# Jersey cow overdosed on rompun



## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

I have been sooooo upset since yesterday afternoon and without much sleep. We had a farrier come out yesterday to trim one of our jerseys hooves. She has a small calf in tote and was having a hard time standing, that's when we noticed her hooves. Since she is pretty much " wild" and stays with a herd of about 60, we decided to have the farrier come out. The farrier asked us to call the vet and ask for a sedative , that it would be easier for both him and the cow. I did. The vet dropped it off in our mailbox And instructed on how
Much to use. When the farrier came, he asked for the sedative and said he would go ahead and get started. I watched him draw it up and noticed her drew up 2 cc's. I said " isn't that a bit
Much? The vet said 1cc was enough." The farrier said " I've been doing this for 30 years and this is what I always do." I trusted he did since I had no idea about it. Besides, he's the farrier for the vets horses! He then explained that 1cc would make her drowsy and that he was going to give her 3 cc's to knock her out. I told him again what the vet said. He reminded me AGAIN that he has been doing this for 30 years and ain't never had a problem yet. I let him and Mr. Peter go on while I went and took care of my goats. 
After the hoof cutting, I had him do one of my goats(Natalie) and he told me that the cow should be up and going in a couple hours. (I'm crying right now).
I waited for her. I watched her calf waiting for her. She won't get up. I did everything I could to get her up then finally she did. I watched her get up and drink some water out of the tub and thought she was fine. I went home. 
The next morning, she was down. Her head was laying up against the fence and she was foaming at the mouth. Her calf was hiding in the bushes. I knew I had to do something fast BUT WHAT????? When I spoke loudly she responded with a drunk look and her breathing was fast and heavy . I gave her fresh water , sprayed her down with the hose and she seemed to respond good. I went and got a tube of jump start and called the vet. The vet asked how much did the farrier give her and when I told him he said the farrier gave her triple the dose of what she should of had. I felt this was all my fault!! I should of never listened to that farrier and made him, no, forced him to listen to what the vet said initially!! The vet told me I had to come up and get the iv medication that would reverse the rompun in her system or she will die. I looked at that calf and ran as fast as I could, got in my car and went. 
When I got up there, I explained what happened and the vet hoped for the best. I never in my life gave meds iv to a cow!!!! The vet couldn't do it , no other vet was available, I called everyone I knew to see if ANYONE could help me! I googled videos while I walked to her pen because I had no help and I had to do this. She was groggy enough that I could so I did. I got her in the neck vein with the medication and hoped for something. I waited. Every hour I was with her, watching for some improvement. I kept giving her water, hay, spraying her down with the hose to keep her cool. She was able to hold her head up. That's good. Maybe she will stand. I cried. I lost it. I screamed and poked her to get up. She tried, she really did. Mr. Peter came by that time and told me she was going to be alright just give her time. In the meantime I called the vet and told
Him the response from the medicine and he said it may take a few hours since it was a large dose and she has been down since yesterday BUT that's not saying she will make it. 
I want to call that farrier and cuss him bad!!!!! He does everyone's livestock Around here. That's how I got his name. I finally text him. I kept it simple. I didn't want to get rude right away so I simply said " hey, our cow is still down and hasn't gotten up since yesterday. Any chance the doseage of 3cc's was too much that you used? Maybe the 1cc was enough as I suggested?"
He said " I'm sorry, that's never happened before. I don't know what could of happened."
Advice? I haven't said anything thus far to him and I am beating myself up terribly as it is. I should of taken control and never let him do that!!!! I should have familiarized myself with rompun better and insisted he only use 1cc. I can't stop crying


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Oh sunshine I'm so sorry  I've been in your shoes with one of my goats. I was warned and even told the jerk the risk but he knew better and she died. EVERY chance I get I tell my story of my poor Nanny to everyone around here. 
I no longer care if I sound like a royal female dog I voice my thoughts when it comes to my animals. But I was like you and figured he should have known what he was doing even though my gut was screaming no.
But as for your poor girl I would think (not for sure) but would think if she was going to die she would have by now. Make sure she is getting plenty of water. I think water and feed should help flush that crap out....I hope. If you need to roll her from side to side to keep the blood flow going to her legs. I hate down cows almost impossible to get them up. 
Really all I can do is wish you the best of luck and say I'm so very sorry


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I'm so sorry. It is hard when someone should have known better. It isn't your fault. I hope she gets better for you.


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## goatygirl (Feb 16, 2013)

Have you taken her temp what color is the foam? Is her calf drinking i would probably bottle feed it till that med pass but keep her awake is she conscious or like a dead sort of awake?


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

No I haven't taken her temp rectally but it's been hot here and she is outside. Her body is hot so I kept hosing her with cool water. Foam is white in color, tongue pale. She is nibbling on hay and drinking water. Won't touch grain.


