# Swollen Knee?



## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

We were clipping the kids 4-H goats today, and noticed that one of the older babies has a swollen knee. She walks fine, no heat, it's just puffy, but very very noticable as it's swollen big on the front and probably more to the inside than even over the knee cap. 

Any ideas? Any ideas on bringing the swelling down? 
I originally thought a big bite, but I am really clueless. I'll try to get a pic later if I can before it gets dark.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

She doesn't seem to be in pain? No limping?


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

No, she seems just fine, and when I pushed on it, felt it for heat and for pain, she could have cared less.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Is it squishy or anything?

Certainly could be just a bug bite or something.


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

It's soft/squishy, and seems a little bit softer today, but still very much there, you can tell it has fluid in it. She's still walking and acting fine, so hopefully it's a bug bite and will go away on it's own. We shaved her a couple of months ago when we bought her, but she grew back a thick coat especially on her legs so it was hard to see just how swollen it was until we clipped her yesterday. She had some mites on her lower legs and chest, but you couldn't feel it under all that hair. She had the small yellowish scabs on her, so I'm pretty sure it was mites and I'm treating it as so. But has me wondering...if they could have anything to do with it?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Hmm...wish I knew....unless it is water on the knee like some people get :hug:


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

I could be painless inflamation from the lice bites. I could give you a long detailed explanation about how the lyphatic system works and why it can cause fluid to settle in a loose skin area but, it's probably enough to say that it can happen. Now if that's what it is you need an anti-histamine such as Benedril and you want to massage up the leg daily like you're trying to move the fluid up to the armpit area. This will help the lymph gland pick it up and get rid of it. Excess fluids like this stop at the knee because the skin is so tight on the lower leg. The fluid probably came from high up on the inner leg near where you saw the lice.


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

Thanks so much! It could very well be from the mites, we had no idea she had them because of the location and the thickness of her hair - even though we had shaved her it grew back thick and very soft and covered her very well, I was very surprised. Her chest was the worst area for them too, and that's not a place we rub on her at when we do pet her.

Yesterday evening my husband put some ichthammol on her knee, and I gave her a shot of ivermectin. I'm getting ready to head out and feed, and we'll massage her leg/knee and see if that helps.

My husband said if it didn't show any signs of going down today, he'll use a syringe and try to get some fluid out of it, see what we're dealing with. He's done this on horse abscesses before.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

If you go in with a needle... just be careful he doesn't move..... :hug:


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

Thanks! Well we did decide to tap into it and see what was going on. He put the needle in soft skin under the callus on the knee, and just under the skin, not deep. He drained about 10cc of fluid and some blood, and it was empty after that. He said it was kind of like a hematoma.
He put some meds on it, and I'll check it in the morning. Fingers crossed that it goes away. My son is planning to show her next week on Tues and Fri.


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

Well it's got some more fluid in it today. Not sure what to do, We can drain it and clean it really good. Maybe use a bigger needle so the hole doesn't close too much? What would cause fluid to build back up? It still doesn't seem to bother her. BTW, she's getting ready to turn 6mo old next week.
I'll try to get a picture of it this afternoon.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Not sure what causes it...I would take her to the vet or have them test the liquid to see if... it is an infection of some sort..... :hug:


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

Thanks Pam, we may end up doing that if it doesn't get better. We got about 4cc out of it this evening, We think it may need a couple more days to finish draining, maybe where so much had built up. My husband squirted a little bit of LA200 up in it, and massaged it, didn't bother her at all, and I'll keep an eye on it tomorrow, fingers crossed it doesn't fill back up.


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

Well it's still not better  Swollen tight today and she was walking sore, I think mostly it was hard for her to bend her leg because it was so tight.
We drained it, was a few cc's of fluid in there, my husband wrapped it with vetwrap after putting some icthammol on it. I gave her a shot of penG and banamine. Her temp was 104.0. She had been standing out in the sun though, so I don't know how much that affected her temp.
Anyway, I think this might be some kind of infection that could be coming to a head? If she's not better tomorrow I'm putting a call into the vet, I just hope the vet that knows about sheep/goats is there as I think he does a lot of farm calls.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Could of been caused by the LA200..cause it can burn...  

