# Promise Kidded this morning! :)



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

Twins, but sadly the boy didn't make it, It's her first time kidding & she didn't clean him up. I didn't make it in time to help out.
She isn't letting the little girl eat though, any suggestions?


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

The doe she is sitting by seems to be taking better care than her mom.
I separated mom & baby from the other does but she's still not taking much interest.
Should I see if my other pregnant doe will let her eat?


----------



## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Oh gosh I wish someone with experience would chime in here !
Maybe just hold mama down and let her realize the baby wont hurt her ?
I dont know , but I maybe just separate them from the rest and let them be for a while. Watch them closely of curse , but maybe momma will realize enough and the baby will get close enough to start nursing.
I would maybe PM Stacy or someone who has more experience.....


----------



## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Oh BTW , congrats and she is gorgeous ! Im so sorry the buckling didnt make 
it


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

Thank you! 
I have them penned up separate but mom seems to be trying to hide from the baby more than care for her :/
Will see if I can get someone to help me put her on the stand & see if that works.


----------



## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

That may work , good idea . Give the momma some grain or whatever she reeally likes just to get her mind off the baby , the poor thing...
I would think she will assume the baby is harmless and the motherly instinct will kick in , but thats just my newbie opinion...
But I know the important thing here is that the baby gets the colostrum soon.
I hope it all goes well for you !


----------



## 20kidsonhill (Feb 28, 2011)

no, don't let the other mom feed her. Put the baby with her mom, hold the mom if you have to and help the baby nurse on her real mom. Do this 4 or 5 times today and tomorrow. Sometimes new mom's get confused. Hopefully she will still take her. She may not realize it is hers,because it was over by the other doe. Does she call to it, or lick it at all? 
If she tries to hurt it, then you may not be able to leave her in the same pen. What I have heard of people doing is putting the kid right next to mom in a small wire pen, so mom can't get to her and hurt her, but still be near. Then every 3 or 4 hours assist the kid by holding mom and letting kid nurse.


----------



## 20kidsonhill (Feb 28, 2011)

you may need to get someone to help you hold mom, sometimes if I am by myself, I can corner, mom in her kidding pen and help the baby reach the teat. Get the plug out of the teat, so milk comes out easier. Let the baby nurse until she is tired of nursing then come back in a couple of hours and do it again. Keep an eye that mom isn't butting the kid, when the kid tries to go near her. 
sorry, I was in a rush typing and didn't make my thoughts very organized. 
Continue doing this for 2 or 3 days, if need be. With a new doe, she may all of a sudden decide this new kid is really awsome. 
the pen should be no bigger than 4x8 or 6x8 to keep them close.


----------



## ksevern (Dec 12, 2012)

You can tie the doe at the head next to a wall, then tie a rope to the back leg furthest from the wall and tie it back ( not tight) so she can't move. Pulling the leg back a couple of inches should expose the teat. Then the baby can eat on her own while you stand there.. untie die when she's done. You could also milk her other teat and put that in the fridge.


----------



## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

All good advice. Rub some afterbirth on the kid too. If it's gone just use her discharge blood. Smear doelings face & rear end generously.

If this girl hasnt eaten eaten yet it's time for you to force the issue. Even if you can milk out a little colostrum & syringe it down her.


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

Thank you will look for a syringe
The pregnant doe that was claiming baby that wasn't hers just aborted one kid. :/
Going to wait a bit to make sure there's not any others coming out.


----------



## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

Oh man, I'm so sorry ...


----------



## 20kidsonhill (Feb 28, 2011)

very sorry, Was the doe that just aborted due to kid? I guess, know if the one that just aborted has a lot of milk, and wants the baby, then give it to her. Either way baby needs some milk in her ASAP. \


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

Ok
Wasn't sure on the exact due date for the other doe but the kid did look on the small side.
I'll put her in with the other doe.


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

Never mind, got kid to drink off of her own mom


----------



## toth boer goats (Jul 20, 2008)

Tie her up snug, with her head, so it is high enough, it will be difficult for her, to try to lay down, then tie up one leg, the one you will be working from.

Milk out some from each teat, keep it to either freeze or feed to her baby to insure colostrum. Via syringe very slowly (no needle). 
When a Doe just kids, their udder is very tight and sore. a New momma will not let the kid near it at this point, that is why, milk out just enough, to make her comfortable. Then try to put the kid on her teat. Make sure, they have time to bond, keep her and her baby in a pen alone, no other goats. Until she starts to show interest and allows the kid to nurse. Make sure, you watch momma's udder, if it gets to tight, milk out a little, to make her comfortable. 

