# How young is too young to breed? * Nigerian Dwarf*



## Wolfloverlanna (Feb 1, 2018)

I have 5 Nigerian dwarf does that I am wanting to breed. 1 of which is bigger then average and 1 of which is smaller then average. At what age do you think would be ok to breed them. I WILL NOT breed them if I think they will have troubles but would like to breed them around the same time that my 3 bigger goats are getting bred. 
2 of them are 7.5 months old (one of these guys is over average size)
1 of them is 7 months old 
1 is 6.5 months old 
1 is 6 months old (this girl is TINY) 

I just want some input as some people say wait till a year and other people say they can be bred at 8 months old. TIA


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Were they mine, I would not breed the 2 youngest this year. Since they are said to be year round breeders (mine were) then if you wanted to breed them in the Spring to stagger milk supply, then they should be mature enough by then. If you don't want to stagger breedings at all, then I'd wait for next year completely.
Again, that would be my choice for my herd.

The other 3? Well, I know you want to breed along with your larger girls, but I don't know how soon that is. I'd say later in the season would be better than early in the season, but I can't go beyond that unless I know you mean tomorrow, or you mean after Christmas.

I hope this helps.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I wouldn't breed under a year. And at a year is only if they are on the larger side. 18 months is a better age and they are usually large enough by then. Why buy trouble? A C section can be expensive and you might lose the goat anyway.


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## Wolfloverlanna (Feb 1, 2018)

mariarose said:


> Were they mine, I would not breed the 2 youngest this year. Since they are said to be year round breeders (mine were) then if you wanted to breed them in the Spring to stagger milk supply, then they should be mature enough by then. If you don't want to stagger breedings at all, then I'd wait for next year completely.
> Again, that would be my choice for my herd.
> 
> The other 3? Well, I know you want to breed along with your larger girls, but I don't know how soon that is. I'd say later in the season would be better than early in the season, but I can't go beyond that unless I know you mean tomorrow, or you mean after Christmas.
> ...


 Ok thank you. I am breeding my bigger girls this December but I will probably wait till spring to breed my younger girls then.


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## Wolfloverlanna (Feb 1, 2018)

ksalvagno said:


> I wouldn't breed under a year. And at a year is only if they are on the larger side. 18 months is a better age and they are usually large enough by then. Why buy trouble? A C section can be expensive and you might lose the goat anyway.


Thank you for the reply! A c-section is what I was worried about and I definitely don't wanna be putting my girls in danger. I will probably breed my 2 oldest girls at a year old because they are pretty big but I guess I will just watch them grow and compare to my adults when the time comes.


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## Goatzrule (Feb 7, 2013)

The rule for NDs is to not breed if they are under 19 inches at the wither


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## Wolfloverlanna (Feb 1, 2018)

Goatzrule said:


> The rule for NDs is to not breed if they are under 19 inches at the wither


Oh ok, but I have one girl who's parents were only 16" and 17" at the withers. I do not expect her be bigger then her parents. 
Should I just wait till she's pretty much full grown?


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## Goatzrule (Feb 7, 2013)

Thats small for a ND. Is she purebred?


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## Goatzrule (Feb 7, 2013)

Wait until she grows more


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

Goatzrule said:


> Thats small for a ND. Is she purebred?


Why would you ask that? I have what I think are small NDs, only seven months old, crossbred with something else would get a smaller offspring?
Asking for personal knowledge, not as a rebuttal.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Pygmies are very often smaller than Nigerian Dwarves.
I think Pygmies are the very smallest recognized breed in the U.S.


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## Goatzrule (Feb 7, 2013)

The minimum height for a nigerian dwarf is 19inches. If they are cross bred with something like a pygmy that would make sense


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## Wolfloverlanna (Feb 1, 2018)

Goatzrule said:


> The minimum height for a nigerian dwarf is 19inches. If they are cross bred with something like a pygmy that would make sense


She is purebred. The person I purchased her from only has Nigerians. 
I also have 2 very small Nigerian bucks (one is 18" and the other is 17") they are both pure bred and both are 2 years old.


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## Wolfloverlanna (Feb 1, 2018)

Goatzrule said:


> The minimum height for a nigerian dwarf is 19inches. If they are cross bred with something like a pygmy that would make sense


I live in Canada, Not sure if that makes a difference but we have lots of tiny ND's here where I live.