Re take her temp ...after she has been in the shade for a while....it is important to know... if she has one...but... the bad part now is ... Banamine was given..which takes down temp... so... it will give a false reading.... you will have to monitor it....


If she was given LA200 and was given pen...it may not of been a good idea... I think one.. may cancel out the other.. if I remember correctly....

I do recommend getting her to a vet soon... if she worsens.... hopefully the vet has know how...  :hug:


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

Thanks Pam! We didn't give her much LA200 at all, it was just a tiny bit in the same place my husband drained her knee. We waited 2 days before we gave her penG.
I don't think she had a temp, I do think it was the heat of the sun/humidity, her temp was fine last night and today, and was fine the days before. 
Her lower leg swelled when we wrapped her knee, so we unwrapped it, and today it's just the knee that's swollen, it looked better this morning than it has looked, and she was walking just fine. 
My husband wants to wrap her whole leg this afternoon. If it gets worse, then we'll get her to a vet. Fingers crossed she gets better.
We're thinking she may have hurt her leg back in the woods, or possibly trying to get away from the herd queen. The creep area is hard for her and her buddy to get into now, and if the herd queen had been chasing her we're thinking she could have hit her knee and hurt her leg on the boards blocking the doorway - it's safe, but again she's big so it's harder for her to get in there.

Goat drama......oh fun! <NOT!>


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Have you given her any type of pain/inflammation med like Banamine?


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Man...I pray she will be OK...sounds a bit odd anyway... :hug: ray:



> Have you given her any type of pain/inflammation med like Banamine?


 Yes they did.... :wink:


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

It was fine and swelled a little more in the evening, but wasn't bothering her at all. We were told to wrap it to help with the swelling and if it's not better on Wed, then I'll call the vet and try to get her in. Hopefully this works, poor baby it has to be uncomfortable. Of course now she can barely bend her leg because the pad we used under the vet wrap is thick <the kind they use on horses to help bring down swelling, kind of like animalintex>. I don't know why I never thought to try using animalintex before...sheesh.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

It is strange for sure....hope she gets better soon or you find out what in the world is causing this..... to be able to treat it.. :hug:


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Did you ever end up going to the vet or figuring out what happened?


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

Not yet, her knee isn't filling with fluid anymore and is a bit firm, but not HUGE like it was, but still swollen. Some people at the show we were at the other day said that could happen for a couple of weeks if she hurt it even if she isn't lame and said to leave it alone. Yesterday when I went to get feed, the man who operates the place/knows a lot about every kind of animal and I were talking, and he said the same thing, he said he'd seen this kind of thing before and said to leave it alone as long as the goat is doing good and if it doesn't go away, then to take her in and have it checked out.

It's puzzling, because she's not lame, it doesn't bother her at all, temp is good, appetite is just fine. What else could cause this in a young goat?
As mean as our herd queen was to her I'm wondering if she twisted her knee perhaps, and by draining it we were just prolonging the healing instead of making it better?
Her and her buddy are no longer in the pen with the adult goats because I'm thinking our herd queen did something to her <she's brutal  >

Edited to add that I keep planning to get a picture and haven't done it yet. Not sure that you can even see it in the picture, but this is from Tuesday at the show, she's the one my son is holding front left knee. 









Her foot was slightly swollen because we had her leg wrapped really firmly up until just before the show. There is no swelling in her foot at all, it's just the knee. 









Again, we're thinking she must have twisted it or something, the knee bends just fine, the grass is tall in the pens, and she pedals to get through it LOL


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Wow, at least someone else has been through this so... now at least... you finally got answers...sorry I didn't help to much..... but I never witnessed anything like that... :hug: 

Love the pics as usual...  :thumb:


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

Thanks Pam! I am very optomistic though, As long as she is comfortable, not in pain, no temp, lame, etc. I'll watch her, but if it starts to swell worse than it is now, etc. then I'll definitely get her into a vet. One of the breeders at the show said if it was in the joint or joint damage she would be lame or would have some other kind of symptoms. 
Fingers crossed that it goes away.


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## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

Thought I'd post that the area above the knee is no longer swollen it's just the knee cap itself. Still praying! She's such a sweetie. My son is showing her tomorrow night at our county fair.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Hope she continues to get better for you.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

:hug: ray:


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