Congrats~!


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

Well my doe that aborted (Riley) passed her afterbirth so she will have no kids of her own this year.
She keeps calling through the fence for the doeling. I think she may have bonded with her before I made it out to separate them.
Since Riley has no kid of her own and the doelings mother(Promise) will be a complete pain trying to get her to accept her do you think it would be alright if I let the other doe adopt her?
Oh & btw Promise has 4 teats, two of which are dysfunctional so I believe this may cause a problem for said doeling.
Riley has two functional teats and seems to have a much stronger mothering instinct.
Suggestions?


----------



## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Newborns figure out real quick which teats dont work.


----------



## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

My very maternal doe adopted Patti, who is not her daughter, so Patti had two mommas :laugh: Your doeling should be encouraged to stay with her real momma at least for a few days so she gets all the colostrum she needs.


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

Wouldn't the other doe have colostrum too?
I think I may just let Riley adopt her instead of fighting Promise.
Would it be ok to put Promise, Riley and baby together in a pen & see who baby chooses?


----------



## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

You should check just to make sure Riley has colostrum at that the little girl would be able to get it. Is her udder full?


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

Yes, her udder looks to be full the doeling did drink a bit from her mom but it was a fight the whole time, but I just came out to the pen and found her happily drinking from Riley.
How do I know if there's colostrum?


----------



## nancy d (Oct 5, 2007)

Colostrum is thick & yellow compared to straight milk. This is her first priority. The first day or two of it is the best, preferably from her own dam.


----------



## 20kidsonhill (Feb 28, 2011)

If you have other does that are due to kid. you shoul have some colostrum from Promise to milk out and freeze for emergencies in the future. Will keep well in a deep freezer in a freezer bag or glass jar for up to 6 months, Although I admist I have used some that was a year old in the freezer. 
As far as knowing if Riley has colostrum, that is a very good question. Does it seem thick, yellowish at all? The colostrum from can vary from doe to doe, some are sooo thick that it is thicker than elmers glue and very yellow looking, Some aren't nearly that thick and yellowish looking. If it strings out goopy at all it is for sure colostrum. 
I would leave her on Riley, I guess the question is if you want to try to force her to drink more of her mothers milk to be sure she is getting colostrum. ONce they are full, they are very hard to get to take a bottle or drink from a syringe. 

How many others do you have to kid?


----------



## 20kidsonhill (Feb 28, 2011)

you might want to collect the dead baby and afterbirth and put it in the fridge and call the vet in the morning and have it tested. We have the state lab right near us so that is handy. 
some kidding disease can be passed on to women, so women should wear gloves and be careful when they are pregnant around livestock that are birthing, especially birthing weak or dead kids.


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

Here's a few photos I snapped while out in the bar


----------



## kristinatucker (Jan 3, 2012)

Oh so sorry about the buck and the aborted baby! Such a bad morning! Congrats on the cute doe though and im glad you got a latch! I would suggest maybe putting her on a milk stand if you have one and taking the baby to her there and letting her nurse. That way its a more controlled environment. Like the others have said the colustrum is super important and best from her own mom but if the other will take her and she has colostrum then i would do that especially with the teat issue. We had a doe last year with 4 teats... and they all worked so it was a mess with milk going everywhere. The does we had favored one side both drinking at the same time so she was very lopsided but they did do it and were very healthy.


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

In the barn*
First is baby & Riley.
Baby baby face <3
Promise (baby's momma) hiding back in the corner trying to avoid baby :/
And baby daddy & Promise & Riley's half sister peeking through the fence, watching the birth and chowing down on some hay.
Oh, btw Promise & Riley are twins.


----------



## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

I hope she pulls through and the mother is ok .


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

I milked a bit from both Promise and Riley and they both seem to have the same consistency an color. I don't deal with goats milk much so I'm Not sure if I'd be able to tell if there was colostrum or not that's why I did this. They look about the same to me.
Does it make anyone feel safer to know Promise and Riley are twins, and were bred to the same buck?
I think I will let Riley adopt the baby because they seem to have a much stronger bond.
I will continue to check up on Promise and let you know if she has any problems.
She took quite a bit longer than Riley did to pass the afterbirth.


