# Pat Colby - Johne's disease



## hayhay

Hi all,

I was doing a net search and an old post on here came up. I am about to start treating one of my sheep tomorrow for what may (or may not!) be Johne's disease. I would love to hear from anyone who has used Pat Coleby's treatment for Johne's disease before.

What dosage did you use?

What treatment regime did you follow?

What was your success (or lack thereof?)

We bought our flock from a breeder who certified free of Johne's disease. We haven't introduced any other sheep, we run organic and re-mineralise pastures and supplement with minerals. Which all lead to not Johne's! This sheep looses condition during lactation. After her first lamb we fed her the minerals and lucerne and she picked up condition. After her second birthing last year, she has re-gained a bit of condition but is still fairly poorly. Last week she started having diarrhoea for the first time.

Any help is much appreciated.


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## hayhay

Also, has anyone used homeopathics on their sheep? And here is Aust do you source them?


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## ksalvagno

Milkmaid did something with Pat Coleby's regimen. If you do a search, you should be able to find it.

Have you had a fecal run? Are the sheep on the same pasture all the time? It only takes 3 years for a totally parasite free pasture to have parasites on it when animals are on it all the time.

I would start with having a thorough fecal (not just a fecal float) done to include coccidia. Then go from there.


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## sweetgoats

Why do you think it is Johne's?

 It is a very serious thing. I know a breeder that had it in her heard and has no idea how she got it. It has pretty much wiped out the whole heard. She has to test all her goats every few months and when one comes up positive she has it destroyed. It is a sad thing. 

 A vet is the only way you will know for sure and if I remember correct they have to have a blood test done for the correct results. Then when it is positive the State Vet HAS to get involved.


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## milkmaid

Hi Hayhay!
I'm the one who said I was going to try the Pat Coleby cure.  As far as I know, nobody has tried it except Pat Coleby. (I tried it on my Johne's positive goat, but by the time I got her tested, she was too far gone and it didn't work.  ) So far, none of my other goats have come up positive, so I haven't given the cure a fair try.

You should get your sheep tested. It could be Johne's disease, but it could also be liver fluke or worms or internal CL or something else, and you could lose time by treating for the wrong disease.

I'm very much the oddball in my view of Johne's disease. Most people put down positive animals, and most won't buy from a breeder with possible positives. So if you keep positives, your sales will be low or nonexistent. Just a warning so you can weigh the costs and benefits.

Definitely get her tested. Also (and I would recommend this to everyone who owns ruminant animals even if they've never had a case of Johne's) come up with a list of questions about the disease and call the Johne's Testing Center in Wisconsin. They do all they can to help you understand and prevent the disease. They are very nice and knowledgeable and helpful. I can't say enough good things about them. Highly recommended!

*Johne's Testing Center
School of Veterinary Medicine
2015 Linden Drive, RM# 4230
Madison, WI 53706-1102
(608) 263-69202*


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## mjs500doo

Johne's doesn't require state vet or isolation.

It's quite common. We deal with Johne's in the dairy cattle herd on a regular basis. I'd love to answer any/all questions.

Johne's is not a death sentence. It is a terrible disease if your animal has the chronic symptoms. Always cull out chronic. An infected animal can live many many years symptom free, happy, healthy. These animals are essentially carriers. We treat them as "time bombs". Stress really escalates the speed in of which Johne's strikes.

One of my close acquaintances works for:

National Johne's Education Initiative
National Institute for Animal Agriculture
13570 Meadowgrass Drive, Suite 201 • Colorado Springs, CO 80921
Phone: 719-538-8843 • Fax: 719-538-8847
Email: [email protected]


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## hayhay

Thankyou all for your responses. It is much appreciated.

We were thinking Johne's mostly out of worry - reading up her symptoms it all seemed to fit. Talked with a vet today (has been a long weekend) who didn't ring any alarm bells for Johne's so fingers crossed its other parasite/worm/etc.

I dosed her water with Vit C and garlic yesterday - along with continuing to feed her to Pat Coleby minerals.

Today I wormed her and injected her with VAM and Vit C. I will investigate a fecal test thanks Karen.

I also brought some fenugreek seeds and slippery elm to make into a paste with molasses to feed her.

This is all very new to me so would appreciate any feedback about how I am treating her.

Karen we run a rotational system between 5 paddocks for worm/parasite control - ideally it would be 12 weeks rest but with the 5 paddocks we can do 2 weeks in a paddock, then 8 weeks before they are back in the same paddock.

I am not in the US, thanks for the contacts though. I might put some questions together and ask them via the email address.

Milkmaid I am sorry you lost your goat. It was your other post that I came across when searching the net for information.

Thankyou all


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## ksalvagno

Just so you know, studies were done and you need to leave pastures to rest much longer than 8 weeks. Google Ohio Sheep Improvement Association. I think you can find the studies there. Some Ohio sheep farmers worked with Ohio State University on the study.


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## mjs500doo

With Johne's they recommend any field or lot that has had an infected animal on it must not be used for animals less than weaning age (3-4 months), ideally no less year olds for a prolonged period of time. Time is unknown at this moment, but studies have also shown soil to hold Johne's, as well as the plants themselves. 

Another thing to consider...deer are carriers of Johne's as well, and even if you're herd was tested negative for years, doesn't mean that your herd is safe.


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## keren

Ok I need to add some Australian relevant information. 

Johnes is a NOTIFIABLE disease in Australia. Which means if you have reason to suspect Johnes, you MUST have the testing done (faecal is best) and if positive your property will be subjected to movement restrictions and possibly quarantine depending on where you are located. I've dealt with it before and it wasnt pretty. We were told the property would be quarantined for 7 years, animals could go straight from the property to slaughter and that was it. This was previously a successful show sheep flock. We opted to depopulate and start the herd again on a clean property. 

There is NO CURE for Johnes and the Pat Colby remedy has no proper proof that it worked (there was no faecal samples taken before and after treatment to show that a positive animal was now negative). 

If you have purchased your sheep from a MAP sheep flock then it would be very unlikely that you have a Johnes infected animal. Where are you located? 

A couple of other questions as I wonder if it is more a case of parasites than anything. You say you run your farm organically - what do you use to worm the sheep with? Organic wormers or conventional?


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