# Cosmo and Star's Waiting Room



## Crossroads Boers

Okay, let's start this over.  

Cosmo the paint doe is due 12/8 and I think she has quads. She had trips last year at about this size at kidding... Poor thing is going to be SO miserable in 4 weeks! 

Star the % dappled doe is due 12/11 and she has triplets I'm almost positive. She didn't even look prego last year as a ff and had BIG twins! Star comes from a dam who produces trips each kidding. 

The chubby red doe is Liberty, Poli's daughter.  She wanted to be in a pic too... We just lost Poli, so Liberty is really special. Special-er now... she's always been special.


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## J.O.Y. Farm

Look at those bellies!!  I can't wait to see some adorable kiddos!


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## ksalvagno

Boy those girls are huge! They are beautiful girls! Good luck with kidding.


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## Frosty

Looking forward to watching this thread and seeing what they each have. As always beautiful goats.


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## Trickyroo

:hug: They all look wonderful Victoria  
Those bellies are huge ! Cosmo and Star are such gorgeous girls 
I need to hug Liberty , lol. She is such a cutie pie 

Best of luck with kidding and looking forward to seeing their beautiful babies


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## Used2bmimi

Aaaccckkk! Are you doorways going to be wide enough?!  Beautiful girls you have there as always! Can't wait to see the babies!


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## Jessica84

Can't wait to see their herd of kids.....and it does look like they each have a herd in their  now is star cosmos daughter???


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## Crossroads Boers

Thank you all!  I'm getting really excited about these girls.  

Nope, Star isn't Cosmo's daughter. She is related to our black dapple doeling Dazzle though. Star is a granddaughter to Dazzle's dad Camo. 

Last year, Star gave us two reds bred to our paint buck and Cosmo gave us two traditionals and a red out of our paint buck! Our goats don't know what color they are supposed to be having!!! 

We are going to get a new bred doe on Saturday.  I am really excited.... so I'll have to add her on here too. There are several that I am looking at, so not sure who we'll end up with or when she'll be due yet.


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## Scottyhorse

Liberty sure is chunky  Can't wait to see the kids  And what doe you end up with!


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## Trickyroo

Can't wait to see your new doe !


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## springkids

Crossroads - How old is Liberty? She is beautiful... as a matter of fact they all are!!!!!


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## Crossroads Boers

Thank you Springkids.  Liberty is 8 months old. She showed really, really well this year. We love her.


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## springkids

Amazing...Beautiful girls....You should have some great kids. Can't wait to see pictures. My kids aren't due untill March. Sure makes for a long winter....


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## Jessica84

Got it!!! I didn't think she was but thought you had posted before that she was.....I get confused lol. 
I wish you would lie and say liberty is like 10 months old  I was so proud of my 8 month old before now lol. She is a beautiful girl. But you know me I'm really looking forward to see some Cosmo kids


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## wildegoats0426

Can't wait for those kids, they are going to be adorable! And liberty is beautiful


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## Crossroads Boers

Thanks. They are both bred to our ennobled buck Mr. Rich, so we should get some great kids.  

We also just had a % doe bred to Rich yesterday. I think Paint Ball and Rich will cross perfectly, so am looking forward to those kids. I think it's too early to add Paint Ball on here though...  Then there's Ace who is bred to Teflon and due in March. So our kiddings will be all spread out!


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## Scottyhorse

I have to wait 5 months for kids!  One doe is being bred today, another was bred a few days ago. Then Annie and the possible new Boer will be bred in January!


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## Crossroads Boers

This is Cosmo and Star last kidding at this stage in their pregnancy. About 4 weeks from kidding. Cosmo is not majorly different, but Star sure is!


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## Trickyroo

I would add Paint Ball ! We can all stay on one thread , lol
It will be easier for you 
And I love to see all your goats


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## Axykatt

Liberty is such a chunker! She's still my favorite Boer in the world, though!


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## Crossroads Boers

I think this thread would get WAAY too long by 5 months from now!!  

That's sweet. 

Dandi, the most spoiled rotten goat I know is my favorite Boer in the world... but Liberty is a close 2nd!


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## Axykatt

Crossroads Boers said:


> I think this thread would get WAAY too long by 5 months from now!!
> 
> That's sweet.
> 
> Dandi, the most spoiled rotten goat I know is my favorite Boer in the world... but Liberty is a close 2nd!


Peggy Sue isn't a Boer...


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## HamiltonAcresBoers

4 more weeks until my Cosmo baby is born!! EEP! Cant even contain my excitement!! I'm honestly hoping for a traditional girl  hehe


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## Crossroads Boers

Well, then... now that that has been said, she'll probably have 3 paint does!!  I wouldn't mind if she gives you a traditional I guess, but I want a paint doe to keep.


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## Jessica84

Ohh so your getting a Cosmo girl.....good choice  I have one myself I'm very fond of


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## Crossroads Boers

I'm getting a Cosmo doe too! I'm so excited!! Hehe...


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## Jessica84

Crossroads Boers said:


> I'm getting a Cosmo doe too! I'm so excited!! Hehe...


Lol...good choice good choice


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## Crossroads Boers

Ha, thanks.


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## toth boer goats

All looking good and big, can't wait to see the kiddo's.


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## HamiltonAcresBoers

See i wouldnt mind a paint, but i do love my traditionals  Ah, im so excited!


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## bayouboergoats

They all look fantastic as usual..

Liberty is such a chunker! Lol she looks huge in the pic! Pretty girl! 

Cant wait to see those babies!


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## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Amber!


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## Crossroads Boers

Some pics of Star from yesterday... this goat is going to be the end of me if she doesn't start eating well soon. She is REALLY picky now and we're lucky if she eats her grain. She has been picky for a week but it makes me *SO* nervous! We've been giving her Bvit shots every day and probios... taking temp 2x a day and checking with Ketone strips 2x a day and nothing. She moans so loud when she lays down, I think she's just really *full* of babies. She's got triplets in there I think. Last year she didn't even look prego and had 8-9lb twins.


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## wildegoats0426

What do the ketone strips do?


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## HamiltonAcresBoers

Any pics of my sweet Cosmo?  Hope her an her precious cargo are doing well!! I'm PRAYING that she has them while or just before i make my trip up!! I would just die of happiness if i could meet my new baby!!!


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## Scottyhorse

Poor star


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## Crossroads Boers

The ketone strips test the ketone levels in her pee and tell us if she is getting PT... It's pretty cool. 

Nope, sorry. No pics of Cosmo today. It rained most of the day... so didn't have much of a chance! 

When do you think you'll be in this area Regan? Cosmo is due Sunday the 11th, but will probably go Friday. I actually don't know if the 11th is her EXACT due date... as she seemed to be in heat for a week straight!


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## HamiltonAcresBoers

Crossroads Boers said:


> Nope, sorry. No pics of Cosmo today. It rained most of the day... so didn't have much of a chance!
> 
> When do you think you'll be in this area Regan? Cosmo is due Sunday the 11th, but will probably go Friday. I actually don't know if the 11th is her EXACT due date... as she seemed to be in heat for a week straight!


I'll be down the 8th and 9th i believe! Maybe i'll get lucky! How cool would that be?


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## Jessica84

If she has a crew in there shell go early  so I think you have a good chance. When ever I have trips they seem to go a week early.
I don't blame you for being nervous I lost my doe to pt almost a year ago and even though my girls are about 3 months along I check them all morning and night very close. But I bet because star is so heavy that she can only eat a very small amount at a time.....poor girl makes my back hurt just looking at her


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## Crossroads Boers

Oooh, there's a good chance then Regan!! That would be so cool.  

After loosing Poli... I am paranoid about loosing these two.  I wish Star would just eat normal like Cosmo does and stop freaking me out!


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## Scottyhorse

I'm sure she's getting super uncomfortable...


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## HamiltonAcresBoers

Sending positive thoughts your way! Your girls will be just fine


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## Crossroads Boers

Did I say Sunday Dec 11th was Cosmo's due date?? Duh... I knew she was due Sunday, but Sunday is the 8th... right? Star is due the 11th. 

So you could VERY easily be here right on time Regan!


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## HamiltonAcresBoers

How cool would that be!? Either way i get to meet you guys and your stunning animals so im excited!


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## Crossroads Boers

I'm excited too.  Although Cosmo isn't going to give you a warm welcome... she hates new people! Especially when she has babies. I bet Dandi would be happy to give you a big kiss though.


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## nchen7

what pretty girls!!

I can't get over how big boers look! and your girls look like boats! poor things look so uncomfortable! can't wait for the baby pictures!!! hoping for the best for the rest of their pregnancies.


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## Crossroads Boers

Thank you!!


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## bayouboergoats

The girls are looking good! Whoo hoo almost bebe time!!!!


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## Crossroads Boers

Star is still not eating much. She hardly picks at her grain, but eats hay pretty well, but not nearly as much as the others. Her temp is at 102.8-9 and holding, and the ketone strips are negative. She's been getting probios and we were giving Bvit shots, with 0 improvement. It's frustrating! I'm hoping she just feels really full...? :sigh:

We got wet cob yesterday and she HATES it.  She won't eat a bite of it. 

Here are some pictures from yesterday. I looked back at some pictures of Cosmo last year at 25 days before kidding (she's 24 today) and she is a LOT bigger this year!! She had 11, 10 and 6lb triplets last year!


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## nchen7

oh my....hoping it's just those babies taking up space in her belly region. I feel bloated an uncomfortable just looking at those girls.....


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## Jessica84

Seriously!!! My girls would kill for wet cob. I really don't know what to say since the strips are coming back OK. Maybe give her a dose of.......I'm not by my meds can't can't think of the name but pregnancy tox. Med and see if that helps. A dose will not hurt her. And she may just not be happy right now. I know this fat girl I swear has quads in her lays around and moans like a Nubian all day so I'm sure stars feels the same as her. But mine eats like a hog  
I'm sure she is driving you up the wall right now


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## Used2bmimi

Just an idea, have you thought about getting a new container of strips just to make sure that what you have are working right? I hope she is just feeling full too, but it sure does seem odd without an explanation. Is she still self exercising?


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## toth boer goats

Treat for Pregnancy Toxemia in case. can't hurt.

Give her Fortified vit B complex to help appetite, I would give 8cc to get her going. It won't hurt her.

She doesn't have very much room for feed intake, it must be a good quality hay, so she can be fed a little, but will benefit her and her babies better, by increasing calorie intake.

Being fat and full of kids, isn't helping the situation. 

She needs exercise as well.

You can give her warm molasses water 

Give nutradrench

Probiotics are good


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## littlegoatgirl

Sorry star's making you worried  Can't wait to see some babies!!! Hope all goes well for you!


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Id treat for a little bit, just in case.

Some of mine dont like wet cob, but every goat eats dry cob here. Mine have to be deathly ill not to eat the dry cob! 

Cosmo sure is bigger this year! Cant wait to see those babies!


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## Crossroads Boers

I tried to give a handful of the cob to Cosmo and she thought she must be in heaven... it was hilarious. I've never seen a goat eat something so fast.  But Star doesn't like it. 

She and the others get free choice alfalfa/orchard grass. We were giving Vit B complex Pam, and saw no improvement in feed intake at all. And she's not fat... She's the thinnest goat we own right now. I can easily feel her spine, and there isn't a lot of cover over her ribs. 

They have molasses in their water... Star exercises more than Cosmo does. It has been raining a lot recently, but when it clears I go out and push them out the door. Star will trot around and get exercise... Cosmo will just stand there and say "you can't make me move".

I have nutri drench I could give her... 

Maybe we should get new ketone strips... but we have been storing them in the house with the lid sealed, I don't think they could have gotten messed up.

Poli stopped eating completely after we treated her with Proplene Glycol if I remember correctly. That worries me a LOT, and I'm scared to give it to Star.


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## Trickyroo

Sorry for the question here , but what is COB ?


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## Crossroads Boers

It stands for Corn, Oats and Barley.  The "wet" cob is coated in molasses.


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## Trickyroo

Thanks


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## Jessica84

See what others say first but what about kero and corn oil. I remember giving that to my doe. Maybe pm goat hiker and see what she says about dark beer and her reason behind that. She told me to give to my doe but she was hitting rock bottom at the time so never tryed it. There is another oral solution you can give other then the Polly stuff I want to say it mpk or something that is letters....did you make sense of that. A lot of people do not like that Polly stuff and they say it burns their throat and should be given threw a feeding tube same as the nutri drench.


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## toth boer goats

Oh wow, I hope she will be OK. 
She is thin?
By the pics, she looks heavy, but all that is babies?


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## Used2bmimi

If it were me, I would use molasses and karo syrup and/ or nutridrench, but NOT propylene glycol. According to my mentor, that stuff is a last resort treatment because it takes away their appetite and slows their rumen. Which to me is exactly the opposite of what you are trying to accomplish. Maybe I am wrong, I am kind of a newbie, but is seems to me that you are trying to get calories in them to stop them from metabolizing their fat and the last thing you want to do is suppress their appetite. Take my advice with a grain of salt though, I don't have the experience to back it up.


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## Crossroads Boers

Thanks for the suggestions.  We did give her nutri drench today, and more vit B. She is bright and happy, just won't eat her grain much if any. She has her head buried in the hay feeder quite often, but I'll watch her and she'll be really picky with it. 

She's not heavy fat wise at all Pam... what you see is babies.


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## Crossroads Boers

Is Light Corn Syrup the same as Karo? I've got plenty of that and molasses. 

She was eating a little bit better tonight and ate a good amount of grain. Just really slow.


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## Jessica84

I don't think so karo is a real sweet syrup. If you go to the store it should be in the syrup area.....like pancake syrup. I think the karo is for the sugar which you might be able to use molasses (?????)


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## toth boer goats

My Does love wet cob(cob with molasses), the last month of pregnancy, it is good for them, try that alone and see if she will eat it, just a little, then, the next time add just a pinch of other grains if you want to. If you haven't already done so.


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## Crossroads Boers

----


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## Crossroads Boers

Yep, tried that. She still doesn't like it. She ate a handful or two last night out of a bucket, but none this morning. She is eating her grain a little better though I think.


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## toth boer goats

Hope she will be OK :hug:


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## goatgirlzCA

Sending positive thoughts your way. Your does are just beautiful. I have not had time to be on here much so I just found out about Poli. I was teary reading the thread. I am so sorry. 

I lost my favorite doe in March who got PT, delivered a week early and lost all 3 kids, then we lost her 10 days later. I still have no real idea what killed her, and two vets didn't know either. It was frustrating!

It was very difficult what you went through, and I know what's going on now is 10 times scarier because of that. Anyway, I am so looking forward to pictures of your triplets and probably quads - everything is going to go perfect for you :hug:


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## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Pam, I think she will be.  She's just so uncomfortable... this is going to be a long 3 weeks! 

Thanks goatgirlzCA.  It was really hard losing Poli...and her babies. I still wish she were here all the time.  I probably wouldn't be nearly as worried about Star if we hadn't of lost Poli. It was hard losing her just because we loved that doe, but it was a huge financial loss too! I don't want that to happen again. 

Star hasn't gotten worse in over a week now, so I can't help but think her not eating much is just normal *for her* at this stage of pregnancy. It greatly worries me though!


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## NubianFan

I always use light karo syrup and light corn syrup interchangeably in recipes so I assume it would be the same for goats? Karo syrup is just a brand name of corn syrup isn't it?


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## bayouboergoats

Sending a whole bunch of prayers and internet hugs your way!

I have a doe who always cuts back on feed about 3 weeks before kidding like clock work every time! If that makes you feel any better. Maybe she is just full feeling from all the babies!


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## Crossroads Boers

I'm sure you're right Amber.


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## Jessica84

I am very sorry she is being a pain but I have learned from this post. I have always been told wet cob is a no no to give. I always ignored it but I found a different grain that I thought would be better while bred......no now I'm gonna start slowly change them back lol. 
As for your girl I just say keep watching her and use those strips. I know going off grain is a sign of pt but from what you say she does not have it. The only thing I can think is maybe she is just under having it but keeping it under control so I would just do the test strips like once or twice a day to be sure  I'm sure your really counting down the days lol


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## NubianFan

how many days do these two does have left? You have probably said so if you have forgive me


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## MsScamp

Awwww, poor Cosmo! She is going to be miserable by the time she delivers! 

Beautiful does! What was the verdict on Liberty? I never did see anything on whether she is fertile or a free martin (and I'm too lazy to find the thread).  :laugh:


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

^^ Liberty checked out ok


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## MsScamp

That is fabulous!  :wahoo:


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## MsScamp

NubianFan said:


> Karo syrup is just a brand name of corn syrup isn't it?


You are correct, Leslie.


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## Crossroads Boers

Thank you.  I like these two does. I'm hoping we get a keeper from each this time! Amber (Bayou Boer Goats) has a red minimally spotted doeling from Star that I absolutely loved. And I'm really looking forward to seeing updated pictures of... hint hint.  

Yep, Liberty has come in heat twice now.  We are going to have her bred to a really cool Capriole buck next year. 

Cosmo has 21 days to go from tomorrow, and Star has 24 days from tomorrow. Oh goodness no... you think I'm counting down the days??? :ROFL: Lol....


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## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> Oh goodness no... you think I'm counting down the days??? :ROFL: Lol....


Nah, the thought never crossed my mind!  :laugh: I like your does, too. They are beautiful! Here's to happy kidding, no problems, and lots of babies running around and being their cute, mischievious, exasperating, frustrating little selves! :hi5: :cheers:


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## Tenacross

Used2bmimi said:


> If it were me, I would use molasses and karo syrup and/ or nutridrench, but NOT propylene glycol. According to my mentor, that stuff is a last resort treatment because it takes away their appetite and slows their rumen. Which to me is exactly the opposite of what you are trying to accomplish. Maybe I am wrong, I am kind of a newbie, but is seems to me that you are trying to get calories in them to stop them from metabolizing their fat and the last thing you want to do is suppress their appetite. Take my advice with a grain of salt though, I don't have the experience to back it up.


Propylene glycol is the main ingredient in Nutri-Drench. Nutri-Drench is known to increase appetite.


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## Tenacross

Victoria. I would switch both these does to the very best dairy quality straight alfalfa I could find. I would treat the doe that's not eating with Propylene glycol and MFO (which is an oral solution of CMPK). I would start her out slow with it. Like 30ccs of each twice a day. If you are opposed to PG, then substitute Nutri-Drench. Please read this article.

http://kinne.net/hypocal2.htm

I've heard some people recommend calcium injected, but Leslie told me that can give one a heart attack, so I would stick with the CMPK oral.


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## Crossroads Boers

Okay thanks Tim... I'll read that article. We did give her Nutri-Drench and ran out, but I'll get some more today. 

I'll have to do some searching for strait alfalfa that is actually worth buying. The stuff from our two feed stores is HORRIBLE. The alfalfa/orchard we have now came from the east side and is really nice. The alfalfa part looks like Leslie's alfalfa. I LOVE Leslie's alfalfa.


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## Crossroads Boers

The doe that you mentioned Tim is still eating... just not as much as she should be IMO. She's been like this for 10 days or so with no worsening...? We keep taking her temp and using the K. strips with nothing alarming. And she's still bright and happy( well as happy as she can be over 4 months bred with trips!)


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## Used2bmimi

Tenacross said:


> Victoria. I would switch both these does to the very best dairy quality straight alfalfa I could find. I would treat the doe that's not eating with Propylene glycol and MFO (which is an oral solution of CMPK). I would start her out slow with it. Like 30ccs of each twice a day. If you are opposed to PG, then substitute Nutri-Drench. Please read this article.
> 
> http://kinne.net/hypocal2.htm
> 
> I've heard some people recommend calcium injected, but Leslie told me that can give one a heart attack, so I would stick with the CMPK oral.


Thank you! That is a great article. Totally makes sense here too! That calcium/phosphorus ratio is so important. And even alfalfa can be low in calcium depending on where and how it is grown. With regards to the Nutridrench, the other things in it besides propylene glycol are beneficial to the appetite. I am told that Nutridrench is way better than just propylene glycol alone.

But again, I am only sharing what I have been told trying to be helpful, I do not have the personal experience to back it up.


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## Tenacross

Crossroads Boers said:


> I'll have to do some searching for strait alfalfa that is actually worth buying. The stuff from our two feed stores is HORRIBLE. The alfalfa/orchard we have now came from the east side and is really nice. .


Don't switch then. Again going with the Sue Reith article, if the reason she is not eating grain (feed) is because she needs more calcium, then you want to feed a hay with a lot of calcium. But you are, so...


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## Tenacross

Used2bmimi said:


> Thank you! That is a great article. Totally makes sense here too! That calcium/phosphorus ratio is so important. And even alfalfa can be low in calcium depending on where and how it is grown. With regards to the Nutridrench, the other things in it besides propylene glycol are beneficial to the appetite. I am told that Nutridrench is way better than just propylene glycol alone. But again, I am only sharing what I have been told trying to be helpful, I do not have the personal experience to back it up.


I think the Ca ratio is a big deal too. When it is most likely to get out of whack is when you feed grain, like COB, which is higher in phosphorus than calcium. There is a reason why a "feed" for goats is balanced. 
By all means everybody.... use the Nutri-drench if you have more faith in that over propylene glycol. It's good to have confidence in what you are using and then we can *both* be right.


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## Crossroads Boers

Finally got some pictures...  

The first picture is Cosmo last year at this stage of pregnancy (25 days to go, 21 right now), the 2nd pic is her today at the same stage. The 3rd pic is Star last kidding at this stage (16 days to go, 23 right now), and then her today.

Cosmo had 11,10 and 6 lb triplets last time, so I say quads this time. Star had 8-9 lb twins last time, so I say triplets this time. I guess we'll see.


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## Frosty

Wow. I don't know how they walk much less eat anything. They are so big and beautiful.


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## Crossroads Boers

We have to push and pull them out the door to get them to walk around...  Poor girls.


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## nancy d

_Both definitely_ bigger than last year!


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## ksalvagno

Those girls are HUGE!


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## MsScamp

Those poor girls! I cannot believe they are that big and still have pretty close to a month to go. Poor babies, they must be completely miserable!  I agree with the quads and triplets, for what it's worth. :laugh:


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## Crossroads Boers

Cosmo seems far from miserable actually... which is funny since she can hardly walk! She doesn't grunt, moan or groan when she lies down, or ever grind her teeth for that matter. She eats like she'll never see food again at every feeding... and all through the day. Glad she's feeling OK for now though...


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## Scottyhorse

Oh. My. Goodness. They are huge!!!!


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## nchen7

they are HUGE! poor girls must be so uncomfortable! it's going to be a LONG 3 weeks, isn't it? for you AND the girls!  (and....us too obviously...)


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## Crossroads Boers

Well, we can say less than 3 weeks now....  Cosmo is due in 20 days, and will probably go early. I am so ready to just have babies here and stop stressing over these pregnant goats!! There are 3 more due after these two, but I'm not going to worry about them for a couple more months anyway.


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## Trickyroo

OMG they look like tanks !!! God bless those girls , poor things !
Im so excited to see these babies  Like everyone else , I know , but I dying to see if Star has a beautiful dappled baby like herself !
Cosmo looks like she has a sub in there !! WOW
You can actually say Cosmo is beside herself in the last picture , lol
It almost looks like her belly might just pass her front end , :ROFL: :hugs::hugs::hugs:
Good luck with kidding


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## toth boer goats

Big Mamma's there.