----------



## ThreeHavens (Oct 20, 2011)

Well, I'd say as long as she's getting colostrum let her drink from the doe that loves her  My only concern at this point would be if the doe had an aborting disease -- you should (if possible) save the aborted baby and have it tested.

I am very sorry this happened. I cried and cried over the kid we lost last year ... it is very painful :hug:


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

Thank you 
How would a doe get an abortion disease?
Unless she somehow caught it from something on our property I find it unlikely. I have not brought my does to any shows yet. I have had goats on my property for 5 years with no abortions prior. (This is only my third time kidding though, the two prior kiddings were Riley's mother). And the only new goat to my herd was added from a well known show breeder from this area.
Are there other ways she could get an abortion disease?


----------



## 20kidsonhill (Feb 28, 2011)

Birds, mice, cats and they can be born with it. The adults can be carriers and then the doelings are born with it and abort their first time kidding. Or they can be exposed as an adult to cat feces, that is called Toxoplasmosis(spelling?) or birds can carry chlamydia. 
The most common are
chlamydia
leptospirosis
and 
toxoplasmosis
any of them can hit a herd at any time, even a closed herd.


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

Hmm,..
Haven't had a cat for a few years, so we can rule out that, also haven't had any problems with mice,..
Is there a way to test the doe for these?


----------



## Tenacross (May 26, 2011)

This is a perfect example of why it is good to learn how to
tube feed a kid. If this same thing happened to me, I would milk
out a few ounces of colostrum from the birth mother and tube
feed the baby with it and then let the other doe raise it if she
had milk. If there wasn't the adoptive mother, I would tie that
naughty girl four times a day and help that baby get some milk.
Like 20kids said, sometimes that might require a hiding spot
for the little one if the doe is mean to the baby. 
Last year I had a doe that only liked the doe kid and not it's twin
brother. She was mean to him sometimes too. I helped him
out religiously for a couple of weeks. Me and that doe had some
battles. Finally the buck kid got really sneaky and would slide
in there when his sister was drinking. I witnessed this on the
camera. After awhile, the doe pretty much accepted the buck
kid too. I think it helped that the doe kid really loved her big
brother.


----------



## JaLyn (Oct 10, 2012)

;you could milk promise and bottle feed some to the baby while also allowing her to be with riley..what do you all think of that?


----------



## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Raccoons , possums carry lepto. I know dogs can contract lepto through their mucous membranes if they step in a puddle or wet grass , leaves that one of these animals has urinated on.


----------



## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Jeez , you learn something everyday. I haven't heard of a aborting disease.


----------



## ShannonM (Mar 29, 2011)

I think that just letting Riley adopt the kid sounds like the best idea at this point. If Promise really doesn't like her she could injure the baby by butting her, and it will also help calm Riley down after she lost her baby.

Although, if you can milk out Promise some and save some of her colostrum for future use, that is always a good idea!


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

I'll plan on picking up some bottles tomorrow so I can milk Promise and use that as a supplement to what she's getting from Riley 
I would try to force Promise to accept her but Promise is the shyest one of my herd and she holds grudges. I think she might become too skittish around me if I'm forcing her to do things.
If she has this problem again next year I Will be forcing her.
I decided to leave Promise, Riley and baby together in a pen for the day and after a few hours Promise did seem to take a bit more interest (maybe jealous of how baby & Riley bonded?) she did go and lick the baby a bit but I don't think she'd let her eat. Will see how things go by tomorrow.


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

**Update**
I ended up leaving Promise and Riley together in with the doeling, and today when I went out to feed I saw baby nursing from her real mom 
Looks like baby has two mommies. Two is better than one right?
Snapped this photo just before I came back in the house.









Riley tucking baby in for the night?


----------



## KymberLeAnn (Sep 16, 2012)

Sorry, that photo was fuzzy,.. This ones a little clearer.


----------



## Trickyroo (Sep 26, 2012)

Happy to hear things are going well


----------



## HoosierShadow (Apr 20, 2010)

Awww that last picture is too cute! I am sorry for the loses you have experienced, I really hope that you don't have any issues with any other kiddings. I'm glad to hear Promise is letting her nurse, that's a good sign IMO 
Hopefully next time Promise will be a better mom from the start. At least both does are accepting the baby, she'll be well protected and loved


----------

