# Constipated bottle baby



## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I've dealt with the exact opposite problem in the past, but this is new to me. I have had a one week old bottle baby for a day and he's constipated. I just gave him some warm water up the rear, New he's hunched up and trying but nothing is happening. I just bought active yoghurt, corn syrup and baking soda, but I'm not sure what I should try first. Seeking some advice please! I lost a baby a couple weeks ago and it was devastating....I don't want to go through that again.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

How much did you put up the rear? warm soapy water is good to use.

One syringe full will not do it. You may have to do it several times, until you see the baby pushing and poo begins to come out. It won't hurt to do another one or two after you see the beginnings of poo to get more to dislodge.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I had only done one and waited. I just spent fifteen minutes and got a few tiny hard poos out. He's definitely got more, giving his bum a little break before I do some more. He's currently started pushing again so I'm going to start up again for another ten or so.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I've also added a couple drops of dish soap.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

He squats and cries a little and it's coming out in hard wet balls. The color was really dark last night but the color is looking more yellow now.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Okay he just pooped without another round...yay! I had given him a tsp of corn syrup and tsp of active yoghurt in his last bottle as well with an ounce of pedialyte . The combination seemed to do the trick thus far. Well keep a eye on him.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Awesome to hear. The black color says he never pooed, glad you were right on top of it. Now that is out and you are getting colostrum/milk coloring, that is a good thing. Nice work.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

He's still having some issues, so I started another round and one softer bit came out but he's still straining. There hasn't been enough poo to account for his two feedings.(one six oz, the next was only4-5) . At what point will i know we're in the clear?


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Last night I noticed a smidge of bright red in the poo. By the time he went himself there was none. Hours later his flushed out poo had no red but then he pushed out some remaining liquid and it had some red again. Is this from constipation, like with people (being bright red) or is there something I should be concerned about or treat for?


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

What breed/how big is he? Six ounces isn't much, and too little milk can constipate kids. 
I had one like this last year. (Because he wasn't getting enough food) I gave three or four olive oil enemas spaced out about 36 hours.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

It can take time to get them all cleaned up. The blood is most likely from the constipation...him pushing to poo...Keep with the enemas. I use a tablesppon of olive oil in 1/2 cup warm water...I fill baby up until a little squirts back out...I refill when he pushes much out..

Also No milk while he's constipated...replace with electrolytes...


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Saanen, one week, no way to weigh him. I just took his temp and it's 107! I'm freaking out now.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Oh and I just bought mineral oil and suppositories


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## deerbunnyfarm (Dec 14, 2015)

Uh oh. Are you sure that temp is right?

I agree that six ounces doesn't seem like it'd be enough for a week old standard sized kid.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I'm not sure it's correct but I really have no way to test the thermometer.....he will stand up and isn't shivering, just a little lethargic.


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## deerbunnyfarm (Dec 14, 2015)

Okay, run down everything you're feeding/supplementing right now? 

Also, I'd run and grab another thermometer. Just a cheap one to double check.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

That was a brand new cheap one. He has a snuffly nose (all the others for sale were very ill so it was expected and I've treated URIs and pink eye before).


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## deerbunnyfarm (Dec 14, 2015)

Can you double check and take the temp again? 

If his temp is that high, that seems pretty bad. I'm not an expert or anything with bottle babies but that concerns me.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I use whole cows milk. Today I added a tsp of active yoghurt, a tsp of corn syrup and some pedialyte (first mix). He drank six oz....this was post enema. His next he only drank four and I halfed the yoghurt and no pedialyte.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I did buy durvet vitamin and electrolyte mix for him but I need to calculate the mixture amount. Can I give that in place of milk with corn syrup tonight and tomorrow?


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

Yeah, that's not enough milk.


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## deerbunnyfarm (Dec 14, 2015)

Can you explain why you're doing so much corn syrup?


Honestly now with that temp and the runny nose I'm nervous about pneumonia.

I'd be switching him to electrolytes only, as much as he'll take, and cut out all of the yogurt/corn syrup stuff. But that's just me. I'd be very, very concerned about that temp and looking into pneumonia/e coli...


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I just bought unflavored electrolytes and baby aspirin until feed store is open early am.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Earlier there was no temp and only constipation, no runny nose. This is in the past hour or so.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I'm going after antibiotics in the morning as well.