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## goatygirl (Feb 16, 2013)

Take her temp the outside weather will not affect her insides and it is vital for the vet to know. Could you find a way to cover her in tarps like make a canopy above her to keep the sun off her.


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## J.O.Y. Farm (Jan 10, 2012)

Oh I'm so so sorry..  :hug: it's not your fault.. Though I know I would be feeling the same as you if it were me.. :/ I hope she gets better for you.. :hug:


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## J.O.Y. Farm (Jan 10, 2012)

goatygirl said:


> Take her temp the outside weather will not affect her insides and it is vital for the vet to know. Could you find a way to cover her in tarps like make a canopy above her to keep the sun off her.


The outside weather will affect her temp.. Esp. of she has been in the sun.


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## nannysrus (Jun 21, 2014)

When did you give the reversal drug? (What time)

Did he give the rompun IV or IM?


Samantha

"5 minutes of fresh air is equivalent to 5 mg Valium"


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## nannysrus (Jun 21, 2014)

Rompun is .25-.75 ml in cattle given IM and 1/3-1/2 the does given IV.

If given IM it takes longer to wear off and the reversal drug takes longer. 

Cattle can suffer from hypothermia (even in hot weather), salivation, and potentional shock. Ruminants if very sensitive to rompun. 

Milk withdraw is generally 24-48 hours. If the calf is still nursing he may potentially get droggy

Samantha

"5 minutes of fresh air is equivalent to 5 mg Valium"


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

Thanks all. The rompun he gave was given IM. I gave the reversal drugs at noon today, IV. The vet said she pretty much would have a 50/50 chance at this point.
I put tarp above her and uses some poles to hold it up to give her shade. I wish I could of gotten a fan down there. I got some help to move her to the barn tomorrow if she makes it. Bottle feeding the calf now with another mothers milk.


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## nannysrus (Jun 21, 2014)

Poor thing. I have seen this happen before sadly. :-( the guy lost 11 of the 25 cattle that day. All the cattle were getting sedated for the same reason. 

Time is all you can give her. The only other thing I know to do to get an animal out of sedation is a sudden adrenaline rush. 


Samantha

"5 minutes of fresh air is equivalent to 5 mg Valium"


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

OH Wendy, Im so sorry...dont beat yourself up...you trusted this man from his experiance...I would have done the same..most of us would....you have done amazing for her...the cool baths..a make shift shelter...the reversal meds...You have done all you can..I will add to say a prayer over her...care for her baby until she can...
((HUGS))


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Cows can indeed get Hypothermia, all living things can. Keep her cool if possible. Keep her calf with her to keep her interested in living. Do check her core temperature rectally to see if she needs more cooling.


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## nannysrus (Jun 21, 2014)

That was suppose to say can not cant that's why I put even in hot weather in parentheses - sorry about that 

Rompun "can" cause hypothermia because it is a 3-way drug (muscle relaxant, sedative, and analgesic)


Samantha

"5 minutes of fresh air is equivalent to 5 mg Valium"


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Okay and I will clarify that keeping an eye on her core temp will tell you if she is hypothermic or hyperthermic. then you can adjust as necessary from applying warm to cool.


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## cheyenne (Aug 21, 2011)

I'm so sorry you had to go through this alone.... I hope she's gonna be ok :worried: Just keep telling her she'll be ok to make her and YOU believe it! Remember the power of positive thinking!


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

goathiker said:


> Cows can indeed get Hypothermia, all living things can. Keep her cool if possible. Keep her calf with her to keep her interested in living. Do check her core temperature rectally to see if she needs more cooling.


100% agree with the calf. The fight to live for her baby is a amazing thing.

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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

If you can, roll her up on her chest- don't let her lie on her side. Use hay bales, etc. to keep her propped up.
That will help her breathe better. Sending good thoughts your way. And, you are by no means responsible. 
It was a very unfortunate thing that happened. Even experienced people mess up sometimes. (Look at doctors!).


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## goatygirl (Feb 16, 2013)

Make sure she is breathing good any change in her breathing should be closely watched. Has she chewed her cud recently. Listen to her stomach make sure you notice any changes.


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

Long day today. She is still down. I called vet and he said if she's not up by tomorrow that he will come out tomorrow afternoon but that's the soonest he can get to her. She's moving better today and is eating grain. We kept rolling her side to side, making sure she was on her sternum. I haltered her calf and brought her over. Mama really was trying to get up but just won't. I have four guys coming soon to put mama in straps to move her under the big john deer canopy I got her today. Maybe she will get up. Praying.


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## goatygirl (Feb 16, 2013)

Well best of luck to you. Looks like you will have a long day.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

When they get there with the straps keep her up as long as you can where her feet are touching the ground. That will get blood moving and help her when she's ready to get up. 


