# Can we talk about predators?



## italgal81 (Aug 16, 2014)

I need help with how secure our enclosure needs to be in regards to predators. We are getting 2 nigerian dwarfs, a 2.5 year old doe and a 6 week old eventual wether. We live in central Virginia on 2 acres. The predators I know of are:
~A den of gray foxes in our neighbors yard. We only see them when the mother is nursing, we occasionally hear them at night.
~Raccoons.
~Red tailed hawk.
~Some kind of owl, maybe a great horned.
~Minks are in the pond.

On occasion neighbors have seen a black bear passing through. Before we built the house a bobcat was spotted. Supposedly coyotes occasionally come into our county (we are in the foothills) but I have not heard one yet.

Do I need to cover the enclosure? Is a 5-6 foot fence high enough? Do I have to have a hot wire?


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## Talron (Nov 17, 2013)

Do you plan to breed? Besides the bear, bobcat, and coyotes none of those animals are a threat to anything but baby goats.
With bears and coyotes the best protection is some sort of guardian animal like a large jack donkey or a herd guardian dog or some llamas.


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## AintGotNoCreekRanch (Jan 1, 2014)

The post above has really great advise so good luck.


❤Chelbi in Southern Texas❤


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Cougars can clear a 6 ft fence with ease. Bobcats are very shy.
We have a couple of LGDs & have never had predator problems.
Having said that, hot wire is a good idea.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I lock my girls up every night in the barn.


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## Hodgson (Jan 7, 2014)

Just remember llamas and donkeys do not protect against flying predators, which can easily carry off a kid. And they are no match for bears or more than one coyote at a time. I've also heard that they do sometimes kill kids, as they aren't as intelligent as dogs and will stomp the 'intruder' that suddenly appears with the doe.


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Since you are getting Nigerians...the fox can definitely carry off a newborn kid. Remember also that those ND babies can get thru some pretty tiny spaces so make sure your fence is ND kid proof (good luck with that one LOL) We have a cougar that makes it way across my pasture at times but it has never bothered my animals *knock on wood* Nor has the bobcat that turned up everyday and ate all my cat food (50 pounds of cat food a week for 6 cats seemed a tad bit excessive) But again, remember how little those ND babies are. Most predators can and will take an easy target and tiny ND's are an easy target. Any predator that eats meat can and will take a small animal if they get the opportunity.


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## AintGotNoCreekRanch (Jan 1, 2014)

Remember also that those ND babies can get thru some pretty tiny spaces so make sure your fence is ND kid proof (good luck with that one LOL) 


Well wouldn't chain link work? I don't have a lot of experience with ND goats because I have boers.
We used chain link on the inside of there pin and barbed wire in the top and bottom of the fence on the outside so our cows wouldn't push through the fence and also so the coyotes, foxes or even stray dogs could not get in. 



❤Chelbi in Southern Texas❤


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## italgal81 (Aug 16, 2014)

Thank you all for so many replies. There is so much to think about.

We don't have a barn. They will just be pets and I don't plan at this point to breed. I had planned on using the small welded wire fencing, but I don't think it comes tall enough for us to cover the whole enclosure.We definitely do not want a dog. No way.

I feel so confused. Back to the drawing board. Please keep the suggestions coming.


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## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Woven wire is much much better than welded. It is more expensive but well worth it.


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## HerdQueen (Oct 15, 2012)

I would not use welded wire, it just does not hold up very well. Use the woven wire instead.


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## AintGotNoCreekRanch (Jan 1, 2014)

Is chain link not a good idea for ND goats?


❤Chelbi in Southern Texas❤


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## AintGotNoCreekRanch (Jan 1, 2014)

And also weren't fainting goats bred for this kinda situation? I don't have much experience with this breed either.


❤Chelbi in Southern Texas❤


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## CAjerseychick (Sep 21, 2013)

This is our second yr with goats- 2 acres like you- they have a shed but arent locked in at night (they rarely use it when its hot actually)- we had a nigie - 8weeks old to about 6 months out on this pasture with the standards- just got a 10 wk old buckling - no problems with predators - and the nearest neighbor has black bear issue, we def have foxes, *****, prob coyote but no sightings as of yet...
we have big dogs though and that probably helps....

Oh and something or other walked through the goats and took 3 ducks over the course of a week last month.... so something is out there...


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

Chain link would work. Welded wire will be a waste of your time. Nigies will break it down quickly. I have one that will pop the welds and push thru in less than 30 minutes! Get the woven....


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## AintGotNoCreekRanch (Jan 1, 2014)

Oh, wow! Only 30 minutes!?!


❤Chelbi in Southern Texas❤


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

AintGotNoCreekRanch said:


> Oh, wow! Only 30 minutes!?!
> 
> ❤Chelbi in Southern Texas❤


That's probably being generous even....probably less time than that for Tabitha to destroy and be thru a welded wire fence. Once she learned that she could break the welds....well.....I've thrown away about 600 foot of welded wire that she totally destroyed!


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## AintGotNoCreekRanch (Jan 1, 2014)

WOW! And she's what breed of goat?


❤Chelbi in Southern Texas❤


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## Hodgson (Jan 7, 2014)

kccjer said:


> That's probably being generous even....probably less time than that for Tabitha to destroy and be thru a welded wire fence. Once she learned that she could break the welds....well.....I've thrown away about 600 foot of welded wire that she totally destroyed!


Don't throw out that wire! Lol I use welded wire on my buck pens, which are next to the doe pasture. A single line of electric wire keeps them away from it. Most the time it's not even plugged in but they really respect it. The fencing is just a physical barrier to stop anything from running through, it's the electric wire that is actually keeping them in. But I agree, it's extremely weak on its own. My herd queen went through a section with one hit when someone on the other side looked at her bucket. That's when the hotwire went up. Lol


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## AintGotNoCreekRanch (Jan 1, 2014)

Wow so many different ways to keep goats in :lol: ROFL


❤Chelbi in Southern Texas❤


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## glndg (Feb 8, 2013)

There are some more ideas in this other thread: http://www.thegoatspot.net/forum/f203/coyote-proofing-my-fence-non-electric-suggestions-170720/

Coyote rollers -- very ingenious. ;-)


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## AintGotNoCreekRanch (Jan 1, 2014)

Wow just went through the thread it is cool!!! Wow keep being inventive people!!   :lol:


❤Chelbi in Southern Texas❤


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## kccjer (Jan 27, 2012)

AintGotNoCreekRanch said:


> WOW! And she's what breed of goat?


Tabitha is a Nigerian Dwarf. She is my escape artist. Even managed to get herself in with the boer buck last year when she was in heat....luckily that turned out ok and not the disaster it could have been. We didn't even know she was pg until the day we noticed she was getting ready to deliver babies!



Hodgson said:


> Don't throw out that wire! Lol l


Um....when I say she destroyed it....I mean she DESTROYED it. There were so many holes in that wire that we couldn't even cut pieces out of it to use as mending patches! Once she showed everyone else how to pop welds, it was all over. LOL And electric only works so long as you can keep it hot....that doesn't seem to be possible at my house with hubby running the fence operation. (I have fibro and can't deal with the mess he has going on all over out there so I seldom go out anymore)


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## ms_mac (Oct 7, 2012)

We have a Great Pyrenees that is very large and protective. He sees red-tailed hawks and watches them and barks at them until they move on. This breed is different from other dogs and a wonderful addition. Gentle yet powerful. No predator will get past one. If you get a puppy, you will have to endure the stage of eating everything for a chew toy but after that, wonderful pet.


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