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## deerbunnyfarm (Dec 14, 2015)

Yeah, a sudden sky rocketing temp like that is common for pneumonia or e coli. I would bet pneumonia. Hope someone more experienced chimes in soon.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Well I retook his temp and it barely hit 106? Dollar store thermometers aren't very reliable and the drug store didn't have a rectal glass one. Since its feeding time I woke him back up, he jumped up, was wagging his tail like crazy and drank about 2.5 oz of electrolyte eagerly. I have him baby aspirin as well, so I'll check him in about half an hour?


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

He also peed a ton so there's no dehydration going on so far and kidneys seem great.


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## deerbunnyfarm (Dec 14, 2015)

Is he refusing to drink more than 2.5 ounces?


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

He realized it wasn't milk and pulled away. I'll offer more in maybe an hour? He's still not pooping again but I read a fever can do that. His last bottle post poo was smaller and that's when his behavior shifted.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I bought mineral oil for later or morning if things don't start moving. He's not teeth grinding or belly aching, just straining to poo. I halved a baby supository and he pushed it out five minutes late with no poo.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

wow..his temp is high...I would start antibiotics asap..use cool compresses behind ears and arm pit area to reduce the fever.. check his belly button for infection..any swelling of joints??

I agree...give straight electrolytes...here is a home made one he might like..you can cut it in half since this makes alot

A half gallon of hot water
2-6 Tablespoons of Unsulphured Blackstrap Molasses or what you have or honey
1-2 Tablespoons of Either Sea Salt, Epsom Salt, Baking Soda or Table Salt.
1 cup of Apple Cider Vinegar

for how much to feed once he is well for milk ..start here:

weigh him and multiply that by 16 to get his weight in oz, then multiply that by 10-12% to see how much per day he needs, then divide into 3-4 feedings...

so if he weighs 
8# x16=128 0z

128x 10% = 12.8 oz of milk per day
divided into 3 feedings =4.3 oz a bottle..

after each bottle feel his tummy, you want it flat but firm..not too poochy..not sunken in...adjust the amount+/- as needed...

whole cows milk is a good choice when goats milk is not available...just feed it plain...nothing added...


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I have been feeling his stomach after feedings. I have no idea what he was fed before, and I've gradually increased his feedings since I first feed yesterday ( every 2.5-3 hrs ) beginning at 4 oz and increasing an ounce each feeding. I only added to the whole milk today to aid in constipation and only 2 bottles. He got up to 6 oz before he started acting icky. He's on electrolytes only now.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I meant 8 but he wasn't finishing it. His constipation began last night and seemed better this afternoon pre fever.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

My first four bottle babies were very ill a few years ago when I bought them with pink eye, pneumonia and severe scours. I knew nothing about goats at all and nursed three to health and lost the smallest one shortly after buying them. I had to do it naturally then. Now I can afford to get the proper treatments. (i had no clue what I was getting myself into last time).


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Would penicillin be sufficient in the morning? I can't get it until then.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Well forty minutes after a baby chewable aspirin crushed up and put in his cheek, his temp is 104.2 and he is bouncing around and guzzled 5 oz of electrolytes!


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

And we're at 103.1 and he's ready to play. Still no more poo since this afternoon. I did give him some milk of magnesia as nobody in the area has C D antitoxin.


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

I don't like to cause a fight, and I sincerely hope that this doesn't do so. 

13 ounces of milk a day is nowhere near enough for a week old, standard sized kid. Think how much he'd be getting from his dam if he was on her.

Let's say the average saanen doe gives a gallon of milk a day and she had triplets. A gallon of milk a day equals 128 ounces, divided among three kids is 42.7 a day for each. Now, I wouldn't feed them that much because that's asking for trouble, but they need a lot more than the formula listed above. All of the kids I've tried raising on the formula have been stunted compared to their dam raised partners until I upped the amount. Then they caught right up.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I got him yesterday afternoon. His first feeding from me was 4 oz...he had no clue what the bottle was and took a bit for him to catch on. Two hours later, he had five oz. Three later he had 6 oz and another 6 before bed time. Today is the second day I've had him. He was constipated when he came into my care with dark wet balls of poo and a lot of strain. I did not want to over feed him. This morning, no poo. 6 oz am bottle. Two and a half later 6 oz with some additions for his tummy and constipation. An enema, one poop on his own all by noon....first 24 hours. Next bottle was 8 oz and he didn't finish more than six. That was three 1/2 hours later. He refused the bottle for hours after. He spiked a fever. I treated the fever and he chugged a bunch of electrolyte fluid.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I've raised saanans only. I know what they eat and I've seen scours suddenly onset from stress of being sold and drive and moved around. Where did you get 13 oz? I haven't even owned him for 36 hours yet. I think my posts have been rambly in my stress......