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

How's she doing?


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

The thing that doesn't make sense is the foam. Are you 100% sure you have your bases covered? No possibility of poison ?


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

Truthfully, I'm almost thinking anaphylaxis...ask your vet his opinion. I've seen this many times before. The foam literally does not make sense from an "OD". She wouldn't have exhibited the symptoms you've described. Increased heart rate, tremors, breathing instability, inability to stand, all signs of anaphylaxis. I totally would recommend Epinephrine (1/100) subQ at a dose of 1cc per 100 lb. of body weight right now. It's not gonna hurt her is she's not having a reaction, but at least the base would be covered and potentially stop a death from anaphylaxis.


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

Vet came out.. 300.00 later, he gave her calcium , glucose, steroids, banamine, b12, and thiamine. 
I asked him about the symptoms and the rompun dose that was given to her, as aster of fact, I asked ATLEAST 20 questions because of how this happened.
He said she could have had a reaction to the rompun but as far as it being an overdose he doesn't think so. Now, in my mind , the initial vet said she was given triple the dose that she should have been given... Now I'm confused. 3 cc of rompun is too much or isn't it? Opinions? 
After the vet checked her out, he said she is probably still down due to neuropathy and since it's been in the 90's here, the heat doesn't help either. Even though we took the steps necessary to keep her as cool as possible, the heat is still a battle in Mississippi. I almost bought a huge fan and twenty extension cords to reach to her but the vet bills are costing me too much at this point. 
Mr. Peter has had downed cows before, I have witnessed it three times myself. Give it time and they will get up. I'm going to keep that in my head for her too. 
As far as the foaming at the mouth, never really got a clear answer on that. Maybe side effect from rompun? Heat? The vet said the rompun, being given im, stayed in her system longer then it would if farrier gave it iv...but should be out by now and we need to concentrate on keeping her turned, hydrated, and watch rumen function. Her calf is taking to the bottle easy now. Her eyes look good, after the vet administered all those remedies, she tried to get up, twice.... I feel today may be the day for a miracle. I'm praying!


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

The foaming is a true sign of anaphylaxis. And from you vet saying she may have had a reaction, it only confirms my suspicions! I wish I would've seen this sooner. I may have been some use. I'm glad she's feeling better. Did he supply you with fluids you could give her? Looks like he covered all potential bases that would prolong her efforts to stand. That's a good vet.


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

Thank you! I think your suspicions are right! The vet that came out specializes in large animals as the first vet we were dealing with does his best. He didn't leave anything with us, is there something that I should be giving her? Or get that I can keep on hand incase something happens? Tractor supply is my only go to other than online supply stores. 
I have thiamine, banamine, dex, glucose here at the farm on hand.


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

I would be giving her lactated ringers solution under the skin for 3 days just to cover potential dehydration issues. How's her skin & hooves look. Sounds like she's on the road to better!


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## nannysrus (Jun 21, 2014)

Mjs500doo doesn't it usually take 2 doses of epinephrine to clear a cow from anaphylactic shock? 

One at the time of the reaction and usually 48 hours later?


Samantha

"5 minutes of fresh air is equivalent to 5 mg Valium"


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

No, we've treated successfully with just one dose. If they still are exhibiting symptoms within a couple hours after dosage, you can hit em again however. We had a cow that was allergic to ampicillin once treated we had to give her four dosages while working on getting all the medicine out of her over a period of 2 days. It was terrible.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Yes have hope!!! We had a cow give birth and she couldn't get up. It had been a week. We were getting a big storm that was gonna hit one night and she was way out in the open field and no way to put shelter up or move her to shelter. I went to go shoot her and she was up and moving. So I always hold onto hope for as long as I can. 
And actually thinking of that girl an idea maybe. I'm not big on neutra drench but I was giving it to that cow for energy. Maybe that helped??? Really don't know but maybe worth a shot?


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

Too big of a calf or nutrient related problem (ketosis, fever)?


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

Where can I get the lactated ringer? Epinephrine? Even if I may not need it, I sure would like to keep it on hand! 
What's the best place to do lactated ringer on cow since back area is so... Tight skinned? I have never done these things for a cow let alone a goat so, I'm worthy of giving it a shot if need be.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

You will need to get those from the vet.


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

I normally work with between 2L-4L depending on dehydration factors. Forgot to add, this is IV. Pick a good thick, healthy vein.


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

Thanks y'all! I'm sure the vet will give us some. I'm going to try and post a picture of her today. The canopy got blown over so we had to use the next best thing.


