# H5N2 bird flu-How are you providing water for waterfowl so wild birds can't drink?



## ProvidenceHill (Sep 9, 2013)

We are trying to put into place a bird flu prevention program before H5N2 actually gets to Virginia. I have 4 kids in 4-H who raise poultry and we have several different flocks. The thought of our kids' birds being "depopulated" makes my blood run cold -- half are pets, and to say that would be a crushing blow to kids aged 6-12 would be an understatement. Let me start by saying I am familiar with basic biosecurity measures. We are aware that by having ANY free range birds our risk of disease is higher, but up until now we have known and accepted that risk. H5N2 is in a different league and we are working to find immediate solutions for our current setup, so please, don't tell me that I have to build several covered pens because that is not an option at the moment. I need to figure out what to do with what we have _now_.

All of the bantams are housed in moveable, covered pens of hardware cloth, so their food and water is completely inaccessible to wild birds. We have a free-range flock of large fowl, as well as free-range ducks and a pair of Sebastopol geese. (By "free-range" I mean they are fenced in an uncovered 1 1/2 acre poultry field/orchard with no access to ponds, streams, bodies of water, etc.)

We are taking strict measures to keep feeders in the coops, immediately clean up any spilled feed, and wherever possible put waterers under cover too, but I am stumped on how to handle the water for the ducks and geese. I have witnessed on many occasions our local flock of crows perched on the edge of the mortar tub drinking. Up until this year we've been happy enough to see them because they keep the hawks away, but now I am trying to find ways to deter them from the water tubs. The free-range large fowl can drink from a nipple waterer inside their coop, but I can't put the open water tubs inside the duck house or it will be a complete mess of soggy bedding. Does anyone have a solution for covering dabbling water so the ducks and geese have access but crows will stay away? I've thought of trying to construct various wire "cages", etc. but I haven't figured out how to let the ducks and geese access it if the crows can't.


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

Wild birds aren't the problem really. It's the people petting cute chicks in Wilco, then going to visit their friend and grabbing eggs for a nice cheese omelet...Here, really read it.

http://www.cdc.gov/mmwr/preview/mmwrhtml/mm6404a9.htm


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## ksalvagno (Oct 6, 2009)

I would say don't let any other kids (or anyone other than your immediate family) into your bird areas and don't let them pet them. People bring all kinds of stuff into your areas on their shoes. Only wear shoes in those areas that are strictly for your "barn" area.

I have shoes that I only wear in my yard. I never wear them outside of my yard. I never wear any other shoes into my barn. I also don't let anyone in my goat area anymore. That way nothing is tracked in.


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## ProvidenceHill (Sep 9, 2013)

Yes, we're already following those biosecurity measures, it's only the dabbling water for the waterfowl I'm struggling to figure out.

Wild waterfowl are the main vectors of this outbreak, and we have no trouble there, but raptors and crows (who feed on possibly diseased wild waterfowl or carcasses) can also be carriers. Songbirds are less of a problem with this particular manifestation. So basically I just need a way to keep the crows away from the water tubs.


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## goathiker (Apr 14, 2011)

So, you do know that flocks are only destroyed for HPAI H5: and there were only 14 cases of H5N2 across the entire US?


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## ProvidenceHill (Sep 9, 2013)

Yes, I do. And I am not interested in my kids' flock being one of the backyard flocks affected, like the 4-Hers whose flock was destroyed in Washington: http://crofsblogs.typepad.com/h5n1/...ackyard-flock-culled-after-h5n2-bird-flu.html . This is old news, it has now been confirmed in several other states.

http://www.vdacs.virginia.gov/news/releases-b/031215precaution.shtml

I'm really most interested in specific suggestions to help with the particular problem I have posted about, thanks. The water tub issue. Anyone?


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## happybleats (Sep 12, 2010)

Make a wire dome over the tubs with side entrance...most wild birds want to fly down to the water...not walk around looking for a door...


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## ProvidenceHill (Sep 9, 2013)

I've thought about something like that, maybe I need to just give it a shot and see what happens. Crows are so unlike other wild birds, ours are hardly even afraid of us. They walk around on the ground like poultry and we pretty much have to shoo them away. But maybe they would dislike the feeling of enclosure enough to avoid going into something that feels like a cage(?).


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## Steampunked (Mar 23, 2015)

Provide clean water for the wild birds outside up high, with trees and shrubs so they feel secure, and put try the dome idea for your domestics at the same time. Wild birds may feel there's no point risking predation with a safe alternative.


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## MissMM (Oct 22, 2007)

this is a topic I have been watching diligently in over a dozen different forums as the Dept. of Ag./ Extension office doesn't seem to have any suggestions..... it is air borne to an extent according to them.... however.... there must be some direct contact happening somewhere.... the "migrant birds" won't "land" if we can find some way to discourage that.... how about putting an "umbrella" of chicken wire over each waterer.... attach some crap CD disks in random locations to the top (use a permanent marker or black spray paint to blacken the side that will face the ground so it doesn't scare your own hens away from their water source).... IDK... I'm grasping at straws here too.... our meat birds for the season haven't arrived yet.... i'm thinking the CD thing works to keep pigeons and barn swallows out of the barn.... so why wouldn't it work to keep migrant birds out of field waterers and feeders?


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## Goat_in_Himmel (Jun 24, 2013)

Not sure if I'm accurately envisioning your setup, or its scale, but I could see putting out a kiddie pool of water, then placing something like a small trampoline above it, so that the water is not visible from above, but your birds on the ground can see it and access it, just fine. Of course, crows are canny, so they'll be looking for ways to outsmart your counter measures. I did like the idea of putting out water for them specifically, elsewhere.


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## ProvidenceHill (Sep 9, 2013)

These are all good suggestions. I am stressing a little less now because the crows have been staying away ever since I added a pair of geese to the free range flock -- it's breeding season and my gander won't allow ANYTHING strange in the field. But once the hormones subside I don't know that he will make a difference.

It is alarming to see how quickly this is spreading now.


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## Greybird (May 14, 2014)

I think you will be okay if you can put domes of chicken wire over your little ponds. Shiny CDs around the edges are a good idea, too. Your birds will quickly get used to them but wild birds won't like them at all - especially when combined with feeling enclosed. Crows are too smart for their own good, so they will probably get used to the idea, but the good news is that they're probably not going to be a primary disease vector since they don't migrate very far. As I understand it (could be wrong) wild ducks are the most likely culprits. You don't want those at all!


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## Snookie (Mar 25, 2015)

ProvidenceHill said:


> These are all good suggestions. I am stressing a little less now because the crows have been staying away ever since I added a pair of geese to the free range flock -- it's breeding season and my gander won't allow ANYTHING strange in the field. But once the hormones subside I don't know that he will make a difference.
> 
> It is alarming to see how quickly this is spreading now.


I agree, it is alarming, and I am watching it closely too.

I have heard geese and other large birds are good for keeping wild birds away. Our Great Pyr keeps everything out of the chicken area. I set up a swinging door so he could go between the chicken and goat areas but the goats/chickens don't go in each other's areas.


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