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Ooh I see...I meant his most previous two feedings when I answered that but when I offered more he turned from it.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Sorry it's been a long day and it's midnight now. His temp is still stable at 103, he drank 5 oz out of six of electrolytes, and is laying down like a proper healthy goat. He's all bouncy and tail wagging like crazy again. Here's till morning!


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

I wasn't actually addressing you-I was addressing the formula in general and the people who recommend it. 
I know you haven't owned him long, and he isn't eating all you've been offering him, but when he does, by all means, keeping going up at a slow rate...


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## deerbunnyfarm (Dec 14, 2015)

Also, feeding him every 2-3 hours is probably a bad idea. The milk doesn't have time to digest, he needs four hours minimum between feedings.


You've treated the symptoms, but I'm concerned that he's not being treated for the actual issue and now his symptoms are being masked.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Ranger1....you made a valid point...some kids need lots more....the formula is just a starting point. ..to build on...each kid is different and each needs to be fed at a rate he can digest. Over feeding is a huge cause of both runs and constipation and floppy kid as well as enertoxemia ect... again..its a starting point to build off of for each kid....i have had sibling that each needed a different amount to thrive...no two are a like..but yes..you are correct...underfeeding can cause stunted growth.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I'm about to head off to pick up antibiotics. Pretty sore it's pnemonia. Fever is gone but he's got a rattle and snot nose and is lethargic again. Just gave him benadryl. If it's bacterial and I treat the Symptoms would penicillin be sufficient? And would IM or SQ be better?


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## deerbunnyfarm (Dec 14, 2015)

http://www.tennesseemeatgoats.com/articles2/healthproblemsKids06.html

Hope this helps.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I'm pretty sure it's interstitial pneumonia which is viral. I lost a healthy baby from the same seller overnight and her others were pretty sick. I've treated the symptoms....but since it's probably viral, should I get antibiotics? I understand that could be bad....


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## deerbunnyfarm (Dec 14, 2015)

I would say that if you're attached to this baby and want to give him his best chance, get him to a vet.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I'm about to start calling around. I know there was one by us that did goats but I'm not sure if he's open anymore.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

If you feel it is pneumonia and the rattling in the chest sounds wet, I would start antibiotics. 
Do what is best and what you feel that is in your heart.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I just stomach tuned him and administered antibiotics and electrolytes with Kari per vet recommendation. He's on a low heating pad. Treated his congestion and he's breathing easier. Now it's a waiting game.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Praying for the little one. Poor baby.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

His temp was at 100.7 when I got home from getting meds. He's almost at 102 now. If I tube feed him 60ccs of fluids, when should I administer more?


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

He's pooping at normal intervals now and it looks normal! He's just laid out and sleepy from the benadryl. His rattle is barely there in his breathing and his nose is clear. I pray I'm on the right track with this little guy!


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

He opened his eyes to go potty but didn't stand up. Would it help to add karo to his electrolytes throughout the day until he is active again?


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

He lifted his head to look at me when I checked on him.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Temp is 102.7


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

The second tubing he actually was trying to turn his head and swallowed several times as it went down then back up. Still just electrolytes with karo. He can't stand but he is moving his legs around now.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

The first time he was a limp noodle.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Will he be able to urinate? He's moving his legs more and can adjust them but can't stand at all.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Sounds like what's in his lungs is breaking up, he's coughing and swallowing the gunk occasionally. He's pulled himself into an almost normal sleeping position....halfway there now!


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

He stood up on his own! He walked around, pooped.....but no pee. Still won't take a bottle and tubing him was a fight. He is now full of electrolytes and mad at me, about to take another nap. His lungs sound almost clear as well!


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

Glad he is doing better. Hopefully he will take a bottle from you soon.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Still no bottle but vitals are stable and he gets up to move around until he can't then he lays down again.


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## Aprilszoo (Mar 31, 2014)

To teach him to suck, put a little honey on your finger and put in his mouth, move it in and out a little against the roof of his mouth if he doesn't start sucking. (Think about how you can offer your finger to a human baby as a pacifier)
Using the feeding tube set-up, I would tape the tubing to my finger so that when he starts sucking, you can begin squirting the milk into his mouth so that he associates sucking with getting milk. 
Have a bottle ready to go, so that you can finish up feeding with the bottle when you see he's getting the idea about what he's supposed to be doing.
The next time, put the honey on the nipple, and he'll remember it, and start sucking. Shouldn't need to do that more than once or twice.... He'll be at it in no time.

How long have you withheld his milk? Don't go more than 24 hours....