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)




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## Naunnie (Jul 4, 2014)

I've been following this thread. Thanks for the pictures. She looks quite alert. The calf is precious. I believe keeping him with her, is helping her "will to survive". You are doing an awesome job with them! I'm anxiously waiting for the post that she is up! Hang in there. :hug:


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

No foaming at the mouth today, a little panting but after giving her ice water, she stopped. Gave injection of b complex sq, electrolytes in water. Massaged her rumen area, rubbed menthol ointment to her legs and hips. She tried to get up three times. Waiting in boys to come help move her. Muddy by hind legs, keeps slipping. Maybe today will be the day!!!!!!!!!


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## cheyenne (Aug 21, 2011)

Any luck yet?


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

No luck yet. I'm not giving up hope because she sure isn't. Today she was mooing.... I
Hope that means she is just getting more ansy and not meaning she is in pain or anything. She wants to get up... She wiggles and moves herself back and forth so I'm almost certain she is really trying.
I went to a local dairy farm today, I pass it everyday and decided to stop. I asked them about lending me a sling, if they had one available but they didn't have one. He said tractor supply sells one, and described a strap type style but we are already using straps. That sling looks like a human hoyer lift , just made for cows and I know it would work. The daisy something or another. I'm working on getting the money together now since they are a bit over 500.00. Well worth to have since this happens more often than not. Anyone use those? What's your take on them OR what's the best thing you did use?


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## billiejw89 (May 7, 2014)

I'm praying for her!


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

Slings are better than the old lifting devices that grabbed the hip bones 
and lifted the cow up. 
I sure hope she finally can stand, soon!
Sending you good thoughts!


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## cheyenne (Aug 21, 2011)

I was so hoping she was up by now... well darn. Don't give up hope tho! Sounds like she's trying! The sling sounds like a really good idea.


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

You've got prayers coming from NJ.


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

Thank you so much everyone!! 
I don't get on here everyday( I really wish I could because it's my go to!)
Update as of today. Not good but not bad?
We got her moved with straps and put her on her right side ... Went back to check on her, she went back on her left side. She is breathing heavy, even when given water. Gah! I hate this!! I'm ordering the sling, hopefully tomorrow! I got to have this ASAP. I am exhausted and have tried all I know. I rub her rumen area, put muscle run on her legs, give water with electrolytes, etc..... She won't get up. She's laying on her left back leg in a way that I don't like. We move her, put hay to hold her position And she seems to maneuver herself right back to how she was, so, with that being said, she moves but not standing. I'm not losing hope, I'm just getting worried... For her. Her calf lays with her, we bottle feed her and I just look at the situation as a whole and I do wish that were me instead of her and we could just switch off until things got better. Not sure how much more she can take. She was laying her head down today, sad eyes....but knocks us with her horns when too close to her snout. Sigh..... What do I do.


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

You're doing all you can, and an amazing job. I'm still praying for her.


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## Naunnie (Jul 4, 2014)

Oh my goodness! She is really putting you thru your paces... as we say down here.  I am getting worried about the circulation in her legs. I know you are keeping that in mind as well. I have a suggestion...not sure if it would work, but we have done this with horses ok. If you can get her up high enough to slide some hay bales under her, between front and back legs. Stacked 2 high worked for the horse, but I'm sure it would depend on her height. The idea is to support the middle body off the ground, but not put full weight on the legs just yet. We used one side of a double horse trailer....possible a cattle chute would also work if you could get her there...? With hay bales under her and strong sides for support, she would not be able to switch sides or lay back down. Sorry...just thinking outside the box to get her up and keep her up. Since she has been down this long, her legs are gonna be weak and she knows it. She needs to get her "land legs" again so to speak....


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

Curious...did she go Down anytime or did she have anywhere where she could've hit her spine? Have you checked ROM & feeling in legs & toes? 

Have you checked for ketosis lately? With her being down, her metabolism may be completely screwy. Just to be on the safe side. Checked for mastitis?


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Naunnie said:


> Oh my goodness! She is really putting you thru your paces... as we say down here.  I am getting worried about the circulation in her legs. I know you are keeping that in mind as well. I have a suggestion...not sure if it would work, but we have done this with horses ok. If you can get her up high enough to slide some hay bales under her, between front and back legs. Stacked 2 high worked for the horse, but I'm sure it would depend on her height. The idea is to support the middle body off the ground, but not put full weight on the legs just yet. We used one side of a double horse trailer....possible a cattle chute would also work if you could get her there...? With hay bales under her and strong sides for support, she would not be able to switch sides or lay back down. Sorry...just thinking outside the box to get her up and keep her up. Since she has been down this long, her legs are gonna be weak and she knows it. She needs to get her "land legs" again so to speak....