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## Crossroads Boers

Poor Star is so miserable.  She is really worrying me. Cosmo actually started moaning a little this morning, she's finally acting prego!!


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## NubianFan

Just three more weeks Star you can do it!!!!


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## Trickyroo

Im sorry these girls are putting you through such a tough time :hug:


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## Crossroads Boers

Yeah, it's okay. I'm just hoping to pull Star through this. I wish she was due sooner.


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## Trickyroo

We are all here for you honey :grouphug:


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## toth boer goats

We sure are


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## littlegoatgirl

Hope everything goes well!!! We are here for you every step of the way! :hi5: :grouphug:


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## Crossroads Boers

Star is doing better this morning.  She ate a quart of grain pretty heartily. She hasn't eaten that much at one time in 12-13 days!! I'm excited. We put her in her own pen last night, and it looked like she had eaten a good amount of hay. She was very bright this morning still, as usual. She probably ate about a quart last night too, and was eating some hay. I also saw her drink a BUNCH of water, which is great. 

I'm still going to call the vet here soon and see what he thinks... She has lost a lot of weight. 

We've been giving her CMPK, Nutri-Drench and Vit B injections every day... I think it's working!!


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## nchen7

what a relief!!! keep holding on Star!


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## Trickyroo

That is good news , hold on Star !


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## Frosty

So glad she seems to be doing better. Can't wait to see those babys. Darn three weeks is a long time..lol


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## Tenacross

Awesome.
If she were my goat, I would consider backing off the Nutri-drench a little as long as she keeps eating like that, but I would continue a maintenance dose of the CMPK. Something you were doing worked.


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## Crossroads Boers

Frosty said:


> So glad she seems to be doing better. Can't wait to see those babys. Darn three weeks is a long time..lol


You don't have to tell ME that!! :GAAH: 

I talked with our vet and he said we are doing everything he was going to suggest... We decided if she is not eating again by tomorrow morning, we'll have blood-work done to see what's going on.

Okay Tim, we'll back off on the ND a little and see how she does. I'm trying not to get too hopeful, but I'm still hoping.


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## Wild Hearts Ranch

Have you checked out Patriot Farm feed? Based out of your area. I switched my girls over to their all purpose this year because it's just four ingredients, and they absolutely inhale it. No Ca/P ratio listed for the all purpose but both of the grower formulas have high levels of calcium, and more protein if they need it.

http://patriotfarmandbison.com/FEED.php


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## Tenacross

Crossroads Boers said:


> Okay Tim, we'll back off on the ND a little and see how she does. I'm trying not to get too hopeful, but I'm still hoping.


No. That's a big deal. If she went from not wanting grain to eating a fairly big portion, she is feeling way better. At least for now you have reversed the bad cycle. AND, you know what to do if she starts doing it again. I keep them on the CMPK. If she starts to weaken, give the ND again to wake her up.


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## Crossroads Boers

Yes, I did look into Patriot Farms at one point... Not sure why I didn't start buying from them, but I know I had a reason at some point!  

I know... but Poli seemed to have her ups and downs too. I've offered Star grain a couple times today and she'll turn her nose up at it, but that's normal for mid-day. We'll see how she does tonight.


----------



## toth boer goats

:hug:


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch

I switched over when my feed store started carrying it, and so far they've done great. I'll probably pick up some grower as they get close to their due dates - I read up and it has a lot of added minerals, as well as the protein. My girls are dairy but I'm not pushing for production so I don't worry about their protein except when they're prego. I'm only paying a dollar or so more than the sheep and goat I was buying.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

That's cool.  ^ 

Star ate about a 1/2 quart of grain tonight. She ate some hay too. It is supposed to be 30 or under tonight, so we put a heat lamp in her stall in case she get's cold. She's so thin I thought she might get cold easily.


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## kccjer

As big as those girls are, I would back off the grain. They don't need it. They are super fat which makes being prego hard on them. I know how hard it is not to feed tho. Lol. And from what I've read on this forum....too much feed/grain in the last month can result in huge babies which can lead to some problems.


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## Crossroads Boers

These does are far from "super fat"... Star is all bones right now, and Cosmo is in good pre kidding weight IMO.


----------



## kccjer

Must have just been the way the pics looked on my phone then cause they looked super fat to me. I'll have look again when I get on the puter and can see pics better


----------



## nchen7

how many more days! any improvement in Star today?


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Star has 20 days to go, and Cosmo has 17.  We're finally under 3 weeks with Star... I am so ready to have these babies!!


----------



## Frosty

Just checking in to see how things are going. Will stop back later hope all is well.


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## Jessica84

Oh no you can look at it better then that  11 more days and 8 more days and they can safely have them  lol. I bet you anything they will come early too. All my trips that I had were born 7 days early so I'm putting money on at least 7 days early


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## Scottyhorse

I'm betting they'll go early too.... 

If you want to see a super fat goat... I will send you a picture of a super fat goat. These girls are not   Too much feed/grain CAN cause kids to become too large, but you want to give them enough food in either the form of hay, or hay/grain so they have enough energy. It's a balancing act.


----------



## Scottyhorse

Have you considered adding something like Sunflower oil (not seeds) to Star's grain ration? It has 14 grams of fat per tablespoon (or teaspoon, I would need to look), and I am adding it to my girls' grain ration for extra fat. Might think about that, to help give her a little extra fluff


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## littlegoatgirl

They are far from "super fat" :laugh: :lol: I'm so excited for you! Hope all goes well! Thanks for all the updates!


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## Crossroads Boers

I'm so excited too...just tired of holding my breath! Lol.

I hope we can make Star last another week or two (edit:before inducing if it comes to that), but I am making a plan B in case we need to induce her. Talked with the vet about the best way to safely induce, *but I hope we won't get there*. I think it's good to have a plan B though in case something bad happens with Star. I wanted to get some Dopram for the kids if they have to come early, and he told me they don't carry it as they don't think it does anything!! Leslie suggested that, so I doubt it doesn't do anything.

I picked up blood tubes from the vet today for the blood test, and saved myself $50 by doing it ourselves.  I'm going back and forth about it a little, as Star is doing pretty well still, but I think it would be good to get that done.

I got some pictures, so will post them a little later tonight or tomorrow morning.  It is SOO cold out there!

Nope Sydney, haven't tried that. And for now I don't want to. We're lucky to get anything down her, I know she wouldn't eat her grain with something on it. I guess we could drench it though.


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## Tenacross

Unless she takes a bad turn, let those babies cook as long as mother nature thinks they need.


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## HoosierShadow

I'm sorry Star still isn't doing all that great, but at least she's hanging in there. Poor sweetie, it's so nerve wrecking! We had a first timer that was bred for end of April that went off her feed in Feb, and couldn't figure out what was wrong with her, everything checked out normal, fecal wasn't an issue, etc. I had to drench her with PG, give her Thiamine injections, and pamper her along. I even bought sweet horse feed to get her more interested, then slowly when she started eating grain again I'd mix her goat feed until she was eating better.
She went off feed again after kidding and took 2 weeks to get her going again.
She had triplets, and had very little milk, just enough for the runt to get 2 days of colostrum and on the bottle she went. She raised the other 2.
She was skin and bones, still is. Accidentally got bred when we brought our new buck home this summer <didn't get a chance to separate her>, and she's looking to be due on New Years Day. So far she hasn't had the big set back, but I am watching her closely.

I sure hope you can figure out what is going on with Star. I'm wondering if in both Star and our doe, having triplets just really threw everything off, and the pregnancy itself is making them so sickly.


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## Jessica84

You are correct have your back up plan it never hurts especially since the vet is down the street. I actually......between kids being born  started a list I want from the vet which includes meds to induce labor. 
But your girl stays on my mind a lot and was thinking......you said I believe that you have molasses and water out for them ????? I wonder if maybe that might play a part in her not wanting grain especially the wet cob. She is just a confusing critter isn't she


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## MsScamp

What happened? Earlier today Star was jogging around her pen and trying to fight with the new girls through the fence, and now you're talking about possibly having to induce labor? I am hoping and praying that it doesn't come to that! I absolutely agree with having a plan B (and even a plan C) just to be safe and prepared, but I'm really hoping Star makes it to delivery safely. How is Cosmo doing?

If it helps any, it's cold here too. Low tonight is supposed to be 15, low tomorrow is supposed to be 3, and Friday is supposed to be 2. I'm excited! :eyeroll:


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## Crossroads Boers

I know Tim....

Okay let me clarify....I am NOT going to induce Star unless she takes a turn for the worse! which is still likely. All I'm doing is being ready in case she get's worse. Poli went down so fast, if Star gets really bad I want to be ready and try to save the babies. I am determined to save these kids and Star. She is skin and bones, and still has 3 weeks before her due date. That is no good, and worries me greatly. 

I have both plain water and molasses water available for the does. Star doesn't seem to like the molasses water, and won't eat any grain with molasses in it plain. She'll pick at it mixed in with other grain though. Wonder why she doesn't like the molasses? 

Here are some pics from this evening... the black dapple doeling (Dazzle) is sired by Star's grandsire, so they are related.  

Cosmo is doing splendidly... Couldn't be better.  At least 1 of the 3 does we had due in December are doing well.


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## Crossroads Boers

She only ate about 6 handfuls of grain tonight... not sure if I mentioned that? It's funny though, she ate the grain mixture that she hasn't eaten in a week, and didn't like the other stuff that she has been liking.


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## MsScamp

Ok, I see. Thank the Lord, I was afraid Star had taken a bad turn and the post had been deleted/lost/erased somehow. The forum is very weird today! I don't mean to sound flippant or anything, but when a doe is that pregnant and has that many hormones coursing through her body all bets are off on what she wants to eat. At 6 handfuls, would it be possible to give her what she wants without further upsetting her system? I've never had to deal with pregnancy toxemia so I don't honestly know.


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## Wild Hearts Ranch

Have you tried straight alfalfa pellets? Maybe it's the sugar/starch that she's not liking.


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## Tenacross

GoatCrazy said:


> What happened? Earlier today Star was jogging around her pen and trying to fight with the new girls through the fence, :


I could have swore I read that too. Thanks for proving I'm not crazy.  Where did the post go?

Victoria. If you haven't already been doing this, when it's super cold they sometimes like to be offered straight water that is bath temperature. I sometimes pack warm water to my close does when it's cold, first thing in the morning. The one time the warm molasses water works for me is right after they kid. Otherwise, not so much at my farm.


----------



## bayouboergoats

Been gone for awhile just read to catch up. Cosmo is looking great! 

How old is Star? I know its somewhere on Goat spot i don't know where ! 

I do not think Star looks bad imo maybe thin compared to your others. But again pics may not do her justice.


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## Texaslass

Crossroads Boers said:


> These does are far from "super fat"... Star is all bones right now, and Cosmo is in good pre kidding weight IMO.


I sure don't know anything about boers, and I don't want this to come off wrong, but how can you tell she's thin? What's the determining factor? I would really like to know! 
I'm not good at telling the difference between a "dairy" goat and a skinny goat, and your girls all look pretty big and healthy to me, well padded even. But I'm used to dairy goats, so I'm sure they look different to me than you..


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## Crossroads Boers

Oh that's weird... where did my posts go? And some of your posts? There is a big jump on the 13th page, from 4 something to 12 on the times.... I didn't delete them, so where'd they go? Weird. 

Star's spine and hip bones have no fat/muscle cover on them, and her ribs have almost no cover on them. Cosmo has an inch 1/2 or so over her ribs, Star has almost nothing. That's how I know she's thin.  

Yes, I have tried giving her warm plain water. She likes it.  

Star is a 2 y/o. This is her second kidding. Her dam is a big producer, and Star is a triplet, so I was expecting triplets, just didn't think her pregnancy would go so poorly!


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## Crossroads Boers

GoatCrazy said:


> At 6 handfuls, would it be possible to give her what she wants without further upsetting her system? I've never had to deal with pregnancy toxemia so I don't honestly know.


Could you clarify on that? I don't think I understand what you mean... sorry!  The grain she does like is a mixture of 1/3 Calf Manna, 1/3 Noble Goat, and 1/3 Allstock (which is a rolled molasses grain). The stuff she didn't like about a week ago (that she had been getting) was 1/2 Noble, 1/2 Allstock with BOSS added in, so it's not that much different. I'm not sure if the super high protein is good for her in the CM though? She LOVES that. I don't think she'd eat that grain at all if the CM wasn't in it. She tried to pick it out.



zebradreams07 said:


> Have you tried straight alfalfa pellets? Maybe it's the sugar/starch that she's not liking.


I haven't... I'm tired of buying grain she won't eat, but I guess somebody would eat it if she doesn't.


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## nancy d

Maybe try offering her grain several times a day?


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## Texaslass

Crossroads Boers said:


> Oh that's weird... where did my posts go? And some of your posts? There is a big jump on the 13th page, from 4 something to 12 on the times.... I didn't delete them, so where'd they go? Weird.
> 
> Star's spine and hip bones have no fat/muscle cover on them, and her ribs have almost no cover on them. Cosmo has an inch 1/2 or so over her ribs, Star has almost nothing. That's how I know she's thin.


Thanks, I thought that's how you could normally tell, but I couldn't see it in the pics. 

Apparently, TGS is being merged into a pack goat forum, and things are kind of weird during the process. :shrug:


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## Crossroads Boers

No problem Sarah.  

I have tried that too Nancy... the only time she'll eat grain is in the morning and evening. 

We are going to take in her blood test today, so I'm anxious to hear the results.


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## MsScamp

Tenacross said:


> I could have swore I read that too. Thanks for proving I'm not crazy.  Where did the post go?


:lol: Darned if I know, but there are a lot of posts missing.


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## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> Could you clarify on that? I don't think I understand what you mean... sorry!  The grain she does like is a mixture of 1/3 Calf Manna, 1/3 Noble Goat, and 1/3 Allstock (which is a rolled molasses grain). The stuff she didn't like about a week ago (that she had been getting) was 1/2 Noble, 1/2 Allstock with BOSS added in, so it's not that much different. I'm not sure if the super high protein is good for her in the CM though? She LOVES that. I don't think she'd eat that grain at all if the CM wasn't in it. She tried to pick it out.


Since she liked the one, I just wondered if it would be doable to switch her over to it for the energy, but I agree with you that she doesn't need super high protein right now.

I wonder if Star doesn't like molasses because it is upsetting her tummy? I know that molasses can reek havoc with a young horse - to the point that they will literally eat wooden structures in an attempt to stop the belly ache. I've also read quite a few articles about molasses changing the ph in rumens. Given that Star is just 2, she is thin, and she doesn't feel very good, perhaps that is why she refusing molasses.


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## Tenacross

I hope she is doing OK today. It's all coming back to me now with the does I've had that were in the same predicament. I found it best to give a good whack of Nutri-Drench late at night and first thing in the morning. It took a little while before you saw the results. Also, keep in mind, being thin will not kill her. It can be a sign or symptom, but as long as she has good energy and continues to eat a minimal amount supplemented with the energy and calcium from the ND and CMPK, she still has a good chance of a happy ending. IMO.


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## Jessica84

GoatCrazy said:


> Since she liked the one, I just wondered if it would be doable to switch her over to it for the energy, but I agree with you that she doesn't need super high protein right now.
> 
> I wonder if Star doesn't like molasses because it is upsetting her tummy? I know that molasses can reek havoc with a young horse - to the point that they will literally eat wooden structures in an attempt to stop the belly ache. I've also read quite a few articles about molasses changing the ph in rumens. Given that Star is just 2, she is thin, and she doesn't feel very good, perhaps that is why she refusing molasses.


See that's what I was kinda thinking as well.....that after the molasses and water she doesn't want any more molasses. Have you tried dry cob?? And if she likes that all stock I believe....not 100% for sure but believe that its basically wet cob in a pellet form. I also missed it and can't find it....what are you testing blood for??


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## Trickyroo

Geez , I don't know what to say but just continue praying for all of you :hug:
This is coming from a someone that is still learning the goat ropes , but would it be a bad thing to offer them minerals and maybe some sea salts ? Forgive me if that is like totally wrong , but i was just wondering…..idk. Just a thought.


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## Crossroads Boers

I don't know Laura...? She has free fed minerals and baking soda, and has been eating those. We are doing a full blood panel, so testing for everything I guess! 

Dandi has a long hard/swollen bump on the side of her face... I know it's not CL, and her breath smells normal so I don't think it's an infection. It showed up over night... I am so frustrated though. It's just one thing after another! I made an appointment for Dandi at 4pm with the vet, and will take Star's blood in then.


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## Crossroads Boers

Jessica84 said:


> See that's what I was kinda thinking as well.....that after the molasses and water she doesn't want any more molasses. Have you tried dry cob?? And if she likes that all stock I believe....not 100% for sure but believe that its basically wet cob in a pellet form. I also missed it and can't find it....what are you testing blood for??


She doesn't drink the molasses water, if that's what you mean?

Have't tried dry COB, but she doesn't like corn either so doubt she'd eat it. Maybe I'll try plain oats just to get a feel for if she'd eat dry COB.

She hates the Allstock.... she won't hardly sniff at it before snorting and throwing her head around in disgust.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Tenacross said:


> I hope she is doing OK today. It's all coming back to me now with the does I've had that were in the same predicament. I found it best to give a good whack of Nutri-Drench late at night and first thing in the morning. It took a little while before you saw the results. Also, keep in mind, being thin will not kill her. It can be a sign or symptom, but as long as she has good energy and continues to eat a minimal amount supplemented with the energy and calcium from the ND and CMPK, she still has a good chance of a happy ending. IMO.


She's still the same... active, bright, trotting around the field trying to escape being drenched, normal temp, and normal ketone level. And she ate 1/2 quart again which is her new norm. And a good amount of hay too.

We have been giving CMPK twice a day still, same with the ND.


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## toth boer goats

She sounds good, keep up the good work. :hug:


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## Tenacross

Crossroads Boers said:


> She's still the same... active, bright, trotting around the field trying to escape being drenched, normal temp, and normal ketone level. And she ate 1/2 quart again which is her new norm. And a good amount of hay too.
> We have been giving CMPK twice a day still, same with the ND.


I think this is perfect. I would be optimistic.


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## Frosty

I am totally lost but gonna add my two cents anyway. I have been giving my goats hot water with tang in it for vit.c. Don't know if this will help you at all cause I got lost in the post. Keeping them in my thoughts and prayers that all goes well...


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## Crossroads Boers

I am optimistic.  Still worried though... I'm worried she's going to continue losing weight as her kids suck more and more from her as they grow inside her. 

What's tang? Not sure it would help or not, but might be worth a try.  

Here's what Dandi's face looks like...


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## nchen7

well she's bright, alert and happy. that's good news!

I hope Dandi will be alright. Maybe she got something lodged in her gums?


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## Texaslass

Whoa, that's a little scary!  Looks a lot like when one of my doelings got cheat grass in her cheek. It did that one day and I freaked out, but it was gone the next day.
It did it again several days later though. So we ended up taking her to the vet, he stuck a needle in the small lump that was there after the larg swelling had gone down, took a look at it in the other room, and pronounced it scar tissue, that's all.
I was so relieved! He said her body just walled it off, and it might stay as a small lump, but would likely go away eventually. 
I hope that's all it is for your girl.


----------



## nchen7

:hug: i'm sorry for all the troubles you've been having lately. I think Star just has a herd in here that's sucking her dry, and she's probably just too pregnant to even want to eat (i'd want to stop eating if I had a belly like that!).


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Hmmm, yeah I tried to look in her mouth and didn't see anything, but didn't get much of a look! I'm hoping it will be a simple fix. Poor Dandi.  

We just drew 20ml of blood from Star and that went well.... I offered her some grain after that and she ate 1/2 quart! That's new. I don't want to make her sick though.


----------



## springkids

Hopefully its nothing with both girls. I can't wait to see the babies.:wave:

Good luck!!!!


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## Trickyroo

I'm hoping the bloods can tell you something so you help. 
Praying for you guys :hugs:


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Star better not give us traditional bucks after all this...!!!! A dapple doe or two would be more like it.  Even better, a dappled paint! 

Thanks Laura.


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## toth boer goats

Almost looks like a spider/ bee/ wasp, fire ant sting. benadryl may help, if it is a allergic reation.

If it is a sticker look for any tiny scab area's or holes

Salivary abscess comes to mind as well.


----------



## springkids

Crossroads Boers said:


> Star better not give us traditional bucks after all this...!!!! A dapple doe or two would be more like it.  Even better, a dappled paint!
> 
> I vote dappled paint...that's my favorite...again beautiful girls. I have a dappled paint boer mix buck this year. I will have to try and post some pics. I am hoping for some paints, some dappled, and some dappled paints!! lol :ROFL:
> 
> Can't wait to see what you have!! Good Luck!!


----------



## Frosty

Tang is a powder you get in grocery store. Its a form of orange juice. I have been giving it to them in their night time water when they go in the stall at night. They drink better and its a form of vit. c.


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## Crossroads Boers

Maybe we'll try that! ^ 

I love dappled paints.  They are my fav too. I just got one 2 weeks ago! She's really cute, and a beautiful doe.


----------



## Scottyhorse

What exactly are you testing for with the blood draw?


----------



## Texaslass

Scottyhorse said:


> What exactly are you testing for with the blood draw?


I was wondering that too! Lol


----------



## HoosierShadow

Scottyhorse said:


> What exactly are you testing for with the blood draw?


 I'd guess she is testing for anything that comes up abnormal, and if she hasn't test for any disease/illnesses, then that as well. 
Bloodwork can say a lot about them, just like w/people. If one thing is off, it can throw so many others off.


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## 8566

OHHH My Golly - I haven't heard the word Tang in ages.
I didn't even know they still made it. I don't think our grocery store carries it.

Victoria - if you feel like you want to rinse out her mouth you can mix a little bit of scope/listerine and water. Suck it up with a syringe and squirt inside the mouth on the outside cheek area for both sides. Then move upper lip up and squirt there and lower lip. This should help flush the area. 

I'm sure you already have this but I would also have a plan for the kiddos once she kids. You might have bottle babies if they bring her down more.

Also - on FaceBook there was some chatter about bad bags of Noble Goat Feed. Maybe someone here knows. I'll go and search for the bag codes that were bad. Maybe it's on Noble's page. Not sure you've heard about this.

As always - you are doing a great job. :grouphug:


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Elizabeth...  Maybe I'll do that. I hadn't thought of rinsing her mouth out. 

I'm worn out. Just thinking about how many more days we have of this makes me tired!! 

The blood work is at the vet now, and I think he said we'll hear from them on Monday. Yep, testing for anything abnormal. 

Poor Dandi had to be sedated... He clipped her cheek and made her look awful, but found no thorn/splinter or anything on the inside or out. He tested what was in the lump and found all kinds of bacteria. So it is an infection, just not sure what caused it. We'll have to take her back on Monday to get it lanced and cleaned out as there was no fluid pocket in there yet. He looked with an ultrasound.... Poor Dandi!! She was out for a LONG time. Things like this always makes me nervous with these expensive goats.