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## GoofyGoat (Sep 21, 2018)

I would wait as well. You want the does to have good bone and especially hip development. I have a tiny 18" doe who will be a year in January but she won't be bred until next fall so she's more physically ready for motherhood.
Good luck with your older does. I have 2 maybe 3 bred and am very excited about the Mid-January to early February births.


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## Dwarf Dad (Aug 27, 2017)

mariarose said:


> Pygmies are very often smaller than Nigerian Dwarves.
> I think Pygmies are the very smallest recognized breed in the U.S.


I didn't know that. Our first goat, Bonnie, supposedly is a Pygmy. I have not measured her,although at eighteen months she is 47 lbs. Our second, could have been registered ADGA but didn't, a wether that weighs 45 lbs is sixteen months old ND. Others are all less than a year old NDs that weigh from 20 to 28 lbs at 4,5,6,8 and9 months.


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## Kaigypsygoats (Jan 10, 2018)

I am sure you got your answer above but here's mine anyway! I have heard that ND's can be bred as early as 8 months or 75 lbs. I have also heard you should not breed them until they are at least a year especially if they are on the small side. 

My own experience right now, I have a doe that is a little stunted so instead of breeding her this month at 8 months, we decided to let her get more height/weight on here and breed for fall babies. By that time, Sugar should be over 100 pounds, hopefully 28 inches or more.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Wow, that large, 28" and 100 pounds! That is close to the size of my mini Alpine and I doubt my ND's will ever be that tall. Would be okay if they do mature to that size though. Right now at 6 months they are 19" and 20", 40 and 43 pounds.


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## Nigerian dwarf goat (Sep 25, 2017)

Goatzrule said:


> The rule for NDs is to not breed if they are under 19 inches at the wither


i didnt know that! that will help me alot this season!


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## Wolfloverlanna (Feb 1, 2018)

Kaigypsygoats said:


> I am sure you got your answer above but here's mine anyway! I have heard that ND's can be bred as early as 8 months or 75 lbs. I have also heard you should not breed them until they are at least a year especially if they are on the small side.
> 
> My own experience right now, I have a doe that is a little stunted so instead of breeding her this month at 8 months, we decided to let her get more height/weight on here and breed for fall babies. By that time, Sugar should be over 100 pounds, hopefully 28 inches or more.


Thank you for your reply! I should probably weight my girls first before even thinking about breeding them. From what everyone is saying I will probably breed them in February/March so they can have fall babies for me, and will give them some more time to mature.


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## Wolfloverlanna (Feb 1, 2018)

GoofyGoat said:


> I would wait as well. You want the does to have good bone and especially hip development. I have a tiny 18" doe who will be a year in January but she won't be bred until next fall so she's more physically ready for motherhood.
> Good luck with your older does. I have 2 maybe 3 bred and am very excited about the Mid-January to early February births.


Thank you! I am very excited as well for my girls to start having babies. I guess I will wait to start breeding my girls!


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## IHEARTGOATS (Jun 14, 2016)

We will probably breed 3 or 4 of our spring kids this fall they will be 8 or 9 months old
We bred 4 last year that were 7 months old
We look at weight more than age we want them at least 40 lbs
We breed anywhere from 7 months old to 18 months old
We've had a couple of accidents at 6 months old
Never heard they had to be 19" to breed That's a new one to me
Also, there is no minimum height for Nigerians with any registry


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## Dayna (Aug 16, 2012)

I would not breed any of them till they are a bit older.


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## IHEARTGOATS (Jun 14, 2016)

I'm on a FB group called Nigerian Dwarf Goats - Dairy Side
A couple of the best known Nigerian breeders posted recently that they will have all of their animals bred by the time they are 1 year old, average 8-9 months old


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## Wolfloverlanna (Feb 1, 2018)

IHEARTGOATS said:


> We will probably breed 3 or 4 of our spring kids this fall they will be 8 or 9 months old
> We bred 4 last year that were 7 months old
> We look at weight more than age we want them at least 40 lbs
> We breed anywhere from 7 months old to 18 months old
> ...


Thank you for your reply! I will definitely weight my girls as soon as I can (I'm pretty sure my one girl is definitely 40 pounds) and then I will go from there. 
Were your goats okay when they were bred at 6 months? Kidded well? C-section?


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## Goatzrule (Feb 7, 2013)

Hmm thats weird I was told 19inches and making sure that their pin bones were wider apart then their hip bones is a hood rule of thumb before deciding to breed. The base height for all standard breeds is 26 inches I wonder way nds would be different.