That's actually a really good idea!!! I'll have to remember that if we get another downer. If this is something you can do I would really try it. I'm sure she is loosing strength in her legs being down so long. I guess if you get the straps that would do the same but just keep her hanging where she can get her legs under her if/when she's ready. 
I'm not sure if you have figured out what's going on and why she's not getting up but a thought.....maybe she hurt herself or pinched something while she was loopey. I for the life of me can not think of the name but what about a shot of the pain med. that everyone uses on here. It's a anti inflammatory and might help (????) just thinking for you 

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## chuckles (Aug 7, 2014)

Jessica, are you thinking of Banamine? Wendylou, dexamethasone might be useful, as well. It is anti inflammatory, but it does suppress the immune system so be careful and talk to your vet first.


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

Great idea with the hay bales! We just have no way of lifting her high enough to do that. I have both banamine and dex,4mg on hand. I was reading about dex and wasn't so sure I should use it. I wanted to! What would be a safe dose of banamine for a cow of her size? I would say she has lost a little bit of weight but is nearly 900 pounds. You think some b complex would help again? I have pen g on hand. Would that work for mastitis? I also have la200 but that stuff burns! I would feel bad hitting her with it. I'm putting probiotics on the grain and a little baking soda to make help with gas. Let me tell you, that works! Ha!


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## nannysrus (Jun 21, 2014)

Banamine is 1cc per 100lbs


Samantha

"5 minutes of fresh air is equivalent to 5 mg Valium"


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I think an antiinflammatory would be good...
here is a link to the banamine info for cows..

http://www.merck-animal-health-usa.com/products/banamineinjectablesolution/overview.aspx


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## chuckles (Aug 7, 2014)

wendylou said:


> You think some b complex would help again? I have pen g on hand. Would that work for mastitis? I also have la200 but that stuff burns! I would feel bad hitting her with it. I'm putting probiotics on the grain and a little baking soda to make help with gas. Let me tell you, that works! Ha!


B complex certainly won't hurt! Ruminants produce B vitamins in the gut but, as stressed as she is or if she is not chewing her cud, she could very well be at a deficit. When you have finished your bottle of LA200, swap it out for Biomycin. They are the same medication, but they have different carriers so the Biomycin doesn't sting like LA200 does. As far as mastitis goes, systemic antibiotics can and do help, but she really needs Today since she is milking. Tomorrow is used for mastitis on a dry cow.


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

Update : she's still down but still managing well. I propped her on the hay bales as best I could, we have been rolling her,Each side once a day, would do more but we just can't. The bales are basically being used to hold her position steady. 
Today was hot, and I mean hot. 
I made an Ice pack out of a garbage bag by filling it with Ice and placing it on her like a saddle bag... On the kidney area, head, neck. Put ice in her water..even though it melted quickly, it was cool to drink. I gave her glucose and have been giving her banamine as well as b complex. She trusts me now. I can sit with her now without her jabbing her horns at me. That's a good thing. Her calf is doing well and remains to lay with her and stays close. 
I hope she gains strength and gets up soon. Today was a struggle.


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

Good job taking such excellent care of her.


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

Have you been using the sling or hip clamps to get her up on those feet? I'm starting to get concerned about her muscle tone...


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## chuckles (Aug 7, 2014)

You're just starting to get concerned about this cows lack of mobility? I've been very concerned about that since day two. I didn't say anything because I knew it wouldn't make a difference but, if she were mine, I would have already put her down.


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

We have been using the straps to lift her but we really need a sling to put her in. We are trying to make a sling with a trampoline tarp as of last night to try and mock the daisy cow sling. 
In talking with my vet tech friend late last night, she called me to inform me she had called two of her old cow vet friends which said to her that the rompun dose given was too much and the cow won't get up. Now, I have been getting different opinions on this and because I'm not familiar with rompun, who do I believe?? The one vet that she spoke to stated that we were just making her suffer and we should have the farrier come out and finish what he started! WHAT???? I just can't believe that I'm sorry. Maybe it was too much BUT I think she would of been dead by now? She's still thriving.... Eating drinking, no bloat.. I'm giving her calcium, mag, dextrose, banamine, thiamine, probiotics, antibiotics, baking soda top dressing on small amount of grain, electrolytes in water, what else.... I know there's more... Gah! 








I took this photo right before we moved her. We flip her once a day. We are actually trying to figure out a way to make a "sled" to lift her on to relocate her completely.


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

I think you're right to follow your gut - if she's still trying, there's a chance. IMO, she will tell you when she is done. She doesn't look quite ready to be done to me.

If it's possible to lift her, that may help encourage and remind her to try standing. Until then, you're doing the very best you can, no matter the outcome!


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I say stick to your gut too!!! I know a few cow folk here is Texas and I will ask around for opinions..!!!


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## Naunnie (Jul 4, 2014)

I agree with ThreeHavens. Trust yourself.....you will know if the time comes.....

Found this http://www.ehow.com/how_12003244_build-cow-sling.html I don't know if it will work.