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## MsScamp

Crossroads, my heart goes out to you. First Polli, then Star, now Dandi. I've always heard things go wrong in 3's, and that is 3. Maybe things will straighten out and it will be smooth sailing from here on out. I sure hope so!


----------



## ksalvagno

I'm so sorry to hear about Dandi. I hope she will be fine now.


----------



## Trickyroo

Honey , I wish I was closer to help you with everything and anything 
I just don't know what to say but to just be here for you and pray for everyone. Im just so sorry  You are a extremely strong woman and I hope I can be half as strong as you are if something goes wrong with my goats ! You are amazing ! God Bless all of you


----------



## nchen7

oh, I'm sorry Victoria! but like GoatCrazy said, things happen in 3's, so this should be it! Hang in there!!!! :hug:


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## Crossroads Boers

:hug:Thank you Laura. I have never had so many goat issues at the same time! Rich has been needing injections every day too as he has an infected cut on his ear. So actually our bad things are in 4's right now...  My sister is a pro at giving injections now... I think we've gone through about 75 in the last 3 weeks! She's getting really good at drawing blood too. I can hardly watch... I can reach in and reposition kids with no problem, and she needs a handler for injections and blood pulls, so we're a good team.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Star ate a quart of grain this morning.  

Her udder is getting huge! I hope she'll be in good enough condition to feed two kids, as she sure is producing a lot! 

We should get the results for Babe's BioPRYN test today, so I am really excited to hear the results! She should be close to 2 months bred to CSB Gauge's G-Force.  I think her kids will be really nice.


----------



## Trickyroo

You go Star !!! That's great to hear  Really good new and we all so need good news right now :clap::thumb::stars::stars:


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Dr. Iverson just called and gave me the results for Star's blood work. He said her GGT and ACP with her liver don't look good, and her muscle CK level is elevated (?) which means she is drastically losing muscle. He said all he saw is consistent with him believing she is getting toxemia. He was very concerned, and surprised when I told him she was doing fine this morning. He said she is close to being a medical emergency, and we should be ready to induce immediately if she worsens. 

Not the news I was hoping for, but glad we got the test done. We'll continue on with our PT treatment and hope for the best!


----------



## Scottyhorse

Uh oh, I hope she is ok! :hug:


----------



## nancy d

Wise move on the blood panel. Prayers being sent.
Interpretation please.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

I don't really understand what he means with all the letters... but he knows and told me what he thought it was! The "ACP" might have been for the kidneys? He mentioned both the liver and the kidneys and the muscle CK. I was trying to write it all down as he was telling me, and asked him to repeat what he saw, but still didn't get it all written down.


----------



## Frosty

Wow it must be so overwhelming for you. Keeping you and your goats in my thoughts and prayers. Just praying the kidding goes alright and they are all strong and healthy.. Hang in there thinking of you. hugs


----------



## toth boer goats

Oh wow, what is going on with your girls this year. I wonder what is causing this, can you think of anything you have done differently? Not blaming, by any means, just kinda strange.

I pray, she will be OK, you have gone through way too much and I hope things will get better. You are on top of it and that is a good thing. 
Glad she is eating better too. :hug:


----------



## Crossroads Boers

It is a little overwhelming...  But I'm still feeling pretty good about Star right now, as she is acting fine. The vet made it sound like she's going to get PT at any moment and we need to watch her very carefully (like we aren't already!) We have been treating for PT, so hopefully she won't get it.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

toth boer goats said:


> Oh wow, what is going on with your girls this year. I wonder what is causing this, can you think of anything you have done differently?


Other than feeding alfalfa, nothing has changed. I think it's just a bad year.


----------



## toth boer goats

I am sorry you are going through a bad year, you are right, we all have those here and there, I hate it when it happens though.


----------



## littlegoatgirl

Man I'm so sorry! This really stinks, hope she pulls through and is okay!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks, I think she will.  

Some pictures from just now. It's an absolutely gorgeous day! It was SO cold this morning, but the sun is out now and it must be in the 40's. I thought I had more of Star, but I guess not.  

I still can't decide of Cosmo has quads or trips. I think big trips at this point. Or small quads. She is bigger than she was last year, but not a lot bigger.


----------



## Texaslass

They're Gi-normous!! :shocked: :lol:


----------



## Trickyroo

Oh my ! I just want to kiss that face and give her such a hug :hugs::hugs::hugs:

All five or six of her 
And while I'm at at , Cosmo and everyone else


----------



## milk and honey

They really are huge!!! .. I'm glad you have the info from the bloodwork, it's always best to have all the info you can and be prepared. Good luck, and saying a prayer for the girls...


----------



## milk and honey

Btw... That was a beautiful pic of you two sisters and your new goats on leaning tree...


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## littlegoatgirl

My goodness, they are giant!


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## Texaslass

milk and honey said:


> Btw... That was a beautiful pic of you two sisters and your new goats on leaning tree...


I missed that one?


----------



## Trickyroo

Im going to check that picture out later


----------



## Crossroads Boers

The are big.  Poor girls.

Oh great, no you're gonna make more people go and see the picture. Shhh!!!! I don't like that pic... I wish Leslie wouldn't post every pic I send her!  I'm in the white and Caroline is in blue. 

Here's a video of Cosmo!!


----------



## toth boer goats

Poor girl, she waddles, but is beautiful.


----------



## goatgirlzCA

Holy Hannah - they are so big!!! Poor girls. Can't wait to see the quintuplets!


----------



## NubianFan

I will say one thing for Cosmo, she can barely shuffle along with that belly but she is super determined to do so!!!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Poor Cosmo is going to hardly be able to move in 2 weeks... 

Just heard from BioPRYN, and Babe is pregnant!! So exciting!


----------



## toth boer goats

Woot :dance:


----------



## Tenacross

Crossroads Boers said:


> He said all he saw is consistent with him believing she is getting toxemia. He was very concerned, and surprised when I told him she was doing fine this morning. He said she is close to being a medical emergency, and we should be ready to induce immediately if she worsens.!


You aren't his usual client. I think it's safe to say the treatment you are doing is why things aren't much worse. Good job! Stay optimistic.


----------



## Trickyroo

:lol: Poor Cosmo !! Im so sorry Cosmo , I'm not laughing at you sweetie  
( ok , maybe I am ) But you are just adorable 
Congrats on Babe's pregancy Victoria ! And BTW , that is a lovely picture


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Tim.. We sure are trying! 

She did well again tonight and ate pretty much a whole quart of grain minus a few small handfuls! She had a nice round belly too so looks like she was eating a lot of hay today. I saw her with her head in the feeder a lot throughout the day and she went outside by herself several times and walked around. I am optimistic....


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Laura!....we posted at the same time. 

I am very glad to finally have some good news for once! I can't wait to see what Babe gives us! Hoping for a paint doe or two...

I am so glad that Cosmo doesn't seem to really be bothered by being so HUGE! I guess she is just use to it by now. She cracks me up.


----------



## J.O.Y. Farm

Haha poor Cosmo! She looks like she's trudging through deep snow the way she walks! :lol: poor gal! 

Hope star continues to improve! And Congrats on Dandie!! :stars:


----------



## BCG

Congrats on Babe. Hope you get your girls.

Prayers for Star and her babies. Hope for a happy ending.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Skyla! Well Dandi's not in a great situation right now, but I know what you meant!  

Star is 5ft even around her belly, and Cosmo is just over 5'5". That's what I do when I have nothing better to do!  It's kind of fun to look back and see what they were the year before. Cosmo was 5'3" at this exact day last year, and Star was 4'5-6".


----------



## Scottyhorse

Wow! So big! Poor girls!


----------



## milk and honey

5'5"! That's impressive...


----------



## littlegoatgirl

Goodness! Watched Cosmo's video, poor girl can barely walk! She looks like she's walking though snow or mud or water!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Yeah, poor Cosmo.


----------



## Trickyroo

How are you doing Victoria and Caroline ? I can only imagine how completely exhausted you guys are


----------



## BCG

Just watched the video. She is so huge...but so cute! What a sweety. Hope all goes well with her and the kids.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

We're doing fine Laura, thanks.  Neither of us are losing sleep over this like we did with Poli. Those few days when Poli was down were terrible, but this is okay. 

Cosmo is due in 15 days!


----------



## MsScamp

Crossroads, how are your girls doing? I have a question for you, if you don't mind. Have you been in drought this year?


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch

Not at all; WA has been extremely wet.


----------



## MsScamp

Ok, thanks Zebra! I asked because I know quite a few of the western states are/have been in drought and I know drought affects the quality of hay. I've also seen a couple of articles that said that droughty hay can be a contributor to pregnancy toxemia in goats, and I wondered if that could maybe explain why both Polli and Star developed it.


----------



## Scottyhorse

Western WA is _always_ wet


----------



## Crossroads Boers

:slapfloor::slapfloor: Did we have a drought?!?!? :ROFL::ROFL: Hahaha... uh no.  Sorry, just had to laugh. We get a LOT of rain! 

It was a good thought though, I can imagine little water produces bad hay...

You know, I really am not sure if Poli ever had PT. Some of the signs were there, but the test strips never showed she had it. I'm not putting a lot of faith in those test strips, but she had a temp of 105.3 on Fri or Saturday (which makes me think pneumonia) and by Sunday mid-day she definitely had Polio. I can't really imagine her having all 3, but I guess she could have.


----------



## Texaslass

Opposite here.  Apparantly y'all get all the rain, cause it doesn't come here! :lol:
Sooo, can droughty hay cause problems in non-pregnant goats as well? I'm interested to know this, since almost every summer here is a drought. d:


----------



## wildegoats0426

Texaslass said:


> Opposite here.  Apparantly y'all get all the rain, cause it doesn't come here! :lol: Sooo, can droughty hay cause problems in non-pregnant goats as well? I'm interested to know this, since almost every summer here is a drought. d:


I second that! But down here in Houston it's been wet for a week!


----------



## Frosty

catching up on post to see how it is going. Think of you and the goats and praying all goes well for you. Can't wait to see the babies.


----------



## Jessica84

Ohhh so Washington is taking the rain from all of us.....come on share. Right now we are sitting at 3% of the average rain fall. But crazy goat might be onto something....have you got more then normal rain fall?? About 5 years ago we got a ton of rain and I remember people saying that their goats were getting sick and dying and the only thing they could figure was the rain was pulling something up out of the ground like too much of some kind of mineral.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Frosty, I can't either.  

Oh, I'd GLADLY share!!! Take the rain, take all you want!  

I got my hay from eastern WA. I have no idea what the year was like over there... 

Star is acting great still, but didn't eat a lot of grain this morning. Probably close to 1/2 a quart though. She acts absolutely miserable when she lays down... poor girl. She can hardly breath it seems!


----------



## Texaslass

Aw..  I hope time goes by fast till she has her babies (for her and you). Sounds like she's pretty uncomfortable. Glad she's okay though.


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch

Actually, we DID have a drought last year so it is possible! Just not common.


----------



## littlegoatgirl

Hope everything turns out okay! How many days left now?


----------



## bayouboergoats

wildegoats23 said:


> I second that! But down here in Houston it's been wet for a week!


Hey I am only about an hour and half from Houston!


----------



## bayouboergoats

How are the girls doing? 

Still saying prayers for you everyday!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Amber! ^ We appreciate any and all prayers and are so grateful for all of the wonderful people on here! 

Cosmo is still doing wonderful, eating like a pig and not seeming too uncomfortable. She is so humungous you would think she would be really grumpy, but she is as happy as ever.  

Star is doing okay still, pretty much the same; bright and energetic, just not eating as much. I am hoping we can get her as far as we can before we have to induce her. She is really loosing weight fast now.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

LittleGoatGirl, Cosmo has 13 days until her due date, or 9 days until she COULD kid, if she decided to go 5 days early. Star has 16 days until her due date, and 11 days until she could kid, if she decided to go 5 days early. We can induce her starting today I think.....she is at day 134 and I think that is the cutoff day to go into labor with the kids surviving.


----------



## NubianFan

How many days does she have left now? isn't around two weeks? We are getting close
lol you were answering my question at the same time I was asking it!!


----------



## Jessica84

If I remember right with my preemies 10 days early is a give or take on being OK. You so don't want preemis that was hell and stressful....poor little girls couldn't even hold their heads up. But I guess even a day makes a big difference in their growth. I think once those kids come just slam the feed to her and she will be good. Since she still has energy I wouldn't stress too much right now.....easy said then done high?? Lol


----------



## NubianFan

I hope she makes it at least another 5-7 days before she kids but I think she will be fine.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Leslie at leaning tree had the 2 1/2 week early preemies and they lived, so perhaps even if they kid now, the kids will be fine


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Yes, I know several people with 2 weeks early preemies who did fine... I hope we won't be there though! I think we should be good for another week or two at least. At least that's what I'm hoping. Star seems to be losing her appetite again, and I don't know what else to do to help that! 

We have not been giving Pro. Glyc. as the Nutri-Drench has that in it, but we will start that if she continues to slow her eating.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

How are your new girls from Leslie doing? One of my new girls, Ebony, kidded the other day!  Twin doelings (almost triplets, but the third wasn't all the way formed).


----------



## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> :slapfloor::slapfloor: Did we have a drought?!?!? :ROFL::ROFL: Hahaha... uh no.  Sorry, just had to laugh. We get a LOT of rain!


No problem.  I knew you guys usually get a lot of rain, but couldn't remember if you were included in the last drought or not.


----------



## J.O.Y. Farm

Yah sorry.. I missed that.. And saw it when I went back and read some more.. Lol! 
How is she doing now? Well I hope! 

Praying for star! :hug:


----------



## Axykatt

Can goats get steroid shots to increase the pace of development so they will be more likely to survive if premie? I know humans can...


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

When you induce, you can give them dexamethasone to develop the kids lungs.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

I am planning on getting Dex and Lute from the vet when we take Dandi back in... still waiting for Dandi's lump to come to a head so we can get it cleaned out. She isn't affected at all, so that's good! It does seem to hurt her when we touch in though.  

Sorry to hear that Lacie, but wow twin does still, that's awesome! Do you have pictures up somewhere?  Babe and Pokey (new does from Leslie) are doing wonderfully. I'm so glad Babe is bred to G-Force!! :stars::wahoo: I was worried as the friends we trailer pooled with got a doe who was in with Babe who's test came back open.  

Thank you Skyla!!!


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Not any good pics yet, just the wet newborn pics and some blurry ones because they won't stop bouncing around :lol: I'll get a pic when they are sleeping and post it somewhere


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

So, with Dandi, was it a lump, or a general area of swelling? My dog got a football size swelling on her face and it was a spider bite, it went down with Benadryl.


----------



## littlegoatgirl

I think she'll wait at least a little longer. Hopefully long enough so you don't have to deal with preemies, but if you do, they are in the best possible hands  prayers


----------



## Crossroads Boers

It started as a large more oval shaped hard bump on the side of her face, but now after two days of treating with penicillin it has gone down to a very small round bump right on her lower jaw about half way form her neck to the tip of her mouth. It is starting to get soft. The vet put her under to get a real good look at it and didn't find any injury. So he thought it might have been a thorn or something that got into her gums and then healed over. Then eventually turned into an abscess. He aspirated some cells from it with a needle and said that it was definitely an infection because there was bacteria all over in the cells that he got out. 

Once it gets completely soft it will have to be lanced and drained/flushed out. So we are just waiting for that and then will take her back to the vet. Poor Dandi!


----------



## Frosty

Wow I think you have had more than your fair share of problems. Still thinking of you and the goats. Prayers all goes well.


----------



## MsScamp

I'm glad everyone is doing well. Every time I log in I am afraid that something has gone wrong somewhere.


----------



## littlegoatgirl

^^^^Same here.^^^^^

Keep the updates coming, it keeps us reassured!  prayers!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Well, this one isn't going to be reassuring... 

Star only ate MAYBE one handful of grain tonight.... She was super picky about it and would spit half of what she got in her mouth out. Her belly was really sunken in, although I had seen her with her head in the hay feeder several times today. I just started giving her some of the Karo syrup, molasses, corn oil mix starting last night so I wonder if maybe that upset her stomach? It wasn't very much, I just gave her a tiny bit of the mix in with her regular meds last night and then gave her some more at 10:30am, and then more at 3:30. It was 1 oz of each thing mixed with a little water.


----------



## BCG

Oh gosh. I feel terrible for her and you! How stressful.  It doesn't seem like that small amount would upset her tummy, but then again, she's pretty fragile right now. Sending prayers.


----------



## MsScamp

Oh no. It sure sounds like molasses is not agreeing with her. I don't understand it since she isn't getting large amounts and goats usually like molasses. Both of you are in my prayers and I hope she pulls out of this. ray: :hug: :hug:


----------



## HoosierShadow

Oh no, I am so sorry about Star not eating well, I have been praying for her. Poor sweetie, when will you have her blood work back? I pray it can give you some idea of what is going on with her. 

Maybe the new mixture is definitely not agreeing with whatever is ailing her. 

What all meds is she getting now? 

Wish I could be of more help  I know it was very exhausting and very heartbreaking when our doe had a similar issue this past winter/early spring. I really thought we were going to lose her. I know I had to give her PG a few times a day, she got Thiamine shots on the bad days where she wouldn't eat, but orally on better days. 
I ended up giving her the horse feed and that's the only grain she'd eat for a while. She'd turn her nose up to good alfalfa and preferred the grass/clover hay.


----------



## bayouboergoats

Oh no come on Star you can do it girl! 

I am at a loss for words Victoria.....you seem to be having such a horrible year....still sending lots and lots and lots of prayers and thoughts.


----------



## nchen7

oh! :hug: i'm so sorry!!! every time I come on, I hope to see good news. poor Start. those babies are just sucking the life out of her!!! keep holding on girl! we're all here rooting for you!


----------



## Trickyroo

Oh geez Victoria , im so sorry  Im thinking that Star's belly is reacting to what was given last just because of her condition. She just can't handle anything else given to her . Just my thoughts here.

Its such a balancing act. I think once she reaches a point where she is eating and drinking , even a tiny bit , not to add anything else as it will unset that very small balance she has . Im so sorry Victoria.
Maybe its all just too much for her system to handle with the pregnancy. Just my opinion , if she was eating on her own and drinking , even the smallest amount , maybe thats all she can handle and to just step back a little and let her be. I don't know what else you can possibly do , but it seems once more is given , it completely throws her off again .
IDK , i know you know better , but its just a thought.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

HoosierShadow said:


> when will you have her blood work back?
> 
> Maybe the new mixture is definitely not agreeing with whatever is ailing her.
> 
> What all meds is she getting now?
> 
> Wish I could be of more help  I know it was very exhausting and very heartbreaking when our doe had a similar issue this past winter/early spring. I really thought we were going to lose her. I know I had to give her PG a few times a day, she got Thiamine shots on the bad days where she wouldn't eat, but orally on better days.
> I ended up giving her the horse feed and that's the only grain she'd eat for a while. She'd turn her nose up to good alfalfa and preferred the grass/clover hay.


We got the bloodwork back on Friday. He said her kidneys/liver and muscle CK all showed she was getting toxemia. He said her muscle CK level showed she was "drastically losing muscle mass" as he put it, and we "need to be ready to induce immediately if she worsens".

She is getting CMPK orally, Nutri-Drench (2x a day) and Vit B orally (in the am).

Thank you all.  Our buck Rich left last night to some friends who live close to us, so that is a HUGE relief. He's one less goat to have to treat right now as they offered to treat his ear. Dandi's face has gotten a lot better, and not sure if we'll even need to take her back. The vet said if we caught it on time, it may just go away and never fill. That would be nice!

I hope I don't sound too "Eeeyore-ish" right now... this is a wonderful time of year to be THANKFUL! Hey, it could be worse!!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Laura, we're definitely going to stop the new stuff and see if that helps her.  That very well could be the only problem I hope.


----------



## ksalvagno

You have been through a lot. It is wearing physically and mentally and emotionally. Sometimes it is hard to be thankful when you have been going through things for a while. I sure do understand that. :hug:

Someone once told me when it is problems in the barn and not the house, it is good. There is definite truth to that but some days doesn't make it any easier.


----------



## nchen7

awww!! how much longer does Star need to hold on for?


----------



## Crossroads Boers

I was just looking back last night, and the earliest due date for these does would be 12/6. I have a ? breeding for Star with a due date of 12/7 and a definite breeding for a due date of 12/11. Latest breeding date for these girls would be 12/12. Rich was only in with them for a week and they never came back in heat.  

So, 2 weeks still for sure.


----------



## ksalvagno

If she could at least hold out this week that would be good.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Yeah, I'm hoping we can bounce her back again and make her eating somewhat well last as long as possible.


----------



## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> I hope I don't sound too "Eeeyore-ish" right now... this is a wonderful time of year to be THANKFUL! Hey, it could be worse!!


Of course you don't, silly woman! In fact, you are amazingly positive and upbeat considering everything you are having to deal with right now. I'm not sure I would be as graceful under that kind of pressure.


----------



## toth boer goats

Oh wow, Victoria, I am praying for her. 
Hope she can hold on and stay at a level to where she can carry her babies to full term and improve more, which her due date isn't very long from now, thank the Lord. Rooting for her. :hug:


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Pam.  

Star ate maybe 1/4 of a quart this morning, and picked at some hay. She's been going and standing outside by herself a lot of the morning/day lately. I don't like it when she does that, especially when all the others are at the feeder eating! It hasn't been all that cold the last few days, but still seems like she would like to stay in the barn.


----------



## toth boer goats

Poor girl, she needs some exercise too, maybe get her on a rope and walk her around on your place, it will help her.
Don't let her just stand or lay around all day. Make her get out and about, she needs it.


----------



## NubianFan

:stars:Go Star go you can do it girl!:stars:
Big hugs for you Victoria:hugs:
I will keep you in my prayers, ray:


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Leslie!  

Yes, she gets lots of exercise. We make sure of that...


----------



## littlegoatgirl

So sorry about star!! Prayers!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

I just offered her grain a couple hours ago and she ate close to a quart... Now she may not eat anything tonight, but at least we caught up on the morning feeding!


----------



## Trickyroo

That a girl Star !!!! Your gonna do this and make your momma happy 
We want you healthy and happy and a couple of beautiful kids would be awesome  Come on Star , we are all here pulling for you girl :grouphug:
I know your going to do fine :hugs:


----------



## BCG

Keep up the good work!


----------



## littlegoatgirl

That's great! :hug: Praying things stay well!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Well, she didn't eat even a bite of grain tonight... it's weird though as she picked at the COB for the first time and actually ate a mouthful. She started picking the corn out of the cob... so there my sister and I stood bent over the cob bin picking all the corn out and giving it to her. She ate several mouthfuls. She hasn't liked corn for over a week! 

Her ketone strip showed as "trace" tonight for the first time. It's been negative ever since I started.  

As I was driving today, a thought suddenly occurred to me. The very first thing the vet mentioned to me when he called with the blood test results the other day, was that Star had low blood sugar. I don't know why I just remembered that today... Or maybe it was a dream... Lol. I don't know! We gave her Kara syrup tonight if that was the case.


----------



## MsScamp

Crossroads, I believe your name is Victoria, may I address you by your given name?


