# Making room for more goats!!!



## LibertysBoerGoatRanch (Aug 26, 2016)

We are finally working on our bigger goat pen!!! It's so exciting to finally be working on something you have been dreaming about for forever!!!

We are making two pens 25ft by 50ft. So here come my questions. My mom seems to think because we are putting them into a bigger pen that we have to worry more about coyotes then we did before. Our neighbors will loose a lamb here and there, but I honestly think it's because they are in a huge pasture with absolutely no shelter or way to get away from them (just empty field) at all!! So does a bigger pen increase the chance of them turning into coyote dinner?

Next question is how many goats would you house in a pen that size? We are going to build this pen and then start planning the next so we are just wanting to get a idea on how many can/should be housed in a pen that size so we no when we need to start the next pen. lol


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## groovyoldlady (Jul 21, 2011)

Huzzah for more space and more goats!!!

I don't think a pen that size would increase predator problems unless it's really far from your house. However, I am no predator expert and I have a very small set up.


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## LibertysBoerGoatRanch (Aug 26, 2016)

You can literally look over our back yard fence and they are going to be right there so they aren't far at all. And sense the buck with be alone he will have a donkey friend with him. We are hoping he will be a guard donkey.


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## Lisalisa89 (Oct 18, 2016)

Our pen actually is like closed off to keep predators out, but I have been noticing most people don't make them like I made mine so now I feel silly lol I also for like a good month did not pen them at night and nothing came after them so I feel like I maybe did the unnecessary but I do hear coyote sometimes.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

How are you making them? I would think if it is in enclosed fencing, it should be fine.


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## LibertysBoerGoatRanch (Aug 26, 2016)

We are putting poles every 10ft and the fencing with probably be 5 and 1/2 ft high with cross rails at the top except for the gait it will probably be the shortest spot of the whole pen. 

How big are your pens and how many animals do you keep to a pen? In the pen they are in now it's a bit over crowded so we want to kinda get a feel for how many animals other keep in their pen set ups.


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## Jessica84 (Oct 27, 2011)

Can't help you with pen size but with the coyotes it shouldn't make a difference with it being bigger. Have a good fence. Usually coyotes do not like things that look like traps. The coyotes here will walk right by the fence line and not even attempt to enter. Now when I didn't know a stream had under mined a spot and I had kids get out they were gone in a heart beat but they respect my fence. 
What a big problem is there are coydogs and coywolfs. That brings on a different kind of animal. The dogs are way more brave, down south I don't think you need to worry about them being crossed with wolfs, if it's pretty crowded where you are you might have dog crosses. A easy fix though that might put your mind at ease will be to put up a strand of hot fence. They shouldn't go over so put it at the bottom. My hot fence on the inside saved my goats from a husky and a pit bull about a few months ago......well I also think having a freaky looking alpaca charging st them also helped lol but I'll keep my hot fence on 24/7 from now on


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## LibertysBoerGoatRanch (Aug 26, 2016)

Coyotes here are brave! We have them jump out property's front fence right in front of us all the time. My mom thinks the only reason they haven't gone after the goats is because they are between two horse pens and the mares are mean!!! 
I'll talk to her about adding hot wire to the fencing to help ease her mind. I honestly don't think we will have a problem so I'm really hoping in right.


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## catharina (Mar 17, 2016)

Following--would also like to know the maximum number of goats for that size pen because I really need more goats!


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## nicolemackenzie (Dec 27, 2014)

I use these recommendations as a starting point/minimum square footage per goat.

http://animalwelfareapproved.us/standards/dairy-goat-2015/#80-housing-and-shelter


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## ArborGoats (Jan 24, 2013)

According to that you could have quite a few goats.  My person limitation factor is and probably always will be Shelter more so than land area. How big is your Shelter? 25x50 is pretty close to an 1/8 of an acre.My 4 girls with twins each (4 adults and 8 kids) do okay in their 1/2 acre pasture, but I feed high quality hay year round. My 2 boys are in a 100×70×100 ft triangle and again the grass grows, but they get bored and I feed hay year round. I have had 4 adult goats in a 25x25ft yard, the ground was dirt/mud depending on the weather, there was no grass, and I had higher parasite problems. I lived in NY though and the most common grass was Timothy which dies when overgrazed repeatedly...


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## LibertysBoerGoatRanch (Aug 26, 2016)

The link doesn't work for me :/


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## LibertysBoerGoatRanch (Aug 26, 2016)

ArborGoats said:


> According to that you could have quite a few goats.  My person limitation factor is and probably always will be Shelter more so than land area. How big is your Shelter? 25x50 is pretty close to an 1/8 of an acre.My 4 girls with twins each (4 adults and 8 kids) do okay in their 1/2 acre pasture, but I feed high quality hay year round. My 2 boys are in a 100×70×100 ft triangle and again the grass grows, but they get bored and I feed hay year round. I have had 4 adult goats in a 25x25ft yard, the ground was dirt/mud depending on the weather, there was no grass, and I had higher parasite problems. I lived in NY though and the most common grass was Timothy which dies when overgrazed repeatedly...


The shelter will probably run the whole back end of the pen and the goal is to make it where we can lock the goats in at night.


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## ArborGoats (Jan 24, 2013)

I'm assuming you have boers, how many do you have currently and how big is their area? That is an easy way to extrapolate what number might work for you. Are you breeding? Do your does tend towards singles, twins, trips?


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## LibertysBoerGoatRanch (Aug 26, 2016)

I would have to check how pig our pens are right now. But in total we have 4 does, 1 wether, and a buck. 
We haven't had any kids yet but plan on using the old pen as the kidding pen. I was thinking no more than 6 does in a pen that size?


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## catharina (Mar 17, 2016)

The link seems to be giving 43 square feet as the total minimum indoor space required for one goat, but I can't find a minimum outdoor space requirement. I have heard 5 goats per acre is a guideline for browsing, but what about dry lot or something where in between?


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## nicolemackenzie (Dec 27, 2014)

Minimum indoor bedded lying area:

Goats (buck/doe)16 sq. feet1.5 sq. meters
Kids4 sq. feet0.4 sq. meters
Doe with one kid22 sq. feet2.0 sq. meters
Any additional kid4 sq. feet0.4 sq. meters
Minimum additional loafing area

Adult goats27 sq. feet2.5 sq. meters
Kids5.4 sq. feet0.5 sq. meters
Doe with one kid33 sq. feet3.0 sq. meters
Any additional kid5.4 sq. feet0.5 sq. meters
8.1.2 Not allocated.

8.1.3 Tie stalls must only be used for milking and/or feeding immediately pre or post milking.

8.1.4 to 8.1.26 Not allocated.


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## nicolemackenzie (Dec 27, 2014)

7.1 Pasture for dairy goats

7.1.1 The activity of the animals must not cause more than 20% of the pasture area they are kept on to be denuded.

I couldn't find exact outdoor area requirements per goat on the animal welfare site.

According to this site they need about 50ft2 of exercise yard each and .2-.3 acres each of pasture.

https://extension.unh.edu/resources/files/Resource000471_Rep493.pdf


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## nicolemackenzie (Dec 27, 2014)

With all that said they do well in many different set ups but I hope this is helpful.


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## catharina (Mar 17, 2016)

So 25 square feet of indoor area ( 5'x5') stall or shed space & 50 square feet (5'x10') is the minimum area per goat? That's not as much as I thought it would be. It would be harder to keep it sanitary just with the minimum space.


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## LibertysBoerGoatRanch (Aug 26, 2016)

Thank you everyone I'll show this to my dad who is in charge or build pens and shelters.


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