# New to goats, help please



## NikkiS (Apr 18, 2015)

Hello. My husband and I purchased very pregnant does. This I believe was quite the mistake? They had their babies, and we have had nothing but trouble. The first doe had a single, and had no milk for him. Now she is so sick, has diarrhea, won't eat, and generally looks really awful  Second doe had twins. First was stillborn, second was tiny but alive. I believe premature, teeth are still in the gums? I took in a fecal sample from the sick momma, they said overloaded with worms. After worming her 5 days ago, no progress and is skin and bones. Any advice would be extremely appreciated.


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## NikkiS (Apr 18, 2015)

I should mention they are both first time fresheners. I have only had them a month and a half. Vet said to worm second doe after she has her baby, which was Thursday.


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## Superdave (Apr 3, 2015)

I'm new here too but you might wanna have a vet come out and give them a once over. I just started raising 11 of them myself and the first thing I did was worm them. Especially during the warm months ahead. I have heard to alternate the worm meds so they won't build an immunity to them. I have also been giving mine a medicated pellet mix, not a lot but to help them stay healthier and don't feed them a lot of grain. Hay is good,weeds etc. 
can't give you much advice on the babies but I do know if you administer worming meds at the right time it helps by coming through the colostrum of mom. If mom has no milk you better get them on the bottle quick. Read your med bottle to see how often you can administer worming so you can help mom perk up. I also give mine an all around feel good squirt of vitamins in the syringe from tractor supply. Orally. Adjust for weight on the pushing part of the syringe. It's sold back there where the worm meds are. 
I usually give them this when I see one isolate themselves from the herd. I can't be much help but what I do for mine seems to work. Hit me up and let me know how it's going.


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## NikkiS (Apr 18, 2015)

Thank you so much. The vet gave me a strong dewormer, not allowed to give while pregnant. I bought probiotic paste, have given her 5 ml about 3 timed. Should I give the second doe probiotics as well? First does (Dolly) baby has taken to bottle quite well. I have been using a mix of whole milk, buttermilk and evaporated milk. My problem is I have read so much about goat care, but have no experience. No one I know personally knows anything about goats . Very thankful for this forum.


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## Superdave (Apr 3, 2015)

I think the baby should be fine. Keep a watch that the milk doesn't give upset her tummy or give her the scours. I think kids ween off around 5weeks. Don't quote me on that but check it out instead. Is mom eating anything? If not try a little hay or some feed. Not grain but pellets. I would worm baby as soon as vet says too. I have mine on a schedule and don't want them to get worms so I stick to it. It wouldn't hurt giving the other doe some pro biotics. I give it to mine when ever they are acting weird or puny. Kinda like a B12 shot. They don't seem to mind it. Hope all goes well and they get better.


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## NikkiS (Apr 18, 2015)

Thanks again superdave. Sick mom is still not eating, looking into coccidia as a possibility. I will go down right now and give Fora probiotics. Thank you.


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

SuperDave goats do not need to be wormed on a regular basis. It is also recommended to stick to one class of wormers at a time until they don't work.
Changing up & under dosing are the major contributors to resistance.

Nikki the formula you are using is perfect if goat milk not available!
Was it Valbazen he gave you?
As for the probiotics she can have that often as long as you think she needs it. In otherwords it cannot be overdosed
Did you happen to get a cocci check with the fecal?
Being the girls were new to your place they most likely got all stressed out, so that whatever normal worm load they were carrying just went crazy.
Are they getting good loose minerals with lots of copper?
Are they getting grain? I would withhold that until diarea clears up.


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## NikkiS (Apr 18, 2015)




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## NikkiS (Apr 18, 2015)

Hi Nancy. Vet gave me Cydectin sheep drench. They called me very quickly, and have read that coccidia takes longer to see the eggs go to the top. Vet said there were so many worms, they could not even count


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## NikkiS (Apr 18, 2015)

I am in southern oregon, the vet I call/bring in samples normally deals with cats, dogs, horses and cattle. I can't seem to find anyone knowledgeable with goats


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Sounds like you have a good vet you are fortunate. Cute baby! You'll get Mama in shape but it's going to take a little time.