----------



## bayouboergoats

Crossroads Boers said:


> . so there my sister and I stood bent over the cob bin picking all the corn out and giving it to her. .


I am pretty sure we have all done crazier things for our goats! LoL
Whatever will make her eat!

Come on star you can do it!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Yes, of course GoatCrazy.  As long as I can have your name...


----------



## nchen7

how's Star doing today? you tell her that she has people all over the world worried about her?!?


----------



## Trickyroo

Awww , that's great Star is trying more foods. I would stand there all day picking corn out for her if I could  Hopefully the karo syrup will give her more energy. I know how low blood sugar feels , and that makes you feel rotten. And with everything else this poor girl has going on , it sure doesn't help matters. Im waiting for more info on the strip , Im going to go back in the posts to see what that is , i completely forgot at this point.
I could see you and your sister , or at least imagine seeing you guys watching Star pick at the corn and eat it , and you guys racing to the feed bin picking out all the corn as fast as you both can , lolol.
Yes , we all would do ANYTHING for our babies


----------



## loggyacreslivestock

I have been off of this site for awhile and am just now catching up. So sorry you are having so much trouble lately. You are a great goat Mama and have been doing your best. Your girls are so lucky to have you. I will be praying for their healing and for strength for you and your sister. One day, one hour at a time.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thank you Julie.  I appreciate it! 

Star only ate about a 1/4 of a quart again this morning. She'll eat it pretty eagerly, then suddenly just stop and walk away and not eat another bite. Her ketone strip still showed "trace", which means her ketone level is rising (or decreasing I guess, not sure which!) and ketosis is at hand. I'm going to talk to our vet again today. 

She ate a whole handful of cob. And still liked the corn a lot... I don't get it. At this point I'm happy if she'll eat anything, but am worried she'll upset her stomach.


----------



## Trickyroo

This is probably too crazy to help , but go through her grain and offer every different piece of grain separately. Whatever she refuses , maybe you can figure out the reason and go from there. Just trying to offer anything that comes to mind. But still , if something was getting caught in a bad tooth or injured gum , you would think she wouldn't eat the corn.
Ugghhhh !


----------



## Trickyroo

What if you coat her belly with something , then offer her her grain ?
Maybe its so disrupted from all the meds and stuff , she can only handle a certain amount at a time ? What exactly did you do before she ate the quart of grain yesterday ? I would sit down and try to write that down .
Maybe once its on paper , it will become easier to figure out.
Im sorry , I'm just throwing my thoughts at you.


----------



## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> Yes, of course GoatCrazy.  As long as I can have your name...


Thank you! I am Jean, and it is very nice to meet you!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Likewise Jean!


----------



## MsScamp

Trickyroo said:


> This is probably too crazy to help , but go through her grain and offer every different piece of grain separately. Whatever she refuses , maybe you can figure out the reason and go from there. Just trying to offer anything that comes to mind. But still , if something was getting caught in a bad tooth or injured gum , you would think she wouldn't eat the corn.
> Ugghhhh !


I don't think it's crazy at all, Trickyroo. Everything I've read says goats know what they need, and I've seen some evidence of that in my own herd. I was actually wondering the same thing - kind of a "buffet", if you will, for Star. Include small amounts of different grains, grass hay, alfalfa hay, and let her choose what she wants and needs. I know grass hay is nature's remedy for upset tummies, maybe it would help settle Star's tummy and stabilize her system a bit. It would be a pain for Victoria, but it just might do the trick!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Good Ideas Laura.  She won't eat BOSS, Noble Goat, or the molasses pellets from the Allstock plain, but she likes corn now, and LOVES calf manna. She used to snort at the cob, but ate a handful of it this morning... We do this every morning. "Will you eat this? nope... okay how about this? nope... this?" 

I hadn't done anything to her yesterday before she ate... just went out there and offered it to her and she ate it. I think it was probably from the vit B we gave her, as we give that after she eats to make sure the gross taste doesn't hinder her from eating.

I have offered her grass hay, and she won't eat it over the alfalfa/orchard. She didn't eat any alfalfa this morning.


----------



## Trickyroo

I would send you a bag of grain from my neck of the woods , maybe she will eat it. Just let me know and i'll get it to you Victoria.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

That's really sweet of you Laura.  Maybe she would...? I don't know. What kind of grain do you have over there?


----------



## Trickyroo

Southern States , Purina ( not that you want that one ) 
And the Noble . I will call up my feed store and see what else they have .
What about mixing your own , like whole oats , Barley …..


----------



## Trickyroo

What about a horse grain ?


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

What about the Payback brand you've got back there, Victoria? Leslie sent a bag of it with my does, and they eat that like no other, when I offered my grains, they turn their nose up at it. 
So I tried a grain pellet they mix out here where I am, they ate that, but it was a lower protein, so I am trying to be clever and slowly mix that stuff with the grain I normally get, but alas, they know what I'm doing, lol. 

Which sucks, because what Leslie was feeding isn't distributed in California, the only way I could get it is if I ordered it from them, and that seems like a pain since I'd have to probably buy it by the truckload! :GAAH:


----------



## Trickyroo

Whatever you decide , and if I can help , let me know 
I can find out what else my feedstore has and let you know.
Im going there in about a hour or so. I think if we can get her a different brand , one that you don't normally get there , she may eat it.
If not , at least you tried it, its definitely worth trying IMO


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Is she being grained by herself? I'm wondering if she had another doe with her, she might be more apt to eat her grain. I have a couple does that eat as fast as a dead bird when they are alone, but if another goat comes around they suck up their grain like a vacuum.

If she eats the calf manna, that is good for her, how much does she eat of that?


----------



## Tenacross

I think it's smart to offer feed and *then* treat in case the meds bum her out before she eats. It's my experience that any animal that has become accustomed to pellets will be hesitant at textured feed and vice versa. But that is beside the point with Star. Whatever you have to do. Corn is not totally bad if that is what she will eat. You are giving her calcium with the CMPK, so it's not like you are denying her any calcium. Coni Ross advises feeding corn to a preg tox/ ketosis doe. Corn has energy and your doe needs energy. Keep doing what you are doing. Keep the faith. 

Is Star still mobile? Does she still have the energy to try and evade you when she knows you are going to treat her? My food suggestion would be some black berry leaves. I've had goats that wouldn't eat anything else eat those and you can usually find some even in the winter.


----------



## Tenacross

Little-Bits-N-Pieces said:


> Is she being grained by herself? I'm wondering if she had another doe with her, she might be more apt to eat her grain. I have a couple does that eat as fast as a dead bird when they are alone, but if another goat comes around they suck up their grain like a vacuum.


This is a good tip. I have heard Coni Ross recommend it as well. Coni says to put a low on the picking order, younger doe in with the doe you want to eat more and sometimes the older doe will eat more because of the competition. It's worth a try for sure.


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## Crossroads Boers

We have been feeding her alone for 2 weeks... sometimes we'll put her in with Cosmo, Liberty and Dazzle who are her pasture mates, and she won't eat their grain at all. So I'll try to put some of her grain in the feeder...and the others will nearly knock me over trying to get to her grain. So I gave that up. 

We have tried getting a doe out and holding her back to where she can't eat Star's food, but wants it really bad. And puts pressure on Star. That helped once, but recently we've found it scares Star and she'll leave. Just about anything will distract Star and make her walk away. If somebody walks behind her when she's eating, she'll leave. I have to hold stock still while feeding her or she'll jerk her head up and walk away. Once she leaves her grain, she won't eat it again. It's not like she's a wild doe though like one of the others we own.... We've had Star since she was 3 months old. She was a ping pong ball when we first brought her home, but calmed down quite a bit. She doesn't like being drenched now, so dislikes any human contact and will "run" around the whole field trying to get away from us. So we make sure to capture her and let her out into the barn so she can't doe that all the time....  

She is still energetic, and was trotting around with the herd yesterday. She and Pokey really dislike each other, so I put Pokey in with her just to make Star get exercise. Pokey doesn't butt her, just gives her nasty looks and puts her hair up.  Star will chase her around the field. Sorry Pokey...  Caroline told me Star was really hard to catch this morning as she slipped back into her pen before we drenched her.


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## Crossroads Boers

I don't think there is a feed store that sells BGD (Leslie's feed) over in my area... I've searched for it though. It is very similar to Noble Goat, so I doubt Star would eat it as she really dislikes the Noble. The closest store I've hear of is in Yakima, which is 4 hours from us.

And yes, she really loved blackberry leaves last I checked. Our whole back field is lined with those, and we have been picking some recently. A lot of the leaves are dead already though.


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## Crossroads Boers

Little-Bits-N-Pieces said:


> If she eats the calf manna, that is good for her, how much does she eat of that?


As much as we give her, which has only been a couple handfuls. I thought a lot of protein was not good for prego does. Is that incorrect?


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## bayouboergoats

We have different feed down here also if you need me to send you some. I have switched everyone to Full-o-pep show goat feed. You can look. It up online. Its made by Allied feeds here in Texas. Tag number for the one i feed is: R9275

Let me know if I can help in anyway also.


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## Crossroads Boers

Thank you so much Amber!

I just talked to our vet, and told him her test strip showed trace last night and this morning, and her feed intake has dropped drastically. He said we need to induce* immediately *and he'll get the injections ready... I said we'll wait until tomorrow before picking up the injections, and he "strongly suggested" I not wait. He knows more than me, but this is my goat, and I don't think she needs to be induced immediately. He said "this is a medical emergency at this point". I'm not majorly concerned though just yet.

At this point, we'll keep testing her with the strips and see if she worsens. If she does we'll plan on inducing. If we were to induce Friday, the vet said she'd probably kid Sunday which would be day 142. Star just ate a whole bucket full of blackberry leaves, 5 oz of calf manna, and 4oz of rolled corn.

We have not been giving proplene glycol, but did just start giving her that with some Karo syrup. I knew the ND had it in it, but not enough.


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## nchen7

oh wow! :hug: c'mon Star! hang on just a little bit longer!!!


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## NubianFan

I'm kinda with you, I think as long as she stays active and is eating something you could wait at least til tomorrow. I would sure keep a close watch though because if she does start crashing it could happen fast. I know you well enough to know you will keep a very close watch.


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## Crossroads Boers

We will need to be gone almost all day Sunday... so if we do have to induce we'll have to be really careful about when. 

She hasn't eaten alfalfa or drank water (that I know of) today at all... that's really abnormal. She's been really good about eating her hay. We just drenched her with lots of water.


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## nchen7

that's odd with the water and alfalfa....BUT my goats don't like to drink water either, and i'm in the tropics.....


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## Jessica84

Was it cold today??? My goats don't drink half their water they normally do when its cold. Keep a eye on her and if she was mine I would tube or if you have ringer left you can give some sq.


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## Jessica84

How much longer till she is due??? I just remembered this. The first goat I tubed was a prego doe and she was not drinking. I tubed her and the next day she kidded so maybe she is close????


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## Crossroads Boers

It has been cold that last week or two...highs only getting up to be in the 40s. Today actually was a warmer day than it has been, I don't know what the temp. was though. I guess I haven't really seen the others drink that much water today either come to think of it....except Cosmo, she must have drunk a gallon this afternoon. Maybe I am just worrying too much!!

She still has 15 days until her due date which is Dec 11th... I know she isn't due any sooner than the 7th for sure. She had the 5 day heat thing and we saw most of the action going on for the later date. I really think tubing would be a good idea, especially for the Propylene Glycol (She HATES that stuff!) ..

Her kids must be positioned weird tonight... I can see her kids kicking like crazy on her left side right in front of her back leg! I put my hand there and the kid kept kicking and moving. It felt like there was only a thin layer of skin separating it from my hand! Star was walking really funny, and kept stretching and she arched her back up once almost like a contraction. I watched her for a long time and she would lay down and get up over and over like she couldn't get comfortable. Poor girl. Hopefully her kids will move soon!


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## Jessica84

Yes if you need to give that crap do as a drench it doesn't just twist like crap but have heard so many times that it burns and that should be given threw a tube....also read the same as nutri drench but I don't think its as bad as the other.


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## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> Maybe I am just worrying too much!!


Given everything you are having to deal with, it's hard not to worry. Poor Star, I hope her kids shift position and give her a little peace.


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## NubianFan

You may get Thanksgiving babies


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## Crossroads Boers

Oh I sure hope not... I really hope we can make it to day 140 or after before she kids. Day 140 is Sunday I think. 

She didn't eat a thing again tonight. Hay or grain.  She was acting a little dull too and kept laying down in weird places while we had her out. On gravel, between the grain bins and right in front of the people door... She was acting really uncomfortable and kept sitting like a dog and grinding her teeth.  She won't stop stretching and holding her back legs straight out when she's standing one at a time. 

Her ketone strip is back to negative again though. She sure isn't acting better...


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## Jessica84

Have you checked her ligs sure sounds like labor to me. I often wonder if goats get braxton hicks like us because those sucker can hurt like the devil. Although you maybe right and just uncomfortable.... my doe that just kidded 37lbs worth of kids acted some what like star.....but she always ate well


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## NubianFan

hmmmm, you know I am a straight up newbie Victoria, but she may not can last til sunday. I don't know exactly what pregnancy toxemia in goats is, but I had preeclampsia in my pregnancy with my daughter and they had to induce me and take her early. They sound similar I was shedding protein in my urine. It can cause a woman to have seizures or a stroke and can cause mom and baby to be lost. Now I am not even beginning to say this is the same thing because I don't know, but I just wouldn't want to push her too far in case she just can't hold up to the stress of the pregnancy


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## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> She was acting really uncomfortable and kept sitting like a dog and grinding her teeth.  She won't stop stretching and holding her back legs straight out when she's standing one at a time.
> 
> Her ketone strip is back to negative again though. She sure isn't acting better...


Lord I hope I'm wrong, but I've seen a few of mine do that when they are starting labor.


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## NubianFan

well I hope if she is in labor that they are fully cooked and happy bouncy when they get out to meet the world and that mama feels better once they are on the outside...


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## littlegoatgirl

So sorry!!! Prayers!!!


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## Crossroads Boers

12/6 is the very soonest due date... She does look like she's in labor, but why would she be? Ligs are still there but very soft, udder is soft. 

You're so right Leslie, but I'm worried I'll lose the kids if I induce her too early...


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## 7blessings

How are things going tonight, Crossroads? My older daughters (ages 15 & 17) and I are following this thread closely. We are praying for you all!

~ Erin


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## NubianFan

Well if she is in labor maybe it is a blessing in disguise, I don't know how early kids can be and be safe but it could be she is done cooking them even though the logical due date says otherwise. I don't think nature is exact. That is the miracle part. If it was exact, we could probably replicate it in a lab somewhere.


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## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Erin and family.  Your support is encouraging! I'm really getting nervous. And thank you Leslie for your encouragement as well. 

She seems really miserable still. I was just out with her, and she stood up, put her head against the wall, closed her eyes and started moaning and grinding her teeth. When she tried to walk she seemed really weak and laid back down again.  I don't know if I should try to stay out there with her tonight... I'm so worried we are going to lose the kids.  It's too early. I'm not ready for them yet... I don't have Dex on hand. I was planning on making a run into Chehalis tomorrow to get all the stuff we need, including colostrum and a feeding tube.

I'm trying not to worry, but am failing miserably. 

My favorite verse right now: Philippians 4:6-7 "Be anxious for nothing, but in everything with prayer and supplication, with thanksgiving, let your requests be made known to God, and the peace of Christ, which surpasses all comprehension will guard your heart." I love that verse.


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## NubianFan

Does she have a bag? I don't know if I would stay out there with her, but I would probably check at least every couple of hours.


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## NubianFan

Do you and your sister both live there? If so maybe you could split it up where one checks at midnight then the other at 2 then the other at 4 and so on?


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## J.O.Y. Farm

Still praying hard here Victoria :hug: 
That is a really good verse too.. Just remember He has a plan in mind.. I'm praying that she can hold out a few days longer for you guys :hug:


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## MsScamp

NubianFan said:


> well I hope if she is in labor that they are fully cooked and happy bouncy when they get out to meet the world and that mama feels better once they are on the outside...


Amen to that!


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## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> She does look like she's in labor, but why would she be?


I truly hope I'm wrong, but I'm thinking she's in labor because her body has been stressed beyond it's limits. I'm thinking good thoughts, and praying that the kids are viable just in case.


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## Crossroads Boers

That's a good idea Leslie.  Yes, 1 sister has married out, but I still have 2 others at home.  My other sister does dogs though. Caroline and I do the goats and horses. 

Yes, she has a very big udder. 

Thanks Skyla!


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## NubianFan

I was just thinking you could always milk colostrum from the doe and give it you wouldn't necessarily have to have any on hand. Also, if say your shift is 2 am shift and things seem to be progressing, you could always up your checks to hourly or even sooner.


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## Wild Hearts Ranch

Personally I'd rather sleep in the barn than wake up every 2 or 4 hours - because I won't get ANY sleep that way.


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## NubianFan

well if you were sleeping in the barn you might as well be sleeping in the house LOL you would still have to wake up to check on her, I know what you mean though. I would probably in any season but winter, I wouldn't want to stay all night in a barn in winter unless I absolutely have to...


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## Tenacross

I have some frozen colostrum if the need comes up.


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## MsScamp

NubianFan said:


> well if you were sleeping in the barn you might as well be sleeping in the house LOL you would still have to wake up to check on her, I know what you mean though. I would probably in any season but winter, I wouldn't want to stay all night in a barn in winter unless I absolutely have to...


It really isn't that bad if there are heat lamps up. It gets a little boring sometimes - but other times it's amazing how fast the time flies.


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## MsScamp

zebradreams07 said:


> Personally I'd rather sleep in the barn than wake up every 2 or 4 hours - because I won't get ANY sleep that way.


Yeah, if I've got does kidding I'm up until the the last one kids and I'm sure they are done. It's just easier that way.


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## milk and honey

Wherever you sleep... I hope the night goes well. We're all praying for you and Star.


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## Wild Hearts Ranch

If I'm sleeping in the barn I can just roll over and crack my eyes instead of getting dressed and walking out through the cold! With enough blankets and a dog to snuggle with I stay pretty warm.


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## Crossroads Boers

I just went out to her and drenched some more Karo, molasses, and corn oil. I also drenched her with a bunch of water. After the drenching I just watched her and she actually starting eating some alfalfa, and was licking up some of the minerals that are in her pen. That is better!  She doesn't seem to be in labor anymore if she was. 

I and my sister will be checking on her through the night. Probably every couple of hours.


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## Crossroads Boers

I just checked on her at 3am just now. She seems bright, but has terrible diarrhea.... From too much calf manna? She ate 10oz of that plain yesterday, several hours apart...and nothing else other than corn.


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## bayouboergoats

Praying praying praying....

Sounds like too much calf manna too me. How is she doing now?


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## Crossroads Boers

Yep I agree... she is acting great actually. Bright and happy. I just gave her 18-20oz of water. She was nibbling at the alfalfa, so that's great.


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## nchen7

now i'm on the edge of my seat!!!! I sending out good vibes that this *WILL *turn out well in the end! so glad Star is looking bright and happy after the drench. she probably just needed a little pick-me-up, and the babies probably shifted somewhere more comfortable.

c'mon Star! you can do it!!!


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## littlegoatgirl

Glad to her a bit of good news. Prayers for you and star!


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## Trickyroo

Praying !


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## BCG

My goodness. You're going to need a relaxing vacation after this is all over! You need a barn camera at night and a quiet place to nap in the afternoons! Hang in there, you're doing a great job!


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## Crossroads Boers

I'm looking forward to having this over with for sure.  It's been too long of a stretch of sick pregnant goats. It would be nice to have a success story this time. 

I don't know if I should induce her. My very knowledgeable goat friend Leslie from Leaning Tree told me I should follow what the vet said and induce her. I just can't seem to bring myself to be ok with that. Should I? 

Star didn't eat anything this morning other than a few bites of hay.  She still has really, really bad diarrhea. Is Pepto Bismol the best thing for that with her?


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## J.O.Y. Farm

I think you should pray about what to do.. Only you can make that choice to induce her now... 

I think the pepto should help with her diarrhea.. Worth a shot I would say...

I will be thinking & praying about you guys all day :hug:
Sorry I don't have better advice..


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## MsScamp

Victoria, I can see pro's and con's for inducing her - what are your instincts and gut telling you to do?


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## Axykatt

Well, if it takes several days for induction to proceed it might be time. You don't want to wait too long, and it seems like she's struggling more. You know Star and you know your own limits, so the choice is up to you. No matter what you decide it will be the right choice. All our thoughts and prayers are with you! :hug:


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## bayouboergoats

I would give pepto that is my first go to when they get diarrhea.


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## nchen7

that's a rock and a hard place for you. only you know your goat the best. go with your gut. :hug:

would drenching more fluids in her help her out like it did last night?

my heart goes to out to you!


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## 7blessings

I agree with J.O.Y. Farm, pray about this decision, Victoria. Also, give the Pepto to help relieve her discomfort and diarrhea, and wait for His answer. I know if it were our family, we would probably move forward with the induction if the life of the doe was at stake. I wouldn't ever be "okay" with doing it, and my heart would be breaking for the possible loss of the babies...but I would take the advice of two or more professionals in this situation.

Knowing that there will be a loss of life when agreeing to a procedure, prompts our first instincts to be "NO WAY!", and to try and hold out the inevitable as long as possible. We ask for wisdom and help, but sometimes the painful answer is not what we are wanting or willing to hear. It's a normal response in wanting to protect ourselves from hurting and desiring another outcome. You've waited 5 exciting months for Star's sweet babies, and it's suddenly a shock trying to come to terms, with how quickly the end result has changed. I am so, so sorry you are struggling through these challenging times, I really wish I had the answers to pull Star through all this. Our family is still praying for you all! ~ Erin

John 14:47 NKJV 
"Peace I live with you, My peace I give to you; not as the world gives do I give to you. Let not your heart be troubled, neither let it be afraid."

2 Corinthians 1:3-4 NKJV 
"Blessed _be_ the God and Father of our Lord Jesus Christ, the Father of mercies and God of all comfort, who comforts us in all our tribulation, that we may be able to comfort those who are in any trouble, with the comfort with which we ourselves are comforted by God."


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## NubianFan

I have never even had a goat kid out at my place so keep that in mind whenever I say anything. That said, I think I would induce today. Here are my reasons, she was visibly uncomfortable and having difficulty eating to the point last night that we wondered if she might be in labor. She is beginning to wane in her energy level. You are going to be gone all day Sunday so if she gets worse after this things are going to be harder to deal with. Your vet, and Leslie from Leaning tree are both advising induction. I feel like the kids will survive if she is induced now. What you don't want is to wait until she can't deal with labor. That takes a lot of energy and you don't want her to go into labor or induction then labor with so little reserves of energy left that she doesn't make it. Honestly, this is just my very inexperienced gut talking, but my gut feeling is, she needs those kids out of her, and I feel like if she gets them out now, both she and the kids will survive. I don't think you will lose the kids. I know that is your biggest fear. 
As everyone else said though, you know your goat best. The decision is yours. And we will all stand by you and keep you in our prayers regardless.


