# Newbie Needs Help Choosing Does :)



## Cricketofthesea (Jul 2, 2011)

*Edit: We finally picked them up (Chocolate Doe and Flashy B/W Doe) and I just submitted a new post with pictures. Thanks for all your help choosing them! :greengrin:

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Hi everyone! My family is looking for Nigerian Dwarf does for family milkers and fell in love with three does for sale by a nearby breeder. Trouble is we can only get two of them  Since we're newbies we don't know much about conformation and are just learning about pedigrees and lines, so I thought we'd come here for advice 

First a little history on the does: All three were owned by Pride of Texas, but they decided to get out of goats and sold off all their stock. The breeder we're talking to bought a lot of her stock (15+), but has decided that she too will get out of breeding goats. So the girls are for sale again. We can't find the number for Pride of Texas and they don't answer emails, so we can't ask them about the does as far as personality/milking. Their current owner doesn't milk her does so unfortunately we don't have much knowledge of their udders/milking.

Now onto the does!

The first doe we're looking at is a 4 1/2 yr old chocolate doe who sire is MCH Twin Creeks BH Bay Watch ++*SE. Her dam is Ponders End Feeling Groovy *D who goes back to Goodwood and Flat Rocks. Though she is a little older at 4 her sire lived to 10 and her dam is still alive at 11, and had her last kid at 8. I couldn't reach her former owners so I don't know how she did as far as kidding.









The second doe is a 3 year old tri-color. Her SS was MCH Twin Creeks Perfect Storm +*S, SD is MCH Pecan Hollow Savannah *D, and her Dam's parents go back to Pecan Hollow SBF Constantine (Whose SS was Baywatch and SD was Tom's Bit a Willy). She had been shown and won Reserve Champion Junior Doe at a show, and kidded with twins this spring. 









The third doe is a 4 1/2 year old black and white. Her sire is MCH Woodhaven Farms Pepe Le Pew, who goes back to Flat Rock and Woodhaven. Her dam is Twin Creeks WB Rebound, who goes back to Baywatch and MCH Goodwood Weisbaden +*S E. I think she kidded with twins this spring too, but no info besides that. Just gorgeous though!









We plan on going to see them this weekend hopefully. Based on their pictures and pedigrees whats your opinions on which two does to get? I know we'll probably decide based on how they act when we get there, since they're not in milk right now and we don't know how to judge conformation, but I thought I should get a little advice from all the experts here 

Thanks for the help!

P.S. At what age do you normally retire does? We were hoping to breed them until they were 6-7, but is that just wishful thinking?


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## KW Farms (Jun 21, 2008)

Really any of those would be great choices. Can't really tell much about their conformation from the photos, but their pedigrees are superb. I think looking at pedigrees i'd go with the first two...but honestly, they all seem pretty equal. 

So my choices are one and two...but I like three as well.  Are you SURE you can't get the three? 

Does can be productive clear up until the last few years of their life. I know of a doe at age 10 who is still being milked is very healthy and could be bred again, but the owner decided to retire her. Nigerians are pretty productive and I think it depends on each doe when you are ready to retire them. Some might need it sooner than others and some may be productive clear up until the last few years of life. They should still be pretty productive at six or seven years...not wishful thinking at all. :thumb:


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## StaceyRosado (Oct 5, 2007)

love the Baywatch line so Im all for you getting a daughter out of him  

As Kylee said the pedigrees dont look bad at all. I like all three but would also go with one and two if it were my choices (just by pictures and the quick pedigree info)

I have a 5 year old here and she is still going strong. I heard of does being bred till they are 10 or 11 years old. 

Goats are still growing till they reach 4 years old. So they are by no means old they are just hitting their prime.


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## firelight27 (Apr 25, 2009)

Four isn't old at all! Its not odd to expect a Nigerian to kid up until 9 or 10 (I won't personally go past that, but some could probably do fine at 11). If you retire them between 8-10 it isn't unusual for them to live to be 12-15. I honestly think they have the average lifespan of a mid-size dog as long as they don't die in childbirth because they are being bred very old. 

I personally like #2. She looks longer and more level from that photo, but all pictures are hard in terms of judging conformation. I agree about the bloodlines, especially Baywatch. If I had to leave one behind, it would be 3 as well.


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## freedomstarfarm (Mar 25, 2011)

Oh whats 3 vs. 2. :laugh: 
I can't tell much conformation from the photos but think 2 may look the best most level. 
1 oh I wouldn't pass up a BayWatch daughter!! 
I have 8&9 year old healthy active does here that I bred one for Fall and am going to breed the other for Spring. I think condition is a key factor for a doe of any age.


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## milkmaid (Sep 15, 2010)

Welcome! Those are all beautiful goats, but if you're looking for family milkers, then the udders are at least as important as the pedigree. Especially the capacity. See if you can find pictures/info on their udders or their dams' udders somewhere. Or you may want to change your mind and buy from someone who milks their does, so you can be sure what you are getting. I made the mistake of buying two "milkers" from people who didn't milk their goats, and while they give an OK amount of milk, it's not great.
Whatever goats you decide to get, you will love them! :thumb:


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## freedomstarfarm (Mar 25, 2011)

the +, * and S all stand for milk amounts earned by family members. I can't explain how they all work and what the relations are but here is a link to the AGS info on it. http://www.americangoatsociety.com/milkpail/advanced_registry.php


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## Cricketofthesea (Jul 2, 2011)

Thanks for all your help everyone. Doe 1 and 2 were our favorites too, but we'll know for sure once we go meet them (hopefully this weekend!).


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## peggy (Aug 11, 2010)

I like doe 1 and 3. I think they are look more dairy and are very deep in the body.


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## Burns Branch Boers (Apr 11, 2011)

I am a black and white fan so I vote for #3 for sure :greengrin: (but I like them all) :laugh:


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## RMADairyGoats (Jun 20, 2011)

I like the conformation on doe #1. I love Baywatch! I also like doe #2, she's GORGEOUS!!!! Doe #3 is not as stylish and does not have the incurve to her rear leg and does not look as wide, but is flashy. She does have a deep barrel though. So I don't know, it's just who you like best


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## GotmygoatMTJ (Apr 25, 2009)

I'd also go for 1 and 3 as well! But any of those girls would be in my barn any day! I'd love to have a Baywatch daughter, you lucky dog you!
Welcome to The Goat Spot, and what a GREAT start to your herd! Wish I had had that start.


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## Calico Patch Farm (Mar 8, 2011)

I would go with 1 and 2. All look great though. Congrats on the find!


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## Goat Song (May 4, 2011)

Oh, just get 'em all! :greengrin:


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## Mini Goat Lover (May 4, 2011)

I like 1 and 2 the best.


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## freedomstarfarm (Mar 25, 2011)

What did you decide? Do you have some new goats??


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## Cricketofthesea (Jul 2, 2011)

Well, it took two months longer than we thought but we finally have our does :stars: 

Their owner had a death in the family and had to travel so we weren't able to meet her until the beginning of this month. We were practicing patience lol. 

We ended up getting the chocolate and white doe (Bridget) and the black and white doe (Dahlia). The little gold and white girl was just so tiny (smallest ND we'd seen!) we were afraid that she would have trouble kidding or not really be able to produce much milk. 

I'll post more pictures on a new post.


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