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

He knows how to drink a bottle, he just won't right now. I've tried the finger trick every couple hours, so far nothing. I did give him a 2 oz milk feeding this morning after I heard his stomach was moving along finally. Since he is moving more should I work milk back in now? I've been adding karo to his fluids, and the first thing he got in the am was honey of my finger in his cheeks (he started holding his head up an hour later)


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

His first feeding from me ( a week old on Sunday, when I bought him) he had no idea what the bottle was and it took me under sixty seconds to get him sucking like mad. He was eagerly drinking from the bottle through last night until this morning when I got up to feed him.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Well he is still kicking, temp still stable, well hydrated, but can't stand to pee. I think he's experiencing full bladder discomfort. Will he just go laying down?


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

He has not urinated in 24 hours and has a full bladder. He can't stand up again.


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## Aprilszoo (Mar 31, 2014)

*No urine at all in 24 hours is an emergency!*
The bladder can rupture if they cannot void their bladder!

Try using a towel or pillowcase as a sling under his chest& belly to hold him up for a little while.

But not standing, shouldn't be keeping him from peeing... There's posts all the time about goats who can't stand that are found to be in a puddle of urine... they peed lying down... So baby should too...

I don't know if it'd work, but maybe:
Using a very warm washcloth, try stroking the area over the bladder. Use pretty firm pressure... Almost massage... Make sure you are over a bunch of towels or something absorbent.... If you can get his bladder to release, you are probably in for a flood...

If it doesn't work, the kid will need to be catheterized by a vet, who can figure out why he's blocked....

But again-- no pee for 24 hours is an EMERGENCY!!!
If you can't get him to pee soon.... Please get to a vet!


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I plan to first thing in the morning. I've tried massaging the area with my hand...His bladder doesn't feel hard but he's definitely uncomfortable about it. I'm sitting up all night with him taking hourly temps and comforting him. I'm afraid to give him more fluids now.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

When I tubed him last a little bit ago, he jumped to his feet but couldn't stay up long.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

He just passed


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I'm sorry you lost him.


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## sassykat6181 (Nov 28, 2012)

Sorry you lost him. I would look for a new place to purchase goats. If the other kids were sick, you were already fighting an uphill battle when you brought him home.


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## deerbunnyfarm (Dec 14, 2015)

So sorry you lost him.


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

oh Im so sorry : (


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I'm definitely not buying from her again. I'm going to wait and buy from a reputable breeder in the future after I recover from this.


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## loggyacreslivestock (Mar 5, 2013)

So sorry you lost the little guy.


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## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Oh no, I am so very sorry.


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## CrazyDogLady (Aug 9, 2014)

I'm so sorry you lost him.


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## Aprilszoo (Mar 31, 2014)

Sorry for your loss.... 
He certainly knew love and compassion in his last days/hours.... 
Sometimes that's all you can do. :blue:


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## Ranger1 (Sep 1, 2014)

I'm so sorry...


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

This is two babes from the same seller in two weeks, same symptoms the first was playful and full of energy with a a runny nose, then overnight in a few hours crashed and died in my arms in the morning...and that hurt me to the core. I know I did everything for this one and he was improving...except he couldn't urinate anymore. It's heartbreaking. What upsets me is this lady sells fifty or more twice a week and I can't stand to imagine the exited little children picking new pets out that had mild cold symptoms....obviously there's pneumonia in the herd and I pray nobody else, especially a child, has had their heart broken like this.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Some of her babes looked like they weren't going to make it another hour...and they were sold already, hopefully to people who knew and were prepared to treat them. I keep telling myself they most likely would have been left for dead and neglected if they weren't sold that day...the woman didn't seem too concerned about the illnesses our their well being or comfort...and I stayed up and comforted him, talked to him, snuggled up to him to the end, and gave him some benadryl and baby aspirin when his bladder was making him cry and nothing helped him relieve. The hardest thing was accepting what was happening and knowing nothing more could be done but making him comfortable as I could.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

I'm going to fully stock on every possible supply before I consider another one...I don't handle heartache well.


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## AmuseableDonkey (Apr 6, 2014)

Sorry if I ramble on here, and thank you all for the advice and support. Nobody around me understand, and there's nobody to listen or help me much through it, and you all have been wonderful.


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

That is a shame that the woman is intentionally selling sick kids. I bet she has a lot of disease in her herd and obviously doesn't care. Hopefully you can find someone else with healthy goats and start out on a good note.


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## sassykat6181 (Nov 28, 2012)

I would report her!


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

cant believe some people...


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