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## springkids

It's a hard decision that only you can make but there is HOPE. I had a set of twins come last spring 16 days to early. Momma had no milk and they were only about 3 lbs each. They were a total surprise to find and were almost dead. They had gotten very cold. They couldn't lift their heads untill they were 3 days old. The little buck died at 5 days but the little doe is still with us and is as sweet as can be. At 5 days old she began to stand with a little help and at 7 days could go anywhere she wanted.

There is HOPE. You are much better prepared than we were. The choice will be difficult however you decide but the important thing is to learn from this and know that no matter how things turn out you did your best for Star and have no regrets....

I will be thinking of you and your girls.....


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## 7blessings

Before we bought our Nigerian doe, her previous owner was shocked when she kidded at 140 days with triplets (her fourth pregnancy), and they all survived.  Her prior deliveries were normal 152 days. There is always hope!


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## milk and honey

Agree with prayer and pepto...(I think that may be my new life modo? I can see that on a t-shirt..) 
I really respect your decision to wait up till now...you have different priorities than your vet, and you know your goats. My thoughts and prayers are with you...


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## springkids

I really like the t-shirt idea......The things goat people do.....


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

For the diarrhea, kaopectate is my first choice, and pepto to follow is a good idea.

So she's got 15 days to go? I'm so sorry you've been having all these problems, talk about a rock and a hard place. I'm not sure if I would induce just yet, if she can hold on another couple days that would be ideal, but if not, then all you can do try. You've been doing everything under the sun for her, hopefully things will permanently start looking up.


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## toth boer goats

I am sorry, you are having to go through this, prayers for your Doe and her kids. No matter what your decision is, it is never wrong. Only you can decide if you want to induce her or not.


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## Crossroads Boers

Thank you all so much... I'm really struggling with this. I don't understand why things are going so terribly wrong this year. First Poli, now Star. 

I just drenched her with some grain, which she seemed to really like. We have gotten a whole 160z bottle of Gatorade down her, and 30 ounces of water since last night. 

At this point I think we should induce today... thanks Leslie for your post. That really helped change my mind. If she kids Saturday, that would be day 139. I absolutely can NOT have her kidding Sunday, and if we wait until Saturday to induce, it could be too late for Star. 

We have a long drive into town to get all the stuff we need, so I still need to think and pray about what to do. I'm so torn. Please keep praying we'll make the right decision.


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## 8566

Yikes - just jumped on.

I would give Star high levels of VitB SQ. Like 8cc - 10cc twice to three times a day for the next 3 days. The runs might kick up Polio and it sure can't hurt.

Probios often / day.

And something I use from Fir Meadows for upset stomachs. Can't remember the name but it has cinammon in it. Makes me choke every time I fix it up to drench. It is a powder. Pepto but there are other things that will dry them up like a horse product called Sponge. If you're going to town maybe see what the feedstore has.

HTH and sending prayers for 4 and 2 legged.



Add On -
She could of took on the 1st heat cycle.

But with lil ones on the way below is what I do and maybe you do to or it could help.

I get a big plastic storage container. Line with towels - heating pad - and then towels again. Once those babies are born I move them inside with warm air for their lungs and turn on the heating pad. Give meds and stimulate if needed.

For me it's getting them into warm air during cold kiddings.

Huggs


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## 7blessings

To increase the possibility of preemie babies surviving, should they be given extra care/stay inside the house?


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## Crossroads Boers

Oh gosh, I don't want to hear polio... That was so horribly with Poli. We have been giving 6cc of vit B complex 3 times a day orally. We can give it SQ too though. 

Yes she could have taken then. That would have been a due date of 12/7 I think... or 12/8. I can't remember. I have a ? after that breeding though. I have a definite breeding marked for 12/11. 

I am planning on taking the kids inside. It's not terribly cold out, but I'm sure that would be best for them. Is there no hope of keeping just 1 on Star though? I know she's got 3 in there...


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## Crossroads Boers

Some pics from just now... Poor Cosmo!


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## ksalvagno

With what she has been through, I would probably just bottle feed. But you can see how things go.


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## Crossroads Boers

Forgot to mention this... she had a temp of 101.9 this morning, and the ketone strip was negative again. ???


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## nchen7

oh my...those are some big girls!


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## HoukFarms

Just read this whole thread :tears: for all of the support coming your way !! it will all work out


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## NubianFan

Cosmo looks like she is posing in the first pic with a smile on her face saying "see my loverly baby belleh" LOL


----------



## ksalvagno

Thst is such a hard decision. Hard to give advice when not physically looking at her. You know your animals and you will know when it is time. Keeping you in my prayers. :hugs:


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## Tenacross

I feel guilty saying this... It's none of my business at this point...

I'd wait. Especially *if* you can get the diarrhea under control.
Especially since Sunday is a bad day. She might not have them on Saturday like she's supposed to.
Especially if she likes the Noble Goat milk shake. 
Especially if she is still moving around.
Especially since you are so close and a couple of days can make a difference for the babies.

If you already gave her the shot. I'm totally behind that too. I'm rooting for you girls.


----------



## HoosierShadow

I'm praying for your girls, I can't believe poor Star is going through this. Such a shame. I'd be losing my mind, so I feel for you! 
Please keep us up to date as I know you will. Thoughts and prayers are going your way ♥


----------



## Crossroads Boers

I 100% agree with you Tim... but what if she goes down and get's really weak, say tomorrow? I can't induce her tomorrow, as she could kid Sunday. Now seems like a good time while she is still active and strong... but I absolutely do not want to induce her if I don't have to. This is harder than the decision to induce Poli... My hope is to wait until Saturday to induce her. It's either then or today if she doesn't improve. We still need to make our trip into town to get the Dex, Lute, BoSe, Dopram, and a big list of other things... I'm currently waiting for two vets to call me back with conformation of getting those injections.


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## Crossroads Boers

Danette has frozen colostrum we can pick up, and the vet just said they'll get the injections ready. That's a relief... 

I'm going to go dose Star again here soon before we leave. We'll be gone for a good part of the day, so I hope she'll be ok.


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

Sending prayers your way. If you need help bottle feeding, let me know. 3 would be quite the handful! Poor Cosmo looks like a blimp! You girls are doing great, just keep up the good work.


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## toth boer goats

Crossroads Boers said:


> Forgot to mention this... she had a temp of 101.9 this morning, and the ketone strip was negative again. ???


 She is back to normal? Oh man, making that decision is even a Harder one then, what a difficult decision to make. I would hold off, but she isn't my goat. 
There is no way, for someone to stay home on Sunday with her? Just asking? No matter what you decide, I pray, it all works out.
It is good, she is back to a normal reading and her temp is good. Have you mentioned this to your vet or mentor?


----------



## Texaslass

I love Cosmo, she's so purty.  Still praying for you. ray: I'm sure it'll come out all right.  :thumbup:


----------



## springkids

Come on Star YOU CAN DO THIS!! We are all pulling for you!!:thumb:


----------



## loggyacreslivestock

Praying, praying, praying.


----------



## HoukFarms

Finger crossed hope all is going well


----------



## NWIndianaBoers

What are you giving to induce? When I induce average kidding is 36 hrs later. Ranges from 30-42 I would say. Had one that went later last year. If she is weakened and isn't progressing by the time you hit 40 hrs you can just go in and check with a couple fingers. If the kids are right there you can assist. If they aren't there is probably a kid coming out wrong. A guy I know induces with higher dosages and his kid within 30hrs of shots. 

I use dexamethasone at 5-7cc depending on size of doe and lute at 2-3cc. Your doe would fall in that high range obviously.


----------



## fezz09

I have been following along with poli's thread and now this thread... I feel terrible for you! And of course your poor ladies. It has been a rough season for you and your goats!! Your in my thoughts constantly!! I hope everything works itself out for the better! Hang in their, your strength is inspiring, and I only hope if(god forbid) I ever find myself in your situation I have the strength, courage and most of all endless amounts of love to carry me through! Good luck


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## NubianFan

I don't know if this helps any Victoria, but I have always been told to trust my gut and I most usually do. I have found that when I don't I wish I would have. When Poli was down I was rooting so hard for you guys and I wanted everything to turn out fine, but I will admit, every time I saw you had posted on that thread I dreaded reading it because I kept thinking this is going to be the time she tells us that Poli has passed. 
I don't have that feeling this time. I just feel like things are going to be okay. I don't know if that gives you any peace of mind whatsoever from a stranger's gut across the country. But I just know, I am not opening the thread in dread each time.


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## HoukFarms

Fingers crossed !! Hope all is going well


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## Frosty

:whatgoat: Just been catching up on reading this thread got a little behind. Thinking of you and praying that all goes well. I know you will make the best decision for your cercomstances. Keeping you in my thoughts and prayers


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## Crossroads Boers

Whew... that was a long day in town. Sorry for the late update...  We've got Dex. (5cc) and Lute (2cc) on hand now, but we decided to wait to induce her.  She is still doing quite well! I am excited. When we got to the barn Star promptly walked in, stuck her head in the feeder and started eating away at the alfalfa! That was great to see her eating. She still didn't want any grain though. 

We drenched her with 32 oz of water, Dextrose, CMPK, Nutri-Drench, Vit B, Karo and Pepto Bismol again tonight... She didn't have any smears on her rear end when we got back. I rinsed her off real good back there before we left to see if the diarrhea continued, and it doesn't look like it was as bad as it used to be. It is still pretty wet though... just not sticking under her tail. According to the friend I talked with for a while today, it's the blackberry leaves doing that. That's about all she'll eat right now, so we've been giving her lots. 

We tried to get a stomach tube in her... and that didn't go real well. I kept listening in the funnel to make sure it wasn't in her lungs, and all I would hear is really loud gurgling.... so I thought we had it right. But she would FREAK out and start muffled screaming right before we put the fluid in, so we'd pull it out immediately, as we were freaked out too. We did that about 4 times and she would absolutely freak out every time just when we'd get it to the mark on the tube, or several inches from it. 

My sisters, brother, dad and I are the worship/music team at our church this Sunday morning... We can't just bow out of that. We usually get back around 12:30, leaving at 7. My mom could stay home, but she'd be clueless as to what to do with kidding...

THANK YOU ALL for your support!! We are grateful!! 

Happy Thanksgiving eve!!


----------



## littlegoatgirl

Prayers, prayers, and more prayers! I do agree worth Leslie though. With Poli, a piece of me always knew what the end was going to be like. Here with star, I don't dread reading your posts in case she passed. I think he's going to make it through this and hopefully have some happy, healthy babies!


----------



## nchen7

I think Star is going to make it! You are doing great with her, keep up the amazing work, and I can't wait to see some bouncing babies!


----------



## toth boer goats

I am so glad, you are holding off on inducing, the longer you wait and see, especially if she is doing OK is wise. 
The closer she is too her kidding date, will be such a relief as well. She is sounding really good and hanging in there.

Glad she is eating hay that is a plus, if you want to get some grain/ alfalfa pellets(if she wasn't eating at all). Blend up some in a blender with some water making so it will easily go through a big 30 or 60 cc syringe and feed it very slowly, at the back corner of her mouth, with breaks in between. Make each batch new. 

Prayers sent and Happy Thanksgiving to you and your family.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Pam! We have been making a Noble Goat/Calf-Manna slushie for her starting yesterday afternoon. We have been making about 1/2 a pound each time and giving it at B-fast, Lunch and dinner. She likes the slushie, but won't eat grain plain. 

I am so hoping we can hold her off at least until day 141, it would be awesome if we could maker her last longer. We'll see...

Happy Thanksgiving to you too, Pam!


----------



## Trickyroo

lol how are you ever going to get her back to eating "plain grain" again !
Too funny , that Star is something else  Good for her for liking 
slushies ! I mean , who doesn't ?


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Lol!!


----------



## toth boer goats

Happy thanksgiving to you too.

LOL, I agree slushie's are good. She is getting spoiled on them, but that is OK, she deserves it.

It is looking really good for her, for holding on. God bless  :grin:


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Just drenched her with everything again. She had her head buried in the hay feeder when I first went out there! 

She's lost just about all the weight she had on her... She is all bones.  For that reason alone I wouldn't want to leave kids on her, but I'm still hoping we can keep a doeling on her, as I want to keep one. I have never kept a bottle kid... but we may have to make an exception here. I really want a doeling from Star.


----------



## bayouboergoats

Glad to hear she is still hanging in there for you!

Happy thanksgiving!

Hope she is still doing well


----------



## Frosty

Just stopped in to see how things are going. Glad to hear she is hanging in there for you. Keeping you both in my thoughts and prayers.


----------



## TrinityRanch

Wow, I just caught up on everything happening here. Haven't been on here in a while! So sorry to hear about Poli's passing, but you guys did all that you could.  I am glad see that Star is doing better and Cosmo is well! You work so hard to keep your goats the best that they can be. I always love coming on here to see that people treat their animals with such care, as if they were family!

I can't believe that it is almost time for these girls to have their babies. It seems like just yesterday you were planning when they would be bred.  Happy Thanksgiving!!


----------



## loggyacreslivestock

What a nice Thanksgiving gift! Hoping and praying Star stays strong and continues getting better until her official due date. Happy Thanksgiving!


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## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> I have never kept a bottle kid... but we may have to make an exception here.


Well, if it makes any difference, I have 2 bottle babies in my herd and they are a dream to kid out. Shuffling from pen to pen - not so much - but it isn't that all that big of a deal, just start out a little earlier and be patient. :laugh:


----------



## Jessica84

Ohhh I hate bottle kids as well but end up having the kids talk me into keeping them lol.......we had 5 this year. With the tubing she probably just didn't like it being in her. After I read that there is a BIG difference in length between the lugs and stomach that's when I said ohhhh I can do this and only hit the lungs once and that was with a dying kid .
I bet this girl will surprise you and when kidding time comes shell be fine......she might be pulling your leg for attention lol.....I put nothing past my goats


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## Crossroads Boers

Well, the routine tonight didn't go well at all.... we went to drench her with the normal stuff and she acted like it was the worst stuff she had ever tasted. She was NOT taking any of it well at ALL. She would clamp her mouth shut so tight every time I went to get the syringe in her mouth. She spit lots of the grain smoothie out tonight and didn't seem to like that one bit either. It was awful... I was so worried we were going to get some fluid in her lungs, and fear we may have. She keeps coughing every 5 minutes or so, just once. She has been grinding her teeth almost non stop all evening, and is the dullest she's ever been. 

Temp is at 102.0. Ketone strips still negative.... Babies are super active. 

We currently have 4 adult bottle babies... 2 of which are the worst goats we own! Absolutely no fear of anything. They are the meanest two goats to the rest of the herd, and are destructive on fencing, trying to smash goats across the fence... I didn't raise any of these 4, but fear mine would be even worse!


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Oh yeah, bottle babies are not cool, sometimes downright dangerous if you aren't strict with them.

I'm so sorry Star is giving you so much trouble! She has to be so uncomfortable with all those babies though, twins made my sister miserable when she was pregnant.
Just keep trying, that's all anyone can do. Hang in there! And hope you had a great Thanksgiving!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Lacie.  We had a wonderful Thanksgiving.  

I'm one of quads... so my mom tells me all the time, "oh don't worry honey, I know she's just uncomfortable with all those babies, I know how it feels!".


----------



## BCG

You yourself are a quad? Wow! Not too many people can say that.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

I heard! I can't imagine having quads! Cheers to her for not going insane, I wouldn't be able to do it! :cheers:

And I finally got around to posting a thread of my boer babies  they are the thread Leaning Tree Boer Kids


----------



## MsScamp

My 2 bottle babies are not mean or destructive at all. In fact, they are among the most timid in the herd and rarely ever cause a problem except for being underfoot most of the time and not wanting to move while I'm shuffling groups from pen to pen. Ebbie will be 3 the 26th of May, and Kahlua will be a yearling the 22nd of March.


----------



## Axykatt

Peg is a bottle baby, and quite frankly she is dangerous to non-goat people. She thinks people are her herd, and while goat people have the correct body language non-goat people tend to be nervous around horns and she can tell. She bullies my female guests whenever she thinks I'm not watching. 

To be fair, however, she has never been troublesome with me and respects my place as herd queen/mommy. She is also very sweet and well behaved for other goat people. 

Bottle raising is a huge hassle, though, regardless of the goat's temperament!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Some great news would be her diarrhea has stopped... Yay.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

BCG said:


> You yourself are a quad? Wow! Not too many people can say that.


Yep.  3 girls and a boy. My parents had 5 kids in diapers for a while...


----------



## Axykatt

:hug:

Hang in there, yer in the home stretch...


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Crossroads Boers said:


> Yep.  3 girls and a boy. My parents had 5 kids in diapers for a while...


At least you were all practically the same age so you all could play together!


----------



## bayouboergoats

Whoo hoo! 

Diarrhea is gone!!!!
Cone on Star!!!!


----------



## bayouboergoats

bayouboergoats said:


> Whoo hoo! Diarrhea is gone!!!! Come on Star!!!!


Edited to fix a typo on spelling!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

The soft poop is back...  Star is acting really miserable still. Grinding her teeth a bunch and moaning with every breath. It sounds different, almost like a whining human kid. She is very dull too and didn't even look at me when I walked in the barn. 

It's 3:30 am. I wasn't sure what I should give her at this hour...? I gave her 1oz of Karo, water and pepto. I still think the molasses and corn oil are upsetting her stomach, but we have been giving that the last day or two. 

We just ran out of Nutri-Drench... we stopped giving proplene, but should I give it to her at the 7am feeding? I don't want to put a lot of faith in the strips, but they are still at negative. I don't know what's causing her to act this way other than PT though. She absolutely hates the PG, and is going to fight it horribly. 

Caroline and I decided to induce her this Monday... unless she starts eating on her own. She's getting worse and worse, and drenching is becoming a nightmare as she isn't taking it well. Even water is a battle to get down her. She is getting really good at spitting stuff out, and will hold it in her mouth for as long as I hold her mouth shut, then as soon as I let go she'll frantically spit it out. I'm running out of patience, and am really exhausted from doing this for weeks.


----------



## nchen7

:hug: i'm so sorry Victoria. C'mon Star! You can hang in there a little big longer!!!


----------



## Trickyroo

Something is telling me not to force her to take anything else.
IDK , but something tells me she is trying to tell you she can't take anymore drench or anything else right now. Maybe just give her a bit of time and see if she tries to take it on her own. Im afraid with all the struggling it just may go down the lungs. I don't know Victoria , but I think your right about inducing her Monday if not sooner. This is coming straight from the heart mind you . Im praying for all of you .


----------



## Jessica84

Sorry I guess I jenxed you  .........yeah maybe give her a few hours and if she's still a pain about drenching I would get down and dirty with her and put that tube in her. But also keep a eye on her and make sure she's not in labor. Are you still doing vit b????


----------



## BCG

I would definitely cut out the corn oil for sure. We've never had Any luck using it and our animals always scoured on it.

On a different note, your parents must have an incredible amount of patients...or drank a lot! LOL. That many kids in diapers all at once...uugh....couldn't image!


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch

Personally, if it was me I would only be giving her Pepto, probios and electrolytes, and hope that the first two settle her stomach enough that she'll have an appetite. Separate her for part of the day and give her a buffet and see if she decides to eat anything. I think continuing to drench her with various things is going to continue to upset her digestion.


----------



## nchen7

BCG said:


> On a different note, your parents must have an incredible amount of patients...or drank a lot! LOL. That many kids in diapers all at once...uugh....couldn't image!


that's what I was thinking! lol. I think I would need about 3 full time nannies/housekeepers just to help me keep my sanity!


----------



## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> Yep.  3 girls and a boy. My parents had 5 kids in diapers for a while...


Oh wow, how cool is that!?!?! I wouldn't have wanted to have to keep up with their laundry, though! :laugh:


----------



## toth boer goats

For appetite maybe keep up the fortified vit B shots and probiotics for sure, her rumen may of gone off. Seeings her temp is OK. 
Stop the grain for now in case it is causing the upset, because she was OK with it for a while and when they get a bit too much their rumen can go off.
It is good she is eating hay so allow her to do so, make sure she gets exercise too. Prayers sent.


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## MsScamp

I have to agree with everyone else about drenching. If Star is going to fight you, there is a good chance of her or her kids getting hurt and I know you don't want that.


----------



## Used2bmimi

Victoria, .....from the heart.....you don't know me, but we have all been praying for you and waiting with you, ....here are my two cents. YOU DESERVE FORBEARANCE FROM YOUR CONGREGATION. If you need to induce your doe, and it sounds like you do, (on the advice of your vet and from the sounds of your posts) you need to make plans to have a different worship team play this week. There is time to do that and we are not just talking about a goat's life here, we are talking about your emotional needs and the financial loss to your program which are important too. Your congregation will understand and I am sure if they knew what was going on they would encourage you to take care of your needs. Be brave, ask for help, and do what you have to do. Again, just my two cents for what they are worth.


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## NubianFan

Sounds like she is getting tired Victoria. Prayers still coming. I think you should definitely induce Monday if not before. I agree with Mimi your congregation may just have to understand.


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## Crossroads Boers

Thank you all for your support and advice.  We did induce her at 9 this morning...  Our worship team will just have to do without a cello (me). When should I expect kids? We gave 5cc of Dex and 2cc of lute. 

We cut way back on what we gave her this morning.. just CMPK, Dextrose for energy and a Vit B injection. We also have given pepto a couple times now. Her diarrhea is HORRIBLE now. It just runs out of her like water. We've been giving her lots of water too. 

She has been quietly bleating now while standing even...non-stop, almost like baby talking... but not. It's sad.

We made sure she got lots of excersise this morning.

We have been giving 10ml of Probios paste every night... is that sufficient?


----------



## nchen7

BEST OF LUCK! I will be glued to this thread, anxiously waiting on babies (not like I wasn't glued to it before).

you play cello?!?! I LOVE the cello. I played violin growing up.

you can do this Star!!! we're all rooting for you!!!!!


----------



## Cactus_Acres

Yet another vote for take a hiatus from church this Sunday if needed. I mean, surely part of your family could go and change it up (it's officially the holidays now, so a bunch of congregation participation carols could be done in a pinch). It's an "ox in the ditch" kind of situation. 

I know, it may also be something your family just plain enjoys doing. I understand, I really do. I love singing, and at previous churches have been in the church choir. I did plenty of solos/special music from my mid teens on up. My youngest child was a choir baby from before he was born, until he was probably a year old (he was a nursing baby and preferred to be with me than hang in the nursery). 

That being said, I have had to skip out on stuff I enjoyed for various reasons.

What would your plan be if one of your family came down sick before Sunday, and wouldn't be healthy enough to attend (and please don't say they would tough it out - my seven year old still gets a croupy, almost asthmatic cough every time he gets upper respiratory issues, all because he had a case of bronchiolitis/mild RSV as a two month old, which he likely caught from someone at church who just thought they had a cold)? Things happen, so what would your backup plan be?


----------



## Cactus_Acres

Well, I guess I was behind on the times. Best of luck (and prayers) for you and her.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

nchen7 said:


> BEST OF LUCK! I will be glued to this thread, anxiously waiting on babies (not like I wasn't glued to it before).
> 
> you play cello?!?! I LOVE the cello. I played violin growing up.
> 
> you can do this Star!!! we're all rooting for you!!!!!