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## IHEARTGOATS (Jun 14, 2016)

Wolfloverlanna said:


> Thank you for your reply! I will definitely weight my girls as soon as I can (I'm pretty sure my one girl is definitely 40 pounds) and then I will go from there.
> Were your goats okay when they were bred at 6 months? Kidded well? C-section?


We had one with a bad presentation that had some problems but I don't think you can attribute that to age, older does van have the same issue
We've never had to have a C section ( knock on wood)


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## IHEARTGOATS (Jun 14, 2016)

Goatzrule said:


> Hmm thats weird I was told 19inches and making sure that their pin bones were wider apart then their hip bones is a hood rule of thumb before deciding to breed. The base height for all standard breeds is 26 inches I wonder way nds would be different.


I've never heard that 
It could be true


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## Goatzrule (Feb 7, 2013)

I stand corrected the height shouldnt be smaller than 17inches full grown. That's adgas "suggestion" any smaller than that and they will take points off


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## Goatzrule (Feb 7, 2013)

But I was always told 19inch for breeding


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Goatzrule said:


> Hmm thats weird I was told 19inches and making sure that their pin bones were wider apart then their hip bones is a hood rule of thumb before deciding to breed. The base height for all standard breeds is 26 inches I wonder way nds would be different.


Dwarfs and Mini goats are bred specific smaller in height, weight and stature than standards. Sort of like a Shetland bred of animal, whether horse or dog are miniature version of their standard counterparts.


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

Goatzrule said:


> I wonder way nds would be different.


ADGA also has different rules for NDs regarding breeding up. Poor NDs, I suspect some deeply rooted bigotry at work there in making up these separate rules...
:heehee:


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## Goatzrule (Feb 7, 2013)

NigerianNewbie said:


> Dwarfs and Mini goats are bred specific smaller in height, weight and stature than standards. Sort of like a Shetland bred of animal, whether horse or dog are miniature version of their standard counterparts.


I understand that but if all the other breeds have a base height then im pretty sure NDs have one too. Just like other breeds the minimum height is more of a suggestion.


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## mariella (Feb 23, 2017)

The way I look at it 1 month for a goat is kind of like 1 year to us so a 8 month old would be an 8 year old little girl. it's not just the does body that needs to mature but her mind and soul to. 

Being pregnant to young can stunt them for life. So be sure they are at the size you wont them to be before you breed them.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Goatzrule said:


> I understand that but if all the other breeds have a base height then im pretty sure NDs have one too. Just like other breeds the minimum height is more of a suggestion.


@ADGA.org no more than 22.5" for does and 2 3.5" for bucks


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## Goatzrule (Feb 7, 2013)

NigerianNewbie said:


> @ADGA.org no more than 22.5" for does and 2 3.5" for bucks


Thats for the max height


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

Goatzrule What do you mean by base height?


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## mariarose (Oct 23, 2014)

NigerianNewbie said:


> Goatzrule What do you mean by base height?


Minimum height. Like a highway may have a speed limit of 65 and you aren't supposed to exceed that. But a highway, like an interstate, may have a minimum speed limit of 40 and you aren't supposed to toodle along at 25. 40 would be the base, and it goes up to 65.


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## NigerianNewbie (Jun 6, 2018)

TY I understand now.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Nothing under 1 year old.


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## lottsagoats1 (Apr 12, 2014)

From what I've seen up here in my area, people are breeding for tiny Nigerians as pets. Pet people want the teeny tiny ones. The serious/show/milk production breeders want the ones that follow breed standard sizes. Every one of the smaller ND I've seen had equally tiny teats and udders that made it almost impossible to milk. They were bred for the pet market.


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## Bree_6293 (Aug 4, 2014)

I have Aussie minis that are similar in size to NDs. I have nearly always waited until they were over 1 year (I bred one at 10 months old as she was so well grown but if I did it again I would wait until she was over 12 months) 
Now I normally breed at the youngest 14-16 months. Some I have waited until they are 2 years old to breed. For me it’s their growth in height and weight plus I like to take into account their mental maturity. I want them to look like a mature well grown healthy doe. Not to still look like a gangly kid


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## IHEARTGOATS (Jun 14, 2016)

There is no breed standard size for Nigerians in ADGA.
The NDGA has what they call and "ideal" height, but I can't tell you what it is because we do not register NDGA.
ADGA has a maximum height. That's it.
And I can also tell you that some Nigerians that are smaller in stature can be very competitive.
Buttin Heads farm has smaller animals and Tom does very well.

Edited To Add
I guess they do score on stature for linear appraisal, so indirectly I guess there is a height that scores higher in that regard.


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