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## NikkiS (Apr 18, 2015)

Ok, thank you very much! Maybe I worry too much lol. Dolly is just so skinny and won't eat, I feel so bad  I wish there was a magic cure to just make them feel better


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## nigies4ever (Sep 19, 2012)

Fyi...there are lots of goat experts on here that are in southern Oregon and north CA, if that helps at all. I've often found that The Goat Spot is better than most vets.  

By the way, Cydectin won't treat coccidia if that's the issue. You'd need Corid, or another wormer specifically for coccidia.


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Nikki do you have Fortified B Complex on hand? From feed store. That will help her appetite.


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## Superdave (Apr 3, 2015)

That's why I always recommend vet orders first. I have only used one type of wormer thus far and have been told by a vet to get on a worming program. I do not under dose my goats and I also keep a ck on their eyes before administering wormer. I have two types of wormer. I was told to alternate. You kinda have to apply what best fits your situation. Always consult a vet is the best advice I will give anyone.


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## NikkiS (Apr 18, 2015)

That is great to hear! I found this goat forum, was so hoping to get knowledge from goat owners  Nancy, I have kept loose minerals out for them, but seems like they just don't eat it. I think I will try a block? I have also just been feeding alfalfa, and grain while pregnant. After kidding, stopped the grain. When I moved them here, there is abundant poison oak and weeds to eat. Not sure if that could have messed anything up. Where I bought them, they were eating alfalfa, and were in a muddy paddock.


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Browsing shouldn't have messed anything up Im sure it was worm load brought on by stress of moving.
They really should have free access to alfalfa though. 

Dave I only worm usually once a year right after kidding & another round 10 days later, but then again mine are dry lotted (if you can call it that here in the rainy Pac NW) 
Hay is fed up off the ground. 
Im not saying it's the only right way, but from the info received from Dr Pugh seminar changing up wormers or worming on a schedule leads to resistance.
The only crisis Ive ever had was when I took her first two boys away. This doe's cocci level was through the roof. 

As for minerals I have found they wont eat it if it's left out for more than a couple of days. Or maybe try a different brand? By the way, blocks don't work well for goats.


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## Superdave (Apr 3, 2015)

I'm located in Ga. Rain has been here for the last month. We've had 5" this month so far. I have a card that is shaded with the different eye colors pertaining to worms. The pinker the eye the healthier,the grayish white the eye the more they lean to having worms. This is not fool proof just a tool to help lead you into watching for them. You pull the btm. part of the eye lid down and hold the card near it to match eyelid tone. Worms here are real and plentiful. Have had some friends loose half their herd due to under treatment. We also have more than one type of worm prevalent here that's why I recommended different meds. Some wormers don't get certain worms from what I've been told. I really hate medicating my goats. I like mine healthy and don't like putting stuff in them except natural stuff like weeds and hay and grass. But I gotta keep them healthy.


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## Tapestry (Feb 5, 2015)

That's the FAMACHA scale and it is good as far as it goes, but not all worms lead to anemia, so it's important to also have a fecal run. Also, wormers should always be repeated to make sure you kill any worms that were not at the right stage of development the first time around. If your goat is anemic, then giving B complex, Red Cell or another iron supplement, a good variety of browse, in addition to probiotics and the right wormer for the type of worms present, will all help with recovery.

I wouldn't take away feed because the goat has given birth, calorie requirements are higher when they are producing milk. Cutting feed is a good way to encourage them to dry up if the kid doesn't survive, but she may still need some extra to help her recover. Of course, if she isn't wanting to eat, that is all moot.

To get her eating again, you need to continue the probiotics until she is fully recovered. You could get her a dark beer and open it to let it go flat and the drench her with it. That helps kick start the rumen. Offer a variety of browse and alfalfa. You may need to make a slurry of alfalfa pellets and water to drench her with.

Good luck!


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## NikkiS (Apr 18, 2015)

Ok, thank you all so much! I am supposed to bring in a fecal sample again in a couple of days. I am just very worried she won't make it that long. You have all been very helpful, I should have registered here earlier. Thanks again.


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## NikkiS (Apr 18, 2015)

Just an update! Started giving Dolly sulmet the day after this post started. She is now doing great! Eating, diarrhea is gone, and seems very happy. So that and the probiotics fixed her right up


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Glad she is bettet.


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

:applaud: Bravo!


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