Thank you! Yes, I have played for 3 or 4 years now.  I played the violin for 5 years, but the cello won me over.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Anywhere from 24-36 hours and you should have kids. I'll be praying all goes well ray:


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Do you have kaopectate? Or an anti diarrheal for her?


----------



## J.O.Y. Farm

So sorry Victoria :hug: hope it all goes smoothly and her and the kids will all be ok.. Praying still! :hug:


----------



## Trickyroo

Yes , maybe something to stop the diarrhea . Everything you put in her is running out the other end . Maybe stop until her stool is better ?
Please Star , keep fighting baby girl , you can do this !


----------



## toth boer goats

Praying for the best for her. Hope her and her babies will be OK.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Trickyroo said:


> Yes , maybe something to stop the diarrhea . Everything you put in her is running out the other end . Maybe stop until her stool is better ?


Maybe stop what? ^

We tried Specto-Gard, that didn't seem to help any. The 2 feed stores we have here didn't have Kaopectate.


----------



## milk and honey

You should be able to get Kao at any pharmacy..?


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Is it possible to give too much pepto? We've given Star a lot in the past day or two... 

Really? ^ The nearest pharmacy is 45 minutes away.


----------



## Trickyroo

Pepto has aspirin in it unless you are using the children's version.
The aspirin could harm the belly. Don't use Imodium on any animal since it can trap the bad bacteria inside the gut. Just saying.
I was thinking about stopping whatever you are giving her until her stool improves or at least firms up a bit.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Do you have any grocery stores near you? They carry kaopectate. Some gas stations do to.

I'd hold off on the pepto for a a few hours.


----------



## liz

I've not posted as all advice has been thorough and good, I do send my prayers for you and your family and that Star can pull through this :hug:


----------



## littlegoatgirl

Prayers! Hoping star and her kids all end up okay


----------



## Riverside Fainters

I have been a silent person on the thread but have been following along the whole time. I hope everything goes well for Star and you..


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Little-Bits-N-Pieces said:


> Do you have any grocery stores near you? They carry kaopectate. Some gas stations do to.
> 
> I'd hold off on the pepto for a a few hours.


Yes, I'll go look... 

I know the CMPK isn't causing the diarrhea as she's been getting that for weeks. Same with the vit B... those are the only things we have given her today other than Dextrose. Dextrose couldn't be the problem, could it?


----------



## ksalvagno

Can you get Biosponge? That stuff works really good. Sometimes the vet will have it.


----------



## HoukFarms

So I have a question sorry if this offends you in anyway :/ umm because you induced her does that mean the babies will survive or that you killed them?


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Well, we sure are hoping and praying that the kids will live. They will be 10-11 days early, but I have heard of lots of kids born then or later and still surviving. I sure would hate to lose the kids after all we have gone through the last 3 weeks and all of the $ we have spent! 

All I can do is pray that they will be ok....

I'm off to see if the local grocery store carries kaopectin...


----------



## TrinityRanch

Praying for Star and her babies!! I hope everyone will pull through this fine.


----------



## HoukFarms

Crossroads Boers said:


> Well, we sure are hoping and praying that the kids will live. They will be 10-11 days early, but I have heard of lots of kids born then or later and still surviving. I sure would hate to lose the kids after all we have gone through the last 3 weeks and all of the $ we have spent!
> 
> All I can do is pray that they will be ok....
> 
> I'm off to see if the local grocery store carries kaopectin...


Sorry if I was offensive in anyway I didn't mean you were doing a bad job with her by any means I was just curious


----------



## Crossroads Boers

No problem, I know you weren't.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

The store didn't have either of those...


----------



## Frosty

Thinking of you and praying that the birth goes smoothly and the kids and mama are all okay. Will keep checking back to see how its going. So sorry this is happening to you. Sending you hugs and prayers for strength for the time to come..


----------



## MsScamp

Victoria, you and Star are in my thoughts and prayers. Both of you have been through so much, but I'm hoping and praying that all is well in the end. Hang in there, hon! Please give Star a hug and kiss for me, and ask her to give you one for me. ray: ray: :hug:


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thank you both.  

Star just at about 6 handfuls of orchard grass. :applaud::applaud::applaud:  She hadn't eaten anything all day, not even the blackberry leaves I offered her. We didn't drench her with any grain either, so I was quite worried. 

She still has aweful diarrhea. I don't know where it's all coming from. Her stomach has to be empty by now! 

Caroline just called the store in Morton, and the do have kao. I think she's going to go get it now, so hopefully that will help!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Some pictures from this morning... I have hopes to graft a doeling from Star onto Cosmo once Cosmo kids. Cosmo should/could kid in 5-7 days. Only problem is, we'd have to teach Star's kid how to nurse... Then we'd have 3 of Cosmo's kids to find homes for as bottle kids!! She's almost definitely got 4. I have two people who want bottle doelings, so hopefully we won't get a bunch of bucks! 

Regan, can you take a bottle kid back with you??


----------



## littlegoatgirl

You in my thoughts and prayers! I hope the store has it!!! You deserve some good. After Poli, now Star. You need to have Star pull through and have healthy babies, you deserve it! Prayers!! :hug:


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

I was just about to say i would take a bottle buck for you, and then i saw your post lol!! Great minds think alike!! 

I'll help you guys out in any way that i can, whether that be bottle kids, or anything else. I'm thinking about coming down a few days early- the 3rd. I'm just anxious to get my doe from leaning tree home and then as soon as im back in utah, I'm driving to wyoming to picking up my new wild mustang mare!!

But all that aside, i would love to take a bottle baby for you. I'm such a sucker for bottle babies- love them to death! I had a bottle buckling three years ago that was my best buddy.

If possible, id still like my cosmo doe kid too!!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Okay, we got kao from the store.  

Cool Regan!! THANKS! That's awesome. If you come too early, your gonna miss Cosmo's kids!! She's due the 6th at the very soonest, probably after.


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

Hmmm maybe i go get my horse first and then come to you guys the 7th and 8th and 9th? I'M staying the night with leslie on the 7th and then maybe on the 8th, i'll drive up to you and stay in a motel or something and then drive home the 9th? Its too long of a drive to drive from soap lake to mossyrock and back in one day. Or maybe i drive to you guys early in the morning, stay for an hour or two then drive the 12 hours home lol. So many options haha! Let me know what you guys think!


----------



## Used2bmimi

If there are bottle bucklings and Regan is coming through Colorado on I-70 I will take one and figure out how to pay you! Edited to add...if that works for Regan to drop him off.


----------



## nancy d

Is it my imagination or has she dropped?
Victoria I'd hold off on blackberry leaves for now. Has she been eating a lot of them?


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

Used2bmimi said:


> If there are bottle bucklings and Regan is coming through Colorado on I-70 I will take one and figure out how to pay you! Edited to add...if that works for Regan to drop him off.


I live in salt lake city, so i wont be going through CO, unfortunately! Sorry


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

I'd give her the whole bottle of kao (8oz).

Lol, if you weren't so far away I'd be happy to help you with the bottle babies, but alas, you're more than 24 hours away from me, round trip!


----------



## nancy d

I have _heard_ that CMPK depletes thiamine. If anyone knows for sure please let Victoria know.


----------



## Used2bmimi

Ok Regan, your location is listed as Kansas.:-D sorry to make assumptions. I could get to Salt Lake if everything works out though.


----------



## lauraanimal1

Crossroads, wish I could get a kid, buck or doeling from you. If there was a way we could get one to Laramie Wy. I'd do it, If we can find a way I would take all that you needed to be bottle fed for ya I actually love that kind of stuff. Tons of tall deep prayers for you and star and cosmo (so she will be ok and take a kid) :hugs::scratch:ray:ray:ray:ray::whatgoat:


----------



## HoukFarms

Has she dropped yet?


----------



## Frosty

Glad to see you got the kao. stopped in to see how things are going. Prayers still being sent your way. Wish I was closer to help.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

I don't know about that, haven't heard anything on it, but in order to give a doe enough calcium with CMPK it gives them to much potassium. You have to keep it balanced.
Dolomite had balanced levels and a lot of people prefer to use that instead.


----------



## Scottyhorse

I'll talk to my parents about feeding a bottle baby... My dad works in Bothell. Not sure how they'll think about another goat, but maybe they will be ok with a baby for 3 months. I'll let you know.


----------



## toth boer goats




----------



## BCG

Los like you have lots of options for bottle babies! LOL

If the kao doesn't do the job....go to the feed store and buy a bottle of Scour Halt. It is a pig product, but works great on sheep and goats. It's in a pump bottle. Give adult 8-10 pumps and the scours will stop or slow down within a few hours. This is an incredible product for managing scours. I'd recommend it to anyone. There is a 21 day withdrawl I believe, so keep that in mind if ever using on market animals.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

I believe she tried the scour halt and it didn't work.


----------



## BCG

Little-Bits-N-Pieces said:


> I believe she tried the scour halt and it didn't work.


You are correct...I just read back 4 pages. Hmm...

How much did you give, Victoria?


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Sounds great Regan, whatever you want to do. We'll be here! 

We have been giving Thiamine every 2-3 days... 

She hadn't eaten anything before those pictures. She's just sunken in. We hadn't even induced her yet in those pics! 

Oh whoa... okay. We just gave 1 ounce of kao! I guess we'll go give more! 

I also had an ounce of the specto-gard left... so it probably wasn't even enough to work. 

She has eaten LOTS of orchard grass, and has been grazing for a while now!!!!! :stars::stars: I'm so happy. Now if we can just get the diarrhea under control...


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Ok, give her 3 more ounces of the kao and the other half in about an hour.

So glad she's eating!!!


----------



## milk and honey

I'm 2-3 hours north... If you need help with bottle babies...? Or anything?


----------



## Trickyroo

Oh man I wish I was closer , I would take a bottle baby off ya hands Victoria  Sounds like you got a lot of good friends offering to help you out already 
Glad to hear she is eating again !!!! Good girl Star


----------



## Scottyhorse

Parents said no way on the bottle feeding, we'd end up keeping it :lol: Sorry


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

Thats why i loveeee living on my own! No parents to say no to bottle babies


----------



## NubianFan

I wanna see beautiful healthy babies!!:baby::girl::girl::boy::kidblack::kidred::kidred::kidblue:


----------



## Jessica84

Wow things got crazy since I last posted!! First Victoria you did awesome. I know your stressed about the kids but star is your girl so I have your back 100% on your decision. 
The scour med you are using I have never had luck with it on anything older then a few weeks. I have had great results with neomycin.....actually just used it yesterday  one dose went from total runs to dog poop looking stuff.
Since these kids are gonna be a bit early I would make plans to keep them in the house. I did a lot of reading on my preemies and every site I read said that they have a hard time maintaining their body heat and to keep them out of any kind of draft even a celling fan. I asked goathiker for help with them and she told me to give some vit b and ......cod oil??? Liver cod oil.....I can't find my bottle but after I gave those in the morning it was like they were different kids and had so much straight. 
You guys are in my thoughts and I'll keep checking in on ya....good luck
PS I do NOT want a bottle kid lol


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Neomycin works great, also known as biosol incase anyone ever needs to know.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

I am really nervous about tomorrow... I want the babies to be living so badly! And they better not be white with brown heads and little danglies between their legs.... :roll::hair::doh: I want a dapple/spotted/paint doeling. Don't care which, just one of those.  And living would be nice.  

:thankU::thankU::thankU: All!!!  Thanks for the advice Jessica... 

Thanks Milk and Honey! We'll see how things go...


----------



## Trickyroo

How is our little lady Star doing ?


----------



## MsScamp

This is agony! I want so badly for Star and her kids to be ok, I'm about to go crazy! How is she doing? How are you doing? How is Caroline doing? Morning is such a long ways away. :GAAH:


----------



## 7blessings

Victoria, our family would love to care for one of your bottle babies, if need be. We have 7 homeschooling children here (3 of them teenagers), who can care for a little one round the clock. You're not too far away in Mossyrock from us! We'd be willing to care for him or her, and give it back for you to sell, when ready. Or until someone from out of state can pick him/her up....Just wanted to throw that idea out there for you! We've bottle raised a Mini Nubian kid in the past (on goats milk), and she was such a jewel. We raise LaManchas and Nigerians now.

~ Erin


----------



## bayouboergoats

Eeek! Just got caught up! Good luck! Sending live healthy doeling prayers!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

THANK YOU Erin!!! We can be in touch. You're wonderful! 

Her ligs are just about gone now... she still has HORRIBLE diarrhea!!! :scratch::sigh::hair: 

Just heard from a long lost friend and I told her about Star. She said they induced their doe 2 years ago at 10 days from her due date, and they lost all 3 of the kids. That wasn't very encouraging! Does anybody have a success story with preemie kids they could share?? I need to hear one of those.


----------



## Trickyroo

Im praying for Star and her babies Victoria . We are all thinking positive here . Star is a very special girl and the power of prayer is amazing. ray::hug:


----------



## Wlschwallenberg

Sending lots of prayers and positive thoughts for Star and those babies! And for you too! Bless you for taking such great care of her!


----------



## ksalvagno

My vet has always said that they can survive if born about 2 weeks prior to when they should have been born.

There are no guarantees but you know that. I have heard stories about kids being born earlier than that and surviving.

Everyone goes through a bad year here and there when in livestock. Keep your head up and your focus on God.


----------



## 8566

I know of a wonderful lady who was a set of quads. They were premies. She, her two sisters and brother lived to be a wonderful caring family - snicker snicker .

:fireworks:


----------



## NubianFan

sunday was your target survival date all along and we are practically to sunday anyway. I think they will be fine if momma can just push em on outta there!!!


----------



## Jessica84

Yep!!! I had twin girls 10 days early. Not gonna lie total pain at first. They were do dang weak they couldn't hold their heads up. While your waiting for her to get going do a search of preemie kids and read up on their care. The only thing I can think of that I haven't mentioned before is to not feed the them like a normal kid. You want many small feedings more often. Did you end up getting tubes for kids?? If not a friend of mine says she uses the rubber part of wind shield wippers. I ordered like 30 tubes years ago so I don't know for sure if that works.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Ligs are gone and she has been having lots of contractions... I'll try to keep you all updated, but don't count on it. This is going to be a crazy morning. :sigh: 

Yes, we do have a kid tube feeder. I have been doing lots of research on preemies....


----------



## NubianFan

Come on Momma Star you can do this!!!:stars::stars:


----------



## mmiller

How exciting Crossroads. Not even my babies an Im all kinds of excited for you!! Don't worry about keeping us updated until the babies are here an doing good. Good luck!!


----------



## mmiller

Just read back a few post didn't realize she was going early. Instead of being so excited now sending prayers an also those babies couldn't ask for a better goat mom to be there for them. Good Luck an I have my fingers crossed for you an the babies.


----------



## BCG

We've had preemies 12 days early that survived. They were very weak and required a lot of extra care. They couldn't stand for about a week or so. Tubed them every 4 hours for 3 days until they were strong enough that they would nurse when held at mamas udder. Keep in mind that their digestive system may not be fully developed. Feed small amounts and pay close attention to their poops. Keep some thiamine on hand just in case.

They started scooting around on their bellies and trying to get up for a few days before they were successful. Make sure you keep them in a large box or some kind of contained area that mom can get her head to them, but can step on them. 

I really think your babies will be Fine, unless they are toxic or something. You'll just have some extra work to do.


----------



## toth boer goats

Prayers sent.


----------



## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> I'll try to keep you all updated, but don't count on it. This is going to be a crazy morning. :sigh:


That's ok! You do what you have to do and we will be praying, hoping, rooting for all of you, and waiting. Good luck and here is to Star coming through ok, healthy babies, and owners who aren't ready for a padded room! :ray:ray:ray:ray:ray:ray:ray:ray:ray:ray:


----------



## HoukFarms

Prayers coming your way !!


----------



## J.O.Y. Farm

Praying here!!


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

My triplet boer kids I had that were born early this year were preemie, they were all one pound at birth. The two that she cleaned of survived and made it just fine. I bottle feed those two though since they were so small and the mom rejected them.

Everything will be ok though! And gosh darn it, they won't be boys!


----------



## MsScamp

I know Victoria wants non-traditional marked does but, at this point, there is a lot to be said for boys that are alive and healthy!  :laugh:


----------



## TrinityRanch

Thinking about Star and her babies this morning! Good luck! ray:


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

True, true. Live babies are better than nothing. 

ray:


----------



## milk and honey

We are all expecting/hoping for great results...but whatever happens, you have done all you could for precious Star! You're a great goat momma!!!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Still no babies... she has been having contractions on and off since 7:30 this morning, but hasn't pushed yet. I felt her about and hour ago and she seems fully dilated. 

Thank you all! We're hoping for the best! 

What should I do with Star's milk? She has filled quite a bit today. Should I milk her out and continue to and hope to get a kid on her in a week or so? Or just forget about it and dry her up?


----------



## Frosty

stopped in to see whats what. Keeping the prayers going your way. Hope your holding up okay. Warm wishes and hugs to you and star..


----------



## Jessica84

See what the kids are like.....you don't have a for sure date right???? If they are all gonna be bottle fed then what I would do is for sure get that colstum. I ended up having to bottle feed my preemies even though they were fed moms milk. They didn't like moms teats and she didn't like them around her bag by the time they were strong enough. I would just see how things go and try my best to put kids on her but be ready to bottle feed.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

If they are strong enough, I'd leave them in with her, so it's not weird when you try to put them back on her. Or just bottle feed the whole way, and milk her for the milk. Milk her out into some empty water bottles, or soda bottles (washed of course) and put them in the fridge until you have babies. To warm it back up, float the bottle in hot water, and shake often.


----------



## goathiker

What I had Jessica do with her little weak premies was give 1/2cc B complex and 1/4cc Cod Liver Oil, both orally with some milk. She told me that it woke those kids right up and got them on their feet and eating. 

I hope your day has a happy ending, I will be watching to see how it's going.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Also, if she's fully dilated, can go in and check? If it's a breach baby, it won't be laying on the cervix the right way, and won't trigger any pushing.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

I'm more concerned about her milk not being *right*. With all the stuff we've been pumping her with in the last week or two, and her not eating great, seems like it wouldn't be good for them. And with her going so early too, I don't know if it will be any good! 

I have two breeding dates on her. One for 12/7 and the other for 12/11. So looks like she had a 5 day heat and mine always take on the later date.

I tried to feel for kids and just felt several bubbles... I didn't want to break them. ?? She's not pushing, so I'm not concerned yet.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

If it's thick like colostrum and looks like colostrum, it should be fine.


----------



## Jessica84

I think it will be OK as well. Not to stress you more but is her energy seem to be good??? Like do you think she has enough energy to push the kids out? But yes I thinkthe milk should be just fine


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Yes, her energy is great...Now I wish we had waited to induce. She has been walking around outside a lot and grazing a little on grass, then she'll come back inside the barn and lay down for an hour or so and then go outside again.

I think she will be just fine pushing the kids out...especially since they will be small.


----------



## Cactus_Acres

Well, I'm going to sit here and pray she took on the first breeding.


----------



## HoukFarms

This is exciting ! Babies on the way


----------



## Crossroads Boers

More of an excitement mixed with dread for me... I want them here, but really don't!


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

Prayers and good vibes being sent your way! Keep us updated  Seeya guys in 4 days!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

4 days!!!?? Cool!! Cosmo better hurry up...


----------



## Trickyroo

:hug:


----------



## Trickyroo

If you still need anything , like a different grain , just let me know


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

Or maybe 5, depending on if i go get my new mare first! I might do that to bide Cos some time!! If you get my little Star kiddo on a bottle, it'll be perfect timing! He'd be 3-4 days old and have the hang of the bottle!


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Anything yet?


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Laura. :hug: 

Star has had several really big contractions now... I felt again recently and still don't feel anything solid. Just fluid, even when she pushes. Come on babies... let's just get this done!


----------



## littlegoatgirl

ray: :hug: Hang in there, I'm praying!!


----------



## Texaslass

:GAAH: I've been trying to stay away long enough that something will have happened when I check again! She'd better have those babies soon before we all explode from impatience! :lol:


----------



## nchen7

I've been lurking all day, and sending good vibes your way. c'mon Star! you can do it girl!!!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

I gave up on kids coming soon and went to ride my horse for a while... came back and heard her pushing in the barn and a water bubble was out. I went and got Caroline and when Star saw us she stood up and the bubble went back in. So we are trying to leave her alone... it's kinda hard though!!


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## NubianFan

Go Star Go, Go Star Go, Go Star Go:girl::girl::boy:


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## nancy d

:hair:If it's a clear bubble & doesn't go back in it might be a breech.


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## NubianFan

She said it went back in so hopefully not!!


----------



## NWIndianaBoers

By now have you felt for the front feet and nose to make sure it's coming out right? If she was in hard labor 1 1/2 hrs ago and there still isn't a kid she needs to be checked. Even if it is coming out right thats a really long time and I would for sure be assisting by now. I've had kids come out with swollen tongues and are a little slow from being in the canal to long and not getting enough blood flow to it's head. Hopefully everything is fine but just saying what I would do in the situation. Of course there is also the possibility it is coming backwards and also could use the assistance to be sure you get it out in time so it's first breath isn't with its head still inside.

As for the colostrum if it looks normal I would use that for sure over the frozen stuff. Hope everything goes well and the babies are out soon.


----------



## toth boer goats

Prayers still coming your way.


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## Crossroads Boers

Yes, I have been checking her and have never felt anything solid... just checked her again past my wrist and still nothing solid. So we're not to the right bag yet I don't think... 

She's baby talking and searching around for her kids. I was hoping she wouldn't so it would be easier to take them away! Should we try not to even let her see them?


----------



## Crossroads Boers

She has never been in "Hard" Labor just off and on contractions and recently she started pushing, but never a lot. I think she is progressing fine. 

She has the water bag hanging from her right now. She really wants to be alone and whenever she sees us she gets up and walks out of the barn and away from us. So we are watching her close from a distance.


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## MsScamp

I could be wrong on this, but if she was mine I would let her dictate what to do about at least some of the kids. She could be able to raise 2 of them. Without the pregnancy and the toxins in her system there shouldn't be any issues of not wanting to eat, and she could rebound quickly. But, again, I could be wrong on that. I've never had to deal with PT or a pregnant doe with polio or listeriosis.


----------



## goathiker

I think a lot will depend on how strong the kids are. Premies get cold very quickly and easily. It doesn't help that we are expecting very cold temperatures starting on Monday over here.


----------



## MsScamp

That is a very valid point, goathiker. I was just thinking that if her kids disappear she will be depressed and that will not help with eating or regaining her strength.


----------



## bayouboergoats

Oh goodness! It is time! 

Sending SOOOOO many prayers your way!


----------



## Frosty

Wow this has been a long day for you and star. Sending prayers and good vibes your way in hopes it helps get thing going for you.


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Any babies yet Victoria?


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Baby #1 is here.  A gorgeous, solid red with a spot or two... buck.  Praise God, he is holding his head up, talking a lot and sucking on everything!!


