam  I'm sometimes jealous of meat goat breeders, you guys don't seem to have half the terms to memorize that we do :lol:


..hehe....sarah ....your welcome....that is so true.. :wink: :ROFL: ...I wish it could be easier for you , but it is good to know ...all the specs on them......... :wink: :greengrin:


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Maybe you dairy folks are just plumb smarter than the average meat goat producer? :shrug: So long as my one Nubian gives a little milk half the year Im happy. Count me on the meat side.
Goathappy thanks, that was really interesting! I had not a clue!


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## goathappy (Oct 5, 2007)

Its not that we're smarter, we just have a lot more stuff to deal with if we choose to breed consistent animals(thats the best I can put it) I'm sure there's a lot of boer people that know a ton of stuff about genetics and such that I have absolutely no clue on whatsoever.

Glad you learned something


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

I was mainly poking fun at us meat people :wink: But I am going to find me a halfway decent Nubian buck for her this year. If Im going out there to milk twice a day she needs better udder structure, I think she has whats called pockets? in the front? 
Now how come that should be avoided? Im not interested in showing the Nubies but would like to see better udders.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

> Its not that we're smarter, we just have a lot more stuff to deal with if we choose to breed consistent animals(thats the best I can put it) I'm sure there's a lot of boer people that know a ton of stuff about genetics and such that I have absolutely no clue on whatsoever.
> 
> Glad you learned something


 thanks sarah..... :hug: :thumbup:


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## KLSpoultry (Dec 14, 2008)

Thanks so much GoatHappy!!

I guess my boy does have a GREAT pedigree! Glad he's going to be my herdsire. I can only hope my doe has an equally great pedigree.

:stars:


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## goathappy (Oct 5, 2007)

nancy d said:


> If Im going out there to milk twice a day she needs better udder structure, I think she has whats called pockets? in the front?
> Now how come that should be avoided? Im not interested in showing the Nubies but would like to see better udders.


Sorry, I was busy last week I had forgotten you had asked about this 

Pockets are generally looked upon as bad because when you have a pocket, 1) you are losing udder capacity, 2) it can make the front attachments weaker especially if she is a heavy milker and 3) it makes the udder look unbalanced. Ideally, the udder should be split into thirds when looking at it from the side, a third sticking out the back of the leg, a third behind the leg and a third sticking out in front of the leg.


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Thanks Goathappy! And no problem for the long awaited answer...we all get busy at times :wink: 
I dont know what the heck im looking at..her udder is fairly divided in 3rds where you see half on each sideview so I guess Im not clear on the pockets thing...assumed it was split in the front btween the two halves. :shrug:


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## goathappy (Oct 5, 2007)

Here is an example of a smooth foreudder, notice how the foreudder blends smoothly into the belly(she does have a wee bit of a pocket though)









Also, when feeling inbetween the halves, you can tell a goat that blends smoothly and one that doesn't. Its hard to explain, but goats with pockets when you feel the foreudder you feel into the 'divot' of the pocket first before your hands starts to run along the doe's belly. When you feel between the halves on a goat with a smooth foreudder, you hand runs from udder to belly. Does that make sense?

Muriel does have a smooth foreudder for the most part, here is a front pic of her udder









Molly, on the other hand has a very abrupt foreudder and a pocket









Idk if you can see, but she has quite a pocket









Hazel has a smooth foreudder









And Gabby basically lacks a foreudder


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## goathappy (Oct 5, 2007)

Here is another example, this is a first freshening yearling Oberhasli, when we started milking her she was always very engorged with milk and it caused the front of her foreudder to have like a 'shelf' all along the front.










You can see the gap in the front. We milked her through due to the fact that she couldn't keep her condition but since milking her through she now has the smoothest foreudder of my Obes


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Goathappy thanks so much for posting these with explanation! It now makes sense! I will now see my Nubians udder with little more knowledge! Yep, she does have a pocket & before now I was just guessing what that meant.


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