I read on another forum about using inflated truck/tractor tubes placed underneath...if you could get her lifted up high enough. They used a tripod stand with engine hoist and a wide strap. They lifted the cow up several times a day, for short periods until she got her land legs.

Another thought....How far are you from Mississippi State? I wonder if the Animal Dairy Science department could help. Maybe have a sling they could loan?


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

I put some feelers out and one gal posted this...


"I had one down for 2 weeks that I took care of (feed, water, antibiotics, etc.) that everyone told me to put down. I didn't give up & she didn't either, finally got up on her own. She also had a baby calf that continued to nurse the cow while she was down. Just saying that sounds like your doing all you can & sometimes it just takes time." 

Im asking what made her cow go down...but wante to share to encourage you!!

EDIT: it was milk fever..but she said she wants you to be encouraged : )


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

^^^ oh yeah it can be done!! That story was just like the downed cow we had. She rolled from side to side so the calf could nurse and we went down to put her Down and she was up.
She had a pinched nerve in her back from having the calf. And every day I was down there a gave her molasses and water and nutra drench for energy......seemed to help her


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Another response..



> My husband is a vet and just did eye surgery on a cow..does not take much...0.4 of Rompun is all he used..very little for a cow..2cc will do 10 -600 lb cows.. the cow most likely has a compression on its nerves....if you have not gotten any help let me know ..


I sent her more info for her husband to read...


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

So would compression on the nerve be the same as a pinched nerve. (I use simple terms lol) 
If so and you haven't already I would really use that pain med stuff that starts with a 'b' and still for the life of me can't remember the name!!! The off brand is preveal. But I had a doe this year that had trouble kidding. When it was done I could get her up with help but she was not walking right AT ALL gave her a dose of the preveal and after a bit was walking so much better. By the next day totally back to normal. 


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

> that pain med stuff that starts with a 'b'


Banamine..yes she has her on this. : )


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

You have done a great job with her. She doesn't look to be distressed, the calf is good, it seems to me
that you should be the one to decide what to do with her. Don't let anyone push you one way or another-
She might stand up tomorrow!


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

any news?


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Wendy , im so sorry :hug: What that farrier did was horrible and i would let other farmers know. My feeling is the vet works with him and just won't say the dose was too much , JMHO. 
I know your flipping her and doing everything you can , i know nothing about cows , but is flipping getting her weight off her heart and lungs ?
Sorry if that sounds silly , but its just a thought i had. 
I would be careful about the ice water though. I know it could be deadly if you give dogs ice water anytime , but especially when they are over heated.
Note , giving a dog a few ice cubes to chew is one thing , but a lot can cause bloat. Just saying. 

My prayers are with you and your cow and her calf.


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## mjs500doo (Nov 24, 2012)

happybleats said:


> Another response..
> 
> I sent her more info for her husband to read...


This is the exact reason I questioned if there was any chance she could have slipped, banged her spine, or fell during the process. Hoping it's just a nerve issue.

Even so, we really need to start pushing the issue of her getting up & using her legs somehow. Even if it's just her toes touching the ground, she'll move them around. Getting her up will give you a for sure answer on the nerve idea as well.

At this point in time, we recently had a cow down with a touch of fatty liver disease when she calved (11th). This led to all sorts of metabolism issues. We battled severe ketosis one day, severe milk fever the next. Repeat. I also suspected nerve damage just in front of her hips. After 7, yes 7 bottles of calcium, after an entire jug of propylene glycol, 3 bottles of glucose, an entire bottle of vitamin b complex, a single bale of hay, one small tub of molasses.. This was all in a week's time. Has it been worth it? Financially, no.

After the 4th day, we started going out with the skid steer, hip clamps, and the shocker. We'd lift her (and give her a single zip to encourage her to help us try-great for her muscles), hold her on her toes, and wait till she was steady. Once steady, we'd slowly creep the skid steer and allow her to walk around 15-20 feet, then rest again. By this time, she either would knuckle over (then we'd lower her down), or she'd be trying to stand. We proceeded to do this for 2 days, 3xD.

On Sunday morning-we just went out with just the shocker, touched her over her ribs, and the effort she already gave us was amazing. She whipped herself up & stumbled around. Even for a couple minutes, this was a vast improvement. We let her rest. Again we just touched her & this time she gave us her sea legs. We slowly pressed her over to the bunker & she ate for the first time. This was only the second time that she had been milked so far. Gave her oxytocin IV, and started stripping her. One quarter was dry, one quarter had hot mastitis, one had flakes, and one "good" but very light quarter. Started heavy antibiotics.

Monday came around, in the afternoon she had gotten herself up & was lying by the water tank. By night after milking, she was standing grazing (weak, but still). Oxy & milked her. Little improvement.

Tuesday she was all over the place. Oxy & milked her. Her good quarter gave us more. Her hot quarter appeared milky.