----------



## RoseBoerGoats

:clap::clap::grin:


----------



## MsScamp

Praise God and lets all do cartwheels in the alleyway! :clap::horse::fireworks::fireworks::stars::stars::leap::leap:


----------



## HoukFarms

:clap: :clap: this is nerve racking and I'm not even there


----------



## NubianFan

Woooohoooo!!!!!!!!!!! :clap::fireworks::wahoo::stars::cheers::leap::kidblue:arty::hi5::boy::balloons::thumbup::sun:


----------



## nchen7

WOOOOO HOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!! GREAT NEWS!!!!! I'm beaming right now!!


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## Emzi00

:stars: :wahoo: :dance: :stars: Go Star! :wahoo:


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

That's fantastic Victoria! Woohoo! :stars: :fireworks: :leap:


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

I'm actually crying because im so so happy for you girls and for Star!! Any more progression?


----------



## TrinityRanch

SO thrilled for you guys!!!!!!! :stars:


----------



## nancy d

C mon Star, you just got started:dance:


----------



## loggyacreslivestock

Yay! go Star and company!


----------



## nancy d

Im grinning with thankful tears. come on Star baby.


----------



## HoukFarms

You can do it star


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

nancy d said:


> Im grinning with thankful tears. come on Star baby.


I'm right there with ya! Come on Star!


----------



## Trickyroo

OMG !!! Yay yay yay !!! I'm up at the barn jumping around like a nut , lol
I'm so happy for you Victoria and Caroline !!!!!
Come on Star !!!


----------



## Jessica84

Ohhh that is so freaking awesome......sounds like it was about time for him to comes any ways ...... now hurry up star so I can see pics lol


----------



## Crossroads Boers

She had triplets.  All are doing wonderful. 2 red bucks and a* gorgeous* paint doe!! I just weighed the first buck and he is close to 7lbs. The other look the same size. The doe is sucking down a bottle already... Praise God!!!


----------



## Trickyroo

:grouphug::grouphug::grouphug::grouphug:
Awesome !!!! You got your doeling !!!!
How is OUR Star ?


----------



## nancy d

Oh oh oh yes praise God!!
Can hardly wait for more updates! This is SOOO awesome!
How's Star doing?


----------



## nchen7

A-MAAAA-ZING!!!!!!!! SOOOOO incredibly happy for this awesome outcome!!!!! I can't wait for pictures of those precious babies!!!!


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

Crossroads Boers said:


> She had triplets.  All are doing wonderful. 2 red bucks and a* gorgeous* paint doe!! I just weighed the first buck and he is close to 7lbs. The other look the same size. The doe is sucking down a bottle already... Praise God!!!


*Tears*!! I'm so so SO happy for you girls!! PICTURES!!


----------



## Trickyroo

Ok can I have the doeling ?:greengrin:


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

Hehe, i think theyre going to be pretty attached to that little girl!! 

I'm so excited about the boys though!! I cant WAIT to get my little guy!!


----------



## Axykatt

:balloons::cake::fireworks::stars:arty::birthday:

So very happy and excited for you and Star!


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch

Pictures!!


----------



## Trickyroo

Yeah , lolol couldn't hurt to ask though , lolol
Congrats on your buckling


----------



## NubianFan

YES!!!!! I knew to trust my gut, I knew they were gonna be alright!!!

I am SO HAPPY for you and Caroline and STAR!!!!! Wooo hoooooo!!!!!


----------



## nchen7

that's how I felt too Leslie! I knew it would all be okay. now we have to wait PATIENTLY for pictures! lol


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

nchen7 said:


> that's how I felt too Leslie! I knew it would all be okay. now we have to wait PATIENTLY for pictures! lol


I dont know the meaning of the word patient! lol! I'm dyin over here without pics


----------



## milk and honey

I'm so glad for all of you!!! Congratulations!!!!


----------



## toth boer goats

If she is strong and I sense that her kids are as well.
If She were mine, I'd let her care for the Doeling and a buckling or the 3, if she has enough milk and eating well. 
She will mend better, if she has her babies on her, now that she is in a better position. Monitor them and see how she does.

Congrats and I thank God, all are doing well.


----------



## NubianFan

Hee hee hee with all that Victoria qnd Caroline have been through, I am willing to give them a break on pics. Don't get me wrong I want to see the babez as much as anyone but I can wait a couple days to let them all take care of everything and REST....


----------



## mmiller

That's wonderful Victoria. Im so happy for you an Star. You've really had a go of it lately an was hoping you got some good news. I might have to start the "We want pictures" chant if you take too long to post em lol. Again so very happy for you!!!


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Yaaayy!! Woohoo! Congrats, you got your paint doe you were hoping for!  Glad they are all doing well! 
:stars:


----------



## nchen7

HamiltonAcresBoers said:


> I dont know the meaning of the word patient! lol! I'm dyin over here without pics


patience is not my virtue either!


----------



## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> She had triplets.  All are doing wonderful. 2 red bucks and a* gorgeous* paint doe!! I just weighed the first buck and he is close to 7lbs. The other look the same size. The doe is sucking down a bottle already... Praise God!!!


WooHoo!!! Thank the Lord and hallelujah! :stars::stars::dance::thumbup::fireworks::wahoo::wahoo:

How are you, Caroline and everyone else doing? How is Star doing? I am so incredibly happy that the hell you guys have been dealing with has a happy ending - that is just toooo cool! :dance: :dance:


----------



## littlegoatgirl

WOOHOO!! Congrats! :stars: :leap: :stars: :leap: :stars: :leap: That's so exciting! Can't wait for pictures!


----------



## littlegoatgirl

GoatCrazy said:


> WooHoo!!! Thank the Lord and hallelujah! :stars::stars::dance::thumbup::fireworks::wahoo::wahoo:
> 
> How are you, Caroline and everyone else doing? How is Star doing? I am so incredibly happy that the hell you guys have been dealing with has a happy ending - that is just toooo cool! :dance: :dance:


Couldn't have said it better! :leap:


----------



## Cactus_Acres

Congrats!


----------



## erica4481




----------



## MsScamp

Lauraanimal left a bit ago on her way home, and she asked me to tell you that she is overjoyed that the kids are ok.


----------



## Texaslass

That's awesome! Happy day finally, congradulations!!  :stars:


----------



## ksalvagno

:stars:


----------



## loggyacreslivestock

Oh thank the Lord for answered prayers! Here's some more for a healthy Mama and kids from here forward! You guys rock!


----------



## goathiker

Oh, that's wonderful news and your doeling as a bonus. :hi5:


----------



## Justice-Kidds

Congrat's Victoria!!!

I've been following this for awhile and praying for y'all. Glad the babies are all doing good. You got your little paint doe!!!
Hope Star is doing good also
Your a great goat momma!!


----------



## MsScamp

loggyacreslivestock said:


> Oh thank the Lord for answered prayers! Here's some more for a healthy Mama and kids from here forward! You guys rock!


Amen!


----------



## bayouboergoats

Ahhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!


OH MY GOODNESS!!!!!


I am thrilled for you guys!!!!! 

I an happy happy happy!

Thank you Jesus! 

Come on babies keep on keeping on!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Goodness... you guys all sound as excited as we are!! This is unbelievable! The doeling has nursed on Star many times, and looks/acts like a full-termer. She weighed 6.11.  The first buck is doing well also, and nursed some from the bottle. He weighed 6.9. The last big huge buck with a white belly stripe is doing well, but not as well as the others. He is breathing really heavy, and has shivered a time or two. We syringed 15ml of colostrum into him. They are wrapped in towels on a towel over a heating pad... in a box with a heat lamp over it and a space heater over it to.  Star is an awesome mom, and drank water out of a bucket for the first time in a week, and ate some grain and hay. She seems like she was never sick! He colostrum looks awesome... It's bright yellow (that's good right?) and is REALLY thick. All of the babies have gotten some. 

Picture soon!!! Sorry! We're busy...    

The doeling we named "Soli Deo Gloria". Or Glory for short. AKA... "To God Be the Glory"!


----------



## nancy d

Thick yellow colostrum is GREAT! Soli Deo Gloria? Wow a great name.
You will get to pics when you have time,


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Good, good! I'm bouncing out of my seat here waiting for pictures!  

The colostrum sounds good.  make sure you get about 8oz into each one within 24 hours. 
Can't wait to see the pretty babies!!


----------



## Trickyroo

How wonderful Victoria ! Congrats to you and Caroline and of course
our beautiful girl , Star 

Your all totally awesome ! I have been on the edge of my chair ever since reading your thread. I think we all were ! But like I said , 
the power of prayer is just amazing  
Get some rest , all of you  (((hugs))) to Star , I'm so glad she is feeling better and recuperating . God Bless


----------



## Trickyroo

I think they all passed out from exhaustion and relief !
Just so happy for them


----------



## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> The doeling we named "Soli Deo Gloria". Or Glory for short. AKA... "To God Be the Glory"!


What a wonderful and absolutely fitting name for your little girl! Don't get them too warm! This is not a good time of year for that. I am so happy and excited for you! Added bonus - a paint doeling and Star is doing well. Yippee!!!! Was the heavy breathing buck the last born? Might want to support his breastbone and tip him upside down to see if there is any fluid in his lungs. Gee, whatever are you busy with? Triplets from an induced, sick doe is not something that happens every day? Well, who would have thunk it?!?!? :: :lol:


----------



## Jessica84

Check in their mouth for teeth if they have teeth they are good and cooked.....although they sound good and cooked lol. But teeth is a good indicator of how early they are.


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

I've never heard that Jessica, thats a great tip!!!


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Sometimes even full term boys don't have their teeth emerged yet, even when their sisters do. Even a few days early, a doeling should have her teeth broken through the gums. If a doeling doesnt have her teeth yet, you know they are preemies.


----------



## liz

Wonderful news to be greeted with! Sounds like all will be well and good with mama Star and her babies :hug:

As far as the one buckling acting sluggish... try a dab of Karo in his mouth, it works wonders for the ones who aren't as active as their siblings


----------



## J.O.Y. Farm

Oh I am soo beyond excited for you guys!!!  :stars: :kidblue: :kidblue: :kidred: :clap:  :leap: 
So glad mom and babies are doing good! Was thinking bout you guys the whole time I was at work!  oh man I am so so happy!!


----------



## HoosierShadow

Awww Congrats! I'm so glad to hear mom and babies are doing well! Hopefully the big boy will come around soon. Seems like there is always 1 that wants to be a bit sluggish, and take a little time to get themselves worked out.

Can't wait for pictures!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks everyone! I am so relieved!!!  

They are still doing well and little Gloria is eating a lot, and is very active. 

The biggest buckling, that hasn't been eating from mom or a bottle, has a really congested sound to his breathing. Sometimes it will get really bad and then sometimes he will sound normal. It seems like it is getting worse over time though. We have tried to suck out his nose/mouth with a newborn baby sucker thing. and have swung him upside down several times to try to clear out his lungs. But maybe we are not doing it hard enough???? I am so worried that we are going to hurt him doing that. Any ideas on how we can fix his breathing or at least help it? Would Dopram help any?

Pictures to come soon!


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

Asking some friends on FB what they think. Should have some answers soon..


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Sometimes you just have to swing them really hard (but support the head so he doesnt get whiplash!). You'd be suprised with how hard you have to do it with a 2oz puppy! Can you tickle his nose with some straw to make him cough? That might help.

My preemie baby, Hank, sounded like he had fluid in his lungs all the time for the first 2 weeks of his life, but sometimes he did sound normal, and off and on the 3rd week, he was raspy/ gurgly breathing but he was just fine, completely normal otherwise.


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

If he doesnt start sucking SOON, you'll need to tube him, if its your first time, or you have any questions on it, call me. I emailed you my phone number earlier tonight. He NEEDS colostrum, and to stay warm.

EDIT: They also said the congestion is somewhat normal and will take care of itself.


----------



## Scottyhorse

Victoria!!!!!!!! :dance::applaud::leap::clap::applaud::grin::fireworks::fireworks::wahoo::wahoo::stars:
You don't even know how happy I am that she had three, alive babies!!!!!!!! Here's the plan - next spring, when I come over to that side for showing, I want to see any that you retain, ok? :greengrin::greengrin: I wish I could give you and Caroline big hugs right now! And mama too! :razz: Can't wait for pictures!!!!


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

Victoria, he needs 3oz of colostrum as soon as possible. That'll get him perked up and feeling good.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

PICTURES!!!! The one with white on it is Glory.  She can stand and I just saw her pee.  

They are all doing wonderfully still!!!!!!!!!!!!! :wahoo::wahoo::wahoo::stars::stars::stars::leap::leap::leap::clap::clap::clap:

The buck is doing better, but still breaths congested. He is pretty lively though like the other two. He was breathing normal when I left, just fast. We switched to using a blow dryer as he kept shivering on and off, and that seemed to really work and he fell right asleep.  

Caroline is watching them now, and I'll take over at 11:30. She has to leave early so... It's gonna be a long night.


----------



## Scottyhorse

They look AMAZING! So big! And cute!!


----------



## kccjer

Cute!!!


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

Ohhhh, im just in love!! I cant wait to snuggle them!!:grin::grouphug: hehe! I'm so so happy for you girls, and for Star!! All the hard work payed off


----------



## Cactus_Acres

That picture of momma checking in on them in the bucket is so cute!


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch

Say it with me: Awwwwwwww! :hugs:


----------



## Crossroads Boers

HamiltonAcresBoers said:


> Victoria, he needs 3oz of colostrum as soon as possible. That'll get him perked up and feeling good.


Thanks for your help Regan... we have gotten an ounce and a half down him since birth. I'll got tell Caroline he needs more...


----------



## J.O.Y. Farm

Oh my goodsness are they ever CUTE?!  I just wanna snuggle them!  congrats!! So beyond happy!!


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

Oh and a friend said to give the big boy 1cc of dex to help his lungs then another 1cc in 6-8 hours


----------



## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> Thanks everyone! I am so relieved!!!
> 
> They are still doing well and little Gloria is eating a lot, and is very active.
> 
> The biggest buckling, that hasn't been eating from mom or a bottle, has a really congested sound to his breathing. Sometimes it will get really bad and then sometimes he will sound normal. It seems like it is getting worse over time though. We have tried to suck out his nose/mouth with a newborn baby sucker thing. and have swung him upside down several times to try to clear out his lungs. But maybe we are not doing it hard enough???? I am so worried that we are going to hurt him doing that. Any ideas on how we can fix his breathing or at least help it? Would Dopram help any?
> 
> Pictures to come soon!


I wouldn't swing him. Tickle the inside of his nose and when he starts sneezing, just tilt him at about a 45 degree angle to the ground. Gravity should do the rest. I would also give him about 1/2 cc of penicillin to prevent pneumonia.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Oh my goodness, how cute and snuggly! I was expecting the doe to have more white, but she is still really pretty! Good job on them babies Star! 

Ditto on the dex for the buck, it helps develop preemie lungs. If you had only used lute to induce, he would probably be way worse.


----------



## ksalvagno

Just beautiful! Congrats!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

We don't have any more Dex... I just got 1 $46 injection for Star! 

Okay, we'll do that Jean.  Orally or under the skin?


----------



## MsScamp

Oh Victoria, they are beautiful! Little Glory is gorgeous, and I love the picture of Star with her head in the tote checking on them! Congratulations and good on you, Caroline, and Star for a job very well done! :thumbup: I am so happy for all 3 of you!


----------



## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> We don't have any more Dex... I just got 1 $46 injection for Star!
> 
> Okay, we'll do that Jean.  Orally or under the skin?


I've always given it SQ.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Holy cow! They charged an arm and a leg, didn't they! Jeez. Nevermind the dex then, he'll be fine.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Yeah... I paid $76 for the Dex and Lute and a BoSe injection.. 

Thank you all very much BTW... I'd have to agree with the gorgeous/adorable comments.


----------



## ksalvagno

Banamine is also great for helping with the lungs. I never had Dex on hand and any time we had problems like that with alpacas, I always gave a shot of Banamine. Helps with any inflammation in the lungs. Worked miracles on some of the crias. One shot should do it. B Complex also helps them.

I'm so glad they are doing well for you.


----------



## MsScamp

That comment wouldn't be biased now would it Victoria? :lol: :lol:


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Karen.  We did give them all vit b.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Wow is all I can say, it was like $6 per drawn shot from the vet the last time I needed it, granted that was 15 years ago, but still!

Congrats on the babies, and they just made this thread, "Cosmos waiting room/ Stars delivery room" :lol:


----------



## Crossroads Boers

GoatCrazy said:


> That comment wouldn't be biased now would it Victoria? :lol: :lol:


Uhhh, no.


----------



## MsScamp

:lol: :lol: :lol:


----------



## Crossroads Boers

I have 51 "likes" at the top of the page from today... hmmm, wonder why??? 

We gave him the shot and he's getting more colostrum. His breathing sounds normal now.  

I really need to go to bed... I'm too excited to sleep.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Glad all is well, you need some rest too!!


----------



## ksalvagno

Try and get some sleep. It has been a long road for you and it is time for a good night's rest. :sleeping:


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

You'll have to be up to trade places with Caroline in just over an hour lol!! I'm so excited for you girls (Star included ) and so glad the buckling is sounding better! You guys rock!


----------



## MsScamp

Crossroads Boers said:


> I have 51 "likes" at the top of the page from today... hmmm, wonder why???
> 
> We gave him the shot and he's getting more colostrum. His breathing sounds normal now.
> 
> I really need to go to bed... I'm too excited to sleep.


Not a clue :razz:, but I do understand the being too excited to sleep and Star and her babies aren't even mine! Go figure. :lol:


----------



## Crossroads Boers

The one buckling is back to breathing really, really raspy. He has been opening his mouth to pant and is breathing really fast.  We just gave him some Dopram, but not sure if that will help any at this point. 

The other two are doing great still.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Also thought I should mention that these are our very first RNSH Mr. Rich *EN* kids!!  Glad we finally have some of our own! 

Now I'm really curious to see what Cosmo will have...


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

Praying for the sweet baby!! I know under your care, he'll be okay. Just give him love and time. Make sure that little one knows how loved he is. Its crazy how love makes a big difference


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

When was the last time he had warm colostrum? he needs 3-4oz of colostrum every two or three hours to function.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

He's breathing normal again.... weird! We just gave him colostrum.  Caroline hadn't gone to sleep as she was tending to this guy... she just left though, so hopefully she can get some rest! 

Anybody have name suggestions for the guys? I don't need any long fancy names as they are % so will be wethers...


----------



## Crossroads Boers

They all have been getting 1/2-1 ounce per hour... at least that's what we are trying to do. When they are sound asleep and not interested in nursing, it's kind of hard to get it down them! I've tried standing them up and twirling their tails, and that works to wake them up.  The syringe is working well when they won't nurse.


----------



## ksalvagno

It takes a while for the lungs to absorb all the liquid. His lungs also might be a little underdeveloped. Sounds like he is doing well though.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Jessica84 said:


> Check in their mouth for teeth if they have teeth they are good and cooked.....although they sound good and cooked lol. But teeth is a good indicator of how early they are.


All 3 have teeth!

The first buck has a weird mouth... he has about a 1/4 inch overbite.  Could that change as he get's older? Or is he going to stay that way??


----------



## nchen7

HOW EXCITING! they are absolutely adorable!!! congrats to all!!! glad they're all doing well!!!


----------



## bayouboergoats

Awwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww


----------



## bayouboergoats

They are some of the most adorable kids ever!!!!
All of our prayers have been answered!!!!! Whoo hoo!



I am not sure on the bite...i have personally never dealt with it. A friend of mine has she says sometimes they grow into it and sometimes they don't.


----------



## bayouboergoats

Oh and pretty sure they are some of the most anticipated kids EVER! Haha


----------



## Trickyroo

I would think he could grow into/out of the bite. He was probably squished a bit by his siblings. But what do I know ? 

Gorgeous babies Victoria  Just gorgeous ! How is Star ?


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks!  

His whole bottom jaw (teeth area) seems a little squished... so maybe you're right!  

Star is doing ok... she hasn't eaten much and won't even look at her grain. She still hasn't passed the afterbirth, and has terrible diarrhea still. But she's a great mom and seems to be enjoying her babies.  I do wish she'd eat though...


----------



## NWIndianaBoers

3-4 oz every 4 hrs seems like a lot of milk for a 10 day premature 7lb kid. I don't give that much to a 12 lb full term kid. Make sure you are feeling it's stomach before you try and force more milk into them to see if it is empty or full. Too much milk in their stomach before they have a chance to digest it can make it go toxic and kill them quick. While they are standing just kind of do little lifts right behind their navel to feel how much is in their stomach.

Is there a chance with the heat lamp and the warming pad etc that the big guy is overheating and part of that open mouth is him panting trying to cool himself? Maybe his temp control is farther along than his smaller siblings and all the extra help is too much?

That is a crazy amount your vet charged you for your single doses. I say either find a better vet when you need meds or try to order some of those things in case you have issues in the future. Lute is $20 for a 30cc bottle, Dex is around $10 for 100cc and Bose is $20 for 100cc. I get that they should make a little on it but not that much. I induce my does regularly to be sure I am home when they kid because you never know when one will need help.

Congrats on getting live healthy babies out. You no doubt had to earn that doe you did get.


----------



## Frosty

I am so excited for you and star. It was a long haul but from the sounds it sure was worth it.. I am totally in love with all three. Still keeping the prayers going your way that they do well for you.. :GAAH::sleeping:


----------



## 7blessings

Good morning Victoria!

I sent you a PM but am not sure if you received my lengthy ramblings or not. I tried to send another, and I think I sent it to myself. Twice. This is exactly the reason my teenagers tell me not to try anything technical, (and to stay off their Pinterest account) unless they are around to help me.  And yet, they are still harassing me add our signature/farm name on here!

~ Erin


----------



## Crossroads Boers

He was shivering on and off last night... I seriously doubt he was overheating. I take them out of the box to feed them and let them stand and pee, and he still breaths heavy. 

Yeah, I need to find a place that sells those! That was an outrageous bill for 3 little injections! I've had goats for 8 years.. and never induced before. Now I think it would be a good thing to have on hand though.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

7blessings said:


> Good morning Victoria!
> 
> I sent you a PM but am not sure if you received my lengthy ramblings or not. I tried to send another, and I think I sent it to myself. Twice. This is exactly the reason my teenagers tell me not to try anything technical, (and to stay off their Pinterest account) unless they are around to help me.  And yet, they are still harassing me add our signature/farm name on here!
> 
> ~ Erin


No problem..  I did get a PM from you, but it was just what I said to you, and nothing new!?? That happened with another person that was PM-ing me. I kept getting blank responses! ??


----------



## 7blessings

Well, nuts! I'm rocking my youngest child back to sleep now (she's 22 months), so I can't type it back out until later...but I promise I will!!

Are all three kids nursing well?

~ Erin


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Try just sending a new one... and not trying to respond to mine. That might work!  

Glory can stand up all by herself, and found the teat pretty well by herself. The biggest buck has never nursed on either a bottle or teat I don't think, but he's still doing well. The smaller buck nursed at about 1am off Star, and hasn't seemed interested since then. He seems to be the weakest, but can still stand if I put his legs under him. The other two try to get up all the time!


