# Failure to progress



## winky (Jun 19, 2011)

I have a Nigerian dwarf doe who was bred when I bought her in December and I don't have a breed date. She started building her udder about 6 weeks ago. The night before last she spent the entire night standing and pacing. Yesterday her ligs were completely gone and she didn't want to go with the other goats out to the pasture. She has been laying down, grunting and grinding her teeth. She hasn't touched her food since yesterday afternoon. She doesn't have a discharge, hasn't been pushing and it doesn't look like her belly has dropped. I checked for urine keytones and it was negative. I gave her some nutridrench last night and this morning. She has had plenty of Alfalfa during this gestation so calcium levels should be fine. She's decent sized doe and this is her second freshening, she lost the kids early in her first pregnancy and the previous owner didn't have any explanation for that. She was bred to a smaller Nigerian buck. Last night she was dilated about 2 cm. This morning I went in thinking there might be a dead kid n there. She's dilated enough for me to get my entire hand in but I don't feel any kids in the birth canal. Something just isn't right. I went in up to my wrist and still can't feel any kids. I've treated her with antibiotics and gave her a thiamine injection today. She had her BoSE shot about 2 weeks ago. Any thoughts? I'm about ready to call the vet but don't really want to if I can avoid it. This isn't my first kidding but it's my first Nigerian kidding.


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

have you tried bouncing her to feel for a kid?


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

If there is any question, I would just call the vet.


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## winky (Jun 19, 2011)

Called the vet, she said bring her so she can fish dead kids out. I think I'll give it one more shot myself first.


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## canthavejust1 (Oct 12, 2012)

Geez...not very good bedside manner for a doctor...even an animal doctor


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## milk and honey (Oct 31, 2010)

I would try again myself too... Sounds like she may just not be the "breeding type"... Good luck! 
I pulled two kids from a FF doe that were far in .. similar situation... anyway, they came out fine. Was never sure why they had not gone into the birth canal... maybe they were both trying at the same time????


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## winky (Jun 19, 2011)

Went in again myself and still no kids that I can feel close enough to grab, I felt a tiny hoof way deep that I could barely touch with my fingertips. I've pulled several kids but they were all right there. It just doesn't feel right going in up to my elbows for some reason. I'm going with my gut and taking her in. I'll let you know what happens. And yes, I know there are kids because I can feel them externally. Unfortunately, all my goat vets have either retired, gone on maternity leave or left the state all in the last 2 months so this is a new vet and I don't know much about her goat skills. I wonder if she's just not ready but then again I don't think this is just prelabor... she looks really dumpy and painful and not doing any of the typical prelabor stuff. I'm so conflicted. On one hand I think I should just wait and see but on the other hand I don't want to sit by if the kids are dead and watch her get septic. I guess I have to err on the side of caution.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Glad you are taking her in. Sounds like the best thing to do. I hope things turn out well and you have live kids.


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## winky (Jun 19, 2011)

Well, I took her to an actual goat vet that a friend recommended. Ultrasound showed at least one healthy fetal heart rate (we couldn't count how many or even get an idea of gestational age). She said she wasn't fully dilated which was strange because she had dilated enough for me to get in there up to my wrist. Her calcium level was a tad on the low side, keytones were negative. She does have a chronic cough which has been unresponsive to antibiotic and dewormer treatments and this cough could be progressing into an actual pneumonia so I got some NuFlor for that. She offered to do a C-section but advised that it would be OK to take her home and give her two days to deliver naturally. She assured me that there is no evidence of a dead kid. So, I'll continue the calcium drench, nutradrench, vitamin b complex, NuFlor and banamine and see what she does. I'll rest easier tonight knowing that she isn't sitting out there in the barn with a dead kid in her uterus.


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## winky (Jun 19, 2011)

This is the strangest labor ever... now she's vocalizing a lot, getting up and down, can't get comfortable, burping and grunting. I'm not feeling any contractions, she's not pushing and she still doesn't have any kind of discharge. The kids still haven't dropped. She's posty, has that super sloped top line look and ligs have been gone for a day and a half now. It's going to a very long night.


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## Tenacross (May 26, 2011)

Reach in as far as you have to and pull the kid(s) out. I've waited and wished I hadn't.


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## FlyingFeetsFarm (Nov 28, 2012)

I agree with Tenacross, you need to get those kids out now. If you can get your hand in her she is dilated enough. I have lost several kids and one doe from "letting nature take its course". Just have someone hold her and go in as far as you need, if you can just get the head only that's good enough, I have delivered a lot of kids head only.


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## winky (Jun 19, 2011)

*Very tragic end*

Tragically, She died minutes after I sent the last post. It was very sudden. I watched her lie down, pull her head over her back and she just stopped breathing. Possibly an embolism. I tried to revive her but she was gone. I grabbed a scalpel and got the kids out but I could not revive them either. Then I went in vaginally to see if there was another kid in the birth canal and discovered that there was just a dead end... no access to the uterus at all. Not like ring womb, more like a deformity of some kind. I called the vet back and she couldn't explain it either. How can a doe get pregnant if she has such a deformity? I wonder if she had uterine torsion? I'm going to do my own gross necropsy tomorrow, just too sad, angry and exhausted to do it tonight. Has anyone every experienced anything like this?


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## milk and honey (Oct 31, 2010)

I'm so sorry...what a tragic ending.


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## fezz09 (Oct 30, 2012)

;'-(. So sorry


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## FlyingFeetsFarm (Nov 28, 2012)

I am so sorry  sending hugs your way. I have never had anything like that happen, I have only had kids that were too big to fit through the birth canal.


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## winky (Jun 19, 2011)

I checked her out really well the next morning and it wasn't uterine torsion. There was a wall of tissue between the uterus and the cervix, no trauma to the cervix or uterus and no bleeding. Got ahold of my reportedly retired vet and she said the doe likely got an infection after she was bred and scar tissue caused the occlusion. I'm hoping the buck didn't cause the infection because I used him on several does.


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## keren (Oct 26, 2008)

Hi Winky, I've had a similar thing found on necropsy, my thought is the scar tissue is more likely caused by a small uterine tear from previous deliveries as opposed to an infection. 

Really sorry to hear how wrong it all went


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## winky (Jun 19, 2011)

Thanks Karen. I hope you're right. I would hate to think i exposed my does to this. I font know of ant testing that should be done on bucks other than the usual CL/CAE. Is there an STD panel? The vet I spoke to has 30 years experience with goats and has a grade A dairy. She felt a massive infection shortly would be the likely explanation. I know this doe had aborted in her first pregnancy so maybe she had an infection from that or maybe uterine trauma. My take home lesson may be extreme but I will not buy any doe who has a history of abortion no matter what. It's just not worth the risk.


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