Wednesday even better. We pushed her off pasture & into a maternity pen in the barn to watch her closer. Ran her through the parlor. Oxy & milked her by hand. Good quarter is back in milk, chunks are gone out of the flaky quarter, dry quarter gave a tiny bit, hot one gave about a cup.

Today we milked her with a machine (and oxy). Still improving, but still getting hit with antibiotics, so she still has a chance. This cow has been through hell. We encouraged her to try harder & she did. We helped what we could. Now look at her. I don't believe she'll make it back into full milk, but so long as she's trying, we'll give her a chance.


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## Naunnie (Jul 4, 2014)

Wow.... mjs500doo! :thumbup: I just love this!....I mean this community! So sorry about your cow but....there is nothing like first hand experience. :thankU: And I'm glad your cow is better. I'm bookmarking this advice! I soo want this cow to get up too.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

100% agree mjs500doo!!
You would be surprised how fast a animal can loose muscle just laying there. At this point she simply might be over what ever the issue is to start with and just can't get up  
You said your tractor can't get her high enough up....how high can it get her?? Even if you lift her up and get her legs in the general idea of under her will help a lot. And yes if you need to hot shot her do it!! Maybe showing her your not her friend will make her more willing to get the heck away from you. 


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## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

How she doing today Wendy ?


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## cheyenne (Aug 21, 2011)

I was so hoping she'd be up by now. Wish I could help you!


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

Here's an update as of today. Last night, I received a call from a vet in Florida ( thank you!!!xxoo you know who you Are!!) very tender guy and very straight to the point. I explained this issue from day one and up until yesterday.. Everything I have done, what I do, advice given, etc....
He agreed the rompun was very much on the high side. For a horse, 3 cc's would of been sufficient BUT with a cow, he said he was able to get one where he needed it to be with 0.4ccs. He had great advice as you all have as well. He took it a step further and explained how to check for deep nerve damage and superficial nerve damage.... Which I did today and low and behold it didn't register as deep nerve damage WHICH GIVES ME HOPE because he said if there was evidence of deep nerve damage, pretty much there was permanent damage which would indicate she would never get up. 

Today I went to t and c. Picked me up a 10x12 brown nylon tarp along with some clamps, and one ton chain hoist. I was determined to make my own daisy cow sling. 
Today I brought two straps that can hold up 1500pounds each. This took me nearly an hour to do by myself to a downed cow. I slipped the straps under her back belly and attached it to the lift with chains on the tractor. I just needed to get her up high enough to slip the nylon tarp under her!! That's it!! I wanted to video tape this but I was by myself doing this and boy was I taking a chance. 

I had folded the tarp to fit her bottom belly measurements as close as I could and still have access to the ring holes so I could link my clamps in the holes to connect them to something else to get her up. I'm thinking..... All the while daisy is drinking her water and wondering, I'm sure , what the HECK am I doing! I'm scared to lift her with these straps I brought because I was afraid I would hurt her or something was going to go wrong that I couldn't get us out of.
I went and got my hunting knife incase I had to cut the straps down... Plus it bought me more time to be nervous.
I started the tractor, had the nylon tarp ready to slide under her so I gently and slowly lifted her. She's getting nervous and so am I! I just needed to get it high enough! I don't want her slipping out before I could jump down and slide this tarp under her!! Omg! I'm going nuts!
I got myself up to just do it and I got half of her high enough back there to where I jumped off the tractor and slid that sucker under her...... Partially, 3/4ths of the way! She's sooooo heavy and I was afraid if I attempted to lift her higher I would hurt her! I let her back down to rest, and me too. I gave her some water and checked my tarp. We are going up again. I got this far and we are doing it. 
I repositioned the straps and clamped them higher up in the chain. I lifted again and saw it worked! I jumped down and I got the tarp under her and let her stay there for a minute while I checked to see if she was ok skinwise and to see if I could leave her up like this for a while but.. She's crooked and dangling wrong. It didn't appear that it was too bad and after all her back end came up! I stayed with her to watch for movement. Her hips move, and her right leg moves slightly. Good. 
The straps were squeezing her bag a bit so I let her down onto the tarp. It's under her good and that's what I intended. Mr. Peter came back from milking and was happy to see what I had done. He said " this is gonna work." Now, we just wait for Ricky to come and we will all do this together. 

Waiting patiently............


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Thats like reading and intro to a good novel!!! Now I want more!!!!..lol


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

I was holding my breath reading about the cow getting lifted up! 
That is great there isn't deep nerve damage!


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## cheyenne (Aug 21, 2011)

On my screen it has a 'page 3' for this thread and I can't get to it!!! When I click on page 3 or the > thingy, and even the type in the number box, it takes me back to page 2. 