----------



## loggyacreslivestock

I have a thread on here about my parrot mouth buckling from this past April. He too had a squished look to his lower jaw when born and looked like he had parrot mouth. When I sold him at 4 months, his bite was perfect!

Congrats on your successful births. I will be rooting and praying for the buckling.


----------



## 8566

Congrats to everyone - babies are CUTE. Mom is precious.
The next two weeks will be crazy with taking care of Star, babies, and then more on the way. 

I know you can get the sel/e in gel form at places like Jeffers. Doesn't work as fast but is the same stuff. I've given it to newborns who needed it and within a day they are doing better. Maybe the vet messed up on the pricing. Couldn't hurt to call and ask. It does seem a bit too much. Lute and the BoSe isn't that expensive of a drug. Don't know about the Dex.

But for now - enjoy. So Cute.


----------



## Cactus_Acres

Yeah, his bite could be like my daughter's jaw. She had torticollis (low muscle on one side of her face/jaw that made it harder to turn her head in one direction) and feet that flexed up toward her legs too much at birth. But she was my first kid, a singleton, I carried her more internally than my boys, and she was 9lb13oz at birth. She outgrew those issues, but it took time.


----------



## Texaslass

Babies are adorable!!!


----------



## nancy d

Mama Star is sure a Star!! how is she doing?
Thank you Lord for hearing all our prayers, for giving Victoria & Caroline wisdom & endurance through all this.


----------



## ksalvagno

If you could get BoSe into them or the Selenium/E gel, that would be really good and will help them a lot.

Glad they are still doing ok.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

We'll definitely get selenium/E gel into the kids today... Star could probably use some too. 

Star is still hanging in there... she's having trouble expelling the afterbirth, and I can tell that makes her really uncomfortable. She pushes every time she lays down. She still won't eat, but just drank a whole bunch of water from a bucket. That's always nice... no drenching!!!


----------



## ksalvagno

The kids nursing on her should help but if you could get a shot of Oxytocin, that would help too.


----------



## goatgirlzCA

I am so relieved for you. We had a triplet this year with a smashed looking jaw - he would blubber like a buck! It straightened out tho. Congrats on the gorgeous babies!


----------



## BCG

Congrats on the beautiful kids. Still praying that all goes well from here. You're doing a great job! 

I would only try feeding once every 2 hours or so, especially if they're sleeping and not interested.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks!! 

I have a .5cc of oxytocin. It was for an 80lb dog.... Should I give that to her or is it not even enough to bother?


----------



## ksalvagno

You could gove that to her. It is not the normal dose but between that and the kids nursing, it should help.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Okay, I'll give that to her.


----------



## ksalvagno

Make sure to give it IM.


----------



## toth boer goats

I love TGS, everyone is so supportive and kind.

Oxytocin in low dosage will help milk letdown and help drop her afterbirth.
I also get a rubber glove and put the afterbirth in it along with a small weight and tie the top area of it as close to the top as possible, it helps.
It is good that she is trying to push it out.

I agree, give Some B0-se to the kids as well.
Nutradrench wouldn't be a bad idea for the kids too, if you haven't given it already.
I also agree not to over feed the kids, it is so easy to do. Feel tummies, it is best to leave them a little hungry rather than to over feed. 

Star is such a sweetheart, I too love the pic of her with her babies. Which the babies are gorgeous by the way. 
It is very good for her babies to suckle from her. Helps her to heal and to bounce back. Even if, it is just the little girl. 

Will she drink warm molasses water?

Is she eating hay or has she stopped eating all together?

All great advice and support by the others, praying all gets stronger and momma starts eating as she should again.

God bless


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch

Crossroads Boers said:


> No problem..  I did get a PM from you, but it was just what I said to you, and nothing new!?? That happened with another person that was PM-ing me. I kept getting blank responses! ??


I had this problem the other day. I did have to send a new message every time, although it has been working fine since then.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

I did give it IM.  I'm stretching myself.... Caroline's not always gonna be there to give shots for me. That wasn't so bad...  

I haven't seen Star eat any hay today... but she's been lying over by the alfalfa stack all day. She has drank a lot of water. I left the kidding pen door open so I can fit in there easier with all my stuff, and the kids in their box. She found a nice spot over by the hay that she has been going to all day. She'll come over and check on her kids every so often and talk to them, then go back to her spot. 

I did also give the kids some Probios. We ran out of Nutri-Drench and the feed store was out too, but we got this stuff called Power-Punch that sounds exactly like it, and has the same ingredients.


----------



## toth boer goats

I commend you girls, for your strength and dedication to your beautiful goats. Keep up the good work.

Power punch sounds like good stuff. I would give that. 

Are you still giving momma fortified vit B complex shots, it may help with appetite.

Try to get the real leafy parts of the Alfalfa, knock it off from the stems of the Alffla and see if she will eat that. Try all kinds of hay and see what she will eat right now. 
When my goats are down, they won't touch Alfalfa, but, will eat oat hay, it is better than nothing.Then, I will try to put just a little bit of Alfalfa beside the oat hay.
I also make sure, they can graze, if it is a decent day, I would take momma and the box of kids out in the pasture area, to see if momma will eat. Just be there and observe. You can leave her babies in the box, but having them out, if weather permits, with her, may help more. She also needs exercise, it is really important and will help get things moving, such as the after birth ect. If there are favorite tree leaves she likes to eat, let her brush on that or bring it to her. 
I will walk my sick goats around that won't eat alfalfa or anything and they will graze on brush,pasture, certain grasses, leaves ect. It helps keep their rumen good and gets them started on normal hay. Along with their 9cc vit B complex shot. And 2cc thiamine shot. I give both to start. I will do this for a few days until they get back on track. With all the stuff she was given may of knocked her rumen off. Keep Giving probiotics too. Giving a few tums with give her some calcium. 

Keep watching toxemia levels.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Pam.  It's been a very educational 5 weeks... I'm so ready to just have a somewhat normal, healthy herd again. This is so exhausting and draining. Poor Star must feel worse than I do! 

Yes, we are giving vit B orally and SQ... 

It's a terribly nasty day here... it's been raining since about 6 last night, and is windy and cold out. I may go get some grass for her and see if she'll eat it. There aren't any leaves left on anything over here, except the blackberrys, and I don't want to try that as I think it started the diarrhea in the first place. 

She won't eat alfalfa leaves... tried that.. and she won't eat the orchard grass. She has nibbled at plain grass hay, but not eaten it in any amount.


----------



## toth boer goats

I hear ya, wish the weather was nice there. it is sunny and nice here, was hoping it was the same there too. Not all the leaves have dropped from all our tree's yet.

Can you get oat hay from somewhere? Maybe try that,if you can get it. I know my sick goats will eat that over anything else, weird, but, it has rang true for us. Just trying to think of something to help Star. :thinking:

Good luck, still praying. :hug:


----------



## Crossroads Boers

She did eat several mouth fulls of grass... 

I have never heard of anybody using oat hay over here... I wouldn't even know where to start as for trying to find some. I know the three fairly local goat people I know don't use it. 

Here are some new pictures.  All 3 can stand up on their own now, and the little red guy (far right in first pic) almost found a teat all by himself.  My plan is to have him be the bottle baby. The other guy hasn't figured out sucking from a teat or bottle yet.


----------



## Scottyhorse

Aww, good little babies


----------



## Wild Hearts Ranch

If he's looking for a teat I would leave him with Star and bottle feed the other one.


----------



## Jessica84

Let them get a tad hungry and they will find the teat. So happy your trying to put them on mom....Pam is right it really does help her out and she won't be sad. They all seem....at least in the pictures that they were almost dappled I see a few whit specks....right???


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Yep, they have specks and spots here and there.  The bright red boy has two white spots on his belly. The other buck has those really dark spots like our Poli/Teflon buckling we had, who Pam now owns. He was really cool.


----------



## Cactus_Acres

My new buckling loves Power Punch. He would suckle that from a baster, so I didn't even have to drench him. Wish I had gotten th bigger bottle (I can only get it in person nearly two hours away). Momma might like it better than the nutridrench too. I went to top dressing his food with it, because he liked it so much.


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

So since the little red guy is going to be the bottle baby, does that make him my bottle baby?  hehe! Theyre so cute and you girls are doing amazing with them. You should seriously be SO proud of yourselves.


----------



## ksalvagno

zebradreams07 said:


> If he's looking for a teat I would leave him with Star and bottle feed the other one.


I agree if he is looking for a teat and has already been on the teat, to keep him on mom and work on getting the other one on the bottle.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

If both the boys need to be bottle kids, so be it. That would probably be better for Star anyway. But for now I want to bottle feed the smaller/weaker one. Yep, Regan... have a name for him yet?  

We just tube fed all 3 with 2oz. It couldn't have gone better! It was SO easy... Caroline slid it in, then I would suck on the end to feel for suction, and then put the milk in... it took 2 minutes. We should have done that sooner!! It takes 10 min to syringe it in.


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

I honestly agree- I think i'd rather have both be bottle kids then try and keep one on star and have it be too hard for her, and have the kid not thrive. Its worth the extra work. Hmm, not i have to think of the perfect name lol!!

Yep, Tube feeding is easy as long as youre sure youre not going in the lungs. Also make sure not to tube them if theyre cold, and their tummies will reject the milk/colostrum and their bodies will shut down. I had that happen with a bottle baby last year. I could warm her up but i couldnt let her starve, so i gave her some milk via tube, and it just made her worse. That poor baby only lived a few hours after i got her home. Sometimes bottle feeding isnt fun. But it sounds like you guys are doing amazing and keeping everyone happy and healthy!


----------



## toth boer goats

I would definitely keep the Doeling on her and teach her both sides down the road, when she gets older, she will go back and forth, always works when I have a single kid.
The bucklings are another story, if they are to be wethers, bottle feeding is best for them.

Glad things are going well.


----------



## HoosierShadow

They are so adorable! I haven't had a chance to post until now, but made sure I had time to see the pics you posted. Precious ♥♥♥
I'm glad Star is being a good mom, I hope she's feeling a lot better. Sounds like the pregnancy was making her sick, poor mama. 
Also sounds like a good idea to keep the doeling with her and bottle feed the boys so they have each other, especially if you don't have any other bottle babies.


----------



## NubianFan

They are adorable Victoria, little red spotty babes... I hope mom passes that afterbirth soon and feels better!


----------



## Frosty

stopped in to check up on the little darlings and momma. So glad they are gaining strength and all are standing. You both did a wonderful job with them. I am still in love with all three. lol


----------



## HoukFarms

Babies are soooo cute !!


----------



## Crossroads Boers

The bigger buck has "floppy kid" or something and is not doing well. He went completely limp.  I called Leslie and she told me to give him electrolytes, thiamine, penicillin and pepto, so we did. It doesn't look good for him.  Leslie said it is brain swelling, caused by traumatic birth or premature birth. 

We have him in the house now by the fire...


----------



## Crossroads Boers

Star did pass the afterbirth finally, and seems a little better.


----------



## J.O.Y. Farm

Awe  poor guy  hope he pulls through :hug:

Good to hear about Star!


----------



## nancy d

Crossroads Boers said:


> The bigger buck has "floppy kid" or something and is not doing well. He went completely limp.  I called Leslie and she told me to give him electrolytes, thiamine, penicillin and pepto, so we did. It doesn't look good for him.  Leslie said it is brain swelling, caused by traumatic birth or premature birth.
> 
> We have him in the house now by the fire...


I wonder if a little banamine would help?


----------



## toth boer goats

Oh wow,that is sad for the little guy. Hope he pulls through. 



Super news she passed her afterbirth, good to hear that.


----------



## ksalvagno

If you have Banamine, I would definitely be giving him a shot of it. I hope he does ok.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

We do have banamine now... how much should I give him?


----------



## nancy d

Banamine is 1 cc pr 100lb so, if he is 10 lb a 10th of a cc? 
Sorry Im no math whiz.


----------



## ksalvagno

It will be very little. It is always 1cc per 100 lbs. So if he is 7 lbs, then it would be .07 cc. Easy to measure if you have 1cc syringes.


----------



## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

You can also crush up some aspirin for him, but banamine would be better.


----------



## Crossroads Boers

We lost him. :tear::tears::mecry::blue:


----------



## erica4481

Very sorry you lost the little guy  :sad:


----------



## littlegoatgirl

Aw I'm so sorry!


----------



## nancy d

Oh no!


----------



## HamiltonAcresBoers

My heart aches for you girls. God bless the little guy. You did everything you could, and you should be very proud of yourselves.


----------



## clementegal

Aww... It's always sad to loose the lil ones I'm praying for the other two and you!


----------



## NubianFan

Awww, Victoria, I am so sorry. You did everything possible. Prayers for the other babes and mom and for you and Caroline and your family because I know you guys have had such an emotional rollercoaster, you will probably sleep for a month once this is over.


----------



## BCG

so sorry. On the positive side, you still have 2 healthy kids and one is a doe.


----------



## bayouboergoats

So sorry Victoria....this all needs to end...just seems like so much has happened to you lately....still sending prayers.


----------



## Texaslass

Very sorry you lost him.  :hug:


----------



## Trickyroo

:hug: You did everything you could Victoria and then some . 
Im so sorry honey


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## J.O.Y. Farm

Oh I'm sorry! :hug:  it's so tough to loose one  at least mom and the other two kids seem to be doing well  hope the other continue to thrive  you are doing such an amazing job with all of them  and you've been so strong though the whole thing  I admire you very much


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## toth boer goats

I am so very sorry for your loss, you did everything for him. 

Focus on the other 2, they are very blessed to have you to care for them.


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## ksalvagno

I'm so sorry you lost him. You did do everything you could have. I'm so sorry you are experiencing one of those really bad years. They just plain stink when you go through them.


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## MsScamp

Oh no! Oh Victoria, I am so sorry! :tear:


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## Crossroads Boers

Thanks everyone....I'm doing okay. I am just glad that he passed peacefully and quickly, not a long, drawn out painful death. 

On a good note, Star is doing much better and drank a LOT of water probably at least 1/2 a gallon. She has eaten some alfalfa leaves and is also much more bright and happy looking. I just hope that she is really truly getting better, and that she is not just doing better because of the Banamine shot I gave her. 

Both of the kids are doing really well and have nursed on Star. Glory is able to nurse pretty much by herself and finds the teat pretty quickly. The little guy still needs some help with finding the teat and staying latched on, but is getting better at it.  Glory is quite the little talker, and is very active!


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## MsScamp

Good deal, I'm so glad the 2 of them are doing ok. I'm still concerned for Star, but it sounds like she is doing better. Are you sure you're ok? How is Caroline doing? I'm so sorry you're having all of these issues this year. At least this year is almost over and a new year is close at hand. I'm hoping and praying things will turn around for you and yours. 

PS Those are some awfully cute little ones there, Star done good! I suspect Glory is going to prove to be a handful - are you sure you want to keep her? LMAO


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## nchen7

awww!!! :hug: I'm so sorry for you loss!!!  it would be so devastating to lose a little one, but seems like everyone else is doing great.


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## Crossroads Boers

GoatCrazy said:


> Good deal, I'm so glad the 2 of them are doing ok. I'm still concerned for Star, but it sounds like she is doing better. Are you sure you're ok? How is Caroline doing? I'm so sorry you're having all of these issues this year. At least this year is almost over and a new year is close at hand. I'm hoping and praying things will turn around for you and yours.
> 
> PS Those are some awfully cute little ones there, Star done good! I suspect Glory is going to prove to be a handful - are you sure you want to keep her? LMAO


 I think Caroline took it harder than I did...  She was more attached to him as she took care of him a lot when he couldn't breath. I was so exhausted last night about when he died. We both cried our hearts out... It's easy to get attached to something after spending nearly two days with it with no sleep! I got in bed at 7:30 last night, and just got up at 1:30 to go take over for Caroline. I really hope this all ends soon.

Lol... yeah I think we may keep her...  She has a split teat on both sides, but I'm hoping they will be legal as she get's older. Both Star and Rich are 1-1.


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## HamiltonAcresBoers

Brainstorming names for my little guy, so he wont be nameless anymore! Tell me what you think or if one stands out.

Jasper
Tex
Hustler
Chaos
Thor
Dexter (For my favorite show )
Flashbolt, Flash for short


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## Crossroads Boers

I think Jasper or Tex fit him really well!  Cute names!


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## Crossroads Boers

3:30am update: 

Star is really bright again, and being a very attentive mother! She seems like she suddenly really cares about life again. And... she has been chewing her cud for a while now, while her babies nurse! She hasn't done that for weeks! Not sure how much good news that means, but I for one think it's GREAT! She has been munching on grass hay on and off for a while now too.  Whoo hoo! 

Glory can get around on her own now, and find the teat with no help at all.  She acts like a normal full term kid now, and is getting really steady on her feet. I still keep her in her box, but we can probably let her out in a day or two for good. The other little guy just nursed some, and I finally got him to suck some from a bottle.


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## nchen7

great news!!!!


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## Crossroads Boers

Cosmo could kid in just a few days now.  She is SO miserable! She rolls around on the ground all night long just trying to get comfortable. Can't wait to see what she's got in there! Hopefully lots of does!


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## nchen7

so much Star drama, and we almost forgot about Cosmo! Poor girl...... she must still be walking funny....


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## J.O.Y. Farm

Greats news about Star!!  I hope she continues to thrive!  and Glory sounds like She's doing wonderfully  hope the little guy gets the hang of it soon 

Awe, poor Cosmo! Thinking pink for her'


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## NyGoatMom

Wow Crossroads....what a journey you have been on! :hug:


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## bayouboergoats

Awww great news star is doing better!!!

Cant wait to see what Cosmo gives you!!!!


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## loggyacreslivestock

So sorry about the little guy! I am hoping for healthy, happy kids, does, and people from here on out.


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## HamiltonAcresBoers

So I think I'm going to call the little guy Chaos  And SO glad Star and Glory are doing well!! Its been quite the morning here- hence why i stopped emailing at 5am my time


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## Crossroads Boers

Thanks!  

Star is still chewing her cud, and acting well.  

Great Regan, we'll start calling him that then! Glad he has a name now!


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## Trickyroo

Great news ! Glad Star, Chaos and Glory are doing well 
So good to hear Star is feeling better ! How are you guys doing ?

Chaos is a wonderful name , he sure was surrounded by a heck ova lot of it !!! 

Cant wait to see what Cosmo gives you Victoria 
How exciting !


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## Crossroads Boers

Thanks Laura! We are doing much better.  We both got a good amount of sleep last night.


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## Scottyhorse

Sorry you lost the buck kid! How sad  At least Star seems to be much better!!  and Glory and Chaos too!!  :hug: hope I get to see her in the spring when I come over to show! (Hopefully)


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## Jessica84

Sorry about the little guy  and so happy the others are going so good!!! Now tell Cosmo to get on with things


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## Crossroads Boers

I hope to show her if her teats end up being ok... what shows do you have in mind Sydney? 

Lol... I did Jessica and she just stared blankly at me. :slapfloor:


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## MsScamp

HamiltonAcresBoers said:


> So I think I'm going to call the little guy Chaos


A very fitting name, Hamilton! Lord knows he and his siblings caused enough of it! :lol:


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## toth boer goats

Glad they are doing well. Great work.  :clap:


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## milk and honey

Chaos and Glory...perfect names for their entry into the world!!! Glad things have settled down.


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## HamiltonAcresBoers

Decided on Chaos due not just to the fact that it was chaos when he was born, but the amount of chaos that will enter my apartment next week hehe!! I'll have my hands full, thats for sure. So glad theyre all doing well.

Cosmo, its your turn now!!  Thinking Pink!


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## MsScamp

:lol: :lol:


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## Crossroads Boers

Star just ate a whole bunch of dried maple leaves and alder leaves.  She ate a great amount of alfalfa this morning too! And she ate a kernel of corn.  Progress!


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## Texaslass

A kernel of corn? :ROFL:


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## nchen7

hurray for eating!!!!!


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## Trickyroo

That kernel of corn must have hit the spot :-D


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## Frosty

Sorry to hear about the little boy, but it sure looks like the rest are headed in the right direction for you. Mommy sounds like she is making progress. I am so happy for you. Come on girls let her have a little break to enjoy these two before she has more to tend to. Its been a rough time.. Looking forward to new pictures when you have time. They are just so cute..


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Glad everybody is on the mend finally! More pics?  And maybe some of pretty Cosmo?


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## Crossroads Boers

I got more pics... so here they are. I also got a really cute video, but it's not done yet. That's kinda mean to do that... sorry!   I'll post it here soon. Actually, maybe I'll make a birth announcement thread for them, and put it in there! It's time to graduate from the waiting room I think.  

I had some really cute pics of Chaos, but not sure where they went! These are all of Glory.


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## Crossroads Boers

It's currently hailing really hard... and FREEZING outside! And the lighting in the barn is really terrible. It's supposed to be clear tomorrow, so I'll get pics of Cosmo then!


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## Little-Bits-N-Pieces

Yikes! Scary weather, and painful weather! It's supposed to be freezing temps on Wednesday with a tiny chance of snow here.


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## Frosty

she is so pretty. Where did you say you lived I might come sneak her away. lol. I am really in love now..


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## nchen7

aannndddd.....i'm in love.  Glory looks so teenie compared to Star!


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## Trickyroo

We just had a break in the below freezing temps we have had here for a bout a week , thank goodness ! Seems almost balmy here at 50 degrees.
Stay warm guys !


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## Trickyroo

Oh that Glory is sooooooo adorable !!!!! I can't believe what a rich red color those babies are ! Just gorgeous ! Star looks really happy too


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## nancy d

They are both just beautiful!
It's hailing here now, they've been telling of a cold front coming in all week but the goats are ahead of the forecast they've been stuffing themselves more than usual a whole week before it got cold.


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## Crossroads Boers

It was snowing just a minute ago... burrrr! 

These are Star's first two kids. "Red, White and Beautiful" and Fireball. Beauty looks kind of similar to Glory, which is GREAT as I loved Beauty! She's in TX now.


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## bayouboergoats

I was just thinking my goodness that looks like Beauty! Lol

She is soooo adorable!!!!! 
Congrats again!


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## toth boer goats

So cute. 

I am so happy they are doing well.


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## Crossroads Boers

You can see a video here: http://www.thegoatspot.net/forum/f219/new-boer-babies-158662/


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## Crossroads Boers

bayouboergoats said:


> I was just thinking my goodness that looks like Beauty! Lol
> 
> She is soooo adorable!!!!!
> Congrats again!


Yeah, but Beauty has those absolutely adorable "dimples" on her ears.. Glory doesn't...


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## Crossroads Boers

I just made a new thread for Cosmo since this one is getting so long. And Star already kidded so.  

It is called Cosmo's Countdown.  See you over there.


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## littlegoatgirl

Can't wai for cosmo, hope everything goes easily, you deserve it!


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## HoosierShadow

I am so sorry about the loss of the bigger buckling, how heartbreaking  I'm so glad that Star seems to be feeling better, and the other 2 babies are doing so well! I saw the video and my goodness they are so adorable


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## Crossroads Boers

It was heartbreaking to lose him...  We had not lost a single kid before then. But all are doing so well now! They are starting to jump around and get really active. I keep saying, "they must be almost supposed to be born now!". Lol!


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