So what happened???? Dang it I have to go to bed! lol


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

This has been some hard work. I can't tell you how hot it is outside and how many changes of clothes I have changed in and out of just from sweating. Mississippi equals TERRIBLE humidity and hard on someone with rheumatoid arthritis. 
It was worth it. The put together cow sling shot works!!!!!! I have been lifting her for an hour and dropping her for an hour....... Since last night! 
It works!! I am crying with joy, anger, female hormones, and pain.. By golly we did it! Ricky will be taking over this afternoon shift for I am all but exhausted. I stayed with her through the night and did this. I dozed off at 3am when I let her down from the 200am hour but got her back on schedule at 430am. It's scary out there at night. So many things out there and I did NOT want to know what they were, I played my jerry reed and buckwheat zydeco to keep us in good spirits and the scary things away. We did it! 


Wendy Lou


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

That is wonderful! What dedication! I give you a lot of credit for hanging in there.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Wendy!! You are amazing!!!


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

Great! :stars:Sending super good thoughts your way for her to stand on her own! 
You sure are a tenacious person! (and that is a good thing!)


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## cheyenne (Aug 21, 2011)

AWESOME!!!!!!!!! :stars: Wendy I am so happy for you!!!! :dance: We'll have to start calling you McGuyver for your home-made sling! 

Praying that she stands on her own today! ray:


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## Naunnie (Jul 4, 2014)

Go Wendy! Go Wendy! :clap: This is great news! :cheers:


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

With all the hard work , effort, and great support from y'all here.. We had hit our downfall. We had the vet out this morning because mama daisy just didn't seem like she wanted to fight anymore. Mr. peter called me early this morning and said she wasn't doing too good last night and she was laying down this morning that he didn't want to sling her. He said she didn't eat and her eyes "lost their soul." I told him I was calling the vet to come out and hung up to call the vet. I was hoping with some iv fluids, calcium, magic in a bag, ANYTHING....something would get her eyes back into wanting to fight. While I was in route to meet the vet at the farm, she had already passed away. The vet said that it could of been numerous reasons why but he was still in shock when we told him the whole story and how long she had Been down. He's from the same office that we used the last time we had the vet come out, He said he had heard a little from when the other vet he works with came out the last time and thought she was already up by then but she was still here, trying. 

She put up a good fight. Not sure what happened here. Guess it was out of my hands and I hope she knew I was trying. 
Her calf is still doing good, we moved her in with Zieger and zoe, the other two small calves so that she will have some friends to keep her mind off what just happened. I personally have seen cows show emotion towards eachother and I believe this little calf knew something was not right. Either way, I want to thank everyone for your support and wonderful help and advice. You have been my strength in this and didn't allow me to give up. 
I'm still a little shocked by all this because she was fine until last night and I was not there. I just can't make any sense of this. 







Wendy Lou


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## CritterCarnival (Sep 18, 2013)

:sigh: Poor girl, sometimes it just doesn't end well. She tried so hard and you did all you could for her...:hug:


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Im sorry Wendy...you gave her a fighting chance...


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## glndg (Feb 8, 2013)

I'm very sorry, Wendy. You did everything humanly possible….and then some. Sometimes things just don't make sense.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I'm so sorry Wendy. You really gave it your all.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

I can't tell you enough how sorry I am  


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Oh no, I was really hoping she would pull through. :blue:
I am so sorry. She's out of pain and stress free now...


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## goatygirl (Feb 16, 2013)

I'm so sorry it should have never happened that way. You did so much for her and she knows that.


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## wendylou (Oct 5, 2013)

Thank you everyone!! I really hate when things like this happen. This was my first time dealing with it hands on with a cow. I feel good that I was able to help her as much as I could and even though it didn't go the way I had hoped for, I feel good knowing she will be at peace and the pain is over. I won't forget her and will make sure I take care of her little calf. 
I don't like this part of not knowing what happened. She was doing so good for the condition she was in. Vet stated that in most of these cases, things will just start to shut down and sometimes without doing an actual autopsy , we really won't know. 




Wendy Lou


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## Goats Rock (Jun 20, 2011)

So very sorry to hear that she lost her fight. You certainly are to be commended for all that you did.
Darn it, sometimes life sure isn't fair!


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## cheyenne (Aug 21, 2011)

Oh no! I'm so sorry Wendy! You both tried so hard. :hug: Sometimes tho, no matter how hard we try, we just can't get the results that we want.


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## InTheCrookedPinesFarm (Mar 20, 2014)

That's really sad. I would be really angry at that guy about now if I were you. 
It's hard to let things like that go.  

Sooo sorry. :'(


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## goatygirl (Feb 16, 2013)

So what are you going to do about the farrier? If I were you I'd be furious


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## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

I'm so sorry. You really gave it 110%.


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